Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

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destiny
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Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by destiny » Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:47 pm

Fascinating study that suggests that retiring early can significantly increase your lifespan. This work was based on an analysis of longevity data from former Boeing Aerospace, and it concluded that “for every year one works beyond age 55, one loses 2 years of life span on average.”

Here are the relevant data:
Retirement Age / Age at Death
49.9 / 86.0
51.2 / 85.3
52.5 / 84.6
53.8 / 83.9
55.1 / 83.2
56.4 / 82.5
57.2 / 81.4
58.3 / 80.0
59.2 / 78.5
60.1 / 74.5
61.0 / 74.5
62.1 / 71.8
63.1 /69.3
64.1 /67.9
65.2 /66.8

(Source: “Actuarial study of life span vs. retirement age” by Ephrem Cheng)

As you can see, these data appear to indicate a continuous decrease in lifespan the longer one works. Perhaps the scariest bit of data here is that those that work through the traditional retirement age of 65 only cash their retirement checks for an average of 17 months. 17 months! Is that what you have in mind when you think about your future? That your “retirement years” will be reduced to little more than a “retirement year”?

Unfortunately, the study didn’t include an analysis of why someone that works longer might die sooner. Of course, you also can’t easily extrapolate from one workplace to another, and we’re running the risk of confusing correlation with causation. Nonetheless, it’s fun to speculate…

Given that many jobs are filled with stress and frustration, it’s not hard to imagine that their might be some health problems associated with working – e.g., heart disease, hypertension, etc. On top of that, a busy work life leaves less time for exercise, eating right, and so forth, which only compounds the problem. I guess the silver lining is that you won’t need as much money for retirement. 😉

https://www.fivecentnickel.com/does-ear ... ve-longer/
once bitten, twice shy

Dottie57
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Dottie57 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:02 pm

destiny wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:47 pm
Fascinating study that suggests that retiring early can significantly increase your lifespan. This work was based on an analysis of longevity data from former Boeing Aerospace, and it concluded that “for every year one works beyond age 55, one loses 2 years of life span on average.”

Here are the relevant data:
Retirement Age / Age at Death
49.9 / 86.0
51.2 / 85.3
52.5 / 84.6
53.8 / 83.9
55.1 / 83.2
56.4 / 82.5
57.2 / 81.4
58.3 / 80.0
59.2 / 78.5
60.1 / 74.5
61.0 / 74.5
62.1 / 71.8
63.1 /69.3
64.1 /67.9
65.2 /66.8

(Source: “Actuarial study of life span vs. retirement age” by Ephrem Cheng)

As you can see, these data appear to indicate a continuous decrease in lifespan the longer one works. Perhaps the scariest bit of data here is that those that work through the traditional retirement age of 65 only cash their retirement checks for an average of 17 months. 17 months! Is that what you have in mind when you think about your future? That your “retirement years” will be reduced to little more than a “retirement year”?

Unfortunately, the study didn’t include an analysis of why someone that works longer might die sooner. Of course, you also can’t easily extrapolate from one workplace to another, and we’re running the risk of confusing correlation with causation. Nonetheless, it’s fun to speculate…

Given that many jobs are filled with stress and frustration, it’s not hard to imagine that their might be some health problems associated with working – e.g., heart disease, hypertension, etc. On top of that, a busy work life leaves less time for exercise, eating right, and so forth, which only compounds the problem. I guess the silver lining is that you won’t need as much money for retirement. 😉

https://www.fivecentnickel.com/does-ear ... ve-longer/
So people who retire at 65.2. Are gonna die before they hit 67. SS admin should be happy, no crisis.

Crisium
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Crisium » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:03 pm

Looks like the link to the study within that article is dead.

Did some searching and found this page questioning the legitimacy of the study (which appears to be over 35 years old as of today):

https://www.intmath.com/blog/mathematic ... n-myth-822

Possible Urban Myth.

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greg24
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by greg24 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:11 pm

Longevity is highly correlated with wealth. Wealthy people retire young. People without money work as long as they can.

