Vanguard going to do TV commercials

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BeachPerson
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Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by BeachPerson » Tue Nov 26, 2019 5:55 pm

Vanguard TV commercials

Vanguard needs PR since Jack passed away
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by bondsr4me » Tue Nov 26, 2019 6:15 pm

I wholeheartedly agree with Taylor’s statement.

Bigger ain’t always better.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by runner9 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 6:18 pm

There was a Vanguard ad that aired late on Sat. November 16 near the end of the 4th quarter of the Baylor/Oklahoma football game. I was quite surprised to see it.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by 02nz » Tue Nov 26, 2019 6:22 pm

The more people get into low-cost investing the better. But that's not the same as saying the more clients Vanguard has, the better. My own experience with Vanguard was that the brokerage side of the house is not properly equipped from a customer service and IT perspective to serve their current customers. So I became a former customer.

As an aside I find Vanguard's marketing rather silly (like the ad with the couple giggling endlessly - strange).

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by fortyofforty » Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:41 pm

I've been seeing Vanguard television commercials for about a week, now. I must say, the first time I was shocked. Vanguard has enough money to spend on commercials. But, why? Is Vanguard losing money? Is Vanguard afraid of losing market share to other companies? Do the bigwigs at Vanguard really believe they should spend our money to increase Vanguard's assets under management? I remember when mutual funds charged 12b-1 fees, partly for marketing expenses.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by retiredjg » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:51 pm

I'm with Taylor.

Vanguard's customer service used to be very good. Now, from what we see here on the forum, it's questionable. Sometimes poor. I would fix that before trying to attract more customers.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by delamer » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:17 pm

Vanguard has been advertising in print media and online forever.

I’m not sure why people are surprised and upset that it is doing TV ads.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by abuss368 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:20 pm

This is new to me. I have not seen any ads on television to date.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by AlohaJoe » Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:31 pm

Vanguard has been advertising on TV since at least 2010.

https://adage.com/article/special-repor ... ise/238421

You're just succumbing to manufactured outrage about a non-issue.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by 02nz » Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:35 pm

delamer wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:17 pm
Vanguard has been advertising in print media and online forever.

I’m not sure why people are surprised and upset that it is doing TV ads.
Leaving aside how long they've been doing it - why? Every so often someone will ask why Vanguard doesn't offer promotional bonuses or reimburse transfer-out fees. The answer, invariably, is that Vanguard tries to keep costs to a minimum for existing customers. Yet Vanguard seems to spend not insignificant sums on advertising. Does that benefit current shareholders? Could those same monies be put to better use on IT systems or - gasp - answering the phone on Saturdays?

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by jyoung » Wed Nov 27, 2019 12:30 am

I won't to pretend to know what Vanguard is thinking, but I would *guess* it may have to do with economies of scale. If the goal is to offer low cost investing options across the board, and not to bait people in only to endless try and and up-sale them on far more expensive products, then using volume to drive down costs might make sense. I'm guessing again, but I'm pretty confident, the average expense ratio on their AUM is quite a bit lower than their competition's, so charging minuscule ERs under those circumstances is probably much more difficult for them without massive scale.

As to why they choose one method of advertising over another, I can only assume that they have done their homework and know where the best return is likely to be found.

Just my 2 cents on the matter coming from someone with no business management background for what it's worth! :beer

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by fortyofforty » Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:14 am

AlohaJoe wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:31 pm
Vanguard has been advertising on TV since at least 2010.

https://adage.com/article/special-repor ... ise/238421

You're just succumbing to manufactured outrage about a non-issue.
I am not seeing "outrage" by anyone, anywhere. Some people on this forum obsess over a penny here and a penny there, and television advertising is quite expensive. I do not support money spent by "my" company, Vanguard, trying to attract new customers. Why? Every dollar spent on advertising is a dollar not saved and passed along to the shareholders. Do they need more customers? Perhaps improve customer service and lower expense ratios, and the customers will stay put. Posting a link to a seven year-old article proves nothing, unless the argument is nothing can change in seven years. I haven't seen a Vanguard advertisement on television until the past month or so, so something has changed recently, despite specious claims otherwise.

