Top 10 Cars in Wealthiest Zip Codes

[menlo]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present - Mercedes and BMW - four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2012/08/ ... zip-codes/

[NYBoglehead]

Typically people that have money have it because they don't spend frivolously in things like cars, boats, etc. Nothing wrong with spending your money however you like to of course, but most people become wealthy because they don't spend on things like that. After you become wealthy it might be a different story.

[cheese_breath]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

[rkhusky]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

Probably a geography bias to the wealthiest zip codes, which tend to be on the coasts.

[TA_Lurker]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

Probably a geography bias to the wealthiest zip codes, which tend to be on the coasts.

That doesn't make any sense. There's nothing about the geography of the coasts that would bias consumers away from American cars. Salt water doesn't make them melt.

[lws6772]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

Probably a geography bias to the wealthiest zip codes, which tend to be on the coasts.

+1

[jwa]

Honda Accords are made in Ohio. Toyota Camrys are made in Kentucky. Some Mercedes are made in Alabama. Some BMW's are made in South Carolina. All VW Passats are made in Tennesse. Some Chevy's come from the Orient and Germany. Some Fords are made in Canada and Mexico.

I'm baffled as to what an American car is. My father is proud of his American Mercury Marquis which came from Canada. He makes smug remarks to my brother about his foreign Camry that came from Kentucky.

[damjam]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present -...- four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

This is talked about in the book "The Millionaire Next Door." Many of the most wealthy don't buy anything flashy. Look at Warren Buffett he's still living in the relatively modest house he purchased for in 1958 for $31,500. It's worth about 700k today.

[bigred77]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present -...- four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

This is talked about in the book "The Millionaire Next Door." Many of the most wealthy don't buy anything flashy. Look at Warren Buffett he's still living in the relatively modest house he purchased for in 1958 for $31,500. It's worth about 700k today.

These are not "millionaire next door" types. These are multimillion dollar homes in exclusive, prestigious neighborhoods. Warren Buffet doesn't live anywhere near these people (unless he alone drives up the average wealth so much he puts his own zipcode on the map, which i doubt).


I have to say I'm pretty shocked. I'm really suprised the base model 3 series is the most favored BMW model by the wealthy. If I make that much Im buyin a 7 series or an M6.


I've always had a thing for cars. i drive a toyota truck which I bought 1 yr used about 4 years ago. I just shook off a phase to upgrade to a BMW convertible (which I REALLY wanted to do) and have decided to drive my truck untill it dies. At which point I think a fair reward would be to treat myself to a nice BMW 5 series about 7-8 years from now (3 yr old certified pre-owned in boglehead fashion of course, and pay cash).

[tludwig23]

The Accords are purchased for the nannies.

[damjam]

I have to say I'm pretty shocked. I'm really suprised the base model 3 series is the most favored BMW model by the wealthy.

Don't knock the 3 series, they're fun to drive.

[bigred77]

I have to say I'm pretty shocked. I'm really suprised the base model 3 series is the most favored BMW model by the wealthy.

Don't knock the 3 series, they're fun to drive.

I would honestly be drivin one now if I wasn't too damn big for em.

[dad2000]

The Accords are purchased for the nannies.

And the kids.

[XtremeSki2001]

Very interesting.

I'd like to see the top 10 cars in the least wealthiest zip codes.

[chaz]

Camry made the list. Where is my Corolla?

[btenny]

The Toyotas and Hondas are driven by the nannies and cooks and wives to go out for groceries and run errands. The kids drive 3 series BMWs. The dads drive the 3 series or the SUVs in the winter when the weather is bad and no one wants to get their really nice car that dirty..

Bill

[Rodc]

The Accords are purchased for the nannies.

And the kids.

Nah, they do better by the kids...

[Petrocelli]

I drive No. 3 on the list. Go figure.

[chaz]

I drive No. 3 on the list. Go figure.

Does your watch go with #3?

[Petrocelli]

I drive No. 3 on the list. Go figure.

Does your watch go with #3?

I am usually wearing it when I drive, but it costs only $98, which is a lot less than the car.

[cheese_breath]

I'm baffled as to what an American car is. My father is proud of his American Mercury Marquis which came from Canada. He makes smug remarks to my brother about his foreign Camry that came from Kentucky.

In my personal view a car's nationality is defined by the home country of the company that builds it. By this definition, even though my truck may have been built in Canada I consider it an American truck. And so is your father's Canadian built Marquis. But that's just my opinion. Dumb huh?