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dm200
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by dm200 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:13 pm

Probably anecdotal - but I have seen claims that earlier retirement shortens lifespan.

Guys retire - and sit on a recliner watching TV and drinking a lot of beer and junk food.

staythecourse
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by staythecourse » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:16 pm

greg24 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:11 pm
Longevity is highly correlated with wealth. Wealthy people retire young. People without money work as long as they can.
Excellent point. Was the group comparing apples to apples comparison. Another way to look at it is folks who are more ill are likley to keep working longer to keep health insurance for treatment of those diseases. Those that are settled financially AND healthy are more likely to retire younger. If that is the case the population that is healthy is dropping out and the folk's with more chronic diseases are the one's continuing to work thus effectively concentration the unhealthy folks each year that goes by until 65. It would make sense as 65 is one folks are eligible for medicare so no surprise some of those folks would be retiring when they get on medicare.

As I often say the methodology studies makes or breaks a study EVERY time.

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6miths
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by 6miths » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:18 pm

Crisium wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:03 pm
Looks like the link to the study within that article is dead.

Did some searching and found this page questioning the legitimacy of the study (which appears to be over 35 years old as of today):

https://www.intmath.com/blog/mathematic ... n-myth-822

Possible Urban Myth.
This 'data' is very old and looks like it was never really 'published' in any peer review form. Was part of a 'talk' that was apparently given by a Chinese academic almost 20 years ago. A single uncited Table that has been repeatedly called out as false and 'a hoax'. Boeing went so far as to release a statement to say it was completely untrue a decade ago but the original press release is no longer on line it appears. Statistically it makes no sense at all and would be such an incredible deviation from normal survival numbers to warrant the X-Files team getting involved. I am loathe to use the term but this truly does look like 'fake news'.
'It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so!' Mark Twain

randomguy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by randomguy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:18 pm

You might want to read the whole article. You know including the part at the bottom that says that boeing thinks the data is BS:) It happens to match some peoples preconcieved notions and gets passed around time after time. I could easily post articles like https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ea ... 5ebde49eff and a bunch of other studies all suggest retiring early kills you. After all think of the life expectancy of people that work til 90:)

Once you correct for things like health (i.e. if you retire cause you have terminal cancer, you aren't going to live long and the benefits of surviving to x age to start with) and professions (talking jobs that take a physical toll on you like construction versus office work), there is little difference in outcomes in most of the studies I have seen. And I have never met anyone that started eating right and got into good shape after retiring. If those things were remotely important to someone, they would do it when they were working.

HIinvestor
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by HIinvestor » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:23 pm

Dunno, my folks are 89 and 93. They are both in pretty good health. The older one worked until about the last decade while the younger one worked until the last tuition bill for kids’ grad school was paid.

I know lots of folks in 70s-90s in HI. Most retired later in life or when forced through disability.

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KlingKlang
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by KlingKlang » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:35 pm

Could look at identical twins where one retired significantly earlier than the other. Might be difficult to get a large enough sample size.

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UpsetRaptor
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by UpsetRaptor » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:40 pm

Correlation != Causation

4nwestsaylng
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by 4nwestsaylng » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:52 pm

There may certainly be some observer bias, and other statistical issues. Most workers don't retire at 49 or 50, so if only a few did, and happened to be nonsmokers with a great family history for longevity, that could bias the early retirement pool. I know nothing about statistics, but I would think here you have to do some controls for similar number of people, etc., since many more work to an older age, and more of those may have been line assembly workers more likely to perhaps smoke, taking smoke breaks, than, say, some Boeing exec who cashed in his stock options and retired at age 50.

On the other hand, whether it is valid at all, it is a cautionary tale for those who look at their 401ks and think "if I just could hang in a few more years, I could have a much more comfortable retirement...." Maybe so, but it is governed by the "lucky" hypothesis as expoused in "Dirty Harry".

Clearly the actuaries who administer generous defined benefit plans such as CalPers,are on the negative bet side, whereas all the CalPers contributors (Calif. state employees) are on the positive bet side, ie that they will all live long and prosper after retirement.

