Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

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FRANK2009
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by FRANK2009 » Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:08 pm

I can work around the loss of the Advantage account without too much hassle. I can't help thinking though, that if I were a new investor, I would not consider Vanguard when Schwab and Fidelity also offer inexpensive index funds AND a CMA.

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oneleaf
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by oneleaf » Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:33 pm

William4u wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:45 pm
I agree with Bill Bernstein. I'm afraid I'll have to move much of our finances to Fidelity for cash-management services. A couple of family member may do so as well.

The WSJ article notes that only 1% of eligible people at Vanguard (those with more than $500k) took advantage of the service, but this is Vanguard's fault for not advertising it and promoting it. It was practically a hidden feature for many years.
Yea, exactly. I'm glad Bill Bernstein mentioned that many people are not easily able to navigate the system to handle this. Vanguard laid the foundation for allowing us to use a proper cash management service. Taking it away to, possibly, many senior citizens who do not remember how to change their social security direct deposits, or change their automatic ACH pulls, etc... it's truly unprecedented and a new low for Vanguard's service, imo.

And yea, they can't claim no one was using it when they did everything possible to slowly kill it (by making it increasingly hard to even know about it).

jackholloway
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Re: Discontinuing VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by jackholloway » Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:51 pm

GoldStar wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:20 pm
HueyLD wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:12 pm
Wiggums wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:58 pm
Parthenon wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:12 pm
Nala wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 10:39 am
What I find most galling is Vanguard's claim that “we have determined that VanguardAdvantage is no longer meeting the range of needs articulated by our clients.”
That must be why, several years ago, Vanguard quit offering free Turbotax to it's flagship clients. It no longer met the range of needs articulated by their clients.

Ed :annoyed
That was likely the result of a change on the Intuit side since T. Rowe Price and Fidelity stopped having the deals at the same time.
Not true. Fido has continued to offer complimentary TurboTax Premier for some of its customers.
It's "no longer meeting the range of needs" because the vast majority of clients don't use it. To continue to pay for and upkeep a system that only a small minority of clients use isn't cost effective. There are many alternatives:
- Auto-Bill-Pay each item (Pull versus Push)
- Nearly any bank in the world (Small regional banks and Credit Unions are generally free)
- Or, if you really want an all-in-one, start moving to Fidelity. Zero ERs and full Banking / Cash Management features.
This seems likely to me. The business model worked only if many people signed up. Not enough did for it to stay free at the size it was, and I bet most of the people vexed by the change would not want to pay the cost, when free alternatives exist at companies that are using a different business model.

Personally, I may spin up a schwab or Fido account, and move enough over to hit minimum balance requirements. VG runs great index funds, but is not a one stop shop.

sd55
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by sd55 » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:43 pm

Vanguard has a tough business model problem. Schwab and Fidelity make a lot of money on the free cash in their brokerage and CMA accounts. Fidelity's core funds have expense ratios (ERs) near 0.4%. Schwab doesn't even offer money market funds for free cash. They pay less than 1% and almost all of their profits come from reinvesting those balances in short term securities. The revenue from free cash is what pays for the high-service cash management features Schwab and Fidelity offer.

Free cash at Vanguard is held in VMFXX with an ER of 0.11%. They just can't afford the same level of functionality and service with that ER.

If I were speculating, I'd guess Vanguard is looking at its cost structure in general. Customer facing services are expensive. Historically, these could be recovered in mutual fund expense charges, but this is getting harder with ETFs that don't have these expenses and which compete largely on ER.

It wouldn't surprise me if Vanguard shifted its model to be more of a low cost asset manager (like Blackrock) and left customer-facing services to other companies. Even if they don't, I see them working to allocate these costs more directly to the customers who use them. The recent announcement reducing the ER of many ETFs below the ER for the corresponding Admiral fund could also be part of this effort.

BigPrince
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by BigPrince » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:45 pm

FRANK2009 wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:08 pm
I can work around the loss of the Advantage account without too much hassle. I can't help thinking though, that if I were a new investor, I would not consider Vanguard when Schwab and Fidelity also offer inexpensive index funds AND a CMA.
New investors would not have enough assets to qualify for VanguardAdvantage Services anyway.

Bill Bernstein
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Bill Bernstein » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:48 pm

I for one would happily pay a reasonable fee, say $50-$100 per year, to keep the Advantage service and avoid the unnecessary complication of adding yet one or two more cogs into my financial life.

Further, the Vanguard Federal MMF rate is 30-40 bp higher than that offered at Fido and CapitalOne, so one wouldn't need a huge MMF balance to pay for that fee.

Both in the WSJ article's comments section, and also via email, I've come across long-time Vanguard clients who didn't know the service was even available.

Bill

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heartwood
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by heartwood » Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:43 pm

Bill Bernstein wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:48 pm
I for one would happily pay a reasonable fee, say $50-$100 per year, to keep the Advantage service and avoid the unnecessary complication of adding yet one or two more cogs into my financial life.

Further, the Vanguard Federal MMF rate is 30-40 bp higher than that offered at Fido and CapitalOne, so one wouldn't need a huge MMF balance to pay for that fee.

Both in the WSJ article's comments section, and also via email, I've come across long-time Vanguard clients who didn't know the service was even available.

Bill
As a decade ++ user I would also pay a reasonable fee rather than go through the work and angst of changing and understanding a new vendor.

Moreover, my takeaway is that Vanguard is send me the message my commercial business is unwanted. I expressed to them that the handling of this deletion of service comes across to me as an unwanted homework assignment of several days or a week or more. Once I've completed that assignment I may decide to consolidate all elsewhere.

sd55
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by sd55 » Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:57 pm

Bill Bernstein wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:48 pm
I for one would happily pay a reasonable fee, say $50-$100 per year, to keep the Advantage service and avoid the unnecessary complication of adding yet one or two more cogs into my financial life.
I doubt they can do it for that price. According to American Bankers Association estimates, the annual cost to a bank to maintain a checking account is between $250 and $400 per year. Vanguard's costs are probably lower because they don't have branches, but I'm sure it's still substantial.