[Teetlebaum]

Honda Accords are made in Ohio. Toyota Camrys are made in Kentucky. Some Mercedes are made in Alabama. Some BMW's are made in South Carolina. All VW Passats are made in Tennesse. Some Chevy's come from the Orient and Germany. Some Fords are made in Canada and Mexico.

I'm baffled as to what an American car is. My father is proud of his American Mercury Marquis which came from Canada. He makes smug remarks to my brother about his foreign Camry that came from Kentucky.

The Jetta is made in Mexico. ¡Olé!

[SurfCityBill]

No's 6 - 10 are for the kids.

-B

[SurfCityBill]

I drive No. 3 on the list. Go figure.

Does your watch go with #3?

I am usually wearing it when I drive, but it costs only $98, which is a lot less than the car.

What do you mean it only cost $98? What happened to the $5000 Rolex?

-B

[ks289]

I am not a car guy.

All of our really great and fairly well paid secretaries drive nicer cars than me. I think my car is less expensive than all of the 10 on the list. Definitely the German ones...oops maybe not the Jetta.

[eucalyptus]

Warren Buffett's car is not nearly as nice as his jet.

[Petrocelli]

I drive No. 3 on the list. Go figure.

Does your watch go with #3?

I am usually wearing it when I drive, but it costs only $98, which is a lot less than the car.

What do you mean it only cost $98? What happened to the $5000 Rolex?

It's a urban legend that I have a $5,000 watch.

I was shopping for a $5,000 watch for my 50th birthday.

I couldn't find one I like. So I got a $98 watch (from Orvis) and a Kindle instead.

[Petrocelli]

No's 6 - 10 are for the kids.

You got that right. My son drives no. 7 on the list. (Honda CRV.)

[rkhusky]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

Probably a geography bias to the wealthiest zip codes, which tend to be on the coasts.

That doesn't make any sense. There's nothing about the geography of the coasts that would bias consumers away from American cars. Salt water doesn't make them melt.

Who knows. People on the coasts prefer imports. Perhaps their jobs aren't as tied to the domestic auto industry.

If you dig deeper into the lists, you will find that Jeeps made the top 5 in a number of the top 10 zip codes.

Once upon a time, Bloomfield Hills, MI was one of the wealthier areas. You probably wouldn't find that many imports there.

[yobria]

I've got a friend living in Ross, CA (one of the two towns mentioned in the article) making more than the median income there. She's a partner in a corporate law firm. She drives a Prius, though her daily commute is by public transportation (ferry). She's environmentally conscious, and has no status need, so it's the logical choice.

[aja8888]

I drive #6.....it's a diesel, of course, and has 201,000 miles on it (just broken in). It's also a 2000 model with no sunroof, crank windows and non-power cloth seats. A real Boglehead machine.

[Valuethinker]

Typically people that have money have it because they don't spend frivolously in things like cars, boats, etc. Nothing wrong with spending your money however you like to of course, but most people become wealthy because they don't spend on things like that. After you become wealthy it might be a different story.

actually in my experience people wh have money have nice cars, boats, cottages-- the cottage is almost de rigeur, or the second home.

What people who have money have is lots of it, and incomes that exceed their cost of living. But that's a lot easier to do on $250k a year than it is on $60k a year, say.

My parents live in a nice neighbourhood, the houses go for c. $1m (they didn't go for that in 1960 when they bought! ).

The other residents, now typically 40-50 years younger? SUVs. Filipina nannies. Cottages. The works. These are typical 2 income yuppie families: lawyers, investment bankers, entrepreneurs, heads of major government agencies etc.

That's Toronto. In London, £1m for a house in a nice neighbourhood is not untypical (in fact, it's cheap). The cars? BMWs and Mercedes and Lexus et al. Don't get me started on the Chelsea Tractors-- the requirement for Land Rovers, Range Rovers and Porsche Cayennes to shuttle the kids through London's mean streets, where it snows maybe every other year at most. The kids? Private schools. Second home? Frequently in Cornwall or the Cotswolds or France or Italy.

I can't xray their stock portfolios but they are usually doing pretty well in terms of pension plans etc. Despite the recession you see little sign of it in the better neighbourhoods of Toronto or London-- restaurants are still full, etc.

I used to wonder about all this, but have realized that if you pay £1m (or $1m) for a house, then $30k (or $50k) for a car doesn't seem that much.

