Search found 35202 matches

by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 26, 2018 4:39 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

The best hedge is to owe money*. * to be precise, long term money at fixed interest rates. 80% of mortgages in the UK were at a floating rate (it's now less than 50%, apparently) and interest rates tend to track inflation. Wouldn't shorting long-term treasury futures do the same thing? You'd lose t...
by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 26, 2018 3:40 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

I am not concern about what did best. I am concern about having enough gold to feed my family and get them out of the country. KlangFool Gold has repeatedly failed to hedge hyperinflation in the empirical data. The best known example is Brazil during the:1980s when gold lost 70% of its value. Sure,...
by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 26, 2018 2:48 am
Forum: Personal Consumer Issues
Topic: Seattle and (Victoria OR Vancouver) next week.
Replies: 24
Views: 1232

Re: Seattle and (Victoria OR Vancouver) next week.

There is no place in the Pacific Northwest that is 100% flat. You have to go to Dallas or Houston to find that. But my own perception is that Vancouver is quite a bit more flat than Seattle, at least in terms of the tourist areas in which you'd be walking around. The downtown area is reasonably fla...
by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 26, 2018 2:42 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

f the local economy, currency controls, etc. There tends to be a cat and mouse game between the government and investors in these situations. Is there a specific situation you want to address or is this more of a general question? The UK point is a bit off. I suspect they are talking about a relati...
by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 26, 2018 2:38 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

(firearms & canned goods) [EDITED] This is the UK (OP is resident in the UK): - private ownership of firearms is difficult - the island is only 700 miles long - there's no way to escape the impact of large urban centres, farming is generally of large holdings and configured around supplying the sup...
by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 26, 2018 2:30 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Equities as a hedge against inflation
Replies: 22
Views: 1209

Re: Equities as a hedge against inflation

This obviously falls into a category like speculation, belief, or dogma, as we don’t know for sure. I buy into it because without being able to return at least at the inflation rate corporations would not attract capital. So this becomes primal for them. I have also read that since corporations are...
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 4:43 pm
Forum: Personal Consumer Issues
Topic: solar panels with payback of 8-10 years?
Replies: 7
Views: 748

Re: solar panels with payback of 8-10 years?

Hi, We are considering installation of solar panels on our house and it looks like the expected payback is about 8-10 years. I feel like that's the range where it's reasonable to go in either direction so I thought I'd get some perspective from others who maybe have thought about it or have advice ...
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 4:30 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

Your foreign assets will hold buying power. So will the income from foreign assets. The problem is that under hyperinflation conditions you may be forced to sell and repatriate your assets. Or they may be heavily taxed. Or it may be impracticable to bring spending money onshore. Yes that's what I m...
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 7:28 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

Thanks Valuethinker. Are you able to point to any data about how different the official exchange rates have been in historical cases from the market rates? I couldn't find anything by Googling. Should I take it then that only physical foreign currency, for use in the informal economy, would be like...
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 7:27 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Siegel: 'stocks are overvalued on a long-term basis, but bonds are enormously overvalued on a long-term basis'
Replies: 49
Views: 4533

Re: Siegel: 'stocks are overvalued on a long-term basis, but bonds are enormously overvalued on a long-term basis'

It's hard to draw precise conclusions, but the idea that the higher the P/E ratio, the lower is the return (E) for what you pay (P) is simple math. The only way US stocks can have higher returns than estimated in that article is through further multiple expansion (even higher CAPE in future) or thr...
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 3:07 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: U.S. stocks continue to soar!
Replies: 286
Views: 27853

Re: U.S. stocks continue to soar!

MJW wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:18 pm
I seem to be missing whatever gene causes people to enjoy seeing their international equity holdings performing poorly.
My international holdings are doing very well, thank you very much.