I think the first good luck rule in this whole thing is not to brag about how well fixed you are for retirement :happy

UpperNwGuy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by UpperNwGuy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:54 pm

The Social Security Administration has a life expectancy calculator that gives completely different results than the study cited by OP:

https://www.ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpectancy.html

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dm200
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by dm200 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:08 pm

Another issue is at what age folks have significant disabilities or loss of "quality of life".

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midareff
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by midareff » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:21 pm

dm200 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:13 pm
Probably anecdotal - but I have seen claims that earlier retirement shortens lifespan.

Guys retire - and sit on a recliner watching TV and drinking a lot of beer and junk food.
Geez, that's depressing. I do cardio exercises for an hour 4 X a week, wife does 5 X. We stay active and travel 4 to 6 times a year. I prefer quality cold cuts and 12 year old single malt personally. According to the study I'm three years past my expiration date now.

randomguy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by randomguy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:33 pm

midareff wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:21 pm
dm200 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:13 pm
Probably anecdotal - but I have seen claims that earlier retirement shortens lifespan.

Guys retire - and sit on a recliner watching TV and drinking a lot of beer and junk food.
Geez, that's depressing. I do cardio exercises for an hour 4 X a week, wife does 5 X. We stay active and travel 4 to 6 times a year. I prefer quality cold cuts and 12 year old single malt personally. According to the study I'm three years past my expiration date now.
Cold cuts are in general linked to higher cancer rates. Might be better off with the junk food:)

Ignore the article because it there is no evidence to back it up and the company itself express questions about its accuracy. And it is such an extreme that if it were true, it would be easy to back up. You would need something incredibly odd (chemical exposure at work, radiation,...?) to cause such an early death rate. For some ancedotal evidence, my dads retirement community is filled with people that retired between 62 and 67 and I can assure you that over half are not dead at 72. N0t even 10%. It isn't until the late 70s that people start dropping like flies:)

Lets think about the subsets of people that retire at say 55
a) the well off. they don't need the money
b) the unhealthy who are unable to work. I can't imagine going on disability insurance at 55 versus working til 60 improves your life expectancy:)

Those subsets are going have to drastically different out comes. Which group outnumbers the other? Does either apply to you.

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willthrill81
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by willthrill81 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:42 pm

UpsetRaptor wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:40 pm
Correlation != Causation
You beat me to it!

But it's very true. There are many other variables at work here, and merely observing that early retirees live longer does not mean that early retirement will result in you living longer. A controlled study (i.e. an experiment) is usually necessary to provide strong evidence of causation. Correlational studies like this can be helpful, but they are far from conclusive.
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings

ReadyOrNot
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by ReadyOrNot » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:47 pm

That "data" is completely bogus. It periodically pops up, particularly among potential Boeing retirees. It is extremely old, mentioning some Boeing anachronisms from the 1960s, and the "statistics" didn't make sense even then. The lifespan of Boeing retirees was never worse than the average American; actually slightly better than the average. Like the average American, lifetimes are actually slightly longer for those who retire later.

And look at the supposed lifetime of those who retired at 65. 66.8? You know that even when Social Security first began paying retirees, and didn't have to pay for as long because life expectancy was shorter, the life expectancy and Social Security payout wasn't that short.

With actual data, the real issue is whether the slight longer lifetime of later retirement makes later retirement worthwhile.
Last edited by ReadyOrNot on Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:02 pm, edited 6 times in total.

tananaev
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by tananaev » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:50 pm

If I extrapolate that statistics and retire and 40, I'll have more than 100 years to live 8-)

LiterallyIronic
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by LiterallyIronic » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:52 pm

midareff wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:21 pm
dm200 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:13 pm
Probably anecdotal - but I have seen claims that earlier retirement shortens lifespan.

