Does one need a bank account anymore?

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Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

lazynovice wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 6:47 pm
Marseille07 wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 6:36 pm For those having a Fidelity CMA, is my understanding correct that you don't have to make any trades in CMA? i.e. I would be able to receive salary deposits, write checks, withdraw at ATM etc etc with funds just sitting as cash?

Based on TDA's response, I'm concerned if I have to do a HYG dance just to place some trades so they don't restrict CMA's functionality.
Correct.

https://www.fidelity.com/cash-managemen ... t/overview

See also the thread “Fidelity as a One-Stop Shop”

I believe Schwab offers something similar but have not looked into it for awhile.
Thank you. As for Schwab, I have a dormant brokerage with them; not really a user. With that said, I'm with TDA so I'll eventually get migrated over. My current issue is, I just opened a new checking account but a bank I chose decided to treat me terribly, so I'm trying to dump them as fast as I can.
Last edited by Marseille07 on Wed Dec 23, 2020 7:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

Just opened a Fidelity CMA. What the heck, this was easy.
VictorStarr
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by VictorStarr »

Marseille07 wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 6:54 pm Just opened a Fidelity CMA. What the heck, this was easy.
BTW, there is 30+ pages long mega thread on Fidelity as one stop shop: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=266538
For starters you can use CMA account as combo savings and checking account and later explore adding MM funds and bond funds.

To find routing and account number click on "Routing Number" link under an account name.
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

VictorStarr wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 7:39 pm
Marseille07 wrote: Wed Dec 23, 2020 6:54 pm Just opened a Fidelity CMA. What the heck, this was easy.
BTW, there is 30+ pages long mega thread on Fidelity as one stop shop: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=266538
For starters you can use CMA account as combo savings and checking account and later explore adding MM funds and bond funds.
Taking a look at the thread, thank you.

I trade a very minor asset class which requires special arrangements; Fidelity brokerage doesn't work particularly well for this purpose, so I don't think they'd be my one-stop-shop. With that said, I already have my 401K with them so adding a CMA to it isn't a problem.
Dead Man Walking
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Dead Man Walking »

Many small businesses in the rural area where I live give discounts for paying with cash. I’ve learned to ask for a discount when paying with cash. I often ask if they are willing to pay Visa 3% so that I can get 1.5% cash back. Many are willing to give me a discount for paying with cash. My dentist gives a discount for paying with a check - I don’t have dental insurance so he doesn’t have to file a claim.

DMW
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

After opening a Fidelity CMA, I noticed that my Fidelity brokerage could have had a debit card / checking ability if I added those features.

Now, earlier I pinged TD Ameritrade and they told me they wouldn't like me using their brokerage account like checking. So opening Fidelity CMA is still the right move, out of an abundance of caution.
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abuss368
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by abuss368 »

We have a few deposits and disbursements during a month. Not many as most transactions are placed on the credit card.

Not sure how else I would do things!

Best.
Tony
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

So far quite happy with Fidelity CMA. It is categorized as a "cash account" under "Savings, Checking and Spending Accounts." Essentially this is a checking account offered by a brokerage firm instead of a bank. Some regulations might differ, but I'm not likely to be impacted.
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camillus
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by camillus »

My local CU:

Reward checking account +2.99% up to 30k
100k HELOC prime rate -0.26%
Low rate mortgage with low balance remaining
Medallion signature (needed for Fidelity!)
Can get $10s and $5s for kids or garage sales
~20 year relationship, business goes to my community

Loan officers, insurance specialists, etc I can call and visit face to face if need be.

I appreciate the physiological barrier between “investing” and “day-to-day operations.” Also, my budgeting app can import from my bank and not worry about all the shenanigans I pull at Fido...
51% US / 34% ex-US / 15% “bond”
Bama12
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Bama12 »

Credit Unions
rockstar
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by rockstar »

I like having physical branches I can go into. I also like being able to get cashier checks by walking into a local branch.
palanzo
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by palanzo »

rockstar wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:07 pm I like having physical branches I can go into. I also like being able to get cashier checks by walking into a local branch.
I love going into a physical branch in the middle of a pandemic. :beer
2tall4economy
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by 2tall4economy »

Doc wrote: Fri May 31, 2019 7:37 am Yes. Some of us need to have actual cash in the form of $5s and $10s etc. The bank branch at the supermarket 3 blocks away is very convenient for that purpose. The local Schwab and Fidelity branches are 20 minutes away by car and I doubt if they have much actual cash on hand if any.

