overlap?

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Topic Author
jgdsss
Posts: 77
Joined: Mon May 16, 2016 11:31 pm

overlap?

Post by jgdsss » Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:38 am

I’m reviewing my and have listed them below. I’m not concerned at this point with the ER because they’re all very low. My question is more do I have too much overlap? I pulled this from my Personal Capital Dashboard…so this is OVERALL…between our Roths, current and old 401ks, Simple IRAs and brokerage this is what we have. I thought this was a good way to look at it as for example, I have VTSAX in several different buckets (some in iras, some in brokerage, etc).

I’m comfortable being all in stocks with hardly any bonds/international. I guess one of my questions would be since i have such small amounts in the international...is it worth even keeping them in there? why wouldn't i just move all to VTSAX?

JAGTX- Janus Henderson Global Technology $7,490.40

FGCKX- Fidelity Growth Company Class K $4,336.36
FXAIX- Fidelity 500 Index $119,218.50
FSMAX- Fidelity Extended Market $11,869.21
FSNKX- Fidelity Freedom 2010 Class K $15,747

VSGAX- Vanguard Small Cap Growth Index Admiral $14,847
VMGMX-Vanguard MidCap Growth Index Admiral $14,798
VFIAX- Vanguard 500 Index Admiral $97,457.01
VTSAX- Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Admiral $312,358
VIGAX- Vanguard Growth Index Admiral $56,664
VIGIX- Vanguard Growth Institutional $3,286
VTIAX- Vanguard Total International $6,464.16
VHYAX- Vanguard High Dividend Yield $7,626.15
VGSLX- Vanguard Reit Index Admiral $4,150.66

Is there anything I should get rid of/combine where there is overlap? I’d like to simplify and I think this looks ok but could use a few pointers.

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1789
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:31 pm
Location: OR

Re: overlap?

Post by 1789 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:54 am

With the information you provided i think you want to go with 100% stocks and you don’t want to include bonds and international markets. One note for your funds: growth funds are bad over the long haul. Extra returns historically maybe proven to come from small and value factors. Not growth funds. If i were you and if i decided not to have any bonds and international, having 100% VTSAX would be the path i picked. You don't need anything more than this in your portfolio. Again to repeat, i am not questioning your need/desire to add bonds/international. Since you didn't listed where these funds are, you may need a plan to unload shares in taxable in less damaging way. Experienced Bogleheads will arrive shortly to provide more inputs for you. Good luck!
"My conscience wants vegetarianism to win over the world. And my subconscious is yearning for a piece of juicy meat. But what do i want?" (Andrei Tarkovsky)

dbr
Posts: 30847
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:50 am

Re: overlap?

Post by dbr » Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:58 am

You can certainly just sell all the little pieces you have in tax deferred accounts. As far as that goes little pieces in taxable don't cost that much in taxes to sell.

For international maybe the consideration should be to buy more so it wouldn't be a little bit.

Without a doubt the current situation is a real mess. The three fund concept of total US, total international, and diversified bond fund is a good picture for your objective. Growth stocks, high dividend stocks, REITs probably should not be in your plan. Freedom fund is not needed.

retired@50
Posts: 698
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by retired@50 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 12:08 pm

jgdsss wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:38 am
I’m reviewing my and have listed them below. I’m not concerned at this point with the ER because they’re all very low. My question is more do I have too much overlap? I pulled this from my Personal Capital Dashboard…so this is OVERALL…between our Roths, current and old 401ks, Simple IRAs and brokerage this is what we have. I thought this was a good way to look at it as for example, I have VTSAX in several different buckets (some in iras, some in brokerage, etc).

I’m comfortable being all in stocks with hardly any bonds/international. I guess one of my questions would be since i have such small amounts in the international...is it worth even keeping them in there? why wouldn't i just move all to VTSAX?

