Admiral @ Fidelity?

Discuss all general (i.e. non-personal) investing questions and issues, investing news, and theory.
User avatar
EyeYield
Posts: 437
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:43 pm
Location: Extremistan

Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby EyeYield » Thu May 02, 2013 11:47 am

I recently tried to buy some Admiral shares at Fidelity, but they wouldn't allow it even though I was trying to buy over the minimum amount needed. It's not bad enough that I have to pay $75 to buy a Vanguard fund at Fidelity, but this is the process I have to go through to make it happen.

Thank you for your patience in waiting for my message. As promised I am writing today to follow up regarding Vanguard Admiral shares.
I was able to reach out to our Non Fidelity Funds Order Room and confirm that if you purchase Investor Shares of Vanguard funds that have Admiral Share equivalents and meet or exceed the minimum required for Admiral Shares, you may request your Investor Shares be converted to Admiral Shares. To make this request you will just need to contact us after you have purchased the Investor Class Shares. We will then submit a request to the fund family, and it will take 5 to 7 business days for your shares to be converted.


No one at either Vanguard or Fidelity was able to tell me why this is so complicated, only that some institutions can't directly buy into Admiral shares.

I can accept that, I just think the process seems like a waste of time and energy.

Does anyone have more specific info on this? Already considering moving to Vanguard, so thanks in advance for that suggestion. 8-)
"The stock market is a giant distraction from the business of investing." - Jack Bogle

Call_Me_Op
Posts: 6129
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:57 pm
Location: Milky Way

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Call_Me_Op » Thu May 02, 2013 12:08 pm

You may wish to also look at Fidelity's Spartan funds, which are competitive with Vanguard funds in terms of expenses.
Best regards, -Op | | "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Einstein

User avatar
schuyler74
Posts: 225
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:56 am

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby schuyler74 » Thu May 02, 2013 12:14 pm

Here is a list of Fidelity's Spartan Funds. The expense ratios in the "Advantage" class is roughly equivalent to Vanguard's "Admiral" funds.

https://www.fidelity.com/mutual-funds/index-funds/why-fidelity

User avatar
EyeYield
Posts: 437
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:43 pm
Location: Extremistan

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby EyeYield » Thu May 02, 2013 12:23 pm

Call_Me_Op wrote:You may wish to also look at Fidelity's Spartan funds, which are competitive with Vanguard funds in terms of expenses.

That's a good suggestion for just about anything, but I'm interested in the Wellesley fund and I haven't seen anything that mirrors that. But maybe I'm missing something? It's probably just as wise to combine two funds to mirror Wellesley and stop making such a big deal of it. My money and my brain = ouch! :oops:
"The stock market is a giant distraction from the business of investing." - Jack Bogle

Snow Boarder
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 9:55 am

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Snow Boarder » Thu May 02, 2013 3:05 pm

I use fidelity too. I had looked into this same topic way back when. The fidelity customer service group said that I needed to rephrase the question from "why doesn't fidelity offer the admiral shares on their website?" to "Why is it that Vanguard doesn't allow fidelity to sell admiral share class on the Fidelity website".

Since then the Fidelity spartan fund family has reduced the qualification level to = Vanguards ($10,000) and reduced the ERs and to be neck-and-neck with Vanguard. At this point I would not even consider paying the $75 fee to buy a Vanguard fund.

SB
Greenville (SC) Chapter Coordinator | greenvillebogleheads@gmail.com

Call_Me_Op
Posts: 6129
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:57 pm
Location: Milky Way

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Call_Me_Op » Thu May 02, 2013 3:37 pm

EyeYield wrote:
Call_Me_Op wrote:You may wish to also look at Fidelity's Spartan funds, which are competitive with Vanguard funds in terms of expenses.

That's a good suggestion for just about anything, but I'm interested in the Wellesley fund and I haven't seen anything that mirrors that. But maybe I'm missing something.


