Vanguard statements dropped estimated yield and annual income [also cost basis]

[ncdcpa]

It appears that on Vanguard brokerage account statements, apparently starting with 9/30/2024, the estimated annual income and estimated yield have been dropped. The 7-days SEC yield still shows on the sweep account.

I'll miss these estimates, especially for current year tax planning in taxable accounts, but I never compared the actual income to theses estimates to determine whether this was a good idea, since i was iterating throughout the year.

Does anyone know of a good place to look these up on a regular basis for common Vanguard funds?

Has anyone noticed anything else missing on the statements?

The cover page of the statement says:
"We've recently made changes to our statements.
You may notice that some information previously
included no longer appears on your statement.
For the most up-to-date information and status
of your account, visit Vanguard.com or download
our mobile app."
But I've not stumbled across this missing information on the website or app.

[VanGar+Goyle]

It appears that on Vanguard brokerage account statements, apparently starting with 9/30/2024, the estimated annual income and estimated yield have been dropped. The 7-days SEC yield still shows on the sweep account.

I'll miss these estimates, especially for current year tax planning in taxable accounts, but I never compared the actual income to theses estimates to determine whether this was a good idea, since i was iterating throughout the year.

Does anyone know of a good place to look these up on a regular basis for common Vanguard funds?

But I've not stumbled across this missing information on the website or app.

If the VBS income estimates are gone, I will miss them, but they did not seem that accurate.
I would then plan to use the online income for the year, and prorate it to be annual.
This has more accuracy for idle accounts with monthly distributions, even using estimated distributions in Nov and Dec.

[jebmke]

this came up in another thread. I have not found them particularly helpful for any tax planning myself.

[backpacker61]

I'll miss these estimates, especially for current year tax planning in taxable accounts, but I never compared the actual income to theses estimates to determine whether this was a good idea, since i was iterating throughout the year.

I'll miss them; I use them for the same purpose that you do.
But I don't iterate throughout the year (I just submit four equal estimated tax payments on the due dates).

[yankees60]

I'll miss these estimates, especially for current year tax planning in taxable accounts, but I never compared the actual income to theses estimates to determine whether this was a good idea, since i was iterating throughout the year.

I'll miss them; I use them for the same purpose that you do.
But I don't iterate throughout the year (I just submit four equal estimated tax payments on the due dates).

I always look at them but never used them. For accuracy I'd compute them myself in an Excel worksheet.

[Mullins]

I found they weren't anywhere near the actual amounts, so I thought perhaps they were to illustrate the estimated amounts for the twelve-month period going forward from that statement period rather than for the current calendar year.

In any event, I didn't use them. Instead I keep an excel sheet with the number of shares per fund, input the dividend payout per quarter and estimate that way, updating share amounts and dividend amounts through the year. It's not exact because it's using last year's dividend amounts for upcoming quarters, but comes in closer.

Of course you can also log in to your account, pull up the distributions year to date and estimate on top of that the amounts for the remaining balance of the year. I do this as well.

[Bagels]

This is a major bummer because I enjoyed looking at the estimates for a slew of individual stocks, even if the figures are perhaps fictional.

Does anyone know of a good place to look these up on a regular basis for common Vanguard funds?

I use the Yahoo Finance app to track dividend increases and Vanguard’s own site for fund yields, but of course you have to do the calculations yourself. Since Vanguard already has to keep track of how many shares we own, it would be nice if they would continue to automate this instead of dropping it and leaving it to accountholders to calculate.

As one person suggested, you could just look at the previous year’s yield for a starting point, which is also harder to get to than in the past. At least, I don’t see any “Dividend” link on Vanguard’s front page.
You could go to a specific account and click Distribution Payouts inside the Show dropdown box and then select 2023 Total.

