TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

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Ketawa
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TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Fri Mar 13, 2020 7:58 am

Here are the TSP's limits on interfund transfers:

https://www.tsp.gov/PlanParticipation/AccountManagement/IFTs.html
You can make an IFT at any time, but there are some important limitations:
  • The first two IFTs of any calendar month may redistribute money in your account among any or all of the TSP funds, including moving your entire balance into the Government Securities Investment (G) Fund.
  • Subsequent IFTs in the same calendar month can only move money into the Government Securities Investment (G) Fund.
I have been rebalancing all the way down. I already made two interfund transfers in my TSP account on March 3 and March 10. Both were net out of the G Fund.

For fun, I submitted another interfund transfer request yesterday, on March 12. It was also net out of the G Fund. It went through!

Am I misinterpreting the rules, or are they not being enforced?

Maybe any interfund transfers after the second have to merely include the G Fund, and don't have to be a net move into it?

ExitStageLeft
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by ExitStageLeft » Fri Mar 13, 2020 10:43 am

It will be good to know, as I just did my first interfund transfer yesterday.

I suspect the web interface may have allowed scheduling the transfer but the transfer itself will not be processed. Or perhaps it isn't being enforced. Please let us know when you get a notification that the transfer completed.

ExitStageLeft
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by ExitStageLeft » Fri Mar 13, 2020 10:45 am

If you cannot do any more transfers, one workaround would be to shift contributions to only purchase C, S and I funds.

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Ketawa
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Fri Mar 13, 2020 10:52 am

ExitStageLeft wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 10:43 am
I suspect the web interface may have allowed scheduling the transfer but the transfer itself will not be processed. Or perhaps it isn't being enforced. Please let us know when you get a notification that the transfer completed.
The interfund transfer completed last night. I can see it in recent transactions and in my account balances.
ExitStageLeft wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 10:45 am
If you cannot do any more transfers, one workaround would be to shift contributions to only purchase C, S and I funds.
I do use new contributions to rebalance, but in a severe down market, this isn't sufficient. I need to be able to sell the G Fund.

rich126
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by rich126 » Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:00 am

Maybe I just had bad luck but the other day I tried to log on (it was not during the trading day) and it took forever to log me in. I thought it was going to time out. I don't check it too much since I just kind of leave that account alone but wanted to check on the damage.

rkhusky
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by rkhusky » Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:57 pm

Hope they don't ban you from future transactions.

MsRenay
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by MsRenay » Wed Mar 18, 2020 3:20 pm

Extremely curious about this myself as I have made a transfer into F fund last Tuesday, then a transfer into all G on Wednesday. Hence, my allotted first 2 IFTs. I assumed I am done for the month being able to make any other "NON G" fund transfers... So you're saying I may be able to transfer a % to say, the C fund this month, it do I have to wait until April?

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Ketawa
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:40 pm

I have completed 4 interfund transfers this month, and submitted a 5th today. All have been net out of the G Fund, in to the I Fund and S Fund.

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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:55 pm

My 5th interfund transfer this month, rebalancing into equities, went through today.

MsRenay
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by MsRenay » Wed Mar 18, 2020 11:17 pm

Wow, I know with our Contribution Allocations, we can make as many transfers as we want, however we want, but I always thought after 2 IFTs we're only able to transfer to G. Anyone else successfully make more than 2 'NON G FUND' transfers?

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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:35 pm

Alright everyone, I partially figured this out. Here is how I rebalanced this month:

Code: Select all

                          % G Fund             % G Fund            % G Fund
Rebalance #    Date     Previous Close   Close Day of Transfer   Rebalanced To
     1         03-03        17.79                18.05                18
     2         03-10        19.70                19.20                18
     3         03-12        18.87                20.67                18
     4         03-16        17.06                19.06                17
     5         03-18        16.40                17.60                17
I'm not sure why I was able to rebalance on March 12, as it was clearly out of the G Fund by either metric. Perhaps the system is tracking rebalance #1 as "Into G Fund" and #2 and #3 as "Not Into G Fund", then everything after has to meet the "Into G Fund" restriction.

Currently, I have 17.00% in the G Fund from yesterday's close. The form will not allow me to enter an interfund transfer unless G Fund > 17.00% and other holdings are all less than their current %. Everything has to be "into" the G Fund (with stale pricing).