Unless you prefer active management, why not combine 1/3 Total Stock Market with 2/3 corporate bonds - and rebalance once per year?
Best regards, -Op | | "In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Einstein

livesoft
Posts: 48265
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby livesoft » Thu May 02, 2013 5:31 pm

Another possibility may be to buy Vanguard Signal share class instead. You will need to check on the availability at Fidelity though. I would not be surprised if the Fido rep did not know about Signal share class. Not all Vanguard funds have such a share class.
This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

User avatar
EyeYield
Posts: 437
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 6:43 pm
Location: Extremistan

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby EyeYield » Thu May 02, 2013 8:45 pm

Thanks everybody for the suggestions. There's probably an easy way to replicate the fund by combining other funds as has been mentioned.

As I tend to move from individual equities and managed funds (as tax gains allow) to index funds and more muni's, I'm still attracted to the Wellesley fund.

I just like it, even though it's managed, and there seems to be nothing similar with the low ER's it has. Not to mention it's track record.

Once I get the minimum to qualify for the Admiral shares, I'll probably consider the itch scratched and move on.

As with every fund family/brokerage, some products are given shelf space and some aren't. In this area, things change quite frequently. I just want to get my portfolio in a set it and rebalance once a year mode, before I get tempted with any of these new products that are coming to market lately.

Thanks again,
"The stock market is a giant distraction from the business of investing." - Jack Bogle

User avatar
tfb
Posts: 7332
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 5:46 pm
Contact:

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby tfb » Fri May 03, 2013 2:07 am

EyeYield wrote:As with every fund family/brokerage, some products are given shelf space and some aren't.

In case it's still not clear, it's Vanguard not allowing Fidelity to sell Admiral, not Fidelity doesn't give shelf space to Vanguard Admiral.
Harry Sit, taking a break from the forums.

User avatar
abuss368
Posts: 10207
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:33 pm
Location: Where the water is warm, the drinks are cold, and I don't know the names of the players!

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby abuss368 » Fri May 03, 2013 6:30 am

Consider moving your assets to Vanguard.
John C. Bogle: "You simply do not need to put your money into 8 different mutual funds!" | | Disclosure: Three Fund Portfolio + U.S. & International REITs

JW-Retired
Posts: 5547
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 12:25 pm

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby JW-Retired » Fri May 03, 2013 8:02 am

If you want Wellesley just open a mutual fund account at Vanguard. Many here have accounts at both Vanguard and Fidelity. I have for a long time and find it's a trivial added complication for us.
JW
Retired at Last

User avatar
Toons
Posts: 10376
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:20 am
Location: Hills of Tennessee

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Toons » Fri May 03, 2013 8:21 am

JW Nearly Retired wrote:If you want Wellesley just open a mutual fund account at Vanguard. Many here have accounts at both Vanguard and Fidelity. I have for a long time and find it's a trivial added complication for us.
JW


+1 Exactly, easy to do
"One does not accumulate but eliminate. It is not daily increase but daily decrease. The height of cultivation always runs to simplicity" –Bruce Lee

User avatar
Christine_NM
Posts: 2313
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:13 am
Location: New Mexico

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Christine_NM » Tue Sep 15, 2015 1:21 pm

deleted
10% cash 45% stock 45% bond. Retired, w/d rate 1.5%

User avatar
Vegomatic
Posts: 194
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:16 pm

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Vegomatic » Tue Sep 15, 2015 10:00 pm

EyeYield and Call_Me_Op wrote:

That's a good suggestion for just about anything, but I'm interested in the Wellesley fund and I haven't seen anything that mirrors that. But maybe I'm missing something.

Unless you prefer active management, why not combine 1/3 Total Stock Market with 2/3 corporate bonds - and rebalance once per year?

The equity portion of the Wellesley Fund, I recall, is fairly close to Vanguard's Equity Income Fund [VEIPX/VEIRX]. If you want passive management or an ETF, Vanguard offers the VG High Dividend Yield ETF [VYM]. Wisdomtree's DLN and Schwab's SCHD are similar.

Not sure which iShares ETF (some trade free at Fidelity) would combine quality and dividend yield, or if it can be traded "for free".

