Search found 468 matches

by fantasytensai
Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:51 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: ESPP purchase doesn't add up
Replies: 12
Views: 1148

Re: ESPP purchase doesn't add up

The only way it makes any sense at all to me is if they charged you a ~$6 commission for purchasing the shares, which would be pretty bizarre. I would expect that all the reports are generated automatically, which makes it so odd that there appears to be a math mistake. I even tried some of the formulas they could have used to get a wrong answer, but still could not match their number. I would be really curious to hear what HR has to say. In all likelihood, this mistake impacts their own ESPP distributions, so the optimist in me thinks they would be happy for someone to ask how they got their numbers. Could it be tax withholdings? Interesting... The amount is in the right ballpark if they were withholding on the money you made off the disc...
by fantasytensai
Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:20 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: ESPP purchase doesn't add up
Replies: 12
Views: 1148

Re: ESPP purchase doesn't add up

regularguy455 wrote: Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:17 pm My ESPP takes the average daily price on the final trading day, not the closing price. Maybe that’s what’s going on?
I'm pretty sure that's not. They clearly labeled the "purchase price"
by fantasytensai
Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:13 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: ESPP purchase doesn't add up
Replies: 12
Views: 1148

Re: ESPP purchase doesn't add up

Iridium wrote: Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:52 pm The only way it makes any sense at all to me is if they charged you a ~$6 commission for purchasing the shares, which would be pretty bizarre.

I would expect that all the reports are generated automatically, which makes it so odd that there appears to be a math mistake. I even tried some of the formulas they could have used to get a wrong answer, but still could not match their number.

I would be really curious to hear what HR has to say. In all likelihood, this mistake impacts their own ESPP distributions, so the optimist in me thinks they would be happy for someone to ask how they got their numbers.
Could it be tax withholdings?
by fantasytensai
Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:46 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: ESPP purchase doesn't add up
Replies: 12
Views: 1148

Re: ESPP purchase doesn't add up

Hi guys, I just made my first ESPP purchase. Basically, it's a very mediocre one with 5% discount, but still better than nothing. But I just saw my first transaction and something doesn't add up. Date FMV Purchase Amount Purchase Price Shares Purchased 15 Oct 2018 PURCHASE 141.2000 359.83 134.1400 2.638 134.14 is a 5% discount from 141.2, that's correct. But for $359.83, divided by $134.14 purchase price, there should be 2.682 shares, not 2.638. Did I miss something here with my lack of understanding of ESPP? Would greatly appreciate it if a seasoned investor could let me know. Thanks! Is there any fees associated with the purchase?? It was never disclosed that there would be, but that would appear to be it. That would be really deceptive ...
by fantasytensai
Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:35 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: ESPP purchase doesn't add up
Replies: 12
Views: 1148

ESPP purchase doesn't add up

Hi guys, I just made my first ESPP purchase. Basically, it's a very mediocre one with 5% discount, but still better than nothing. But I just saw my first transaction and something doesn't add up.

Date FMV Purchase Amount Purchase Price Shares Purchased
15 Oct 2018 PURCHASE 141.2000 359.83 134.1400 2.638

134.14 is a 5% discount from 141.2, that's correct. But for $359.83, divided by $134.14 purchase price, there should be 2.682 shares, not 2.638. Did I miss something here with my lack of understanding of ESPP? Would greatly appreciate it if a seasoned investor could let me know. Thanks!
by fantasytensai
Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:51 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: ESPP Discount Tax in plain English
Replies: 4
Views: 1091

Re: ESPP Discount Tax in plain English

Iridium wrote: Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:44 pm There are two different definitions of bargain element TurboTax neglected to mention:

Qualifying: Market price at end of purchase period - price paid
Disqualifying: Market price at beginning of purchase period - price paid

The benefit is subtle, but since stock prices rise over time, the qualifying definition is the more beneficial one a majority of the time.
Thanks, that explains it.