This link may or may not take you there, as the site keeps changing - https://distributions.web.vanguard.com/ ... on-payouts

[ncdcpa]

Thanks, all, for the comments. To summarize my understanding thus far, it is easy to get historical data to use as a proxy estimate for future dividends or yields, but maybe not the estimates for future income and yield as previously on the statement. For most purposes, the readily available information is probably about as good as the estimates that were on the statements.

Before I started using these estimated yield and annual income from the statement, I used extrapolations from historical dividends or yields, with ad hoc adjustments or overrides for changing market conditions, like interest rates. But I thought it almost certain that the statement estimates were better than mine, so preferred those, loving that they to not require me to do research and (mis)calculations. When using them for current-year tax planning, I used them very cautiously, since in most cases, yield and income vary with economic and market conditions.

The statements with those numbers have a Disclosures section, which under Portfolio holdings, Estimated values on statements, has a nice long paragraph on these numbers. They make clear limitations and warn, among other things, "they should not be relied on for making investment, trading, or tax decisions". And they provide some high level information on what these numbers are, including: "Certain security types estimate the annual yield based on historical actual income paid while others estimate future yield based on existing conditions."

[osmalfa]

Vanguard also dropped the Cost basis summary (Realized gain/loss and Unrealized gain/loss) from the Account Overview page, and they dropped cost basis information (Total cost) from the Balances and holdings section.

Now in addition to download the statements, I have to navigate to and screenshot the Cost Basis page from their website.

Nice Job, Vanguard. Nice Way to "Streamline" things for your customers.

[ncdcpa]

Vanguard also dropped the Cost basis summary (Realized gain/loss and Unrealized gain/loss) from the Account Overview page, and they dropped cost basis information (Total cost) from the Balances and holdings section.

Now in addition to download the statements, I have to navigate to and screenshot the Cost Basis page from their website.

Nice Job, Vanguard. Nice Way to "Streamline" things for your customers.

Wow. Cost basis is important for a lot of tax and planning purposes, so it seems strange not to have it on the primary document that communicates account state. [However, I'm removing most of my additional comments about that.]

At the moment, the cost basis web page seems more printable than most of the new Vanguard web pages, so using the print "save to pdf" feature works well.

I don't see a way to get historical cost basis, but don't see a need for that except maybe to check my understanding of gains on a 1099, which is silly, since software never makes mistakes.

[nisiprius]

Boo. To be fair, it doesn't affect me, as I didn't use those numbers. But I perceive it as part of a pattern of Vanguard cutting back on things they used to provide.

Hmmm.... I also noticed that the "look" of the statements has changed just a bit. This is very subtle and people are going to laugh at me for even mentioning it. (This is NOT a "complaint," by the way). It looks to me as if the printing technology has changed, and the new statement is subtly grayer and less crisp than before. It's still coming from "Monroe, Wisconsin" so I assume it's still the R. R. Donnelly plant. Am I nuts or have others noticed this?

Same scanner, same settings, same magnification as close as I can get it. The typeface for "Vanguard Voyager Select Services®" looks different to me. Tighter spaces between the letters--a bit too tight in my opinion. And there's a barcode, which I won't reproduce in case it encodes personal data, which has changed position on the page, size, and shape.

I wonder who changed something, Vanguard or R. R. Donnelly?

Either way, it's definitely a conspiracy.

[osmalfa]

Perhaps they're paying for printer toner or ink by the molecule...

[jebmke]

The cost basis is showing on my holdings. I export it to an Excel file every time I make a buy or sale affecting my taxable account.

Not concerned it isn't on statement. It will be on the tax doc.

[BolderBoy]

Mine no longer show pending Settlement Fund balances (admittedly trivial amounts).

Only get the eStatements.

[osmalfa]

Some people have (perhaps multiple) buys in their taxable accounts every month: they're called automatic reinvestments. Export That.

[zoenw]

My latest statement from Vanguard eliminated avg price/share, total cost, income and yield. It's basically useless. If I create on online account will I be able to see and print these items in my statements again?

