Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

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MotoTrojan
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by MotoTrojan »

If I am understanding this correctly, all of your cash savings is in an IRA (the brokerage account mentioned). A 7% interest loan is certainly costing you more than the one-time tax-hit of withdrawing from an IRA, especially in a low income year such as what seems to be approaching you in 2020. Even if you had the IRA in stocks I’d suggest you withdraw and pay off high interest debt (7% is very high in today’s world, yes I understand it’s low for a CC), but with cash earning <2% it’s a no brainer to withdraw.
Topic Author
smmsmm57
Posts: 21
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by smmsmm57 »

Thank you very much and I owe you guys an apology if I seemed snippy or
aggravated. This is indeed an "interesting" (stressful) time in my life. I greatly
appreciate ALL of the feedback I have gotten so far.

Also I did a lousy job of conveying my situation, some parts were vague and others
were incorrect. I will try to be more concise:

I have $330 K in IRAs (the gold stock is in there as well).

I am not sure about what my tax bracket is.

I need to keep the car loans I think because each of them is a known quantity,
I have kept great care of them and I should not have to put much money into them
going forward for a long time.

I was a programmer for 36 years and I made a lot more than $ 15 an hour. I need
to greatly improve my skill set and need to do online courses since for past 10 I
was very complacent.

In the meantime, I will look for a job in January and try to get at least $ 1,000 to $
1,500 more a month coming in.

My mortgage payment is $ 1,200 and that won't end anytime soon.

Other than paring down what I spend each month to the greatest extent possible, I guess my one big question would be what stocks, etfs or mutual funds I should get. My gold stocks are way up and I plan on cashing them out this week (I made a lot of $$ with them past 6 months but it is time to not be so speculative. So I figure I will have all of the $ 330K in stocks, mutual funds or ETFs. Vanguard tools told me I should be 50 / 50 bonds and stocks.

Once again, sorry if I seemed aggravated, I should have been more grateful that people here took the time and effort to give me advice in the first place.

Thanks!
Mr.BB
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Mr.BB »

What you need to do is create a strip down budget. You need to get by on minimal expenses Cut your cable/ satellite? Start cooking all your foods at home, avoid eating out. Start talking to people you know, get references for job interviews or connections.
Plenty of part time work available out there if you need it for right now.
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

smmsmm57 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:37 am I need to keep the car loans I think because each of them is a known quantity
Okay. But you could purchase less expensive cars that would also be a known quantity.
I was a programmer for 36 years and I made a lot more than $ 15 an hour. I need
to greatly improve my skill set and need to do online courses since for past 10 I
was very complacent.
At 62, it might be time to choose a different job/profession rather than trying to improve your skill set with hopes to get back where you were. It's hard to go from complacent-for-10-years to up-to-date in a short time period.
In the meantime, I will look for a job in January and try to get at least $ 1,000 to $
1,500 more a month coming in.
Not sure why you would limit yourself to such a low amount? You could probably find something for at least $15/hour, right?
Other than paring down what I spend each month to the greatest extent possible, I guess my one big question would be what stocks, etfs or mutual funds I should get. My gold stocks are way up and I plan on cashing them out this week (I made a lot of $$ with them past 6 months but it is time to not be so speculative. So I figure I will have all of the $ 330K in stocks, mutual funds or ETFs. Vanguard tools told me I should be 50 / 50 bonds and stocks.
I don't see where your assets add up to $330k, but whatever. 50/50 might make sense.
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.
Topic Author
smmsmm57
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 10:13 am

Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by smmsmm57 »

Thank you very very much, all of your points are very well taken. My mechanic's advice
was to keep cars and not buy another person's possible headache.

You are correct on some other comments you made....

THANKS again, this site is great in terms of people expending the effort
to help others....
Emg
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Emg »

smmsmm57 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:37 am
I was a programmer for 36 years and I made a lot more than $ 15 an hour. I need
to greatly improve my skill set and need to do online courses since for past 10 I
was very complacent.
Just a thought, if you can't find work writing code, you might be able to get work doing testing. Some places break that out into a separate job. You would be already be familar with building test plans, procedures, documenting results, etc.
Jack FFR1846
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

Consider refinancing your car loans. DCU specializes in this and the rates are the same as new car rates. This can both reduce the interest rate, potentially and also extend the term which can free up cash. But you and your wife should get jobs to support your refi applications. As I mentioned above, it doesn't matter what the job is. Get money coming in. You are going to run into age discrimination. There are plenty of companies who won't hire people over 50 and some who force them out (I was forced out of mega tech when I was 55 and dozens of others also were).
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FI4LIFE
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by FI4LIFE »

Your mechanic cannot tell you whether or not your vehicles will have problems in the future unless he is the owner/operator of Nostradamus Motors, LLC. I don't take financial advice from my mechanic and you shouldn't either.

It is time to address the vehicle and credit card expenses. I'm being blunt in an attempt to get you to make some changes. I am not trying to be mean spirited but to most on this forum your post and responses read like this:

"I lost my job and refuse to address the major liabilities in my financial life. Even though I am a 62 year old programmer with an obsolete skill-set, I will not adjust my lifestyle in any way. Give me some stock picks."

In your situation, a 50/50 total stock market index/total bond index allocation is as aggressive as I would get. VTSMX/VBMFX. If you don't address your expenses your allocation won't matter and nobody is going to give you investment advice that will allow you to live beyond your means.