You should write for Turbotax. You would think that they can add one important freakin sentence when marketing such a popular product lol.
by fantasytensai
Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:23 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: ESPP Discount Tax in plain English
Replies: 4
Views: 1091

ESPP Discount Tax in plain English

Hi, I have been doing some research on ESPP taxation on the discount portion - for instance, a $100 stock discounted 15% would yield a $15 discount. I have been reading up on Qualifying Disposition v. Disqualifying Disposition, based on how long you hold the stock, and the explanation online is simply sorely lacking. I was hoping someone here can clarify. For example, here is the excerpt from TurboTax: Disqualifying disposition: You sold the stock within two years after the offering date or one year or less from the exercise (purchase date). In this case, your employer will report the bargain element as compensation on your Form W-2, so you will have to pay taxes on that amount as ordinary income. The bargain element is the difference betwe...
by fantasytensai
Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:12 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Reverse Mortgages - Pros, Cons
Replies: 55
Views: 5756

Re: Reverse Mortgages - Pros, Cons

I have no kids, and do not plan on having any. For me, a reverse mortgage may not be a bad idea, if I can get a fair valuation.
by fantasytensai
Fri Sep 14, 2018 1:52 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?
Replies: 15
Views: 2207

Re: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?

Update: I did nothing since both contributions posted on the same date. Weird. Hopefully just a one time thing.
by fantasytensai
Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:45 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?
Replies: 15
Views: 2207

Re: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?

Thanks for the information. The actual pay date is 8/15. So they are already late. I think I can go to DoL now then. Then 8/24 was their required transmittal date to Empower. Giving transmittal times to Empower and deposit times. They are no more than a couple days late at this time. I don't know if I would go to DOL over a few days. You do not even know at this point if Empower might be the problem. I would contact HR before I would go nuclear (DOL) on them. Why do they give more time for big companies to comply? Shouldn't it be the other way around? They don't necessarily give more time to large employers. The 7 business days for small business is a safe harbor . A larger company has no safe harbor, they can actually be expected to take ...
by fantasytensai
Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:18 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?
Replies: 15
Views: 2207

Re: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?

The 15th business day of September 2018 is the 24th. That is the maximum that a large employer can take even with sufficient justification. The actual rule is, that the employer must transmit the contribution as soon as it can reasonably segregate the contributions from the businesses other funds. There is a special small employer (< 100 employees) 7 business day safe harbor rule. A small employer must report on Form 5500 Schdule I each and every occurrence where they missed this deadline. Your 8/1 -8/15 contributions should have been transmitted to Empower no later than 7 business days after the pay date of the 8/1 - 8/15 pay period. Depending on whether they pay Empower by check or ACH, this could easily take 2- 5 business days. When was...
by fantasytensai
Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:57 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?
Replies: 15
Views: 2207

Re: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?

Is there a way to deal with this situation without being the squeaky wheel? My general life strategy is to lie low and not attract attention. I may contact DoL but withhold my own personal information. If my employer is late in contribution, is the mess on their hands or mine? I don't really mind missing out on a couple of months worth of market gains, just want to make sure everything is there eventually.

Appreciate the help guys!
by fantasytensai
Wed Sep 05, 2018 3:13 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?
Replies: 15
Views: 2207

Delay in 401k Contribution Posting, cause for concern?

My employer (small-med company, 50-100 employees) has always been lax in posting 401k contributions. But lately it has gotten worse and worse. It used to be that there would be about a 5 day delay in posting (i.e. 1/1-1/15 contribution would post around 1/20). Then it became 10 days. Now, it has gotten long enough to cause me concern of potentially running afoul of the DoL regulations. My contribution from 8/1 to 8/15 still has not posted, and under DoL regulations if it is not posted by the 15th business day of September (9/20), there would be a messy situation. I know it's only 9/5, but I have close to zero confidence that my employer would post both the 8/1 to 8/15 and the 8/15 to 8/31 contribution before 9/20 (when both are due). To mak...
by fantasytensai
Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:18 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

