anyone factor in future inheritance?
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anyone factor in future inheritance?
I was just curious on Bogleheads thoughts on this. What if you knew you would be getting a sizable inheritance(or any size actually)..would you factor that in your retirement savings calculations? Obviously, you wouldn't know when the inheritance would come, and maybe if at all. I just never see this discussed.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I do. I also factor in the Powerball lottery I will win in 2026.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I'll say no. Not sure I'll even be alive or if anything will be left.
- cheese_breath
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
It's been discussed before, but quite awhile ago. IMO you can never be safe assuming an inheritance until it's legally yours.
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.
- bertilak
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
As the saying goes, "Don't count your chickens..."
The rest is left as an exercise for the reader.
Possible answer: "... before they cross the road!
The rest is left as an exercise for the reader.
Possible answer: "... before they cross the road!
Last edited by bertilak on Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.
May neither drought nor rain nor blizzard disturb the joy juice in your gizzard. -- Squire Omar Barker (aka S.O.B.), the Cowboy Poet
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
No. I plan on saving for my own retirement. Future inheritance? Never crossed my mind.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions
- SmileyFace
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I have factored in the opposite (aging in-laws with no savings that might need some caring for sometime in the future).
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Why wait till then? The Powerball is tonight.Chan_va wrote:I do. I also factor in the Powerball lottery I will win in 2026.
"One should invest based on their need, ability and willingness to take risk - Larry Swedroe" Asking Portfolio Questions
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Do you really think it's reasonable to count on an inheritance? Here is just a short list of factors that might come between you and any expected inheritance: dementia, new spouse with expensive tastes, very expensive illness, very persuasive favorite charity, unscrupulous financial planner, poor estate planner, fraudster.
- cheese_breath
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Until they're in the pot? Preferably a chicken in every pot.bertilak wrote:As the saying goes, "Don't count your chickens..."
The rest is left as an exercise for the reader.
Possible answer: "... before they cross the road!
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Most cases no, but I do feel that sometimes there is a very high likelihood that someone would know they would be receiving a fairly substantial inheritance...obviously when that would be couldn't be known. I also realize that anyone who might actually be in such a position might not want to admit it.Rupert wrote:Do you really think it's reasonable to count on an inheritance? Here is just a short list of factors that might come between you and any expected inheritance: dementia, new spouse with expensive tastes, very expensive illness, very persuasive favorite charity, unscrupulous financial planner, poor estate planner, fraudster.
- cheese_breath
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Gramps wanting one last bit of whoopie before he goes marries 23 yo mail order bride and leaves her everything.Rupert wrote:... new spouse with expensive tastes...
The surest way to know the future is when it becomes the past.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Yes. I expect that the OP will die before me and leave me a large inheritance since I'm so helpful on this board.
Or, maybe the OP will die before the relative he/she expects to die first. It does happen!
Or, maybe the OP will die before the relative he/she expects to die first. It does happen!
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
OK...I'll go against the grain. I factored it into one of our retirement projections....but I have multiple projections based on "what if" scenarios.
Also...like another poster, I factored in my mother's lack of retirement and the fact we'll probably need to help monetarily with her. I'm not sure about other places in the US, but in the South, folks think they can retire and make $1000/month in SS.
OTOH, my inlaws own 100 acres and are worth about $1.5M. They also have 5 heirs. But I think in one of my scenarios I did factor in $100K as an inheritance sum. I'm not banking on it though.
We have friends who bank on a parent or grandparent's inheritance. Especially large landowning families. There's still a brisk market for timberland in this area. #sad
Also...like another poster, I factored in my mother's lack of retirement and the fact we'll probably need to help monetarily with her. I'm not sure about other places in the US, but in the South, folks think they can retire and make $1000/month in SS.
OTOH, my inlaws own 100 acres and are worth about $1.5M. They also have 5 heirs. But I think in one of my scenarios I did factor in $100K as an inheritance sum. I'm not banking on it though.
We have friends who bank on a parent or grandparent's inheritance. Especially large landowning families. There's still a brisk market for timberland in this area. #sad
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
No.
Even in your post you wrote "you knew you would get" then wrote "if at all".
It's not something to "count on" in my opinion, until it is actually yours.