Guys retire - and sit on a recliner watching TV and drinking a lot of beer and junk food.
Geez, that's depressing. I do cardio exercises for an hour 4 X a week, wife does 5 X. We stay active and travel 4 to 6 times a year. I prefer quality cold cuts and 12 year old single malt personally. According to the study I'm three years past my expiration date now.
Heh, that's pretty much my plan for retirement. Sleep in late, take a long shower (I'm talking breakfast at 11:30 or noon kind of late), spend the day doing a combination of: 1) watching TV; 2) watching movies; 3) playing console-based video games; and 4) playing PC-based video games, then fall asleep whenever I get tired. I have a large backlog of TV series' to watch (and it grows every time a promising new show hits the air or has a new season), expect my DVD collection to reach 1000 discs by retirement, and have a huge backlog of Steam games. I look forward to retiring so I can do nothing.

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mlebuf
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by mlebuf » Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:57 pm

In one of his articles, Scott Burns reports that men whose earnings are in the top decile, live on average 10 years longer than those whose earnings are in the bottom decile.
http://assetbuilder.com/scott_burns/lif ... omplicated

I suspect that when we retire has little to do with longevity. Lifestyle choices made before/in retirement are likely far more important.

Taylor retired well before 60 and is still going strong at 94. On the other hand, I knew a couple who both retired in their 40's and neither one made it to 70. We were friends since we were all in our teens and early 20's. As best as I could tell, they both lived healthy, active, enjoyable lives before and after retirement. One died of kidney cancer and the other died of non-alcoholic cirrhosis. Sometimes it's just the luck of the draw. Life is a cruel lottery.
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tennisplyr
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by tennisplyr » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:15 pm

My mom lived til 93 and she worked til 82.
Those who move forward with a happy spirit will find that things always work out.

quantAndHold
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by quantAndHold » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:19 pm

Without even reading the nonexistent “study,” the math doesn’t pass the smell test on this one. It would mean that nearly everyone who works to age 65 dies almost immediately. Which we all know doesn’t happen.

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Artsdoctor
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Artsdoctor » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:22 pm

That study was from years ago and is not accepted in the medical community. There is no reasonable physician that I've heard of that sits down a patient and says, "You'd better retire now because if you don't, you'll die sooner rather than later."

There have been articles since your study that have shown that early retirement results in a shorter life expectancy, and there have been studies which have shown no difference.

Here's an article which can give you a hyperlink to read more if you're interested:

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... earch-jobs

3-20Characters
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by 3-20Characters » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:28 pm

Anecdotaly, I have known many people who died suddenly after retiring. Everything from heart attacks to aggressive cancer. I don’t think it’s retirment that caused it and I have some theories but I’ll leave them out of the discussion other than to say, there are good retirements and bad retirments and it’s a phase of life that many people do not think about or plan for well.

Zonian59
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Zonian59 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:02 pm

I've seen that Boeing retirement/longetivity table. I believe it was generated by McDonnell Douglas in the 1980s or thereabouts and pertains to McDonnell Douglas employees. Aerospace is a stressful industry. I've heard lots of anectdotal stories of people in aerospace dying from heart attacks and other stress-related ailments during and after the Apollo moon program. By the time you reach 65, you're burnt out, so there is "some" truth to that 17 month life expectancy.

On the other hand, that table may have been generated to convince the McDonnell Douglas employee to take their retirement earlier so the Company payout is at lower rate.

I used to work a stressful job at Boeing and was forced to "retire" (read: laid off) two years ago at 57 only to find myself becoming a fulltime caregiver for my then-91 year old mother. She's now 93 and shows no signs of quitting, despite being an invalid.

Ran across this article about longterm caregiving shortening life expectancy up to eight years:
https://www.healthcentral.com/article/l ... ight-years

So my life expectancy is now adjusted to around 73-75. I'm rethinking my retirement strategy to the point of considering applying for my Boeing pension next year when I turn 60 and Social Security at 62.

Those of you who retired only to become a caregiver for parents, do all you can to take care of your physical health, mental wellbeing and keep stress under control.

