VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

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jay4u
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Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:42 pm

VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by jay4u »

I was not able to complete a trade on Vanguards website due to a bug in their system (which when I called in the advisor agreed was a bug). When I later asked for some satisfaction with the problem I was told - no - it isn't a bug!!!
Try it yourself, "paste" a fund name (copy and use this VBTLX ) in the buy screen (set up to sell a fund, and the second part where you buy) - the system doesn't do anything. Then try the optional 'pick a fund' drop down list technique, the "VBTLX" doesn't even show up. But no, according to Vanguard thats not a bug, because the system is designed to have you type the find name in... even though it doesn't say that and the fact it allows you to paste it.
This happened at 3:50PM one day, I didn't have time to call it in and get help. I did call in though after 4pm, and the person I got with did agree it was a bug.
I have been in contact with their executive action team. They talked with the software development team and others who all claim that's not a bug!! Of course the ones who developed the program with errors in it aren't going to admit it! After being a Vanguard customer for 20 years, I'm switching to another firm. I don't appreciate a company lying to me!!!
Last edited by jay4u on Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:47 pm, edited 4 times in total.
il0kin
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by il0kin »

Do you have any idea how ridiculous you sound?
Topic Author
jay4u
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by jay4u »

No I don't. I am a software engineer. I know how to code and how to test code. When there is a bug in a system it should be acknowledge and fixed. When it financially affects a customer, they should be assisted in some way. This bug cost me thousands of dollars.
TravelGeek
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by TravelGeek »

jay4u wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:18 pm When I later asked for some satisfaction with the problem I was told - no - it isn't a bug!!!
What specifically were you asking for?
cheezit
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by cheezit »

FYI, no mutual fund orders placed after 3:00 are guaranteed to go through same-day in any case.
onourway
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by onourway »

I don't understand the problem?

VBFMX is a closed fund. It no longer exists.

If I paste an active funds name in the box, but do not click on the menu that verifies the fund name, I get an error that I must fill in the fund name before continuing.

The only way I can complete the transaction is if I choose the suggested fund. This works whether I paste content in or start typing.
criticalmass
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by criticalmass »

jay4u wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:18 pm I was not able to complete a trade on Vanguards website due to a bug in their system (which when I called in the advisor agreed was a bug). When I later asked for some satisfaction with the problem I was told - no - it isn't a bug!!!
Try it yourself, "paste" a fund name (copy and use this VBMFX ) in the buy screen (set up to sell a fund, and the second part where you buy) - the system doesn't do anything. Then try the optional 'pick a fund' drop down list technique, the "VBMFX" doesn't even show up. But no, according to Vanguard thats not a bug, because the system is designed to have you type the find name in... even though it doesn't say that and the fact it allows you to paste it.
This happened at 3:50PM one day, I didn't have time to call it in and get help. I did call in though after 4pm, and the person I got with did agree it was a bug.
I have been in contact with their executive action team. They talked with the software development team and others who all claim that's not a bug!! Of course the ones who developed the program with errors in it aren't going to admit it! After being a Vanguard customer for 20 years, I'm switching to another firm. I don't appreciate a company lying to me!!!
This may be the craziest post ever here. If you want to buy some XXXX, logon, click MY ACCOUNTS -> Buy and Sell. Follow the prompts, which vary depending on what platform you use for Vanguard funds. Type in XXXX on the buy screen, and voila, you will purchase VBMFX. No need to call, talk about "bugs," the "system," wait 10 minutes for help, etc.
Last edited by criticalmass on Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
jpmorganfunds
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by jpmorganfunds »

And this is why the asset management business will never go away folks.
criticalmass
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by criticalmass »

jpmorganfunds wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:29 pm And this is why the asset management business will never go away folks.
Agreed. And more power to them for cornering this market.
OnTrack2020
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by OnTrack2020 »

il0kin wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:24 pm Do you have any idea how ridiculous you sound?
I'm glad I'm not the only one that thought this.
ofckrupke
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by ofckrupke »

OP, please let us know when you get your case scheduled before Judge Judy.
Grt2bOutdoors
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

You had all day to place the trade. Did you purposely wait until the last 10 minutes of trading to place it, in hopes of say "timing the market"?
A day is nothing in the life of an investor, however a second can cost a speculator as you say "thousands". :)
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions
pragmatist
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by pragmatist »

A closed fund. I would be embarrassed.
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JMacDonald
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by JMacDonald »

Last edited by JMacDonald on Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Best Wishes, | Joe
frugalmama
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by frugalmama »

I don't really understand the issue or why you think that it is a bug as it looks like it works as intended...maybe just not like you want it to. However, did you not get a confirmation that your transaction went through (i.e. it didn't go through)? Or, did it not go through the same day like you wanted?
(the issue of trades after 3 has already been addressed) I'm unclear as to what type of resolution you wanted.
Topic Author
jay4u
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by jay4u »

onourway wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:28 pm I don't understand the problem?

VBFMX is a closed fund. It no longer exists.

If I paste an active funds name in the box, but do not click on the menu that verifies the fund name, I get an error that I must fill in the fund name before continuing.

