U.S. stocks in freefall

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randomizer
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby randomizer » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:41 am

nedsaid wrote:
randomizer wrote:They need to freefall a bit more before I can harvest any losses. None of my purchased lots, even the most recent, is showing a loss yet.


Wow. Excuse me for my naïvete, but I always invested to MAKE money. By all means take advantage of tax loss harvesting when it makes sense but this seems like letting the tax tail wag the investing dog.

Sorry. I should have put irony quotes around my post. (I figured saying I wanted my holdings to "freefall" was obviously tongue in cheek.) I was just a little too nostalgic at seeing this thread pop up again and let the emotion get the best of me. I'm quite happy that I don't have any loss harvesting opportunities for the time being.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Ari » Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:12 am

lgs88 wrote:I'm inclined to believe that a nice psychological crutch, even if it's nothing more than that, CAN improve your returns. So many investing mistakes are psychologically-rooted.

Perhaps. I'm not going to argue against that. If it's easier to buy in a crash than it is to not sell, I suppose it works.
All in, all the time.

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Uncle Pennybags
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Uncle Pennybags » Wed May 17, 2017 8:32 am

I knew it this is it; sell, sell, sell. :shock:

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Toons » Wed May 17, 2017 8:34 am

Uncle Pennybags wrote:I knew it this is it; sell, sell, sell. :shock:


Excellent,,,,pick up shares at lower prices
Bring It On :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Tamalak » Wed May 17, 2017 8:41 am

Man. We're starved for an actual freefall. When's the last time the markets dropped even 5%?

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby lazydavid » Wed May 17, 2017 8:50 am

Tamalak wrote:Man. We're starved for an actual freefall. When's the last time the markets dropped even 5%?


I thought it happened (briefly) last year, but looking back the momentary Brexit slump was only about 3.5%. And recovered in the time it takes to mow the lawn. :P

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Tamalak » Wed May 17, 2017 8:53 am

I feel like, as with forest fires, it's healthy for stocks to have 10% dips on a regular basis to clear out the 'weak money'

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby SquawkIdent » Wed May 17, 2017 8:59 am

You do realize that the DOW could fall 1000 points and it would be a 5% move. The things people get "excited" about nowadays is somewhat strange. It's just noise. Long term we all know where we are going. Just like Toons and Mr. Buffett say....use that noise to your advantage.

Also, a well diversified portfolio probably has some bonds in it. Look how they are doing today. Relax. :sharebeer

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby livesoft » Wed May 17, 2017 9:12 am

Uncle Pennybags wrote:I knew it this is it; sell, sell, sell. :shock:

What? You didn't rebalance out of equities yesterday? Somebody did and posted about it.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby MotoTrojan » Wed May 17, 2017 9:16 am

livesoft wrote:
Uncle Pennybags wrote:I knew it this is it; sell, sell, sell. :shock:

What? You didn't rebalance out of equities yesterday? Somebody did and posted about it.


Crap I went 100% triple leveraged S&P500 yesterday!!!

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Hector » Wed May 17, 2017 9:20 am

Tamalak wrote:Man. We're starved for an actual freefall. When's the last time the markets dropped even 5%?


I think U.S. stocks fell about 15% earlier last year.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby retiredjg » Wed May 17, 2017 9:30 am

livesoft wrote:
Uncle Pennybags wrote:I knew it this is it; sell, sell, sell. :shock:

What? You didn't rebalance out of equities yesterday? Somebody did and posted about it.

I did rebalance out of equities on the weekend (meaning Monday after market close). Just luck. And won't amount to much of anything. 8-)

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby GoldenFinch » Wed May 17, 2017 11:32 am

Nobody posted on this thread between March 30th and May 17th! That's a long time!

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Doom&Gloom » Wed May 17, 2017 12:05 pm

GoldenFinch wrote:Nobody posted on this thread between March 30th and May 17th! That's a long time!


A roaring bull market to tell your grandchildren about!!!

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby triceratop » Wed May 17, 2017 12:16 pm

What a shame this mini-bull run had to end. Oh well; I bought more US SCV today.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Grt2bOutdoors » Wed May 17, 2017 12:23 pm

triceratop wrote:What a shame this mini-bull run had to end. Oh well; I bought more US SCV today.


A bull is considered over when the market has declined over 10%, the bull is still here.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby triceratop » Wed May 17, 2017 12:29 pm

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
triceratop wrote:What a shame this mini-bull run had to end. Oh well; I bought more US SCV today.


A bull is considered over when the market has declined over 10%, the bull is still here.


