Edward Jones - outrage of the week

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apezam
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Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by apezam »

Hi,
My mother-in-law broke her hip and now is in the nursing home. Family decided to liquidate her ~300K portfolio (100% equities) at Edward Jones.
For 2021 tax year ~150K is being sold and first notice just arrived in the mail. 10% commission? Is this right? So she will have to pay ~15K for her first 150K transaction, I don’t get this.
Should we transfer in kind before selling at EJ next year? Will that eliminate commissions?

Image
Last edited by apezam on Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Charles6
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Charles6 »

Transfer before selling. Their commissions are criminal.
000
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by 000 »

I can't see your image or your link.

I hadn't heard about the 10% commission before, how is that even legal?
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student
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by student »

10% commission? That does not seem right. I see it now. Only 12 shares.....
Last edited by student on Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
000
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by 000 »

From https://www.edwardjones.com/us-en/media/2951
In a Select Account, the commissions on trades for common or preferred stocks may be up to 2.5% of the principal amount or a $50 minimum commission.
Maybe there is a $50 minimum being split over multiple sales?

For more: https://www.edwardjones.com/us-en/discl ... ation-fees

In any event I would instruct them in e-mail / writing to cancel all sale orders. Then transfer out.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Wiggums »

Thank you for the screenshot. I am wondering if the charge is appears to be ten percent, because the stock sale total was only $166.20 and they cannot charge more than ten percent or $16.20 ? I see on the fee schedule they also added $4.95 transaction fee.

Can you move the stock in-kind and sell elsewhere? They might get you on an account closure fee if you go this route. You really need to ask about the fees to determine the best way to move the funds.
Last edited by Wiggums on Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by kelway »

000 wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:49 pm In any event I would instruct them in e-mail / writing to cancel all sale orders. Then transfer out.
In any event, I'd show up on their doorstep with a weed eater. Wow this is infuriating.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by dukeblue219 »

Wiggums wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:50 pm Thank you for the screenshot. I am wondering if the charge is appears to be ten percent, because the stock sale total was only $166.20 and they cannot charge more than $16.20 ? I see on there fee schedule they hit you up for $4.95 on top of that too.
I think it's fair to assume these numbers are skewed due to the small transaction. Maybe they have a $20 commission that cannot be more than 10% of a given trade?

It's still a ripoff but impossible to extrapolate from this up to the full amount.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by livesoft »

This is a sell of 12 shares of a single stock, so sure the commission just happens to amount to 10%. One should be able to get a list of fees and commissions. Some brokers would charge more. For instance, if this was an assisted trade over the phone at Vanguard, I think it would have cost $25 or more than what was shown on this order confirmation from Edward Jones.

You might look up what the commission was to buy this dinky number of shares in the first place. That might really create some outrage.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by UpsetRaptor »

When I was with them, commission for individual stocks was 2.5% on both the buying and selling side (so 5% total). 10% doesn't seem right, must be some type of minimum or other fee playing in.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by whodidntante »

The next and the last communication Mr. Jones would get from me is the ACATS that I started tonight with my good friend, Charles Schwab. Or Interactive Brokers. Or Fidelity. Or Firstrade. Or just about any discount broker, really. Pick the one you like best.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by suemarkp »

Someone posted the fee schedule for equity commissions in brokerage accounts. Fees vary depending on the account type. This schedule below lists the fees for stock and ETF trades from a brokerage account. The percentage varies depending on the amount. It says 2.5% for buys or sells of $5,999 or less. To cash out $300K would be 0.3% + $1205. There is an asterisk that says minimum commission is $50. You paid less than that, so again Edward Jones fees are very difficult to sort out (some fees are reduced or eliminated when you have $250K or more in the account).

https://www.edwardjones.com/us-en/media/6966

Expecting the commission to be priced linearly is not logical, as the work is mostly the same to sell 1 share as it is 1000.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by increment »

livesoft wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:55 pm This is a sell of 12 shares of a single stock, so sure the commission just happens to amount to 10%. [...]

You might look up what the commission was to buy this dinky number of shares in the first place. That might really create some outrage.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by nisiprius »

Added: See below.

Well, it's a small transaction and the phrase "accommodation trade" probably means something. It probably means it's not at their usual rate, and it's an "accommodation," for some reason it's a trade they wouldn't do or don't want to do or are doing as a kind of favor.

I'm not saying it's great, but I suspect that's not the normal commission and I suspect that "accommodation trade" is the answer.
Last edited by nisiprius on Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:33 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by 000 »

nisiprius wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:43 pm Well, it's a small transaction and the phrase "accommodation trade" probably means something. It probably means it's not at their usual rate, and it's an "accommodation," for some reason it's a trade they wouldn't do or don't want to do or are doing as a kind of favor.

