Rumor mill - Fidelity starting individual HSA's Nov. 15th

[liberty53]

I was in my local Fidelity office a few days ago, and asked them if Fidelity would ever start individual HSA accounts (accounts not associated with an employer plan). They replied that they had just recently received a company email stating individual plans would be allowed starting Nov. 15th. They would not share the contents of the email, and I don't have any other information confirming this.

For me, this would be really great since I have many of my accounts at Fidelity, and hate managing my orphaned HSA through HSA bank.

Again - this is not confirmed - but maybe somebody on this forum can corroborate this information?

[exigent]

I have seen similar rumors from various Fidelity customers, including on a discussion thread over at The Finance Buff. The timeline of these rumors has varied between sometime in Q4 to early 2019 This would be fantastic news! I really, really hope it’s true. And the sooner the better.

[leeks]

Would anyone be eligible to open one? Or only if you have a high deductible insurance plan?

[liberty53]

Would anyone be eligible to open one? Or only if you have a high deductible insurance plan?

The rep indicated I would be able to rollover my HSA to Fidelity. I made clear that I wasn't contributing anymore, so I don't believe you need to be in a High Deductible plan to roll one over. You probably need one to start a new plan though.

[LadyGeek]

Would anyone be eligible to open one? Or only if you have a high deductible insurance plan?

Only if you have an existing high deductible insurance plan. See the wiki: Health savings account

I fixed the spelling in the thread title. "Rumor" is the US version of "Rumour" (used outside the US).

[beyou]

You need to be in an HDHP to CONTRIBUTE new funds, but you can create new accounts for the purpose of rollover of existing past contributions.

[Quickblue02]

Good news depending on the costs and investment options. I also would move my HSA from HSA Bank if Fidelity beats HSA Bank in costs and investment potential.

[Bacchus01]

I really wish Vanguard would follow suit.

[b0B]

That would be an interesting in the context of this
"Big players dropping HSA business despite growth potential"
https://www.businessinsurance.com/artic ... -potential

What I'd be interested in is:
Fees?
Dead cash amount required to access investing?

There's some info here
https://www.hsasearch.com/hsa_providers/fidelity/
but I don't know how accurate it is.

This page
https://workplace.fidelity.com/health-s ... count.html
is for employers, and I can't see hints there. (Okay, I'm done googling.)

[b0B]

https://thefinancebuff.com/best-hsa-pro ... money.html
Comment 81:"Just talked to Fidelity to see if I could move my HSA account there. He said that 4th quarter of this year (2018) they will begin offering Standalone HSA accounts for those of us that cannot enroll through an employer. This sounds great for me, and no maintenance fees if have more than $250,000 at Fidelity."

So, not for everyone? Only "those that cannot enroll through an employer"? Or is it everyone, including that group?

[jbmitt]

I hope this is true. I’ll roll my HSA funds over from Optum. I’m all for having fewer accounts to keep track of.

[Kompass]

Add me to the wishful thinking list.

[Spirit Rider]

Last I knew, Fidelity's current HSA fees were $12/quarter if an employer was no longer paying them, with no cash minimum. I believe you could invest in just about anything. I don't know about the 0% ER index funds.

This would be a welcome addition to the HSA custodian choice. Now, if we could just get direct online ACH transfers and Roth sub accounts to their SE401k.

[arf30]

I've got an employer HSA at Fidelity and there are no fees/minimums or cash requirement. I've got the entire balance in FZROX. Hopefully the individual HSAs are similar.

[tuningfork]

This would be very good news. On my quest toward simplification I've consolidated all my investment accounts at Fidelity and Vanguard, except for my pesky HSA at HSA Bank (and the linked brokerage account at TD Ameritrade). Even if the fees are a little higher than HSA Bank, I will gladly move my HSA to Fidelity and eliminate those two accounts.

[b0B]

Last I knew, Fidelity's current HSA fees were $12/quarter if an employer was no longer paying them, with no cash minimum. I believe you could invest in just about anything. I don't know about the 0% ER index funds.

The fees are a little higher than others, but if it gives easy access to their full slate of mutual funds, (with no other costs) I would consider this.

I wonder if this is another market share move by Fidelity.

[Elena]

I hope this is true. I’ll roll my HSA funds over from Optum. I’m all for having fewer accounts to keep track of.