JAGTX- Janus Henderson Global Technology $7,490.40

FGCKX- Fidelity Growth Company Class K $4,336.36
FXAIX- Fidelity 500 Index $119,218.50
FSMAX- Fidelity Extended Market $11,869.21
FSNKX- Fidelity Freedom 2010 Class K $15,747

VSGAX- Vanguard Small Cap Growth Index Admiral $14,847
VMGMX-Vanguard MidCap Growth Index Admiral $14,798
VFIAX- Vanguard 500 Index Admiral $97,457.01
VTSAX- Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Admiral $312,358
VIGAX- Vanguard Growth Index Admiral $56,664
VIGIX- Vanguard Growth Institutional $3,286
VTIAX- Vanguard Total International $6,464.16
VHYAX- Vanguard High Dividend Yield $7,626.15
VGSLX- Vanguard Reit Index Admiral $4,150.66

Is there anything I should get rid of/combine where there is overlap? I’d like to simplify and I think this looks ok but could use a few pointers.
Given the Vanguard funds shown above, can we presume you have a Vanguard account?

If so, I'd suggest you use your Vanguard access to add all "Outside Investments" that aren't held at Vanguard to your account view page at Vanguard. This will allow you to see all your various retirement account assets on a single screen. Further, Vanguard has a "Portfolio Watch" tool that allows you to set target(s) for stock and bond allocations, then see how your current assets compare to your desired allocation. Finally, the "Stock Analysis" tab under the portfolio watch tool will show your stock assets in the 9-box grid that depicts whether they are value oriented, growth oriented, or a blend of those styles. Seeing where your assets land on this grid can give you a relevant picture of your assets.

In general, using funds that are strictly oriented toward "Growth" or "Technology" are market or sector specific bets that over-weight your portfolio toward a strategy that may or may not exceed the overall market average. Most Bogleheads prefer to attempt to match the market, instead of trying to out-perform the market by over-weighting specific areas.

Regards,

Topic Author
jgdsss
Posts: 77
Joined: Mon May 16, 2016 11:31 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by jgdsss » Sat Nov 16, 2019 1:48 pm

Thank you for the thoughtful replies. I will spend the time getting the vanguard tool set up; I’ve been using Personal Capital for similar but will see if Vanguard might be more helpful.

The Janus/fidelity funds were from old 401ks, I haven’t pulled the trigger on rolling them over to Vanguard just bc I thought the Fidelity 500 was decent, ER is low, wasn’t hurting to leave it there, etc. Perhaps a project for the new year.

tibbitts
Posts: 9375
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:50 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by tibbitts » Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:19 pm

jgdsss wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 1:48 pm
Thank you for the thoughtful replies. I will spend the time getting the vanguard tool set up; I’ve been using Personal Capital for similar but will see if Vanguard might be more helpful.

The Janus/fidelity funds were from old 401ks, I haven’t pulled the trigger on rolling them over to Vanguard just bc I thought the Fidelity 500 was decent, ER is low, wasn’t hurting to leave it there, etc. Perhaps a project for the new year.
Vanguard has improved Portfolio Watch slightly over the years, but the main limitation is that you still can't manually categorize outside investements as far as I know.

MotoTrojan
Posts: 6929
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2017 8:39 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by MotoTrojan » Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:33 pm

Main thing that sticks out to me is your extreme tilt towards growth funds. It is a common misconception that "growth" means higher risk or higher expected return, but that is false. Historically value has actually performed better than growth, especially in small-caps.

Growth just means a business that is growing rapidly, but that also means it has a high-valuation to reflect that growth (think Amazon, Netflix, etc...). Value means a business that is not growing as rapidly, or is even at risk of decline, but because of that it has a low-valuation. Remember: Stocks don't do well when a company does well, they do well when a company does better than expected. Everyone knows Amazon as a business will do WAY better than Best Buy, but Best Buy has a much lower price/earnings ratio to reflect this, and thus it is much more difficult to know which stock will do better.

We are well into a secular period of significant growth out-performance. I would say now is an excellent time to simplify and move those growth holdings to standard Total Market or blend funds, or even consider transitioning some (the small in particular) to value funds.

