Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

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Johnnyone
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Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Johnnyone » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:58 pm

Dave Ramsey Reacts To Potential Stock Market Crash!

[YouTube video, link formatted by admin LadyGeek]

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by angelescrest » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:11 pm

I imagine this is a good moment for his business.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by abuss368 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:20 pm

The older I get the more I tune out all “noise”!

Nobody knows nuttin!
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by DesertDiva » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:24 pm

What?! When did the stock market crash?? :shock:

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by prairieman » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:35 pm

I tuned him out when he ranted against taxes but promoted 10% tithing to a church. If a person is poor and in debt (his audience) they are probably not paying much tax anyway and, well, ....

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by rudeboy » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:36 pm

double-post
Last edited by rudeboy on Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by abuss368 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:39 pm

DesertDiva wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:24 pm
What?! When did the stock market crash?? :shock:
That was good! :beer
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Triple digit golfer » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm

Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:56 pm

The man has common sense, he says the facts as they are. While I normally don't agree with his investment advice, he makes perfect sense here.
Companies have lost 30% of their market value over the last month or so, those are bargains now. Why is there so much selling? Fear, that's why, not because the businesses have become worthless. Are people going to stop flying forever? How about their cars in the driveway? Going to sit there or will they be driving - anywhere? There are so many other examples of this.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm

Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Flyer24 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:06 pm

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by LadyGeek » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:53 pm

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by averagedude » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:27 pm

Dave Ramsey is a great motivator for people in debt, but I bash him every chance I get when it comes to his advice on investing. His advice on investing has conflicts of interest and some of the things he say's on investing are just wrong. This video however, I agree with him 100%. It seems that before Dave sent out this video, he read up on the bogleheads wiki, read a bunch of threads on this website, and viewed a boatload of You Tube videos of Jack Bogle. This advice seems fantastic. What is there not to like about the advice in this video?

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by dh » Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:48 pm

Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
You beat me to it. He is focused solely on the short-term and probably doesn't have an asset allocation in line with his ability to take risks (hence, his rage).

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by dru808 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:08 pm

I thought that was a great speech for his listeners.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by siriusblack » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:09 pm

dh wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:48 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
You beat me to it. He is focused solely on the short-term and probably doesn't have an asset allocation in line with his ability to take risks (hence, his rage).
I think DR makes most of his money from his business, books, radio, conferences, endorsements, etc. -- BUT, he also tends to suggest 100% stocks, which is almost certainly above risk tolerance of many of his listeners.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by wander » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:14 pm

A lot of people criticize Dave Ramsey for 100% equity, no bond portfolio. Actually, his mutual funds occupies a small percentage in his portfolio. His big part is real estate which is paid for. I don't know about you, but he's done better than me.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Nate79 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:19 pm

Stay the course, a powerful message for anyone. Especially there are a lot of people worried out there.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by teniralc » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:36 pm

Johnnyone wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:58 pm
Dave Ramsey Reacts To Potential Stock Market Crash!

[YouTube video, link formatted by admin LadyGeek]
From a 2016 article
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/why-does ... 136f188c21
“...Ramsey’s entire business model is that he claims you can get 12 percent returns in the market, and he has a network of endorsed local providers who pay him for referrals,” Olen told The Huffington Post.

From the Missouri Secretary of State (read the SUMMARY OF THE SECURITIES DIVISION’S ALLEGATIONS , page 1)
https://www.sos.mo.gov/CMSImages/Securi ... -16-26.pdf

From a 2017 article...
https://www.investmentnews.com/advisers ... past-71056
"...Mr. Ramsey’s referral program proved so successful that it recently drew the attention of state securities regulators in Missouri, which had 26 advisers participating in his referral program. The Missouri securities division concluded that from 2010 through 2014, Mr. Ramsey’s company, The Lampo Group, “qualified,” or acted, as an investment solicitor, and because of its marketing materials, as an independent investment adviser rep, though it was not registered as either.

Last fall, the state ordered Mr. Ramsey’s company to pay $50,000 to a Missouri investor education fund and $5,000 for the cost of the investigation. After January 2015 and continuing to the present, Lampo fixed the issue, meeting all the regulatory requirements regarding an exemption for solicitors from registration as an investment adviser rep, according to the Missouri order.

Shortly before that order was issued, The Lampo Group changed the way its referral program worked. Instead of receiving leads, now advisers pay an advertising fee and are part of a directory, called SmartVestor Pros. As a result, they have no exclusivity in their geographic area. Instead of being directed to one adviser, Mr. Ramsey’s radio listeners and website visitors are given the names and addresses of several advisers."

