General advice for a new attending physician

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wikiradio
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:13 pm

General advice for a new attending physician

Post by wikiradio » Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:01 pm

Hi fellow boglers, your advice has been so helpful over the years that I thought and ask you about choosing my first job as an attending.

Brief financial background:
-32, married with 1 kid. Wife is a happy stay at home mom
-no student debt or otherwise
-Live in no state income tax state
-Emergency fund is more than funded (~40k cash in "high" interest account)
-170k in retirement accounts from moonlighting and residency (btw 457, solo 401k, roth iras)
-paid off ~165k home
-very good financial habits and very high savings rate

When I started the job hunt, I had in mind that I wanted to a group in city A--where I did all my medical training (6 years) and have become close with many friends or city B--my home town where I was born and raised and still have family but sadly fewer friends there. My wife and I are open to either town and are having a hard time deciding.

I will cover from a strictly financial aspect first:
City A job--Local type group. Lower initial salary but if/when (very high rate of making partner) I become partner after 4 years, I will have a higher salary than taking the job in city B. There is a hefty buy-in for valuable tangibles for this job once you become partner, but you eventually get it back when you leave. For this reason, I will leave out any financial considerations of the buy-in.

City B job--National, more corporate group. Much higher initial salary, partner in 3 years but not a big bump in pay once partner. Once you become partner, you get equity in the private stock. This stock value has increased over the years but you never know what the future holds. Additional annual bonus has been ~30k per year on average.

Breakeven analysis (lots of implied assumptions like partner salary does not change, taxation, etc):
--If I exclude the bonus from city B job, it would take ~9 years to break even in total earnings between job A and job B. Afterwards, At 20 years, I will have earned ~1.3m more at job A than job B.

Everything else:

-Cost of living in my home town, city B, is ~13% higher than in city A. Housing is the largest component of the increased cost of living in city B.
-Much more professional satisfaction in city B job. I will get to exclusively practice my subspecialty and can do general work purely for moonlighting.
-Only have to drive to two hospitals for city b job instead of 6 for job A
-Closer to family for job B, thinking this is becoming more important now that we have a newborn. Also a little hesitant about being family too involved.
-Much better social circle in city A; Essentially have to start over for city B
-Already have a home in city A that I could live in for 4 years until I become partner. If I leave for job B, I will have to sell and get something comparable for a moderately higher price.


Ok so I know this is a financial forum but I know there are a lot of physicians on this forum. From your experiences, if you had to choose a job--would you consider (or re-consider) the money as a very high priority or does there come a point a few years after training that you feel like you have enough and other things matter more. I am hoping to make a more mature decision rather than one based purely on financials.

Thank you in advance fellow bogleheads

Tabib
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2017 9:46 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by Tabib » Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:34 pm

First of congratulations on nearly finishing residency! That's quite an accomplishment that takes lots of years of scholarly pursuit and dedication and weary eyes from being on-call. Secondly, your financial foundation and equities/accounts seems solid given a resident salary. I guess moonlighting does help a lot!

I'm not yet in your position, but I suspect that in 20 years from, there are more things that matter than just money. You probably should ask yourself whether those 1.3m will make much of a difference in the grand scheme of things, especially if you're net worth is going to be in the millions (I assume). I assume you'll be able to accomplish or do things even wtihout the extra 1.3m (if net worth will be in millions). Money can't buy friends or happiness. Also consider that you might not stay with that group for 20 years.

Ultimately you'll have plenty of money, so I think you should think about what is more important you, wife and child when considering your job. For some reason, this post reminds of goals-of-care discussion with patients and families.

Looking forward to reading what insights the senior Bogleheads in this forum can share with you and us.

somekevinguy
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2017 9:23 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by somekevinguy » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:09 am

I think like most things, this will come down to personal values. That being said, I can give you my take.

