Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

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ebeb
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Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by ebeb »

Hello,

After combing through many of the posts looking for fee-only financial/investment advisors (non-AUM based), I see the below advisors come up frequently based on their reputation on this site. Although many members suggest DIY bogleheads way, at times it does help to get to know some unknown unknowns .....that tends to be the difficult ones. :D

Rick Ferri - https://rickferri.com - $450/hr or $925 for 2hrs review divided into 6-minute segments at $45 per segment.
Allan S. Roth - https://daretobedull.com - one-time plan for $450 an hour with plans starting at 8-10 hours, depending upon complexity.
MARK ZORIL - https://planvisionmn.com - first year price $239, auto renew at the end of the first year at $8 a month, can cancel any time.
Mike Piper, CPA - https://michaelrpiper.com - Initial engagements typically require 8-16 hours of work, billed at $300/hour rate.

Some members have suggested searching advisors in below websites:
https://www.garrettplanningnetwork.com/ fee-only advisors search directory
Harry Sit - https://adviceonlyfinancial.com/ - provides list of advisors $200
https://www.napfa.org/ - fee only advisor search directory

Update 7/16/2022: Came across this blog that list some more advisers some are expensive: https://robberger.com/low-cost-financial-advisors/


Please suggest any other fee-only advisors that you may be aware of or have had good experience with.

Thanks!
Last edited by ebeb on Tue Aug 01, 2023 4:31 pm, edited 7 times in total.
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nedsaid
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by nedsaid »

At $450 an hour, I would get right to the point! No chit-chat. Ferri and Roth would be worth the fees given their vast experience and expertise.
A fool and his money are good for business.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Kevin K »

I wanted to get a second opinion on my portfolio and help with SS claiming strategies and such since I turn 65 this year, and had read about Rick Ferri's "Porfolio Second Opinion" program. But Rick being a well-known author was already booked well into next year and on his website he recommended his colleague Jon Luskin.

Jon is a Boglehead through-and-through and is very knowledgeable. I've been mostly a DIY investor for the past 25+ years but was with a very good FA (Evanson Asset Management - low cost, very much into DFA funds and highly-diversified defensive portfolios) for about 4 years. I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.

I paid for Jon's portfolio second opinion ($925 but it looks like the price has just gone up to $1125) and found it to be well worth the money and time spent. He saved me a multiple of his fee. I recommend him highly.

https://jonluskin.com
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by secondopinion »

Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I wanted to get a second opinion on my portfolio and help with SS claiming strategies and such since I turn 65 this year, and had read about Rick Ferri's "Porfolio Second Opinion" program. But Rick being a well-known author was already booked well into next year and on his website he recommended his colleague Jon Luskin.
I certainly do not think you mean me, right?
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midlifeinvestor
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by midlifeinvestor »

Thank you for compiling this list. Do any of these advisors provide services for small accounts, assuming about $400K in taxable and IRA accounts in total, is considered as a small account? If so, can you please point which ones from the list do?

thank you!
Soon2BXProgrammer
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Soon2BXProgrammer »

nedsaid wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:04 pm At $450 an hour, I would get right to the point! No chit-chat. Ferri and Roth would be worth the fees given their vast experience and expertise.
Some people view the chit chat as unnecessary, but during that time, i typically find out many qualitative points about a person, which are required to be able to give good advice.

When people want to skip it, i point out if i didn't figure out that your tired and exhausted because you are the part time care giver for your mother in law, how can i give you good advice, since it appears you are responsible for someone you didn't write on the paperwork?

my point is, the qualitative section is important, and can't be skipped, and provide a comprehensive service.
Earned 43 (and counting) credit hours of financial planning related education from a regionally accredited university, but I am not your advisor.
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retiredjg
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by retiredjg »

I think it is a great idea to pull this information into a central location. However, I'd like to point out that the term "fee only" does not mean what a lot of people think it means.

"Fee only" just means that the advisor does not receive commissions. "Fee only" actually includes advisors who use the AUM model for compensation.

Here is what I mean by that - of the people mentioned so far I believe that Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin only offer advice service. To my knowledge, none of these people actually manage your money for you. This is the type of advisor that would be found on Harry Sit's "advice only" list (also mentioned in the original post).

On the other hand, people on the Garrett Network and NAPFA network might use several types of compensation including retainers, AUM, hourly fees, or flat fees. All of those are considered "fee only" as long as the advisor does not also receive commissions. Many (maybe all?) of the people on these lists do manage your money for you. I've read here at BH that some do not even offer an "advice only" service.

For someone who is considering looking for assistance, you must be very specific about what type of assistance you are looking for. Are you simply looking for advice? Or are you looking for someone to actually manage your money for you? Be sure this is clearly understood before making an appointment.
Last edited by retiredjg on Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
midlifeinvestor
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

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retiredjg wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:06 am I think it is a great idea to pull this information into a central location. However, I'd like to point out that the term "fee only" does not mean what a lot of people think it means.