I am also in Optum, with very expensive fund options. Is the provider not chosen for us by our employer, though? I always thought I was stuck with vendors because my employer pitches in a bit.

[drk]

Last I knew, Fidelity's current HSA fees were $12/quarter if an employer was no longer paying them, with no cash minimum. I believe you could invest in just about anything. I don't know about the 0% ER index funds.

That includes the commission-free iShares ETFs?

[drk]

I hope this is true. I’ll roll my HSA funds over from Optum. I’m all for having fewer accounts to keep track of.

I am also in Optum, with very expensive fund options. Is the provider not chosen for us by our employer, though? I always thought I was stuck with vendors because my employer pitches in a bit.

You're allowed to make all of your HSA contributions away from your employer, but you'll pay payroll taxes because you're not using pre-tax payroll contributions. You can also rollover your HSA funds to another custodian, but Optum probably charges a fee to do this.

[tfb]

https://thefinancebuff.com/best-hsa-pro ... money.html
Comment 81:"Just talked to Fidelity to see if I could move my HSA account there. He said that 4th quarter of this year (2018) they will begin offering Standalone HSA accounts for those of us that cannot enroll through an employer. This sounds great for me, and no maintenance fees if have more than $250,000 at Fidelity."

So, not for everyone? Only "those that cannot enroll through an employer"? Or is it everyone, including that group?

Currently (before the rumor turns true), your employer has to choose Fidelity as its HSA provider before you can open an HSA account there. The mention "those that cannot enroll through an employer" referred to this restriction. It really meant "those that cannot enroll through an employer [that chose Fidelity.]" Once opened up, I think it beats every other HSA provider even if you have to pay the $48/year fee. Many Bogleheads will pay no fee as noted above.

[b0B]

^ Okay, that makes sense.

[jbmitt]

I hope this is true. I’ll roll my HSA funds over from Optum. I’m all for having fewer accounts to keep track of.

I am also in Optum, with very expensive fund options. Is the provider not chosen for us by our employer, though? I always thought I was stuck with vendors because my employer pitches in a bit.

You're allowed to make all of your HSA contributions away from your employer, but you'll pay payroll taxes because you're not using pre-tax payroll contributions. You can also rollover your HSA funds to another custodian, but Optum probably charges a fee to do this.

I'm not covered under the HSA at Optum, so I'd rather move the funds away. I believe that you are allowed one roll-over per year, so you could get the payroll benefit/contributions from your employer and then move it. We just consolidated my DW's account at Fidelity from Optum and I believe it was $25 to move/close it out. I don't think you pay the fee if you leave 0.01 in it.

My last straw with Optum was after my former employer stopped paying the monthly fee, and I had to have $5k uninvested to avoid a monthly charge. I sold some of the invested funds, moved it over, and I was still charged for 6 consecutive months of fees because the monthly average wasn't $5k in the month I did it. Admittedly, I didn't read the fine print, and wasn't actively using the account so it kept going. I thought it was sneaky that despite having the $5k in the account, the average monthly balance wasn't $5k, and then subsequent monthly fees reduced it further.

[JustinR]

Last I knew, Fidelity's current HSA fees were $12/quarter if an employer was no longer paying them, with no cash minimum. I believe you could invest in just about anything. I don't know about the 0% ER index funds.

This would be a welcome addition to the HSA custodian choice. Now, if we could just get direct online ACH transfers and Roth sub accounts to their SE401k.

https://thefinancebuff.com/best-hsa-pro ... money.html
Comment 81:"Just talked to Fidelity to see if I could move my HSA account there. He said that 4th quarter of this year (2018) they will begin offering Standalone HSA accounts for those of us that cannot enroll through an employer. This sounds great for me, and no maintenance fees if have more than $250,000 at Fidelity."

So, not for everyone? Only "those that cannot enroll through an employer"? Or is it everyone, including that group?

Currently (before the rumor turns true), your employer has to choose Fidelity as its HSA provider before you can open an HSA account there. The mention "those that cannot enroll through an employer" referred to this restriction. It really meant "those that cannot enroll through an employer [that chose Fidelity.]" Once opened up, I think it beats every other HSA provider even if you have to pay the $48/year fee. Many Bogleheads will pay no fee as noted above.