Where this all goes wrong of course if there is 1). illness or job loss that prevents being able to get back into highly paid work 2). divorce. Then 'assets' like the house and the second home have to be sold.

[Valuethinker]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

Probably a geography bias to the wealthiest zip codes, which tend to be on the coasts.

That doesn't make any sense. There's nothing about the geography of the coasts that would bias consumers away from American cars. Salt water doesn't make them melt.

Who knows. People on the coasts prefer imports. Perhaps their jobs aren't as tied to the domestic auto industry.

So do people who live in Kentucky and Tennessee drive Hondas and Toyotas? Which are made locally?

How about Alabama? BMW and Mercedes?

Ontario? They make Hondas, Chrysler, GM & Ford in Ontario. (Toyotas too from memory).

The 'nationality' of a car is always suspect now because the parts and assembly can be anywhere.

I think it's cultural. Saab and Volvo used to have strong footholds in New Hampshire and Vermont. California was the first place Japanese cars took off, because California was always a good place for smaller more economical cars (in the early days, Japanese cars weren't great with winter: one reason why for a long time they were less popular in Alberta).

I agree with you re Michigan and Ohio, perhaps, which were 'Big 3' central.

If you dig deeper into the lists, you will find that Jeeps made the top 5 in a number of the top 10 zip codes.

Given the reliability of Jeeps, proving that having more money doesn't make you more sensible! (or conversely that having a car in the shop all the time is less of an issue).

[hicabob]

the E class is nice - sort of understated yet very proficient and comfortable - the depreciation on new and service costs on the old would give the typical boglehead pause though.

[Valuethinker]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present - Mercedes and BMW - four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2012/08/ ... zip-codes/

I don't know US car prices, but is there a car in that list for less than $30k?

[hicabob]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present - Mercedes and BMW - four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2012/08/ ... zip-codes/

I don't know US car prices, but is there a car in that list for less than $30k?

I think jetta's go for 20k and up here in the US - the us seems to have by far the lowest car prices in the western world - I compared to Australian prices a couple years ago and the US price was about 66% of the Oz price! Prius sold for about 50k in Oz - which pretty much relegated them to politicians cars.

[Valuethinker]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present -...- four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

This is talked about in the book "The Millionaire Next Door." Many of the most wealthy don't buy anything flashy. Look at Warren Buffett he's still living in the relatively modest house he purchased for in 1958 for $31,500. It's worth about 700k today.

If that's what Buffett made on his house, it's a truly lousy investment. My parents paid $21,000 for their house somewhat later which would be worth a cool $1m now. Warren Buffett has not done well on his housing investment .

Millionaire Next Door is a statistical con, as Taleb amongst others points out. We don't have a tracking study: we don't know if other people, making those same decisions, wound up not rich-- because the book only profiles those that wound up rich, then imputes how they wound up rich. the 'price per pound of car' is a pretty amusing, and pointless, statistic in the book.

Buffett is a bad example because he is so unlike any other billionaire and billionaires are so unlike the merely well paid. Even Gates had a Porsche (which he wrecked a couple of times) before Melinda settled him down, and an enormous mansion full of the latest tech goodies (most of which was unused, I gather). Buffett owns a jet leasing company for goodness sake: he doesn't even need to have a private jet.

[Inapproprate comment removed by admin LadyGeek]

Most billionaires have more than 1 home, homes in more than 1 country in fact.

[Valuethinker]

I thought this survey showing the top 10 best-selling cars in the 10 wealthiest zip codes was interesting. Although the usual suspects are present - Mercedes and BMW - four of the top 10 are Honda's and Toyota's.

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2012/08/ ... zip-codes/

I don't know US car prices, but is there a car in that list for less than $30k?

I think jetta's go for 20k and up here in the US - the us seems to have by far the lowest car prices in the western world - I compared to Australian prices a couple years ago and the US price was about 66% of the Oz price! Prius sold for about 50k in Oz - which pretty much relegated them to politicians cars.

The equivalent car would go for about £18,000 here or nearly USD 28,000. That does include 20% Value Added Tax, though.

Australia (NZ worse) the problem has always been it's a relatively small market. This is even true of Canada, where a BMW costs quite a premium over the US market, even say Buffalo vs. Toronto-- less competition.

The real problem with Jettas is high depreciation/ high maintenance costs. it's not an economical option.