I'm not saying it's great, but I suspect that's not the normal commission and I suspect that "accommodation trade" is the answer. I
nisiprius, what do you think about this article I found?

I don't know if they're using the term this way, but...
Accommodation trading refers to closing a securities transaction at an amount other than the published price.
I see VTRS traded between 13.64 and 13.97 on 11/17, so their 13.85 execution is within that range.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Soon2BXProgrammer »

apezam wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:32 pm 10% commission? Is this right?
My guess is their trade fee is a fixed fee per trade, not a % of the value, but you would have to check your fee agreement.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by nisiprius »

000 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 12:03 am...nisiprius, what do you think about this article I found?

I don't know if they're using the term this way, but...
Accommodation trading refers to closing a securities transaction at an amount other than the published price.
I see VTRS traded between 13.64 and 13.97 on 11/17, so their 13.85 execution is within that range.
:oops: Dumb of me to guess instead of looking.

No luck yet finding a meaningful Edward Jones schedule of fees. I thought I'd found it, Brokerage account schedule of fees (PDF) but no, not really. There are some interesting things, though. This may only apply to "Estate Services," but there is a 2% charge for dividend reinvestment into stocks, versus "normal transaction fees" for mutual funds.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by dbr »

Getting outraged over $16 is silly. Finding out what the commission on the $150k-$300k might be is in order. Even at EJ it is not going to be 10%.

Possibly of more concern would be to check the capital gains tax situation. That really is at a possible rate of between 0% and 15%.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by suemarkp »

nisiprius wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:49 am No luck yet finding a meaningful Edward Jones schedule of fees. I thought I'd found it, Brokerage account schedule of fees (PDF) but no, not really. There are some interesting things, though. This may only apply to "Estate Services," but there is a 2% charge for dividend reinvestment into stocks, versus "normal transaction fees" for mutual funds.
I posted it above, assuming you want stock and etf trading fees. https://www.edwardjones.com/us-en/media/6966

Like I posted in another EJ thread, if you search the EJ website for fees, you get about 150 results and some of those have multiple links to other fee schedules.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Doom&Gloom »

Nate79 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 4:41 pm No, I'm outraged at getting pulled into a thread over $16.
LOL! I'm not the busiest guy in the world, but I'd never get dragged into anxiety over $16 of MIL's assets.

It is far too late for OP, but the best way to avoid these things is to advise friends and relatives to run from EJ when and if asked about EJ or investment companies. Someone should add this to their list of threads re: EJ to be linked when replying to posts on BH about using EJ.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by illumination »

Have the securities moved over to a brokerage like Schwab or Fidelity, even a hypothetical 2.5% commission is outrageous. That would be $7,500 on a $300k transaction.

But is "liquidating" all in one year a good idea anyway? At the very least, it would seem waiting a few weeks and break it in 2 calendar years could make a lot of sense from a tax standpoint.

Be careful though getting involved.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by lazynovice »

illumination wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:49 pm Have the securities moved over to a brokerage like Schwab or Fidelity, even a hypothetical 2.5% commission is outrageous. That would be $7,500 on a $300k transaction.

But is "liquidating" all in one year a good idea anyway? At the very least, it would seem waiting a few weeks and break it in 2 calendar years could make a lot of sense from a tax standpoint.

Be careful though getting involved.
I was thinking the same thing. Nursing home bills aren’t due all at once so liquidate as needed. I know some places require a big purchase fee to get in.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Mr.BB »

Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:09 pm
Nate79 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 4:41 pm No, I'm outraged at getting pulled into a thread over $16.
LOL! I'm not the busiest guy in the world, but I'd never get dragged into anxiety over $16 of MIL's assets.

It is far too late for OP, but the best way to avoid these things is to advise friends and relatives to run from EJ when and if asked about EJ or investment companies. Someone should add this to their list of threads re: EJ to be linked when replying to posts on BH about using EJ.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by jebmke »

Mr.BB wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 6:36 pm
Doom&Gloom wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 5:09 pm
Nate79 wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 4:41 pm No, I'm outraged at getting pulled into a thread over $16.
LOL! I'm not the busiest guy in the world, but I'd never get dragged into anxiety over $16 of MIL's assets.

It is far too late for OP, but the best way to avoid these things is to advise friends and relatives to run from EJ when and if asked about EJ or investment companies. Someone should add this to their list of threads re: EJ to be linked when replying to posts on BH about using EJ.
+1
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by afan »

Yes.
Transfer out of EJ before selling anything else.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by 9-5 Suited »

This can’t be right, I saw a commercial where a middle aged couple was smiling because the EJ advisor helped them get their daughter through college and buy a boat for retirement. They looked like best pals!