Even in your post you wrote "you knew you would get" then wrote "if at all".
It's not something to "count on" in my opinion, until it is actually yours.
Very little is needed to make a happy life; it is all within yourself, in your way of thinking. -Marcus Aurelius
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
From a planning perspective, it doesn't make much sense to me to ignore a potentially material inheritance.
At the same time, it seems foolhardy to depend on something you don't own and can't control.
I factor an assumed inheritance into my numbers, but assign a high enough risk factor so that the possibility of an inheritance doesn't change my saving / investing behaviour.
At the same time, it seems foolhardy to depend on something you don't own and can't control.
I factor an assumed inheritance into my numbers, but assign a high enough risk factor so that the possibility of an inheritance doesn't change my saving / investing behaviour.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I absolutely would not "factor that in your retirement savings calculations". I will very likely be the recipient of a non trivial inheritance which would make a lot of things possible in our retirement. My greatest hope is that it will come much later than I expect as it will be from my mom. I also know that even with solid Medicaid planning already in place we may choose to spend down a significant portion of those protected assets to improve her quality of life should we go down a protracted path.
I am a numbers guy and what I have learned from the bogleheads and my spreadsheet analysis gives me a pretty clear picture of what our future will look like under varying scenarios. Nowhere on those spreadsheets or anywhere else in my plan do those inheritance assets and funds appear. I know what they are but don't ever want to think about "what would happen if I got x$'s in year such and such as a result of the inheritance". They will or will not be there at some point in the future and that I cannot control. I can control parts of my plan and must work to make certain it is successful to the extent that I can.
I am a numbers guy and what I have learned from the bogleheads and my spreadsheet analysis gives me a pretty clear picture of what our future will look like under varying scenarios. Nowhere on those spreadsheets or anywhere else in my plan do those inheritance assets and funds appear. I know what they are but don't ever want to think about "what would happen if I got x$'s in year such and such as a result of the inheritance". They will or will not be there at some point in the future and that I cannot control. I can control parts of my plan and must work to make certain it is successful to the extent that I can.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I've already made plans for tonight's jackpot. Please wait until Saturday.Grt2bOutdoors wrote:Why wait till then? The Powerball is tonight.Chan_va wrote:I do. I also factor in the Powerball lottery I will win in 2026.
- Sandtrap
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I have seen very substantial inheritances (7-10 figures) written into trusts and wills that seemed as though written in stone, very well done, seemingly airtight provisions. Then, on the death of the trust grantor, seemingly out of nowhere, comes a POA (power of attorney) or multiple POA's that invalidated everything in the trust provisions/will. Inheritances vanished or skimmed mercilessly. Legal counsel on both sides or from all directions reaping the benefits of trust litigation while the beneficiaries are left broke or in debt. Substantial wealth has the ability to turn wonderful relationships into bitter disputes, sometimes.
Per actionable answer from a personal viewpoint per forum guidelines, I would not count on a dime's worth of inheritance until it is in your bank account and either trust or will is completely resolved.
Per actionable answer from a personal viewpoint per forum guidelines, I would not count on a dime's worth of inheritance until it is in your bank account and either trust or will is completely resolved.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Don't count it 'til you got it....
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Same here, on both side of the familyDaftInvestor wrote:I have factored in the opposite (aging in-laws with no savings that might need some caring for sometime in the future).
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Even in those rare circumstances, you should save enough to live the lifestyle you want to live in retirement. When and if the inheritance comes, upgrade your lifestyle accordingly.theplayer11 wrote:Most cases no, but I do feel that sometimes there is a very high likelihood that someone would know they would be receiving a fairly substantial inheritance...obviously when that would be couldn't be known. I also realize that anyone who might actually be in such a position might not want to admit it.Rupert wrote:Do you really think it's reasonable to count on an inheritance? Here is just a short list of factors that might come between you and any expected inheritance: dementia, new spouse with expensive tastes, very expensive illness, very persuasive favorite charity, unscrupulous financial planner, poor estate planner, fraudster.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
My folks are in their late 70s (78 and 77), while I am 46. My wife is 48 and her mother is 70ish. Everyone is healthy.