Most banks lose money on checking but make it up elsewhere in the relationship. But Vanguard's low expense model makes this difficult.

Personally, I've found Vanguard to be an excellent asset manager and a poor provider of customer services. Because of this, the best solution I've found is to hold Vanguard ETFs at Fidelity or Schwab. I doubt I'm profitable for them either, but they are able to make up the difference with less cost-aware customers.

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GreatOdinsRaven
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by GreatOdinsRaven » Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:22 pm

Bill Bernstein wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:48 pm
I for one would happily pay a reasonable fee, say $50-$100 per year, to keep the Advantage service and avoid the unnecessary complication of adding yet one or two more cogs into my financial life.

Further, the Vanguard Federal MMF rate is 30-40 bp higher than that offered at Fido and CapitalOne, so one wouldn't need a huge MMF balance to pay for that fee.

Both in the WSJ article's comments section, and also via email, I've come across long-time Vanguard clients who didn't know the service was even available.

Bill
I’m one such person. Would have used it if I had known about it. Vanguard does not do a good job of connecting with its clients and informing them of available services as their assets grow.

Over the past two years I’ve opened accounts at Schwab (new 401(k)), TD Ameritrade (IRA and taxable brokerage) and Fidelity (their individual HSA) and have slowly moved money out of Vanguard taxable brokerage and IRA accounts into these accounts. Have to say I’ve been impressed with Fidelity and Schwab. Their customer service has been better than Vanguard’s without any of the website/account issues I’ve had with Vanguard. Neutral on TD A’s AdvisorClient website (it’s not as good as Vanguard’s). Very basic.

Will be exploring CMA options with Fidelity in the coming days.
"The greatest enemies of the equity investor are expenses and emotions." -John C. Bogle, Little Book of Common Sense Investing. | | "Winter is coming." Lord Eddard Stark.

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SpringMan
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by SpringMan » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:51 am

Are there any Flagship perks left? Used to be free TurboTax and access to CFP portfolio reviews now Vanguard Advantage gone. Other than access to Vanguard PRIMECAP managed funds, not much is left.
Best Wishes, SpringMan

Grasshopper
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Grasshopper » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:01 am

A sidebar here, so I am moving my VA autopay to Wells Fargo on my Citi Costco card. Something I have never seen before Citi wants my WFB logon information. Citi than logs in to my account at WFB checks my balance, all this while I am on the Citi website. :shock:

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galawdawg
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by galawdawg » Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:00 am

SpringMan wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:51 am
Are there any Flagship perks left? Used to be free TurboTax and access to CFP portfolio reviews now Vanguard Advantage gone. Other than access to Vanguard PRIMECAP managed funds, not much is left.
You also get 25 additional commission-free trades for stocks, options, transaction-fee mutual funds, and non-Vanguard ETFs not already included in their commission-free list. That and a Flagship representative. Perhaps with Vanguard's cost structure there is no economy of scale for larger retail accounts so they have no reason to be concerned about the satisfaction of their Flagship customers.

On a side note, I still have not received notification from Vanguard that they are discontinuing the service. I did confirm with my Flagship Rep that the service would end after I read the initial post here, but I was also told that I would receive a notice from Vanguard. If the WSJ article is correct that less than 2% of eligible (Voyager Select and Flagship) customers are using this service, I'm not sure why Vanguard couldn't be bothered to ensure all of those affected received timely notice at the same time rather than trickling the notices out or letting customers find out on this forum or the WSJ article (in print today). Does Vanguard lack the technology or ability to send an email to all VanguardAdvantage customers at the same time?

On the other hand, they have managed to send a number of unwanted email solicitations over the past few months for PAS. Perhaps they think that I need help managing my two fund portfolio at an annual cost of over $3,000. :annoyed

stan1
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by stan1 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:07 am

galawdawg wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:00 am
That and a Flagship representative.
Flagship reps are being phased out in favor of a Flagship call center whose reps are supposed to be more experienced. Not sure how Vanguard has decided how to do the phasing which seems to be multi-year. Might be based off usage e.g. people who use their dedicated Flagship rep more than others have been allowed to keep one whereas people who don't use it have been moved into the call center.

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Zephavest
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Zephavest » Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:40 am

retiringwhen wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:55 pm
After being a front-seat observer of an estate being managed out of a full-service financial services firm, I would hazard that 90% of all investors would do their heirs a great service by putting their money at Vanguard. Every single thing costs tons of money to do and the help just got in the way. I would hazard that the brokerage siphoned a good 3-4% off the assets by their shenanigans by either levying fees or giving and controlling advisory actions that were not truly in the interest of the estate.
100% Agree !!!
PatrickA5 wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:34 pm
It's a toss up. Would I be better off having DW (or kids) handle things over the phone with VG or at an office with Fidelity? Does the potential for upselling at Fidelity (or Schwab) negate the positives of having an office to go to? Would my heirs be better off possibly going with PAS at VG versus a more expensive option at FIDO? These are the questions I'm trying to figure out. Vanguard getting rid of Advantage accounts was just one more reason why I might want to move (but not the biggest reason).
Move your cash management if you need to, but not your investments!!!

For me, I had downloaded the the VanguardAdvantage application last week and intended to open the account this week, so this blew up my plan. After reading all the great posts and looking at Fidelity CMA, I think I will hold still for now. I pay most of what I can on my Costco rebate Visa card, autopay the the monthly payment from my PurePoint Financial 2.35% interest rate savings account. For bills that require a bank or bill pay I just use my local Chase Bank account, with minimum balance keep at the pathetic .01% interest.