But then, the US is an international market to me ;-).
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 2:51 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: US TSM returns since 2009
Replies: 17
Views: 1532

Re: US TSM returns since 2009

I was playing around with various asset mixes and even though I knew the past 10 years were really good for US Market, it didn't strike me how huge it is until I checked. Since Jan 2009 to end of Aug 2018, US TSM produced 15.41% annualized, without a single year of -ve returns. During the same peri...
by Valuethinker
Tue Sep 25, 2018 2:44 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds
Replies: 22
Views: 1139

Re: Hyperinflation and holding foreign stocks/bonds

I was wondering if you could help me to understand how much does holding foreign stocks and bonds (i.e. those whose earnings are in foreign markets and currencies) help to protect an investment portfolio against hyperinflation in one's own country? I'm basically interested to understand if having a...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:58 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: How much is too much in one stock?
Replies: 13
Views: 1436

Re: How much is too much in one stock?

...they now hold a 50/50 portfolio (the bond fund fills their IRAs). One third of their savings is still in seventeen stocks within the taxable account. What is the rest of the portfolio, the other 20% or so, invested in? Some of these stocks represent from 1% to 4.5% of savings. How much is too mu...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:52 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Siegel: 'stocks are overvalued on a long-term basis, but bonds are enormously overvalued on a long-term basis'
Replies: 49
Views: 4533

Re: Siegel: 'stocks are overvalued on a long-term basis, but bonds are enormously overvalued on a long-term basis'

- The CAPE ratio might be permanently higher due to indexing lowering costs for investors (an interesting argument that I had not heard of before) ...interesting point. I thought that the potential effect of indexing on CAPE was the most interesting part of the piece because it's new for me... Heav...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:55 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Best corporate long-term bond fund
Replies: 26
Views: 1990

Re: Best corporate long-term bond fund

Your OP (original post, original poster) does not make your situation clear. --Will you be a US citizen in Europe for a visit? --Will you be retiring to Europe? --Will you keep your US citizenship if you retire to Europe? --Will you surrender your US citizenship if you retire to Europe? Believe the...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:17 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: EU - Trouble finding an alternative to the VEA fund
Replies: 6
Views: 382

Re: EU - Trouble finding an alternative to the VEA fund

olk as it is specifically not US domiciled. Probably no use to you though, since I doubt that it is any more available in Europe than is VEA. PRIIPS and MiFID 2 really are a bit of a nuisance. Moreover they are nuisances without any apparent or visible compensating investor benefits. I wonder if th...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 5:14 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: Swiss Investor 3 Fund Portfolio
Replies: 6
Views: 485

Re: Swiss Investor 3 Fund Portfolio

Basically if capital gains is payable, you want Distribution funds (pay out all dividends and capital gains, periodically). Accumulation funds (the NAV of the fund increases so to realize capital you have to sell units) work in tax exempt accounts. (also Accumulation funds are a nightmare for capit...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:27 am
Forum: Personal Consumer Issues
Topic: Seattle and (Victoria OR Vancouver) next week.
Replies: 24
Views: 1232

Re: Seattle and (Victoria OR Vancouver) next week.

I would search on here for good past Seattle threads and tripadvisor. I'd do a coffee and brewery tour based on Yelp reviews. I find big cities fairly underwhelming (Victoria definitely more charming than Vancouver) so if it were me I would spend most of my time at Mt. Rainier or in Canada in the W...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:24 am
Forum: Personal Consumer Issues
Topic: Seattle and (Victoria OR Vancouver) next week.
Replies: 24
Views: 1232

Re: Seattle and (Victoria OR Vancouver) next week.