I wish you the best of luck in your job search and a prosperous New year. You'll figure it out. :beer
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BL
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by BL »

Be sure you are not using any of those c cards that carry a balance, as they will charge interest immediately.
donall
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by donall »

OP, on getting a job with your existing skill set, look to positions in federal, state and local government units as well as schools districts and universities. These entities tend to have outdated IT systems and your current skills could be quite valuable. Probably less pay, but often there are good benefits such as a pension and health insurance. Also work with a IT placement firm or recruiter. I thing it is wise to update your skills. Can your wife also find a job?

I am unsure how much savings you have or what the current allocation is, but 50/50 stocks/bonds sounds reasonable for your age. You are using low cost Vanguard funds along with some highly fluctuating and risky investments. That being said, the more important part is not allocation, but that the amount should be higher for a comfortable retirement. So decreasing your expenses and adding to your savings should be goals along with finding a job. Pay off high interest loans with funds from taxable accounts.

If you have other income, stop receiving Social Security so that the benefit can grow. The Social Security amount each year increases the longer you wait.
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arcticpineapplecorp.
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by arcticpineapplecorp. »

smmsmm57 wrote: Wed Dec 25, 2019 2:05 pm 1. I recently lost my job and am now living on monthly social security of $2,200 a month and about $2,500 from my IRA.
you still didn't say whether the "$2500 from my IRA" is monthly or yearly.

If monthly, you're drawing down your IRA at a withdrawal rate of 9% per year.

do you know what the "safe" withdrawal rate is?
It's "Stay" the course, not Stray the Course. Buy and Hold works. You should really try it sometime. Get a plan: www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Investment_policy_statement
Topic Author
smmsmm57
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by smmsmm57 »

FI4LIFE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 1:09 pm Your mechanic cannot tell you whether or not your vehicles will have problems in the future unless he is the owner/operator of Nostradamus Motors, LLC. I don't take financial advice from my mechanic and you shouldn't either.


Some of these replies are a lot more tactful than others. I did not mean to imply that my mechanic was or is a fortune teller. My point was that the odds are greatly in favor of my current cars not running into any mechanical problems vs. any other ones I might purchase. Obviously, no one can tell the future. I was not "taking financial advice" but rather asked him about his area of expertise as it relates to the condition of my two automobiles.

I'm just sayin'...

Thanks
Thegame14
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Thegame14 »

I guess it seems like you aren't really seeking advice if you just argue with everyone...

One more try, what are your monthly expenses? That less your SS, is what you need to bring in with a new job, until your spouse starts SS then add both those amounts together, and if you still are short that is the amount of money you need to bring in. No way around it, you need to get another job, period.

Also how have you had cars for 5 years and still have 2.5 years remaining, they should have been paid off with a 3 or 5 year loan. Also how do you have a mortgage with 12 years left, did you buy your first house at 44??? You should have paid your house off in no more than 30 years so a lot of things don't add up.... Also if no one works, certainly you don't "need" two cars....
peterwantstosave
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by peterwantstosave »

I realize this advice may be hard to hear, but . . .

You could:

Sell your house and downsize to an apartment.
Sell your cars, buy a beater car for 3k on Cars.com.
Liquidate your taxable brokerage and pay off all your debt, vowing to never reenter into the bondage of debt.
Get a temp job while you look for a job in your chosen field.

If you did these four things, you could have free cash flow, be debt free, and be moving forward.

If you don't do some combination of these things, you will be bankrupt in 8 years, if you continue your current habits.

If you confront short term pain, you will be free long term.

The choice really is up to you, but I know which one I would choose.

P

EDITED TO ADD: You also seriously need a budget. The fact that you made so much money and have 0 suggests that you've never made one before. Be mindful of what you have and keep as much of it as you can. Google YNAB or Everydollar or Clarity Money.
403b: 54% VTSAX, 36% BTMKX 10% QCBMRX | GSRA: 100% Money Market (100% QCBMRX on Dec 11, 2020) | Roth IRA: 100% FIPFX | Taxable: 100% FSKAX
APX32
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by APX32 »

You know, as great as this forum is (and I’ve learned a lot over the years as a lurker), sometimes when we see a post like the OP who’s perhaps going thru a difficult and challenging time and inquiring about some advice, the responses are downright callous. There seems to be very little sympathy and a sanctimonious tone in some replies (we know best, we are millionaires, you did a horrible job saving over the years and now the chickens have come home to roost), seriously?

The OP is a fellow American, like millions and millions of others who has not saved enough for retirement. Instead of shaming him with condescending advice, perhaps be a bit more helpful? To be fair, there is plenty of good advice here, it’s just that some of the “millionaires” who have been perfect all their lives in the savings department can’t help but kick their fellow man when he’s down. Pretty despicable if you ask me.

OP, keeping your cars is fine, especially since you’re the only owners and as you mention, both are “known quantities” and you’re very unlikely to be stuck with large repair bills over the next few years.

As far as your IRA, I can’t quite add everything up to $330k, but if that’s the number, just consolidate everything at Vanguard and buy either Wellesley or Wellington. Or go with a 50/50 VTI/AGG or something similar.

With all of that out of the way, just focus on finding some sort of employment that will cover your expenses alongside the $2200 from SS. If you can avoid touching the IRA for 8 more years, it will grow to about $500k (asssuming a conservative 5% return) by the time you’re 70. You will be in much better shape by then.