When I'm gone I'm setting up everything for my non-investor savey wife (and / or daughter) to be able to manage our accounts/estate. I've personally seen what Wells Fargo, Fidelity and Chase are likely to do to them with high fee advice and product upsells. While a Wells Trade client, everytime I went to see a Wells Fargo Personal Banker, they were fawning and drooling trying to sell me their high price brokerage services and products. When I retired and rolled over my 401K the Fidelity rep tried to sell me an annuity for 100% of the proceeds, I balked and then he tried for 50% (he did not understand Bogleheads). When opening our local Chase checking account, and never telling them the value of our Vanguard accounts, the Banker said "oh, even if you just have a question our brokers are happy to answer it (trying to get their foot in the door).

How do you think your non-investor savey heirs would react to any of these situations, are they just lambs for the picking?

My written letter to my executor (my wife and daughter) explain how to setup the Vanguard accounts with their PAS. Infact I've had several phone appointments with them and in time may setup the arrangement with the $50,000 minimum so the relationship is already established, as another poster mentioned.

dbr
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by dbr » Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:48 am

It sure seems simple enough to do banking at a bank and investing at a broker and just leave it alone.

MisterMister
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by MisterMister » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:05 am

Grasshopper wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:01 am
A sidebar here, so I am moving my VA autopay to Wells Fargo on my Citi Costco card. Something I have never seen before Citi wants my WFB logon information. Citi than logs in to my account at WFB checks my balance, all this while I am on the Citi website. :shock:
Yes, I've seen this before and as a technologist I'm definitely not crazy about the idea, even though I have done it with some trusted apps(e.g. Google Pay does this when linking a bank account).

They say they do not keep log in information but how would you know?

It's surprising to me, almost shocking, that this is becoming common.

EDIT: I suppose if you are willing to trust someone with your full ACH information this is not much of a stretch. But note that your log in information exposes all your bank accounts associated with the login rather than a single one.

Snapper
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Snapper » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:33 am

We are seeing two things at Vanguard. Cutting low useage program in Advantage, while pushing PAS to generate revenue. I wonder if Fidelity no fee funds are having an effect. When Vanguard was much cheaper it was easier to eat the other companies lunch. Fidelity may have hit on how to attack Vanguard. Cut fees on the bread and butter Vanguard offerings and attempt to starve them out. If index fund fees go to zero it is a problem for Vanguards business model. Hard to cut costs as they seem to lag on tech and customer service. Tough to raise revenue with no cost index funds and ETFs. If you just want index funds it will be hard to justify Vanguard for a new customer looking at competitors with CMA accounts and responsive customer service. Yes, Vanguard is huge today but the Advantage cancellation has attracted press attention. In addition to the WSJ I am seeing it on Twitter. It seems to be attracting a disproportionate negative press response. The WSJ ended like a commercial for Fidelity.

PatrickA5
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by PatrickA5 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:34 am

Zephavest wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:40 am

How do you think your non-investor savey heirs would react to any of these situations, are they just lambs for the picking?

My written letter to my executor (my wife and daughter) explain how to setup the Vanguard accounts with their PAS. Infact I've had several phone appointments with them and in time may setup the arrangement with the $50,000 minimum so the relationship is already established, as another poster mentioned.
I've written out extensive plans for DW (and kids) in my "When I'm Dead" book. I've included a discussion of PAS as an option, and have also considered doing a small piece of our IRA's in PAS now to test the waters.

I haven't decided on whether or not to open a Fidelity CMA to test it out. Since I have a local (free) bank account that we do all of our bill paying out of, the loss of the VG Advantage account isn't a big deal. Check writing on VG Prime Money Market should be good enough really.

PatrickA5
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by PatrickA5 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:48 am

stan1 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:07 am
galawdawg wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:00 am
That and a Flagship representative.
Flagship reps are being phased out in favor of a Flagship call center whose reps are supposed to be more experienced. Not sure how Vanguard has decided how to do the phasing which seems to be multi-year. Might be based off usage e.g. people who use their dedicated Flagship rep more than others have been allowed to keep one whereas people who don't use it have been moved into the call center.
I enjoyed my discussion (about Advantage) with my Flagship Rep. She was very nice and answered all of my questions. Having said that, Flagship reps are not financial advisors. They are call center people with either more education or experience (or both) than the average VG call center person. I think my current rep is right out of college. My previous 4 or 5 reps all left for other jobs at VG, so I guess the Flagship Rep position is a stepping stone to better areas within the company. I imagine the Flagship Rep is probably about the same as a decent Rep at Fido or Schwab.

Dandy
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Dandy » Mon Mar 04, 2019 11:15 am

Bill Bernstein makes a good point about having to switch when income like SS, pensions and annuities go to a different firm.

I decided a few years ago that banks and credit unions often change the rules when it comes to checking accounts e.g. changing the minimum deposits, requiring other accounts, changing or imposing other fees etc.

I decided to have pension and ss sent to an online bank savings account that has a track record of having competitive savings rates. Twice a month I have that account transfer money to my interest bearing checking account roughly based on my target withdrawal dollars. It acts like a bi monthly paycheck I used to have. It has the following advantages:

1. If the bank with my checking makes their checking account a bother - I can switch easily to a bank with a better checking deal. Just have to change the transfer destination at the Online Savings account.
2. Same advantage if I move and the bank with checking is no longer convenient.
3. On line Savings account pays a lot more than most checking accounts and you can plan your transfers to your checking account closer to when you actually need the money e.g. most of my bills come toward the end of the month but my pension arrives on the first. So earn a bit more while the monies are in a savings vs a checking account.
4. If I have money left over at the end of the month that is a good sign that I'm living within my draw down "budget". If I often have to move more money to checking it may be a sign of expense/inflation creep.