I think given your excellent financial habits, I would probably take money largely out of the equation. You will likely have enough either way. For me, I think you'll be spending a fair amount of your time at this job and you want it to be professionally satisfying. The idea of 6 hospitals also seems like a lot too (different staff, EMR's, systems etc to get used to-I would imagine it would be harder or take longer to feel "at home" in your new job with a). Given what you stated, it seemed position b was a better job even if the compensation might not be as good over time. Also, as someone with young children, we've definitely valued being close to family, particularly as grandparents get older etc and if they are willing to help out with the grandkids (whether in small or more significant ways).

Other considerations like moving to a new place/selling your old place seem like they would be lower on the list of factors (I imagine your home has appreciated a reasonable amount) and while it is nice to have your social network for job a, that can change a fair amount with a kid as at least for us, most of our social network has morphed into other young families with kids.

Just my 2 cents from someone just a few years further down a similar path.

TroutMD
Posts: 79
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:58 am

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by TroutMD » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:29 am

wikiradio wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:01 pm
Hi fellow boglers, your advice has been so helpful over the years that I thought and ask you about choosing my first job as an attending.

Brief financial background:
-32, married with 1 kid. Wife is a happy stay at home mom
-no student debt or otherwise
-Live in no state income tax state
-Emergency fund is more than funded (~40k cash in "high" interest account)
-170k in retirement accounts from moonlighting and residency (btw 457, solo 401k, roth iras)
-paid off ~165k home
-very good financial habits and very high savings rate

When I started the job hunt, I had in mind that I wanted to a group in city A--where I did all my medical training (6 years) and have become close with many friends or city B--my home town where I was born and raised and still have family but sadly fewer friends there. My wife and I are open to either town and are having a hard time deciding.

I will cover from a strictly financial aspect first:
City A job--Local type group. Lower initial salary but if/when (very high rate of making partner) I become partner after 4 years, I will have a higher salary than taking the job in city B. There is a hefty buy-in for valuable tangibles for this job once you become partner, but you eventually get it back when you leave. For this reason, I will leave out any financial considerations of the buy-in.

City B job--National, more corporate group. Much higher initial salary, partner in 3 years but not a big bump in pay once partner. Once you become partner, you get equity in the private stock. This stock value has increased over the years but you never know what the future holds. Additional annual bonus has been ~30k per year on average.

Breakeven analysis (lots of implied assumptions like partner salary does not change, taxation, etc):
--If I exclude the bonus from city B job, it would take ~9 years to break even in total earnings between job A and job B. Afterwards, At 20 years, I will have earned ~1.3m more at job A than job B.

Everything else:

-Cost of living in my home town, city B, is ~13% higher than in city A. Housing is the largest component of the increased cost of living in city B.
-Much more professional satisfaction in city B job. I will get to exclusively practice my subspecialty and can do general work purely for moonlighting.
-Only have to drive to two hospitals for city b job instead of 6 for job A
-Closer to family for job B, thinking this is becoming more important now that we have a newborn. Also a little hesitant about being family too involved.
-Much better social circle in city A; Essentially have to start over for city B
-Already have a home in city A that I could live in for 4 years until I become partner. If I leave for job B, I will have to sell and get something comparable for a moderately higher price.


Ok so I know this is a financial forum but I know there are a lot of physicians on this forum. From your experiences, if you had to choose a job--would you consider (or re-consider) the money as a very high priority or does there come a point a few years after training that you feel like you have enough and other things matter more. I am hoping to make a more mature decision rather than one based purely on financials.

Thank you in advance fellow bogleheads

Ignore the money. Either will put you in the top 1-2% of income earners.

Go where you will be happy, and more importantly, where she will be happy living.

Don't follow the money, I have seen it over and over again, when people do that, they are not happy, and they move/family falls apart/they burn out, etc.

Your in a *great* shape financially for a completing residency doctor. DONT screw it up by buying a 7 figure home, Ferrari, private jet rentals, etc. Keep doing what you are doing for 5-10 years. You will be MUCH more happy...

