Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Have a question about your personal investments? No matter how simple or complex, you can ask it here.
natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:05 pm

Too bad that none of the Vanguard Admiral shares with minimum investments of "only" $10,000 are available at Wells Trade.

List of Vanguard Investor and Admiral mutual funds available at Wells Trade: http://cxa.marketwatch.com/WellsFargo/M ... roup&mode=

I would prefer the Admiral share class over the ETF share class, since using the Admiral share class will save me on the bid-ask-spread and make TLH'in so much easier. But switching to Vanguard has its disadvantages too.

Pros/Cons of Wells Trade:
+ simplicity / everything is already at Wells Trade
+ better tax reporting (turbotax.com downloads perfectly from wellsfargo.com)
- pay of bid-ask spreads and possibly even premiums/disocunts
+ wider variety of commission-free investment options (but I am currently not buying any non-Vanguard funds)

Any thoughts/comments/ideas?

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:16 pm

Learn to appreciate and use ETFs. That really solves your problem.

Or use Fidelity Spartan index funds.

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:25 pm

livesoft wrote:Learn to appreciate and use ETFs. That really solves your problem.
What do you mean?

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:30 pm

livesoft wrote:Or use Fidelity Spartan index funds.
Which ones have a minimum investments of only $10,000? I looked at a few and the ones that had ERs competitive with Vanguard ETFs all had minimum investments of $100,000.

DSInvestor
Posts: 10845
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:42 am

Post by DSInvestor » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:30 pm

Investors with larger bond allocations may look for Admiral shares of their core bond funds. I didn't see Admiral shares of Total Bond Market, Intermediate Term Bond Index or Short Term Bond Index on that list of funds. I would prefer admiral shares of these bond funds over ETF shares and investor shares.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:31 pm

It is very likely that you can buy ETFs at lower prices than their closing prices and sell them at prices higher than their closing prices. One can use their closing prices as a proxy for the relative value of the open-end mutual fund shares.

Thus, I believe that you can overcome bid/ask spread. And with TLH, you can pick up an additional fraction of a percent that you would not be able to do with a simple end-of-day fund exchange.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:39 pm

Yesterday, I bought just $100 of a Schwab Total Market Index fund with expense ratio of 0.1% (Schwab is reducing the e.r. of this fund).

Here are some ticker symbols of Spartan funds: FSTMX, FSIIX, FSEMX
Are they available at WT?

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:43 pm

But I will admit that I have my Admiral funds held directly at Vanguard.

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:52 pm

DSInvestor wrote:Investors with larger bond allocations may look for Admiral shares of their core bond funds. I didn't see Admiral shares of Total Bond Market, Intermediate Term Bond Index or Short Term Bond Index on that list of funds. I would prefer admiral shares of these bond funds over ETF shares and investor shares.
Exactly. I think Admiral shares are always preferably over ETF shares even for equity funds due to the ability to trade at NAV (unless they have redemptions fees etc). All Admiral and ETF shares have the same ER.

For bonds, I have decided that I even prefer investor shares over ETF shares, despite the higher ER of investor shares.

Wells Trade does offer Admiral shares for some bond funds, but only for the active ones, for which the minimum investment is $50,000.

topos
Posts: 190
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:47 pm

Post by topos » Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:58 pm

It is very likely that you can buy ETFs at lower prices than their closing prices and sell them at prices higher than their closing prices.
I'll be curious how you do that. :?
If I knew, I think I could make quickly a fortune with ETF.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:01 pm

topos wrote:
It is very likely that you can buy ETFs at lower prices than their closing prices and sell them at prices higher than their closing prices.
I'll be curious how you do that. :?
If I knew, I think I could make quickly a fortune with ETF.
Tell me how you would make make a fortune and I will tell you how to do that.

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:12 pm

livesoft wrote:Yesterday, I bought just $100 of a Schwab Total Market Index fund with expense ratio of 0.1% (Schwab is reducing the e.r. of this fund).

Here are some ticker symbols of Spartan funds: FSTMX, FSIIX, FSEMX
Are they available at WT?
Thanks for your posts!

FSTMX is available but the ER is 0.10%, whereas VTI has an ER of 0.07%. I would guess that the bis-ask spread is less than the ER difference. Same goes for the Schwab fund until they actually lower it, at which time I would revisit the issue.

FSIIX is not available.