Does early retirement make you live longer? Not necessarily. From what I've read, maintaining health, eat healthy diet and regular exercise, have good positive social network and friendships, and have little or no stress in your life is more conducive to longetivity. Also, concentrate on the love and warmth of family and friends, security of your faith, and enjoyment of doing activities that gives meaning and fulfillment to your life.

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by baconavocado » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:39 pm

UpperNwGuy wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:54 pm
The Social Security Administration has a life expectancy calculator that gives completely different results than the study cited by OP:

https://www.ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpectancy.html
That calculator estimates lifespan based only on gender and date of birth. It doesn't consider your age at retirement.

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by willthrill81 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:42 pm

baconavocado wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:39 pm
UpperNwGuy wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:54 pm
The Social Security Administration has a life expectancy calculator that gives completely different results than the study cited by OP:

https://www.ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpectancy.html
That calculator estimates lifespan based only on gender and date of birth. It doesn't consider your age at retirement.
Indeed. It also doesn't take into account a myriad of factors known to impact life expectancy, including your health, marital status, ethnicity, wealth, tobacco use, sleep patterns, etc.
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.” J.R.R. Tolkien,The Lord of the Rings

UpperNwGuy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by UpperNwGuy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:09 pm

baconavocado wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:39 pm
UpperNwGuy wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:54 pm
The Social Security Administration has a life expectancy calculator that gives completely different results than the study cited by OP:

https://www.ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpectancy.html
That calculator estimates lifespan based only on gender and date of birth. It doesn't consider your age at retirement.
I know that. My point was to highlight the vast discrepancy between the Social Security Administration's estimates and the data cited by OP.

UpperNwGuy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by UpperNwGuy » Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:10 pm

willthrill81 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:42 pm
baconavocado wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:39 pm
UpperNwGuy wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:54 pm
The Social Security Administration has a life expectancy calculator that gives completely different results than the study cited by OP:

https://www.ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpectancy.html
That calculator estimates lifespan based only on gender and date of birth. It doesn't consider your age at retirement.
Indeed. It also doesn't take into account a myriad of factors known to impact life expectancy, including your health, marital status, ethnicity, wealth, tobacco use, sleep patterns, etc.
I know that, too. My point was to highlight the vast discrepancy between the Social Security Administration's estimates and the data cited by OP.

2015
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by 2015 » Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:46 pm

I don't know about living longer, but I am certainly living monumentally better. :D

Starfish
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Starfish » Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:49 am

There are 2 kinds of retirement (early or not):
1. no money or no desire, TV, no activities, die early.
2. active, physically, intellectually, socially, healthy, long happy life.

I would think that people who identify more with their jobs tend to be more type 1 in retirement while early retirees are more of type 2.
The simple fact that you have a lot of time to walk around, go to the gym, ski, hike, surf, spend with friends etc and without stress makes it healthier to retire early. But you have to do those things.
This is why it is said that you have to retire TO something, not from something. Early retirement cannot be about doing nothing, it should be about doing something else (than your job).

randomguy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by randomguy » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:11 am

Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:49 am
There are 2 kinds of retirement (early or not):
1. no money or no desire, TV, no activities, die early.
2. active, physically, intellectually, socially, healthy, long happy life.

I would think that people who identify more with their jobs tend to be more type 1 in retirement while early retirees are more of type 2.
Personaly I think your projecting. My experience had been it is more acurate to say there are 2 types of people and retirement has nothing to do with it. The person who comes home from work and watches tv will do that in retirement. The one that comes home from work and rock climbs for any hour will do it in retirement. What exactly people do might change (3 week hiking expedition versus 5 day one) but retirement doesnt fundamentally change who you are.

visualguy
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by visualguy » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:22 am

Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:49 am
The simple fact that you have a lot of time to walk around, go to the gym, ski, hike, surf, spend with friends etc and without stress makes it healthier to retire early. But you have to do those things.
This is why it is said that you have to retire TO something, not from something. Early retirement cannot be about doing nothing, it should be about doing something else (than your job).
Physical exercise isn't enough... If you had any kind of intellectually stimulating job, it really hits you hard mentally when you stop doing it. Been there... You suffer socially as well - much of your social world is gone. Instead of trying to put together something worthy of retiring to with all the right ingredients (really tough), maybe it makes sense just to keep working longer - possibly easier and more straightforward. That's what I found out when I tried to retire early, and then went back to work. Retirement can easily become depressing, which shortens life.