Isn't that the formal definition of a correction? Surely a market runup can end in ways other than a correction. For example: a flat market for years is definitely not a bull market.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby nisiprius » Wed May 17, 2017 12:32 pm

Doom&Gloom wrote:
GoldenFinch wrote:Nobody posted on this thread between March 30th and May 17th! That's a long time!


A roaring bull market to tell your grandchildren about!!!
"Those were the days, my friend,
We thought they'd never end,
We'd sing and dance forever and a day;
We'd live the life we choose,
We'd fight and never lose,
For we were young and sure to have our way!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2O5EeBjxhiY
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Grt2bOutdoors » Wed May 17, 2017 12:33 pm

triceratop wrote:
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
triceratop wrote:What a shame this mini-bull run had to end. Oh well; I bought more US SCV today.


A bull is considered over when the market has declined over 10%, the bull is still here.


Isn't that the formal definition of a correction? Surely a market runup can end in ways other than a correction. For example: a flat market for years is definitely not a bull market.


Flat market = sideways market. A market run-up can end with a whimper! :)
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby triceratop » Wed May 17, 2017 12:37 pm

nisiprius wrote:
Doom&Gloom wrote:
GoldenFinch wrote:Nobody posted on this thread between March 30th and May 17th! That's a long time!


A roaring bull market to tell your grandchildren about!!!
"Those were the days, my friend,
We thought they'd never end,
We'd sing and dance forever and a day;
We'd live the life we choose,
We'd fight and never lose,
For we were young and sure to have our way!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2O5EeBjxhiY



Friends all tried to warn me
But I held my head up high
All the time they warned me
But I only passed them by
They all tried to tell me
But I guess I didn't care
I turned my back and
Left them standing there

....

Years have passed and I keep thinking
What a fool I've been
I look back into the past and
Think of way back then
I know that I lost everything I thought that I could win
I guess I should have listened to my friends

https://youtu.be/XA9581o27uA?t=1m25s
"To play the stock market is to play musical chairs under the chord progression of a bid-ask spread."

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby oldzey » Wed May 17, 2017 1:33 pm

Uncle Pennybags wrote:I knew it this is it; sell, sell, sell. :shock:


Did someone say...

Image
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby livesoft » Wed May 17, 2017 1:49 pm

Public Service Announcement: A few things are having a RBD, such as IWN, IWM

This news report has "worst day" in the headline. [Headline changed, no longer has "worst day", but text still does. ]
Last edited by livesoft on Wed May 17, 2017 2:53 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby MotoTrojan » Wed May 17, 2017 1:56 pm

livesoft wrote:Public Service Announcement: A few things are having a RBD, such as IWN, IWM


VIOV/IJS as well. Too bad I bought a share yesterday. Maybe I'll grab some more.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby livesoft » Wed May 17, 2017 1:57 pm

MotoTrojan wrote:
livesoft wrote:Public Service Announcement: A few things are having a RBD, such as IWN, IWM


VIOV/IJS as well. Too bad I bought a share yesterday. Maybe I'll grab some more.

No, VIOV, IJS are not a having a RBD yet as I type this.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby DaftInvestor » Wed May 17, 2017 2:00 pm

Less than 2% is considered free-fall and less than 3% is considered a RBD???

What will you all call a 10%, 20%, 30% drop I wonder....

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby MotoTrojan » Wed May 17, 2017 2:01 pm

livesoft wrote:
MotoTrojan wrote:
livesoft wrote:Public Service Announcement: A few things are having a RBD, such as IWN, IWM


VIOV/IJS as well. Too bad I bought a share yesterday. Maybe I'll grab some more.

No, VIOV, IJS are not a having a RBD yet as I type this.


Remind me where the rules are again? 2.46% vs. 2.52%....

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby livesoft » Wed May 17, 2017 2:05 pm

MotoTrojan wrote:Remind me where the rules are again? 2.46% vs. 2.52%....

The rules are posted in this thread: viewtopic.php?t=194427

For those who don't care to read carefully, an RBD is a technical term and is actually not a specific number. It changes based on context.

It is even possible that things close higher today out of RBD territory.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Clever_Username » Wed May 17, 2017 2:07 pm

SquawkIdent wrote:Just like Toons and Mr. Buffett say....use that noise to your advantage.


Two excellent sources of advice, may I add.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby nedsaid » Wed May 17, 2017 2:10 pm

Oh goody! The thread is popping up again. Market rally just around the corner.
A fool and his money are good for business.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby willthrill81 » Wed May 17, 2017 2:26 pm

nedsaid wrote:Oh goody! The thread is popping up again. Market rally just around the corner.