FSEMX is available. With an ER of 0.10% and a minimum investment of $10,000 it would definitely beat VXF it seems (unless there are other disadvantages of FSEMX like significnatly fewer holdings or higher turn over or so). I plotted the two funds on a morningstar.com growth chart, and the Fidelity fund outperformed: http://quote.morningstar.com/fund/chart ... %2C0%22%7D

livesoft, any other ideas for non-Vanguard mutual funds at Wells Trade?

DSInvestor
Posts: 10845
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:42 am

Post by DSInvestor » Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:21 pm

natureexplorer wrote:
DSInvestor wrote:Investors with larger bond allocations may look for Admiral shares of their core bond funds. I didn't see Admiral shares of Total Bond Market, Intermediate Term Bond Index or Short Term Bond Index on that list of funds. I would prefer admiral shares of these bond funds over ETF shares and investor shares.
Exactly. I think Admiral shares are always preferably over ETF shares even for equity funds due to the ability to trade at NAV (unless they have redemptions fees etc). All Admiral and ETF shares have the same ER.

For bonds, I have decided that I even prefer investor shares over ETF shares, despite the higher ER of investor shares.

Wells Trade does offer Admiral shares for some bond funds, but only for the active ones, for which the minimum investment is $50,000.
Taxable investors looking to use specific share identification and tax data downloads get better service from WF than at Vanguard. Vanguard is working on specific share tax lot tracking. Once the have that, the WF may not offer any signficant advantage over Vanguard. Vanguard would have commission free ETF trades (of VG ETFs only), all admiral shares, easy to use specific share ID and probably fully functional tax data download.
Last edited by DSInvestor on Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Post by livesoft » Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:21 pm

You are working down in the nether-regions of e.r. differences. If your portfolio is large enough to make the difference between 0.07% and 0.10% matter, then you qualify for those $100,000 minimums anyways. Same goes for worrying too much about the bid/ask spread.

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:45 pm

livesoft wrote:You are working down in the nether-regions of e.r. differences. If your portfolio is large enough to make the difference between 0.07% and 0.10% matter, then you qualify for those $100,000 minimums anyways. Same goes for worrying too much about the bid/ask spread.
All else equal, that ER difference over 10 years (assuming a zero investment return) would be over $30 per $10,000 invested. Make it $30,000 and we are talking about a $90 difference. I can have a lot of real lunches for that much money. Throw additional bid-ask spread cost in, and the the difference only grows to your disadvantage. Costs are one of very few things once seems to be able to control.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by livesoft » Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:15 am

An update to this thread: Yesterday I was able to buy online for zero commission at Wells Trade shares in a Vanguard Index fund of the Signal share class. Sammy_M gave the names of the available signal share funds, but here is a Vanguard link: https://institutional.vanguard.com/VGAp ... gnalShares (Note expense ratios in that link are from 2007 and have not been updated.)

So while WellsFargo apparently does not let one buy Admiral share class of index funds, that is no real hindrance as the Signal shares appear to have the same expense ratio. A benefit of the Signal shares is that you do not need the initial minimum that you need for Admiral shares. There is no published minimum for Signal shares to my knowledge.

Admiral shares of non-index funds are available at WF.

I will also post this in a related thread.
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

User avatar
G-Money
Posts: 2867
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 7:12 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by G-Money » Wed Jan 18, 2012 8:35 am

livesoft wrote:Sammy_M gave the names of the available signal share funds, but here is a Vanguard link: https://institutional.vanguard.com/VGAp ... gnalShares (Note expense ratios in that link are from 2007 and have not been updated.)
Updated list with current expense ratios: https://institutional.vanguard.com/VGAp ... ubCatL2%3A

I haven't checked to see if any or all are available for purchase at WellsTrade.
Don't assume I know what I'm talking about.

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Jan 18, 2012 8:55 am

Thanks for sharing! What is the minimum investment?

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 8:59 am

livesoft wrote:An update to this thread: Yesterday I was able to buy online for zero commission at Wells Trade shares in a Vanguard Index fund of the Signal share class. Sammy_M gave the names of the available signal share funds, but here is a Vanguard link: https://institutional.vanguard.com/VGAp ... gnalShares (Note expense ratios in that link are from 2007 and have not been updated.)

So while WellsFargo apparently does not let one buy Admiral share class of index funds, that is no real hindrance as the Signal shares appear to have the same expense ratio. A benefit of the Signal shares is that you do not need the initial minimum that you need for Admiral shares. There is no published minimum for Signal shares to my knowledge.

