Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

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whaleknives
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Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:53 pm

:!: 6/12/17 edit: I've changed the thread title to encourage participation. Help make the sample representative by casting your vote, whether or not you own stock. See later posts for result updates.

This poll on individual stock ownership was prompted by recent threads discussing stock picks and, of course, curiosity. The poll has 4 questions on stock ownership, ranges of age and net worth, and employer profit-sharing stock. The choices of data were a compromise between usefulness and ease of response, considering the following:
The links are: Any comments can be made in this Bogleheads thread.

6/10/17 6:00 pm CDT edit: If you bookmark the results link, we'll have a better idea whether views are from first-time respondents, and not from checking results.
Last edited by whaleknives on Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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whaleknives
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Sun Jun 11, 2017 1:34 pm

The results after 24 hours: 64% responding hold individual stocks, and only 25% of those have any from an employer plan.

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This has got me wondering now about percentages of portfolio.
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by Tamales » Sun Jun 11, 2017 1:37 pm

Maybe it would be useful to add another question: if you own individual stock, is it ALL from an employer plan?

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Sun Jun 11, 2017 1:52 pm

Tamales wrote:Maybe it would be useful to add another question: if you own individual stock, is it ALL from an employer plan?
Yes, but I wanted to limit the detail, and since only 25% had any from an employer plan, it doesn't seem to be a significant factor. Bogleheads own stocks even when they don't have to. :D
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by ValueInvestor99 » Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:53 pm

I would like to know what percent of the stock owned is individual stocks compared to ETFs.

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by daveydoo » Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:07 pm

ValueInvestor99 wrote:I would like to know what percent of the stock owned is individual stocks compared to ETFs.
Yes. I would think lots of folks have little bits, at least -- like holdovers from pre-BH years with lots of CG exposure. "Do you own" is a great start but still leaves a lot of room.

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:48 pm

daveydoo wrote:
ValueInvestor99 wrote:I would like to know what percent of the stock owned is individual stocks compared to ETFs.
Yes. I would think lots of folks have little bits, at least -- like holdovers from pre-BH years with lots of CG exposure. "Do you own" is a great start but still leaves a lot of room.
I've never considered an Exchange Traded Fund to be a stock.
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by daveydoo » Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:55 pm

whaleknives wrote: I've never considered an Exchange Traded Fund to be a stock.
I don't think that's what the poster I was responding to meant. "ETF vs. individual stock" was how I interpreted it.

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Sun Jun 11, 2017 6:14 pm

daveydoo wrote:
whaleknives wrote: I've never considered an Exchange Traded Fund to be a stock.
I don't think that's what the poster I was responding to meant. "ETF vs. individual stock" was how I interpreted it.
Yes, but the purpose of the poll was to determine the popularity of individual stocks, and not a breakdown of funds.
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by sandramjet » Sun Jun 11, 2017 7:00 pm

So how representative a cross section is this poll? How many responses relative to boglehead membership?

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Sun Jun 11, 2017 8:45 pm

sandramjet wrote:So how representative a cross section is this poll? How many responses relative to boglehead membership?
The poll was shown only on this site; all Bogleheads by definition. If you mean were all voters registered here, I can't tell you. There look to be good age, net worth, and geographical distributions, consistent with bobblehead's Net Worth Survey, 2015 Edition.

These are details for 34 responses, rather than the 33 shown above:

Code: Select all

Yes by age  ----- Yes by Net Worth -----  Yes by Employer Plan  No for Stock  
< 40    6   < $1 Million               6       Yes  5    
40-60   7   $1 Million - < $3 Million  8       No  16 
61-80   8   $3 Million - < $5 Million  5
> 80    1   $5 Million - < $7 Million  1
            $7 Million or more         2
Totals 22                             22           21                12
The only confusion seems to be over the Employer Plan question, where one stock owner seems to have answered "Not Applicable".
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by celia » Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:09 pm

I'll bet that those who DON'T own individual stocks won't even open this thread as they may assume it doesn't apply to them. Maybe the thread title should be "Poll: Do you own individual stocks?" Compared to 1,000+ responses to past polls that you referenced, it this poll gets only 100 responses, I will assume that 90% of bogleheads don't own individual stocks.