FYI - I retitled your thread to add parentheses around (Victoria OR Vancouver). If you work with software, the interpretation would instead be "(Seattle and Victoria) OR Vancouver". :) I don't want to push her beyond a few hundred feet elevation gain IN A DAY. Is this a limitation due to physical f...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:02 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: Fidelity: REIT funds
Replies: 8
Views: 1044

Re: Fidelity: REIT funds

Hi, I always wanted about 20% of my investment in real estate. You can blame on my upbringing outside but I believe RE has a valid place in my invesment portfolio. I have looked at buying rental properties, notes, syndications, etc. The first 2 are too much work along with my job. I would rather sp...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 2:59 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: Swiss Investor 3 Fund Portfolio
Replies: 6
Views: 485

Re: Swiss Investor 3 Fund Portfolio

I am located in Switzerland and not sure how to implement a 3 fund ETF portfolio. In particular I am not sure how to calculate the asset allocation in combination with the pension. For those unfamiliar with the swiss system, we have a pension system that consists of 3 different parts: 1. AHV: Manda...
by Valuethinker
Mon Sep 24, 2018 2:50 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: How much is too much in one stock?
Replies: 13
Views: 1436

Re: How much is too much in one stock?

Hi All I just completed moving all of my in-laws funds from Wells Fargo to Vanguard. They are in their 80's with father in-law in cognitive decline. After re-working what I could without tax implications, they now hold a 50/50 portfolio (the bond fund fills their IRAs). One third of their savings i...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 12:14 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Buying Put Options on the S&P 500
Replies: 22
Views: 2039

Re: Buying Put Options on the S&P 500

What about selling cash covered Puts on the S&P? You would get option premium up front. You would have to have cash, in the event someone exercised their option however. Since writing a Put has a theoretically unlimited loss, can you cash cover such an exposure? Isn't the only true hedge to hold th...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 12:11 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Would David Swensen's advice be different if he wrote his book in 2017?
Replies: 9
Views: 1839

Re: Would David Swensen's advice be different if he wrote his book in 2017?

We are now in a period of financial repression, and who knows if or when it will change. What are your thoughts? What do you mean by financial repression? It's a term used to characterize monetary policy since the Great Financial Crash, where interest rates were held below their "normal" level in a...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 8:23 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?
Replies: 12
Views: 868

Re: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?

A more general economics book, "What Would the Great Economists Do?: How Twelve Brilliant Minds Would Solve Today's Biggest Problems", by Linda Yeuh. https://www.amazon.com/What-Would-Great-Economists-Brilliant/dp/1250180538/ Rogoff also compares it to the Heilbroner book. "An extremely engaging su...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 8:23 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?
Replies: 70
Views: 3701

Re: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?

Interesting. I don't know what my place would rent for, but maybe something like $3500. Multiply that by 12 and that's $42K. Maybe the place is worth $700K, so that's 6%. I'd expect that to be double the long term appreciation rate, but obviously things vary, especially lately. If I could know a ho...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:41 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?
Replies: 12
Views: 868

Re: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?

https://www.maynardkeynes.org/keynes-the-speculator.html interesting stuff about JM Keynes as an investor-- he switched from being what we would call a macro speculator (or hedge fund) now to what we now know as Value Investing. And was highly successful. http://www.chrisleithner.ca/newsletter/2016-...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:34 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Buying Put Options on the S&P 500
Replies: 22
Views: 2039

Re: Buying Put Options on the S&P 500

epeterson1970 wrote:
Sat Sep 22, 2018 6:35 pm
What about selling cash covered Puts on the S&P? You would get option premium up front. You would have to have cash, in the event someone exercised their option however.
EDIT: my comment didn't make sense as I confused writing a naked Call (one should never do this) with writing a Put.
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:33 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Buying Put Options on the S&P 500
Replies: 22
Views: 2039

Re: Buying Put Options on the S&P 500

I can't find the source but I recall reading back in the mid-nineties about the Getty Foundation losing $500M on portfolio insurance. The board of directors was convinced the market was about to dump and bought "insurance" which I assumed to be puts on the index. Things went against them. If it was...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:23 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Corporate debt bubble?
Replies: 20
Views: 2398

Re: Corporate debt bubble?