Both of our families have sizeable assets. In my case, my folks have an estate (liquid plus illiquid) of about $4-5m. I know, because we sat down and talked about it not long ago. My wife's mother (who has two children in addition to my wife) has commercial real estate that is worth a lot. Unclear how much but for tax purposes it's valued at about $10-12m. It kicks off significant annual income. This asset will be left to the three kids (I know, because it's been discussed). There is also a small trust (less than $300,000) from a life insurance payout from years ago. My wife is a trustee.
Now, to your question. In our retirement planning, we max out our savings, and even without any inheritance we should be fine to retire late 50s.
That said: Yes, in my calculations I assume that our parents will not live to be 100 (possible, of course) and in my software I do enter in some expected amounts 15 years from now. The amounts that I presume are much less than what I've stated above. If it happens, great, it will make for a very comfortable retirement. But we're not saving any less because of it.
Now, if this money was in a trust and could not be touched by the parents TODAY, then yes, I would count on it. But that's not the case.
I will also add that my folks basically own their home and have long term care insurance.
Both of our families have sizeable assets. In my case, my folks have an estate (liquid plus illiquid) of about $4-5m. I know, because we sat down and talked about it not long ago. My wife's mother (who has two children in addition to my wife) has commercial real estate that is worth a lot. Unclear how much but for tax purposes it's valued at about $10-12m. It kicks off significant annual income. This asset will be left to the three kids (I know, because it's been discussed). There is also a small trust (less than $300,000) from a life insurance payout from years ago. My wife is a trustee.
Now, to your question. In our retirement planning, we max out our savings, and even without any inheritance we should be fine to retire late 50s.
That said: Yes, in my calculations I assume that our parents will not live to be 100 (possible, of course) and in my software I do enter in some expected amounts 15 years from now. The amounts that I presume are much less than what I've stated above. If it happens, great, it will make for a very comfortable retirement. But we're not saving any less because of it.
Now, if this money was in a trust and could not be touched by the parents TODAY, then yes, I would count on it. But that's not the case.
I will also add that my folks basically own their home and have long term care insurance.
- TomatoTomahto
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I sure hope my kids don't factor it in
For a bunch of reasons.
For a bunch of reasons.
I get the FI part but not the RE part of FIRE.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
The above situation is why blanket statements like "never count on an inheritance" are misleading. "Never count" should not be interpreted as "ignore completely." There are some circumstances where an inheritance is highly likely. In those cases, why not do planning that incorporates an inheritance into some retirement scenario given that we all should be looking at multiple outcomes anyway?Admiral wrote:My folks are in their late 70s (78 and 77), while I am 46. My wife is 48 and her mother is 70ish. Everyone is healthy.
Both of our families have sizeable assets. In my case, my folks have an estate (liquid plus illiquid) of about $4-5m. I know, because we sat down and talked about it not long ago. My wife's mother (who has two children in addition to my wife) has commercial real estate that is worth a lot. Unclear how much but for tax purposes it's valued at about $10-12m. It kicks off significant annual income. This asset will be left to the three kids (I know, because it's been discussed). There is also a small trust (less than $300,000) from a life insurance payout from years ago. My wife is a trustee.
Now, to your question. In our retirement planning, we max out our savings, and even without any inheritance we should be fine to retire late 50s.
That said: Yes, in my calculations I assume that our parents will not live to be 100 (possible, of course) and in my software I do enter in some expected amounts 15 years from now. The amounts that I presume are much less than what I've stated above. If it happens, great, it will make for a very comfortable retirement. But we're not saving any less because of it.
Now, if this money was in a trust and could not be touched by the parents TODAY, then yes, I would count on it. But that's not the case.
I will also add that my folks basically own their home and have long term care insurance.
One thing that humbles me deeply is to see that human genius has its limits while human stupidity does not. - Alexandre Dumas, fils
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
We don't. I have friends whose family lost money to Allen Stanford, and know others whose parents just keep hanging in there, after the "kids" have retired. It would embarrass and frighten me to be retired and waiting for the jackpot of inheritance. We plan on a lifestyle we can afford. If money comes in, maybe we'll give more away, or upgrade our travel status.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Well, I guess I DID factor it in, in a way, into our Roth conversion plan. We started doing Roth conversions when DH retired. When I retired, I mapped out all our expected income until age 72 (after we will have both been on SS for a whole year), then tried to figure out how to "level" that income to stay in the same tax bracket. We couldn't do anything about our age 70 expected SS incomes, but we could control when we did Roth conversions and stay within a lower tax bracket.