"Fee only" just means that the advisor does not receive commissions. "Fee only" actually includes advisors who use the AUM model for compensation.

Here is what I mean by that - of the people mentioned so far I believe that Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin only offer advice service. To my knowledge, none of these people actually manage your money for you. This is the type of advisor that would be found on Harry Sit's "advice only" list (also mentioned in the original post).

On the other hand, people on the Garrett Network and NAPFA network might use several types of compensation including retainers, AUM, hourly fees, or flat fees. All of those are considered "fee only" as long as the advisor does not also receive commissions. Many (maybe all?) of the people on these lists do manage your money for you. I've read here at BH that some do not even offer an "advice only" service.

For someone who is considering looking for assistance, you must be very specific about what type of assistance you are looking for. Do you want advice or maybe just a second opinion? Or are you looking for someone to actually manage your money for you? Be sure this is clearly understood before making an appointment.
Great pointers and the details. Can you please clarify what is the difference between advice and second opinion here?
I thought both are same. I have not used an advisor before but I am looking to approach one.

I am looking for advice-only and not AUM. Therefore, I can consider Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin etc - but do these folks provide a financial plan based on your salary, expenses, and how much do I have in my brokerage accounts?
In addition to that if I want them to take a peek/deep-dive into my current portfolios in various brokerage account, is this considered as a second opinion? if so, do I have to approach different kind of advisors and how do I do that? Again, I am not interested in AUM.
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ebeb
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by ebeb »

midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:15 am Thank you for compiling this list. Do any of these advisors provide services for small accounts, assuming about $400K in taxable and IRA accounts in total, is considered as a small account? If so, can you please point which ones from the list do?

thank you!
I don't presume 400k is that small considering the savings of many retirement accounts in USA. All the advisors especially fee-only will be happy to advice for that amount. And it is a good amount to start getting some solid advice. I would go with the $189 plan from MARK ZORIL and if still not satisfied then try the others like Rick Ferri or Alan Roth.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by vanbogle59 »

Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.
Cool! Care to share a vague example or 2? :D
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by midlifeinvestor »

ebeb wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:16 am
midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:15 am Thank you for compiling this list. Do any of these advisors provide services for small accounts, assuming about $400K in taxable and IRA accounts in total, is considered as a small account? If so, can you please point which ones from the list do?

thank you!
I don't presume 400k is that small considering the savings of many retirement accounts in USA. All the advisors especially fee-only will be happy to advice for that amount. And it is a good amount to start getting some solid advice. I would go with the $189 plan from MARK ZORIL and if still not satisfied then try the others like Rick Ferri or Alan Roth.
Thank you for clarification and the recommendation about Mark Zoril, in fact I was researching his website and it looks promising to start with $189.

Also, I took a look at "https://adviceonlyfinancial.com/ - provides list of advisors " website and I see they charge $200 just to have access to the list of nationwide advice-only advisors. Not knowing enough about it, is this fee worth it? Just curious
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Soon2BXProgrammer »

midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:24 am
ebeb wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:16 am
midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:15 am Thank you for compiling this list. Do any of these advisors provide services for small accounts, assuming about $400K in taxable and IRA accounts in total, is considered as a small account? If so, can you please point which ones from the list do?

thank you!
I don't presume 400k is that small considering the savings of many retirement accounts in USA. All the advisors especially fee-only will be happy to advice for that amount. And it is a good amount to start getting some solid advice. I would go with the $189 plan from MARK ZORIL and if still not satisfied then try the others like Rick Ferri or Alan Roth.
Thank you for clarification and the recommendation about Mark Zoril, in fact I was researching his website and it looks promising to start with $189.

Also, I took a look at "https://adviceonlyfinancial.com/ - provides list of advisors " website and I see they charge $200 just to have access to the list of nationwide advice-only advisors. Not knowing enough about it, is this fee worth it? Just curious
Advice only is the business where people literally only sell their advice/time. No commissions, no AUM, nothing. They are hard to find. (However they are findable, but very hard to find, as the number that I know is quite small).

Edit: i think one has to also decide if that is the service you actually want.. I'm not saying it isn't, but it isn't the service for "delegators"
Earned 43 (and counting) credit hours of financial planning related education from a regionally accredited university, but I am not your advisor.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by retiredjg »

midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:12 am Great pointers and the details. Can you please clarify what is the difference between advice and second opinion here?
I did not intend for that to sound either/or. To me they would be essentially the same thing. Sorry.

