Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th [2018]

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ogleheaded
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by ogleheaded » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:32 pm

b0B wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 3:23 pm
indexfundfan wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 3:12 pm
Here are a couple of interesting links about the size of HSA providers, account balances etc.
Who's Raking in the HSA Dollars?
https://thehsareportcard.com/the-hsa-re ... he-numbers
2017 Year-End Devenir HSA Research Report
http://www.devenir.com/research/2017-ye ... ch-report/

Fidelity is 4th in HSA Assets, and 6th in number of accounts.
I wonder how long it will take for Fidelity to be in the top two? 5 maybe 6 years? HSA holders just need to do either indirect rollovers or trustee to trustee transfers to Fidelity and do it each year (or multiple times a year for no fee transfers). Unless the other HSA companies compete and step up, they will lose HSA assets to Fidelity. The zero ER Fidelity mutual funds have already gathered a billion in the month that it was open.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Horsefly » Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:20 pm

ogleheaded wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:32 pm
I wonder how long it will take for Fidelity to be in the top two? 5 maybe 6 years? HSA holders just need to do either indirect rollovers or trustee to trustee transfers to Fidelity and do it each year (or multiple times a year for no fee transfers). Unless the other HSA companies compete and step up, they will lose HSA assets to Fidelity. The zero ER Fidelity mutual funds have already gathered a billion in the month that it was open.
Based only on how quickly this thread has grown to 8 pages, I'd say Fidelity certainly has generated lots of interest. I'm really happy with them after over a year running my HSA, and I would guess they will quickly jump near the top and maybe force some changes in the competition.

Atgard
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Atgard » Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:16 am

Assuming everything works smoothly, I would say Fidelity just leaped to the very top as the no-brainer #1 choice for HSAs. On top of that, many people already have Fidelity accounts, CCs, etc. and will want to switch for consolidation/simplification purposes. So I think they'll not only dominate new HSA accounts, but will have quite a number of incoming transfers also. As was said above, this thread is already 8 pages and they've only been offered for a week.

(Cool story: my wife was opening an HSA literally 9 days ago, did the research, Fidelity didn't offer them for individuals, went with HSA Bank and opened an account but didn't mail the check in yet... then after seeing this thread I ran up to her and snatched the envelope out of her hand! OK, slight exaggeration on the last bit. But we did walk into a Fidelity branch together the next morning to open her account and transfer mine.)

tschaefges
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by tschaefges » Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:58 am

hoppy08520 wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:08 pm
I opened my new Fidelity individual HSA and want to begin the transfer. Before doing this, should I first liquidate the TDA holdings and transfer the TDA funds back into the "savings account" of the HSA? Or can I leave my TDA funds as they are? If I leave the TDA funds as they are, will they transfer in-kind into Fidelity in the same holdings and same share amounts?
I'm transfering from HSA Bank/TD Ameritrade to Fidelity. I opened the HSA account earlier this week and filled out the online transfer form to move my TD Ameritrade HSA account. Yesterday I got a message from Fidelity that they will not do an in-kind transfer to an HSA. The TD Ameritrade assets must be sold first, then the cash can be moved to the Fidelity HSA.

Turbo29
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Turbo29 » Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:26 am

Have an Optum HSA through my employer.

This thread has got me considering opening up one at Fidelity. As I don't have my per paycheck contribution maxed out, I can take the balance up to the max for this year and put it in Fidelity.

For now I need to use the Optum account to get my employer contribution each year. Have been funneling all the investment money (over the required $2K in checking) to SWYEX and SWYLX (Schwab target 2030 and 2020).

I am retiring in two years so it would be nice to have the no-fee Fidelity account set up and ready to go as I am assuming Optum will charge after I am no longer employed. (Right now my employer covers the cost.)

exigent
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by exigent » Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:39 am

Turbo29 wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:26 am
Have an Optum HSA through my employer.

This thread has got me considering opening up one at Fidelity. As I don't have my per paycheck contribution maxed out, I can take the balance up to the max for this year and put it in Fidelity.

For now I need to use the Optum account to get my employer contribution each year. Have been funneling all the investment money (over the required $2K in checking) to SWYEX and SWYLX (Schwab target 2030 and 2020).

I am retiring in two years so it would be nice to have the no-fee Fidelity account set up and ready to go as I am assuming Optum will charge after I am no longer employed. (Right now my employer covers the cost.)
This is my current situation, minus the two years until retirement... I'm considerably further out. I moved a chunk from Optum (formerly USBank MyCDH) to HSA Bank in the past but never got around to investing it there. So I'm pulling that to Fidelity via trustee-to-trustee rollover, and will then do periodic indirect rollovers from Optum to move my ongoing contributions over to Fidelity. This is limited to once every 12 months, but that's preferable to paying a fee to do periodic trustee-to-trustee transfers.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by exigent » Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:43 am

danaht wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:46 pm
jhfenton wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:04 pm
Yes. They will reimburse it inside the HSA. The Fidelity rep was great, and we discussed all the specifics. She said that after the transfer I can call and give them my permission to reimburse the fee. She said that it sounds funny, but they are required to get the customer's permission to credit the fee.
Great news! A lot of people would probably want to make sure that the reimbursement does not add to the contribution limit. Hopefully Fidelity does not treat that as a contribution.
This is a great question because I'm maxing out contributions each year. Reimbursement is great, and having it go back into the HSA would be preferable. BUT if the reimbursement counts as a contribution, then I would prefer to just avoid the fee entirely (via yearly indirect rollovers). Otherwise I'm effectively chipping away at my available HSA space.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:45 am