ColoRetiredGirl wrote: Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:02 pm
invst65 wrote: Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:34 am
JoeRetire wrote: Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:03 pm
Rupert wrote: Fri Aug 10, 2018 2:39 pm That's exactly the point I kept trying to impress upon OP in my posts above without getting into politics. See https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigr ... ts-n897931
Yup.
Maybe things will work out in spite of all that.
The optics in that NBC story are quite interesting.
The words “self-sufficient” jumped off the page in this article for me. OP, what occupation or skills does she have to bolster her job opportunities?
She's a dance instructor who will have a hard time teaching when she's in her 60s...I believe that SSI and Medicaid is the best option. Of course if things change, I will adapt.
by fantasytensai
Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:48 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

After 5 years on the green card she will become a citizen. Is there anything saying she can't apply for SSI and medicaid? And medicare through SSI? Well said. If she has less than 3K in asssets, 65+ age, low income(check specific number), she will be eligible for Medicaid if her green card is 5 year old. If she is a US citizen (which she will be after 5 years of GC), and all other above conditions (3K assets, low income) she can get SSI for $550 per month. She can also get EBT (food stamps) benefits when she gets Medicaid. So if she is poor and can survive first five years she is fine. In many states like CA, NY state will provide state funded Medicaid to new immigrants provided they are poor. That is you don’t have to wait for five years....
by fantasytensai
Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:46 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Response from boss re: market analysis
Replies: 71
Views: 9180

Re: Rude response from boss re: market adjustment

I always thought that if you are a critical employee, management will take care of you(money/title/work etc). If you are not, then you are deceiving yourself wasting time over talking to somebody - has this worked for anyone??? With HR??? 😄 - They get reviewed based on for how less they can hold you. So, a) Be critical to company or b) Be happy with what you get or c) Leave the job In your case the clear option is c) - its rare to get such a direct answer. To be clear, being a "critical", meaning "vital" employee will result you having leverage and requesting additional benefits, including compensation, from your employer. However, being a "critical", meaning "like to critique" employee will result y...
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:04 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

kenoryan wrote: Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:39 pm After 5 years on the green card she will become a citizen. Is there anything saying she can't apply for SSI and medicaid? And medicare through SSI?
Thank you! That is a much more straightforward method! This will be perfect for my MiL since she has no assets and likely no income when she turns 65.
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:58 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

OAG wrote: Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:46 pm 1099 means she has to pay her own SS/MC taxes on the income IN ADDITION to the Employers side of the taxes (this would be a Self-Employment situation). Basically the employment taxes are the same as if she works for you (W2 employee). I think in either case the situation may get tedious as time proceeds.
Yes I know and I will make sure she pays all the taxes of course.
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:43 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

Is there a down side to this? Yes, it may be in violation of US tax law and/or SS rules. Please review carefully Pub 926 for household employees (she will be one in my opinion). It is not clear to me that the wages you pay your MIL will count as SS wages. Given that not caring for my MiL is not an option, paying 50-60k over 10 years to ensure that she has at least some sort of safety net is a pretty good tradeoff, right? How old is MIL? If MIL does not work for 30 years the SS "safety net" will place her well below poverty level (even at current benefit levels which may change). This may be more trouble than it is worth. I much prefer other poster's suggestion about maintaining foreign citizenship/dual citizenship and allowing MI...
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:06 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

I'm not afraid of an IRS challenge. I hire my MiL to provide a service. I don't dictate her hours, or tell her what to do. I just request that she spends 3 hours a week cleaning my house. If that's not a 1099 relationship, I don't know what is. She has no medical issues right now. I was simply anticipating for when people get old they need medical care. In the 10 years leading up to retirement I will be buying her insurance. Smells like a sham 1099 relationship to me. Just do the right thing, which is treat her as a W2 employee and pay the required taxes. Why in the world would you risk her immigration status (especially in today's climate) over this? Sincerely curious. What exactly is a legitimate 1099 relationship? She's going to clean y...
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:53 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

UnitaryExecutive wrote: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:51 pm We're in a similar situation where my in-laws want to move to the US and we'd have to subsidize health care, life, or both. They have ~800k in assets but spend significantly more than that amount of passive income and are pretty financially illiterate and won't listen when we try to plan with them.