Best of luck to you in this challenging time, I hope everything works out in your favor.
20% SPY | 12% GLD | 68% Cash
peterwantstosave
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by peterwantstosave »

APX32 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:09 pm You know, as great as this forum is (and I’ve learned a lot over the years as a lurker), sometimes when we see a post like the OP who’s perhaps going thru a difficult and challenging time and inquiring about some advice, the responses are downright callous. There seems to be very little sympathy and a sanctimonious tone in some replies (we know best, we are millionaires, you did a horrible job saving over the years and now the chickens have come home to roost), seriously?

The OP is a fellow American, like millions and millions of others who has not saved enough for retirement. Instead of shaming him with condescending advice, perhaps be a bit more helpful? To be fair, there is plenty of good advice here, it’s just that some of the “millionaires” who have been perfect all their lives in the savings department can’t help but kick their fellow man when he’s down. Pretty despicable if you ask me.

OP, keeping your cars is fine, especially since you’re the only owners and as you mention, both are “known quantities” and you’re very unlikely to be stuck with large repair bills over the next few years.

As far as your IRA, I can’t quite add everything up to $330k, but if that’s the number, just consolidate everything at Vanguard and buy either Wellesley or Wellington. Or go with a 50/50 VTI/AGG or something similar.

With all of that out of the way, just focus on finding some sort of employment that will cover your expenses alongside the $2200 from SS. If you can avoid touching the IRA for 8 more years, it will grow to about $500k (asssuming a conservative 5% return) by the time you’re 70. You will be in much better shape by then.

Best of luck to you in this challenging time, I hope everything works out in your favor.
Agree with the advice to use Wellesley or Wellington. This could simplify the picture quite nicely. And I think we're just responding to what we see on the board, it's clear that OP is going through a hard time. Every good wish going forward, P
403b: 54% VTSAX, 36% BTMKX 10% QCBMRX | GSRA: 100% Money Market (100% QCBMRX on Dec 11, 2020) | Roth IRA: 100% FIPFX | Taxable: 100% FSKAX
HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

APX32 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:09 pm You know, as great as this forum is (and I’ve learned a lot over the years as a lurker), sometimes when we see a post like the OP who’s perhaps going thru a difficult and challenging time and inquiring about some advice, the responses are downright callous. There seems to be very little sympathy and a sanctimonious tone in some replies (we know best, we are millionaires, you did a horrible job saving over the years and now the chickens have come home to roost), seriously?

The OP is a fellow American, like millions and millions of others who has not saved enough for retirement. Instead of shaming him with condescending advice, perhaps be a bit more helpful? To be fair, there is plenty of good advice here, it’s just that some of the “millionaires” who have been perfect all their lives in the savings department can’t help but kick their fellow man when he’s down. Pretty despicable if you ask me.
+1000

Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
ColoRetiredGirl
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by ColoRetiredGirl »

Op. I am sorry for your job loss. I know it is a stressful time. I have read through all of the responses and totally understand the frustration from you and the responders. Simply put, the posters are stating you are putting the cart before the horse (asset allocation before getting your financial house in order). In order to identify an asset allocation to carry your through retirement and/or ensure your money will last, you need to know what funds are true retirement investments. Based on your posts, it is difficult to answer your question because of your high level debt. An asset allocation of 50/50 may not be appropriate after the financial dust settles. You may need to be more conservative but who knows. I would recommend filling out a budget with ALL your expenses to determine how much, if any, of your $330k is needed to reduce your debt to improve your cash flow and identify the shortfall. After identifying your shortfall you will know the amount from a job and/or side gigs you need. I use You Need A Budget (YNAB) to ensure I live within my means. Please take a hard look at the responders recommendations and then revisit us once you have an action plan for your debt reduction, investments and asset allocation decision. We maybe able to offer you some tweaks to assist you in having the best retirement you can. Good luck!
onourway
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by onourway »

I am going to assume, since you still haven’t answered, that your IRA withdrawal amount is monthly. If so, that means that you are spending $4700/month (and really, a lot more than that, as you have both credit card and HELOC debt).

You both need jobs, AND you need a budget. We are a family of 5 in a HCOL area and our monthly non-childcare, non-savings budget is only a smidge above your spending - and I’d consider us to live fairly extravagantly. If those numbers are true, there is a LOT of fat to trim.

If you have never lived on a budget before, now is the time to start!
Trader Joe
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Trader Joe »

smmsmm57 wrote: Wed Dec 25, 2019 2:05 pm Emergency funds: 0 (zero)

Debt:
Mortgage & Home equity loan on house (Value $ 225K:
Mortgage: $135K
HELOC: $20K

Credit Cards $13 K – Average 7% interest

Tax Filing Status:
Tax Rate: 24% Federal, 0% State

State of Residence: FL

Age: 62

Desired Asset allocation: (unknown, seeking advice)

Current retirement assets

Taxable
0 (zero)

His 401k (Fidelity) Percent of Total
S&P 500 Index (expense ratio: 0.023 %) $ 6K 0.02

IRA at Vanguard: Percent of Total
VTBLX Total Bond Market Index (expense ratio: 0.05 %) 30 % ($ 100K)
VTABX Total International Bond Market Index (expense ratio: 0.11 %) 16 % ($ 53 K)
VTIAX Total International Stock Index (expense ratio: 0.11 %) 15 % ($ 52 K)
VTSAX Total Stock Market Index (expense ratio: 0.04 %) 3 % ($ 10K)

Stocks:
AU ANGLOGOLD 0.04 7% ($ 23 K)

Brokerage Fund at TD Ameritrade:
$ Cash available to trade 15 % ($ 50 K)

Contributions
New annual Contributions
$0 (zero)

Questions:
1. I recently lost my job and am now living on monthly social security of $2,200 a month and about $2,500 from my IRA. I need to reallocate my holdings to reflect my new situation. In terms of a level of risk I am willing to have I would say around 7 out of 10. I am 62, my wife is 55, neither one of us is currently working and we are using Obama Care for medical insurance.