tschaefges wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:58 am
hoppy08520 wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:08 pm
I opened my new Fidelity individual HSA and want to begin the transfer. Before doing this, should I first liquidate the TDA holdings and transfer the TDA funds back into the "savings account" of the HSA? Or can I leave my TDA funds as they are? If I leave the TDA funds as they are, will they transfer in-kind into Fidelity in the same holdings and same share amounts?
I'm transfering from HSA Bank/TD Ameritrade to Fidelity. I opened the HSA account earlier this week and filled out the online transfer form to move my TD Ameritrade HSA account. Yesterday I got a message from Fidelity that they will not do an in-kind transfer to an HSA. The TD Ameritrade assets must be sold first, then the cash can be moved to the Fidelity HSA.
This is clearly not true. My in-kind transfer from TD Ameritrade/Lively has been acknowledged on both side and is in process. I explained the online process I followed earlier in this thread.

Did you try to transfer from HSA Bank or did you completely ignore HSA Bank and transfer from TD Ameritrade? I did the latter. I initiated the transfer as if Lively didn't exist. I just needed LIvely to send a Letter of Release to TD Ameritrade. As far as Fidelity and TD Ameritrade go, it's just a brokerage to brokerage ACATS transfer of the kind they undoubtedly do in both directions every day.

I don't want to post it because it doesn't seem to be a public number, but I have the number and extension of Fidelity's Transfer of Assets desk. I spoke to them twice regarding the Letter of Release from Lively, which I didn't know I needed to begin with. They might be able to explain what the problem is. If anyone wants the number, send me a PM.

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hoppy08520
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by hoppy08520 » Thu Nov 22, 2018 12:37 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:45 am
tschaefges wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:58 am
hoppy08520 wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:08 pm
I opened my new Fidelity individual HSA and want to begin the transfer. Before doing this, should I first liquidate the TDA holdings and transfer the TDA funds back into the "savings account" of the HSA? Or can I leave my TDA funds as they are? If I leave the TDA funds as they are, will they transfer in-kind into Fidelity in the same holdings and same share amounts?
I'm transfering from HSA Bank/TD Ameritrade to Fidelity. I opened the HSA account earlier this week and filled out the online transfer form to move my TD Ameritrade HSA account. Yesterday I got a message from Fidelity that they will not do an in-kind transfer to an HSA. The TD Ameritrade assets must be sold first, then the cash can be moved to the Fidelity HSA.
This is clearly not true. My in-kind transfer from TD Ameritrade/Lively has been acknowledged on both side and is in process. I explained the online process I followed earlier in this thread.

Did you try to transfer from HSA Bank or did you completely ignore HSA Bank and transfer from TD Ameritrade? I did the latter. I initiated the transfer as if Lively didn't exist. I just needed LIvely to send a Letter of Release to TD Ameritrade. As far as Fidelity and TD Ameritrade go, it's just a brokerage to brokerage ACATS transfer of the kind they undoubtedly do in both directions every day.

I don't want to post it because it doesn't seem to be a public number, but I have the number and extension of Fidelity's Transfer of Assets desk. I spoke to them twice regarding the Letter of Release from Lively, which I didn't know I needed to begin with. They might be able to explain what the problem is. If anyone wants the number, send me a PM.
Thanks for the heads up. I’m not sure how all this works but could it be that Lively and HSA Bank operate differently and have different policies?

On Wednesday (day before Thanksgiving) I opened a Fidelity HSA and in Fidelity, initiated a transfer from my HSA Bank/TDA account, from the TDA side. We shall see what happens...

FWIW, before doing this, I called HSA Bank and asked them about outgoing transfers. I asked if I could transfer to Fidelity directly in-kind from TDA and they said “no, you must liquidate your holdings in TDA, transfer back to the HSA Bank savings account, and initiate the transfer using your HSA Bank account, not the TDA account.” He was very clear about that even after I tested him on that (“Are you realllly sure about that?”).

I also spoke to a Fidelity person about HSA Bank transfers. I told him I’d prefer to transfer from TDA in-kind. After asking some people, he said they were not sure yet how HSA Bank is handling these situations because this is so new, so he told me I’d have to ask HSA Bank for guidance.

So in spite of what the HSA Bank person told me, I am trying to go an in-kind transfer from TDA anyway. I’ll report back what happens....

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jhfenton
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:02 pm

hoppy08520 wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 12:37 pm
So in spite of what the HSA Bank person told me, I am trying to go an in-kind transfer from TDA anyway. I’ll report back what happens....
Good luck. It's certainly possible that HSA Bank could block you, but I know some folks were able to transfer in-kind from TD Ameritrade to TD Ameritrade going from HSA Bank to Lively.

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Vulcan
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Vulcan » Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:38 pm

mx711yam wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:53 pm
Boglemeister wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:35 pm
For those transferring from Saturna with Vanguard admiral shares to this new Fidelity option, what is the fastest way to accomplish this? I was told by Fidelity that an in-kind transfer of VTSAX is not possible. I don’t want to lose $500 in market value while waiting for cash to transfer to save $25/yr in fees
Very interested to hear this answer as well.
If you have bonds elsewhere in your portfolio, sell the amount equal to your HSA and buy VTSAX, buy bonds in HSA, and initiate the transfer.
Bonds are much less volatile, so the risk of being out of the market at the very wrong time is significantly lowered.
If you torture the data long enough, it will confess to anything. ~Ronald Coase

NewtoInvesting403
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov.

