Wash sale question

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iamblessed
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Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:08 pm

I bought a mutual fund 2-1-18. I bought the same mutual fund two more times in October. All three of these positions were down when I exchanged into another fund the end of October. Is this a wash sale?

rkhusky
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by rkhusky » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:00 pm

iamblessed wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:08 pm
I bought a mutual fund 2-1-18. I bought the same mutual fund two more times in October. All three of these positions were down when I exchanged into another fund the end of October. Is this a wash sale?
Assuming this was in a taxable account, technically there might have been a wash sale, but it won't really matter if you sold all the shares. Especially if you sold them all in one transaction.
Last edited by rkhusky on Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Slow FIRE
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by Slow FIRE » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:02 pm

Yes, wash sale

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:50 pm

I sold them all in one transaction. This is a taxable account.

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jhfenton
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by jhfenton » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:16 pm

rkhusky wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:00 pm
Assuming this was in a taxable account, technically there might have been a wash sale, but it won't really matter if you sold all the shares. Especially if you sold them all in one transaction.
This is correct. Your broker may show a wash sale and shift the loss from one of the two October lots to the other, but the end result would be the same. Or they may not, since both lots were sold in the same transaction.

Just report it however your broker shows it on your 1099-B in a few months.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:34 pm

The buy on 2-1-2018 was for 75% of the total the two October buys for 25% of the total. Under realized gains/losses they show it all as a loss.

rkhusky
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by rkhusky » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:38 pm

iamblessed wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:34 pm
The buy on 2-1-2018 was for 75% of the total the two October buys for 25% of the total. Under realized gains/losses they show it all as a loss.
Do the losses match up to what you would expect?

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:39 pm

rkhusky wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:38 pm
iamblessed wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:34 pm
The buy on 2-1-2018 was for 75% of the total the two October buys for 25% of the total. Under realized gains/losses they show it all as a loss.
Do the losses match up to what you would expect?
Yes

rkhusky
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by rkhusky » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:49 pm

iamblessed wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:39 pm
rkhusky wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:38 pm
iamblessed wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:34 pm
The buy on 2-1-2018 was for 75% of the total the two October buys for 25% of the total. Under realized gains/losses they show it all as a loss.
Do the losses match up to what you would expect?
Yes
I think you are good to go.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:50 pm

That is good news.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:30 pm

To be safe I only counted on the oldest lot being not a wash sale. I am on the ACA so I have to watch my income.

rkhusky
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by rkhusky » Fri Nov 30, 2018 8:53 am

iamblessed wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:30 pm
To be safe I only counted on the oldest lot being not a wash sale. I am on the ACA so I have to watch my income.
OK. That gives you some mental cushion, but if sale of the oldest shares is not a wash sale, then the others will not be either. And if the sale of the newer shares is a wash sale, then the sale of the oldest share will be too.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:15 am

rkhusky wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 8:53 am
iamblessed wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:30 pm
To be safe I only counted on the oldest lot being not a wash sale. I am on the ACA so I have to watch my income.
OK. That gives you some mental cushion, but if sale of the oldest shares is not a wash sale, then the others will not be either. And if the sale of the newer shares is a wash sale, then the sale of the oldest share will be too.
So they won't split them up? So they can go either way. That is kind of wild. Does Vanguard show you anywhere on the site if you made a wash sale?

rkhusky
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by rkhusky » Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:15 am

iamblessed wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:15 am
So they won't split them up? So they can go either way. That is kind of wild. Does Vanguard show you anywhere on the site if you made a wash sale?
I was talking more about your specific situation where you sold all the shares and your oldest shares were 75% of the total.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:22 am

I wish there was a way to check I have several thousand in ACA funds depending on the outcome.

rkhusky
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by rkhusky » Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:27 am

iamblessed wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:22 am
I wish there was a way to check I have several thousand in ACA funds depending on the outcome.
In this post, Livesoft purposely created a wash sale and provided screen shots of it: viewtopic.php?t=179414
If you go down to the first Dec 16 post, you can see how Vanguard used to indicate a wash sale in the Unrealized gains & losses tab. Perhaps they still do it the same way. Further down there is a screenshot of the Realized gains/losses tab, with "Show details" clicked, which has further indication of a wash sale.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:55 am

rkhusky wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:27 am
iamblessed wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:22 am
I wish there was a way to check I have several thousand in ACA funds depending on the outcome.
In this post, Livesoft purposely created a wash sale and provided screen shots of it: viewtopic.php?t=179414
If you go down to the first Dec 16 post, you can see how Vanguard used to indicate a wash sale in the Unrealized gains & losses tab. Perhaps they still do it the same way. Further down there is a screenshot of the Realized gains/losses tab, with "Show details" clicked, which has further indication of a wash sale.
Thanks so much rkhusky. I don't see that symbol anywhere under realized gains so I pray that I am ok. Livesoft wrote this so it looks like I am ok. 2. Not buy the fund to be harvested for 30 days prior to harvest No! No! No! This is not correct and confuses many people and often costs them money. One must also sell any shares bought in the 30 days prior to harvest (but only if one wants to avoid a wash sale).

I did sell all the shares.

livesoft
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by livesoft » Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:14 am

Since you sold all shares, there is no wash sale, but also no consequences if there was a wash sale anyways. Who is your broker and what did they indicate in your account? If the broker indicated a wash sale, i would like to know that.
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FoolMeOnce
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by FoolMeOnce » Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:10 am

I had a similar question and got the answer in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=262225&p=4181489#p4181371

You'll see how the basis adjusted for a wash sale in which I sold all recent lots so that the tax impact was no different than if there was no wash sale.

iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Thu Dec 06, 2018 2:29 pm

livesoft wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:14 am
Since you sold all shares, there is no wash sale, but also no consequences if there was a wash sale anyways. Who is your broker and what did they indicate in your account? If the broker indicated a wash sale, i would like to know that.
Vanguard I saw no symbol that they use to show wash sales. Going by you post back in 2015 or 2016. I hope they are still doing that.

livesoft
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by livesoft » Thu Dec 06, 2018 2:44 pm

Vanguard is pretty trigger happy when it comes to indicating wash sales, so if they don't show it, one can conclude there was no wash sale.
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iamblessed
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by iamblessed » Thu Dec 06, 2018 3:07 pm

livesoft wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 2:44 pm
Vanguard is pretty trigger happy when it comes to indicating wash sales, so if they don't show it, one can conclude there was no wash sale.

The buy date were listed as various.

livesoft
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Re: Wash sale question

Post by livesoft » Thu Dec 06, 2018 3:24 pm

iamblessed wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 3:07 pm
The buy date were listed as various.
That won't matter and is true given what you told us. I suspect you did not have the Cost Basis Method set to Specific Identification, too. That didn't matter since you sold all shares. For the fund you exchanged into, you should probably set the Cost Basis Method to Specific Identification. I suspect that you have a loss in the new fund shares and may wish to exchange out of them.
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