[note: OP added more detail in this post below - moderator prudent]
If I were in your situation I would file for Unemployment Insurance immediately and I would look for another job asap.
Emg
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Emg »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
I think what people are reacting to is not the balance in the OP's account, but the combination of car loan, cc, HELOC and mortgage debt. That's a lot of debt to be carrying into your later years. Without this debt load they would be in fine shape.
HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

Emg wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:41 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
I think what people are reacting to is not the balance in the OP's account, but the combination of car loan, cc, HELOC and mortgage debt. That's a lot of debt to be carrying into your later years. Without this debt load they would be in fine shape.
He is net worth positive on all those items.
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dodecahedron
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by dodecahedron »

APX32 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:09 pm You know, as great as this forum is (and I’ve learned a lot over the years as a lurker), sometimes when we see a post like the OP who’s perhaps going thru a difficult and challenging time and inquiring about some advice, the responses are downright callous. There seems to be very little sympathy and a sanctimonious tone in some replies (we know best, we are millionaires, you did a horrible job saving over the years and now the chickens have come home to roost), seriously?

The OP is a fellow American, like millions and millions of others who has not saved enough for retirement. Instead of shaming him with condescending advice, perhaps be a bit more helpful? To be fair, there is plenty of good advice here, it’s just that some of the “millionaires” who have been perfect all their lives in the savings department can’t help but kick their fellow man when he’s down. Pretty despicable if you ask me.
I certainly did not intend to come across as kicking anyone. Our household has experienced traumatic unexpected job losses (and unexpected losses of major clients) so I do sympathize and understand how traumatic such experiences can feel. To a large extent, our household has not been ¨perfect,¨ but we have also had far more than our share of luck. That said, sometimes the luck took a while to realize itself, and for us at such times, focusing on mitigating our income and outgo situation was absolutely critical to buy the time we needed for that luck to play out.
APX32 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:09 pm OP, keeping your cars is fine, especially since you’re the only owners and as you mention, both are “known quantities” and you’re very unlikely to be stuck with large repair bills over the next few years.
If you do need both cars or just consider them a very high lifestyle priority, I agree you might as well keep your current vehicles rather than buying into unknown troubles, especially since reliable transportation could be key to future job opportunities for you and your spouse, but I would take a hard look at the interest rate you are paying on those car loans and if that rate is higher than your return on investments, see if you can find tax-efficient funds (not IRA distributions!) to pay down as much of your high interest debt as possible. Paying off high interest debt is a very high return low risk proposition.
APX32 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:09 pm As far as your IRA, I can’t quite add everything up to $330k, but if that’s the number, just consolidate everything at Vanguard and buy either Wellesley or Wellington. Or go with a 50/50 VTI/AGG or something similar.

With all of that out of the way, just focus on finding some sort of employment that will cover your expenses alongside the $2200 from SS. If you can avoid touching the IRA for 8 more years, it will grow to about $500k (asssuming a conservative 5% return) by the time you’re 70. You will be in much better shape by then.

Best of luck to you in this challenging time, I hope everything works out in your favor.
I also wish you best of luck and hope that all works out for the best. Agree that patience, mitigation strategies, and giving your assets some time to grow (rather than drawing them down soon) is the best hope for success.
MindBogler
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by MindBogler »

My advice:

1. Sell one of the cars. You don't need 2 anymore.
2. Sell your speculative gold position and buy an index or Wellington.
3. If you want, try and find part time work (20 hours/wk) for a couple years.
4. Adjust your Asset Allocation to 40/60 or 50/50.
5. Don't take on any additional debt.

I think the OP will be just fine. People make it on a lot less in the US every day. I would get rid of the 2nd car because it is superfluous at this point.

However, I'll add;

if you are drawing $2500/mo from your retirement accounts then that is a problem. If this is true, you need to drastically cut your expenses, earn some income, or some combination of both - ASAP. If your wife hasn't earned enough credits to qualify for social security, it might be a good time for her to start.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.
onourway
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by onourway »

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
X2. The problem is not their assets. It’s the spending.
CryingHawaiian
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by CryingHawaiian »

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
given the numbers provided above a SWR of 4% would be $1K per month, right?
You get what you get and you don’t get upset
HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
The OP has fixed expenses of $2k per month (cars, mortgage, CC payments).

Social security + 4% SWR yields $3.3k per month in income.

It’s tight, but add on a Starbucks job or two slinging lattes and they are home free.
onourway
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by onourway »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:09 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?

The OP has fixed expenses of $2k per month (cars, mortgage, CC payments).

Social security + 4% SWR yields $3.3k per month in income.

It’s tight, but add on a Starbucks job or two slinging lattes and they are home free.
That ignores all of the ancillary, but necessary, spending around those things (not to mention food).

Taxes. Insurance. Fuel. Utilities. Home and vehicle maintenance. Medical. And so on.
Herekittykitty
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Herekittykitty »

Herekittykitty wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:17 pm I organized the information the best I could. If I got anything wrong I'll be happy to edit in the corrections. If I missed something tell me & I'll edit it in; I'll do the same if OP provides more information/clarification.