We were a little ahead on our Roth conversion plan and would have finished converting all of it until DH inherited a tIRA. Those withdrawals are not convertible, but they will be taxed highly if we do most of the withdrawals while taking SS. So we withdrew as much as we could while staying in our current tax bracket and delayed some of the remaining Roth conversions. We are planning on using Qualified Charitable Donations from these IRAs when we reach 70.5.
So, yes, I did plan for a possible inheritance, although we didn't know when or how much it would be. Although I was initially frustrated at the setback in the conversion plan, I'm now glad the inherited IRA was received while we still had time to withdraw large amounts.
We were a little ahead on our Roth conversion plan and would have finished converting all of it until DH inherited a tIRA. Those withdrawals are not convertible, but they will be taxed highly if we do most of the withdrawals while taking SS. So we withdrew as much as we could while staying in our current tax bracket and delayed some of the remaining Roth conversions. We are planning on using Qualified Charitable Donations from these IRAs when we reach 70.5.
So, yes, I did plan for a possible inheritance, although we didn't know when or how much it would be. Although I was initially frustrated at the setback in the conversion plan, I'm now glad the inherited IRA was received while we still had time to withdraw large amounts.
A dollar in Roth is worth more than a dollar in a taxable account. A dollar in taxable is worth more than a dollar in a tax-deferred account.
- oldcomputerguy
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Sorry. I just bought tonight's winning ticket. Chan_va will have to wait until Saturday.Grt2bOutdoors wrote:Why wait till then? The Powerball is tonight.Chan_va wrote:I do. I also factor in the Powerball lottery I will win in 2026.
There is only one success - to be able to spend your life in your own way. (Christopher Morley)
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Just like I factored in my income, I have factored in my inheritance along with the expenses I will incur to support both of our aging parents. I fail to understand why you wouldn't want it to be part of your plan. So long that is not the ONLY plan for your retirement
I understand that it is not guaranteed and prone to many factors. But isn't the same apply to your income and projections or ROR?
I understand that it is not guaranteed and prone to many factors. But isn't the same apply to your income and projections or ROR?
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
No, we didn't. Although we did receive one that was intended for autistic BIL whom we cared for 35 years. We called the inheritance a fair compensation for our troubles. The inheritance was used to purchase a rental-see notes below.
Our Only, should not expect to see an inheritance although we and Only know that we have more than enough without the rental and that the rental will likely pass to him in a step up.
Our Only, should not expect to see an inheritance although we and Only know that we have more than enough without the rental and that the rental will likely pass to him in a step up.
Rev012718; 4 Incm stream buckets: SS+pension; dfr'd GLWB VA & FI anntys, by time & $$ laddered; Discretionary; Rentals. LTCi. Own, not asset. Tax TBT%. Early SS. FundRatio (FR) >1.1 67/70yo
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
You should factor in an inheritance, keeping in mind that it's timing and size are unknown.theplayer11 wrote:I was just curious on Bogleheads thoughts on this. What if you knew you would be getting a sizable inheritance(or any size actually)..would you factor that in your retirement savings calculations? Obviously, you wouldn't know when the inheritance would come, and maybe if at all. I just never see this discussed.
The many comments saying that you should ignore the inheritance because of the uncertainty around it are wrong. By that logic you should ignore your stock portfolio too, since there is great uncertainty about its value decades from now.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Well in fairness, the OP asked this: "would you factor that in your retirement savings calculation."Beliavsky wrote:You should factor in an inheritance, keeping in mind that it's timing and size are unknown.theplayer11 wrote:I was just curious on Bogleheads thoughts on this. What if you knew you would be getting a sizable inheritance(or any size actually)..would you factor that in your retirement savings calculations? Obviously, you wouldn't know when the inheritance would come, and maybe if at all. I just never see this discussed.