> Govt "net debt" has increased from around 30% GDP to about 80% GDP What does this mean and what are the consequences I think that is net against financial assets governments hold. It gets really complicated, and you can skew the numbers to make whatever argument you want, if you start to include ...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:21 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Corporate debt bubble?
Replies: 20
Views: 2398

Re: Corporate debt bubble?

Did bondholders get bailed out in ~2008 ? Who ate most of the losses from the crisis They did. At least the GM ones did not (c. 10 cents on the dollar). But bank bondholders did, generally. Ireland in particular. But also RBS, HBOS, Citi, AIG, FNMA & FMAC etc. Monte di Paschi di Sienna the latest e...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:12 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?
Replies: 12
Views: 868

Re: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?

Sir John Hicks wrote the best summary of Keynesian economics. "The Worldly Philosophers" by Robert Heilbroner is a good introduction as to how Keynes fits into the intellectual history of economics. Even those refuting Keynes use his terms and basic ideas. Thanks, these are useful references; I am ...
by Valuethinker
Sun Sep 23, 2018 5:25 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?
Replies: 12
Views: 868

Re: What book by Keynes is Mr Bogle referring to here?

Sir John Hicks wrote the best summary of Keynesian economics.

"The Worldly Philosophers" by Robert Heilbroner is a good introduction as to how Keynes fits into the intellectual history of economics.

Even those refuting Keynes use his terms and basic ideas.
by Valuethinker
Sat Sep 22, 2018 10:49 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?
Replies: 70
Views: 3701

Re: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?

1. Shiller goes to a lot of lengths to find like for like properties. The Herengracht (canal in Amsterdam) since 1630s. What Monnery additionally says is that if you don't update, the value of the property falls. 2. New York nearly went bust in 1976. Its recovery since then is sacre mirabile. Londo...
by Valuethinker
Sat Sep 22, 2018 10:20 am
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Change Careers -- slower path to retirement
Replies: 6
Views: 1477

Re: Change Careers -- slower path to retirement

My current thinking is to build up savings at least 2-3 more years for extra security (considering time off work needed to get new degree and risk of finding new job), then consider taking the plunge. If anyone has done something similar, and has any words of warning or encouragement, I’d love to h...
by Valuethinker
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:28 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: S&P sectors are changing
Replies: 8
Views: 658

Re: S&P sectors are changing

And yet it is a common misunderstanding. The financial press reported in 2017, when they decided to elevate REITs into their own sector, that changes in the sector percentages within in the S&P index were going to cause problems for S&P 500 index funds . The real question is why anybody would chang...
by Valuethinker
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:15 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?
Replies: 70
Views: 3701

Re: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?

There will be exceptions of course but most houses from 1890 were torn down long ago or are pretty decrepit now. Well, then also Exxon's oil wells are not the same they were in the 80's... Which plays havoc with house price indices over long periods. There's a renewal expense in housing. Neil Monne...
by Valuethinker
Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:45 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?
Replies: 70
Views: 3701

Re: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?

I never did. Others mentioned REIT returns and I commented they underestimate total RE return, so we agree. Never mean to imply. It was just an aside on the thread that I tacked on at the end. As another aside, I have a hard time believing that established real estate properties have a return close...
by Valuethinker
Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:36 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?
Replies: 70
Views: 3701

Re: Are unleveraged real estate returns more comparable to stock market returns or just a notch above inflation?

There will be exceptions of course but most houses from 1890 were torn down long ago or are pretty decrepit now. Well, then also Exxon's oil wells are not the same they were in the 80's... Which plays havoc with house price indices over long periods. There's a renewal expense in housing. Neil Monne...
by Valuethinker
Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:14 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Can predictions on currency depreciaction be any more accurate than those of the stock market?
Replies: 13
Views: 839

Re: Can predictions on currency depreciaction be any more accurate than those of the stock market?