I am looking for advice-only and not AUM. Therefore, I can consider Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin etc - but do these folks provide a financial plan based on your salary, expenses, and how much do I have in my brokerage accounts?
In addition to that if I want them to take a peek/deep-dive into my current portfolios in various brokerage account, is this considered as a second opinion? if so, do I have to approach different kind of advisors and how do I do that? Again, I am not interested in AUM.
I have not used any of these advisors but I would expect that each one (and any other advice only advisor you might find on Harry Sit's website) to look at your complete financial situation. I can't see doing this with two different people unless you just want a variety of opinions.
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ebeb
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by ebeb »

midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:12 am
I am looking for advice-only and not AUM. Therefore, I can consider Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin etc - but do these folks provide a financial plan based on your salary, expenses, and how much do I have in my brokerage accounts?
In addition to that if I want them to take a peek/deep-dive into my current portfolios in various brokerage account, is this considered as a second opinion? if so, do I have to approach different kind of advisors and how do I do that? Again, I am not interested in AUM.
The way I understood Mark Zoril plan, you need to enter all your money scattered in all places and income and expenses into their online system. This gives him an overall picture of your finances and then he will review and make a plan and recommendation on the entirety of your portfolio and risk profile and future goals.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by retiredjg »

midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:24 am Also, I took a look at "https://adviceonlyfinancial.com/ - provides list of advisors " website and I see they charge $200 just to have access to the list of nationwide advice-only advisors. Not knowing enough about it, is this fee worth it? Just curious
I think it is worth it if you do not easily find something on your own. Some of the people already mentioned are booked out for months and you may not wish to wait that long. Or you might want try to find someone you can visit face to face. Or whatever.

If you do not easily find something you are interested in, Harry has done the legwork for you - worth $200 if you consider how much time it might take to contact a number of people/firms.

However, I understand why you would ask. You don't know if there are 5 people on his list or 500. :happy Harry does answer email if you want to ask. (He is also a "known" entity around here - not a stranger - having posted on the BH forums for years.)
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by midlifeinvestor »

retiredjg wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:44 am
midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:12 am Great pointers and the details. Can you please clarify what is the difference between advice and second opinion here?
I did not intend for that to sound either/or. To me they would be essentially the same thing. Sorry.

I am looking for advice-only and not AUM. Therefore, I can consider Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin etc - but do these folks provide a financial plan based on your salary, expenses, and how much do I have in my brokerage accounts?
In addition to that if I want them to take a peek/deep-dive into my current portfolios in various brokerage account, is this considered as a second opinion? if so, do I have to approach different kind of advisors and how do I do that? Again, I am not interested in AUM.
I have not used any of these advisors but I would expect that each one (and any other advice only advisor you might find on Harry Sit's website) to look at your complete financial situation. I can't see doing this with two different people unless you just want a variety of opinions.
Got it, thank you very much!
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by midlifeinvestor »

ebeb wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:54 am
midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:12 am
I am looking for advice-only and not AUM. Therefore, I can consider Rick Ferri, Allan Roth, Mark Zoril, and Jon Luskin etc - but do these folks provide a financial plan based on your salary, expenses, and how much do I have in my brokerage accounts?
In addition to that if I want them to take a peek/deep-dive into my current portfolios in various brokerage account, is this considered as a second opinion? if so, do I have to approach different kind of advisors and how do I do that? Again, I am not interested in AUM.
The way I understood Mark Zoril plan, you need to enter all your money scattered in all places and income and expenses into their online system. This gives him an overall picture of your finances and then he will review and make a plan and recommendation on the entirety of your portfolio and risk profile and future goals.
Thanks again, yours and retiredjg's response also clears my confusion :)
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by midlifeinvestor »

retiredjg wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:00 am
midlifeinvestor wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:24 am Also, I took a look at "https://adviceonlyfinancial.com/ - provides list of advisors " website and I see they charge $200 just to have access to the list of nationwide advice-only advisors. Not knowing enough about it, is this fee worth it? Just curious
I think it is worth it if you do not easily find something on your own. Some of the people already mentioned are booked out for months and you may not wish to wait that long. Or you might want try to find someone you can visit face to face. Or whatever.

If you do not easily find something you are interested in, Harry has done the legwork for you - worth $200 if you consider how much time it might take to contact a number of people/firms.

