VTIAX price drop discrepency

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singlephoton
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VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by singlephoton » Mon Jul 06, 2015 5:38 pm

Can someone explain this? Can't figure it out.

Today international stocks dropped obviously.

According to Vanguard website, Vanguard Total Internal Stock Index Admiral (VTIAX) fund dropped 5.81% today to $25.60. Yet both morningstar and yahoo say it only dropped 1.62% to $26.74.

Comparable Vanguard FTSE All-World ex-US Index Fund Admiral fund VFWAX only dropped 2.01%.

Did VTIAX really drop 5.81% today? Why so much more than VFWAX?
Last edited by singlephoton on Mon Jul 06, 2015 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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dodecahedron
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VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by dodecahedron » Mon Jul 06, 2015 5:40 pm

[Thread merged into here, see below. --admin LadyGeek]

I was pretty surprised to see Vanguard's website showing VTIAX (Vanguard Total International Stock Index Fund) down by 5.81% (drop of $1.58 with a price of $25.60 shown for 7/6/15). Other websites (Yahoo and Morningstar were quoting a much smaller drop and higher price, $0.44, 1.62%, and $26.74, respectively, for the same fund on the same day.)

When I checked Vanguard's page for the non-Admiral class of the same fund, I saw a 1.60% drop, which suggests that the Yahoo and Morningstar numbers for the Admiral class fund are probably right and the Vanguard figures are wrong.

I am wondering how common such errors are. Such a big discrepancy is pretty disconcerting.

livesoft
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by livesoft » Mon Jul 06, 2015 5:47 pm

Maybe somebody at Vanguard was having a Really Bad Day?
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singlephoton
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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by singlephoton » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:01 pm

I just posted about this too: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=169006

Doesn't make any sense. Must be a mistake but that would be a pretty big mistake on Vanguard's part.

schachtw
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by schachtw » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:19 pm

I spoke with Vanguard and their site is showing an incorrect price. $26.74 is the correct closing price.

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Archie Sinclair
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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by Archie Sinclair » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:21 pm

The Investor class is down 1.60%, while the Admiral class is down $1.58. One possibility is that someone at Vanguard got confused between the % and the $.

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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by RadAudit » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:21 pm

livesoft wrote:Maybe somebody at Vanguard was having a Really Bad Day?
Just those who sold.
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singlephoton
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by singlephoton » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:29 pm

Well good I have a $5k purchase order I put in this morning!

I actually just called Vanguard. They said it's a mistake, don't know why it happened but they are looking into it.

Doesn't really inspire confidence in their accounting practices.

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dodecahedron
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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by dodecahedron » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:33 pm

Archie Sinclair wrote:The Investor class is down 1.60%, while the Admiral class is down $1.58. One possibility is that someone at Vanguard got confused between the % and the $.
Interesting theory. You would think there would be built-in mechanisms to detect such an egregious error before public posting.

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ram
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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by ram » Mon Jul 06, 2015 6:49 pm

I noticed it too. It is not ex dividend today. Yahoo and google are showing it down 1.6%. Vanguard itself is showing VEU down by about 1.6%. So that 5.8% decrease must be a mistake.
Ram

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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by bayview » Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:28 pm

They've fixed the error, or at any rate, they're changing something.

I saw the 5-something % at 6:45 Eastern this evening, and now at 8:27, it shows as down 2.02%, down $0.55.

eta: per my website, price is $26.63.
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dodecahedron
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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by dodecahedron » Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:59 pm

bayview wrote:They've fixed the error, or at any rate, they're changing something.

I saw the 5-something % at 6:45 Eastern this evening, and now at 8:27, it shows as down 2.02%, down $0.55.

eta: per my website, price is $26.63.
Interesting! They have also changed the figures on the non-Admiral class fund (in the opposite direction), so the two are now in alignment (as far as the percentage drop goes.)

Yahoo Finance has also changed their numbers so they agree with the current Vanguard numbers, but Morningstar remains where they were early this evening.

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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by LadyGeek » Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:06 pm

FYI - I merged dodecahedron's thread into here. The software sorts posts by time - singlephoton gets listed first.

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poker27
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by poker27 » Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:42 pm

I saw the same thing. I couldnt believe that it was down 5% after looking at the individual markets, but didnt drill into it. It even showed my balance as being down 5+ %. Not it seems to have corrected, and down much less. Somewhat concerning

sanfran2015
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What happened to VTIAX today?

Post by sanfran2015 » Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:55 pm

When Vanguard first reported todays change, it said VTIAX was down 5.8%. An hour or so later, it changed to -2.2%.

Is this sort of a change common?

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TomatoTomahto
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Re: What happened to VTIAX today?

Post by TomatoTomahto » Mon Jul 06, 2015 9:02 pm

See thread http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... 0&t=169006

Please ignore. I posted this reply when the post was a lonely comment and referred to the main thread. For some reason I can't delete it now. :oops:
Last edited by TomatoTomahto on Mon Jul 06, 2015 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by LadyGeek » Mon Jul 06, 2015 9:06 pm

I merged sanfran2015's post into here, which is in the Investing - Theory, News & General forum.
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sanfran2015
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Re: VTIAX anomaly on Vanguard's website

Post by sanfran2015 » Mon Jul 06, 2015 11:42 pm

dodecahedron wrote:
Archie Sinclair wrote:The Investor class is down 1.60%, while the Admiral class is down $1.58. One possibility is that someone at Vanguard got confused between the % and the $.
Interesting theory. You would think there would be built-in mechanisms to detect such an egregious error before public posting.
One would presume that the prices get updated automatically. So the only way this happens is if someone manually tinkered with the prices? Thats a scary thought!

inbox788
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by inbox788 » Tue Jul 07, 2015 2:09 am

It was my fault. I bought VTIAX last week at 27.xx. I think I'm a contrarian indicator. I'm near the very bottom of the "Bogleheads 2015 Hedge Fund Contest". (was 3rd from last recently, now just checked, I'm 2nd from last!)

http://libra-investments.com/hf/bh.html

Got to warn you all, I'm thinking of adding some VTSMX soon if the SP500 keeps falling, maybe under 2000. As soon as I buy some, that's probably when the 10% correction or more that some people have been calling for will occur (I don't prescribe to that belief as you can tell).

Seriously, I'm not seeing the discrepancy and it's just over 2% like the other sites for me right now.

IPer
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by IPer » Tue Jul 07, 2015 3:46 am

singlephoton wrote:Well good I have a $5k purchase order I put in this morning!

I actually just called Vanguard. They said it's a mistake, don't know why it happened but they are looking into it.

Doesn't really inspire confidence in their accounting practices.
Not about accounting. There was an argument with the rotation device. One said he wants to be called a Gerbil the other a Hamster
so they weren't able to keep up with the market at that time, sorry, it will be corrected soon.
Read the Wiki Wiki !

kd2008
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Re: VTIAX price drop discrepency

Post by kd2008 » Tue Jul 07, 2015 4:11 am

Bought $14K of VTIAX yesterday in my Vanguard taxable account. Vanguard gave $26.63 as the price per share. I hope it is correct. Please let me know if it is not & I will call them.

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