But in all seriousness, regardless of how much it turns out the OPs family member actually pays in commissions, this kind of stress is so frustrating. Hope it turns out the commission rates are not actually what you think from this one example.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Stinky »

9-5 Suited wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:10 pm This can’t be right, I saw a commercial where a middle aged couple was smiling because the EJ advisor helped them get their daughter through college and buy a boat for retirement.
Did the commercial show the advisor’s boat? :twisted:
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by celia »

apezam wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:32 pm For 2021 tax year ~150K is being sold and first notice just arrived in the mail. 10% commission? Is this right? So she will have to pay ~15K for her first 150K transaction, I don’t get this.
Where do you see a $15K commission? I only see one-thousandth of that at $16.

Note that the commissions will also be higher, sometimes significantly, if you call in for assistance instead of entering the trade online yourself. But whether you call in or enter the trade yourself, the applicable commission is likely to be mentioned/shown for the trade. If you pay attention, you won’t be surprised!
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by 9-5 Suited »

Stinky wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:23 pm
9-5 Suited wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:10 pm This can’t be right, I saw a commercial where a middle aged couple was smiling because the EJ advisor helped them get their daughter through college and buy a boat for retirement.
Did the commercial show the advisor’s boat? :twisted:
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Mando19 »

According the EJ site the commission on $150K would be about 1%.
I agree, the commission is high, but don't think it's a surprise, since it is posted on their site.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by nisiprius »

suemarkp wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 2:23 pm
nisiprius wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 9:49 am No luck yet finding a meaningful Edward Jones schedule of fees...
I posted it above, assuming you want stock and etf trading fees. https://www.edwardjones.com/us-en/media/6966

Like I posted in another EJ thread, if you search the EJ website for fees, you get about 150 results and some of those have multiple links to other fee schedules.
So you did. Sorry I overlooked it.

Image
Footnote 3 reads:
3 Minimum commission is $50.00.
"Minimum commission is $50" is pretty bad. Except that it wasn't that long ago that Vanguard etc. were charging $20 for trades placed by human phone call.... can you place an order online yourself at Edward Jones or do you always need human assistance?

$150 on a $6,000 order is... well... it's about what I paid back in the early 1970s, before the end of fixed commissions and the rise of discount brokerages.

Fidelity's is easy to find, popped right up in a Google search:
STOCKS/ETFs
Online $0.00 per trade
FAST® $12.95 per trade
Rep-Assisted $32.95 per trade
So $50 minimum isn't necessarily way out of line, but at Fidelity it's a fixed number of dollars no matter how big or small the trade is.

Vanguard's popped up right away, too:
Commission and fee schedule, stocks

Image

This seems to be a case where Vanguard gives a marginally better deal than Fidelity
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by illumination »

Don't forget though, Edward Jones also has fees for assets under management. The trading commissions aren't the real issue. Plus the funds they put you in likely have high expense ratios, potentially with sales loads. All of this combined makes a massive difference.

They get you coming and going. I bet there's even more fees with EJ than just AUM and trading commissions. I was with Northern Trust for a while and they even charged a fee for each account to produce a 1099 at the end of the year.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Eagle33 »

celia wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:33 pm
apezam wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:32 pm For 2021 tax year ~150K is being sold and first notice just arrived in the mail. 10% commission? Is this right? So she will have to pay ~15K for her first 150K transaction, I don’t get this.
Where do you see a $15K commission? I only see one-thousandth of that at $16.

Note that the commissions will also be higher, sometimes significantly, if you call in for assistance instead of entering the trade online yourself. But whether you call in or enter the trade yourself, the applicable commission is likely to be mentioned/shown for the trade. If you pay attention, you won’t be surprised!
Based on the transaction statement of 12 shares @ $13.85/share for a total amount of $166.20, the $16.62 commission is 10% of the $166.20 amount. Using that commission rate for the remaining $150k would result in $15k in commission. My guess is that there are minimum commissions for small transactions as the one shown and do not apply for larger transaction.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by RetiredAL »

Last year I sold a REIT Fund in my Dad's Trust that was held via CompterShare. The total ComputerShare fee to do so was $280 for a $16000 investment.

My parents had bought this investment about 30 year ago and at some point servicing was taken over by ComputerShare.