Post by NewtoInvesting403 » Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:39 pm

I’m paying fees with a Fidelity HSA through my employer.
Could I roll it out into a fidelity NON-employer HSA to avoid the fees?
Anyone in a similar boat as I?

danaht
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov.

Post by danaht » Thu Nov 22, 2018 4:28 pm

NewtoInvesting403 wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:39 pm
I’m paying fees with a Fidelity HSA through my employer.
Could I roll it out into a fidelity NON-employer HSA to avoid the fees?
Anyone in a similar boat as I?
It's worth looking into. Before you do - I would talk to someone at Fidelity to see if they would be willing to waive the fees going forward. Also if you close the account - your employer will no longer be able to contribute to your HSA and you might lose the ability to contribute without paying FICA taxes. If your employer does not contribute anything to your HSA this might be an interesting decision. 7.65% (FICA tax) of $3500 is $267.75. But if you make considerably more than $128,700 - you will only save on the medicare portion which is 1.45% or $50.75. These amounts double if you are maxing out a family HSA contribution.

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Clark & Addison
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Clark & Addison » Fri Nov 23, 2018 10:10 am

Anyone know how to make sure that a rollover to Fidelity is not counted as a 2018 contribution for the IRS? I rolled over an amount under the yearly limit, but adding it plus my contributions to my employer plan would be above the limit. I did this indirect rollover online and didn't see anywhere to mark it as a rollover as opposed to a 2018 contribution.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:38 am

Has anyone's rollover contribution posted at the Fidelity HSA account?
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by veggivet » Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:57 am

indexfundfan wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:38 am
Has anyone's rollover contribution posted at the Fidelity HSA account?
Yes, my assets are listed when I go to the 'Transfer Tracker', but haven't been credited to my account yet. Transfer from TDA initiated last Friday, so it's only been 4 business days. Everything looks good so far...
If you watch your pennies, your dollars will take care of themselves.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:06 pm

veggivet wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:57 am
indexfundfan wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:38 am
Has anyone's rollover contribution posted at the Fidelity HSA account?
Yes, my assets are listed when I go to the 'Transfer Tracker', but haven't been credited to my account yet. Transfer from TDA initiated last Friday, so it's only been 4 business days. Everything looks good so far...
Sounds great! From your previous post, it looks like you were transferring in-kind from HSA Bank/TDA.
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by veggivet » Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:12 pm

That is correct, all assets transferred in kind after moving all my idle cash from HSA Bank to TDA. By the way, I called HSA Bank this morning to close the account, but the rep said I needed to wait until the assets were officially posted to my new account at Fidelity. She was very nice, and seemed to be well informed. Me thinks I wasn't the first person to call requesting account closure this week...
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by veggivet » Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:40 pm

Didn't mean to cause any confusion. To be clear, my transaction is a transfer, not a rollover.
If you watch your pennies, your dollars will take care of themselves.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by tj » Fri Nov 23, 2018 1:31 pm

veggivet wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:40 pm
Didn't mean to cause any confusion. To be clear, my transaction is a transfer, not a rollover.
What's the difference between an HSA transfer and an HSA rollover?

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Clark & Addison
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Clark & Addison » Fri Nov 23, 2018 2:28 pm

b0B wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 10:33 am
What procedure did you use? How exactly did you designate the incoming funds as a rollover? (Is it even possible online?)

I know there's this paper form here (to be filled and mailed with paper check)
https://www.fidelity.com/bin-public/060 ... t-slip.pdf
But is there any other method to do it?
Here is what I did. I withdrew funds from my employer sponsored HSA and place those funds into my checking account that is linked to Fidelity. I logged into my Fidelity account to transfer the money from my local checking account to my new Fidelity HSA. I couldn't find anywhere online to designate the funds as a rollover (like the paper form linked above), so I called Fidelity prior to transferring from my checking account. The representative that I talked to said they would note that my incoming funds were from a rollover, not new contributions for the year. I feel like I need to call back to ensure that the funds were marked correctly so that the IRS doesn't see it as an over contribution.

This is the first time I've attempted a rollover. I was under the impression that I should just withdraw funds from my employer HSA, then deposit those funds into my Fidelity HSA within 60 days. The problem is I couldn't find anywhere online to designate the deposit as a rollover.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Clark & Addison » Fri Nov 23, 2018 2:42 pm

I just talked to another Fidelity representative. He said that my online deposit showed up as a contribution, not a rollover. He cancelled that transaction and is having me fill out the paper form linked above and send it in with a check. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like there is a way to do the rollover all online.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:48 am

veggivet wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:57 am
indexfundfan wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:38 am
Has anyone's rollover contribution posted at the Fidelity HSA account?
Yes, my assets are listed when I go to the 'Transfer Tracker', but haven't been credited to my account yet. Transfer from TDA initiated last Friday, so it's only been 4 business days. Everything looks good so far...
My transfer hasn't posted at Fidelity yet, but my TD Ameritrade account is locked as of this morning. I cannot log in either directly or through SSO from Lively. I know from a few years ago when I transferred all of our regular accounts from TDA to Vanguard that it is their standard procedure to lock accounts when a full transfer is in progress. I was expecting it to happen a day or two earlier. I was a bit surprised that I could still log in yesterday.