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by junior » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by willthrill81 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:07 pm

junior wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.
Probably because Ramsey doesn't actually pay much attention to what goes on in the markets. He didn't make his money investing; he made most it by selling lots of books and the rest by selling financial advisors salespeople the privilege of his endorsement. He's still saying that stocks have returned 12% annually and that you can withdraw 8% from your portfolio with safety. When it comes to investing, why should anyone on this forum care at all what he says?
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by dh » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:40 pm

willthrill81 wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:07 pm
He's still saying that stocks have returned 12% annually and that you can withdraw 8% from your portfolio with safety. When it comes to investing, why should anyone on this forum care at all what he says?
Seriously????? If that is true, I would add .. why should anyone in the world care what he says? Put Ramsey down, and pick up a book from the Bogleheads reading list wiki or Taylor's Gems.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by rascott » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:47 pm

Do people even watch the linked videos before commenting? Or does the name Ramsey just send people into a tizzy?

What he said was basically pure Boglehead material with just a little more fire.

Also he said oil was down 33%...... not the stock market. Think he mentioned Southwest airlines down 30% but that's about it.

Basically told people to shut off the news and quit being panicked/ stupid.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by TheDDC » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:06 pm

rascott wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:47 pm
Do people even watch the linked videos before commenting? Or does the name Ramsey just send people into a tizzy?

What he said was basically pure Boglehead material with just a little more fire.

Also he said oil was down 33%...... not the stock market. Think he mentioned Southwest airlines down 30% but that's about it.

Basically told people to shut off the news and quit being panicked/ stupid.
Dave Ramsey is spot on in this segment. He is a bit like a hand grenade when it comes to investing. Close counts in life sometimes.

On debt, he is entirely correct in his analyses.

As for how he got rich (and lost it), it’s been real estate. That is probably most of his net worth today, in addition to business assets. I’d say investing is in third place for him.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by whodidntante » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:43 pm

Permabulls usually don't understand how leveraged companies are. If ticket sales go down 40% and stay down, it's not a 40% impact to the likes of American Airlines and Carnival Cruises. They needed reasonably good times just to break even. It is possible that household names will go bankrupt.

And are China, Italy, Germany, and South Korea up to full speed yet? Not according to what I can see. This is an issue.

I don't know that the market lost it's mind. Who decides what a stock is worth anyway? The market.

That said, I'm staying in. But stocks are always risky, including after a market drop. This market can still break necks. Never take too much or too little risk.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by sergeant » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:48 pm

Dave often says that he isn't an investment expert. I agree.

I do think his advice on debt and living below your means is spot on for most people.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by willthrill81 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:48 pm

sergeant wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:48 pm
Dave often says that he isn't an investment expert. I agree.

I do think his advice on debt and living below your means is spot on for most people.
:thumbsup
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Ferdinand2014 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:52 pm

prairieman wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:35 pm
I tuned him out when he ranted against taxes but promoted 10% tithing to a church. If a person is poor and in debt (his audience) they are probably not paying much tax anyway and, well, ....
I tithe 10% of everything I earn anonymously to many organizations including my church and it pays me back 1,000 fold more. In fact I consider it rather selfish as it makes me feel so good.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by jibantik » Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:57 pm

Thanks, got a good laugh out of Dave saying "learn some basic math". This is a guy who does not know the difference between a roth and traditional IRA and tells people they can get 12% returns :oops:

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by rascott » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:35 pm

sergeant wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:48 pm
Dave often says that he isn't an investment expert. I agree.

I do think his advice on debt and living below your means is spot on for most people.
Yes we know if his investment advice is sub optimal, by far.
His show and audience isn't really about investing. It's a personal finance show that's more about human behavior.

That said, anyone that actually directly followed his personal finance advice (babysteps) for life would likely end up in the top decile of Americans heading into retirement.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm

junior wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.
Let me clarify as I see why you and others may not grasp the point. As I mentioned above, two weeks ago certain individual companies and sectors were selling for a 30% higher price, today they sell for 30% or more less. The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:54 pm

jibantik wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:57 pm
Thanks, got a good laugh out of Dave saying "learn some basic math". This is a guy who does not know the difference between a roth and traditional IRA and tells people they can get 12% returns :oops:
Like a broken record, we are reminded of that often on this forum. I’ve heard him make the distinction between a Roth and a Traditional IRA, guess you missed that episode?
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by sergeant » Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:02 am

rascott wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:35 pm
sergeant wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:48 pm
Dave often says that he isn't an investment expert. I agree.