Admiral shares of non-index funds are available at WF.

I will also post this in a related thread.

I hope this true, I have learned to like ETF's but the MF has its appeal to me. If you goto the livesofts link then click on a fund the ER's are updated on that page, I just checked the total stock market.

If they have a Signal class version of VXUS that would make it a great start for the core holdings as the total bond fund is listed as well.

I was under the inpression that one would only get the Signal Class shares if you did a roll over, or maybe that was for Admiral shares.

Edit: I see a version of VXUS is on the list.
Last edited by Jay69 on Wed Jan 18, 2012 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 9:01 am

natureexplorer wrote:Thanks for sharing! What is the minimum investment?

0 from what I seen thus far.
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Jan 18, 2012 9:06 am

Are you guys buying these funds in a taxable account?

I have tried buying Vanguard Signal Shares at Wells Trade before, but I believe at the time the minimum investment was $100,000.

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 9:21 am

natureexplorer wrote:Are you guys buying these funds in a taxable account?

I have tried buying Vanguard Signal Shares at Wells Trade before, but I believe at the time the minimum investment was $100,000.
I looged in to my WF Roth and looked at VTSSX (toal stock market) and it shows minimum of 0. No clue if you can buy it or not. I need some VXUS, will try to buy the VTSGX version today.
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:36 am

Jay69 wrote:
natureexplorer wrote:Are you guys buying these funds in a taxable account?

I have tried buying Vanguard Signal Shares at Wells Trade before, but I believe at the time the minimum investment was $100,000.
I looged in to my WF Roth and looked at VTSSX (toal stock market) and it shows minimum of 0. No clue if you can buy it or not. I need some VXUS, will try to buy the VTSGX version today.
Edit: I tried to pick up VTSGX, no go. "

The Mutual Fund symbol entered is valid but cannot be traded online in this Account."
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by livesoft » Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:53 am

I bought about 50 shares of the S&P500 index fund VIFSX in my taxable account.

I wonder if WT needs to somehow have $100,000 or more of a given Signal share class before online trading is allowed. Can you buy with a phone call?

Maybe someone can try to buy $100 only of VIFSX?

Maybe I will try to buy a bit of all the other Signal funds?
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:02 pm

livesoft wrote:I bought about 50 shares of the S&P500 index fund VIFSX in my taxable account.

I wonder if WT needs to somehow have $100,000 or more of a given Signal share class before online trading is allowed. Can you buy with a phone call?

Maybe someone can try to buy $100 only of VIFSX?

Maybe I will try to buy a bit of all the other Signal funds?

Tried $100 on VIFSK within my Roth

Brokerage Cash $2,752.53

Not sure why I got this message "•You have insufficient funds to place this trade online. You may have an open order reducing your cash available for trading."

Edit: I biff it, I did have a open order that I thought I canceled, will try VIFSX again!

I will call about about VTSGX, VTSSX and VBTSX.
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:08 pm

ok tried $100 on VIFSX, it appears it would go thru, I got the following message, never bought a MF thru WellsTrade so was not sure if this message is typical or not?

Warnings:•You should not purchase mutual funds against the sale proceeds of equities. Most no load mutual funds settle in one day. (MBY:N:U:00815)
•This mutual fund has associated fees which will be deducted from the gross order amount. Please click on the "View Prospectus" link below for more information on this fund. (MBY:N:T:00653)
•When submitting a buy order, your brokerage account (including any linked bank account) should contain sufficient funds for ALL open orders. Otherwise, your order may be rejected or cancelled. (MBY:N:T:00682)
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:20 pm

Take all this with a grain of salt, I called WellTrade and they noted "they do not have a selling agreement for VIFSX, VTSSX, VTSGX" I did not bother checking the VBTSX bond fund.
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

User avatar
tfb
Posts: 7872
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 5:46 pm
Contact:

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by tfb » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:20 pm

Jay69 wrote:ok tried $100 on VIFSX, it appears it would go thru, I got the following message, never bought a MF thru WellsTrade so was not sure if this message is typical or not?