I'm going to email LIvely this week and ask them to turn off my TD Ameritrade account on their side so that I am not billed another $2.50 for December.

I actually had a check en route to Lively from my employer-sponsored HSA when Fidelity made their announcement. So I'm going to have a ~1,500 cash transfer from Lively once that check arrives, probably toward the end of this week.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:59 am

b0B wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:20 pm
indexfundfan wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 12:06 pm
veggivet wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:57 am
indexfundfan wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:38 am
Has anyone's rollover contribution posted at the Fidelity HSA account?
Yes, my assets are listed when I go to the 'Transfer Tracker', but haven't been credited to my account yet. Transfer from TDA initiated last Friday, so it's only been 4 business days. Everything looks good so far...
Sounds great! From your previous post, it looks like you were transferring in-kind from HSA Bank/TDA.
Are you using the words "rollover" and "transfer" interchangeably. That could cause confusion.
My bad. I should just say "transfer".
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:03 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:48 am
veggivet wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:57 am

Yes, my assets are listed when I go to the 'Transfer Tracker', but haven't been credited to my account yet. Transfer from TDA initiated last Friday, so it's only been 4 business days. Everything looks good so far...
My transfer hasn't posted at Fidelity yet, but my TD Ameritrade account is locked as of this morning. I cannot log in either directly or through SSO from Lively. I know from a few years ago when I transferred all of our regular accounts from TDA to Vanguard that it is their standard procedure to lock accounts when a full transfer is in progress. I was expecting it to happen a day or two earlier. I was a bit surprised that I could still log in yesterday.

I'm going to email LIvely this week and ask them to turn off my TD Ameritrade account on their side so that I am not billed another $2.50 for December.

I actually had a check en route to Lively from my employer-sponsored HSA when Fidelity made their announcement. So I'm going to have a ~1,500 cash transfer from Lively once that check arrives, probably toward the end of this week.
I opened the Fidelity HSA last week and sent them a secure message asking a) if they will reimburse any transfer fee, and b) if the fee is reimbursed, it is not considered as a contribution. I will keep the reply as a record.

If the reply is positive, I will liquidate SPDW which I hold at TDA and transfer the cash over to Fidelity. I will put the money into a Fidelity developed markets mutual fund (no un-invested dollar).
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:05 pm

indexfundfan wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:03 pm
I opened the Fidelity HSA last week and sent them a secure message asking a) if they will reimburse any transfer fee, and b) if the fee is reimbursed, it is not considered as a contribution. I will keep the reply as a record.

If the reply is positive, I will liquidate SPDW which I hold at TDA and transfer the cash over to Fidelity. I will put the money into a Fidelity developed markets mutual fund (no un-invested dollar).
Two different transfer of assets reps at Fidelity told me that they will reimburse transfer TD Ameritrade's $50 transfer fee if they charge It. I just need to call them back and give them permission after the transfer is complete.

I've decided that I'm just going to put everything in FPADX (Fidelity Emerging Markets) at 8 bp. At this point, it's the cheapest option available anywhere. I'm going to ask for two free trades to liquidate my two existing ETF positions so that I can put the money in their fund.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Sun Nov 25, 2018 2:06 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:05 pm
indexfundfan wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:03 pm
I opened the Fidelity HSA last week and sent them a secure message asking a) if they will reimburse any transfer fee, and b) if the fee is reimbursed, it is not considered as a contribution. I will keep the reply as a record.

If the reply is positive, I will liquidate SPDW which I hold at TDA and transfer the cash over to Fidelity. I will put the money into a Fidelity developed markets mutual fund (no un-invested dollar).
Two different transfer of assets reps at Fidelity told me that they will reimburse transfer TD Ameritrade's $50 transfer fee if they charge It. I just need to call them back and give them permission after the transfer is complete.

I've decided that I'm just going to put everything in FPADX (Fidelity Emerging Markets) at 8 bp. At this point, it's the cheapest option available anywhere. I'm going to ask for two free trades to liquidate my two existing ETF positions so that I can put the money in their fund.
Yeah. I just received the reply from Fidelity, confirming the fee reimbursement. The rep also says the "reimbursement is considered a fee reversal, not a contribution". So, now I have it on record as well.

FPADX is probably a good idea for me too, since its ER is even lower than the ETFs I use elsewhere.
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by aristotelian » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:45 am

Update on my transfer to Fidelity: initially I received an email from customer service that they would not reimburse transfer fees for accounts under $25,000. I replied with a request to halt the transfer since my account is $12K. They responded with a one time offer to reimburse the transfer fee.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:35 am

aristotelian wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:45 am
Update on my transfer to Fidelity: initially I received an email from customer service that they would not reimburse transfer fees for accounts under $25,000. I replied with a request to halt the transfer since my account is $12K. They responded with a one time offer to reimburse the transfer fee.
:sharebeer Nice job.