However, I understand why you would ask. You don't know if there are 5 people on his list or 500. :happy Harry does answer email if you want to ask. (He is also a "known" entity around here - not a stranger - having posted on the BH forums for years.)
Nice 😊 , agree with all the points you quoted, thank you!
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

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vanbogle59 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:17 am
Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.
Cool! Care to share a vague example or 2? :D
It would be very helpful if anybody who has some experience managing their own finances could point out some specific recommendations where an adviser added value. For example for me it would have helped if an adviser had looked at my situation and told me, before I had realized it, how my RMDs (still more than 10 yrs in the future) were getting a bit out of hand. I knew the math for compounding and RMDs, but simply had failed to apply them to my own situation in a timely manner.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

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tibbitts wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:10 am
vanbogle59 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:17 am
Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.
Cool! Care to share a vague example or 2? :D
It would be very helpful if anybody who has some experience managing their own finances could point out some specific recommendations where an adviser added value. For example for me it would have helped if an adviser had looked at my situation and told me, before I had realized it, how my RMDs (still more than 10 yrs in the future) were getting a bit out of hand. I knew the math for compounding and RMDs, but simply had failed to apply them to my own situation in a timely manner.
A family member was advised to use all his assets to purchase an annuity. This would probably have been a good financial idea because that mentally ill family member spent all the money on cocaine in instead. But the advisor did not know that at the time. The rational reason the family member had to justify not making that purchase was that the person was too young and inflation would have made even an SPIA only a bad choice at the time, which was a correct reason not to follow that advice. It actually turns out that if an SPIA had been purchased it would have increased annual income to exceed the limit for qualifying for elderly waiver Medicaid assistance, which would be a huge problem now if it were the case.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by tibbitts »

dbr wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 9:39 am
tibbitts wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:10 am
vanbogle59 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:17 am
Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.
Cool! Care to share a vague example or 2? :D
It would be very helpful if anybody who has some experience managing their own finances could point out some specific recommendations where an adviser added value. For example for me it would have helped if an adviser had looked at my situation and told me, before I had realized it, how my RMDs (still more than 10 yrs in the future) were getting a bit out of hand. I knew the math for compounding and RMDs, but simply had failed to apply them to my own situation in a timely manner.
A family member was advised to use all his assets to purchase an annuity. This would probably have been a good financial idea because that mentally ill family member spent all the money on cocaine in instead. But the advisor did not know that at the time. The rational reason the family member had to justify not making that purchase was that the person was too young and inflation would have made even an SPIA only a bad choice at the time, which was a correct reason not to follow that advice. It actually turns out that if an SPIA had been purchased it would have increased annual income to exceed the limit for qualifying for elderly waiver Medicaid assistance, which would be a huge problem now if it were the case.
That's an excellent example where I'm not sure any financial adviser would have known even all the financial pieces of that situation, much less the behavioral aspects. And sometimes if you or an adviser misses some "little" detail (like the Medicaid limits, or other state-specific assistance program limits) you can have a serious problem. Although it probably does illustrate that doing all of anything is usually not a good idea, be it buying an annuity, or the often-discussed Roth conversions, or anything else.
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

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I'm hoping that people will add some more names to the list. :happy
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by ebeb »

retiredjg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:10 am I'm hoping that people will add some more names to the list. :happy
Yes more the merrier :D
I just paid for Mark Zoril plan lets see how it goes!
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by midlifeinvestor »

ebeb wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:17 am
retiredjg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:10 am I'm hoping that people will add some more names to the list. :happy
Yes more the merrier :D
I just paid for Mark Zoril plan lets see how it goes!
So did I, I am hoping the same :)
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by nedsaid »

Soon2BXProgrammer wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 6:31 am
nedsaid wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:04 pm At $450 an hour, I would get right to the point! No chit-chat. Ferri and Roth would be worth the fees given their vast experience and expertise.
Some people view the chit chat as unnecessary, but during that time, i typically find out many qualitative points about a person, which are required to be able to give good advice.

When people want to skip it, i point out if i didn't figure out that your tired and exhausted because you are the part time care giver for your mother in law, how can i give you good advice, since it appears you are responsible for someone you didn't write on the paperwork?

my point is, the qualitative section is important, and can't be skipped, and provide a comprehensive service.
You are right, if I was paying that much per hour, I would want to maximize the effectiveness of the time billed.
A fool and his money are good for business.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Soon2BXProgrammer »

nedsaid wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:26 pm
Soon2BXProgrammer wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 6:31 am
nedsaid wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:04 pm At $450 an hour, I would get right to the point! No chit-chat. Ferri and Roth would be worth the fees given their vast experience and expertise.
Some people view the chit chat as unnecessary, but during that time, i typically find out many qualitative points about a person, which are required to be able to give good advice.

When people want to skip it, i point out if i didn't figure out that your tired and exhausted because you are the part time care giver for your mother in law, how can i give you good advice, since it appears you are responsible for someone you didn't write on the paperwork?

my point is, the qualitative section is important, and can't be skipped, and provide a comprehensive service.
You are right, if I was paying that much per hour, I would want to maximize the effectiveness of the time billed.
I try to explain to people, that with modest levels of wealth, the first year, might not be less then an AUM advisor, in fact in some situations, paying hourly can be more then an AUM advisor for an early career HENRY (high earner not rich yet). However, the value is in the outyears, because the first year is normally the most expensive on hourly, then after that its cheap. Whereas, AUM gets more and more expensive over time.