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:24 pm

celia wrote:I'll bet that those who DON'T own individual stocks won't even open this thread as they may assume it doesn't apply to them. Maybe the thread title should be "Poll: Do you own individual stocks?" Compared to 1,000+ responses to past polls that you referenced, it this poll gets only 100 responses, I will assume that 90% of bogleheads don't own individual stocks.
The response was a steady 14 to 16% of the 237 viewers in the first 24 hours, respectable for self-reporting. I don't think any Boglehead would avoid opening a poll. :D

The current total is 96 responses.
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by Peter Foley » Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:38 pm

I do not own any individual stocks and have not held any since before the last recession. The last stocks I purchased and held were in a utility company and I was holding them primarily for a 3% dividend. In addition to the dividend, over a 2 year period the stock appreciated about 10% if I remember correctly and I sold. This was close to the time when I adopted the BH strategy a little more purely.

After another day's worth of replies it would be nice to see the correlations between age and stock ownership and net worth and stock ownership.

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by Ethelred » Mon Jun 12, 2017 12:13 pm

I agree that the question about employer stock needed an "only" choice. The only individual stock my wife and I own is in our employers. And we usually sell that as soon as it vests.

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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:25 pm

After 48 hours with 121 responses, stocks are held by 65%. The age of stockholders seems to moving lower. Responses have broadened from the coterminous U.S. to Toronto, Alaska, Hawaii, Tokyo, and London. Stockholders with no employer plan stock outnumber other stockholders by more than 2:1. I've added a portfolio stock % (for new voters only, but better late than never).

Code: Select all

121 responses

   Yes by age   |   Yes by Net Worth     |   Yes from   |     % Stock      | No for   
                |                        |   Employer   |                  |  Stock
< 40    22  18% |  < $1 Million  27  22% | N/A   7   6% | <25%       3  2% |
40-60   35  29% |  $1-< $3 Mil   30  25% | Yes  21  17% | 25%-<50%         |
61-80   21  17% |  $3-< $5 Mil   12  10% | No   51  42% | 50%-<75%         |
> 80     1   1% |  $5-< $7 Mil    4   3% |              | 75%+             |
                |  $7 Mil+        6   5% |              |                  |
Totals  79  65% |                79  65% |      72  59% |            3  2% | 42  35%

7 who have stock responded N/A to employer plan
I'm confused about the confusion over the employer plan question, "If you own individual stock, is any from an employer plan?" Seven stock owners answered "Not Applicable".
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:31 pm

Ethelred wrote:I agree that the question about employer stock needed an "only" choice. The only individual stock my wife and I own is in our employers. And we usually sell that as soon as it vests.
I recognize the point you'd like to make. Full disclosure: The only stock I've ever owned was my employer's contribution to a retirement fund. But since the stockholders without any employer plan stock outnumber us by more than 2:1, I don't think employer contributions are the biggest reason for the Forum's stock ownership. :)
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by triceratop » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:42 pm

The poll requires an answer to the following question, and the survey is not submitted unless one does so. Remember to subtract out those who own no individual stocks from the "<25%" count.
If you own individual stock, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:58 pm

triceratop wrote:The poll requires an answer to the following question, and the survey is not submitted unless one does so. Remember to subtract out those who own no individual stocks from the "<25%" count.
If you own individual stock, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?
Thank you! I'm adding a "Not Applicable". Actually, I'm changing "Not Applicable" to "I don't own individual stocks."
Last edited by whaleknives on Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by Fallible » Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:38 pm

whaleknives wrote:...
This poll on individual stock ownership was prompted by recent threads discussing stock picks and, of course, curiosity. ...
Sorry if I missed something earlier, but what are you curious about? What is the point of knowing how many Bogleheads - or at least those Bogleheads who post often on the forum - own individual stocks?
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by Ethelred » Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:41 pm

whaleknives wrote:
Ethelred wrote:I agree that the question about employer stock needed an "only" choice. The only individual stock my wife and I own is in our employers. And we usually sell that as soon as it vests.
I recognize the point you'd like to make. Full disclosure: The only stock I've ever owned was my employer's contribution to a retirement fund. But since the stockholders without any employer plan stock outnumber us by more than 2:1, I don't think employer contributions are the biggest reason for the Forum's stock ownership. :)
You might still be right, but it doesn't automatically follow. It's possible in theory that all the non-employee shareholders are institutions or mutual funds/ETFs.