My assets from TD Ameritrade are now showing up at Fidelity as pending transfer:

Code: Select all

Assets Being Transferred
Name							Symbol	Quantity	Quantity Received	Date Received
DEBIT CASH BALANCE					n/a	50		--			--
ISHARES INC EDGE MSCI MULTIFACTOR EMERGING		EMGF	xxx		--			--
SPDR INDEX SHS FDS S&P EMERGING MKTS SM CAP ETF		EWX	xxx		--			--
The interesting part is the confirmation that TD Ameritrade charged a $50 transfer fee and transferred it as a debit cash balance.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by tj » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:48 am


My assets from TD Ameritrade are now showing up at Fidelity as pending transfer:
how long did this take? I dropped the paperwork off at a branch last week and the website is still showing paperwork not yet received.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:24 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:35 am
My assets from TD Ameritrade are now showing up at Fidelity as pending transfer:

Code: Select all

Assets Being Transferred
Name							Symbol	Quantity	Quantity Received	Date Received
DEBIT CASH BALANCE					n/a	50		--			--
ISHARES INC EDGE MSCI MULTIFACTOR EMERGING		EMGF	xxx		--			--
SPDR INDEX SHS FDS S&P EMERGING MKTS SM CAP ETF		EWX	xxx		--			--
The interesting part is the confirmation that TD Ameritrade charged a $50 transfer fee and transferred it as a debit cash balance.
jhfenton, I appreciate your update.

In your earlier post, you mentioned a letter of release from Lively to TDA. Is this a letter your received from Lively and you then email to TDA, or does it go directly from Lively to TDA without going through you?
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:30 pm

tj wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:48 am

My assets from TD Ameritrade are now showing up at Fidelity as pending transfer:
how long did this take? I dropped the paperwork off at a branch last week and the website is still showing paperwork not yet received.
I did mine entirely online, so there was no paperwork involved.

I submitted it on Friday 11/16/18. It was processed on Saturday 11/17/18 by Fidelity. There was a halt on Tuesday 11/20/18 because TD Ameritrade needed a letter of release from Lively. At my request, Lively provided the release the same afternoon. TD Ameritrade locked my account yesterday Sunday 11/25/18. This morning the assets show pending at Fidelity.
indexfundfan wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:24 pm
jhfenton, I appreciate your update.

In your earlier post, you mentioned a letter of release from Lively to TDA. Is this a letter your received from Lively and you then email to TDA, or does it go directly from Lively to TDA without going through you?
Last Tuesday I played a game of telephone to figure out what I needed to do after getting an online notice to call Fidelity. After speaking to Fidelity and to Lively on the phone, I emailed Lively a copy of my Fidelity transfer form and asked Lively to send a Letter of Release to TD Ameritrade. Lively emailed me back about an hour later and said that the letter had been sent to TD Ameritrade. I call TD Ameritrade and confirmed. I called Fidelity back and confirmed.

If you proactively ask Lively for a Letter of Release as soon as you submit the transfer request to Fidelity, you should speed up your transfer by a day or two.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:38 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:30 pm
Last Tuesday I played a game of telephone to figure out what I needed to do after getting an online notice to call Fidelity. After speaking to Fidelity and to Lively on the phone, I emailed Lively a copy of my Fidelity transfer form and asked Lively to send a Letter of Release to TD Ameritrade. Lively emailed me back about an hour later and said that the letter had been sent to TD Ameritrade. I call TD Ameritrade and confirmed. I called Fidelity back and confirmed.

If you proactively ask Lively for a Letter of Release as soon as you submit the transfer request to Fidelity, you should speed up your transfer by a day or two.
Thank you! This will save me time. My HSA account is about 10k in SPDW. I'm selling it today (with a purchase elsewhere to match) and start the transfer when it settles. I think someone mentioned earlier that TDA does not charge for cash transfers, we'll see.
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by terran » Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:16 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:35 am
aristotelian wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:45 am
Update on my transfer to Fidelity: initially I received an email from customer service that they would not reimburse transfer fees for accounts under $25,000. I replied with a request to halt the transfer since my account is $12K. They responded with a one time offer to reimburse the transfer fee.
:sharebeer Nice job.

My assets from TD Ameritrade are now showing up at Fidelity as pending transfer:

Code: Select all

Assets Being Transferred
Name							Symbol	Quantity	Quantity Received	Date Received
DEBIT CASH BALANCE					n/a	50		--			--
ISHARES INC EDGE MSCI MULTIFACTOR EMERGING		EMGF	xxx		--			--
SPDR INDEX SHS FDS S&P EMERGING MKTS SM CAP ETF		EWX	xxx		--			--
The interesting part is the confirmation that TD Ameritrade charged a $50 transfer fee and transferred it as a debit cash balance.
Thanks for updating us all on the process for this. Very helpful.

So is it your understanding that the full balance of your TD ameritrade account has been transferred to Fidelity, they've been paid an account closing fee by Fidelity, and Fidelity has told you that they'll remove this debit from your account (thus paying the fee themselves without charging you)?

Given aristotelian's comment above about Fidelity only reimbursing fees for accounts over $25k, is your HSA balance over $25k?

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:23 pm

terran wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:16 pm
Thanks for updating us all on the process for this. Very helpful.

So is it your understanding that the full balance of your TD ameritrade account has been transferred to Fidelity, they've been paid an account closing fee by Fidelity, and Fidelity has told you that they'll remove this debit from your account (thus paying the fee themselves without charging you)?
Exactly.
terran wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:16 pm
Given aristotelian's comment above about Fidelity only reimbursing fees for accounts over $25k, is your HSA balance over $25k?
Yes. After the drop in emerging markets this year, it's just under $50K.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by terran » Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:40 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:23 pm
terran wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:16 pm
Thanks for updating us all on the process for this. Very helpful.