Warnings:•You should not purchase mutual funds against the sale proceeds of equities. Most no load mutual funds settle in one day. (MBY:N:U:00815)
•This mutual fund has associated fees which will be deducted from the gross order amount. Please click on the "View Prospectus" link below for more information on this fund. (MBY:N:T:00653)
•When submitting a buy order, your brokerage account (including any linked bank account) should contain sufficient funds for ALL open orders. Otherwise, your order may be rejected or cancelled. (MBY:N:T:00682)
Yes these are typical.
Harry Sit, taking a break from the forums.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by livesoft » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:28 pm

Thanks for trying to pop some $100 trades.

All I know is that I got my shares of VIFSX with no fees and no commissions. I wanted this fund because I will exchange a corresponding amount of money out of the S&P500 index fund in my 401(k) into a bond fund. This keeps cash out of my taxable account. That is, I practice what I preach.

It looks like I might earn an extra 0.8% on my money for this one day endeavor. :)
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Wed Jan 18, 2012 12:33 pm

livesoft wrote:Thanks for trying to pop some $100 trades.

All I know is that I got my shares of VIFSX with no fees and no commissions. I wanted this fund because I will exchange a corresponding amount of money out of the S&P500 index fund in my 401(k) into a bond fund. This keeps cash out of my taxable account. That is, I practice what I preach.

It looks like I might earn an extra 0.8% on my money for this one day endeavor. :)

The funny thing about VIFSX, acording to the Rep I talked to they are unable to sell it. One wonders how accurate the otther information was!
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

User avatar
wintermute
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:36 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by wintermute » Tue Jan 31, 2012 2:11 pm

I was able to buy VBSSX signal shares (short term bond). I purchased >$3000 (<$5000). Didn't show up until the third business day. This makes wellstrade PMA an even better deal. Don't mention this to customer service - it might be a screw up and they only meant wells fargo advisers to have access to these funds.

caklim00
Posts: 1710
Joined: Mon May 26, 2008 10:09 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by caklim00 » Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:15 pm

Thanks for the updated info. Unfortunately, there are no Signal shares of SCV...

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by livesoft » Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:28 pm

For SCV, use the ETF: VBR
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

texas_archer
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by texas_archer » Wed Feb 01, 2012 1:04 pm

just through a $100 order in for VTSSX. Will see if it goes through.

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Feb 01, 2012 1:22 pm

wintermute wrote:I was able to buy VBSSX signal shares (short term bond). I purchased >$3000 (<$5000). Didn't show up until the third business day. This makes wellstrade PMA an even better deal. Don't mention this to customer service - it might be a screw up and they only meant wells fargo advisers to have access to these funds.
Weird that the order only showed up on the third day.

User avatar
nisiprius
Advisory Board
Posts: 36151
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:33 am
Location: The terrestrial, globular, planetary hunk of matter, flattened at the poles, is my abode.--O. Henry

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by nisiprius » Wed Feb 01, 2012 1:34 pm

natureexplorer, I think you're being picky. Things are what they are and you pays your money and you takes your choice.

Actually, just a half an hour ago I was in the supermarket for canned spinach and they were out. No DelMonte, no PopEye, no house brand. I ask for help, employee checks same shelf and is surprised, too, but says, "You know, we have fresh spinach in produce." "Too expensive." "Let's try the International aisle." No Goya, no Sylvia.

So what did I do? I went to the frozen food aisle. Three brands in two styles, cut leaf and chopped. I bought the house brand. I got the brand I wanted, at a cheap price, just not in my preferred form. (Short on freezer space).

If you're shopping at WellsTrade, I guess they don't have exactly what you want, so settle for the frozen spinach ETF. Or shop at Vanguard, where you can get all the exact Vanguard products you want, but you just don't happen to like the store as well.

P.S. The experiments with Signal shares are fascinating but I think they might end up in long convoluted stories. I'd be worried that there might be a software bug that lets you buy shares you aren't supposed to buy, but no corresponding bug that lets you sell shares you aren't supposed to have.

P.P.S. natureexplorer, you have done the math on exactly what the various difference in expense ratios are going to cost you, in dollars? The difference in expenses between, say, $50,000 in Fidelity Spartan Total Market Index (0.10% ER) and Vanguard Total Stock Market Index (Admiral shares) (VTSAX) at 0.06% ER is $20 a year. For comparison, I just joined the Weight Watchers Online program at $20/month so I can keep my wife company because she's doing the same thing, so I'm probably going to pay them $240/year just for the service of calling 100 calories "three PointsPlus points," and domestic companionship. (So when she says "The serving on your plate is six points," I can be properly appreciative).
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.