Would I need to go to PA to get a cashier's check to close my upcoming RE transaction?
This.

I loved overseas for the better part of a decade and moved 100% of my finances to a cma and investment model.

Worked just fine.

But when I came back I decided having a local branch for the hassles of life - depositing cash, depositing large checks, obtaining cash for merchant discounts, having kids interact with a teller as they learn about money, getting a notarization, having a relationship to do other things (becoming less and less relevant) was worth it for me to switch to a local chase bank. Private client didn’t hurt either but it’s definitely just a perk, not a reason to move.

I remember I had to put a check for $120k in the mail once from China to the USA. If it was lost / confiscated, best case would be begging the the issuer to issue another check and providing proof it wasn’t anything nefarious. Not something I looked forward to.

I could barely sleep for days.
You can do anything you want in life. The rub is that there are consequences.
inspector00
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by inspector00 »

You can definitely get by without a bank account these days, but there are a number of reasons I like having both a no-fee local account and an online Ally Account.

1. I go by a nickname that's different than my legal first name, There are rare occasions I've gotten a check made out to my nickname and it's very easy to deposit it at a local bank by signing both the name on the check followed by my legal name. Ally doesn't allow 3rd party checks so this isn't an option. I assume a CMA would have the same issues with 3rd party checks as Ally.

2. My village takes payments for sewer/trash pickup either in the mail by check or in person by check/cash/credit with 3% fee. Although they don't officially have online bill pay, by having a bank account I can pay that bill with 1 click from my bank website and they generate and mail a check for me.

3. I have used free Notary/cashiers checks

4. once in a while my wife or I will write a check

5. Depositing cash, particularly $50/$100 bills. I hate dealing with cash so I usually just keep about $50 for situations where a credit card isn't accepted without a fee.

There are definitely ways around all of these scenarios but it also costs very little effort to keep the accounts open. Even depositing cash isn't a deal-breaker since you could give it a someone who can venmo/paypal you the money back or spend it.
tj
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by tj »

camillus wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 4:12 pm My local CU:

Reward checking account +2.99% up to 30k
100k HELOC prime rate -0.26%
Low rate mortgage with low balance remaining
Medallion signature (needed for Fidelity!)
Can get $10s and $5s for kids or garage sales
~20 year relationship, business goes to my community

Loan officers, insurance specialists, etc I can call and visit face to face if need be.

I appreciate the physiological barrier between “investing” and “day-to-day operations.” Also, my budgeting app can import from my bank and not worry about all the shenanigans I pull at Fido...
Wow! What CU is this that offers 3% on 30k?
VictorStarr
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by VictorStarr »

2tall4economy wrote: Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:08 pm
Doc wrote: Fri May 31, 2019 7:37 am Yes. Some of us need to have actual cash in the form of $5s and $10s etc. The bank branch at the supermarket 3 blocks away is very convenient for that purpose. The local Schwab and Fidelity branches are 20 minutes away by car and I doubt if they have much actual cash on hand if any.

Would I need to go to PA to get a cashier's check to close my upcoming RE transaction?
This.

You can go to random bank and ask for a cash advance using you CMA debit card in denomination of your choice.

I loved overseas for the better part of a decade and moved 100% of my finances to a cma and investment model.

Worked just fine.

But when I came back I decided having a local branch for the hassles of life - depositing cash, depositing large checks, obtaining cash for merchant discounts, having kids interact with a teller as they learn about money, getting a notarization, having a relationship to do other things (becoming less and less relevant) was worth it for me to switch to a local chase bank. Private client didn’t hurt either but it’s definitely just a perk, not a reason to move.

I remember I had to put a check for $120k in the mail once from China to the USA. If it was lost / confiscated, best case would be begging the the issuer to issue another check and providing proof it wasn’t anything nefarious. Not something I looked forward to.


I could barely sleep for days.

Sending such a large check by mail from China sounds stressful.
I double checked my daily mobil deposit limit at Fidelity - $200,000, it is way more than at Chase ($10,000) or Wells Fargo ($25,000 PMA).
Hebell
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Hebell »

I was pleased to see that medallion stamps were already mentioned. if you don't have that personal relationship, you won't get it. Absolutely essential.