{EDIT: AJ, below, points out that's an error. I am mentally mapping back to the 80s, when Jettas were fun cars, but expensive to repair (and unlike the Japanese, not overly reliable. But it's a point.)

(EDIT: I would still maintain that the 'sober' car buyer still bets on Japanese. With Hyundai coming up the inside track-- I tend to have neighbours now who are like that, and I am struck at how many Hyundais I see).

[Valuethinker]

Interesting. Not an American car on the whole list.

Probably a geography bias to the wealthiest zip codes, which tend to be on the coasts.

That doesn't make any sense. There's nothing about the geography of the coasts that would bias consumers away from American cars. Salt water doesn't make them melt.

No but the cultures are different.

To an extent, affluent suburbs in America are more like other affluent suburbs, in other parts of America, than they are like, say, the ghetto 10 miles away.

But there are observable cultural differences, and the US coasts are 'more open' (in a sense) to foreign influence. Partly it's because people like Honda started in California. European retailers, if they try to crack the USA, start in places like NYC and San Francisco/ LA first (they will then typically leap to Chicago).

Wherever we are, we tend, even if only unconsciously, to ape our neighbours (and this dates back to our primate origins, at the least). So Berkeley California has a big concentration of Priuses (Prii? ). If you live in some rich suburb of Memphis I bet you tend to drive big American SUVs, or Cadillacs? Around here (suburban London) I am tracking the rise and rise of Hyundai-- the people who would once have bought Honda/ Toyota now drive Hyundai.

I believe it now costs less to ship a car from Yokohama to Long Beach than it does from Long Beach to Chicago, say, but I'd have to check that-- the global cost of shipping with supersized container ships has plummeted.

It was also true (going back to the 70s) that Japanese and German cars didn't take to the peculiarly North American combination of bitter winters and road salt. You didn't see many (or any) in Alberta. I think they have more or less fixed that, though.

[sscritic]

But there are observable cultural differences, and the US coasts are 'more open' (in a sense) to foreign influence. Partly it's because people like Honda started in California.

Southern California is home to nearly all U.S. (or sometimes "North American") headquarters of Asian automakers. (The notable exception is Subaru of America, located in Cherry Hill, New Jersey.)

from 2006 http://laedc.org/reports/Auto-2006.pdf

P.S. I tried to quote the list, but our software keeps saying I have too few characters. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Hyundai, and Kia are all in SoCal. See page 3.

[Valuethinker]

But there are observable cultural differences, and the US coasts are 'more open' (in a sense) to foreign influence. Partly it's because people like Honda started in California.

Southern California is home to nearly all U.S. (or sometimes "North American") headquarters of Asian automakers. (The notable exception is Subaru of America, located in Cherry Hill, New Jersey.)

from 2006 http://laedc.org/reports/Auto-2006.pdf

P.S. I tried to quote the list, but our software keeps saying I have too few characters. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Hyundai, and Kia are all in SoCal. See page 3.

And the piece (which had a degree of economic development 'puffery') was a goldmine of interesting stuff:

- economists talk constantly about 'Clusters' -- the tendency of Hedge Funds to cluster in Mayfair, London, Park Ave NYC and Greenwich Connecticut. Carmakers around Detroit. Luxury goods companies in northern Italy. Medical device manufacturers in Michigan and just south. Silicon Valley. Cambridge in England. The consensus is that firms often share similar suppliers: of skilled labour, of components, of outsourced design and marketing expertise, etc. What this is saying is that Southland is a 'cluster' of automotive expertise, focused around design etc.

- the report notes changes in the ways cars are transported-- specialized car transporters on railways which lowered damage and theft issues. Hence no longer the need to make cars in America's largest single car market (southern CA)

- the innovations in traffic management (and previously in pollution control) may be the area's most lasting contribution to the automotive world. The world is going to have 1 billion cars: we don't have the roadspace for them all to drive (actually the world may have passed 1 billion cars, so the problem is already here). If you want to see the future of driving, then SoCal is probably a good place to see it.

So with the exception now of Nissan (which has moved HQ to Tennessee but retains its design studios in CA) we see a 'cluster' of Japanese auto manufacturers, the lead ones having moved there in the late 1950s.