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JoMoney
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by JoMoney » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:37 am

Check out page 12 of this:
https://www.sandia.gov/LabNews/LN11-16- ... -16-01.pdf
... As it turns out, this data is bogus but the claim has
attained the status of an urban legend as it’s been
disseminated via e-mail and fax ...

... Data for deceased Sandia retirees, both
male and female, show a positive rather
than negative dependence of age at death ...
"To achieve satisfactory investment results is easier than most people realize; to achieve superior results is harder than it looks." - Benjamin Graham

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by WanderingDoc » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:40 am

destiny wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:47 pm
Fascinating study that suggests that retiring early can significantly increase your lifespan. This work was based on an analysis of longevity data from former Boeing Aerospace, and it concluded that “for every year one works beyond age 55, one loses 2 years of life span on average.”

Here are the relevant data:
Retirement Age / Age at Death
49.9 / 86.0
51.2 / 85.3
52.5 / 84.6
53.8 / 83.9
55.1 / 83.2
56.4 / 82.5
57.2 / 81.4
58.3 / 80.0
59.2 / 78.5
60.1 / 74.5
61.0 / 74.5
62.1 / 71.8
63.1 /69.3
64.1 /67.9
65.2 /66.8

(Source: “Actuarial study of life span vs. retirement age” by Ephrem Cheng)

As you can see, these data appear to indicate a continuous decrease in lifespan the longer one works. Perhaps the scariest bit of data here is that those that work through the traditional retirement age of 65 only cash their retirement checks for an average of 17 months. 17 months! Is that what you have in mind when you think about your future? That your “retirement years” will be reduced to little more than a “retirement year”?

Unfortunately, the study didn’t include an analysis of why someone that works longer might die sooner. Of course, you also can’t easily extrapolate from one workplace to another, and we’re running the risk of confusing correlation with causation. Nonetheless, it’s fun to speculate…

Given that many jobs are filled with stress and frustration, it’s not hard to imagine that their might be some health problems associated with working – e.g., heart disease, hypertension, etc. On top of that, a busy work life leaves less time for exercise, eating right, and so forth, which only compounds the problem. I guess the silver lining is that you won’t need as much money for retirement. 😉

https://www.fivecentnickel.com/does-ear ... ve-longer/
This is not by accident. Thanks for sharing!
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WanderingDoc
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by WanderingDoc » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:44 am

Even if you told me (and could guarantee) that working longer will result in a longer life, i would STILL retire very early. There is simply too much to see and try in life to work full time (at the same job no less) even if you happen to love your initial vocation.
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WanderingDoc
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by WanderingDoc » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:52 am

LiterallyIronic wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:52 pm
midareff wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:21 pm
dm200 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:13 pm
Probably anecdotal - but I have seen claims that earlier retirement shortens lifespan.

Guys retire - and sit on a recliner watching TV and drinking a lot of beer and junk food.
Geez, that's depressing. I do cardio exercises for an hour 4 X a week, wife does 5 X. We stay active and travel 4 to 6 times a year. I prefer quality cold cuts and 12 year old single malt personally. According to the study I'm three years past my expiration date now.
Heh, that's pretty much my plan for retirement. Sleep in late, take a long shower (I'm talking breakfast at 11:30 or noon kind of late), spend the day doing a combination of: 1) watching TV; 2) watching movies; 3) playing console-based video games; and 4) playing PC-based video games, then fall asleep whenever I get tired. I have a large backlog of TV series' to watch (and it grows every time a promising new show hits the air or has a new season), expect my DVD collection to reach 1000 discs by retirement, and have a huge backlog of Steam games. I look forward to retiring so I can do nothing.
Sounds like a 18 year old オタク's dream :P
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by davidsorensen32 » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:59 am