(with high levels of wealth, the first year can be a savings as well)
Earned 43 (and counting) credit hours of financial planning related education from a regionally accredited university, but I am not your advisor.
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Kevin K »

vanbogle59 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:17 am
Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.
Cool! Care to share a vague example or 2? :D
Sure. Among the most useful items for me were how to properly use an HSA to sock away money for our health care expenses even though we don't have earned income anymore, a detailed check list for power-of-attorney and estate-related items I hadn't dealt with properly and a good strategy for combining delayed Social Security claiming with a rising equity glidepath that helps us, as new retirees, strike the right balance between spending on things we enjoy while we're still able-bodied enough to do them and hedging against sequence-of-returns risk.
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by CrazyCatLady »

ebeb wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:17 am
retiredjg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:10 am I'm hoping that people will add some more names to the list. :happy
Yes more the merrier :D
I just paid for Mark Zoril plan lets see how it goes!
Please share how it goes. Mark Zoril is on my list, but I haven't purchased yet. I'm looking for someone to help on tax planning/retirement planning at 10 years out, and I'm not sure if that is his thing.

The following are not fee only advisors, but I've been watching their videos on YouTube and they have a lot of good videos to help identify issues (which maybe you can then raise with Mark or another fee only advisor):

--Sensible Money: they do AUM fees (1.25%), but also you can purchase what they call their juicing plan for $6900 which is apparently a comprehensive retirement plan without the AUM element.

--Safeguard Wealth Management: seems to only be AUM, but their fee is only 0.48%, they use low cost ETFs, and they seem to offer comprehensive tax planning as part of that fee. Bonus is that they actually presented the SS tax torpedo and cap gains tax torpedo in a way I understood it.

--Oak Harvest Financial: strictly AUM and you have to have at least $500,000 under management, but their videos are informative.
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nedsaid
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by nedsaid »

Soon2BXProgrammer wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:52 pm
nedsaid wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:26 pm
Soon2BXProgrammer wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 6:31 am
nedsaid wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:04 pm At $450 an hour, I would get right to the point! No chit-chat. Ferri and Roth would be worth the fees given their vast experience and expertise.
Some people view the chit chat as unnecessary, but during that time, i typically find out many qualitative points about a person, which are required to be able to give good advice.

When people want to skip it, i point out if i didn't figure out that your tired and exhausted because you are the part time care giver for your mother in law, how can i give you good advice, since it appears you are responsible for someone you didn't write on the paperwork?

my point is, the qualitative section is important, and can't be skipped, and provide a comprehensive service.
You are right, if I was paying that much per hour, I would want to maximize the effectiveness of the time billed.
I try to explain to people, that with modest levels of wealth, the first year, might not be less then an AUM advisor, in fact in some situations, paying hourly can be more then an AUM advisor for an early career HENRY (high earner not rich yet). However, the value is in the outyears, because the first year is normally the most expensive on hourly, then after that its cheap. Whereas, AUM gets more and more expensive over time.

(with high levels of wealth, the first year can be a savings as well)
Yep. As the account balance grows, so does the AUM fee. Paying for advice by the hour is most cost effective.
A fool and his money are good for business.
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Harry Livermore
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Harry Livermore »

ebeb wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:17 am
retiredjg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:10 am I'm hoping that people will add some more names to the list. :happy
Yes more the merrier :D
I just paid for Mark Zoril plan lets see how it goes!
Care to follow up? Were you happy with the service?
Cheers
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ebeb
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by ebeb »

Harry Livermore wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:35 pm Care to follow up? Were you happy with the service?
Cheers
I did use Mark Zoril services for $189 and he gave some good advice. Also he gave me access to free emoney account https://wealth.emaplan.com/ to consolidate all my investment accounts info in one place to look at instead of using a spreadsheet, which is very useful to see your long term goal and whether you will hit your retirement goals and do some detailed simulations. He provided various scenarios and provided the likelihood of assets lasting through ones lifetime and even suggested the possibility of retiring few years early based on withdrawal and investment returns. Overall lot of info to plan ahead and ability to talk to him whenever one needs advice is good bonus. No complaints.
80% VOO | 20% BND+TBILL+CASH | Don't believe Nobody because Nobody knows nothin' - Anon
EvelynTroy
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Re: Fee-only financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by EvelynTroy »

tibbitts wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:10 am
vanbogle59 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:17 am
Kevin K wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm I consider myself a reasonably knowledgeable investor but Jon was able to show me several areas I needed to pay much more attention to.
Cool! Care to share a vague example or 2? :D
It would be very helpful if anybody who has some experience managing their own finances could point out some specific recommendations where an adviser added value. For example for me it would have helped if an adviser had looked at my situation and told me, before I had realized it, how my RMDs (still more than 10 yrs in the future) were getting a bit out of hand. I knew the math for compounding and RMDs, but simply had failed to apply them to my own situation in a timely manner.
Back in 2009-2010 I worked with Buckingham Asset Management, St. Louis - Larry Swedroe's firm. I was with them about 5-6 years, forget exactly. But I am very grateful for the service and am still receiving the benefit. Some years ago I wrote what I viewed as "value added" that was provided. I'm copying/pasting here: (it's long so you're prepared :D )