I was considering using the VG Advantage account since the Fed Money market fund is paying a bit more than my on line Savings account. Glad I didn't switch - still haven't received official notice from VG.

stan1
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by stan1 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:08 pm

PatrickA5 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:48 am
stan1 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:07 am
galawdawg wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:00 am
That and a Flagship representative.
Flagship reps are being phased out in favor of a Flagship call center whose reps are supposed to be more experienced. Not sure how Vanguard has decided how to do the phasing which seems to be multi-year. Might be based off usage e.g. people who use their dedicated Flagship rep more than others have been allowed to keep one whereas people who don't use it have been moved into the call center.
I enjoyed my discussion (about Advantage) with my Flagship Rep. She was very nice and answered all of my questions. Having said that, Flagship reps are not financial advisors. They are call center people with either more education or experience (or both) than the average VG call center person. I think my current rep is right out of college. My previous 4 or 5 reps all left for other jobs at VG, so I guess the Flagship Rep position is a stepping stone to better areas within the company. I imagine the Flagship Rep is probably about the same as a decent Rep at Fido or Schwab.
It sounds like you still have a named Flagship rep. Some of us no longer have one. I never called the one I had for the better part of 10 years so I imagine Vanguard looked at those metrics and transitioned me to the call center "team concept" sooner than people who used the named Flagship rep more frequently. I think all new Flagship customers get the "team concept".

HappyToBeHere
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by HappyToBeHere » Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:29 pm

While we will no longer provide the services associated with the VanguardAdvantage account, your cash remains invested in your Vanguard Federal Money Market Fund yielding 2.32%* (as of February 12, 2019), well above the national average for savings accounts.** Once bill pay has been established with your bank, consider connecting your Vanguard money market fund to your bank account. Moving money between the two can then be completed quickly and easily. This will allow you to make the most of your cash—combining the yield on Vanguard Federal Money Market Fund with the convenience of your bank's bill pay service.
This is what I've been doing, forever. I move it in to my local checking account, as needed, and it is done the next day. It works great for me. I'm sure it is an inconvenience for those of you have grown accustomed to using it. We all hate change.

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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by ProfessorX » Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:50 pm

Fidelity gave me a no fee CMA before I qualified for the VanguardAdvantage account.
Fidelity has a good bill pay system, and a 2% cash back Visa card.

I think the $500k minimum is what caused these accounts to be under utilized. By the time folks are in that boat they usually already have their banking all figured out. At least that was what happened for me. I’m happy having my investments at more than one broker.

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William4u
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by William4u » Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:54 pm

HappyToBeHere wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:29 pm
While we will no longer provide the services associated with the VanguardAdvantage account, your cash remains invested in your Vanguard Federal Money Market Fund yielding 2.32%* (as of February 12, 2019), well above the national average for savings accounts.** Once bill pay has been established with your bank, consider connecting your Vanguard money market fund to your bank account. Moving money between the two can then be completed quickly and easily. This will allow you to make the most of your cash—combining the yield on Vanguard Federal Money Market Fund with the convenience of your bank's bill pay service.
This is what I've been doing, forever. I move it in to my local checking account, as needed, and it is done the next day. It works great for me. I'm sure it is an inconvenience for those of you have grown accustomed to using it. We all hate change.
That does not address why I switched from this system to VanguardAdvantage. Under my old system (which is the one you mention) I kept about 3 months of typical expenses in my checking and 3 months in my MM fund, and would regularly transfer between the two to keep enough for my large and variable expenses to pull from checking (NB that sometimes my monthy expenses would approach the 3 month average in a month, so I had to keep an eye on it). But this system had two major flaws: it required a lot of tinkering and it required I keep 3 (typical) months of expenses in a low-interest checking account. By keeping all 6 months in my VanguardAdvantage account, I no longer needed to tinker and all 6 months of expenses were earning the higher rate. Even during heavy spending months, 6 months of typical expenses in the MM would easily cover it without having to double check anything. Easy peasy.

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asset_chaos
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by asset_chaos » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:32 pm

stan1 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:07 am
galawdawg wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:00 am
That and a Flagship representative.
Flagship reps are being phased out in favor of a Flagship call center whose reps are supposed to be more experienced. Not sure how Vanguard has decided how to do the phasing which seems to be multi-year. Might be based off usage e.g. people who use their dedicated Flagship rep more than others have been allowed to keep one whereas people who don't use it have been moved into the call center.
Hmm, I didn't know that. There is still a named person listed as my rep when I log into my account, and I don't contact the rep above once a year. On the other hand, a few weeks ago I did receive a Vanguard survey about Flagship service. I guess they wanted to get the survey done before contaminating the pool with news of the Advantage closure.
Regards, | | Guy

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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by asset_chaos » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:47 pm

SpringMan wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:51 am
Are there any Flagship perks left? Used to be free TurboTax and access to CFP portfolio reviews now Vanguard Advantage gone. Other than access to Vanguard PRIMECAP managed funds, not much is left.
That's a good question. None that I use regularly come to mind. Complimentary tax software and advantage cash management I used to use regularly---and valued them for the convenience. Free trades I have used rarely, except the one year I received an inheritance of a couple dozen individual stocks. I got a portfolio review once, just to see what it consisted of. The dedicated flagship rep I talk with rarely, and that seems to be going away too.
Regards, | | Guy

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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by smectym » Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:36 pm

I wrote my Flagship guy objecting to the decision to discontinue Advantage--though I specifically noted that I myself was not affected by the billpay issue as I didn't use Advantage for billpay.

Here is the (obviously robotic, cut and paste) response:

"Thank you for your feedback. We understand this will require additional
effort for you to transition features found in the VanguardAdvantage
Account (VAA) to a different bank. I apologize for any inconvenience.

If you would like to discuss this information in more detail, you can
contact me directly by phone or email using the information provided below.

You can also schedule an appointment for me to call you. To do so, log on
to your account and on the right side of the page select “Create/edit
appointment” to view my calendar.

We appreciate your understanding regarding this decision. Thank you for
being part of the Vanguard community of investors.

Best regards,"

Taildragger
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:49 am

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Taildragger » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:46 pm

I would like a real bank and Wells Fargo bill pay looks tempting, partly because they hold my mortgage.