[Merged into previous discussion - moderator oldcomputerguy]

[Palsonn]

[merge here - mod mkc]

Vanguard has dropped the "Total cost" amount for individual funds or other securities starting October 2024 on their monthly statements. Can anyone tell me who in Vanguard management I can kevetch (complain to)??? A phone rep told me Vanguard is considering the feedback of clients on the dropping of the Total Cost figure. Can I email the new CEO of Vanguard? I like the convenience of having the cost basis on my statements for at least 2 reasons. Before on my September statement I could easily estimate the capital gain from the difference between Total Cost and current value. I like to see how much my individual funds went up or down from the time i bought them.

[Title clarified - moderator Kendall]

[jebmke]

head dude

Unrealized gains and losses can be accessed from the Holdings screen on their web site. Cost basis can be downloaded as well; I do this whenever I do a transaction in our taxable account that affects basis.

[CFM300]

Vanguard has dropped the "Total cost" amount for individual funds or other securities starting October 2024 on their monthly statements.

Thanks for the heads up on this. And welcome to the forum!

Vanguard also dropped the average price per share, total estimated annual income, and estimated yield. Bummer.

Can anyone tell me who in Vanguard management I can kevetch (complain to)???

I sent a message through their Message Center. I'll post their response when I receive it.

[zoenw]

Vanguard also dropped average price/share and total cost which gives you an idea of your capital gains if you decide to sell and also how well your stock/fund is doing compared to the price you paid. Is there an easy way to get this information in printed form for your whole portfolio--i.e. is there some way to put together a statement online that includes this information in a printable format? Dropping it out makes the statement pretty useless now. Is a Fidelity statement better?

[jebmke]

Vanguard also dropped average price/share and total cost which gives you an idea of your capital gains if you decide to sell and also how well your stock/fund is doing compared to the price you paid. Is there an easy way to get this information in printed form for your whole portfolio--i.e. is there some way to put together a statement online that includes this information in a printable format? Dropping it out makes the statement pretty useless now. Is a Fidelity statement better?

The Holdings tab allows you to select Unrealize Gains and Losses and print a report. For some obscure reason they show the IRAs but you can easily ignore accounts where the Gains and Losses are irrelevant.

[mkc]

I merged Palsonn's topic on cost basis being dropped from Vanguard's monthly statements into this one to collect the assorted statement changes into a single topic. mod mkc

[Palsonn]

CFM300, regarding "Total Cost" Vanguard deletion on statements, thank you kindly for mentioning the Vanguard "Message Center" for giving feedback about dropped "Total Cost" basis on statements. Please tell me, CFM300, how in the heck do i contact the Message Center to kevetch??? You're nice to mention that, & have a Blessed Day!

[CFM300]

CFM300, regarding "Total Cost" Vanguard deletion on statements, thank you kindly for mentioning the Vanguard "Message Center" for giving feedback about dropped "Total Cost" basis on statements. Please tell me, CFM300, how in the heck do i contact the Message Center to kevetch???

Sorry for the late response. I just saw your post.

When I log in to my account on vanguard.com, "Messages" appears in the top nav, under an envelope icon. When I click that I'm taken to the "Message Center" where I can compose and send a message to VG. I think the compose and send option has been disabled for some clients. Not sure why it's still there for me, but it is. Good luck!

[CFM300]

I sent VG a message on the 16th complaining about their removal of info on the statements. Finally received a response today.

"In an effort to streamline and simplify statements, select fields have been removed from statements starting in September and going forward into future statements."

"Your comments are important to us, and I have forwarded your feedback to our Online Development Team for review. I've also shared your concerns with our management team. Our statement design and features are based on recommendations from our clients, so comments such as yours are important as we work on enhancements."

[MakesCents]

I sent VG a message on the 16th complaining about their removal of info on the statements. Finally received a response today.

"In an effort to streamline and simplify statements, select fields have been removed from statements starting in September and going forward into future statements."

