A bit more on Tontines

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sean.mcgrath
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A bit more on Tontines

Post by sean.mcgrath » Sun Jun 18, 2017 12:16 pm

I remember a couple of forum topics on tontines (including one covering Milevsky -- who's quoted in this one), and thought I'd share this Economist article. Interesting idea for me that a tontine could turn DC plans back into DB.

In any case a fun read: http://www.economist.com/news/finance-and-economics/21723413-modern-day-enthusiasts-hope-revive-ancient-financial-instrument-death-pools?frsc=dg%7Ce

MIpreRetirey
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by MIpreRetirey » Sun Jun 18, 2017 12:30 pm

So the rate of patent applications on tontine ideas is rising? I won't hold my breath, though.
Interesting about the re-naming a kid with a deceased kids name (the beneficiary.) Never heard that one, myself.
Guess they were enrolling their kids in the tontine in hopes of getting a long-term benefit. When the kid dies, the benefit stops. So rename one.

dbr
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by dbr » Sun Jun 18, 2017 12:59 pm

Everything in the world and a lot out of it is covered on The Simpson's, including a tontine: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raging_Ab ... ellfish%22

sean.mcgrath
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by sean.mcgrath » Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:23 am

Yep, the Simpsons were mentioned in the last thread as well :-)

The basic idea that tontines served a purpose, but were flawed by conflicts of interest makes sense to me: it is risk pooling just like insurance. It also seems to make sense that you could anonymize the tontines with a big enough pool. Then you securitize them, sell them to banks, and it's just like mortgages.

Ok, we know where that story ended, but still a cool idea. 8-)

anonenigma
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by anonenigma » Mon Jun 19, 2017 6:50 am

Note the episode of The Wild, Wild West: "The NIght of the Tottering Tontine":

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0748583/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

sean.mcgrath
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by sean.mcgrath » Mon Jun 19, 2017 9:04 am

anonenigma wrote:Note the episode of The Wild, Wild West: "The NIght of the Tottering Tontine"


That's what happens when you don't use blockchains. :wink:

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DaftInvestor
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by DaftInvestor » Mon Jun 19, 2017 9:06 am

I can't read the article as I don't subscribe to Economist and am getting blocked by its pay-wall (and didn't feel like taking the time for finding ways around it) - for those that want a bit more info on Tontines that don't subscribe to Economist I found this article informative:
https://www.kitces.com/blog/tontine-agr ... s-tontine/

sean.mcgrath
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by sean.mcgrath » Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:39 pm

DaftInvestor wrote:I can't read the article as I don't subscribe to Economist and am getting blocked by its pay-wall (and didn't feel like taking the time for finding ways around it)


Not sure why -- I got to the article on two computers where I wasn't subscribed. I think you get three views a week without subscribing; maybe you have already used them up.

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DaftInvestor
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Re: A bit more on Tontines

Post by DaftInvestor » Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:59 pm

sean.mcgrath wrote:
DaftInvestor wrote:I can't read the article as I don't subscribe to Economist and am getting blocked by its pay-wall (and didn't feel like taking the time for finding ways around it)


Not sure why -- I got to the article on two computers where I wasn't subscribed. I think you get three views a week without subscribing; maybe you have already used them up.


It states on the pay-wall that you get 3 articles per week only if you register (don't need to subscribe - but do need to register). If you don't register - who knows - it was stating I've reached my limit though and I've used the site very rarely (maybe its 3 total ever). In any case, since I had a few minutes I went into my cookies and deleted those associated with the economist so I can now read it (as a side note - they nearly win the prize on the number of cookies dropped of all the sites I visit - with one visit to the article they dropped a total of 33 cookies!). I found the kites article I mentioned above a bit more informative but perhaps someone already posted that one on a prior thread.

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