So is it your understanding that the full balance of your TD ameritrade account has been transferred to Fidelity, they've been paid an account closing fee by Fidelity, and Fidelity has told you that they'll remove this debit from your account (thus paying the fee themselves without charging you)?
Exactly.
terran wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:16 pm
Given aristotelian's comment above about Fidelity only reimbursing fees for accounts over $25k, is your HSA balance over $25k?
Yes. After the drop in emerging markets this year, it's just under $50K.
Great, thanks for the info!

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Sailor36 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:13 pm

Has anyone attempted a transfer from HealthSavings Administrators yet? If so, were there any snags in the process?

I am 100% in Vanguard Total Stock Mkt Admiral and their fees add up to about 50 bp per year. If possible I would prefer not to liquidate the holding before transferring.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by terran » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:00 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:29 am
1. Open a new Fidelity HSA online.

2a. Either as part of the initial set-up or after logging into your new $0 HSA account, go to Transfer on the main menu.
2b. Selection Transfer From...Another Financial Institution (Transfer Assets)
2c. Click Start a New Transfer
2d. Enter Firm name: Type TD and select TD Ameritrade Inc from the drop-down menu
2e. Enter your TD Ameritrade account number and Select Health Savings Account as the Account Type
2f. Select To: your new Fidelity HSA and Transfer All Account Assets? Yes
2g. Upload a statement from TD Ameritrade
2h. Digitally sign the Fidelity Transfer Form and submit the transfer. Save a copy of the Fidelity transfer form.

3. Email Lively customer service. Send a copy of the Fidelity transfer form and ask them to send a letter of release to TD Ameritrade allowing your TD Ameritrade account to be transferred to Fidelity.
I just went through these steps, thanks for the excellent writeup.

Fidelity confirmed (via chat) that I they would reimburse any fee charged by TD Ameritrade. There was no mention of a minimum HSA balance at which they would offer this reimbursement, but we do have quite a bit in other accounts with Fidelity, so if you have a low HSA balance and low/no balances in other Fidelity accounts you may not be offered reimbursement -- I can't speak to that.

Their does seem to be some question as to whether I'll be able to sell my SPTM investment without a fee. The chat rep said she would put a note on my account requesting a few free trades, but that she couldn't guarantee it -- for that I would need to speak with a trader on the phone. Since I'll need to call in to request the account closing fee reimbursement I'm going to roll the dice and hope they'll give me a free trade at that point.

After emailing Lively to request the letter of release I received this response indicating that I didn't need to request the letter. Since this is counter to jhfenton's experience, I don't know if this is a change they've made or confusion on their part that will come back to bite me, but it's possible you can now skip step 3 in the instructions above:
Lively wrote: Once you submit the In-Kind Transfer request to Fidelity, they will submit it directly to TD Ameritrade to request your assets. TD Ameritrade will reach out directly to us at Lively to confirm and request a letter of release which we will sign and initiate the in-kind-transfer process.

You do not need to reach out directly to our support team until after your investments and funds are all moved over, after which please notify us and we can close out your account.
I'll report back with anything else I learn.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by RickBoglehead » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:01 pm

Fidelity told me no fees at all. No $250,000 balance requirement, nothing. I sent the paperwork via fax today. They said my HSA bank has to send them a manual check.

Why a Fidelity HSA?
The Fidelity HSA is a brokerage account, not affiliated with your employer, that gives you flexibility with your money. An account with Fidelity offers:
Broad investing options, Holistic wealth and retirement planning, No account opening or transaction fees.

Fidelity HSA® Funds to Consider

They're professionally selected for HSA investing, all with waived investment minimums and no transaction fees. The list of funds is coming soon!

https://www.fidelity.com/go/hsa/investing-your-hsa
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:18 pm

terran wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:00 pm
I just went through these steps, thanks for the excellent writeup.

Fidelity confirmed (via chat) that I they would reimburse any fee charged by TD Ameritrade. There was no mention of a minimum HSA balance at which they would offer this reimbursement, but we do have quite a bit in other accounts with Fidelity, so if you have a low HSA balance and low/no balances in other Fidelity accounts you may not be offered reimbursement -- I can't speak to that.

Their does seem to be some question as to whether I'll be able to sell my SPTM investment without a fee. The chat rep said she would put a note on my account requesting a few free trades, but that she couldn't guarantee it -- for that I would need to speak with a trader on the phone. Since I'll need to call in to request the account closing fee reimbursement I'm going to roll the dice and hope they'll give me a free trade at that point.

After emailing Lively to request the letter of release I received this response indicating that I didn't need to request the letter. Since this is counter to jhfenton's experience, I don't know if this is a change they've made or confusion on their part that will come back to bite me, but it's possible you can now skip step 3 in the instructions above:
Lively wrote: Once you submit the In-Kind Transfer request to Fidelity, they will submit it directly to TD Ameritrade to request your assets. TD Ameritrade will reach out directly to us at Lively to confirm and request a letter of release which we will sign and initiate the in-kind-transfer process.