Him: 62 yo. Lost job.
Her: 55 yo. Not working.
State of residence: Florida

Tax bracket:
Federal: Unclear
State: None

Income:
Social Security (His): $2,200 monthly

Expenses:
$4,700 monthly (I got this by adding $2,200 Social Security and $2,500 monthly withdrawals from an IRA.) Shortfall funded by IRA withdrawals of about $2,500 a month.

Debt Payments:
Cars: $500/month for both
Credit Cards:
Mortgage:
HELOC:
Any other loan using the house as collateral/secured by the house:

Assets:
Emergency fund: Zero
Home (Equity in home - i.e. how much it would sell for minus how much owed)
2 cars (his and hers) well maintained and in good shape

His 401k: Fidelity S&P 500 $6,000

VG IRA (His?):
$100,000 Total Bond
$53,000 International Bond
$52,000 International Stock
$10,000 Total Stock

IRA (His?): Gold Stocks $23,000

TD Ameritrade IRA (His?): Cash $50,000

TOTAL IRA'S: OP Lists this as $330,000. I get $288,000 (pencil & paper). Are these Roth IRA's or Traditional IRA's?

Liabilities as listed by OP.

Mortgage & HELOC & anything other loan using the house as collateral:
I can't figure this out - Home Equity Loan & HELOC (are those to HELOC's?) How many mortgages are there? What is the total owed on the house including all mortgages & all HELOC's and any other loan with the house as collateral? Interest rates? Payments on each?
Mortgage and Home Equity Loan $225,000
Mortgage $135,000
HELOC $20,000

Credit Cards: $13,000, average interest 7%

Car payments (both cars): $15,000, payment for both $500, payoff date 2.5 years from now (about 6/2021)

Miscellaneous thoughts:

1.Re: Monthly expenses and emergency fund (and budgeting):

If you don't have a budget, make one. Otherwise money will find its way out of retirement funds without a clear purpose and you will spend more than you need since the retirement fund money will look like discretionary spending money.

Get an emergency fund. Otherwise you are using your retirement funds as an emergency fund, and you will not be in control of it.

Pay down debt to the degree possible to increase cash flow (reducing and ultimately eliminating monthly withdrawals from the retirement funds)

How to do the above? I'm looking at that $50,000 cash in TD Ameritrade and the $23,000 in gold stocks.

$15,000 pays off the cars and frees up $500 a month
$13,000 pays off the credit cards and frees up whatever that monthly payment is plus saves interest
That's $28,000.

That reduces the monthly income shortfall to $2,500 minus ($500) minus (monthly credit card payment) = $2,000 minus monthly credit card pmt
Example If the monthly cc payment is $500, your monthly shortfall becomes $1,500. (CORRECTED FROM MY ORIGINAL $2,000 FIGURE.) More manageable than $2,500.

Now get an emergency fund of about 6 months income (in your case, your shortfall after Social Security is $2,000 x 6 = $12,000). This isn't going to last 6 months if you have emergencies, but if you decrease expenses and increase income by any amount you will extend the period the $12,000 will last you even if you do have emergencies.

Decide which is the best way from the tax perspective in 2019 or 2020 and do it. If the gold stocks (I would start with those) or the TD Ameritrade generate taxes when withdrawn, just withdraw the amount to cover the car and credit card payments and plan on withdrawing $2,000 monthly up to 6 months unless expenses go down or income goes up.

2. Re: The cars. Keep them. Yes, I know I will get tackled because there are good arguments against this. But there are good arguments for keeping them too, and the OP will feel more at peace with the security that known cars give him.

3. Re: Work. There has been good advice regarding types of jobs to look for. Such as jobs where your abilities and experience will be an asset - those jobs are good goals to aim for. But get any job, especially desireable would be a job with benefits. If your wife is able to work, she could get a job too. Any job consistent with maintaining good health is fine to start.

4. Re: Retooling. Consider what kind of education could increase your capacity to work. Have you applied for unemployment? If not and if there is still time, do it. Even if you were terminated for cause, apply and make your case. Also work with the unemployment office to see if there are educational opportunities they can help unemployed workers increase their capacity, considering what educational opportunities (especially funded opportunities) might be available for any unemployed worker and what mght be available for workers in your category, for example your age.

5. Re: General health and well being. Take care of these. Look good (regular haircuts, well kept clothes and shoes.) Get regular check ups and take care of medical and dental issues. Get regular exercise. Join a gym. The YMCA is usually good, and has senior and family discounts - this will be good for health and well being and for socializing. Attend a place of worship of your choice. Join local interest and professional groups that interest you.

Finally: You and your wife are young. Either or both could live for decades. Stay well, keep learning, and get back in the game.

Best wishes.
Edited to correct a careless math mistake.
Last edited by Herekittykitty on Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Dottie57
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Dottie57 »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm
APX32 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:09 pm You know, as great as this forum is (and I’ve learned a lot over the years as a lurker), sometimes when we see a post like the OP who’s perhaps going thru a difficult and challenging time and inquiring about some advice, the responses are downright callous. There seems to be very little sympathy and a sanctimonious tone in some replies (we know best, we are millionaires, you did a horrible job saving over the years and now the chickens have come home to roost), seriously?