Good luck!

staythecourse
Posts: 5981
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:40 am

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by staythecourse » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:36 am

TroutMD wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:29 am
wikiradio wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:01 pm
Hi fellow boglers, your advice has been so helpful over the years that I thought and ask you about choosing my first job as an attending.

Brief financial background:
-32, married with 1 kid. Wife is a happy stay at home mom
-no student debt or otherwise
-Live in no state income tax state
-Emergency fund is more than funded (~40k cash in "high" interest account)
-170k in retirement accounts from moonlighting and residency (btw 457, solo 401k, roth iras)
-paid off ~165k home
-very good financial habits and very high savings rate

When I started the job hunt, I had in mind that I wanted to a group in city A--where I did all my medical training (6 years) and have become close with many friends or city B--my home town where I was born and raised and still have family but sadly fewer friends there. My wife and I are open to either town and are having a hard time deciding.

I will cover from a strictly financial aspect first:
City A job--Local type group. Lower initial salary but if/when (very high rate of making partner) I become partner after 4 years, I will have a higher salary than taking the job in city B. There is a hefty buy-in for valuable tangibles for this job once you become partner, but you eventually get it back when you leave. For this reason, I will leave out any financial considerations of the buy-in.

City B job--National, more corporate group. Much higher initial salary, partner in 3 years but not a big bump in pay once partner. Once you become partner, you get equity in the private stock. This stock value has increased over the years but you never know what the future holds. Additional annual bonus has been ~30k per year on average.

Breakeven analysis (lots of implied assumptions like partner salary does not change, taxation, etc):
--If I exclude the bonus from city B job, it would take ~9 years to break even in total earnings between job A and job B. Afterwards, At 20 years, I will have earned ~1.3m more at job A than job B.

Everything else:

-Cost of living in my home town, city B, is ~13% higher than in city A. Housing is the largest component of the increased cost of living in city B.
-Much more professional satisfaction in city B job. I will get to exclusively practice my subspecialty and can do general work purely for moonlighting.
-Only have to drive to two hospitals for city b job instead of 6 for job A
-Closer to family for job B, thinking this is becoming more important now that we have a newborn. Also a little hesitant about being family too involved.
-Much better social circle in city A; Essentially have to start over for city B
-Already have a home in city A that I could live in for 4 years until I become partner. If I leave for job B, I will have to sell and get something comparable for a moderately higher price.


Ok so I know this is a financial forum but I know there are a lot of physicians on this forum. From your experiences, if you had to choose a job--would you consider (or re-consider) the money as a very high priority or does there come a point a few years after training that you feel like you have enough and other things matter more. I am hoping to make a more mature decision rather than one based purely on financials.

Thank you in advance fellow bogleheads

Ignore the money. Either will put you in the top 1-2% of income earners.

Go where you will be happy, and more importantly, where she will be happy living.

Don't follow the money, I have seen it over and over again, when people do that, they are not happy, and they move/family falls apart/they burn out, etc.

Your in a *great* shape financially for a completing residency doctor. DONT screw it up by buying a 7 figure home, Ferrari, private jet rentals, etc. Keep doing what you are doing for 5-10 years. You will be MUCH more happy...

Good luck!
Excellent advice. Since you will not be poor in either choice I would say let your wife choose since she will be the one at home more vulnerable to the plus and minus of the social situation. Does she have a strong preference?

Good luck.
"The stock market [fluctuation], therefore, is noise. A giant distraction from the business of investing.” | -Jack Bogle

TheNightsToCome
Posts: 343
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2017 11:48 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by TheNightsToCome » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:43 am

wikiradio wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:01 pm
Hi fellow boglers, your advice has been so helpful over the years that I thought and ask you about choosing my first job as an attending.