Benjamin Button, is that you ?
WanderingDoc wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:52 am
Heh, that's pretty much my plan for retirement. Sleep in late, take a long shower (I'm talking breakfast at 11:30 or noon kind of late), spend the day doing a combination of: 1) watching TV; 2) watching movies; 3) playing console-based video games; and 4) playing PC-based video games, then fall asleep whenever I get tired. I have a large backlog of TV series' to watch (and it grows every time a promising new show hits the air or has a new season), expect my DVD collection to reach 1000 discs by retirement, and have a huge backlog of Steam games. I look forward to retiring so I can do nothing.
[/quote]

Sounds like a 18 year old オタク's dream :P
[/quote]

Starfish
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Starfish » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:02 am

randomguy wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:11 am
Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:49 am
There are 2 kinds of retirement (early or not):
1. no money or no desire, TV, no activities, die early.
2. active, physically, intellectually, socially, healthy, long happy life.

I would think that people who identify more with their jobs tend to be more type 1 in retirement while early retirees are more of type 2.
Personaly I think your projecting. My experience had been it is more acurate to say there are 2 types of people and retirement has nothing to do with it. The person who comes home from work and watches tv will do that in retirement. The one that comes home from work and rock climbs for any hour will do it in retirement. What exactly people do might change (3 week hiking expedition versus 5 day one) but retirement doesnt fundamentally change who you are.

There are 2 types of people, and the one who watches TV is less likely to retire early than the one who climbs. I think we agree.
Of course, it's a bad example. It is really hard to rock climb after work when you have a demanding job (say 10h), a long commute (1h one way) and a family.

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Starfish » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:11 am

visualguy wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:22 am
Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:49 am
The simple fact that you have a lot of time to walk around, go to the gym, ski, hike, surf, spend with friends etc and without stress makes it healthier to retire early. But you have to do those things.
This is why it is said that you have to retire TO something, not from something. Early retirement cannot be about doing nothing, it should be about doing something else (than your job).
Physical exercise isn't enough... If you had any kind of intellectually stimulating job, it really hits you hard mentally when you stop doing it. Been there... You suffer socially as well - much of your social world is gone. Instead of trying to put together something worthy of retiring to with all the right ingredients (really tough), maybe it makes sense just to keep working longer - possibly easier and more straightforward. That's what I found out when I tried to retire early, and then went back to work. Retirement can easily become depressing, which shortens life.
But it's the same: people defined by their jobs don't have a social circle or hobbies or passions outside those jobs. Retirement or worse, early retirement, for them is probably going to shorten their lifespan (but they would not retire voluntarily anyway).
People who have other things to do in life except their jobs, have already a bunch of things lined up for the next 100 years to keep them entertained, engaged, intellectually stimulated. And they have friends and social circles outside work.

I have a friend who retired at 38. I talk to him often, he is very employable but very happy about his decision and has no desire to go back.

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by randomguy » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:35 am

Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:02 am


There are 2 types of people, and the one who watches TV is less likely to retire early than the one who climbs. I think we agree.
Of course, it's a bad example. It is really hard to rock climb after work when you have a demanding job (say 10h), a long commute (1h one way) and a family.
I would have to see some data on that. :) I have met both types and I am not sure I ever detected a huge difference in when one retires. Heck the active ones as far as I can tell keep on working longer. Granted we can be talking different samples. Most of the under 45 crowd I know of that have retired (or could) won the option lottery. The active ones turn around and go join another company and do it again. The inactive ones chill out and play video games. And yes we are talking small sample sizes:)

As far as it being hard to do stuff when working, I worked in a job with dozens of people all in similar life situations working 10h+ days for weeks at time. Somehow a bunch of us found time to play ice hockey, go climbing, do triathlons, take international vacations while others didn't have time but could talk about all sorts of tv programs. If it is something you want to do, you find the time. If it isn't, you don't. And yes it involves making choices like going to bed at 10 so you can be up at 5:30 so you can be at the climbing gym when it opens at 6. Maybe if you are retired you do something 5 hours/week instead of 3 but I doubt very many sedentary people switch to an active lifestyle when they retire. I bet even fewer change dietary habits that they have had for 30 years:) But again this is all observational of relatively small sample sizes.