If Fidelity is $48/year, then Lively is still better at $30/year (2.50/mo).

[Bacchus01]

Last I knew, Fidelity's current HSA fees were $12/quarter if an employer was no longer paying them, with no cash minimum. I believe you could invest in just about anything. I don't know about the 0% ER index funds.

This would be a welcome addition to the HSA custodian choice. Now, if we could just get direct online ACH transfers and Roth sub accounts to their SE401k.

https://thefinancebuff.com/best-hsa-pro ... money.html
Comment 81:"Just talked to Fidelity to see if I could move my HSA account there. He said that 4th quarter of this year (2018) they will begin offering Standalone HSA accounts for those of us that cannot enroll through an employer. This sounds great for me, and no maintenance fees if have more than $250,000 at Fidelity."

So, not for everyone? Only "those that cannot enroll through an employer"? Or is it everyone, including that group?

Currently (before the rumor turns true), your employer has to choose Fidelity as its HSA provider before you can open an HSA account there. The mention "those that cannot enroll through an employer" referred to this restriction. It really meant "those that cannot enroll through an employer [that chose Fidelity.]" Once opened up, I think it beats every other HSA provider even if you have to pay the $48/year fee. Many Bogleheads will pay no fee as noted above.

If Fidelity is $48/year, then Lively is still better at $30/year (2.50/mo).

I’m at $36 at Optum with $2K held in cash. Hoping Fidelity can beat that. Would love Vanguard to do it.

[tfb]

If Fidelity is $48/year, then Lively is still better at $30/year (2.50/mo).

But it's one full fledged Fidelity brokerage account with many more free options than a TD Ameritrade account (index funds versus ETFs, iShares ETFs versus SPDR ETFs, commission-free Treasuries, ... ...). Can set up automatic investing if desired; no extra step to transfer between Lively and TDA. Easily worth extra $18/year.

[JustinR]

If Fidelity is $48/year, then Lively is still better at $30/year (2.50/mo).

But it's one full fledged Fidelity brokerage account with many more free options than a TD Ameritrade account (index funds versus ETFs, iShares ETFs versus SPDR ETFs, commission-free Treasuries, ... ...). Can set up automatic investing if desired; no extra step to transfer between Lively and TDA. Easily worth extra $18/year.

Due to HSA's ridiculously low limit, HSA management is a once-a-year event for me so none of those things are really important.

But yea if that stuff is worth $18 for you, cool. I'm happy Fidelity is joining the competition.

[informal guide]

A few years ago, I was able to roll my individual HSA over to Fidelity, purportedly because I had worked at Fidelity for a few years in the early 1990s. No fees; seems to be processed just like a brokerage account (I could buy i-shares ETFs offered through Fidelity with no commissions and could also buy the then spartan Low fee Fidelity index funds and Vanguard ETFs with low commissions). More interestingly, a year or two ago, my wife was able to open and fund an HSA, even though she never had any Fidelity employment relationship (she has an HDHP).

Neither my wife or I have been charged fees on our HSA account.

[b0B]

If Fidelity is $48/year, then Lively is still better at $30/year (2.50/mo).

But it's one full fledged Fidelity brokerage account with many more free options than a TD Ameritrade account (index funds versus ETFs, iShares ETFs versus SPDR ETFs, commission-free Treasuries, ... ...). Can set up automatic investing if desired; no extra step to transfer between Lively and TDA. Easily worth extra $18/year.

I could see it being worth extra $18/year. (I use Select/Further, transferring from employer-chosen HealthEquity.) I'd want to know how easy it is to transfer other HSA assets in (e.g. from employer-chosen HSA) and to ACH withdrawals to bank, if wanted. I assume that the bank and investment components would be a more seamless combination than it is with most HSAs. Most HSAs are a bit annoying to deal with, so this could easily be >$18/year less annoying.

[White Coat Investor]

I wish Vanguard would get into the game. It would simplify things for me.

But I totally get why the big boys aren't getting into it. Look at the fees, they're piddly. I did a post recently looking at all the top players and the vast majority would collect fees from me of under $100 a year. Hard to stay in business like that.

[b0B]

I wish Vanguard would get into the game. It would simplify things for me.