You do not need to reach out directly to our support team until after your investments and funds are all moved over, after which please notify us and we can close out your account.
I'll report back with anything else I learn.
:beer It sounds like TD Ameritrade and Lively have figured out the process. They were probably caught unprepared two weeks ago.

I'm in the same boat with the free trades. I'm hoping that if I'm planning to put $45-50K into one of their mutual funds, they'll waive two $4.95 commissions. If not, it's only $9.90.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by Spirit Rider » Mon Nov 26, 2018 5:24 pm

jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:18 pm
:beer It sounds like TD Ameritrade and Lively have figured out the process. They were probably caught unprepared two weeks ago.

I'm in the same boat with the free trades. I'm hoping that if I'm planning to put $45-50K into one of their mutual funds, they'll waive two $4.95 commissions. If not, it's only $9.90.
I realize that at this early stage, this might be inside baseball at BH, but I wonder just how many people are going to request rollovers from the various HSA providers to Fidelity. It has been just 11 days, but I guessing there have been or will shortly be some serious UH-OH meetings at the other HSA custodians. Isn't competition is a wonderful thing. This is the first mainstream brokerage to jump into the retail HSA market. Who's next?

If you are referring to Fidelity mutual funds, there are no trading fees

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by LadyGeek » Mon Nov 26, 2018 5:48 pm

Spirit Rider wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 5:24 pm
I realize that at this early stage, this might be inside baseball at BH, but I wonder just how many people are going to request rollovers from the various HSA providers to Fidelity.
I will. Until now, I've always had a Flexible spending arrangement. Starting in 2019, I'll be on an HDHP and will start my very first HSA.

I have no idea who it will be with, but I'll be moving everything over to Fidelity once I get enough invested to make it worthwhile (and I'm allowed to do so).
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:11 pm

Spirit Rider wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 5:24 pm
I realize that at this early stage, this might be inside baseball at BH, but I wonder just how many people are going to request rollovers from the various HSA providers to Fidelity. It has been just 11 days, but I guessing there have been or will shortly be some serious UH-OH meetings at the other HSA custodians. Isn't competition is a wonderful thing. This is the first mainstream brokerage to jump into the retail HSA market. Who's next?

If you are referring to Fidelity mutual funds, there are no trading fees
Second question first, I was referring to the commissions to sell the two ETFs I'm transferring in from TD Ameritrade. They are both emerging markets ETFs, and I'm just going to consolidate them into Fidelity's now cheaper-than-dirt emerging market fund at 8 bp (FPADX). (FPADX was their Institutional Premium share class before the consolidation. Vanguard's comparable share class is 9 bp, but the retail Admiral Shares is still 14 bp. Vanguard's move.)

As for the first question, I've been wondering the same thing. Who or what is next?

Fidelity was already the only major brokerage firm that I'm aware of that directly offered HSAs, albeit only through employers. TD Ameritrade (with Lively and HSA Bank) and Schwab (with Further) have secondary arrangements. Vanguard has their funds on some platforms, but has no brokerage arrangements. It was actually a fairly small technical step for Fidelity to make their HSAs available retail, but making them free was big.

Schwab could do the same thing if they judged the market attractive enough. They have the same incentive as Fidelity to attract assets and the same ability to profit indirectly from the relationships. But we're definitely still a small minority using HSAs as long-term investment vehicles, so I'm not sure how attractive that market is.

I actually feel a bit sorry for the folks at Lively. They had passed the one-year mark offering investments in October, and raised $11 MM in their Series A funding round that closed on October 30. They had a solid value proposition at $2.50/month, no cash requirement, and a linked brokerage account at TD Ameritrade. Now suddenly Fidelity is free and offers their own brokerage platform, so you don't have to juggle two accounts as part of the same HSA. Fidelity can make money other ways on their HSA customers. Lively can't.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by harvestbook » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:47 pm

Sailor36 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:13 pm
Has anyone attempted a transfer from HealthSavings Administrators yet? If so, were there any snags in the process?

I am 100% in Vanguard Total Stock Mkt Admiral and their fees add up to about 50 bp per year. If possible I would prefer not to liquidate the holding before transferring.
I am. Will be starting the switch next week. Plan A is request Fidelity cover the costs of trustee-to-trustee transfer ($25) and account closing fee ($25).

If no go, then I will withdraw all the funds (app. $14,000) and do an indirect rollover submitting a paper check with the deposit slip marked as "Rollover." Then close the HealthSavings Administrators account and pay the $25 fee. It's important to close the account to avoid the annual fee ($40 or $45 if I remember correctly).

I use Vanguard total stock, VG int'l stock, VG Small Cap Index, and VG total bond there. Even if they transfer in-kind, I'll go with Fidelity's zero funds. Will report back on the process.
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by exigent » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:02 pm

Just wanted to share that I sent a secure message to Fidelity via their web interface re: fee reimbursement. Based on their response I can confirm that: (a) they will reimburse transfer fees for amounts of $25k or larger, and (b) the reimbursement is *not* considered a contribution. Others have said similar things, but I wanted to add my independent confirmation to that body of evidence. 8-)

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Fidelity HSA

Post by eltron » Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:20 am

[merged into existing thread - moderator prudent]

I just noticed HSA being an option on Fidelity's website. When did this happen? I thought people had been wanting one of these larger brokerages (Vanguard, Fidelity, Schwab, etc.) to offer an HSA option for some time now - I wasn't aware this had happened. Is this recent?