There are other areas of simplification such as combining your S&P500 and Total US Market funds, as they are nearly equivalent, but I would not pay capital gains tax to do that (not sure what type of accounts these are all in).

retired@50
Posts: 698
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by retired@50 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:51 pm

tibbitts wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:19 pm
jgdsss wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 1:48 pm
Thank you for the thoughtful replies. I will spend the time getting the vanguard tool set up; I’ve been using Personal Capital for similar but will see if Vanguard might be more helpful.

The Janus/fidelity funds were from old 401ks, I haven’t pulled the trigger on rolling them over to Vanguard just bc I thought the Fidelity 500 was decent, ER is low, wasn’t hurting to leave it there, etc. Perhaps a project for the new year.
Vanguard has improved Portfolio Watch slightly over the years, but the main limitation is that you still can't manually categorize outside investements as far as I know.
Since I have all my funds at Vanguard, this isn't something I've considered.

Given that the OP showed ticker symbols for all investments, I presume Vanguard Portfolio Watch would just use publicly available information to categorize the funds based on their actual holdings and investing style.

Regards,

tibbitts
Posts: 9375
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:50 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by tibbitts » Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:55 pm

retired@50 wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:51 pm
tibbitts wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:19 pm
jgdsss wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 1:48 pm
Thank you for the thoughtful replies. I will spend the time getting the vanguard tool set up; I’ve been using Personal Capital for similar but will see if Vanguard might be more helpful.

The Janus/fidelity funds were from old 401ks, I haven’t pulled the trigger on rolling them over to Vanguard just bc I thought the Fidelity 500 was decent, ER is low, wasn’t hurting to leave it there, etc. Perhaps a project for the new year.
Vanguard has improved Portfolio Watch slightly over the years, but the main limitation is that you still can't manually categorize outside investements as far as I know.
Since I have all my funds at Vanguard, this isn't something I've considered.

Given that the OP showed ticker symbols for all investments, I presume Vanguard Portfolio Watch would just use publicly available information to categorize the funds based on their actual holdings and investing style.

Regards,
It does, although categorization used to be far more accurate for non-Vanguard funds than for Vanguard funds. Now they seem similar.

The issue is that if you have holding in for example a 401k, they are often proprietary funds that don't have a ticker. I believe you used to be able to categorize them as stock, bond, whatever (not very precise, but something) in Portfolio Watch (through what was then Vanguard's aggegation tool), but now you can't.

retired@50
Posts: 698
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2019 2:36 pm

Re: overlap?

Post by retired@50 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 5:43 pm

tibbitts wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:55 pm
retired@50 wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:51 pm
tibbitts wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:19 pm
jgdsss wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 1:48 pm
Thank you for the thoughtful replies. I will spend the time getting the vanguard tool set up; I’ve been using Personal Capital for similar but will see if Vanguard might be more helpful.

The Janus/fidelity funds were from old 401ks, I haven’t pulled the trigger on rolling them over to Vanguard just bc I thought the Fidelity 500 was decent, ER is low, wasn’t hurting to leave it there, etc. Perhaps a project for the new year.
Vanguard has improved Portfolio Watch slightly over the years, but the main limitation is that you still can't manually categorize outside investements as far as I know.
Since I have all my funds at Vanguard, this isn't something I've considered.

Given that the OP showed ticker symbols for all investments, I presume Vanguard Portfolio Watch would just use publicly available information to categorize the funds based on their actual holdings and investing style.

Regards,
It does, although categorization used to be far more accurate for non-Vanguard funds than for Vanguard funds. Now they seem similar.

The issue is that if you have holding in for example a 401k, they are often proprietary funds that don't have a ticker. I believe you used to be able to categorize them as stock, bond, whatever (not very precise, but something) in Portfolio Watch (through what was then Vanguard's aggegation tool), but now you can't.
I see your point... Without a ticker symbol, I suppose it's anybody's guess as to what the fund holds. I sure hope the 401k participants are able to find out what's in these "mystery funds". :shock:

Regards,

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