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Starfish » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:56 am

If you are FI because you are lucky it does not count.
People who sacrifice things for FIRE are the one with a drive.
but I doubt very many sedentary people switch to an active lifestyle when they retire.
I wasn't so extreme. The guy who goes once a week or once a month at the climbing gym might go 2-3 times a week if he has time.
To maximize your life span you don't have to run marathons, just have to walk 30-60 minutes a day. A small difference in physical activity goes a long way.

WanderingDoc
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by WanderingDoc » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:59 am

Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:02 am
randomguy wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:11 am
Starfish wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:49 am
There are 2 kinds of retirement (early or not):
1. no money or no desire, TV, no activities, die early.
2. active, physically, intellectually, socially, healthy, long happy life.

I would think that people who identify more with their jobs tend to be more type 1 in retirement while early retirees are more of type 2.
Personaly I think your projecting. My experience had been it is more acurate to say there are 2 types of people and retirement has nothing to do with it. The person who comes home from work and watches tv will do that in retirement. The one that comes home from work and rock climbs for any hour will do it in retirement. What exactly people do might change (3 week hiking expedition versus 5 day one) but retirement doesnt fundamentally change who you are.

There are 2 types of people, and the one who watches TV is less likely to retire early than the one who climbs. I think we agree.
Of course, it's a bad example. It is really hard to rock climb after work when you have a 1) demanding job (say 10h), 2) a long commute (1h one way) and 3) a family.
All voluntary choices.
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randomizer
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by randomizer » Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:36 am

Seems pretty obvious that it's the wealth and not the early retirement — that's just another side-effect — that leads to a long life.
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors » Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:50 am

dm200 wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 3:13 pm
Probably anecdotal - but I have seen claims that earlier retirement shortens lifespan.

Guys retire - and sit on a recliner watching TV and drinking a lot of beer and junk food.
That^^ + lack of mental stimulation.
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by snowox » Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:58 am

WanderingDoc wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:44 am
Even if you told me (and could guarantee) that working longer will result in a longer life, i would STILL retire very early. There is simply too much to see and try in life to work full time (at the same job no less) even if you happen to love your initial vocation.

:sharebeer



I agree with this. I also think people can do whatever study they want to prove whatever they want so I will just go with what I think is simple logic. If your job is killing you then its probably better to retire if you can. If your sitting your ass on the couch doing nothing and drinking beer then its a decision if your happy given up most likely living like that or become more active. Other than things you cant avoid I believe being happy is the biggest part of it all.

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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by carolinaman » Thu Nov 15, 2018 7:53 am

I worked to age 66 and am now 74. According to this study, I should already be dead. I know many people who worked well into their 60s and beyond, and are still in good health years later.

This data looks seriously flawed to me.

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JoMoney
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by JoMoney » Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:00 am

JoMoney wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:37 am
Check out page 12 of this:
https://www.sandia.gov/LabNews/LN11-16- ... -16-01.pdf
... As it turns out, this data is bogus but the claim has
attained the status of an urban legend as it’s been
disseminated via e-mail and fax ...

... Data for deceased Sandia retirees, both
male and female, show a positive rather
than negative dependence of age at death ...
One more quote from the article, that deserves emphasizing :
... Boeing has vigorously denied that this graph is representative of its retirees. According to Julie Curtis, Boeing’s Director of Actuarial Services, this graph has no basis in fact. It, and charts like it, have circulated for at least 20 years and, “although completely untrue, have become an urban legend.” Curtis states flatly, “Just as important, our data show that the life expectancy of a Boeing retiree does not depend on the age at retirement.” ...
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Re: Does Early Retirement Make You Live Longer?

Post by RobLyons » Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:23 am

Excellent post to highlight the fact that one must dig deeper and evaluate the quality and dependability of any statistics. As stated correlation does not imply causation. Children who get tutored get worse grades than children who do not get tutored..
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