Actually, I personally wish the markets would move sideways for the next five to six years (selfish I know). I should be able to really pump money in the market then, and I'll want good returns for the ten to fifteen years following. Solid returns for the next 20 years is too much to wish for. :D
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby TomatoTomahto » Wed May 17, 2017 2:28 pm

I just might invoke Livesoft's Rule* and tell my wife that we have to buy another Tesla. We passed Model 3 territory hours ago, and are currently at Model X with moderate options. Wheee!

* for those unfamiliar with the rule, Livesoft once declared that you can spend as much on a car as your portfolio goes up OR down on a given day.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby tuffy7222 » Wed May 17, 2017 2:56 pm

TWO days ago I called Vanguard to correct my asset allocation
It was 27.2 % stocks, 72.8% bonds
As I receive Social Security and Pension this pays for my house bills + other things.
I never withdraw from my IRA except RMD'S which i re invest in a taxable most of the time.
I'm 80 years old in June 2017
My allocation this day 5-17 is 40% stocks 60 % bonds (all in index mutual funds, 3 fun portforlio)
I sold $ 70,000 in bonds and bought $70,000 in total stock mkt to accomplish this transaction.
DID I make a terrible mistake on this bad day for stocks ????????????????

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby MotoTrojan » Wed May 17, 2017 3:04 pm

tuffy7222 wrote:TWO days ago I called Vanguard to correct my asset allocation
It was 27.2 % stocks, 72.8% bonds
As I receive Social Security and Pension this pays for my house bills + other things.
I never withdraw from my IRA except RMD'S which i re invest in a taxable most of the time.
I'm 80 years old in June 2017
My allocation this day 5-17 is 40% stocks 60 % bonds (all in index mutual funds, 3 fun portforlio)
I sold $ 70,000 in bonds and bought $70,000 in total stock mkt to accomplish this transaction.
DID I make a terrible mistake on this bad day for stocks ????????????????


Youd be better off if the transaction happened tonight but nobody can predict that. 80 years old with a $1/2M account and a pension sounds like you're doing great!!

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby GoldenFinch » Wed May 17, 2017 3:12 pm

TomatoTomahto wrote:I just might invoke Livesoft's Rule*

.....

* for those unfamiliar with the rule, Livesoft once declared that you can spend as much on a car as your portfolio goes up OR down on a given day.


My husband will be happy to hear that he can finally get a new car today and get out of that minivan with 240,000 miles on it that I have asked him to keep for one more year. I'm predicting we lost the cost of a nice car today. I'm just not sure he'll understand that I was telling him to not buy a car for Boglehead reasons and now buy a car for Boglehead reasons. I think I just won't say anything and continue to feel guilty for driving the nice car and wait another year.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby TomatoTomahto » Wed May 17, 2017 3:19 pm

GoldenFinch wrote:
TomatoTomahto wrote:I just might invoke Livesoft's Rule*

.....

* for those unfamiliar with the rule, Livesoft once declared that you can spend as much on a car as your portfolio goes up OR down on a given day.


My husband will be happy to hear that he can finally get a new car today and get out of that minivan with 240,000 miles on it that I have asked him to keep for one more year. I'm predicting we lost the cost of a nice car today. I'm just not sure he'll understand that I was telling him to not buy a car for Boglehead reasons and now buy a car for Boglehead reasons. I think I just won't say anything and continue to feel guilty for driving the nice car and wait another year.

Tbh, I never understood why a decline in your portfolio counted as much as an increase, but who am I to second guess a Rule?
I drove a minivan for years; it builds character :wink:

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby deltaneutral83 » Wed May 17, 2017 3:25 pm

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/ma ... 101788270/

Great article today noting how the S&P is up 23% from Election day through yesterday. Duhhhhhhhhh. Not. USA Today folks, USA Today. One comment out of the first 100 mentioned this. Yikes.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby triceratop » Wed May 17, 2017 3:33 pm

I bought my last car for a price which is ~3x the amount of money I lost today; it was a good decision: one cannot rely on a car which is worth less than $1000.

The good news is I broke my record for most losses sustained in a single day: $950.
"To play the stock market is to play musical chairs under the chord progression of a bid-ask spread."

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby GoldenFinch » Wed May 17, 2017 3:37 pm

TomatoTomahto wrote:
GoldenFinch wrote:
TomatoTomahto wrote:I just might invoke Livesoft's Rule*

.....

* for those unfamiliar with the rule, Livesoft once declared that you can spend as much on a car as your portfolio goes up OR down on a given day.