Brief financial background:
-32, married with 1 kid. Wife is a happy stay at home mom
-no student debt or otherwise
-Live in no state income tax state
-Emergency fund is more than funded (~40k cash in "high" interest account)
-170k in retirement accounts from moonlighting and residency (btw 457, solo 401k, roth iras)
-paid off ~165k home
-very good financial habits and very high savings rate

When I started the job hunt, I had in mind that I wanted to a group in city A--where I did all my medical training (6 years) and have become close with many friends or city B--my home town where I was born and raised and still have family but sadly fewer friends there. My wife and I are open to either town and are having a hard time deciding.

I will cover from a strictly financial aspect first:
City A job--Local type group. Lower initial salary but if/when (very high rate of making partner) I become partner after 4 years, I will have a higher salary than taking the job in city B. There is a hefty buy-in for valuable tangibles for this job once you become partner, but you eventually get it back when you leave. For this reason, I will leave out any financial considerations of the buy-in.

City B job--National, more corporate group. Much higher initial salary, partner in 3 years but not a big bump in pay once partner. Once you become partner, you get equity in the private stock. This stock value has increased over the years but you never know what the future holds. Additional annual bonus has been ~30k per year on average.

Breakeven analysis (lots of implied assumptions like partner salary does not change, taxation, etc):
--If I exclude the bonus from city B job, it would take ~9 years to break even in total earnings between job A and job B. Afterwards, At 20 years, I will have earned ~1.3m more at job A than job B.

Everything else:

-Cost of living in my home town, city B, is ~13% higher than in city A. Housing is the largest component of the increased cost of living in city B.
-Much more professional satisfaction in city B job. I will get to exclusively practice my subspecialty and can do general work purely for moonlighting.
-Only have to drive to two hospitals for city b job instead of 6 for job A
-Closer to family for job B, thinking this is becoming more important now that we have a newborn. Also a little hesitant about being family too involved.
-Much better social circle in city A; Essentially have to start over for city B
-Already have a home in city A that I could live in for 4 years until I become partner. If I leave for job B, I will have to sell and get something comparable for a moderately higher price.


Ok so I know this is a financial forum but I know there are a lot of physicians on this forum. From your experiences, if you had to choose a job--would you consider (or re-consider) the money as a very high priority or does there come a point a few years after training that you feel like you have enough and other things matter more. I am hoping to make a more mature decision rather than one based purely on financials.

Thank you in advance fellow bogleheads
I would strongly favor the home town job.

1. Don't count on making partner and/or wanting to stay long enough to become partner and/or the pay remaining higher indefinitely. All of that may come to pass, but maybe not, and many (most?) new attendings leave their first job within a couple of years.

2. Given #1, the initial higher salary and lack of buy-in with the home town job is appealing.

3. It's your home town! You have family there. Different folks have different feelings about being near family, but I would love that. All of my sibs live in my home town, and mom and dad have been a big help with their kids. More importantly, all of the grandchildren are very close to grandma and grandpa; it's very good for grandparents and grandkids.

4. Job A covers 6 hospitals. Don't underestimate what a PITA that can be. For whatever reason, you expect more professional satisfaction with the home town job. That is very important. You are going to spend a lot of time at work. It's a huge part of your life.

5. For me, the social circle wouldn't matter much. I have friends from different stages of life scattered around the country now. I keep in touch via email, LinkedIn and the like. I almost never see the one friend that I've had since high school that actually works at the same hospital. Life moves on.

Good luck with your choice.

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White Coat Investor
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Location: Greatest Snow On Earth

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by White Coat Investor » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:02 am

I'd take A, but owning my job is very important to me.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course

bubbadog
Posts: 644
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:17 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by bubbadog » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:04 am

As a 51 year old physician, my advice is city job B.

You are in great shape for a very prosperous future, congrats!

mt
Posts: 150
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 11:25 am

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by mt » Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:44 pm

It is hard to put a price on not having a boss once you become partner. That would be a huge plus for practice A for me.

kenoryan
Posts: 156
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2017 7:11 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by kenoryan » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:03 pm

58 year old physician here. Small private group in flyover high tax state.