The many comments saying that you should ignore the inheritance because of the uncertainty around it are wrong. By that logic you should ignore your stock portfolio too, since there is great uncertainty about its value decades from now.
I think most responses (mine included) make the point that you should not let an expected sum in the future reduce what you're saving now. That's asking for trouble. I think few few people on this board (which tends toward financial conservatism) would reduce their retirement contributions with the expectation of, say, a pension--unless they are very close to claiming it. We factor it in, yes, but don't reduce our savings because of it. That's foolish.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
The $64 question though - do you tax effect that? Nominal or real dollars?Chan_va wrote:I do. I also factor in the Powerball lottery I will win in 2026.
Don't trust me, look it up. https://www.irs.gov/forms-instructions-and-publications
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I didn't worry about my parents' possible estates. As it turns out my father recently passed and he may have left us a bit more than I expected, but nothing that will radically change our plans.
My wife, however--her father was a successful businessman who died relatively young with a pretty substantial estate. He put his estate into trusts, and the terms of the trusts are his second wife can live off the income but the principal is also supposed to grow with inflation. She can draw on the principal in certain specific hardship circumstances, but she has other assets and income which makes those circumstances unlikely. When she passes my wife will inherit most of it. We know who the trustee is and we know how it is invested.
I don't feel like I can rationally just ignore all that. And yet, after deliberation we've decided not to change our plans much anyway. Practically, that means that money, should it be realized, may end up mostly benefiting our heirs. Since we now have two kids, that is OK. If we get it sooner rather than later, then we will have to reevaluate some plans--like we might retire earlier, since we could live off a portion of that inheritance while waiting to access our own retirement funds.
I suspect most people here are not making critical compromises in order to save adequately for retirement, so could easily make the same decision to not change plans. If saving now was a real hardship for us--then we might have made a different decision, and I think that could be reasonable.
My wife, however--her father was a successful businessman who died relatively young with a pretty substantial estate. He put his estate into trusts, and the terms of the trusts are his second wife can live off the income but the principal is also supposed to grow with inflation. She can draw on the principal in certain specific hardship circumstances, but she has other assets and income which makes those circumstances unlikely. When she passes my wife will inherit most of it. We know who the trustee is and we know how it is invested.
I don't feel like I can rationally just ignore all that. And yet, after deliberation we've decided not to change our plans much anyway. Practically, that means that money, should it be realized, may end up mostly benefiting our heirs. Since we now have two kids, that is OK. If we get it sooner rather than later, then we will have to reevaluate some plans--like we might retire earlier, since we could live off a portion of that inheritance while waiting to access our own retirement funds.
I suspect most people here are not making critical compromises in order to save adequately for retirement, so could easily make the same decision to not change plans. If saving now was a real hardship for us--then we might have made a different decision, and I think that could be reasonable.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Nope.
"The broker said the stock was 'poised to move.' Silly me, I thought he meant up." ― Randy Thurman
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Can't agree with this at all. I expect a pension and social security, and my retirement plans depend on both of these. The timing and magnitude are clear, and the pension is guaranteed by the PBGC. I have no reservations planning to receive the pension. Of course, something catastrophic could happen, but the pension and SS are Plan A, plus my savings.I think most responses (mine included) make the point that you should not let an expected sum in the future reduce what you're saving now. That's asking for trouble. I think few few people on this board (which tends toward financial conservatism) would reduce their retirement contributions with the expectation of, say, a pension--unless they are very close to claiming it. We factor it in, yes, but don't reduce our savings because of it. That's foolish.
The inheritance I can't control, and do not plan on. Fraud, remarriage, lawsuits (FIL drove long after he should have quit), legal battles with other heirs....the list of things that can make an inheritance vaporize is long.
We still saved a lot, but I don't think most people even on this board are so conservative as to leave pensions out of the plan.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I don't' count on it in my regular calculations, but I do believe that within the next 5-10 years, we may be receiving some money. I know my relatives financial numbers and have taken 25% off the number I think we would inherit. (If it's higher than it's just a bonus).
I'm not counting on any of it, but I have made some estimations of what I would like to do with most of the money; if we get any.