I worked for Vanguard for 14 years and was a Project Manager for several banking projects. I have found the Vanguard Advantage Account to be a useful one-stop-shop. Lately they double-paid a $10,000 Master Card ACH (Automated Clearing House) payment to Chase Bank. I insisted Vanguard back out the second payment, but they couldn't do it, two egregious errors. Now I have $10K to spend on this credit card. Perhaps this was the last nail in the coffin for VA if this happened to all dozen account holders.

Wells Fargo recently had the same issue and got some bad press. I have not heard of any bad press on this issue about Vanguard.

This traumatic change to my bill paying service may be a blessing in the following ways:

- I can now have a physical bank. PNC was a pseudo-bank.
We travel a lot and Wells Fargo, for example, has a physical presence nation-wide.
- Can get service for critical services like Signature Guarantees.
- Cashier's Checks, and other check types.
- Large sums of cash. Sorry, but sometimes real cash is king. I used to tap the ATM 20 times just to get $6K in cash.
- Nation-wide network of ATMs with low or no ATM fees
- International services like no or low credit card transaction fees

It is incomprehensible for me to think I would use the F word (Fidelity) for my bill pay service, but my question is:

- Do Fidelity's physical branch offices offer full bank services as mentioned above? (E.g. Signature guarantees, large sums of cash)?
- What Bill Pay companies do 100% of what VA can do?
-- ACH electronic payment
-- physical checks
-- eBill
-- Reports of up to 18 months of bill pay history. Many only do 6 months of history, which is unacceptable at tax time.
The VA reports are CRITICAL at tax time.

MisterMister
Posts: 243
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:50 pm

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by MisterMister » Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:32 pm

Taildragger wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:46 pm
It is incomprehensible for me to think I would use the F word (Fidelity) for my bill pay service, but my question is:

- Do Fidelity's physical branch offices offer full bank services as mentioned above? (E.g. Signature guarantees, large sums of cash)?
- What Bill Pay companies do 100% of what VA can do?
-- ACH electronic payment
-- physical checks
-- eBill
-- Reports of up to 18 months of bill pay history. Many only do 6 months of history, which is unacceptable at tax time.
The VA reports are CRITICAL at tax time.
The best answers would come directly from Fidelity but maybe others here will have some ideas. My own gut feeling is that, for what you want, you are better off with a nation-wide bank. I wasn't aware of it but WF does have locations in my large metropolitan area, but only 3. None are close to me. So whether WF will meet your needs nationwide might be worth some homework. As for Fidelity, pretty sure they do all of these with the exception of "large sums of cash" (I've been to my local branch a number of times and never noticed a big honkin' walk-in safe!). That doesn't mean it's your best option, though. Many of these may require special advance arrangements for the branch; it won't be like walking into a bank and getting immediate assistance.

I don't use CMA so perhaps others can provide more authoritative answers. But I like using banks for banking services. All eggs, one basket doesn't appeal to me. How do we know Fidelity's banking won't go the route of Vanguard's? Changing banks can be a major nuisance. Once every decade or so is about the most I can handle.

brndog2
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Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:38 pm

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by brndog2 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:50 pm

I started up a Fidelity CMA and brokerage and will be moving the bulk of my assets. The experience with Fidelity so far has been outstanding. I had a question that popped up at 8:30 PM and gave Fidelity a call. I talked to a live person who cheerfully and accurately answer my question. So far I am liking the change!!

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Zephavest
Posts: 51
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Location: Texas

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Zephavest » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:58 am

Taildragger wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:46 pm
I would like a real bank and Wells Fargo bill pay looks tempting, partly because they hold my mortgage.
Hi Taildragger,

Please carefully recondsider Wells Fargo, this is my post from above:
Zephavest wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:40 am
When I'm gone I'm setting up everything for my non-investor savey wife (and / or daughter) to be able to manage our accounts/estate. I've personally seen what Wells Fargo, Fidelity and Chase are likely to do to them with high fee advice and product upsells. While a Wells Trade client, everytime I went to see a Wells Fargo Personal Banker, they were fawning and drooling trying to sell me their high price brokerage services and products.
I had multiple accounts at Wells Fargo, I closed them all. For just the local bank need, try other nationwide ones such as Chase, Citi, or BofA.

In case you have not seen Wells Fargo in the press in the last few years, here is a summary:
Fed limits Wells Fargo's growth, citing 'consumer abuses'

The Federal Reserve late Friday restricted Wells Fargo's growth, citing the embattled bank's "widespread consumer abuses and compliance breakdowns."

As a result, the San Francisco-based bank struggling to move past a scandal over having created millions of fake accounts will replace three members of its board of directors by April and a fourth by the end of 2018.

In a cease-and-desist order issued after financial markets closed, the Fed said Wells Fargo must improve its governance and risk management, as well as oversight by its board of directors.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/20 ... 302973002/
Other good links:

Wells Fargo too arrogant to own up to its fraudulent ways
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opi ... story.html

Wells Fargo account fraud scandal
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wells_Far ... ud_scandal

Wells Fargo's 17-month nightmare
https://money.cnn.com/2018/02/05/news/c ... index.html

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galawdawg
Posts: 73
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Location: Georgia

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by galawdawg » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:02 am

Taildragger wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:46 pm
I would like a real bank and Wells Fargo bill pay looks tempting, partly because they hold my mortgage.

I worked for Vanguard for 14 years and was a Project Manager for several banking projects. I have found the Vanguard Advantage Account to be a useful one-stop-shop. Lately they double-paid a $10,000 Master Card ACH (Automated Clearing House) payment to Chase Bank. I insisted Vanguard back out the second payment, but they couldn't do it, two egregious errors. Now I have $10K to spend on this credit card. Perhaps this was the last nail in the coffin for VA if this happened to all dozen account holders.
Was the error on the Chase payment on Vanguard's end (i.e.using BillPay), or was the error a result of having Chase do an ACH pull from Vanguard?