The only way I can complete the transaction is if I choose the suggested fund. This works whether I paste content in or start typing.
My mistake (and that's why I used cut and paste, lol) I meant VBTLX
.
Last edited by jay4u on Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
pasadena
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by pasadena »

Thank you for the laugh.
Teague
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by Teague »

I'll venture that you're quite young and drink way, way too much Red Bull.

Might I suggest more exercise, perhaps try yoga, meditation can also be helpful.
Semper Augustus
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9-5 Suited
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by 9-5 Suited »

If Vanguard is an example of an unethical business, I don't even want to know what you consider the rest of the business world to be.
onourway
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by onourway »

jay4u wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:43 pm
My mistake (and that's why I used cut and paste, lol) I meant VBMFX.
Ok, I still don't understand the bug? If I paste the fund name of an active fund, it provides me with a dynamic window that verifies the fund name. I have to click on that link to be able to proceed to the next step.
KyleAAA
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by KyleAAA »

Huh? What satisfaction are you demanding? This is an extremely low-impact usability quirk. I’m fairly certain the fund you mentioned is closed, meaning you can’t buy that share class. It’s not surprising a fund you can’t buy doesn’t appear in a drop down list of funds to buy.

I have to assume this is a troll post.
Last edited by KyleAAA on Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Brianmcg321
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by Brianmcg321 »

Teague wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:44 pm I'll venture that you're quite young and drink way, way too much Red Bull.

Might I suggest more exercise, perhaps try yoga, meditation can also be helpful.
Lol. You must be a Boomer. They drink White Claw now.
Rules to investing: | 1. Don't lose money. | 2. Don't forget rule number 1.
Topic Author
jay4u
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Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:42 pm

Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by jay4u »

criticalmass wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:29 pm
jay4u wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:18 pm I was not able to complete a trade on Vanguards website due to a bug in their system (which when I called in the advisor agreed was a bug). When I later asked for some satisfaction with the problem I was told - no - it isn't a bug!!!
Try it yourself, "paste" a fund name (copy and use this VBMFX ) in the buy screen (set up to sell a fund, and the second part where you buy) - the system doesn't do anything. Then try the optional 'pick a fund' drop down list technique, the "VBMFX" doesn't even show up. But no, according to Vanguard thats not a bug, because the system is designed to have you type the find name in... even though it doesn't say that and the fact it allows you to paste it.
This happened at 3:50PM one day, I didn't have time to call it in and get help. I did call in though after 4pm, and the person I got with did agree it was a bug.
I have been in contact with their executive action team. They talked with the software development team and others who all claim that's not a bug!! Of course the ones who developed the program with errors in it aren't going to admit it! After being a Vanguard customer for 20 years, I'm switching to another firm. I don't appreciate a company lying to me!!!
This may be the craziest post ever here. If you want to buy some XXXX, logon, click MY ACCOUNTS -> Buy and Sell. Follow the prompts, which vary depending on what platform you use for Vanguard funds. Type in XXXX on the buy screen, and voila, you will purchase VBMFX. No need to call, talk about "bugs," the "system," wait 10 minutes for help, etc.
The point is, if you "paste" the fund name in on the buy screen, nothing happens.
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Re: VERY disappointed in Vanguard's ETHICS!!!

Post by Misenplace »

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Topic Author
jay4u
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Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:42 pm

Vanguards ETHICS - update

Post by jay4u »

After reading some of your posts (mostly about how superior you are to me...) someone said it worked pasting the fund name in. I then went in to my account and tested, and yes it does now work.
Vanguard FIXED the bug, though they are telling me there wasn't a bug in their system!!
Too late for me, their bug cost me $75,000!!
Mako
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Re: Vanguards ETHICS - update

Post by Mako »

If I know anything about Vanguard from reading this board, it’s that it’s really unlikely they would fix any sort of IT issue in just a few days.
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Steve Reading
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Re: Vanguards ETHICS - update

Post by Steve Reading »

jay4u wrote: Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:07 pm Vanguard FIXED the bug,
Zero percent chance that happened. It’s Vanguard lmao.

Not sure what you’re talking about exactly but are you sure you didn’t put in the ticker for a closed fund or something?
"... so high a present discounted value of wealth, it is only prudent for him to put more into common stocks compared to his present tangible wealth, borrowing if necessary" - Paul Samuelson
Topic Author
jay4u
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Re: Vanguards ETHICS - update

Post by jay4u »

It was reported to them March 4th. I just can't believe I got this email from them today - "To update, I did confirm with our senior management groups that our systems were working properly on March 4, 2020. With this said, I recognize that
pasting the ticker symbol within the exchange pathway did not pull up an
associated list of funds, causing you to miss the 4 p.m., Eastern cutoff
timeframe. This is something that has been well documented and noted by our
senior management groups.
However, please understand that Vanguard is not considering this to be
Vanguard or system error. In the future, we would recommend placing
transactions with our representatives over the phone...""

So they knew about it, fixed it, -- BUT it wasn't a bug....
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