I'm not counting on any of it, but I have made some estimations of what I would like to do with most of the money; if we get any.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I don't factor it into my planning, but if it does happen as expected it will greatly move up our timelines. That being said, I am hoping they all live long enough to spend every dime.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Certainly not. It's too morbid to consider.
He that loveth silver shall not be satisfied with silver; nor he that loveth abundance with increase: this is also vanity.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
No,
If i had....I am afraid of may have gotten lazy in the workforce
If i had....I am afraid of may have gotten lazy in the workforce
"One does not accumulate but eliminate. It is not daily increase but daily decrease. The height of cultivation always runs to simplicity" –Bruce Lee
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
No. And my father proved that for my sister and I when he and his younger wife made a new will out after he had a stroke. The irony of it all was that when he died she inherited it all and then she died 10 months later of cancer and her children inherited it all. That's why you should not include it in your planning.
It is what it is until it isn't anymore
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I do include a potential inheritance in retirement planning.
I consider the inheritance as longevity insurance. In other words, I can feel comfortable assuming that if I live to be over 90, I will have some inheritance to supplement my own savings. I can do this planning without guilt since it would mean the death of a loved one at over age 115.
All these factors could come between me and my own retirement accounts. Actually , it is more likely to affect me as the potential inheritance would come from someone with has state constitutionally guaranteed pension with Cola, health insurance that pays 100% of what Medicare does not, adequate income that none of the IRA/RMD funds have been spent, and a long term care policy with an inflation adjusted lifetime benefits. I have none of those. And I assist with financial planning, estate planning, and fraud protection.Do you really think it's reasonable to count on an inheritance? Here is just a short list of factors that might come between you and any expected inheritance: dementia, new spouse with expensive tastes, very expensive illness, very persuasive favorite charity, unscrupulous financial planner, poor estate planner, fraudster.
I consider the inheritance as longevity insurance. In other words, I can feel comfortable assuming that if I live to be over 90, I will have some inheritance to supplement my own savings. I can do this planning without guilt since it would mean the death of a loved one at over age 115.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Don't count your chickens before they are hatched.
P.S. When did barnyard fowl become an accounting method?
P.S. When did barnyard fowl become an accounting method?
Felix is a wonderful, wonderful cat.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I do not. DW's folks will likely leave her something, maybe even six figures. But it's not a certainty, and I'd rather have it "surprise on the upside" then incorporate it into our plans and not have it materialize. On top of that, on my side, my guess is it's more likely we'll be supporting family members in the final phase than it is that there will be any inheritance for me.
Now, if and when we do actually receive an inheritance, it will certainly be invested per our AA, and it will move us closer towards our "number." I am hopeful that will happen, but certainly not planning on it.
Now, if and when we do actually receive an inheritance, it will certainly be invested per our AA, and it will move us closer towards our "number." I am hopeful that will happen, but certainly not planning on it.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Didn't factor it in but had hopes for one. Didn't pan out bcuz dear sister bilked mom out of most of it.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I didn't say "leave them out of the plan." What I meant was that, in my view (and based on my reading of posts on this topic) there are not a lot of people who curtail their retirement savings based on the fact they they think they will receive a pension. I would say the same is true for social security (unless, as noted, you are near retirement). Today, we have no idea what the SS laws will be in 15-20 years. They could very well up the retirement age to 69, or 70. I of course factor SS into my retirement expectations, but save up to the legal limit and assume that I will not be receiving SS until I am 70.NotWhoYouThink wrote:Can't agree with this at all. I expect a pension and social security, and my retirement plans depend on both of these. The timing and magnitude are clear, and the pension is guaranteed by the PBGC. I have no reservations planning to receive the pension. Of course, something catastrophic could happen, but the pension and SS are Plan A, plus my savings.I think most responses (mine included) make the point that you should not let an expected sum in the future reduce what you're saving now. That's asking for trouble. I think few few people on this board (which tends toward financial conservatism) would reduce their retirement contributions with the expectation of, say, a pension--unless they are very close to claiming it. We factor it in, yes, but don't reduce our savings because of it. That's foolish.
The inheritance I can't control, and do not plan on. Fraud, remarriage, lawsuits (FIL drove long after he should have quit), legal battles with other heirs....the list of things that can make an inheritance vaporize is long.
