You could have said the same about AOL in 1999. This would be my fear for cryptocurrency. When a crash happens, what's to say some other currency doesn't take over as the dominant force in this space like it did during the dot com days? How do you choose in advance which currency will be the long term winner?whodidntante wrote: ↑Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:53 pmCritical mass, availability of exchanges, and "brand recognition" for lack of a better term.
Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Oh, great! A BitCoin troll. Quit feeding the troll, BHs. There are better BitCoin threads on the site with real points to make and everything.
“Love with your heart; Use your brain for everything else.” -Captain Disillusion
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
When I can go to the grocery store and buy bread, milk vegetables, etc I will believe in bitcoin. Right now U.S. currency is what I need.
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Then go put your life savings into bitcoin. I think you will need a better reasoned argument to sway the rest of us from investing in a manner which has proven reliable for over 100 years (index funds are the modern form) to switching to an unbacked “currency” created, controlled and widely held by a variety of unknown actors.agottem wrote: ↑Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:57 pm The vast majority of people buying index funds don’t care much about the underlying companies they are purchasing shares of. Their primary goal is to perform as well as the underlying market and hopefully beat inflation. They are speculating that by throwing their money into a little bit of everything that the overall gains will outweigh their losses. If another index comes along that can outperform their current index on a risk adjusted basis they won’t hesitate to pull their money from the companies they previously owned a part of. This is not investing.
I argue that this is just as speculative as people buying bitcoin.
*snip*
I see a lot of talk calling bitcoin a bubble. This is my alternative perspective on the situation. I believe in bitcoin as a technology. I believe in bitcoin as a currency. And I believe in bitcoin as a store of my wealth.
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- whodidntante
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Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Interactive brokers announced you can't short Bitcoin futures there.investorpeter wrote: ↑Sun Dec 10, 2017 7:01 pmSell the bitcoin future on the CBOE which just started trading a couple of hours ago, Ticker: XBT
https://www.cnbc.com/quotes/?symbol=%40XBT.1
https://ibkr.info/article/3049
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
nisiprius wrote: ↑Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:57 pmLightning Network is not a technology yet. It is a controversial proposal that hasn't been completed, much less implemented.
It was said in the past that bitcoin would allow instant micropayments anywhere in the world. One satoshi, currently worth $0.00015, should be "micro" enough for anybody.
The need for Lightning Network shows that bitcoin does not, in fact, have the characteristics that were widely claimed for it.
Lightning Network is an elaborate way of going all around Robin Hood's barn to solve a problem that could be solved by changing one constant in one line of bitcoin's code. The fact that the bitcoin community has not simply done this (increased the block size) suggests a bitcoin community riven by disputes and factions, and far from being governed by "consensus rules."
Lightening Network Protocol RC 1 was completion was announced a few days ago. They've been doing tests for a while now on the testnets and done the first successful test on the Bitcoin mainnet.
https://medium.com/@lightning_network/l ... d22b7b19c4
Scaling of Bitcoin will come across the Blockchain (bigger sizes, pruning, etc) and a Payments layers.
- arcticpineapplecorp.
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Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 61% in one day like bitcoin (April 10, 2013) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the toal stock market indexes falling 33% in one day not once but twice like bitcoin (March 6 and March 11, 2013) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 51% over two days like bitcoin (August 17-19, 2012) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 36% in one day like bitcoin (January 17, 2012) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 68% over 4 days like bitcoin (June 8-12, 2011) do you?
source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/timothylee ... 6b67240397
source: http://fortune.com/2015/08/24/stock-mar ... t-decline/
So, no index funds are not just as speculative as buying Bitcoin. sorry.
That's funny, I don't remember the toal stock market indexes falling 33% in one day not once but twice like bitcoin (March 6 and March 11, 2013) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 51% over two days like bitcoin (August 17-19, 2012) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 36% in one day like bitcoin (January 17, 2012) do you?
That's funny, I don't remember the total stock market indexes falling 68% over 4 days like bitcoin (June 8-12, 2011) do you?
source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/timothylee ... 6b67240397
source: http://fortune.com/2015/08/24/stock-mar ... t-decline/
So, no index funds are not just as speculative as buying Bitcoin. sorry.
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Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
If I buy Dutch tulips with Bitcoin, will it cause a rupture in space-time?
2b2
2b2
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
You should study up on behavior aspects of investing. Specifically you should ask yourself why you are investing in bitcoin. Would you still be a believer if bitcoin was worth $10, did you discover bitcoin when it's value started to skyrocket, did you need a non-inflationary store of value before you discovered the bitcoin bubble (e.g., gold), etc. How can this investment go wrong for you? How does the volatility affect your store of value or investment beliefs?
As with all investments, don't get too attached to your beliefs! We all struggle against this. You should make a plan and stick too it.
Bitcoin is very hot right now and the worth may have exceeded the value. It might be wise to seek out other investments that meet your investing criteria.
As with all investments, don't get too attached to your beliefs! We all struggle against this. You should make a plan and stick too it.
Bitcoin is very hot right now and the worth may have exceeded the value. It might be wise to seek out other investments that meet your investing criteria.
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Actually I bought a PC last week and had the option to pay in bitcoin. The target audience is slightly more likely to have bitcoin, and I understand that you're saying when the everyman can use it like a currency, then you'll "believe." I "believe" in bitcoin as a currency within an alternative financial system, almost certainly a better one although a minority player right now. But I'm still not convinced that I need that currency even if the financial system is better.
- Noobvestor
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Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Too true. I also wonder who op is trying to convince: us or themselves?
"In the absence of clarity, diversification is the only logical strategy" -= Larry Swedroe
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
Bitcoin is entirely speculative.
If you want an investment, you should go with Dave Ramsey Bitcoin(tm), which is guaranteed to return 12% per year forever, and you should totally bet your entire financial future on it....
If you want an investment, you should go with Dave Ramsey Bitcoin(tm), which is guaranteed to return 12% per year forever, and you should totally bet your entire financial future on it....
Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
One other bit of advice: investing and emotions make a bad combination. If you like a company, by all means buy its products, but don't buy its stock, unless you can demonstrate rationally that the price has not already been bid up past its future value. This is why you see Bogleheads buying Teslas but not Tesla stock. If you are enthusiastic about a cryptocurrency, use it, talk about it, encourage merchants to adopt it, contribute on the technical side, but don't bet your retirement on it. Don't let your passions cloud your judgement.
- Mel Lindauer
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Re: Buying index funds is just as speculative as buying Bitcoin
This thread is locked. Non-actionable and speculative. - Mod Mel
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