"Your comments are important to us, and I have forwarded your feedback to our Online Development Team for review. I've also shared your concerns with our management team. Our statement design and features are based on recommendations from our clients, so comments such as yours are important as we work on enhancements."

I just noticed this and I will be writing to them also. I hope more folks will as well.
I found it be helpful in at least a rough estimation. It already said 'estimated', so I wasn't banking on it. But to go through the work tracking it isn't my thing, especially if they have the data.

It was Very Helpful of 'At a Glance', in the Taxable Account Statements. It was there in August.
Helped me estimate tax payments
And as others wrote, the cost fell off the statement as well!


Not happy about this At All.

MakesCents
edited about the cost basis missing info

[MakesCents]

I hope that all who found the information useful will write them.
I ?think? we are shareholders of the company?

Are there other brokerage companies that provide that info (key Metrics)? I can't imagine they don't? Or am I dreaming?

Makes Cents

[MakesCents]

Here's the basics of their reply

the removal of certain pieces of information such as cost basis, estimated income fields and pending distributions are part of a multi-year statement initiative meant to simplify the amount of information included on account statements

estimated annual income section removed because Vanguard wants to encourage clients to utilize the actual income/yield information found on vanguard.com
and provide it to their tax advisor for any tax planning

"Multi year statement initiative" sounds like more changes are in the plans.
Simplify - removing key data/metrics, when they have the data, already had it on the statement, makes no sense to me. Seems like pushing off work to the investors, even though, the reporting fields were already on the statements.


MakesCents

[mmse]

Confirming removal of cost basis information from the statement. Wrote a message asking for rationale and alternative. I do not think screenshots of a web page is a fair replacement to the official account statement.

[MakesCents]

I might inquire How Long does VG intend to archive, with easy access to official documents, the cost basis of anything? With actual purchase records, and without a cost for the reports to investors.
I've known other companies that just can't get it, and they say rely on your own records. But what if we have none?
If I'm not mistaken, the record keeping, for IRS, is on the owner.

It's always been put on the investors to save their records. But VG seems to be making it harder?

[jebmke]

I might inquire How Long does VG intend to archive, with easy access to official documents, the cost basis of anything? With actual purchase records, and without a cost for the reports to investors.
I've known other companies that just can't get it, and they say rely on your own records. But what if we have none?
If I'm not mistaken, the record keeping, for IRS, is on the owner.

It's always been put on the investors to save their records. But VG seems to be making it harder?

Download your basis after each transaction or at least once a year. Some people don’t even retain a copy of their statements so not clear the presence on a statement helps everyone.

[rkhusky]

Isn’t Vanguard required to maintain cost basis info for covered shares?

[Geologist]

I might inquire How Long does VG intend to archive, with easy access to official documents, the cost basis of anything? With actual purchase records, and without a cost for the reports to investors.
I've known other companies that just can't get it, and they say rely on your own records. But what if we have none?
If I'm not mistaken, the record keeping, for IRS, is on the owner.

It's always been put on the investors to save their records. But VG seems to be making it harder?

Financial institutions are required to keep records of cost basis of covered shares indefinitely and report sales of covered shares with the basis in annual 1099's (which both the IRS and the shareholder get). Financial institutions are required to maintain nothing more than average basis for non covered shares (and they don't report anything about these sales to the IRS at all). If you want to use specific ID for noncovered shares, you need your own records.

I don't see how Vanguard is making it harder. Your own records in this case are the records of your transactions (purchase and sale). With spreadsheets, calculation of gains or losses is straightforward.

[rkhusky]

I download a custom transaction report for each of my accounts at the end of the year, sorted by fund, along with the December statements. That should be enough to reconstruct anything if I need to in the future.

[MakesCents]

Well, I had stocks purchased at a brokerage after the 'rule that brokerages had to track basis" passed, and those shares were transferred to VG.