We had 30 years with Bank of america, and they've stopped doing medallion stamps. So 2 years ago we added BB&t Bank to our list of banks. Because they do it for us. I've used that medallion service three times in the last two years for treasury direct accounts

I also needed a physical bank for our irrevocable trust account (not a living trust). It was much easier to get the successor trustee assignment done with a person at the bank that knew me
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wander
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by wander »

I need Schwab online checking accounts for no-fee ATMs and brokerage accounts. I need local bank for public notary and Gas rebate credit cards. Yes, I sure need a bank account.
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Flobes
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Flobes »

+1 Medallion Signature Guarantees. Plus Bank Signatures Guarantees and IBond redemptions.

I maintain account at a nearby B&M, a local bank with branches scattered among the towns in the region.

Very community-centered: rewards for good report cards, funding local celebrations, supporting nonprofits, etc. "Everyone knows your name" casual, with convivial (gossipy) tellers. Free lollipops and dog biscuits (and sometimes donuts!). Nimble response to local emergencies and tragedies.

So I keep my checking account there, as I have for many decades, because I live here, and my community deserves a bank that knows who we are.
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JoMoney
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by JoMoney »

Despite loving the Fidelity CMA account, and the idea of consolidating everything to Fidelity, one of the reasons I decided I needed a separate bank account is that I've needed a separate bank statement where I could show someone else my money flows of payroll deposits and expenses/debits, and I did not want to also disclose my entire investment/retirement account balances.
Among some other situations, a lot of landlords seem to have taken to wanting to see a bank statement :annoyed
"To achieve satisfactory investment results is easier than most people realize; to achieve superior results is harder than it looks." - Benjamin Graham
manlymatt83
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by manlymatt83 »

Isn’t this what m1 finance is trying to solve for? Paging Brian Barnes.
IPS: 90% VTWAX, 10% SCV until Vanguard’s test says otherwise. IRA I don’t contribute to anymore set aside separately as “play” fund, which is 3% of net worth.
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abuss368
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by abuss368 »

Sandtrap wrote: Fri May 31, 2019 7:43 am
K8ya wrote: Fri May 31, 2019 5:38 am The fidelity article on this topic made me think. If I have a cash management and brokerage account with them, what might I miss with those being my only accounts?
There are no inconveniences nor additional expense to having bank accounts at a physical location (ample locations across the nation helps, too).
Establish ACH transfer links to your brokerage to move funds back and forth with ease.
True, you don't "have to have" a bank account(s) with physical locations, but, there are times when it is greatly useful and you'll be glad you had it.
IE: cashier's check, checks, cash, large cash withdrawals (substantial), personal face to face service, etc.
YMMV.
I agree Jim. There are times (rare but it happens) when going into a branch for a service is needed. Probably there are alternatives and workarounds.

Many years ago we had MULTIPLE bank accounts. Checking at different banks and multiple savings accounts. Now we simply have one checking account and one money market fund in a stand alone account at Vanguard.

I found over the years, a focus on simplicity and eliminating resulted in less needs for all these accounts.

Simplicity.
John C. Bogle: “Simplicity is the master key to financial success."
manlymatt83
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by manlymatt83 »

Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
IPS: 90% VTWAX, 10% SCV until Vanguard’s test says otherwise. IRA I don’t contribute to anymore set aside separately as “play” fund, which is 3% of net worth.
Blue456
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Blue456 »

manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:06 pm Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
Age of credit is not as important for credit score as people make it sound to be.
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:06 pm Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
? First time hearing credit card issuers might mess with you for closing their checking offering. Do they really happen? I just opened a Chase checking but they're treating me badly, was looking to close it; but it'd be a problem if they close my Chase CC in retaliation.
Blue456
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Blue456 »

Marseille07 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 3:52 pm
manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:06 pm Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
? First time hearing credit card issuers might mess with you for closing their checking offering. Do they really happen? I just opened a Chase checking but they're treating me badly, was looking to close it; but it'd be a problem if they close my Chase CC in retaliation.
Chase departments don’t talk to each other so I doubt that would really be the case.
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JoMoney
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by JoMoney »