Bear in mind that most of those Bogleheads holding no individual stocks are still indirectly holding stock in your employer through mutual funds.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by Toons » Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:42 pm

I own Stocks
Microsoft
Praxair
Coca Cola
Mcdonalds
Dominion Resources.
Walmart.

Not sure If I qualify to be a Boglehead :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by my3sons » Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:49 pm

Where are you getting the geographical information from?

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:59 pm

Fallible wrote:
whaleknives wrote:...
This poll on individual stock ownership was prompted by recent threads discussing stock picks and, of course, curiosity. ...
Sorry if I missed something earlier, but what are you curious about? What is the point of knowing how many Bogleheads - or at least those Bogleheads who post often on the forum - own individual stocks?
I don't have a point, and certainly not an agenda.
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Re: Poll: Stock Ownership

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:03 pm

Ethelred wrote:
whaleknives wrote:
Ethelred wrote:I agree that the question about employer stock needed an "only" choice. The only individual stock my wife and I own is in our employers. And we usually sell that as soon as it vests.
I recognize the point you'd like to make. Full disclosure: The only stock I've ever owned was my employer's contribution to a retirement fund. But since the stockholders without any employer plan stock outnumber us by more than 2:1, I don't think employer contributions are the biggest reason for the Forum's stock ownership. :)
You might still be right, but it doesn't automatically follow. It's possible in theory that all the non-employee shareholders are institutions or mutual funds/ETFs.
Bear in mind that most of those Bogleheads holding no individual stocks are still indirectly holding stock in your employer through mutual funds.
I guess I don't understand. The responses on stock ownership are from Forum participants, not institutions.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:05 pm

Toons wrote:I own Stocks
Microsoft
Praxair
Coca Cola
Mcdonalds
Dominion Resources.
Walmart.
Not sure If I qualify to be a Boglehead :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
No rules on stocks here, or active funds. No agendas either, just curiosity. :D
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by alfaspider » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:11 pm

It depends what you mean by "own." I have a considerable percentage of my portfolio (~30%) in company stock if you include unvested restricted stock units.

I'd prefer not to have so much exposure, but it's a healthy portion of my compensation, and I sell them as I vest. I look at it more as a component of my annual bonus that doesn't become fixed until vesting.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by Yohanson » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:17 pm

I'm in the majority for every question. Go figure.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:25 pm

my3sons wrote:Where are you getting the geographical information from?
The geographical location comes from your IP address, and is reported usually as a city, but could include a longitude and latitude to 4 decimal places. I don't know how close that comes.

If you have concerns about anyone locating you from your internet use, you can try avoiding it with VPNs or browsers like Tor. Cell phones are even worse, with Stingray simulating cell towers to detect location without phone use.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:30 pm

alfaspider wrote:It depends what you mean by "own." I have a considerable percentage of my portfolio (~30%) in company stock if you include unvested restricted stock units. . .
I think you should answer yes to stock ownership, and yes to stock from an employer plan. :D
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:31 pm

Yohanson wrote:I'm in the majority for every question. Go figure.
You're in a comfortable place, here.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by my3sons » Mon Jun 12, 2017 3:47 pm

whaleknives wrote:
my3sons wrote:Where are you getting the geographical information from?
The geographical location comes from your IP address, and is reported usually as a city, but could include a longitude and latitude to 4 decimal places. I don't know how close that comes.