VG didn't have the basis.
VGs answer as to why the cost basis wasn't carried over?

The reporting brokerage didn't include it in the transfer.
I wrote to the transfer company and they basically said, oh well. Don't have it.

It's still up to us to keep track it.

https://www.finra.org/investors/insight ... sis-basics

"4 Recordkeeping Tips
While brokerage firms have cost-basis reporting obligations, it's still important for you to keep good records of your transactions. Follow these tips:

Keep an electronic or printed copy of your trade confirmations showing how much you paid for specific shares.
Keep track of stock dividends or non-dividend distributions you receive, because they may affect the cost basis of your shares.
If you purchased stock of a company at different times and prices and can adequately identify the shares you sold, their basis is the cost for those specific shares. If you can’t determine exactly which shares you’re selling, tax rules generally require you to calculate a gain or loss as if you’re selling the earliest acquired shares (sometimes referred to as the "first in, first out" method).
If you received the securities as a gift or through an inheritance, you might have to find out what the fair market value was when it was given to you or the previous owner's adjusted basis.
IRS Publication 550 offers detailed guidance on how to calculate cost basis under different circumstances. It's also sound practice to consult with a tax professional when computing and reporting a gain or loss.

The bottom line is that the IRS expects you to maintain records that identify the cost basis of your securities. If you don’t have adequate records, you might have to rely on the cost basis that your brokerage firm reports—or you may be required to treat the cost basis as zero, which could mean owing more in taxes. For this reason, consider checking whether you have cost basis information for securities you want to sell before doing so."

Statements with all information are really important at this point.
YES they are required to report sales, but only with the information they have.
Per IRS rules, you are allowed to correct it.
But you need to prove it.

MakesCents

[MakesCents]

For a sale this year
Thankfully, I have statements dating back to 2012, after the 2011 rule of brokerages reporting gains/losses passed, so I can prove my cost basis - which VG didn't receive.

Did a spreadsheet to figure it out and can prove my basis with paperwork to back it up, with real statements.

I honestly thought investing would be easy after that law, but such is not the case, as far as cost basis.

That's why full statements are still important.
Brokerages: S/W changes, things change, no company is going to keep anything indefinitely

MakesCents

[MakesCents]

And as for how long statements or transactions records are available for is also a concern.
I know my bank, does a limited amount of time to access statements without a fee. Can't download a few years without $ paying.
And a few years is short in investment time.

So download your transactions as the archives might cost.
Sorry to be a Negative Nancy, but, I'm just not liking where this 'simplifying' is going.

MakesCents
or not

[ncdcpa]

Isn’t Vanguard required to maintain cost basis info for covered shares?

I think so, but who is that young?

[UpperNwGuy]

Why not just use the Vanguard website for this information? What's so special about the monthly statements?

[ncdcpa]

Why not just use the Vanguard website for this information? What's so special about the monthly statements?

About basis: Statements tend to get filed away for periods longer than things are kept in customer facing web sites. Web sites tend to be more transient. Over long periods of time, there can be reasons to change custodians, perhaps leaving some history behind, not necessarily recognized until you need it. Even when keeping statements, an occasional statement gets lost or misfiled, so having key info like basis reported regularly can come in hand.

About estimated yield and annual income: it can be convenient to have custodian estimates, but they are only estimates. Having to pull together my own just adds to cost of financial management, in either my time or that of another service provider (e.g., tax guy). And may make it less likely that one gets around to refining tax plans as often as might be advantageous.

[abuss368]

Why not just use the Vanguard website for this information? What's so special about the monthly statements?

About basis: Statements tend to get filed away for periods longer than things are kept in customer facing web sites. Web sites tend to be more transient. Over long periods of time, there can be reasons to change custodians, perhaps leaving some history behind, not necessarily recognized until you need it. Even when keeping statements, an occasional statement gets lost or misfiled, so having key info like basis reported regularly can come in hand.