If the error was on Vanguard's end, I don't understand how they can avoid correcting the error. The terms of the account provide in pertinent part
"Provided none of the foregoing exceptions are applicable, if we cause an incorrect amount of funds to be removed from your Payment Account or cause funds from your Payment Account to be directed to a Payee that does not comply with your Payment Instructions, we shall be responsible for returning the improperly transferred funds to your Payment Account, and for directing to the proper Payee any previously misdirected Billpay Transactions, and, if applicable, for any late-payment–related charges."
If the error was on Chase's end, they should be able to reverse the erroneous EFT if it has been less than sixty days since the settlement date of the transaction.

In either event, I believe that resolution of errors would be covered by Regulation E (https://www.consumerfinance.gov/policy- ... 05/11/#d-1). If you haven't followed their error reporting process, you may want to consider that to "unwind" the erroneous ACH transfer.

As far as banking options, you may want to see if a Bank of America/Merrill Edge preferred rewards account would meet your needs. That is one of the options I am considering in light of this move by Vanguard.

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walletless
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by walletless » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:16 am

First they make ETF cheaper than Admiral class funds... and now this :-(

MisterMister
Posts: 243
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:50 pm

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by MisterMister » Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:44 am

Taildragger wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:46 pm
...
I worked for Vanguard for 14 years and was a Project Manager for several banking projects. I have found the Vanguard Advantage Account to be a useful one-stop-shop. Lately they double-paid a $10,000 Master Card ACH (Automated Clearing House) payment to Chase Bank. I insisted Vanguard back out the second payment, but they couldn't do it, two egregious errors. Now I have $10K to spend on this credit card.
...
Or you can just ask Master Card to send a check for the overpaid balance.

linenfort
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by linenfort » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:30 am

dbr wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:48 am
It sure seems simple enough to do banking at a bank and investing at a broker and just leave it alone.
+1. Easy enough to transfer money back and forth these days, like between Vanguard settlement account and Ally checking.

dkturner
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by dkturner » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:44 am

brndog2 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:50 pm
I started up a Fidelity CMA and brokerage and will be moving the bulk of my assets. The experience with Fidelity so far has been outstanding. I had a question that popped up at 8:30 PM and gave Fidelity a call. I talked to a live person who cheerfully and accurately answer my question. So far I am liking the change!!
It’s my understanding that the Fidelity CMA Account only yields .79% (on balances over $100k) In order to get MM fund rates don’t you need a separate Fidelity brokerage account? How do the CMA and brokerage account interface?

zrail
Posts: 62
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by zrail » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:48 am

The Fidelity CMA is a taxable brokerage account with a FDIC insured core position and a few other niceties. You can purchase any funds, equities, bonds, Treasuries, CDs, etc that you want. If you purchase a money market fund in the CMA Fidelity treats that as “available cash” and will automatically redeem shares as necessary to service withdrawals.

mervinj7
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by mervinj7 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:06 pm

dkturner wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:44 am
brndog2 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:50 pm
I started up a Fidelity CMA and brokerage and will be moving the bulk of my assets. The experience with Fidelity so far has been outstanding. I had a question that popped up at 8:30 PM and gave Fidelity a call. I talked to a live person who cheerfully and accurately answer my question. So far I am liking the change!!
It’s my understanding that the Fidelity CMA Account only yields .79% (on balances over $100k) In order to get MM fund rates don’t you need a separate Fidelity brokerage account? How do the CMA and brokerage account interface?
Here's a somewhat real example from my CMA this week:
1. I keep roughly ~$5k in FDLXX (Fidelity Treasury Only Money Market) with an yield of 1.99% and TEY of 2.26%.
2. I deposited a check for $250.69 from the water company (rebate for WiFi sprinkler). I now have $250.69 in CORE and $5k in FDLXX.
3. I wrote a check to my gardener for $150. $100.69 in CORE and $5k in FDLXX.
4. I wrote a check to the swim school for $300. $0 in CORE and $4800.69 in FDLXX

New deposits go to the CORE account but they can be used to purchase any Fidelity money market fund. Withdrawals will first come from CORE and then Fidelity will auto-liquidate their MMFs. Thus, between billpay, checks, and automatic transfers to investment accounts, there's very little left in my CORE account. Right now, it's currently $0.18. The rest is earning interest in FDLXX but still available as settled cash. I don't currently have overdraft linked with my brokerage account. In fact, I have my accounts on Money Transfer Lockdown.

https://dpcs.fidelity.com/ftgw/dpcs/security/lockdown

Glamdring56
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Glamdring56 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:41 pm

mervinj7 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:06 pm


Here's a somewhat real example from my CMA this week:
1. I keep roughly ~$5k in FDLXX (Fidelity Treasury Only Money Market) with an yield of 1.99% and TEY of 2.26%.
2. I deposited a check for $250.69 from the water company (rebate for WiFi sprinkler). I now have $250.69 in CORE and $5k in FDLXX.
3. I wrote a check to my gardener for $150. $100.69 in CORE and $5k in FDLXX.
4. I wrote a check to the swim school for $300. $0 in CORE and $4800.69 in FDLXX

New deposits go to the CORE account but they can be used to purchase any Fidelity money market fund. Withdrawals will first come from CORE and then Fidelity will auto-liquidate their MMFs. Thus, between billpay, checks, and automatic transfers to investment accounts, there's very little left in my CORE account. Right now, it's currently $0.18. The rest is earning interest in FDLXX but still available as settled cash. I don't currently have overdraft linked with my brokerage account. In fact, I have my accounts on Money Transfer Lockdown.

https://dpcs.fidelity.com/ftgw/dpcs/security/lockdown
I am considering opening up my replacement VanguardAdvantage at Schwab. Can anyone else be as eloquent and describe the operation of their account at Schwab Bank? Do they have a automatic liquidation of the MM to satisfy banking withdrawals?