We were also trying to figure out how to get them Medicare or get them enough work to qualify for it.
The good thing with my MiL is that she is very good natured and will listen to us and trusts us. Just trying to find the best path.
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:49 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

JoeRetire wrote: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:24 pm Has MIL already gotten a green card?
Not yet, currently in the process
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:46 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

Rupert wrote: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:41 pm
fantasytensai wrote: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:21 pm I'm not afraid of an IRS challenge. I hire my MiL to provide a service. I don't dictate her hours, or tell her what to do. I just request that she spends 3 hours a week cleaning my house. If that's not a 1099 relationship, I don't know what is.

She has no medical issues right now. I was simply anticipating for when people get old they need medical care. In the 10 years leading up to retirement I will be buying her insurance.
Smells like a sham 1099 relationship to me. Just do the right thing, which is treat her as a W2 employee and pay the required taxes. Why in the world would you risk her immigration status (especially in today's climate) over this?
Sincerely curious. What exactly is a legitimate 1099 relationship?
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:21 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Re: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

I'm not afraid of an IRS challenge. I hire my MiL to provide a service. I don't dictate her hours, or tell her what to do. I just request that she spends 3 hours a week cleaning my house. If that's not a 1099 relationship, I don't know what is.

She has no medical issues right now. I was simply anticipating for when people get old they need medical care. In the 10 years leading up to retirement I will be buying her insurance.
by fantasytensai
Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:04 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence
Replies: 34
Views: 3655

Plan for Parental Care in my road to financial independence

My wife and I have agreed to take care of my Mother in Law when she is older. The question is how to do it in a way that does not greatly impede our path to FI, which we hope to achieve in 10-15 years (currently 30). So I came up with a plan. My MiL will be immigrating to the US sometime in the coming year. She will be a green card holder for 5 years then become a citizen via naturalization. She has no assets and no income. My plan is to make sure that she has at least access to minimum social security benefits, and more importantly, Medicare coverage, after 10 years. The plan is to hire my MiL as a 1099 contractor to help out with house cleaning and babysitting. She will be living with us rent free. I plan on paying her the federal minimum...
by fantasytensai
Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:17 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: How to bring up this issue with your boss? (firm failure to contribute employer match)
Replies: 6
Views: 999

How to bring up this issue with your boss? (firm failure to contribute employer match)

So I work for a 50-100 employee law firm (total employees, not just lawyers). The firm has a sucky, but not horrendous 401(k) match - 3% of salary, vesting 25% each year over 4 years. I have now been employed for about 15 months here.

I realize that the first 25% of the match still has not posted to my 401(k) account. I call up the 401k administrators and they tell me that it is not an issue on their end. Rather, it is my employer who still has not put in the match. I'm looking to bring this issue up with one of the principals of the firm (HR doesn't know anything). How should I approach this situation gently to make sure I get what I am owed, but also not to embarrass anyone?
by fantasytensai
Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:39 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?
Replies: 89
Views: 10411

Re: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?

28fe6 wrote: Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:34 pm About 42%, but I max my ESPP. If I add the ESPP escrow back in, which is 15% of gross pay, then it would be about 57%. Not maxing anything except HSA.
Out of curiosity, why not max 401k?
by fantasytensai
Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:18 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?
Replies: 89
Views: 10411

Re: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?

luminous wrote: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:17 pm take home/gross = 37%

I am maxing out pre-tax 401k and mega backdoor Roth, and I have a small FSA contribution as well.
That's brutal! But at least if you are maxing out the MBR, that's 55k right there, 110k if 2p, so that makes sense.
by fantasytensai
Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:17 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?
Replies: 89
Views: 10411

Re: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?

PFInterest wrote: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:12 pm i am confused as to the purpose of this exercise.
but here goes
take home/gross = 65%

however that was different from last week as this is my first paycheck without 401k contributions deducted.
The purpose, to be brutally honest, is that when I did the calculations for myself and saw that I was only taking home less than 55% of my take home pay, I was a little shocked, and wanted to see if this is normal.