There was already another thread on the topic of closing credit cards, but personally I've never had reason to be worried or concerned if a bank chose to cancel a credit card, or closing it myself if I don't use it. They're not pets, and there's a ton of other places offering them. While some do have nice 'bonuses' associated with them, they're not irreplaceable.
"To achieve satisfactory investment results is easier than most people realize; to achieve superior results is harder than it looks." - Benjamin Graham
manlymatt83
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by manlymatt83 »

Blue456 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:04 pm
Marseille07 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 3:52 pm
manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:06 pm Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
? First time hearing credit card issuers might mess with you for closing their checking offering. Do they really happen? I just opened a Chase checking but they're treating me badly, was looking to close it; but it'd be a problem if they close my Chase CC in retaliation.
Chase departments don’t talk to each other so I doubt that would really be the case.
They definitely factor your banking activity into credit decisions:

https://www.asksebby.com/blog/how-to-av ... r-accounts
IPS: 90% VTWAX, 10% SCV until Vanguard’s test says otherwise. IRA I don’t contribute to anymore set aside separately as “play” fund, which is 3% of net worth.
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

Cool. Well, I'm not doing anything crazy here, just charging $200/mo or so. I don't think they'll close my CC in retaliation for closing their checking.
tj
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by tj »

manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:07 pm
Blue456 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:04 pm
Marseille07 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 3:52 pm
manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:06 pm Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
? First time hearing credit card issuers might mess with you for closing their checking offering. Do they really happen? I just opened a Chase checking but they're treating me badly, was looking to close it; but it'd be a problem if they close my Chase CC in retaliation.
Chase departments don’t talk to each other so I doubt that would really be the case.
They definitely factor your banking activity into credit decisions:

https://www.asksebby.com/blog/how-to-av ... r-accounts
I must have opened 7 or 8 Chase checking accounts for the bonus in the past 11 years. They haven't stopped approving me for credit cards (or for bank accounts, obviously).
Bama12
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Bama12 »

This is why I need a bank close to home.

Business in North Alabama are now taking cash only. The bombing in Nashville has shut down a lot of the systems in the area.
manlymatt83
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by manlymatt83 »

tj wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:51 pm
manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:07 pm
Blue456 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 4:04 pm
Marseille07 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 3:52 pm
manlymatt83 wrote: Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:06 pm Your post is why I wish I could close my chase checking I never use without fear of them closing my credit cards in retaliation, and why I also wish I could close 4 credit cards I don’t use anymore but keep open because of how old they are (20+ years).
? First time hearing credit card issuers might mess with you for closing their checking offering. Do they really happen? I just opened a Chase checking but they're treating me badly, was looking to close it; but it'd be a problem if they close my Chase CC in retaliation.
Chase departments don’t talk to each other so I doubt that would really be the case.
They definitely factor your banking activity into credit decisions:

https://www.asksebby.com/blog/how-to-av ... r-accounts
I must have opened 7 or 8 Chase checking accounts for the bonus in the past 11 years. They haven't stopped approving me for credit cards (or for bank accounts, obviously).
Hmm. Good to know. Maybe I will close it out. My money just literally sits there. It never gets used.
IPS: 90% VTWAX, 10% SCV until Vanguard’s test says otherwise. IRA I don’t contribute to anymore set aside separately as “play” fund, which is 3% of net worth.
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Garco
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Garco »

My "bank account" is at a credit union. This has been my only bank since 1975. My monthly paycheck was always direct deposited there; now that I'm retired my Social Security checks are automatically deposited to the credit union. Also, my RMD distributions from my investment accounts are direct deposited to the credit union.

Do I need cash? Use an ATM. Do I need a loan? Do I want to make a large down-payment, such as when buying a car? If needed, I draw on my HELOC ($60K home equity line of credit). I don't need to clear it in advance unless the amount is very large.

Almost all of my money transactions are on-line with this credit union. My Visa account is there; I transfer money to that account via an on-line transaction from my "checking" or "savings" account. Do I need a LOT of cash in a hurry? Use my HELOC.

More than 90% of my transactions with the credit union are on-line transfers using my cellphone or my computer.