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galawdawg
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Location: Georgia

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by galawdawg » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:09 pm

Glamdring56 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:41 pm
I am considering opening up my replacement VanguardAdvantage at Schwab. Can anyone else be as eloquent and describe the operation of their account at Schwab Bank? Do they have a automatic liquidation of the MM to satisfy banking withdrawals?
According to hotpancakes, Schwab does not automatically liquidate MM to cover CMA transactions.

viewtopic.php?p=4409130#p4409130

I'm visiting Schwab, FIdelity, and Merrill Edge (and perhaps TD Ameritrade) this week and that is one of the questions that I'll be posing to each.

arf30
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by arf30 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:44 pm

Glamdring56 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:41 pm
I am considering opening up my replacement VanguardAdvantage at Schwab. Can anyone else be as eloquent and describe the operation of their account at Schwab Bank? Do they have a automatic liquidation of the MM to satisfy banking withdrawals?
It's just a regular checking account, no special features other than no minimums/fees.

The Fidelity account only has those extra features because it's actually a Fidelity brokerage account glued to a bank account at UMB bank.

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galawdawg
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by galawdawg » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:46 pm

As i weigh moving to another investment firm, I found some interesting results comparing fees using Vanguard's own fund cost comparison tool for a two fund VG portfolio comprised of VTSAX and VBTLX and the equivalent offerings at Fidelity and Schwab:

For Total Stock Index funds (using $1,000,000 initial investment, 30 yr time horizon and assuming 6% annual return):
Results summary (Fidelity)

The graphs above show that the Fidelity Total Market Index Fund is the lower-cost investment. Because of its lower costs, an investment in Fidelity Total Market Index Fund could create $51,318.12 more wealth than an investment in Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Fund Admiral Shares.
Results summary (Schwab)

The graphs above show that the Schwab Total Stock Market Index Sel is the lower-cost investment. Because of its lower costs, an investment in Schwab Total Stock Market Index Sel could create $17,056.44 more wealth than an investment in Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Fund Admiral Shares.
For Total Bond Index funds (using $500,000 initial investment, 30 yr time horizon and assuming 3% annual return):
Results summary (Fidelity)

The graphs above show that the Fidelity U.S. Bond Index Fund is the lower-cost investment. Because of its lower costs, an investment in Fidelity U.S. Bond Index Fund could create $10,812.39 more wealth than an investment in Vanguard Total Bond Market Index Fund Admiral Shares.
Results summary (Schwab)

The graphs above show that the Schwab U.S. Aggregate Bond Index Fund is the lower-cost investment. Because of its lower costs, an investment in Schwab U.S. Aggregate Bond Index Fund could create $3,593.68 more wealth than an investment in Vanguard Total Bond Market Index Fund Admiral Shares.
Obviously, drawing down on those investments in retirement and better/worse than assumed market performance would affect those results, but they certainly do provide food for thought. While the money market rates used to fund CMA accounts at VG competitors is less, that difference may be more than made up in the lower ER of the competitors stock and bond index fund offerings.

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steve50
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by steve50 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:49 pm

Looks like Fidelity CMA is the best option as a replacement. Fidelity can automatically liquidate MM for BillPay. Schwab cannot do this.
Last edited by steve50 on Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

PugetSoundguy
Posts: 223
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by PugetSoundguy » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:51 pm

I am considering opening up my replacement VanguardAdvantage at Schwab. Can anyone else be as eloquent and describe the operation of their account at Schwab Bank? Do they have a automatic liquidation of the MM to satisfy banking withdrawals?



Not sure about the eloquence, but here goes: I opened a Schwab Bank and brokerage account a few months ago to handle billpay and ATM withdrawals. Most of our assets are at Vanguard. I discovered VanguardAdvantage a month or so ago because it seemed a better billpay option, but then oops! So relying on Schwab.

Here's how it works:

The Schwab Bank FDIC-insured checking account currently pays 0.40%. There is no minimum balance required. This is the account that is the source of bill payments, ATM withdrawals, checks, etc.

The companion Schwab brokerage account has a sweep settlement account that pays 0.33%. According to the Schwab telephone representative, this 0.33% sweep account serves as a backup to the Schwab Bank checking account if there is an overdraft. In the Schwab brokerage account, you can also hold money market funds. The Schwab U.S. Treasury Money Fund (SNSXX), for example, currently pays about 2.04%. However, neither this fund nor any other Schwab money market fund (other than the 0.33% account described above) will serve as an automatic backup in case of Schwab Bank overdrafts.

If you want your bill paying funds earning higher interest, you have to deposit money into the brokerage account and then buy money market fund shares. When you need money to pay bills, you can then sell money market shares. If you sell on a Monday, for example, the money from the sale will be in your brokerage sweep settlement account on Tuesday. Also on Tuesday, you can then instantly transfer the funds from the sweep settlement account to you Schwab Bank checking account. So you have to go through a few steps with a day's delay to earn any sort of a decent interest rate on your funds set aside for paying bills.

Having low interest rates on the checking and sweep accounts is how I'm sure Schwab pays for the other helpful features of the accounts. What I like about the checking account is that all ATM fees worldwide are reimbursed. There also is no foreign transaction fee.

Be aware, however, that your local Schwab brokerage office does not really serve as a branch of Schwab Bank (based in Nevada). I was surprised that the local office could only accept checks for deposit into the brokerage account, not the checking account. Also it appears no other banking services are offered at the local branch. So think of the Schwab Bank as more like an online bank like Ally. Not a big deal for me since my transactions generally are electronic and I still have a local brick and mortar bank with traditional banking services.

Also ACH transfers to Schwab Bank take four days to clear, which seems a bit long. Direct deposits are credited the same day. For some reason, ACH transfers to the brokerage account seems to take only three days to clear (and then you can transfer the cleared funds to your Schwab Bank account the same day). Hope this helps. We've decided to keep most of our assets at Vanguard, with Schwab Bank for bill pay and ATM use, and a brick and mortar national bank with a free checking account for other banking needs. Works for us.

