Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokerage

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ElJay
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Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokerage

Post by ElJay » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:02 pm

I am trying to help my mother transfer some stocks which she inherited to Vanguard Brokerage. The assets currently sit at Edward Jones in the estate brokerage account of her father, which will be split equally with her siblings.

Thus far Vanguard hasn't been terribly helpful in assisting her with this transfer (six figures). We have a Vanguard Brokerage account set up for her, and Vanguard sent her the brokerage in-kind transfer form (ACTF). This form doesn't seem to be well-suited for this task given the questions it is asking. It seems more like a form where I send it to Vanguard and then they reach out to Edward Jones to start the transfer. The account we're trying to transfer from is not in my mom's name and the balance is not all hers. We are not going to send Vanguard a recent account statement from the estate since it shows the entire assets owned by the estate, not my mother's share of it.

The process Edward Jones has explained to us is that Edward Jones is in the process of collecting account transfer forms for my mom and the other heirs. After those are all received, Edward Jones will split the stocks up and do the in-kind distributions to the different heirs. In other words, what I am hearing for my mom's share is a "push" from Edward Jones to Vanguard. We've tried getting more detail from Edward Jones in what they need other than a "transfer form." They don't want to see the money leave, so they're not being terribly helpful either. We do not want to open up an account at Edward Jones and pay their fees.

For this process, should Edward Jones require any more info other than Vanguard's DTC number (0062), my mom's Vanguard Brokerage account number, the type of account it is, and her social security number? Does Vanguard need to do anything other than sit around and wait for the assets to arrive? I have told my mother to call Vanguard again and see if she can get in a conference call with Edward Jones and they can get to the bottom of what needs to happen, but I am interested in hearing the feedback and tips from anybody who has dealt with this before.

livesoft
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by livesoft » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:08 pm

My advice is to sell everything and transfer only cash. The idea of splitting up stock shares is a PITA. If a taxable account, then the assets probably received a complete stepped-up basis and little if any tax consequences. If tax-advantaged, then no tax consequences for going to cash.

I'm sure others will chime in if my advice is bad, but that's what I would do from personal experience.
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Retread
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by Retread » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:11 pm

I agree with Livesoft. It makes no sense to distribute in kind. Sell, distribute cash and let the beneficiaries invest on their own. This is the procedure I followed in estates I administered over a 35 year career with corporate fiduciaries.
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bloom2708
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by bloom2708 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:19 pm

Did you call Vanguard and talk to a Concierge rep? Call and ask for Brucelee Sterile.

I did "in kind" transfers of 6 accounts. He walked me through and essentially filled out each form/transfer and it was all electronic.

The transfer itself took about 7-10 days. I do tend to agree with other replies. With the stepped up basis, sell, distribute and then transfer to Vanguard from your checking acct.
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James2
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by James2 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:26 pm

I'd wait until the account has been split. You can then use the account transfer form provided to move things to Vanguard. Remember that you will be charged some kind of fee for leaving EJ and selling the assets at EJ may cost a steep fee.

James

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TheGreyingDuke
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by TheGreyingDuke » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:27 pm

When my mother died (assets at Vanguard) the advice we got on their end was the easiest way to proceed was to have the heirs open accounts at Vanguard, sort of strange but that was how we proceeded.

As to in-kind or otherwise, I wanted to help establish some habits for two of the heirs (my nieces) and since the assets were a simple 3 fund plus 1 portfolio, I decided to do an in-kind transfer. From reports, my efforts yielded a 50% success rate with one of the heirs maintaining the approach while the other one has gone off the deep end and has just paid $4000 for training as a day trader :oops:

What can I say??

EDIT: Oh, I just remembered, I was visiting family in Valley Forge at the time and I went right to headquarters to do the transfers, one way to make sure all the Ts were crossed
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livesoft
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by livesoft » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:40 pm

Splitting up into 3 accounts before selling the assets will probably triple the ultimate costs. Think seriously about selling first.
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Crow Hunter
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by Crow Hunter » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:44 pm

ElJay wrote:I am trying to help my mother transfer some stocks which she inherited to Vanguard Brokerage. The assets currently sit at Edward Jones in the estate brokerage account of her father, which will be split equally with her siblings.

Thus far Vanguard hasn't been terribly helpful in assisting her with this transfer (six figures). We have a Vanguard Brokerage account set up for her, and Vanguard sent her the brokerage in-kind transfer form (ACTF). This form doesn't seem to be well-suited for this task given the questions it is asking. It seems more like a form where I send it to Vanguard and then they reach out to Edward Jones to start the transfer. The account we're trying to transfer from is not in my mom's name and the balance is not all hers. We are not going to send Vanguard a recent account statement from the estate since it shows the entire assets owned by the estate, not my mother's share of it.