I couldn’t work for one of them national ‘group’ types. All those guys in suits are being paid by skimming money from what you bring in. In the small group, you are your own boss. It is very important in the long run. I would strongly suggest a small private group. City A is my vote.

Even with privileges at 6 hospitals, you will have a primary hospital where you will do most of your work, and fill in at other hospitals as needed.

How did you manage to save 170k in your retirement account? Well done!

coastalinvestor
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:38 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by coastalinvestor » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:44 pm

I left my first attending job mainly because I didn’t like the city. I am now very happy in my current private practice job (where I am self-employed) - and I think a lot of my happiness comes from my location, social circle, etc. If you ask people on this forum an A vs. B question you are going to get very objective, clinical answers but I think the key question is where would you and your wife be happiest and where would you like to raise your kids? I agree with White Coat Investor that being self employed is - in general - better than being employed - but I have plenty of friends who are happy in employed situations. With your saving habits you will likely have a very high net worth when you retire after a career with either practice.

ENT Doc
Posts: 118
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:14 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by ENT Doc » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:56 pm

With your break even did you factor in opportunity cost and use after tax dollars? The social aspects of A are nice, but the majority of your life is going to be spent with your job and your family. It sounds like you'll have a better job and quality of life related to B. Family is with you regardless and perhaps even more in B since it's your home town. Don't let the money make this decision for you.

daveydoo
Posts: 1564
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Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by daveydoo » Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:11 pm

kenoryan wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:03 pm
In the small group, you are your own boss.
I don't think it's like making partner at a law firm. There's no guarantee you can stay your own boss or even be your own boss in small medical practice. For example, your one hospital gets bought and threatens to contract with mega-group for your specialty. Or they just bring them in in parallel and you're outcompeted. If you have all your own lasik centers, on the other hand, that may be different. But a relative in a surgical sub was basically steamrolled in just the way I described.

Other than that, it comes down to family vs. friends and I'm no help there. You don't mention the distance between the positions -- that would be a factor for me. Family's vital when kids are small, imo. If it's a one-hour drive, that's one thing; if it's a two-flight odyssey, that's very different...
"I mean, it's one banana, Michael...what could it cost? Ten dollars?"

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climber2020
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Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by climber2020 » Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:50 pm

daveydoo wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:11 pm
kenoryan wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:03 pm
In the small group, you are your own boss.
I don't think it's like making partner at a law firm. There's no guarantee you can stay your own boss or even be your own boss in small medical practice.
In medicine, unless you are purely cash pay, you are not completely your own boss. You work for the US government and the insurance companies, who have quite a bit of control over what you do and how you get paid.

3funder
Posts: 712
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:35 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by 3funder » Mon Dec 04, 2017 9:29 am

somekevinguy wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:09 am
I think like most things, this will come down to personal values. That being said, I can give you my take.

I think given your excellent financial habits, I would probably take money largely out of the equation. You will likely have enough either way. For me, I think you'll be spending a fair amount of your time at this job and you want it to be professionally satisfying. The idea of 6 hospitals also seems like a lot too (different staff, EMR's, systems etc to get used to-I would imagine it would be harder or take longer to feel "at home" in your new job with a). Given what you stated, it seemed position b was a better job even if the compensation might not be as good over time. Also, as someone with young children, we've definitely valued being close to family, particularly as grandparents get older etc and if they are willing to help out with the grandkids (whether in small or more significant ways).

Other considerations like moving to a new place/selling your old place seem like they would be lower on the list of factors (I imagine your home has appreciated a reasonable amount) and while it is nice to have your social network for job a, that can change a fair amount with a kid as at least for us, most of our social network has morphed into other young families with kids.