But I totally get why the big boys aren't getting into it. Look at the fees, they're piddly. I did a post recently looking at all the top players and the vast majority would collect fees from me of under $100 a year. Hard to stay in business like that.

That's what I was saying here

That would be an interesting in the context of this
"Big players dropping HSA business despite growth potential"
https://www.businessinsurance.com/artic ... -potential

I wonder if this is another market share move by Fidelity.

Perhaps Fidelity doesn't care if they don't make much money or lose a little (also with their low/no cost funds). They may want to keep/gain customers, so this HSA is another way.

[Northern Flicker]

Old National Bank partners with the brokerage devenir to offer various mutual funds at cost including a number of Vanguard admiral shares funds:

https://hsainvestments.com/fundperformance/?p=TBH

Annual fee is $36, so less than Fido’s $48 if you do not meet the asset threshold. You do have to maintain $1000 in an Old National HSA checking account however.

[White Coat Investor]

Old National Bank partners with the brokerage devenir to offer various mutual funds at cost including a number of Vanguard admiral shares funds:

https://hsainvestments.com/fundperformance/?p=TBH

Annual fee is $36, so less than Fido’s $48 if you do not meet the asset threshold. You do have to maintain $1000 in an Old National HSA checking account however.

That's about the going rate. Surprisingly little variation in the fees on these things.

[Bacchus01]

I wish Vanguard would get into the game. It would simplify things for me.

But I totally get why the big boys aren't getting into it. Look at the fees, they're piddly. I did a post recently looking at all the top players and the vast majority would collect fees from me of under $100 a year. Hard to stay in business like that.

I wonder at what point it becomes attractive to them. Balance of $50K? $100K?

[veggivet]

If this information is accurate and Fidelity doesn't charge any fees for clients with over 250k in assets with them, I think it is a no brainer. I wonder if Fidelity will cover any account closure charges that may be incurred by moving the HSA to them. I see this move as a way to broaden their product line and increase their AUM incrementally. I don't think they are viewing it is a major profit center.

[sperry8]

This would be very good news. On my quest toward simplification I've consolidated all my investment accounts at Fidelity and Vanguard, except for my pesky HSA at HSA Bank (and the linked brokerage account at TD Ameritrade). Even if the fees are a little higher than HSA Bank, I will gladly move my HSA to Fidelity and eliminate those two accounts.

I'm in a similar situation as you. But not sure I'd move if fees were same. Just not worth the bother. But if they offered something better or special to switch, I'd jump. From Fidelity's perspective this is a good move. I was actually thinking of leaving Fidelity to consolidate with Vanguard. But if I had my HSA there, I wouldn't. So they'd keep some customers like me with this rumored move. Assuming rates and investment opportunities are better than HSA Bank.

[Horsefly]

The company I retired from in 2013 moved all their 401k and benefit management to Fidelity in late 2016. I was then able to move my HSA to Fidelity in April of 2016. It has been awesome. It's just a regular brokerage account, where I can invest in anything I could in my other Fidelity accounts. Free debit Visa card, and no fees.

[veggivet]

For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...

[Horsefly]

For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...

I don't think transfer-in-kind is even a thing in HSAs. It really doesn't matter anyway, since there is no taxable event from liquidating inside an HSA. Get the cash into Fidelity, and buy what you want (even if it is the same funds you had at HSA bank).

The important thing is for HSA Bank to work with Fidelity for a trustee-to-trustee transfer, rather than cutting you a check. Heath Savings Administrators did manage to do this for me, even though they were horrible to deal with in every other way.

[sperry8]

For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...

I don't believe that is true. The assets are held with TD Ameritrade and they are set up to do transfers-in-kind. I also see in the Lively thread that people did just that.

[terran]

Does anyone know what's included Fidelity asset thresholds? Employer accounts? Joint taxable accounts on which you're a joint owner? Spouse's accounts on which you're not a joint owner?

[mervinj7]

For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...

I don't think transfer-in-kind is even a thing in HSAs. It really doesn't matter anyway, since there is no taxable event from liquidating inside an HSA. Get the cash into Fidelity, and buy what you want (even if it is the same funds you had at HSA bank).