In your shoes I'd worry more about Italy. The Italian government bond market will have a tipping point, that if crossed, leads to another crisis for the Eurozone. yes I don't own any Bpts (except perhaps in some structured products that I own in small amounts). Would such a Eurozone crisis be likel...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:23 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Can predictions on currency depreciaction be any more accurate than those of the stock market?
Replies: 13
Views: 839

Re: Can predictions on currency depreciaction be any more accurate than those of the stock market?

I know that Bogleheads believe that the stock market is unpredictable, but I was wondering whether other forecasts, such as the one on currency depreciaction Dalio makes at about 12:15 (of the dollar likely losing about 30% in 2020) can be any more accurate? (If you are a non US investor, invested ...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:19 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Can predictions on currency depreciaction be any more accurate than those of the stock market?
Replies: 13
Views: 839

Re: Can predictions on currency depreciaction be any more accurate than those of the stock market?

I've come across this video where Dalio speaks of the economy as of a machine, governed by law of cause and effect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nm0m62reFuY I know that Bogleheads believe that the stock market is unpredictable, but I was wondering whether other forecasts, such as the one on curr...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:56 am
Forum: Investing - Help with Personal Investments
Topic: Robo-advisor Scalable Capital Whitepaper
Replies: 3
Views: 318

Re: Robo-advisor Scalable Capital Whitepaper

Hi all, I'm wondering if anyone else read the Scalable Capital whitepaper ? There are some really interesting points IMO (especially because the marketing BS from the US robo-advisors annoys me; "Nobel-price winning technology" as if anyone is not starting with Markowitz): Value-at-Risk as a better...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:55 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Commodities have never been cheaper - time to buy?
Replies: 46
Views: 4992

Re: Commodities have never been cheaper - time to buy?

Yes, I like commodities now. My portfolio looks something like this: 20% gold 15% crude oil (via long-dated futures) 15% emerging markets equities 10% non-US developed markets equities 25% long term bonds 15% cash The only thing missing from this portfolio is Emerging Market Debt in local currency....
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:13 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: New [Vanguard] environmental, social, governance (ESG) ETFs
Replies: 25
Views: 1727

Re: New environmental, social, governance (ESG) funds

Vanguard launched two new environmental, social, and governance (ESG) funds on Tuesday. Vanguard ESG U.S. Stock ETF (ESGV) Vanguard ESG International Stock ETF (VSGX) filing announcement (6-27-18) https://pressroom.vanguard.com/news/Press-Release-Vanguard-Files-For-Two-New-ESG-ETFS-06272018.html Va...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:35 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Other investment opportunities besides the stock market
Replies: 25
Views: 1886

Re: Other investment opportunities besides the stock market

As far as real estate, the closest I would want to get is the TIAA fund, although I’ve never bought it. In thinking about that fund, would it be completely impractical to offer a real estate state product with a constant NAV and the return varied on revenues and fluctuations in the property values?...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:22 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Why is it so much cheaper to borrow money in Euros?
Replies: 19
Views: 2088

Re: Why is it so much cheaper to borrow money in Euros?

I cannot remember the exact nostrum, but it runs along the lines of: You can have: - free floating exchange rate - no currency controls - independent monetary policy You can have any 2 of those, but not all 3. We live in an era of "dirty floats" (free floating XR with periodic Central Bank intervent...
by Valuethinker
Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:20 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Why is it so much cheaper to borrow money in Euros?
Replies: 19
Views: 2088

Re: Why is it so much cheaper to borrow money in Euros?

There are some opportunities in small countries where the local currency is pegged to the USD, in some cases for several decades. In such countries it sometimes happens that one can get a CD in local currency that pays you more, say, 4%, than the same bank charges you on a USD loan, say, 3%. This i...
by Valuethinker
Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:14 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: Other investment opportunities besides the stock market
Replies: 25
Views: 1886

Re: Other investment opportunities besides the stock market

Drought, also? Do the authorities close car washes when water supply gets tight? It's the opposite in California. Most car washes around me recycle their water and reuse each gallon of water for 4 to 5 washes. According to the article, the most efficient commercial washes use about 2.5 gallons per ...