One big example – I will get a teacher retirement pension (now receiving it) – I had several years in the system that I could buy back – it never dawned on me that it could be in my best interest to purchase these years - it was expensive.
Advisor spent considerable time contacting the retirement system gathering the info – and calculating if I would be better off continuing to invest that amt. or buying the years. Bottom line it would have been foolish for me not to buy these years of pension credit. They completed the paperwork and facilitated the transfer of funds. They also did some research on the financial stability of my pension system.
The advisor initiated all of this – it wasn’t me questioning anything. The advisor could have recommended I not purchase the pension years back – it would have been about $50K more assets under management they would have gotten more fees on.
The point – the effort the advisor made will be more money in my pocket with no risk. This was the emphasis – I could probably make a little more on an investment but would take a lot more risk.
I’ve also gotten hand-holding on a variety of other things – that either helped me save some money, or reassured me on one thing or another, i.e. they calculated it was better for me to pay off my mortgage – another $70K they could be managing and increasing their fee. They recommended what was in my best interest.

Advisor accompanied me to estate attorney’s office twice for the initial consultations and worked with me throughout the process of establishing a trust – reviewing the trust when completed, phoning the attorney to answer questions. This was one of those tasks that the advisor must have reminded me half dozen times I needed to get this done - I kept procrastinating. She must have nudged me half dozen times to get this done.

The tax professionals at the firm have helped my sister with tax questions – she reports so helpful to her with always an encouraging, “call anytime – we’re happy to help you.”
My sister does my taxes - its helpful she has someone to call – I know nothing about taxes. My advisor has phoned my sister numerous times to explain why things were done in terms of the tax consequences.
We explored long-term care insurance – not in my best interest because of my age and assets I hold.
Some months ago - I had some new money to invest and profits that needed to be looked at, and according to my plan it was time to reduce equities ( my portfolio 40% equities and 60% fixed income)
- I’ll just include the summary of the email:
... the repositioning is completed and in line with the more tax advantageous manner we discussed.
· Reducing the equity in your IRA can reduce your Required Minimum Distributions that begin at 70.5 and less tax owed
· Equities in your trust are subject to lower tax rates
· Your beneficiaries will benefit from a step up in value of your trust assets at your death which eliminates capital gain tax. Equities in an IRA are not eligible for the step up benefit.
There are multiple strategies going on at the same time within the portfolio, tax planning, and estate.
I would have never known to do these things, much less implement them – all money saving things for me.
As noted – I am single and really don’t have anyone knowledgeable to work thru / figure out some of the different financial issues.
Decided for ME preventing a few mistakes has the potential to pay for the advisor fee.
nocker noted: “not everyone is capable - know thy self.”

FIrmly convinced for ME the importance of planning, executing, and preventing mistakes pays for the advisor fee – and finally peace of mind. My advisor encouraged me to be knowledgeable and involved. I was given copies of Larry's books. Over time I became more confident and decided to manage the portfolio myself, which has worked out fine.

Now those many years later, retired 8 years and age 75 having what for me is "enough" I'm in the planning and reviewing stages of seeking a trusted fee-only advisor that I can turn to if I have some cognitive decline, or just get tired of managing the portfolio myself, or I should become disabled or sick. I'll post specifics in another post. I chose not to do the Luskin review - nothing bad, just needed more than their service. I did have a 2nd opinion review. Someone may ask why not just go back to Buckingham if they were so good? Answer - since those days BAM has grown to be a huge firm - I want a smaller firm, plus there are others for less cost.

Hope this is helpful. All that said - for those interested in 2nd opinions/portfolio reviews and other financial advice I highly recommend as a start to do the portfolio/financial review here at Bogleheads on the Personal Investing section - the template is first rate in terms of gathering and organizing your information. Whether you do an advisor review or not you will have to compile and put together basically the same information. It also is very helpful when you see all your information in front of you to see your own picture clearer - at least it was for me. In fact when I had my recent portfolio review I approached the firm with my Boglehead template in hand, along with my ISP - I got a nice pat on the back, saying rarely had anyone ever had their information put together in such a well organized manner.