I have seen no justification for spending money on costly television ads, unless Vanguard thinks it is losing customers to companies that provide better customer service, lower fees, or both. In that case, the answer is obvious and does not include more advertising.
Indexing works, not because of magic, but because of math. | Diligentia. Vis. Celeritas. - Jeff Cooper | Original Vanguard Diehard

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by tibbitts » Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:37 am

fortyofforty wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:14 am
AlohaJoe wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:31 pm
Vanguard has been advertising on TV since at least 2010.

https://adage.com/article/special-repor ... ise/238421

You're just succumbing to manufactured outrage about a non-issue.
I am not seeing "outrage" by anyone, anywhere. Some people on this forum obsess over a penny here and a penny there, and television advertising is quite expensive. I do not support money spent by "my" company, Vanguard, trying to attract new customers. Why? Every dollar spent on advertising is a dollar not saved and passed along to the shareholders. Do they need more customers? Perhaps improve customer service and lower expense ratios, and the customers will stay put. Posting a link to a seven year-old article proves nothing, unless the argument is nothing can change in seven years. I haven't seen a Vanguard advertisement on television until the past month or so, so something has changed recently, despite specious claims otherwise.

I have seen no justification for spending money on costly television ads, unless Vanguard thinks it is losing customers to companies that provide better customer service, lower fees, or both. In that case, the answer is obvious and does not include more advertising.
I think we all have to limit how far we take the "my" company attitude. Vanguard competes for business like everybody else and somebody at the company determines what the guess is the best mix of econonomies of scale, service levels, etc. The fact that you don't see any justification for it doesn't mean other customers, maybe not so much tradtional Bogleheads, don't think Vanguard should buy more ads - maybe it's split 50/50 among the percent would would vote either eay. While you haven't seen any data, do you really think Vanguard would provide that data to you, when it even treats executive compensation as confidential?

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by jeffyscott » Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:00 am

jyoung wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 12:30 am
I won't to pretend to know what Vanguard is thinking, but I would *guess* it may have to do with economies of scale.
I would've guessed that they are already so huge that there can't be much to gain with that, but then I'd have said the same thing about Schwab and look what they are willing to spend to gather more assets via acquiring TDA.
As to why they choose one method of advertising over another, I can only assume that they have done their homework and know where the best return is likely to be found.
I'd assume that they would want to attract new clients with large accounts, as getting a bunch of small accounts would likely increase costs, rather than reduce them. For ETFs, though, wouldn't it be better for the overall cost to Vanguard if folks were to buy Vanguard ETFs at other brokerages, rather than at Vanguard's?
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by bondsr4me » Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:02 am

fortyofforty wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:14 am
AlohaJoe wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:31 pm
Vanguard has been advertising on TV since at least 2010.

https://adage.com/article/special-repor ... ise/238421

You're just succumbing to manufactured outrage about a non-issue.
I am not seeing "outrage" by anyone, anywhere. Some people on this forum obsess over a penny here and a penny there, and television advertising is quite expensive. I do not support money spent by "my" company, Vanguard, trying to attract new customers. Why? Every dollar spent on advertising is a dollar not saved and passed along to the shareholders. Do they need more customers? Perhaps improve customer service and lower expense ratios, and the customers will stay put. Posting a link to a seven year-old article proves nothing, unless the argument is nothing can change in seven years. I haven't seen a Vanguard advertisement on television until the past month or so, so something has changed recently, despite specious claims otherwise.

I have seen no justification for spending money on costly television ads, unless Vanguard thinks it is losing customers to companies that provide better customer service, lower fees, or both. In that case, the answer is obvious and does not include more advertising.
+1

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by fortyofforty » Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:04 am

tibbitts wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:37 am
fortyofforty wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:14 am
AlohaJoe wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:31 pm
Vanguard has been advertising on TV since at least 2010.

https://adage.com/article/special-repor ... ise/238421

You're just succumbing to manufactured outrage about a non-issue.
I am not seeing "outrage" by anyone, anywhere. Some people on this forum obsess over a penny here and a penny there, and television advertising is quite expensive. I do not support money spent by "my" company, Vanguard, trying to attract new customers. Why? Every dollar spent on advertising is a dollar not saved and passed along to the shareholders. Do they need more customers? Perhaps improve customer service and lower expense ratios, and the customers will stay put. Posting a link to a seven year-old article proves nothing, unless the argument is nothing can change in seven years. I haven't seen a Vanguard advertisement on television until the past month or so, so something has changed recently, despite specious claims otherwise.