The kicker is that if this REIT Fund had been held in his Schwab account, there would have been no trading fee.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by hookemhorns »

UpsetRaptor wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:09 pm When I was with them, commission for individual stocks was 2.5% on both the buying and selling side (so 5% total).
:shock: That’s highway robbery considering most brokers don’t even charge commissions anymore.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by DRC67 »

I was with Edward Jones for about 16 years never could find out what they were charging me. I even ask my EJ advisor what I am being charged when I met with her, she avoided telling me and went on trying to sell me nursing home insurance. I never bought her insurance and contacted Vanguard about moving my two accounts. I gave Vanguard the ticker symbols and was told they could be moved. Vanguard handle the transaction and now I am all in with Vanguard and could not be happier. I had two accounts, and Edward Jones charge me $95.00 per account to close them out. Kind of high but the money was well spent in the end.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Vanguard User »

I was with EJ for years. I paid starting 5.75% load on AF for Roth IRA and the annual $40 fee. It also had high ER. As high as 1%. With the help of this forum I did in kind to Fidelity and they also credited $135 EJ closing costs.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Vanguard User »

DRC67 wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:41 pm I was with Edward Jones for about 16 years never could find out what they were charging me. I even ask my EJ advisor what I am being charged when I met with her, she avoided telling me and went on trying to sell me nursing home insurance. I never bought her insurance and contacted Vanguard about moving my two accounts. I gave Vanguard the ticker symbols and was told they could be moved. Vanguard handle the transaction and now I am all in with Vanguard and could not be happier. I had two accounts, and Edward Jones charge me $95.00 per account to close them out. Kind of high but the money was well spent in the end.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by DRC67 »

EJ reps work on commissions. They do not have your best interest. Glad you left.
[/quote]

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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by GoldenGoose »

Out of curiosity I googled up EJ and visited their website. They are a full financial service company with personal advisors so yeah it does come with costs. It is like owning a Bentley and you dont know anything about cars. Over the years I have received solicitations from FAs but I ignored them. For people who dont know anything about finance or care to deal with it, shops like EJ cater.

With that said, what interesting I got from quickly reading their site was on the "why we are different" page. The very first thing on that page said "investing is not just about creating wealth. It is about making your money work for you". Say what? Too much for my little brain to comprehend. I see they have local offices in my area. Will stop by today to sign up since they seem philosophically smarter than I am.
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by dbr »

GoldenGoose wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:11 am Out of curiosity I googled up EJ and visited their website. They are a full financial service company with personal advisors so yeah it does come with costs. It is like owning a Bentley and you dont know anything about cars. Over the years I have received solicitations from FAs but I ignored them. For people who dont know anything about finance or care to deal with it, shops like EJ cater.

With that said, what interesting I got from quickly reading their site was on the "why we are different" page. The very first thing on that page said "investing is not just about creating wealth. It is about making your money work for you". Say what? Too much for my little brain to comprehend. I see they have local offices in my area. Will stop by today to sign up since they seem philosophically smarter than I am.
At which point we post the paradigm pitch of all time: https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=jo ... &FORM=VIRE
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by Stinky »

GoldenGoose wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:11 am With that said, what interesting I got from quickly reading their site was on the "why we are different" page. The very first thing on that page said "investing is not just about creating wealth. It is about making your money work for you".
Such profound words! Clearly a bargain at only 2% fees per year.

Sign me up!
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by GoldenGoose »

dbr wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:31 am
GoldenGoose wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:11 am Out of curiosity I googled up EJ and visited their website. They are a full financial service company with personal advisors so yeah it does come with costs. It is like owning a Bentley and you dont know anything about cars. Over the years I have received solicitations from FAs but I ignored them. For people who dont know anything about finance or care to deal with it, shops like EJ cater.

With that said, what interesting I got from quickly reading their site was on the "why we are different" page. The very first thing on that page said "investing is not just about creating wealth. It is about making your money work for you". Say what? Too much for my little brain to comprehend. I see they have local offices in my area. Will stop by today to sign up since they seem philosophically smarter than I am.
At which point we post the paradigm pitch of all time: https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=jo ... &FORM=VIRE
"They earn it"?
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Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by GoldenGoose »

Stinky wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:48 am
GoldenGoose wrote: Fri Nov 26, 2021 9:11 am With that said, what interesting I got from quickly reading their site was on the "why we are different" page. The very first thing on that page said "investing is not just about creating wealth. It is about making your money work for you".
Such profound words! Clearly a bargain at only 2% fees per year.

Sign me up!
only if it was "it is about making OUR money work for you", then I would have no problems understanding. I want wealth but I dont want my money work for me or be tied up. I want to spend it on life's finer things. Can they work with that?
Topic Author
apezam
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 2:11 pm

Re: Edward Jones - outrage of the week

Post by apezam »

To close the loop the check came in today and no fees or commissions were taken from subsequent sale. The only difference is those were funds not individual stocks

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