The OP is a fellow American, like millions and millions of others who has not saved enough for retirement. Instead of shaming him with condescending advice, perhaps be a bit more helpful? To be fair, there is plenty of good advice here, it’s just that some of the “millionaires” who have been perfect all their lives in the savings department can’t help but kick their fellow man when he’s down. Pretty despicable if you ask me.
+1000

Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
I haven’t responded to op in this thread. But do disagree that members are kicking op when he is down. I think members are trying to get op to wake up. Expenses do need to be less or equal to income to make retirement work. I’ve watched someone near retirement go through bankruptcy and it ain’t pretty. Much better to look at the situation and come up with a realistic plan.

I hope OP does listen and get on the right footing.
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JAZZISCOOL »

Herekittykitty wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:17 pm I organized the information the best I could. If I got anything wrong I'll be happy to edit in the corrections. If I missed something tell me & I'll edit it in; I'll do the same if OP provides more information/clarification.

Him: 62 yo. Lost job.
Her: 55 yo. Not working.
State of residence: Florida

Tax bracket:
Federal: Unclear
State: None

Income:
Social Security (His): $2,200 monthly

Expenses:
$4,700 monthly (I got this by adding $2,200 Social Security and $2,500 monthly withdrawals from an IRA.) Shortfall funded by IRA withdrawals of about $2,500 a month.

Debt Payments:
Cars: $500/month for both
Credit Cards:
Mortgage:
HELOC:
Any other loan using the house as collateral/secured by the house:

Assets:
Emergency fund: Zero
Home (Equity in home - i.e. how much it would sell for minus how much owed)
2 cars (his and hers) well maintained and in good shape

His 401k: Fidelity S&P 500 $6,000

VG IRA (His?):
$100,000 Total Bond
$53,000 International Bond
$52,000 International Stock
$10,000 Total Stock

IRA (His?): Gold Stocks $23,000

TD Ameritrade IRA (His?): Cash $50,000

TOTAL IRA'S: OP Lists this as $330,000. I get $288,000 (pencil & paper). Are these Roth IRA's or Traditional IRA's?

Liabilities as listed by OP.

Mortgage & HELOC & anything other loan using the house as collateral:
I can't figure this out - Home Equity Loan & HELOC (are those to HELOC's?) How many mortgages are there? What is the total owed on the house including all mortgages & all HELOC's and any other loan with the house as collateral? Interest rates? Payments on each?
Mortgage and Home Equity Loan $225,000
Mortgage $135,000
HELOC $20,000

Credit Cards: $13,000, average interest 7%

Car payments (both cars): $15,000, payment for both $500, payoff date 2.5 years from now (about 6/2021)

Miscellaneous thoughts:

1.Re: Monthly expenses and emergency fund (and budgeting):

If you don't have a budget, make one. Otherwise money will find its way out of retirement funds without a clear purpose and you will spend more than you need since the retirement fund money will look like discretionary spending money.

Get an emergency fund. Otherwise you are using your retirement funds as an emergency fund, and you will not be in control of it.

Pay down debt to the degree possible to increase cash flow (reducing and ultimately eliminating monthly withdrawals from the retirement funds)

How to do the above? I'm looking at that $50,000 cash in TD Ameritrade and the $23,000 in gold stocks.

$15,000 pays off the cars and frees up $500 a month
$13,000 pays off the credit cards and frees up whatever that monthly payment is plus saves interest
That's $28,000.

That reduces the monthly income shortfall to $2,500 minus ($500) minus (monthly credit card payment) = $2,000 minus monthly credit card pmt
Example If the monthly cc payment is $500, your monthly shortfall becomes $2,000. More manageable than $2,500.

Now get an emergency fund of about 6 months income (in your case, your shortfall after Social Security is $2,000 x 6 = $12,000). This isn't going to last 6 months if you have emergencies, but if you decrease expenses and increase income by any amount you will extend the period the $12,000 will last you even if you do have emergencies.

Decide which is the best way from the tax perspective in 2019 or 2020 and do it. If the gold stocks (I would start with those) or the TD Ameritrade generate taxes when withdrawn, just withdraw the amount to cover the car and credit card payments and plan on withdrawing $2,000 monthly up to 6 months unless expenses go down or income goes up.

2. Re: The cars. Keep them. Yes, I know I will get tackled because there are good arguments against this. But there are good arguments for keeping them too, and the OP will feel more at peace with the security that known cars give him.

3. Re: Work. There has been good advice regarding types of jobs to look for. Such as jobs where your abilities and experience will be an asset - those jobs are good goals to aim for. But get any job, especially desireable would be a job with benefits. If your wife is able to work, she could get a job too. Any job consistent with maintaining good health is fine to start.

4. Re: Retooling. Consider what kind of education could increase your capacity to work. Have you applied for unemployment? If not and if there is still time, do it. Even if you were terminated for cause, apply and make your case. Also work with the unemployment office to see if there are educational opportunities they can help unemployed workers increase their capacity, considering what educational opportunities (especially funded opportunities) might be available for any unemployed worker and what mght be available for workers in your category, for example your age.

5. Re: General health and well being. Take care of these. Look good (regular haircuts, well kept clothes and shoes.) Get regular check ups and take care of medical and dental issues. Get regular exercise. Join a gym. The YMCA is usually good, and has senior and family discounts - this will be good for health and well being and for socializing. Attend a place of worship of your choice. Join local interest and professional groups that interest you.

Finally: You and your wife are young. Either or both could live for decades. Stay well, keep learning, and get back in the game.