I do think his advice on debt and living below your means is spot on for most people.
Yes we know if his investment advice is sub optimal, by far.
His show and audience isn't really about investing. It's a personal finance show that's more about human behavior.

That said, anyone that actually directly followed his personal finance advice (babysteps) for life would likely end up in the top decile of Americans heading into retirement.
I agree.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by beehivehave » Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:04 am

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm
junior wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.
Let me clarify as I see why you and others may not grasp the point. As I mentioned above, two weeks ago certain individual companies and sectors were selling for a 30% higher price, today they sell for 30% or more less. The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
More genius logic from Cornpone Dave's followers. The concept that the market may have been at least temporarily overpriced or in a bubble completely eludes them. The same people who think because a store marks up an inflated original price on an item, then offers a "discount", that is a "bargain sale" and by buying it they have "saved money"; in other words the same people who go in debt "saving money" on bargains.
BH Rule 1: No one ever knows when markets are "on sale" until after the fact.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Portfolio7 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:33 am

beehivehave wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:04 am
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm
junior wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm
Triple digit golfer wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:51 pm
Best buying opportunity in 10 or 15 years. More like 15 months, unless he thinks S&P 500 at 2750 is a better than it was at 2350 15 months earlier.
What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.
Let me clarify as I see why you and others may not grasp the point. As I mentioned above, two weeks ago certain individual companies and sectors were selling for a 30% higher price, today they sell for 30% or more less. The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
More genius logic from Cornpone Dave's followers. The concept that the market may have been at least temporarily overpriced or in a bubble completely eludes them. The same people who think because a store marks up an inflated original price on an item, then offers a "discount", that is a "bargain sale" and by buying it they have "saved money"; in other words the same people who go in debt "saving money" on bargains.
BH Rule 1: No one ever knows when markets are "on sale" until after the fact.
That's a legitimate statement about prices, though not necessarily the correct viewpoint. In any case, it's better expressed without insulting anyone else on this forum.
"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest" - Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by beehivehave » Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:38 am

Portfolio7 wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:33 am
beehivehave wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:04 am
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm
junior wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:01 pm


What he means is it's the best single opportunity to invest in indexes or actively managed funds (depending on your preference) and pick up the same exact companies that a week or two weeks ago were selling for 30% or higher. You can point out 15 months ago as having the S&P at 2350, but what you can not say is that it was at a higher level at that point, nor can you make the argument that it was on "sale" then either. A sale in the traditional sense is a markdown in price, the S&P trading at 2350 was at "fair market value" - as in that was the price not the sale price, "the price" - if you wanted to buy on that day, the price you paid was 2350, not 2,350 = 3,055 * (1-.30). I hope this clarifies it for you.
The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.
Let me clarify as I see why you and others may not grasp the point. As I mentioned above, two weeks ago certain individual companies and sectors were selling for a 30% higher price, today they sell for 30% or more less. The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
More genius logic from Cornpone Dave's followers. The concept that the market may have been at least temporarily overpriced or in a bubble completely eludes them. The same people who think because a store marks up an inflated original price on an item, then offers a "discount", that is a "bargain sale" and by buying it they have "saved money"; in other words the same people who go in debt "saving money" on bargains.
BH Rule 1: No one ever knows when markets are "on sale" until after the fact.
That's a legitimate statement about prices, though not necessarily the correct viewpoint. In any case, it's better expressed without insulting anyone else on this forum.
Fair enough, I apologize. I was overzealous in stating it, but the viewpoint still makes no sense to me.

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watchnerd
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by watchnerd » Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:56 am

dru808 wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:08 pm
I thought that was a great speech for his listeners.
I have differences of opinion with Dave on some things, but I agree.

+1, I didn't think there was anything objectionable in what he said.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Portfolio7 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 1:23 am

beehivehave wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:38 am
Portfolio7 wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:33 am
beehivehave wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:04 am
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm
junior wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:04 pm


The S & P 500 isn't down 30%. The 52 week low is about 19.5% down from the 52 week high. I'm curious why the 30% number is being thrown around.
Let me clarify as I see why you and others may not grasp the point. As I mentioned above, two weeks ago certain individual companies and sectors were selling for a 30% higher price, today they sell for 30% or more less. The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
More genius logic from Cornpone Dave's followers. The concept that the market may have been at least temporarily overpriced or in a bubble completely eludes them. The same people who think because a store marks up an inflated original price on an item, then offers a "discount", that is a "bargain sale" and by buying it they have "saved money"; in other words the same people who go in debt "saving money" on bargains.
BH Rule 1: No one ever knows when markets are "on sale" until after the fact.
That's a legitimate statement about prices, though not necessarily the correct viewpoint. In any case, it's better expressed without insulting anyone else on this forum.
Fair enough, I apologize. I was overzealous in stating it, but the viewpoint still makes no sense to me.
Thanks. I'm curious why you think stocks are overpriced. Everyone has their starting point, and that seems to heavily skew their interpretations of the market activity.