I have seen no justification for spending money on costly television ads, unless Vanguard thinks it is losing customers to companies that provide better customer service, lower fees, or both. In that case, the answer is obvious and does not include more advertising.
I think we all have to limit how far we take the "my" company attitude. Vanguard competes for business like everybody else and somebody at the company determines what the guess is the best mix of econonomies of scale, service levels, etc. The fact that you don't see any justification for it doesn't mean other customers, maybe not so much tradtional Bogleheads, don't think Vanguard should buy more ads - maybe it's split 50/50 among the percent would would vote either eay. While you haven't seen any data, do you really think Vanguard would provide that data to you, when it even treats executive compensation as confidential?
Then Vanguard needs to lay off pushing the idea that it is a mutual company, owned by the shareholders of the underlying funds. Yet, Vanguard continually uses that idea in its marketing. And if you believe Vanguard somehow polled existing shareholders as to whether or not they support the television advertising push, I'd be interested in how you arrived at that notion. More likely is that the upper echelon at Vanguard decided and acted, not that the upper echelon at Vanguard polled the ostensible owners and then acted. Do you really believe Vanguard worries what any one of us, thinks, even if it had a way to find out?

No, the advertising is to attract new customers. Vanguard believes it needs to attract new customers because it is losing customers to companies that provide more services, better services, and/or cheaper services. Again, the answer is not to lure in people by slick advertisements, in my opinion. Vanguard has over $5 TRILLION assets under management. And it needs to attract more investors. Strange.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by delamer » Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:00 am

02nz wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:35 pm
delamer wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:17 pm
Vanguard has been advertising in print media and online forever.

I’m not sure why people are surprised and upset that it is doing TV ads.
Leaving aside how long they've been doing it - why? Every so often someone will ask why Vanguard doesn't offer promotional bonuses or reimburse transfer-out fees. The answer, invariably, is that Vanguard tries to keep costs to a minimum for existing customers. Yet Vanguard seems to spend not insignificant sums on advertising. Does that benefit current shareholders? Could those same monies be put to better use on IT systems or - gasp - answering the phone on Saturdays?
So Vanguard should do no advertising because it costs money? Should it stop introducing new ETFs because that costs money? The list goes on...

Every business makes decisions about the best way to deploy its assets, which by definition are a limited resource. And none of us have any idea how much Vanguard spends on advertising as a percent of its budget or how that compares to other similar businesses. If Vanguard has a net loss of assets because of its decisions, it’ll change its operations.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by jyoung » Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:01 am

Vanguard's once special sauce of low cost, passive funds has now been commoditized. The competition is willing and able to go to 0 (or always below Vanguard) to attract market share, and can subsidize that effort with much higher margin products. It's a slow process, but easy for me to see a future where Vanguard is irrelevant.

Once the current crop of investors, with their brand loyalty and laziness, fade away what's the compelling reason for anyone to choose Vanguard over another company that offers the same products at a lower cost with better support and technology to back then up?

Maybe management sees the writing on the wall and is desperate to do something to avoid becoming the next business to get "disrupted."

Like people here are fond of saying, "don't love something that can't love you back." The same is true for Vanguard, to do otherwise goes against rational decision making.

Full disclose: I'm with Vanguard and intend to stay there even if it's not the optional choice.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by nisiprius » Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:10 am

What jyoung said. I'm with Vanguard--I consolidated everything at Vanguard years ago, it's all Vanguard funds held at Vanguard, with no plans to jump ship. But I do think I see definite signs of Vanguard "reverting to the mean" and becoming more like other brokerages. The recently-introduced factor ETFs, the recently-introduced actively managed products, an attempt to nudge clients toward using ETFs... and, in particular, the recent addition of a [collateralized] commodities [futures] fund. Is such a fund truly needed to "give [Vanguard's clients] the best chance for investment success?"

And, yes, I imagine that despite having no formal position within the company, John C. Bogle had a personal influence as a keeper of the flame, and probably a lot of little pet projects that were on hold because of what he might have said are now being dusted off and implemented.

It's hard to say how much it matters. Vanguard as index fund provider has becomes less and less important. However, Vanguard as a straight shooter and non-games-player is very important. I do have some brand loyalty and trust in Vanguard "not to do anything awful," and it's not quite as strong as it was.