Best wishes.
Herekittykitty:
You were so kind to put this in the "standard" BH format! Much easier to see the overall picture :happy

OP, very sorry you are going through this. Many of us have gone through various challenges in life and it is never easy. I don't have any big suggestions beyond what others have posted. I would focus on finding employment and you stated you were planning to do that. Also sitting down and working on a budget will help clarify expenses during this time and help you feel more in control. :thumbsup
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Wiggums
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Wiggums »

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
According to the latest Bureau of Labor Statistics data, which is based on 2016 figures, “older households” — defined as those run by someone 65 and older — spend an average of $45,756 a year, or roughly $3,800 a month.

In terms of liabilities, 2016 retirees were also slightly more indebted on average than previous generations of retirees because of higher holdings of mortgage debt. The value of debt among retirees grew from $11,000 in 1989, to $24,000 in 2001 and then to $51,000 in 2016.

It was not clear from the information provided, why the OP was drawing $2,500 / month from the IRA in addition to SS.
Last edited by Wiggums on Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:33 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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JAZZISCOOL
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JAZZISCOOL »

Wiggums wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:27 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
According to the latest Bureau of Labor Statistics data, which is based on 2016 figures, “older households” — defined as those run by someone 65 and older — spend an average of $45,756 a year, or roughly $3,800 a month.

However, the report also said the retiree has less debt.
More debt between 1989 and 2016:

"Overall, our analysis indicates that the average value of asset holdings among retirees has more than doubled between 1989 and 2016 after adjusting for inflation. An increase in both financial assets, such as stocks and bonds, and nonfinancial assets, such as housing, contributed to the rise in assets among retirees. In terms of liabilities, retirees in 2016 were slightly more indebted on average than retirees in 1989, primarily due to larger holdings of mortgage debt."

:happy
CryingHawaiian
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by CryingHawaiian »

Herekittykitty wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:17 pm His 401k: Fidelity S&P 500 $6,000

VG IRA (His?):
$100,000 Total Bond
$53,000 International Bond
$52,000 International Stock
$10,000 Total Stock

IRA (His?): Gold Stocks $23,000

TD Ameritrade IRA (His?): Cash $50,000

TOTAL IRA'S: OP Lists this as $330,000. I get $288,000 (pencil & paper). Are these Roth IRA's or Traditional IRA's?
Most of OP's calculated % of total portfolios are off of an assumed ~ $330K total. His percentages are missing 14%, or ~$42K.

OP - Did you forget to list one of your positions or is the total IRA amount $288,000 ?
You get what you get and you don’t get upset
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

onourway wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:12 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:09 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?

The OP has fixed expenses of $2k per month (cars, mortgage, CC payments).

Social security + 4% SWR yields $3.3k per month in income.

It’s tight, but add on a Starbucks job or two slinging lattes and they are home free.
That ignores all of the ancillary, but necessary, spending around those things (not to mention food).

Taxes. Insurance. Fuel. Utilities. Home and vehicle maintenance. Medical. And so on.
How much federal income tax do you expect them to pay on $26k SS and $14k IRA withdrawals? How about a big fat 0? I’m not even counting tax credits. No state income tax in FL.

Insurance? ACA subsidy means they can probably find a plan for $300/month

Gas? $100

Utilities? They live in FL. How about $100

Still leaves $800 for food.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

CryingHawaiian wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:03 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
given the numbers provided above a SWR of 4% would be $1K per month, right?
What numbers are you using?

Does it somehow answer the question of median monthly expenses?
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:09 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
The OP has fixed expenses of $2k per month (cars, mortgage, CC payments).

Social security + 4% SWR yields $3.3k per month in income.

It’s tight, but add on a Starbucks job or two slinging lattes and they are home free.
That didn't answer my question.
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HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

The more I think about it the more I think the OP should be commended for living at his means and getting to the finish line with exactly what he needs.
dodecahedron wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 3:16 am If your SS at age 62 is $2,200, that indicates you must have had a pretty significant earnings record over your lifetime, but your assets are very low and your debt is significant.
No doubt he has had a great life full of memories and consumption.

Something more Bogleheads can take a lesson from.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

Wiggums wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:27 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:58 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:23 pm Hey everybody, guess what the median net worth of an American retiree is?

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications ... households

About exactly the OP’s net worth.

All this “emergency” talk says less about the OP and more about how out of touch the posters are.
What's the median monthly expenses of an American retiree?
According to the latest Bureau of Labor Statistics data, which is based on 2016 figures, “older households” — defined as those run by someone 65 and older — spend an average of $45,756 a year, or roughly $3,800 a month.
So, according to the article, the average retiree in 2016 had $538,000 in financial assets, and was spending $3,800 month.
The OP has less financial assets and spends more each month, and is not yet 65 years old.

Doesn't seem that the replies are out of touch at all - just concerned.
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by CryingHawaiian »

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:50 pm So, according to the article, the average retiree in 2016 had $538,000 in financial assets, and was spending $3,800 month.
The OP has less financial assets and spends more each month, and is not yet 65 years old.
Median total assets among retirees also grew substantially, from $151,000 in 1989, to $240,000 in 2001 and to $301,000 in 2016.The median retiree held little to no debt throughout our sample period. Therefore, median net worth increased substantially from $145,000 in 1989 to $246,000 in 2016.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

CryingHawaiian wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:56 pm
JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:50 pm So, according to the article, the average retiree in 2016 had $538,000 in financial assets, and was spending $3,800 month.
The OP has less financial assets and spends more each month, and is not yet 65 years old.
Median total assets among retirees also grew substantially, from $151,000 in 1989, to $240,000 in 2001 and to $301,000 in 2016.The median retiree held little to no debt throughout our sample period. Therefore, median net worth increased substantially from $145,000 in 1989 to $246,000 in 2016.
Fair enough. I mixed up median and average here.
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by onourway »

Median or averages don’t matter one bit to the individual.