Two working theories that resolve all inconsistencies:

Theory 1
-Initially, interfund transfer form accepts anything.
-Counter for "Not Into G Fund" is incremented if at time of entry, "Current %" for G Fund (i.e. previous close %) is lower than "New %" for G Fund.
-Once counter for "Not Into G Fund" = 2, interfund transfers only allowed if "New %" for G Fund entered into form is higher than "Current %", AND all other holdings "New %" <= "Current %"
-As long as form accepts input, interfund transfer is executed regardless of subsequent closings.

Theory 2
-The system was broken.

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Ketawa
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Wed Mar 25, 2020 11:27 am

Code: Select all

                          % G Fund             % G Fund            % G Fund
Rebalance #    Date     Previous Close   Close Day of Transfer   Rebalanced To
     1         03-03        17.79                18.05                18
     2         03-10        19.70                19.20                18
     3         03-12        18.87                20.67                18
     4         03-16        17.06                19.06                17
     5         03-18        16.40                17.60                17
     6         03-20        16.45                16.78                17
     7         03-24        17.23                16.03                17
I completed an interfund transfer yesterday, and it invalidated Theory 1. I think the system that restricts the number of interfund transfers is simply broken. Maybe the form that restricts entry only works correctly if the "Current %" (reflecting previous day's close) is an integer. That was the case when I attempted to enter an interfund transfer on March 19 and today; since I made an interfund transfer the day before, G Fund "Current %" was exactly 17.00%. I'll have to test again tomorrow.

MsRenay
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by MsRenay » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:03 pm

I'm still trying to follow along. So correct me either way. You have not yet been 100% vested in G this month; so when you're making all these Interfund transfers, you just add a little more into your current G making the % slightly higher during each transfer; and you are changing your other funds however you want? Since I'm already 100% in G, I cannot increase G, nor can I transfer to the other funds. Am I following correctly?

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Ketawa
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by Ketawa » Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:48 pm

MsRenay wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:03 pm
I'm still trying to follow along. So correct me either way. You have not yet been 100% vested in G this month; so when you're making all these Interfund transfers, you just add a little more into your current G making the % slightly higher during each transfer; and you are changing your other funds however you want? Since I'm already 100% in G, I cannot increase G, nor can I transfer to the other funds. Am I following correctly?
I am rebalancing back to my target AA, which currently requires me to have 17% of my TSP account in the G Fund. I also have a Roth IRA and some investments in taxable that are included in my overall portfolio. A couple of the other TSP funds are included in my calculations for rebalancing; my posts in this thread have focused on the G Fund because that is what the TSP claims is important for its restrictions on interfund transfers.

With a lot of volatility in the market, my AA ends up being a little off after a big loss or gain, so I rebalance back to my target AA. Sometimes that means that my % in the G Fund goes up, sometimes it goes down. With the market down so much, I am usually selling G Fund to get back to my target, since my other holdings in the TSP drop. I am rebalancing a lot more that most people, but I find it interesting, don't have much better to do with my time at home, and don't buy into things like the 5/25 rebalancing bands a lot of people use.

If you are 100% G Fund and you have already made 2 interfund transfers this month, I don't know whether the system will allow you to rebalance to your target AA. The only way to find out is to try.

pduncanj
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by pduncanj » Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:06 am

To refresh this string: Ketawa helpfully replied to original query with the answer that s/he had been able to exceed the 2-per-month-out-of-G-Fund rule. However Ketawa is making extremely small adjustments to her/his balances, and maybe these somehow fly under the radar.

I am 100% in G fund (and have been since before the current downturn) and would like to shift funds into risk assets, and I'd like to do this with timing and amounts of my choosing, not in line with an arbitrary rule. A lot at stake here, $650k in G fund and timing counts in such a volatile environment.

Does anyone else have experience with 3+ interfund transfers in a calendar month, none of which are into G fund?

Many thanks! 8-)

ExitStageLeft
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Re: TSP allowing more than two interfund transfers per month?

Post by ExitStageLeft » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:23 am

I have only made two interfund transfers this month, and they did not happen quickly. I posted my second request on a Friday and received notification the following Tuesday. Timing wasn't a concern for me, but I suspect the TSP is processing a lot of transfers and it may be a challenge having it take effect exactly when you want it to.

P.S. Welcome to the forum!

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