For example, I don't believe that P/E or valuation aggregates like Cape is telling us much, in part because of accounting and structural changes that have influenced financial reporting over the years. I've seen low future return forecasts for a decade, and watched those forecasts get blown away. I've seen the dot.com crash and timed the 2008 crash (luck or skill?) In both cases I saw big valuation issues that were sure to break, and I don't believe we're seeing such now (though of course I could be wrong.)

I believe there is a natural rate of interest, and that it's very low at the moment. Central Banks may not want to acknowledege that, but they are forced to in order to avoid rate inversions; they can't control the longer end of the market. That low rate governs asset valuations, and justifies the high prices we were seeing in January and February, and that I believe we'll see again. There are other YTY boosts, from energy and Tariff mitigation, but those are relatively small potatoes. Now, my viewpoint could just be entirely wrong, but it meshes with a lot of what I've experienced over the years. If I'm right, then stocks are currently on sale. If I'm wrong, then I may get a clue why from your answer!
"An investment in knowledge pays the best interest" - Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Culbretd » Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:25 am

Ferdinand2014 wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:52 pm
prairieman wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:35 pm
I tuned him out when he ranted against taxes but promoted 10% tithing to a church. If a person is poor and in debt (his audience) they are probably not paying much tax anyway and, well, ....
I tithe 10% of everything I earn anonymously to many organizations including my church and it pays me back 1,000 fold more. In fact I consider it rather selfish as it makes me feel so good.
+1.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by oldcomputerguy » Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:57 am

Several disparaging comments were removed. As a reminder, see General Etiquette:
We expect this forum to be a place where people can feel comfortable asking questions and where debates and discussions are conducted in civil tones. Discussions are about issues, not people. If you disagree with an idea, go ahead and marshal all your forces against it. But do not confuse ideas with the person posting them. At all times we must conduct ourselves in a respectful manner to other posters. Attacks on individuals, insults, name calling, trolling, baiting or other attempts to sow dissension are not acceptable.
Discussing the merits of Dave Ramsey's financial or investment philosophies in factual terms is on-topic. Personal attacks against him (or anyone else) are not. Please keep the discussion civil.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Nate79 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:57 am

rascott wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:47 pm
Do people even watch the linked videos before commenting? Or does the name Ramsey just send people into a tizzy?

What he said was basically pure Boglehead material with just a little more fire.

Also he said oil was down 33%...... not the stock market. Think he mentioned Southwest airlines down 30% but that's about it.

Basically told people to shut off the news and quit being panicked/ stupid.
Clearly the answer is no but people love to take the opportunity to bash Dave.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by GlennK » Wed Mar 11, 2020 6:14 am

Culbretd wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:25 am
Ferdinand2014 wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:52 pm
prairieman wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 5:35 pm
I tuned him out when he ranted against taxes but promoted 10% tithing to a church. If a person is poor and in debt (his audience) they are probably not paying much tax anyway and, well, ....
I tithe 10% of everything I earn anonymously to many organizations including my church and it pays me back 1,000 fold more. In fact I consider it rather selfish as it makes me feel so good.
+1.
+2

bgf
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by bgf » Wed Mar 11, 2020 6:22 am

TheDDC wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:06 pm
rascott wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:47 pm
Do people even watch the linked videos before commenting? Or does the name Ramsey just send people into a tizzy?

What he said was basically pure Boglehead material with just a little more fire.

Also he said oil was down 33%...... not the stock market. Think he mentioned Southwest airlines down 30% but that's about it.

Basically told people to shut off the news and quit being panicked/ stupid.
Dave Ramsey is spot on in this segment. He is a bit like a hand grenade when it comes to investing. Close counts in life sometimes.

On debt, he is entirely correct in his analyses.

As for how he got rich (and lost it), it’s been real estate. That is probably most of his net worth today, in addition to business assets. I’d say investing is in third place for him.