Reversion to the mean is not all bad. Once the extended teething pains are over, Vanguard's "new platform," in which mutual funds are held within the brokerage account, will be a Good Thing--even if it just means finally doing what Fidelity and Schwab have done forever.

TV commercials. Ugh. (The time Digital Equipment Corporations began doing TV commercials is just about same time in which its decline began. I remember Ken Olsen saying something like "Of course we do marketing. For example, we take absolutely everything we know and put them in little books, and then we print up thousands of copies of those books and give them away for free, and that's not TV advertising, but it's marketing.")
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by greg24 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:21 am

Does Vanguard publish how much they we spend per year on advertising?

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by 02nz » Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:28 am

delamer wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:00 am
02nz wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:35 pm
delamer wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:17 pm
Vanguard has been advertising in print media and online forever.

I’m not sure why people are surprised and upset that it is doing TV ads.
Leaving aside how long they've been doing it - why? Every so often someone will ask why Vanguard doesn't offer promotional bonuses or reimburse transfer-out fees. The answer, invariably, is that Vanguard tries to keep costs to a minimum for existing customers. Yet Vanguard seems to spend not insignificant sums on advertising. Does that benefit current shareholders? Could those same monies be put to better use on IT systems or - gasp - answering the phone on Saturdays?
So Vanguard should do no advertising because it costs money? Should it stop introducing new ETFs because that costs money? The list goes on...

Every business makes decisions about the best way to deploy its assets, which by definition are a limited resource. And none of us have any idea how much Vanguard spends on advertising as a percent of its budget or how that compares to other similar businesses. If Vanguard has a net loss of assets because of its decisions, it’ll change its operations.
Talk about straw man arguments. I didn't say Vanguard shouldn't do anything that costs money. I questioned why Vanguard is spending resources on acquiring new customers when there's clearly room for improvement in how it serves existing customers.

Call me old-fashioned, but if you serve your customers right they'll do the marketing for you. I used to be someone who did that kind of marketing for Vanguard. Not anymore.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by oldcomputerguy » Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:50 am

For what it's worth, Vanguard is also doing radio advertising. The last few times I've listened to my favorite NPR podcast, one of the "This podcast is sponsored by" ads was for Vanguard.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Silence Dogood » Wed Nov 27, 2019 12:07 pm

Vanguard starting to advertise on TV just when the youngest generations stop watching TV...

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Silence Dogood » Wed Nov 27, 2019 12:22 pm

nisiprius wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:10 am
But I do think I see definite signs of Vanguard "reverting to the mean" and becoming more like other brokerages.
I agree with you - but I think that current Vanguard leadership is misguided.

I don't think Vanguard will ever be a better Fidelity than Fidelity. I don't think Vanguard will ever be a better Schwab than Schwab.

Vanguard is pushing for ETFs while Fidelity is introducing zero cost mutual funds. Bizarre...

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by pdavi21 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:26 pm

I am not that concerned about Vanguard's advertising, active and factor funds, advising, etc. push. These things cost money, but they also make money. In order to compete with Fidelity (and Schwab-TD), Vanguard will have to maintain low cost tax efficient ETFs (or MFs). I don't think anyone is worried about Fidelity raising their ERs. I am worried that Vanguard's publications will no longer be a relatively unbiased source of information.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Mr.BB » Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:29 pm

retiredjg wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:51 pm
I'm with Taylor.

Vanguard's customer service used to be very good. Now, from what we see here on the forum, it's questionable. Sometimes poor. I would fix that before trying to attract more customers.
+1
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by delamer » Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:49 pm

Silence Dogood wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 12:07 pm
Vanguard starting to advertise on TV just when the youngest generations stop watching TV...
But the number of print media that is available to advertise in has declined dramatically.

So maybe some of the TV spending is redirected from print?

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Nate79 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:50 pm

Vanguard has been clear in the past that they are putting an emphasis on driving more customers (new/existing) towards their PAS service so as to increase revenue.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Silence Dogood » Wed Nov 27, 2019 4:27 pm

Nate79 wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:50 pm
Vanguard has been clear in the past that they are putting an emphasis on driving more customers (new/existing) towards their PAS service so as to increase revenue.
Yes, that seems pretty clear to me.

I'm skeptical about VPAS.

Their advisors may help prevent investors from making behavioral mistakes, but I seriously doubt that Vanguard will have enough advisors to pick up the phone when a 2008-like crash happens again. I can imagine a lot of unhappy clients ditching VPAS if something like that were to happen. Then the usefulness of having paid for it for all that time would be gone.