We still saved a lot, but I don't think most people even on this board are so conservative as to leave pensions out of the plan.
Now obviously if one needs the money to live and cannot afford to save the max, that's different. But as we all know retirement on SS income alone is very, very difficult.
Again, this is based on your age and expected age to stop working, and of course any benefits you've already accrued.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I have no pension, but I agree with Admiral. I account for Social Security (that is, when I'll claim and how I'll use it), but I am not depending on Social Security. If I get Social Security, I need to know how it impacts taxes, RMDs, and inheritances. But my planning assumes that Social Security is a backup plan, not a primary source of income. I think of it in terms of an inflation-adjusted longevity annuity that backstops my retirement plan. I anticipate that it will change before I get to claim it, but I have no idea what those changes will look like.Admiral wrote:I didn't say "leave them out of the plan." What I meant was that, in my view (and based on my reading of posts on this topic) there are not a lot of people who curtail their retirement savings based on the fact they they think they will receive a pension. I would say the same is true for social security (unless, as noted, you are near retirement). Today, we have no idea what the SS laws will be in 15-20 years. They could very well up the retirement age to 69, or 70. I of course factor SS into my retirement expectations, but save up to the legal limit and assume that I will not be receiving SS until I am 70.NotWhoYouThink wrote:Can't agree with this at all. I expect a pension and social security, and my retirement plans depend on both of these. The timing and magnitude are clear, and the pension is guaranteed by the PBGC. I have no reservations planning to receive the pension. Of course, something catastrophic could happen, but the pension and SS are Plan A, plus my savings.I think most responses (mine included) make the point that you should not let an expected sum in the future reduce what you're saving now. That's asking for trouble. I think few few people on this board (which tends toward financial conservatism) would reduce their retirement contributions with the expectation of, say, a pension--unless they are very close to claiming it. We factor it in, yes, but don't reduce our savings because of it. That's foolish.
The inheritance I can't control, and do not plan on. Fraud, remarriage, lawsuits (FIL drove long after he should have quit), legal battles with other heirs....the list of things that can make an inheritance vaporize is long.
We still saved a lot, but I don't think most people even on this board are so conservative as to leave pensions out of the plan.
Now obviously if one needs the money to live and cannot afford to save the max, that's different. But as we all know retirement on SS income alone is very, very difficult.
Again, this is based on your age and expected age to stop working, and of course any benefits you've already accrued.
But that's because I'm relatively young and decades away from claiming. Even if I claimed early, I'm more than 10 years off.
If you're close to or in retirement, and you know what your social security and pensions will look like, then the equation changes. I'd still have a plan B in case the pension goes bust, but I wouldn't anticipate many changes to current recipients of Social Security.
I expect no inheritances, although it is possible I will receive one. I will treat it as an unanticipated windfall if I do. I make no planning allowances for them other than a general plan for how I treat windfalls.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
Many years ago I put an inheritance into our retirement plan. But the person was 90, I was the executor to the estate, and I knew exactly what was in the will and what the obligations and liabilities were for the person. Seemed reasonable to me.
Bottom line - whether you put it in your plan depends on the details. If it is a near certainty, I do not see why not.
Bottom line - whether you put it in your plan depends on the details. If it is a near certainty, I do not see why not.
Kolea (pron. ko-lay-uh). Golden plover.
Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I take a somewhat simplified approach, essentially reap what you sow. To the extent there is an inheritance, this means someone along the way not only lived within their means, but managed to save on top of that. My plan is to do the same. To the extent there is inheritance (which is actually likely), I would hope to perpetuate that. To do otherwise would imply essentially doing the opposite of what they did. Don't really want to live and plan my life that way, but to each their own.
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Re: anyone factor in future inheritance?
I don't worry about doing the opposite of what the person leaving the inheritance did. For example, if I get an inheritance because someone was a cheating mooching miser, I don't feel the need to be a cheating mooching miser, nor do I feel the need to compensate for anyone who was. A gift is a gift, to use or squander as I choose.
Mostly, I don't want my heirs to feel they have to spend or use any money I leave behind the same way I would have. They might well have better ideas.
Mostly, I don't want my heirs to feel they have to spend or use any money I leave behind the same way I would have. They might well have better ideas.