Just my 2 cents from someone just a few years further down a similar path.
+1

kenoryan
Posts: 156
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2017 7:11 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by kenoryan » Mon Dec 04, 2017 9:54 pm

daveydoo wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:11 pm
kenoryan wrote:
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:03 pm
In the small group, you are your own boss.
I don't think it's like making partner at a law firm.
I have no clue how partnerships work in law firms. Having been in *medical* private practice most of my life, I can say that when you work for a national group, someone definitely has their hand in your pocket. You are answerable to a bean counter. You don’t get to sit down with other docs in your small group and decide how you’re going to deal with issues that you face. It varies from specialty to specialty, but most of the national groups that I can think of are anesthesia, radiology, ER, neonatology, hospital medicine. The group owners skim money off the top easily 100-200k. If you want to be happy and not feel like you’re getting screwed over by a suit, be your own boss in your own group practice.

wikiradio
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2014 12:13 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by wikiradio » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:12 am

Thank you all for all of your advice. Although I was leaning toward job B in my hometown, I decided to sign at job A. I talked it over with family and took your thoughts into consideration and finally thought job A would be better for me.

How I finally decided:
1. The city in Job A is a true partnership job in a large, very secure private group. Job B contracts with only two hospitals and the contract can change hands much more quickly. This most likely wont affect my job security, but will make life more stressful if a change occurs.

2. I will be a true partner is job A--important for me and for work morale. If I joined job B in my home town, I will be working for a large group and will inherently have lower morale due to regulation from above.

3. I will initially make less money but once I am a partner, I will make considerably more--more than what I initially thought to calculate the total earnings breakeven point.

4. Wife likes both cities but slightly prefers city A.

Now...I have to live with my choice and know that I made a good one =)


1. Some moves I was able to make with the new job. I asked them to give me a sign-on bonus and 15k of my salary up front. This way I can max out my 2018 457b with my training hospital before I finish my fellowship in June. The reason is, I do not get access to a 401k with my new job until January 2019. This way I spread out some of taxes as well.

2. #livelikearesident; We will live in my current (paid off) home for 4 years till I move to partner salary. Goal is to save 50% of gross.

3. Maybe buy a small home and rent it out. Problem is, Texas isnt the best for single home rentals due to high property taxes. Any idea where I should park some money aside from my retirement accounts and stock market.

4. Bought a very small amount of bitcoin and ethereum...I know I know but very small amount and just for fun.

**Wouldn't have been able to do this without learning from WCI**

abonder
Posts: 225
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2012 10:52 am

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by abonder » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:23 am

If you want to invest in real estate, I would do a lot of learning first. As you noted, a single family home in your area might not be the most effficient use of your resources. I think your overall plan of staying in your paid off home, saving a high percentage of your income, and holding off on a bigger home until partnership is attained is a winning strategy. Open a taxable account, 529, consider I bonds. If you want to get involved in direct real estate ownership, do it after learning and with the intent of running a business, rather than buying a home that you *may* want to live in at some later time. Just my thoughts. I think your overall plan is really rock solid and you pretty much can’t mess it up. You have no student loans, a paid-off home, a funded emergency fund, well into 6 figures of retirment savings and you’re still a trainee. You ought to be giving out more advice rather than soliciting it! Enviable situation for a newly-minted doc. You could work part-time in a low paid field from day one and still be in an excellent fiscal position down the line because all the groundwork has been laid.

raddoc101
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri May 27, 2016 12:56 pm

Re: General advice for a new attending physician

Post by raddoc101 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:05 pm

Sounds like you may be in radiology... A few thoughts...

I hope that all of the corporations fail, so I hope you pick A. Of course, group A may sell out to a corporation while you're on the partnership track.

I agree that finances are secondary, but an extra thought... If it's an imaging center, you may benefit significantly from the pass through income with the tax changes. We're looking into restructuring as an S corp now.

I probably would prefer not to be fully subspecialized since it may restrict your ability to change jobs if the first one does not work out.

If your subspecialty happens to be interventional radiology, I'll give you option C - join our practice. It's wonderful here and we're actively recruiting. Just kidding - sort of.

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