The process Edward Jones has explained to us is that Edward Jones is in the process of collecting account transfer forms for my mom and the other heirs. After those are all received, Edward Jones will split the stocks up and do the in-kind distributions to the different heirs. In other words, what I am hearing for my mom's share is a "push" from Edward Jones to Vanguard. We've tried getting more detail from Edward Jones in what they need other than a "transfer form." They don't want to see the money leave, so they're not being terribly helpful either. We do not want to open up an account at Edward Jones and pay their fees.

For this process, should Edward Jones require any more info other than Vanguard's DTC number (0062), my mom's Vanguard Brokerage account number, the type of account it is, and her social security number? Does Vanguard need to do anything other than sit around and wait for the assets to arrive? I have told my mother to call Vanguard again and see if she can get in a conference call with Edward Jones and they can get to the bottom of what needs to happen, but I am interested in hearing the feedback and tips from anybody who has dealt with this before.
Going through the exact same thing right now and no, Vanguard is not being very helpful about it. Losing the forms (or forgetting to send them), then sending the wrong replacement forms. Honestly, during this whole ordeal Vanguard has been the least helpful of all the different financial institutions that I have had to deal with. I have to transfer 3 accounts. A taxable and 2 separate inherited IRAs combined in the low 6 figures. Supposedly the correct replacement set of forms are on the way via FedEx.

Personally, I want to do a transfer in kind to Vanguard because their sales fees are lower than Edward Jones and I will likely take a huge haircut on some of the fixed income Unit Investment Trusts and MBS that my Mother had invested in if I sell them so I will likely just keep them.

I was not charged a fee to split my Mom's holdings between myself and my brother. (Or at least none was disclosed or reported to me).

Honestly, Edward Jones has been much faster and easier to deal with than Vanguard where my Mother also had an account even though I let them know up front that I was likely going to consolidate my accounts with Vanguard. I just call and they take care of it. Maybe that is why Mom never moved everything to Vanguard like I wanted her to.

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ElJay
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by ElJay » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:55 pm

Thanks a lot for the comments.

She has talked to a concierge rep which dumped that transfer form on her and left her feeling confused and overwhelmed. It has kind of frustrated me since I recommended Vanguard. My own customer service experience with Vanguard has been mixed, but they have always ultimately gotten to the proper result in the end.

Edward Jones' fees are leading us to want to perform an in-kind transfer. Otherwise it's a flush of 1.5% down the toilet, which is a few thousand bucks that should be in my mom's pocket instead of EJ's. It's a non-retirement account. Some of the heirs actually want the stock (though my mom plans to sell most of it).

Crow Hunter, good luck! This stuff is so tiring and frustrating. I'd think Vanguard would be excited to be getting a lot (well, in my lowly terms) of new money flowing in, but nobody there seems to want to orchestrate and the process to make it happen.

livesoft
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by livesoft » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:02 pm

ElJay wrote: Some of the heirs actually want the stock.
They can always buy the stock with any cash they get. :)
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ElJay
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by ElJay » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:07 pm

livesoft wrote:
ElJay wrote: Some of the heirs actually want the stock.
They can always buy the stock with any cash they get. :)
True. I think the estate is past the point of no return on this decision since all heirs have decided to do in-kind transfers. If EJ's fees were not so greedy I would have no problem simplifying the process by having my mom open up an account at EJ. But if we do that it's an account open fee, an annual fee, ridiculous fees to sell, and an account termination fee. Plus she doesn't like dealing with the EJ guy so she is trying to minimize her exposure to him.

I'm going to see if i can get my mom on the phone with Brucelee Sterile and get this resolved. We seem to have chosen the most complicated route; it came out of good intentions in trying to minimize costs.
Last edited by ElJay on Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

livesoft
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by livesoft » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:10 pm

Once the account is split, then each account owner has to take care of their own business.
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Crow Hunter
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by Crow Hunter » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:38 pm

ElJay wrote:
Crow Hunter, good luck! This stuff is so tiring and frustrating. I'd think Vanguard would be excited to be getting a lot (well, in my lowly terms) of new money flowing in, but nobody there seems to want to orchestrate and the process to make it happen.
You would think so.

Good luck to you too.

I think we are going to need it. :beer

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SunsetKid
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Re: Transfering inherited assets in-kind to Vanguard Brokera

Post by SunsetKid » Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:36 pm

How about open a Vanguard account for the estate, transfer the entire EJ account to Vanguard.
Then either sell everything and divide the money, or transfer out each persons value to separate accounts.

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