If you have concerns about anyone locating you from your internet use, you can try avoiding it with VPNs or browsers like Tor. Cell phones are even worse, with Stingray simulating cell towers to detect location without phone use.
no concern, it's just that my location wasn't showing anything after my response.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by ps56k » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:13 pm

I'm not sure the last couple of questions are getting tallied correctly....
I answered on the % of stock ownership - and it is still showing ZERO - for the 50% and above

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by MrNewEngland » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:19 pm

73% of respondents have a net worth over $1M... that's impressive.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:21 pm

ps56k wrote:I'm not sure the last couple of questions are getting tallied correctly....
I answered on the % of stock ownership - and it is still showing ZERO - for the 50% and above
I see one response for 50% to < 75% now. I don't know what the response time is, but I refresh often.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:27 pm

MrNewEngland wrote:73% of respondents have a net worth over $1M... that's impressive.
But I think I should have made a category for < $500k, for symmetry.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by informal guide » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:39 pm

Is there any way to revise my answers? I incorrectly answered the question "% of equities in individual stocks?" rather than "% of portfolio in individual stocks." That moves me from 25-50% reported to 10-25%, given that I am roughly 65% equities.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:48 pm

informal guide wrote:Is there any way to revise my answers? I incorrectly answered the question "% of equities in individual stocks?" rather than "% of portfolio in individual stocks." That moves me from 25-50% reported to 10-25%, given that I am roughly 65% equities.
I don't think so. Even if you tell me your IP address to identify your response, there is no way to allow one person to resubmit. You'll just have to be satisfied that the error is in 1 of 203 or 0.5% of responses so far.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by daveydoo » Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:06 pm

MrNewEngland wrote:73% of respondents have a net worth over $1M... that's impressive.
I better hurry up and take that poll -- I like those odds.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:31 pm

daveydoo wrote:
MrNewEngland wrote:73% of respondents have a net worth over $1M... that's impressive.
I better hurry up and take that poll -- I like those odds.
It's only 59% at $1 Mil or over currently. :D
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by triceratop » Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:32 pm

whaleknives wrote:
triceratop wrote:The poll requires an answer to the following question, and the survey is not submitted unless one does so. Remember to subtract out those who own no individual stocks from the "<25%" count.
If you own individual stock, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?
Thank you! I'm adding a "Not Applicable". Acutally, I'm changing "Not Applicable" to "I don't own individual stocks."
Okay, but did you make a note of how many people had responded "I don't own individual stocks" on other survey questions prior to the time of the question addition? Because the counts still need correction for the first part of the survey.

P.S. Even though I answered "No", I do actually own 1 share of BRKB, but not primarily for investment reasons but to receive insurance discounts.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by oldcomputerguy » Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:44 pm

The only individual stocks owned in our house comes from DW's mom's estate. DW inherited some shares of Cracker Barrel and of Suntrust Bank, and she sold some and kept some for sentimental reasons. Everything else is in index funds. Taken together, the CBRL and STI comprise about six percent of the total.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:57 pm

triceratop wrote:
whaleknives wrote:
triceratop wrote:The poll requires an answer to the following question, and the survey is not submitted unless one does so. Remember to subtract out those who own no individual stocks from the "<25%" count.
If you own individual stock, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?
Thank you! I'm adding a "Not Applicable". Actually, I'm changing "Not Applicable" to "I don't own individual stocks."
Okay, but did you make a note of how many people had responded "I don't own individual stocks" on other survey questions prior to the time of the question addition? Because the counts still need correction for the first part of the survey.
P.S. Even though I answered "No", I do actually own 1 share of BRKB, but not primarily for investment reasons but to receive insurance discounts.
The portfolio question says "If you own individual stocks, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?", so not owning stock shouldn't enter into it. There should be no responses for <25% stock from those with no stocks.