I'm currently with Saturna which is an investing HSA as I purchase 1 fund 1 time a year to max it out and will not touch it for medical purposes, i.e. use it as an extra retirement vehicle.

How does Fidelity's HSA compare to Saturna? Should I be rolling over my funds to Fidelity or stay put with Saturna?

Does anyone have any experience using an HSA through Fidelity?

Thanks!

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:28 am

b0B wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:21 pm
jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:11 pm
... and I'm just going to consolidate them into Fidelity's now cheaper-than-dirt emerging market fund at 8 bp (FPADX). (FPADX was their Institutional Premium share class before the consolidation. Vanguard's comparable share class is 9 bp, but the retail Admiral Shares is still 14 bp. Vanguard's move.)
To be fair, FPADX and VEMAX are not precisely comparable. FPADX is large caps only, while VEMAX is all caps. Fidelity is cutting corners somewhat. Either fund is fine, but VEMAX is more diversified with only slightly higher ER.
Good point. I should have mentioned that. FPADX does have some mid-caps, but it doesn't include small caps or the smaller mid caps. It also follows (since 2016) an MSCI index rather than FTSE, so it includes South Korea as an emerging market. Including South Korea at 14.91% (3.65% of that Samsung) could easily swamp 6 bp in performance one way or the other.

But since I don't have a view on whether Korea will outperform or underperform, I don't really factor that in.

I could credit Vanguard a basis point before for the broader index, but the broader index shouldn't really translate into a significantly higher expense ratio. When Vanguard went all-cap (and 5% China A inclusion) starting in late 2015, the expense ratio did not increase. And with Fidelity now expanding their Institutional Premium pricing to everyone, Vanguard needs to step it up.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by MikeG62 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:28 am

jhfenton wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:30 pm

...Last Tuesday I played a game of telephone to figure out what I needed to do after getting an online notice to call Fidelity. After speaking to Fidelity and to Lively on the phone, I emailed Lively a copy of my Fidelity transfer form and asked Lively to send a Letter of Release to TD Ameritrade. Lively emailed me back about an hour later and said that the letter had been sent to TD Ameritrade. I call TD Ameritrade and confirmed. I called Fidelity back and confirmed.

If you proactively ask Lively for a Letter of Release as soon as you submit the transfer request to Fidelity, you should speed up your transfer by a day or two.
I am thinking of moving my HSA funds from Lively/TDA to Fidelity. However, my Lively account was only opened in April of this year so I want to avoid the Lively account closure fee (I think it is $25).

I am wondering if I can avoid the Lively account closure fee by asking Lively to release my TDA account for the transfer to Fidelity, but to keep the Lively account open (there is a very small amount of money - pennies - sitting with Lively or their bank)? I could then wait till April/May of 2019 then contact Lively and ask them to close the account (after the 12 month window from account opening passes).

Any thoughts on this?

I can't be the only one who opened their Lively account within the last 12 months and is looking to move the funds over the Fidelity.
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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by jhfenton » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:51 am

MikeG62 wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:28 am
I am thinking of moving my HSA funds from Lively/TDA to Fidelity. However, my Lively account was only opened in April of this year so I want to avoid the Lively account closure fee (I think it is $25).

I am wondering if I can avoid the Lively account closure fee by asking Lively to release my TDA account for the transfer to Fidelity, but to keep the Lively account open (there is a very small amount of money - pennies - sitting with Lively or their bank)? I could then wait till April/May of 2019 then contact Lively and ask them to close the account (after the 12 month window from account opening passes).

Any thoughts on this?

I can't be the only one who opened their Lively account within the last 12 months and is looking to move the funds over the Fidelity.
Lively has no closing fees. They are quite explicit about it in their FAQ. Choice Financial has a $25 fee for direct accounts in their terms, but it doesn't apply to Lively accounts.
Are there any Closing Fees?

No.

If you are unhappy with Lively for any reason and want to move your funds to another provider, we won't penalize for wanting to do so. As such, there are no closing or transfer fees out of Lively, although we hope you wouldn't want to do this!
Last edited by jhfenton on Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

Post by indexfundfan » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:53 am

MikeG62 wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:28 am

I am thinking of moving my HSA funds from Lively/TDA to Fidelity. However, my Lively account was only opened in April of this year so I want to avoid the Lively account closure fee (I think it is $25).

I am wondering if I can avoid the Lively account closure fee by asking Lively to release my TDA account for the transfer to Fidelity, but to keep the Lively account open (there is a very small amount of money - pennies - sitting with Lively or their bank)? I could then wait till April/May of 2019 then contact Lively and ask them to close the account (after the 12 month window from account opening passes).

Any thoughts on this?

I can't be the only one who opened their Lively account within the last 12 months and is looking to move the funds over the Fidelity.
I just started on the transfer today, from TDA/Lively to Fidelity. My Lively account is also not a year old yet.

Fidelity has made it very simple -- everything is done online, including online signing. I followed the steps outlined by jhfenton. Also, according to terran, we apparently no longer need to contact Lively to get the Letter of Release. Lively will release it automatically. We'll see.

I sold my holding at TDA prior to the transfer request -- thinking that maybe TDA will not charge the transfer fee for cash transfer. Otherwise, TDA will probably charge you a $50 transfer fee. I did this despite the fact that I already had a secure message from Fidelity saying that they will reimburse the transfer fee.
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