I do see a use for it for people who are concerned about potential cognitive decline.

Otherwise, I think many investors are probably better off in a LifeStrategy/Target Retirement fund (which use the same funds VPAS recommends anyways), especially if all of their investments are in tax-advantaged accounts*.

I don't see their LifeStrategy/Target Retirement funds being advertised anywhere.

*I wonder what percentage of young investors even have a need for taxable accounts? Between my wife and I, we had $50K worth of tax-advantaged space available to us this year (IRA limit of $12K with 401k limit of $38K) - that's more than enough tax-advantaged space for most people. I understand that not everyone has access to a 401k, but most Americans aren't saving enough to max out their IRAs anyway.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by fortyofforty » Wed Nov 27, 2019 7:03 pm

greg24 wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:21 am
Does Vanguard publish how much they we spend per year on advertising?
This.

All those defending Vanguard's costly efforts to attract new investors with slick television advertising probably squawked loudly about those pesky 12b-1 fees that other mutual fund companies assessed to fund investors, years ago. I don't mind some advertising, but I fail to see how an additional trillion or two in Vanguard's coffers will benefit me (and no way will advertising bring in even close to that amount). Granted the Vanguard campus is spotless, enormous, and impressive. But with all that money already, how much more is necessary to drop an expense ratio from 0.05% to 0.04%? Economies of scale indeed.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by abuss368 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:22 pm

My expense ratios better not go up!
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Scooter57 » Fri Nov 29, 2019 10:17 pm

Vanguard does not make public how its executives are compensated. They were a wonderful company 31 years ago when I began investing with them, a decent company a decade ago when I had some compex issues to deal with, and a pain in the ass now, when they have taken to having strangers call me on the phone to pitch their advisory service. I emailed that guy to tell him to stop calling and he tried to pitch more Vanguard services in the email acknowledging my email.

I assume their execs get paid based on AUM and that they will continue to add to their customer base though it means cutting costs by cuttng customer service to the bone.I don't like their new funds which chase every new fad and I hate the cheesy hucksterism that now infiltrates all their contacts with me.

Jack Bogle was the soul of that company who made it so special years ago, but the guys running it now do not have his commitment to the customers.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by nedsaid » Fri Nov 29, 2019 10:28 pm

I am shocked, just shocked that marketing and outright capitalism is going on at Vanguard headquarters. You would think it is a gambling den in there. Time to call in the Vice Cops I guess.
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Cubicle » Fri Nov 29, 2019 11:27 pm

Maybe naively, I have faith that just the existence of Vanguard pushes other companies to lower their costs. Or at least in the past. And not having shareholders to appease, I will stick with Vanguard until they are no longer client owned or their fees are "significantly" more than competitors. Being so low already, the savings from a passive Vanguard fund to a zero-cost fund, for me not being ultra high net worth, is small. So unless I become ultra high net worth or Vanguard raises their fees, I want to stick with them. Even if it means paying a little more, my intentions are funding Vanguard to push the industry towards a better standard.

I'd like to say though, when I wear my Vanguard cap, I get many questions about it. And I speak highly of Vanguard every opportunity I get. If Vanguard would just let me purchase stuff with the logo & name I'll advertise for them.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by LilyFleur » Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:47 pm

Cubicle wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 11:27 pm
Maybe naively, I have faith that just the existence of Vanguard pushes other companies to lower their costs. Or at least in the past. And not having shareholders to appease, I will stick with Vanguard until they are no longer client owned or their fees are "significantly" more than competitors. Being so low already, the savings from a passive Vanguard fund to a zero-cost fund, for me not being ultra high net worth, is small. So unless I become ultra high net worth or Vanguard raises their fees, I want to stick with them. Even if it means paying a little more, my intentions are funding Vanguard to push the industry towards a better standard.

I'd like to say though, when I wear my Vanguard cap, I get many questions about it. And I speak highly of Vanguard every opportunity I get. If Vanguard would just let me purchase stuff with the logo & name I'll advertise for them.
I speak highly of Schwab every opportunity I get.
I just don't understand how, with no shareholders to appease...that Vanguard doesn't provide excellent customer service to its investor/owners? How accountable are Vanguard's executives with the secret salaries, to the owners of their company?

bberris
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by bberris » Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:24 pm

Vanguard is not a public service. Don't be fooled into thinking that it is different from any other mutual fund sponsor because it is non-profit. That does not mean the same as "sold at cost". Profit is still the motive. I am not getting romantically involved with a business.