-TheDDC
i think thats right. and like many who've become as wealthy as him, he was in the right place at the right time. property value increases and growth in middle tennessee have been great for many years. i grew up about a mile from his current hilltop mansion. the growth in that area since the early 90s has been incredible.

hes also an entrepreneur and started a business "from a cardtable." and good for him on that front. he's helped a lot of people.
“TE OCCIDERE POSSUNT SED TE EDERE NON POSSUNT NEFAS EST"

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Blue456 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 6:44 am

bgf wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 6:22 am
he's helped a lot of people.
I completely agree. He has inspired me, my family and my friends to live way under our means, to create a budget, pay off debt. This guy has done a lot of good. And while his investment advice is not aligned with BH principles, I think it would be a huge mistake to call him a bad guy in here.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Chris001122 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 6:52 am

Put me on Team Dave. I learned a lot from his radio shows, his podcasts, and his books. I think he is doing a huge service to others and I agree with much of what he says. I also agree with some on here that the investing portion of Dave's approach cannot match Boglehead approach. I use the Boglehead approach on investing but incorporate as much of the Ramsey baby steps as I can. I also agree 100% stocks is not the asset allocation for me and my wife. I sleep better with the Bogle approach to that.

Thank you.
"It's always been a mistake to bet against the United States since 1776." - Warren Buffett

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by junior » Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:20 am

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm
The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
I'm guessing he wasn't warning people stocks were expensive 3 weeks ago. Seems a bit of a cognitive bias to call it "on sale" when stocks are down but not "above market rate" when they are up.

You don't say whether you agree with Ramsey but if you do here's a hot tip: Carnival cruise line is over 50% down from it's 52 week high and about 45% down from it's high a few weeks ago. I don't know how to read a financial statement but I know how to calculate basic percentages. Maybe that's good enough and there's money to be made? I won't be making that money but maybe you will?

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by champion_ham » Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:24 am

Great video! Thanks for posting!

Dave is spot on in this video. He’s saying things that BHs’ preach every day, and I think he should be commended for it. It’s a great reminder to keep calm, tune out the noise, and carry on.

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by lostdog » Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:27 am

He says this a lot and it's in line with Jack's "stay the course" rule.

You only get hurt on a roller coaster if you jumop off.
-Dave Ramsey on the stock market.

He understands "stay the course" and keep investing in good times and bad.
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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by 260chrisb » Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:42 am

I can take it or leave it when it comes to Dave Ramsey. He's a bit of a huckster and his investing advise can be hazardous to your wealth if you follow it including his Smartvestor Pro network which as you listen to a caller you can just about feel the recommendation coming on. Some need this. Most here don't. I find it interesting how many ways there are for people to do really dumb things with their money and am always thankful I've not done some of the things his callers have done and am entertained with this aspect of his show. His basic belief and philosophy of living without debt is fine although his approach to reducing debt can be debated. Again, some need his scorched earth approach, some don't.

As it relates to this video; he's spot on!

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Re: Dave Ramsey Reacts to Stock Market Crash

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:44 am

junior wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:20 am
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:49 pm
The S and P 500 was down about 19.5 percent from the peak to Monday’s close, that is a discount price.
I'm guessing he wasn't warning people stocks were expensive 3 weeks ago. Seems a bit of a cognitive bias to call it "on sale" when stocks are down but not "above market rate" when they are up.

You don't say whether you agree with Ramsey but if you do here's a hot tip: Carnival cruise line is over 50% down from it's 52 week high and about 45% down from it's high a few weeks ago. I don't know how to read a financial statement but I know how to calculate basic percentages. Maybe that's good enough and there's money to be made? I won't be making that money but maybe you will?
I agree with what the larger message is and that is not to panic, to invest as your plan dictates (you do have an Investment Policy Statement, right?) and to carry on. I really don’t get why you think Dave or I for that matter are advocating individual stock.

Let me be very clear here so you understand and stop with the cherry picking - an index is made of a grouping of “individual components”. Those individual components in Dave’s example happen to be companies which sit in the Total Stock Market Index. There are at times steep sell-offs in the markets based on some very real reasons and sometimes because of other factors possibly including the boogey-man is coming for you. The bigger point is, inevitably over time, that’s key here, over time the market trend is UP!! You can read through the many thousands of posts on this forum where I and others have said that, where noted authors have said that, where many of the recommended books have said that. Most notably, John Bogle writes the easiest way to earn your fair share of market returns is to continue investing in low cost broad based indexes, owning the entire haystack and staying the course. How many do you think are staying the course right now? Dave’s message to his listeners is to stay the course. His message is not to go out and buy individual stock.

Do you understand now?
Last edited by Grt2bOutdoors on Wed Mar 11, 2020 11:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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