What I'll be missing is the 121 responses before I added the question, some with stock, who had no opportunity to vote portfolio %.
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by triceratop » Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:13 pm

whaleknives wrote:
triceratop wrote:
whaleknives wrote:
triceratop wrote:The poll requires an answer to the following question, and the survey is not submitted unless one does so. Remember to subtract out those who own no individual stocks from the "<25%" count.
If you own individual stock, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?
Thank you! I'm adding a "Not Applicable". Actually, I'm changing "Not Applicable" to "I don't own individual stocks."
Okay, but did you make a note of how many people had responded "I don't own individual stocks" on other survey questions prior to the time of the question addition? Because the counts still need correction for the first part of the survey.
P.S. Even though I answered "No", I do actually own 1 share of BRKB, but not primarily for investment reasons but to receive insurance discounts.
The portfolio question says "If you own individual stocks, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?", so not owning stock shouldn't enter into it. There should be no responses for <25% stock from those with no stocks.

What I'll be missing is the 121 responses before I added the question, some with stock, who had no opportunity to vote portfolio %.
Oh I see, you erased the answers from the first responses. Got it.
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whaleknives
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:17 pm

triceratop wrote:
whaleknives wrote:The portfolio question says "If you own individual stocks, what percentage of your portfolio is stock?", so not owning stock shouldn't enter into it. There should be no responses for <25% stock from those with no stocks.
What I'll be missing is the 121 responses before I added the question, some with stock, who had no opportunity to vote portfolio %.
Oh I see, you erased the answers from the first responses. Got it.
I prefer to think of it as "The answers to the portfolio question were never entered in the first responses, because the question didn't exist yet." :D
"I'm an indexer. I own the market. And I'm happy." (John Bogle, "BusinessWeek", 8/17/07) ☕ Maritime signal flag W - Whiskey: "I require medical assistance."

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JonnyDVM
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by JonnyDVM » Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:22 pm

whaleknives wrote:
daveydoo wrote:
MrNewEngland wrote:73% of respondents have a net worth over $1M... that's impressive.
I better hurry up and take that poll -- I like those odds.
It's only 59% at $1 Mil or over currently. :D
Srry. I was really close but some quick mental math and I don't think I'm there yet. Brought it down :(
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whaleknives
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by whaleknives » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:06 am

After 3 days, stockholders are at 61%, down slightly. The largest age group remains unchanged at 40 to 60 years, and the largest category of net worth has decreased to < $1 Million. Stockholders without employer plans still lead 2:1. The late question on % portfolio shows most stock is less than 25% of investment.

Code: Select all

244 responses

   Yes by age   |   Yes by Net Worth     |   Yes from   |     Yes by        | No for   
                |                        |   Employer   |     % Stock       |  Stock
< 40    48  20% |  < $1 Million  56  23% | None  9   4% | None       1   0% |
40-60   65  27% |  $1-< $3 Mil   52  21% | Yes  41  17% | <25%      54  22% |
61-80   35  14% |  $3-< $5 Mil   22   9% | No   99  41% | 25%-<50%  12   5% |
> 80     1   0% |  $5-< $7 Mil    7   3% |              | 50%-<75%   3   1% |
                |  $7 Mil+       12   5% |              | 75%+       1   0% |
Totals 149  61% |               149  61% |     149  61% |           71  29% | 95  39%
The links for the survey are: Any comments can be made in this Bogleheads thread.
"I'm an indexer. I own the market. And I'm happy." (John Bogle, "BusinessWeek", 8/17/07) ☕ Maritime signal flag W - Whiskey: "I require medical assistance."

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tuningfork
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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by tuningfork » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:04 pm

My answer is I used to own stocks, but after several years of portfolio simplification and risk reduction I sold my remaining individual stocks last year.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by tuningfork » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:05 pm

My answer is I used to own stocks, but after several years of portfolio simplification and risk reduction I sold my remaining individual stocks last year.

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Re: Poll: Do Bogleheads own Stocks?

Post by IlliniDave » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:35 pm

I had to answer "yes" to stocks because I own 7ish shares of my employer's stock that I got as a cashless redemption of an option grant many years ago (something like 100 shares at a price the stock sunk below and barely got above just as the exercise window was closing). I kept them because of the novelty--it was a new thing (granting options to low/mid level people) that they tried once and abandoned.
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