My husband will be happy to hear that he can finally get a new car today and get out of that minivan with 240,000 miles on it that I have asked him to keep for one more year. I'm predicting we lost the cost of a nice car today. I'm just not sure he'll understand that I was telling him to not buy a car for Boglehead reasons and now buy a car for Boglehead reasons. I think I just won't say anything and continue to feel guilty for driving the nice car and wait another year.

Tbh, I never understood why a decline in your portfolio counted as much as an increase, but who am I to second guess a Rule?
I drove a minivan for years; it builds character :wink:


Yes! Character! Thank you! I will pass that along to him. (I love Bogleheads!) Plus the minivan has a life-time warranty. I do feel bad driving the Lexus though...

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Uncle Pennybags » Wed May 17, 2017 3:44 pm

tuffy7222 wrote:DID I make a terrible mistake on this bad day for stocks ????????????????
Why did you decide to change your asset allocation? If it was a running with the bulls thing yes you made a mistake.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby deltaneutral83 » Wed May 17, 2017 3:46 pm

TomatoTomahto wrote:I just might invoke Livesoft's Rule*

.....

* for those unfamiliar with the rule, Livesoft once declared that you can spend as much on a car as your portfolio goes up OR down on a given day.


Does this take into account Sept 2008-March 2009 swings? Market moved 5-7% daily :sharebeer

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby sharpjm » Wed May 17, 2017 3:46 pm

Tamalak wrote:Man. We're starved for an actual freefall. When's the last time the markets dropped even 5%?

Ironically, after hours trading on November 8, 2016.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby GoldenFinch » Wed May 17, 2017 3:55 pm

sharpjm wrote:
Tamalak wrote:Man. We're starved for an actual freefall. When's the last time the markets dropped even 5%?

Ironically, after hours trading on November 8, 2016.


I seem to remember February 11th 2016 as a decently recent big low. Things have gone up quite a bit since then. :moneybag

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby munemaker » Wed May 17, 2017 4:01 pm

"Easy come, easy go! It pays to advertise."

James Bond in Octopussy
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Uncle Pennybags » Wed May 17, 2017 4:02 pm

deltaneutral83 wrote:https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/markets/2017/05/17/stocks-trump-political-risk/101788270/

Great article today noting how the S&P is up 23% from Election day through yesterday. Duhhhhhhhhh. Not. USA Today folks, USA Today. One comment out of the first 100 mentioned this. Yikes.
Thank you for my "fake news" fix for the month. Does anyone listen to third party reports anymore?

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby deltaneutral83 » Wed May 17, 2017 4:05 pm

Uncle Pennybags wrote:
deltaneutral83 wrote:https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/markets/2017/05/17/stocks-trump-political-risk/101788270/

Great article today noting how the S&P is up 23% from Election day through yesterday. Duhhhhhhhhh. Not. USA Today folks, USA Today. One comment out of the first 100 mentioned this. Yikes.
Thank you for my "fake news" fix for the month.


Exactly, if it were "Jimbob's financial blog" I would have laughed and gone on my way. But USAToday, aren't they supposed to be modestly factual? And then reading the comments and seeing everyone side step the obvious foul was even more surreal.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby Earl Lemongrab » Wed May 17, 2017 4:20 pm

The thing I most need to buy is VNQ, and it went up! Diversification at work.
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby boglephreak » Wed May 17, 2017 4:37 pm

saw this thread on front page. open up newest post. march 2017. cant believe i missed the March 2017 free fall!!! i wouldnt even had known it existed if i hadnt opened this thread.

didnt even know aboout the current free fall until a co-worker said DOW was down at which i wondered if i should buy.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby roymeo » Wed May 17, 2017 6:17 pm

They may have fixed that USA Today article, it now says "Thanks to the market's "Trump Bump," someone who had invested $100,000 in an index fund tracking the 500 largest U.S. companies on Election Day would have seen that money grow to $112,300 at the market's recent record high on May 15 after a 12.3% rally. But that same investor would have suffered a loss of roughly $2,044 in Wednesday's stock selloff which resulted in a 1.8% loss for the S&P 500 stock index."
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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby kappy » Wed May 17, 2017 7:02 pm

I had a stroke of luck. I rebalanced some of my small cap into REIT before markets closed yesterday to meet my desired AA. It was a mini win for a day or two but in the grand scheme of things, won't mean a thing. It did put a smile on my face though.

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Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Postby bostondan » Wed May 17, 2017 7:47 pm

I've taught my wife to be a good Boglehead who stays the course and doesn't think about market turbulence. I told her that we lost about $60k today with the market decline. She said, "Good, that means we have a lot of money."
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