The important thing is for HSA Bank to work with Fidelity for a trustee-to-trustee transfer, rather than cutting you a check. Heath Savings Administrators did manage to do this for me, even though they were horrible to deal with in every other way.

There is a taxable event for some states. For example, in CA one would owe capital gains tax on any gains on any securities sold. It's one of the reasons folks recommend using treasury bonds in CA HSAs.

[jeffyscott]

I wish Vanguard would get into the game. It would simplify things for me.

But I totally get why the big boys aren't getting into it. Look at the fees, they're piddly. I did a post recently looking at all the top players and the vast majority would collect fees from me of under $100 a year. Hard to stay in business like that.

Looking at figures in the article b0B linked, the cash deposits and account fees, not the invested assets, is where the profits would appear to be (if anywhere):
HSA Bank 2 million HSA accounts, with $4.08 billion in deposit assets and $728 million in investments
HealthEquity 2.2 million members, assets under management $4.1 billion, AUM includes $488 million in investments
SelectAccount more than 250,000 HSA accounts, $700 million in deposit assets, $105 million in investment assets

That's about $8.4 billion in deposits on which very little is paid and only about $1.3 billion invested assets. Based on those figures the average account is only ~$2000, so the vast majority of folks are probably putting in only what they expect to use in the year, paying $3-5 per month, and earning nearly nothing. Most are just doing it for the current tax deduction.

[b0B]

^ They may also get some revenue from debit card swipe fees.

[veggivet]

For those who may be considering transferring from HSA Bank to Fidelity, it looks like you'd need to liquidate all holdings to cash in order to complete the transfer. It doesn't appear that HSA Bank is set up to transfer assets in kind...

I don't believe that is true. The assets are held with TD Ameritrade and they are set up to do transfers-in-kind. I also see in the Lively thread that people did just that.

I was just going by what I found buried at the HSABank website. It instructed to liquidate all positions and then call the number on the back of your debit card for further instructions. I'd much rather pull this from the Fidelity side than have HSA Bank push the funds over; they will likely drag their heels...

[mervinj7]

Old National Bank partners with the brokerage devenir to offer various mutual funds at cost including a number of Vanguard admiral shares funds:

https://hsainvestments.com/fundperformance/?p=TBH

Annual fee is $36, so less than Fido’s $48 if you do not meet the asset threshold. You do have to maintain $1000 in an Old National HSA checking account however.

Do you know how much interest that $1000 earns in the Old National checking account? A 1 year Treasury bond (purchasable in a Fidelity HSA) currently yields 2.73% or $27.30 for a $1000 investment. Depending on the interest rate, you can easily make up that $12 difference.

[White Coat Investor]

I wish Vanguard would get into the game. It would simplify things for me.

But I totally get why the big boys aren't getting into it. Look at the fees, they're piddly. I did a post recently looking at all the top players and the vast majority would collect fees from me of under $100 a year. Hard to stay in business like that.

I wonder at what point it becomes attractive to them. Balance of $50K? $100K?

That's just the issue. A higher balance doesn't necessarily increase the fees if you're investing it all in cheap Vanguard ETFs like I am. I've got $60K+ invested at HSA Bank/TD Ameritrade and my total fees are something like $60 a year including commissions.

[liberty53]

That's just the issue. A higher balance doesn't necessarily increase the fees if you're investing it all in cheap Vanguard ETFs like I am. I've got $60K+ invested at HSA Bank/TD Ameritrade and my total fees are something like $60 a year including commissions.

For me, it's just about simplification. I have taxable and IRA accounts at Fidelity, and really like the interface and support they provide. It's especially nice to have everything summarized in one statement.

From the brokerage side, I wonder if this is a good "loss leader" to attract future investors and managed clients? I wonder too if the percentage of HDHP's will increase as insurance costs go up or the political winds favor increasing the contribution limits.

[veggivet]

My advisor confirmed the rumor, but said that he couldn't discuss any details until the 15th.

[liberty53]

My advisor confirmed the rumor, but said that he couldn't discuss any details until the 15th.

Sweet - thanks for another data point!

[southerndoc]

I have Health Equity's HSA. Not a huge fan of them, but fees are reasonable ($2.50/month with discount from my PEO-based health insurance).

Would be nice if Fidelity doesn't charge too much. If cheaper than $2.50/month, I would likely transfer mine.