You can check out ETFs at ETF.com. For example like this:

http://www.etf.com/VYM
http://www.etf.com/DLN
http://www.etf.com/SCHD

The bond portion of the Wellesley fund is (I believe) currently pretty close to 20% of the Vanguard Total Bond Market Fund [VBMFX] or ETF [BND]; and 80% Vanguard Intermediate Term Investment Grade Fund [VFICX/VFIDX].

You can mix the funds up so that the aggregate stock and bond mix is similar to Wellesley, but you will need to handle your own rebalancing.

Or ... could you open up a Vanguard account, perhaps and buy Wellesley directly?

NOTE:

The Fidelity Total Bond ETF [FBND] would not be a good apples-to-apples substitute for the Vanguard BND ETF or Fund, because the Fidelity FBND includes some high yield and other bonds, that are typically found in the Barclays Universal Index, rather than the Barclays Aggregate Index.

Anything that follows the Barclays Agg would be close to Vanguard BND, etc. This would include Fidelity's FBIDX.

The Vanguard BND and VBMFX follow a float-adjusted version of the Barclays Agg.

User avatar
Jerry55
Posts: 470
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2015 1:56 am
Location: That Toddlin' Town

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby Jerry55 » Tue Sep 15, 2015 10:36 pm

abuss368 wrote:Consider moving your assets to Vanguard.


+1 :happy Yep ~

I have 3 funds outside of my TSP.

1. Dodge & Cox International

2. Vanguard Wellington

3. Vanguard Wellesley (Roth IRA, opened 3/12)

I just LOVE my 2 Vanguard Funds, and as soon as Dodge & Cox moves back into (better) profitability, I may just

take those funds and split between Wellington (taxable) and increase my emergency funds. Time will tell.

Good Luck !!!
Retired 12/19/2012 @ age 57 | Good Bye Tension, Hello Pension !!!

toto238
Posts: 1684
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 2:39 am

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby toto238 » Wed Sep 16, 2015 12:01 am

livesoft wrote:Another possibility may be to buy Vanguard Signal share class instead. You will need to check on the availability at Fidelity though. I would not be surprised if the Fido rep did not know about Signal share class. Not all Vanguard funds have such a share class.


My understanding was that signal shares have been completely phased out. They've been 100% merged in with admiral shares.

I can't find anything about signal shares on the VG website anymore.

I did find this:

https://institutional.vanguard.com/VGApp/iip/site/institutional/researchcommentary/article/NewsInstInfo102714

Seems everything is converted.

fidelio
Posts: 217
Joined: Sun May 04, 2008 5:28 pm

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby fidelio » Wed Sep 16, 2015 4:56 am

i had the same issue once upon a time and decided to just buy fido spartan funds, as i had 401k at fido and no option to totally exit. seventy-five bucks was a deal killer. it's all the same stocks. no doubt fido wouldn't have their spartan index funds if it wasn't for vanguard, and the ugly truth is that pepsi isn't going to sell coke at their stand, or if they do, it's gonna be in a tiny cup w/ no ice.

User avatar
abuss368
Posts: 10207
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:33 pm
Location: Where the water is warm, the drinks are cold, and I don't know the names of the players!

Re: Admiral @ Fidelity?

Postby abuss368 » Wed Sep 16, 2015 8:17 am

Jerry55 wrote:
abuss368 wrote:Consider moving your assets to Vanguard.


+1 :happy Yep ~

I have 3 funds outside of my TSP.

1. Dodge & Cox International

2. Vanguard Wellington

3. Vanguard Wellesley (Roth IRA, opened 3/12)

I just LOVE my 2 Vanguard Funds, and as soon as Dodge & Cox moves back into (better) profitability, I may just

take those funds and split between Wellington (taxable) and increase my emergency funds. Time will tell.

Good Luck !!!


Hi Jerry55,

It appears that you have a very simple plan that is effective.

Keep investing simple!

Best.
John C. Bogle: "You simply do not need to put your money into 8 different mutual funds!" | | Disclosure: Three Fund Portfolio + U.S. & International REITs


Return to “Investing - Theory, News & General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Sheepdog, Yukon and 22 guests