Cash
Posts: 1274
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 10:52 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Cash » Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:03 pm

nisiprius wrote:I'd be worried that about a computer bug that lets you buy shares you aren't supposed to buy, but no corresponding bug that lets you sell them.
This is the primary issue keeping me from buying them. What's to prevent them from changing you to sell? I think all ETFs is the best route to go for WF.

Nevertheless, I will take WF's Wal-Mart experience to Vanguard's Aldi experience :).

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by natureexplorer » Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:30 pm

Do we know yet which Signal Shares are are available at Wells Trade? Only Index Funds? Has anyone tried it with Institutional shares?

nisi, yes, I did the math and $20 p.a. is like two free lunches per year for me. And even more if I make them from frozen spinach. (By the way, I think VTSAX charges 0.07%.)

Cash, I wish Vanguard was like Aldi. For example, Vanguard now offers a multitude of small-cap funds. Aldi would never offer a multitude of frozen or fresh spinach.

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by livesoft » Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:39 pm

natureexplorer wrote:Do we know yet which Signal Shares are are available at Wells Trade? Only Index Funds? Has anyone tried it with Institutional shares?
We know that non-index Vanguard Admiral shares are available.
We know that all the ETFs are available whether Vanguard or not.
We now have some data points on buying Vanguard Signal-class index shares.
We know that many Vanguard index funds have the Vanguard ETF share class.

It seems to me that some of the objections to WF versus Vanguard have simply disappeared.
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

texas_archer
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by texas_archer » Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:53 pm

Tried Total International Signal Shares and it was a no-go.

texas_archer
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by texas_archer » Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:02 am

VTSSX went through.

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:49 am

texas_archer wrote:VTSSX went through.

When did you buy and has it settled yet?

When I called WellsTrade a few weeks ago they noted "they do not have a selling agreement for VIFSX, VTSSX, VTSGX".
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

natureexplorer
Posts: 4191
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by natureexplorer » Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:55 am

Jay69 wrote:
texas_archer wrote:VTSSX went through.
When did you buy and has it settled yet?

When I called WellsTrade a few weeks ago they noted "they do not have a selling agreement for VIFSX, VTSSX, VTSGX".
How much did you buy?

texas_archer
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by texas_archer » Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:16 am

$100 yesterday and today my account shows 3.12 shares.

User avatar
wintermute
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:36 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by wintermute » Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:22 pm

natureexplorer wrote:
wintermute wrote:I was able to buy VBSSX signal shares (short term bond). I purchased >$3000 (<$5000). Didn't show up until the third business day. This makes wellstrade PMA an even better deal. Don't mention this to customer service - it might be a screw up and they only meant wells fargo advisers to have access to these funds.
Weird that the order only showed up on the third day.
The order showed up, but it didn't complete until the third day.

Nisiprius, good point about selling problems, but sells (to the best of my knowledge) are less restrictive. If you transfer over, say DFA funds, you can't buy but you can sell. Worst case you should be able to sell by calling them.

Texas_archer, did it let you place the order for international signal? (I'm wondering what the failure mode is for the ones that don't work.)

texas_archer
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by texas_archer » Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:26 pm

No, I get this error with VTSGX

Errors:

The Mutual Fund symbol entered is valid but cannot be traded online in this Account. (MBY:N:S:00543)

User avatar
Jay69
Posts: 1801
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:42 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Jay69 » Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:35 pm

texas_archer wrote:No, I get this error with VTSGX

Errors:

The Mutual Fund symbol entered is valid but cannot be traded online in this Account. (MBY:N:S:00543)

Did you happen to try Total Bond VBTSX?
"Out of clutter, find simplicity” Albert Einstein

texas_archer
Posts: 423
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by texas_archer » Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:40 pm

No, just VTSSX and the value index.

I did not complete the value index, just check to confirm that it would go through.

VTSSX did go though and I will start contributing it monthly now. Im thinking that if this is not as intended, those that own the fund will probably be able to continue purchasing the fund once they correct it.

Cash
Posts: 1274
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 10:52 am

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by Cash » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:09 pm

Thanks for the update. Does anyone know how quickly sales of VG funds at WF typically settle?

livesoft
Posts: 61915
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:00 pm

Re: Admiral funds at Wells Trade

Post by livesoft » Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:28 pm

T+1 day for me. Isn't that the industry standard?
Wiki This signature message sponsored by sscritic: Learn to fish.

Post Reply