Evelyn
EvelynTroy
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by EvelynTroy »

Specific recommendations - fee-only AUM advisors -

Blankenship Financial Services -their website: https://financialducksinarow.com/
Look at the top navigation bar for their services.

This is a tiny two man, low-cost, index ETF focused firm in the tiny Illinois town of New Berlin. I visited with them in person on two occasions several years apart. As noted in my previous post I am single with no one who is financially astute to seek advice or review financial matters with. My portfolio had grown and I was thinking maybe I needed to have an advisor again or at the least look at my situation - look at my asset allocation among other things.
Spent about 45 minutes each time with my information in hand - I was assured both times I did not need an advisor and to simply stay the course. Both occasions no charge.
Very reasonable cost for on-going portfolio management, which includes tax preparation
https://financialducksinarow.com/servic ... financial/

In my search for an advisor for when I need one I would turn to this firm immediately - I just have to decide if a long distance advisor will be the best as I continue to age.

4-5 months ago I had a portfolio and financial well-being review completed at a local, St. Louis firm - Fiduciary Advisors:
https://www.fiduciaryadv.com/

They charged $1700 for the review - it was thorough, and also provided a number of follow-up phone calls with questions I had after the in person meeting.
I can’t recall the cost for on-going portfolio management - if interested it is in the ADV on the website.

Evelyn
heyyou
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by heyyou »

Evanson Asset Management (EAM) charges a flat fee (paid quarterly) that is fixed when you open your account, then not ever raised. That is reasonable since the initial portfolio set up is their most time consuming work. My fee is now less than VG's % of AUM advisory fee.

The suggested allocation is a slice and dice portfolio of DFA funds and gold, of which you can accept or reject any of the components, and you can choose your allocation's percentages if requested. Fidelity and VG funds were available, IDK current status of those. That is a minor complaint of mine, that type of policy change might not be mentioned, such as when was the commodities exposure to PCRIX discontinued, while I continued to own it? For more than 15 years at EAM, I have had the same advisor with CFA credentials, who was helpful on calculating my dozen annual IRA to Roth IRA conversions in early retirement.
solargod007
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by solargod007 »

Deliberate Finances- https://www.deliberatefinances.com (Ryan Frailich)
MomandDadmoney: https://momanddadmoney.com (Matt)
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Taylor Larimore
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Taylor Larimore »

Bogleheads:

I do not feel the need for an advisor with my simple 3-fund portfolio. However, if I were to select from advisors that I know personally, I would choose either Allan Roth CPA, CFA, or Rick Ferri, CFA . Both these advisors have graciously contributed their time and talents to "The John C. Bogle Center for Financial Literacy." I never heard of anyone disappointed with their professional assistance.

Best wishes.
Taylor
Jack Bogle's Words of Wisdom: "Tens of millions of investors need personal guidance in allocating their assets and selecting funds. Other tens of million do not."
"Simplicity is the master key to financial success." -- Jack Bogle
GeoMetry
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by GeoMetry »

https://www.jimhelps.com/

They have a comprehensive list of their fees. All their services are à la carte. They do retirement planning as well as tax planning. If you want them to manage assets their fee is capped at $5K
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Stinky
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Stinky »

Reviving an old thread.

On one of Stan the Annuity Man’s podcasts this week, he interviewed Pam Krueger, who is the host of the MoneyTrack series on PBS. Pam has set up a firm called WealthRamp - www.wealthramp.com - which is a nationwide referral network of fee-only fiduciary financial advisors.

I haven’t used the service (and don’t feel the personal need to do so now) but thought that this firm sounded promising based on the interview and a quick scan of the website.
Retired life insurance company financial executive who sincerely believes that ”It’s a GREAT day to be alive!”
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martincmartin
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by martincmartin »

There's Xyplanningnetwork.com a market place where you can find a number of financial advisors that are fixed fee.
curious george
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by curious george »

Some family members have no interest in finances and are using VG PAS but really aren't happy.
Is anybody familiar with or used Safebridge (Jack Zarinsky)? Any experience ? Seems like he also helps with a tax situation and that may be helpful as well. Record looks clean and fees are a bit high but no AUM.
stan1
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by stan1 »

curious george wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 8:42 am Some family members have no interest in finances and are using VG PAS but really aren't happy.
Is anybody familiar with or used Safebridge (Jack Zarinsky)? Any experience ? Seems like he also helps with a tax situation and that may be helpful as well. Record looks clean and fees are a bit high but no AUM.
Just curious, what would you think would be a fair hourly rate for an expert such as he seems to be, someone who provides advice, manages your investments, helps coordinate estate planning, does your taxes even, and calls frequently to check in?