Matching your expenses to your income does.

There is a substantial mis-match here at the moment which is the heart of the problem.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

onourway wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:03 pm Median or averages don’t matter one bit to the individual.

Matching your expenses to your income does.

There is a substantial mis-match here at the moment which is the heart of the problem.
Yup.

And if you mis-match long enough, you'll be forced to match later when your nest egg runs out.
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by Watty »

smmsmm57 wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:37 am I was a programmer for 36 years and I made a lot more than $ 15 an hour. I need
to greatly improve my skill set and need to do online courses since for past 10 I
was very complacent.
I was a software developer for about the same number of years. I voluntarily retired a few years ago just just before I turned 59 but for at least the last ten years I was doing mainly doing support and system conversions which my company specific knowledge was at least as important as by technical skills.

Over the years I studied various new technologies and I was able to learn them reasonably well but since I worked in a large IT department there were usually several other people that also knew the other technologies just as well or better so I didn't get a chance to use the new technologies much. It is unlikely that any other company would have hired be for those skills since I did not have any actual work experience in using them.

At this point I don't think just studying things online would make you very employable.

By all means look for a position where your old skills are still needed but if you can't find one of those right away it could be time to look for some other job. It does not even need to pay a lot. If both you and your wife got jobs that paid $1,500 a month that would be $3,000 and it would really help your numbers a lot.

I knew a number of people that worked in IT that were laid off in their 50's and could they could not get another IT job. Two of them got jobs working at school bus drivers because the job came with benefits and around here they are always looking to hire school bus drivers. It worked for them even though it did not pay a lot but it came with benefits and they got summers and school holidays off.
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by FI4LIFE »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:45 pm The more I think about it the more I think the OP should be commended for living at his means and getting to the finish line with exactly what he needs.
dodecahedron wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 3:16 am If your SS at age 62 is $2,200, that indicates you must have had a pretty significant earnings record over your lifetime, but your assets are very low and your debt is significant.
No doubt he has had a great life full of memories and consumption.

Something more Bogleheads can take a lesson from.
I am likely missing something but don't understand the logic. From what I gather, he has been drawing down his $300k retirement account at what appears to be $2500 per month (not year). It's possible that he is in fact only drawing down $2500 per year. If this is the case he has nothing to worry about and can basically ignore all the advice that has been given.

I agree that his assets are not "low" just too low for his current spending levels based on the information provided. If he were only drawing down $1000 per month he'd be golden. Do you not agree that he has an approximate $1500 per month shortfall?
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

FI4LIFE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:24 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:45 pm The more I think about it the more I think the OP should be commended for living at his means and getting to the finish line with exactly what he needs.
dodecahedron wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 3:16 am If your SS at age 62 is $2,200, that indicates you must have had a pretty significant earnings record over your lifetime, but your assets are very low and your debt is significant.
No doubt he has had a great life full of memories and consumption.

Something more Bogleheads can take a lesson from.
I am likely missing something but don't understand the logic. From what I gather, he has been drawing down his $300k retirement account at what appears to be $2500 per month (not year). It's possible that he is in fact only drawing down $2500 per year. If this is the case he has nothing to worry about and can basically ignore all the advice that has been given.

I agree that his assets are not "low" just too low for his current spending levels based on the information provided. If he were only drawing down $1000 per month he'd be golden. Do you not agree that he has an approximate $1500 per month shortfall?
I agree his withdrawal rate is unsustainable but nowhere did he say his expenses were actually $4700? I only count $1950 in fixed expenses (thanks Herekittykitty), leaving $1350 in room for other expenses. In a LCOL like FL they can easily downsize to that level of spending, if they chose to.

If not, they can get a job at Starbucks which puts them way into the green.

Where’s the emergency?
Last edited by HEDGEFUNDIE on Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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JoeRetire
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by JoeRetire »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:44 pmIn a LCOL like FL they can easily downsize to that level of spending, if they chose to.

Where’s the emergency?
"My mortgage payment is $ 1,200 and that won't end anytime soon."
It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | It's the end of the world as we know it. | And I feel fine.
HEDGEFUNDIE
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by HEDGEFUNDIE »

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:48 pm
HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:44 pmIn a LCOL like FL they can easily downsize to that level of spending, if they chose to.

Where’s the emergency?
"My mortgage payment is $ 1,200 and that won't end anytime soon."
So what? SS and SWR also don’t end
CryingHawaiian
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Re: Age 62 - just lost job - seeking advice

Post by CryingHawaiian »

HEDGEFUNDIE wrote: Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:44 pm I agree his withdrawal rate is unsustainable but nowhere did he say his expenses were actually $4700? I only count $1950 in fixed expenses (thanks Herekittykitty), leaving $1350 in room for other expenses. In a LCOL like FL they can easily downsize to that level of spending, if they chose to.

If not, they can get a job at Starbucks which puts them way into the green.

Where’s the emergency?
The implied $4,700 expenses per month is based on $2,200 from social security + $2,500 being withdrawn monthly from IRA.
You get what you get and you don’t get upset
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