So to answer the lead question: Do I need a bank? You bet -- or a credit union.
Last edited by Garco on Sat Dec 26, 2020 11:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
classicindexer
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by classicindexer »

The Fidelity CMA (free checks, bill pay and debit card) and Brokerage accounts + Fido Visa credit card do almost everything except:

- Fidelity CMA/brokerage does not accept cash deposits (just keep cash on hand or we can deposit it at our credit union)
- Fidelity CMA/brokerage does not accept checks made payable to "Cash" - Have to use our Credit Union or the Ally HYSA account mobile deposit accepted them
- We are members at a local credit union with the required savings account because of our mortgage there
CycloRista
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by CycloRista »

I continue using a local bank for checking and savings.

It has been a great learning tool for my kids... going to the bank and physically seeing and depositing money into a savings account.

Far more convenient when documents need to be notarized, dealing with estate authorizations, etc.

Some items I buy locally from individuals are thousands of dollars on occasion (guitars, bicycles, etc.). Not everyone uses PayPal/Venmo and some are even not keen on taking a check. I don't want to have to drive around town hitting multiple ATM's to come up with the cash.

The local bank I use has been on the internet for a long time and pays competitive interest rates (even though they are not all that great right now- they certainly have been in the past).

I still get a phone call from a human to verify checks of larger amounts being cashed/deposited and large electronic funds transfers which is not a bad thing either.
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

Any recos for online banking besides Chase / Citi? I tried Fidelity CMA but it still had a feel of checking functionality bolted onto a brokerage account. Ally checking is there but it doesn't pass my too-big-to-fail test. Marcus checking is all talk, they're talking for a year with little to show for.
manlymatt83
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by manlymatt83 »

Schwab? I also really like M1 Plus and First Republic.
IPS: 90% VTWAX, 10% SCV until Vanguard’s test says otherwise. IRA I don’t contribute to anymore set aside separately as “play” fund, which is 3% of net worth.
Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

Schwab is borderline TBTF, and I hear they aren't very expat friendly - I forgot to mention but expatting is a possibility on my horizon. I'm not sure if the other ones you mentioned are TBTF.

I'm actually pinging Citi if they can change the state of my account if I re-open, as I don't want my account having a California label.
7eight9
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by 7eight9 »

Marseille07 wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 7:00 pm Schwab is borderline TBTF, and I hear they aren't very expat friendly - I forgot to mention but expatting is a possibility on my horizon. I'm not sure if the other ones you mentioned are TBTF.

I'm actually pinging Citi if they can change the state of my account if I re-open, as I don't want my account having a California label.
As a U.S. citizen living abroad, you'll enjoy a number of advantages with Schwab, including:

Convenient access to your money through U.S. dollar–denominated checks, debit cards, and the Schwab MoneyLink® Electronic Funds Transfer Service.
Competitive rates of exchange when transitioning from the U.S. dollar to another major currency, and vice versa.
Simplified U.S. tax reporting due to all accounts being U.S.-domiciled dollar accounts.
Clear online reporting and a 1099 form to help your IRS filing.
A Schwab Visa® debit card that you can use at any ATM in the world, and Schwab will refund the fees.
https://international.schwab.com/expatriate-essentials
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Marseille07
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Re: Does one need a bank account anymore?

Post by Marseille07 »

7eight9 wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 7:07 pm
Marseille07 wrote: Fri Jan 08, 2021 7:00 pm Schwab is borderline TBTF, and I hear they aren't very expat friendly - I forgot to mention but expatting is a possibility on my horizon. I'm not sure if the other ones you mentioned are TBTF.

I'm actually pinging Citi if they can change the state of my account if I re-open, as I don't want my account having a California label.
As a U.S. citizen living abroad, you'll enjoy a number of advantages with Schwab, including:

Convenient access to your money through U.S. dollar–denominated checks, debit cards, and the Schwab MoneyLink® Electronic Funds Transfer Service.
Competitive rates of exchange when transitioning from the U.S. dollar to another major currency, and vice versa.
Simplified U.S. tax reporting due to all accounts being U.S.-domiciled dollar accounts.
Clear online reporting and a 1099 form to help your IRS filing.
A Schwab Visa® debit card that you can use at any ATM in the world, and Schwab will refund the fees.
https://international.schwab.com/expatriate-essentials
Yeah it's kind of crazy that they appear to be expat friendly then we see stuff like this: viewtopic.php?p=4873661#p4873661
I vaguely remember someone else also talking about Italy but I'm having trouble finding the post.
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