MotoTrojan
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by MotoTrojan » Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:27 pm

Seen many of them recently. Oh well, I’m not fully moved to Fidelity anyways. Love it.

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bengal22
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by bengal22 » Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:38 pm

bberris wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:24 pm
Vanguard is not a public service. Don't be fooled into thinking that it is different from any other mutual fund sponsor because it is non-profit. That does not mean the same as "sold at cost". Profit is still the motive. I am not getting romantically involved with a business.
Well said
"Earn All You Can; Give All You Can; Save All You Can." .... John Wesley

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mrspock
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by mrspock » Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:52 pm

Wow, lots of emotion here, very little data. If the advertising represents 0.001 of your ER — who cares... no really. If it’s 0.03, maybe let’s find out more. Until We know which is which, then folks need to take a deep breath.

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fortyofforty
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by fortyofforty » Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:33 pm

mrspock wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:52 pm
Wow, lots of emotion here, very little data. If the advertising represents 0.001 of your ER — who cares... no really. If it’s 0.03, maybe let’s find out more. Until We know which is which, then folks need to take a deep breath.
Funny but the most emotional responses in this whole thread are from those defending Vanguard's use of television advertising. Not sure if it's just some misguided notion of "My Vanguard, right or wrong" or something else. Oh, well. Nothing we can do about it, for or against.
Indexing works, not because of magic, but because of math. | Diligentia. Vis. Celeritas. - Jeff Cooper | Original Vanguard Diehard

02nz
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by 02nz » Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:44 am

viewtopic.php?p=4866757#p4866757

Seems to me like they could be investing a little more in their IT instead.

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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by CoastalWinds » Mon Dec 02, 2019 1:16 pm

Bummer. I regard commercials as a crutch for those companies whose reputation based on fundamentals like good service is insufficient to promote or grow their business. It’s little more than brainwashing. And perhaps it is the poor recent customer service that is causing said reputation to sputter.

Caduceus
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Re: Vanguard going to do TV commercials

Post by Caduceus » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:23 pm

What's worrying is that Vanguard's culture seems to be changing. It used to be more primarily index funds. And now there are quite a lot of pages and articles promoting the actively managed ETFs that Vanguard has. Vanguard seems to have more and more actively managed, and non-diversified sector options.

It's also no longer the cost leader on commissions now that the other brokerages have gone down to zero.

And now it sees a need to advertise for new business ...

I wonder what Mr. Bogle would have thought about all this.

PackersFan12
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Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by PackersFan12 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:33 pm

[Thread merged into here, see below (next page). --admin LadyGeek]

I don't watch a whole lot of television, but when I do, I get inundated with commercials from Fidelity, TD Ameritrade, Schwab, E-trade, though nothing from Vanguard. What gives?

Silk McCue
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Re: Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by Silk McCue » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:37 pm

They must have heard your concern.
Cheers

elderwise
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Re: Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by elderwise » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:38 pm

I think pretty recently i saw a video ad on youtube too ...

02nz
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Re: Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by 02nz » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:40 pm

Amazing what the search function will turn up:

viewtopic.php?t=296052

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RickBoglehead
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Re: Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by RickBoglehead » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:44 pm

Was going to say that the OP is watching the wrong channels, since Vanguard has been advertising during Sports broadcasts as others have noted. Then I saw the OP's name, PackersFan12, and figure maybe Vanguard picks winning teams? :D
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Re: Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by rasta » Wed Dec 11, 2019 1:44 pm

what will be their message?

"we are the highest price broker out there, except for money market funds"

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Re: Why doesn't Vanguard advertise on TV like other companies?

Post by pkcrafter » Wed Dec 11, 2019 2:21 pm

PackersFan12 wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:33 pm
I don't watch a whole lot of television, but when I do, I get inundated with commercials from Fidelity, TD Ameritrade, Schwab, E-trade, though nothing from Vanguard. What gives?
I guess Vanguard does advertise a bit, but as a rule they don't waste investors money--they return it.

Paul
When times are good, investors tend to forget about risk and focus on opportunity. When times are bad, investors tend to forget about opportunity and focus on risk.

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