One other note: If you don't mind the complication, you can squeeze a bit more yield out of the money you have sitting in the Schwab brokerage account by buying T-bills with no commission. That's complicated for a small advantage, however.

mptfan
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by mptfan » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:53 pm

arf30 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:44 pm
Glamdring56 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:41 pm
I am considering opening up my replacement VanguardAdvantage at Schwab. Can anyone else be as eloquent and describe the operation of their account at Schwab Bank? Do they have a automatic liquidation of the MM to satisfy banking withdrawals?
It's just a regular checking account, no special features other than no minimums/fees.
I disagree that the Schwab checking account is just a regular checking account with no special features other than no minimums or fees. Certainly having no balance minimums and no fees is a big feature that makes it much more than "just a regular account" and ignoring that major difference is not fair. I could say that I am just as rich as Jeff Bezos other than he has $150 billion and I don't.

The schwab checking also reimburses for all ATM withdrawals and all debit card cash advance fees, no matter which bank you use, and including foreign ATM or cash advance fees. Those features also make the Schwab checking account much more than just a regular checking account.

The schwab checking account also does not charge foreign transaction fees for foreign debit card purchases, I am not aware of any other checking account with no minimum balance requirements that offers that feature. Also checks are free.

Also, it's a real bank account, not a brokerage account linked to other bank accounts.

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indexfundfan
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Contact:

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by indexfundfan » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:15 pm

I created the following to compare Fidelity, Schwab and Vanguard Advantage.

Image
My signature has been deleted.

Carl53
Posts: 1794
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by Carl53 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:25 pm

mervinj7 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:06 pm
dkturner wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:44 am
brndog2 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:50 pm
I started up a Fidelity CMA and brokerage and will be moving the bulk of my assets. The experience with Fidelity so far has been outstanding. I had a question that popped up at 8:30 PM and gave Fidelity a call. I talked to a live person who cheerfully and accurately answer my question. So far I am liking the change!!
It’s my understanding that the Fidelity CMA Account only yields .79% (on balances over $100k) In order to get MM fund rates don’t you need a separate Fidelity brokerage account? How do the CMA and brokerage account interface?
Here's a somewhat real example from my CMA this week:
1. I keep roughly ~$5k in FDLXX (Fidelity Treasury Only Money Market) with an yield of 1.99% and TEY of 2.26%.
2. I deposited a check for $250.69 from the water company (rebate for WiFi sprinkler). I now have $250.69 in CORE and $5k in FDLXX.
3. I wrote a check to my gardener for $150. $100.69 in CORE and $5k in FDLXX.
4. I wrote a check to the swim school for $300. $0 in CORE and $4800.69 in FDLXX

New deposits go to the CORE account but they can be used to purchase any Fidelity money market fund. Withdrawals will first come from CORE and then Fidelity will auto-liquidate their MMFs. Thus, between billpay, checks, and automatic transfers to investment accounts, there's very little left in my CORE account. Right now, it's currently $0.18. The rest is earning interest in FDLXX but still available as settled cash. I don't currently have overdraft linked with my brokerage account. In fact, I have my accounts on Money Transfer Lockdown.

https://dpcs.fidelity.com/ftgw/dpcs/security/lockdown
Your link takes me to a login page, and since I have no Fido account, nothing. How about cut and paste a little of the relevant info.

PugetSoundguy
Posts: 223
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Location: Seattle

Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by PugetSoundguy » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:29 pm

indexfundfan wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:15 pm
I created the following to compare Fidelity, Schwab and Vanguard Advantage.

Image
Thank you for an excellent chart! Just the right amount of information.

One very minor footnote: I believe Fidelity CMA ATM users could pay a 1% fee on foreign withdrawals whereas that fee would not apply to the Schwab Bank account ATM use.

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indexfundfan
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by indexfundfan » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:35 pm

PugetSoundguy wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:29 pm
indexfundfan wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:15 pm
I created the following to compare Fidelity, Schwab and Vanguard Advantage.

Image
Thank you for an excellent chart! Just the right amount of information.

One very minor footnote: I believe Fidelity CMA ATM users could pay a 1% fee on foreign withdrawals whereas that fee would not apply to the Schwab Bank account ATM use.
You are partially correct. For overseas use, the Fidelity CMA card has a 1% fee if used as debit card in a purchase transaction. But there is no fee if used in an ATM to withdraw cash. This is generally not a concern for most people because it is much better to use a credit card for purchases anyway.

The Schwab card has no fee for ATM or when used for debit purchases overseas.
Last edited by indexfundfan on Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
My signature has been deleted.

mervinj7
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Re: Vanguard is Discontinuing their VanguardAdvantage Accounts

Post by mervinj7 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:36 pm

Carl53 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:25 pm
mervinj7 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:06 pm
In fact, I have my accounts on Money Transfer Lockdown.
https://dpcs.fidelity.com/ftgw/dpcs/security/lockdown
Your link takes me to a login page, and since I have no Fido account, nothing. How about cut and paste a little of the relevant info.
Fidelity Money Transfer Lockdown
Money Transfer Lockdown blocks any attempt to electronically transfer your money, including electronic fund transfers (EFTs), Wire transfers, payments pulled by external institutions and direct debit.

Transactions protected
Outbound money transfers
Transfers between Fidelity accounts
Transfer of Shares and Assets to another institution
Individual Withdrawals

Transactions not affected
Deposits or Transfers into your Fidelity accounts
Checkwriting and Direct Debit*
Debit card/ATM transactions
Trading
Scheduled Required Minimum Distribution (RMD) or Personal Withdrawal Scheduled Plan
BillPay*

By the way, you can sign up for Guess Access to view internal Fidelity pages for 30 days without fully signing up for an account.
https://guest.fidelity.com/GA/profile

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