Minimum wage in my state is $15.50 per hour, but there are plenty of retail jobs paying $20-25/hour to attract workers. So wouldn't you expect someone with years of very specialized experience in finance, tax, and more to charge $300-500 per hour? In this case it is bundled as a flat fee service which I think would help him provide higher quality of service by having a stable business base. Someone running only an hourly fee business needs to spend A LOT of time doing marketing and recruitment. A good business person is not going to stay in that business model. His fees are much less than 1% AUM on $1M, and less than Vanguard PAS for a whole lot more service once you are over about $2.2M.

I've never heard of him, but looking at his web site he seems like a transparent and down to earth person. I would definitely interview him if I was looking for an advisor who did a lot more than Mark Zoril at PlanVision. Thanks for the mention.
curious george
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by curious george »

Great points about costs for time invested. It probably also costs money to have some one available and ready to speak with you.

while PAS has been ok, it has not been the best for family - they often can’t get through at busy times of the year (end of year and tax times) and if it is not pressing - they just contact the service later.

I may interview him and will post my thoughts i we do.

Anybody else ever use him ?
Thanks
Nosh
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Nosh »

retiredjg wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:10 am I'm hoping that people will add some more names to the list. :happy
Timothy Financial is another option, they have a helpful website. But their waitlist is a year long the last I checked.
https://timothyfinancial.com/
Normchad
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Normchad »

curious george wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 8:27 pm Great points about costs for time invested. It probably also costs money to have some one available and ready to speak with you.

while PAS has been ok, it has not been the best for family - they often can’t get through at busy times of the year (end of year and tax times) and if it is not pressing - they just contact the service later.

I may interview him and will post my thoughts i we do.

Anybody else ever use him ?
Thanks
Yep. I signed up a while back to talk someone. They were $450/hour and indicated up front that a thorough examination and consult would be about 10 hours typically. So expect in the neighborhood of $4500.

Sounds like a lot of money.

My mother, who is with Edward Jones, pays $12,000, EVERY SINGLE YEAR in fees, and doesn’t get much for it. And her portfolio is much smaller than mine.

To me, it absolutely makes sense to hire real experts when you need them. And if you have a a million bucks invested with a 1% AUM guy, that’s 10,000 per year. Well worth it to spend $4500 once a decade or so for a tune up or second opinion.
conundrum
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by conundrum »

Nosh,
I heard about Timothy Financial on the The Long View podcast with Christine Benz and Jeff Ptak from Morningstar. Do you know anyone who has used their services?
Thanks,
Drum
Nosh
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by Nosh »

conundrum wrote: Mon Apr 03, 2023 1:16 pm Nosh,
I heard about Timothy Financial on the The Long View podcast with Christine Benz and Jeff Ptak from Morningstar. Do you know anyone who has used their services?
Thanks,
Drum
Hi Drum,
Unfortunately I don’t know anyone who has used them. My information about the waitlist is over a year old, so it might be worth it to give them a call. Sorry I couldn’t be more help.
Nosh
tibbitts
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by tibbitts »

Normchad wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 9:30 pm
curious george wrote: Fri Mar 03, 2023 8:27 pm Great points about costs for time invested. It probably also costs money to have some one available and ready to speak with you.

while PAS has been ok, it has not been the best for family - they often can’t get through at busy times of the year (end of year and tax times) and if it is not pressing - they just contact the service later.

I may interview him and will post my thoughts i we do.

Anybody else ever use him ?
Thanks
Yep. I signed up a while back to talk someone. They were $450/hour and indicated up front that a thorough examination and consult would be about 10 hours typically. So expect in the neighborhood of $4500.

Sounds like a lot of money.

My mother, who is with Edward Jones, pays $12,000, EVERY SINGLE YEAR in fees, and doesn’t get much for it. And her portfolio is much smaller than mine.

To me, it absolutely makes sense to hire real experts when you need them. And if you have a a million bucks invested with a 1% AUM guy, that’s 10,000 per year. Well worth it to spend $4500 once a decade or so for a tune up or second opinion.
I won't defend overly expensive advisers, but I would caution that the $4500 or whatever with an hourly planner, if you're actually using the service, would also be an every year expenditure. If you're not managing your own investments you're unlikely to know about things like tax law changes or simply how market changes may have influenced things like how much to Roth convert in a given year. Waiting a decade to find out about those things would be completely useless.
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bobcat2
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Re: Fee-only non-AUM financial/investment advisor recommendation

Post by bobcat2 »

Rick Miller at Sensible Financial Planning
Link to website - https://www.sensiblefinancial.com/

Paula Hogan at Creative Planning - https://www.plannersearch.org/financial ... la-h-hogan

I know both Rick and Paula. They know their stuff. :thumbsup :thumbsup

BobK
In finance risk is defined as uncertainty that is consequential (nontrivial). | The two main methods of dealing with financial risk are the matching of assets to goals & diversifying.
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