About estimated yield and annual income: it can be convenient to have custodian estimates, but they are only estimates. Having to pull together my own just adds to cost of financial management, in either my time or that of another service provider (e.g., tax guy). And may make it less likely that one gets around to refining tax plans as often as might be advantageous.

Hi ncdcpa -

In some respects, I believe the overall value of investments statements are declined over the years.

Now that basis is required and reported, it lowered the overall value of monthly statements.

I personally have not used any information on monthly statements in years.

The cost basis tax reporting statement that Vanguard provides is all that is needed.

In reviewing the amounts reported for basis and proceeds, I have never uncovered any errors.

Best.
Tony

[abuss368]

Why not just use the Vanguard website for this information? What's so special about the monthly statements?

Hi UpperNwGuy -

I too have thought about this over the years.

Many years ago, monthly statements provided value and were used in tax return preparation.

Please see my response upthread.

In my opinion, since cost basis was required to be reported many years ago, the results was a decline in value (if any) of monthly statements.

Best.
Tony

[abuss368]

Bogleheads -

Who does not download, print, save monthly statements but rather selects the transaction report feature on Vanguard’s website and runs 1 simple report for the year with all transactions?

Much less space.

Best.
Tony

[rkhusky]

Isn’t Vanguard required to maintain cost basis info for covered shares?

I think so, but who is that young?

That’s irrelevant. Vanguard hasn’t been providing actual cost basis for noncovered shares for a long time. Before 2012 you should have been keeping track of it yourself anyway. But, even so, they still have transaction history online going back a lot further than that.

[Halicar]

I hope this isn't too far off-topic, but I've had a taxable brokerage account at Vanguard holding VFIAX for about ten years now. I add to it occasionally and reinvest dividends. I will likely start withdrawing from it in 10-15 years. Is there anything I should be doing now to make life easier at that time re. cost basis of shares I sell?

[jebmke]

I hope this isn't too far off-topic, but I've had a taxable brokerage account at Vanguard holding VFIAX for about ten years now. I add to it occasionally and reinvest dividends. I will likely start withdrawing from it in 10-15 years. Is there anything I should be doing now to make life easier at that time re. cost basis of shares I sell?

Have you selected a cost basis method on the VG site?

[Halicar]

I hope this isn't too far off-topic, but I've had a taxable brokerage account at Vanguard holding VFIAX for about ten years now. I add to it occasionally and reinvest dividends. I will likely start withdrawing from it in 10-15 years. Is there anything I should be doing now to make life easier at that time re. cost basis of shares I sell?

Have you selected a cost basis method on the VG site?

I had to look it up--it says I haven't selected one.

[jebmke]

Have you selected a cost basis method on the VG site?

I had to look it up--it says I haven't selected one.

Specific ID gives you the most flexibility as to which lots are sold with what cost basis. That allows you to sell in the most tax efficient way.

[Halicar]

I had to look it up--it says I haven't selected one.

Specific ID gives you the most flexibility as to which lots are sold with what cost basis. That allows you to sell in the most tax efficient way.

So when the time comes to withdraw, will the site provide me with the choice of all the lots? Is that something I should start keeping track of and organizing now? I see that I can download a transaction report with dates and prices of every purchase and reinvestment. Is it any use to import that into Excel and maintain it going forward?

Thank you for your input.

[jebmke]

Specific ID gives you the most flexibility as to which lots are sold with what cost basis. That allows you to sell in the most tax efficient way.

So when the time comes to withdraw, will the site provide me with the choice of all the lots? Is that something I should start keeping track of and organizing now? I see that I can download a transaction report with dates and prices of every purchase and reinvestment. Is it any use to import that into Excel and maintain it going forward?

Thank you for your input.

Yes, you will be able to select specific lots to sell.

They will maintain the cost information but for redundancy, at least once a year I download the cost basis information from the site and preserve a copy in a spreadsheet.