The Southern California area is always an interesting one, because it is entrepreneurially one of the most dynamic areas of the USA. And one finds all these types of industries one was not always aware of:

- aerospace- almost gone now, a product of the WW2 buildup and then the Cold War/ Moon Shot. I keep thinking of Roy Scheider in the movie '52 Pickup' who owns an aerospace forging plant
- Hollywood
- p*rnography - dying now with the internet and free distribution, but San Fernando Valley was the largest maker of adult entertainment films in the world at one time
- finance - there's a cluster of innovation around spinoffs from Michael Millikens Drexel Burnham Lambert, which was based in Beverly Hills and was 100% of the junk bond market at one point

And now you tell me foreign car import and customization for N American market (the world's largest, or China may just have surpassed it).

As they say in New York 'who knew'?

[aja8888]

The real problem with Jettas is high depreciation/ high maintenance costs. it's not an economical option.

That's quite a statement given you did not provide any statistics.

Jetta's around here are highly sought after in the used market. I have been offered $4000 for my 2000 Jetta GLS with 200,000 on it. The original price was $18,305 and I have the documents to prove that. Of course it's in mint condition and very economical. Maybe things are different where you live, wherever that is, but seems like used VW's, BMW's, MB's etc around here are selling very well.

[topper1296]

But there are observable cultural differences, and the US coasts are 'more open' (in a sense) to foreign influence. Partly it's because people like Honda started in California.

Southern California is home to nearly all U.S. (or sometimes "North American") headquarters of Asian automakers. (The notable exception is Subaru of America, located in Cherry Hill, New Jersey.)

from 2006 http://laedc.org/reports/Auto-2006.pdf

P.S. I tried to quote the list, but our software keeps saying I have too few characters. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Hyundai, and Kia are all in SoCal. See page 3.

Nissan's North American HQ is located in a suburb just south of Nashville, TN (Franklin, TN).

[Valuethinker]

But there are observable cultural differences, and the US coasts are 'more open' (in a sense) to foreign influence. Partly it's because people like Honda started in California.

Southern California is home to nearly all U.S. (or sometimes "North American") headquarters of Asian automakers. (The notable exception is Subaru of America, located in Cherry Hill, New Jersey.)

from 2006 http://laedc.org/reports/Auto-2006.pdf

P.S. I tried to quote the list, but our software keeps saying I have too few characters. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Hyundai, and Kia are all in SoCal. See page 3.

Nissan's North American HQ is located in a suburb just south of Nashville, TN (Franklin, TN).

The cited report notes that they made this move relatively recently (mid 2000s) *and* they kept their design studio in LA.

Clusters. It's all about clusters.

[Valuethinker]

The real problem with Jettas is high depreciation/ high maintenance costs. it's not an economical option.

That's quite a statement given you did not provide any statistics.

Jetta's around here are highly sought after in the used market. I have been offered $4000 for my 2000 Jetta GLS with 200,000 on it. The original price was $18,305 and I have the documents to prove that. Of course it's in mint condition and very economical. Maybe things are different where you live, wherever that is, but seems like used VW's, BMW's, MB's etc around here are selling very well.

OK fair point. I was mapping Golf to Jetta, here, and I was remembering Jettas of yore (my brother had one).

Golfs here are high depreciation (they are the most popular car of their class in Europe).

Friends had Jettas in the 80s, in North America, and they cost a bomb to fix. Great cars, particularly given how the average North American car was so sloppy then to drive, but repair cost was high (and Japanese cars had some similar issues re costs of repair, but much higher reliability overall).

So I take your point, I may just be out of date.

Just on BMers and Mercedes. In Ontario, they have high depreciation. They start out expensive, but they depreciate. In Europe the conditions are generally less tough (road salt, winter-summer variations etc.) but they still are generally cars to avoid if more than 5+ years old-- reliability, and the cost of fixing them.

I would guess this is less of an issue in, say, California? Some place where winter is not the slog it is in the NE/ Midwest?

[CMartel2]

But there are observable cultural differences, and the US coasts are 'more open' (in a sense) to foreign influence. Partly it's because people like Honda started in California.

Southern California is home to nearly all U.S. (or sometimes "North American") headquarters of Asian automakers. (The notable exception is Subaru of America, located in Cherry Hill, New Jersey.)

from 2006 http://laedc.org/reports/Auto-2006.pdf

P.S. I tried to quote the list, but our software keeps saying I have too few characters. Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Mazda, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Suzuki, Hyundai, and Kia are all in SoCal. See page 3.

Nissan's North American HQ is located in a suburb just south of Nashville, TN (Franklin, TN).

Yep. Nissan left California for Tennessee for economic reasons, but it was in California.

[LadyGeek]

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[Alex Frakt]

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