Thanks for your numbers. I was was hoping more for a yearly summary, but this is helpful as well.
by fantasytensai
Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:09 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?
Replies: 89
Views: 10411

Re: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?

yatesd wrote: Sun Jun 03, 2018 7:58 pm I'm not sure the results will be meaningful. Too many variables. Short term/long term disability, benefits, HSA, 401K, life insurance, people saving for a flex account etc.
I disagree, I think it will be very meaningful. Why not just tell us if you maxed out HSA, 401k, etc? Life insurance and disability premiums are usually negligible amounts.
by fantasytensai
Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:08 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?
Replies: 89
Views: 10411

Re: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?

PharmerBrown wrote: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:06 pm
fantasytensai wrote: Sun Jun 03, 2018 7:52 pm
For the purposes of this survey, take home pay is the actual amount of cash deposited into your bank account each payroll, so if you get paid bi-weekly, it is your bi-weekly pay X 24. It is NOT the W-2 wage referred to on your 1040 form.
There are typically 26 paychecks each year if you are paid bi-weekly.
Changed, thanks!
by fantasytensai
Sun Jun 03, 2018 7:52 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?
Replies: 89
Views: 10411

What is your Take Home Pay / Gross Pay ratio?

For those of us still in the corporate grind, especially the W-2ers, I was curious what your typical take home pay / gross pay ratio is. I feel that this is one of the less invasive questions on the sub since it's asking for a percentage rather than a number. For the purposes of this survey, take home pay is the actual amount of cash deposited into your bank account each payroll, so if you get paid bi-weekly, it is your bi-weekly pay X 26. If you are paid twice a month, it would be X 24. It is NOT the W-2 wage referred to on your 1040 form. To keep things as simple as possible, let's not include bonuses. Also, it would be helpful to include if you receive a big refund (meaning you withheld too much), or owed taxes (withheld too little). I w...
by fantasytensai
Thu May 24, 2018 10:46 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

Wait, does 1 share of VBTLX give the same yield regardless of its NAV? If so what you say make sense, NAV doesn't matter. I had no idea that's how it worked. I always assumed that 1 share of VBTLX at a NAV of $30 will give off more dividend per month than 1 share of VBTLX at a NAV of $20. Not exactly. Fund distributions are not necessarily exactly consistent from month to month even under conditions where you don't expect a change on average and where the NAV is constant, even beyond the number of days in a month being different. So they will not be exactly the same generally, regardless of NAV. Bond fund NAV can drift over time while changing distributions because of drops from downgrades and selling bonds early that are not recovered. Th...
by fantasytensai
Thu May 24, 2018 9:29 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

Because the interest earned on the bonds keeps going up also. I like getting a raise, even though I am not working. How are you getting a raise? The yield goes up on the bond funds, but the NAV goes down, so you earn a larger percentage of a smaller amount. Isn't it a wash, and you get pretty much the same amount for a long time? If you need to sell, you are worse off because the NAV went down. I don't need to sell- for 7 years. My duration is less than that!! I will make up all of the loss capital with the increase in interest rates. At that point, I am getting a raise as my assets are paying me a higher interest rate. And I have owned these bond funds for years as the NAV went up due to decreasing rates. It makes no difference which way ...
by fantasytensai
Thu May 24, 2018 9:25 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX up 3%

livesoft wrote: Thu May 24, 2018 8:57 pm When this thread was started with its fake title, VTSAX was up 3% YTD and not down 0.23%. May I ask where "down 0.23%" came from please?
https://www.google.com/search?q=vtsax&r ... e&ie=UTF-8

Market Summary > Vanguard Total Stock Market Index Fund Admiral Shares
MUTF: VTSAX
68.69 USD +0.21 (0.31%)
May 23 · Disclaimer

YTD return -0.23%
Net assets 191.09B
Front load -
Yield (ttm) 1.74%
Expense ratio 0.040%
Financial news, comparisons and more
by fantasytensai
Thu May 24, 2018 5:19 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

So you care about short-term bond fluctuations, but you take the long view on stocks? He's saying that in 10 years the fact that the bond fund is down 2% this year won't matter, just like the fact a stock fund could go down 30% this year doesn't matter to you... Because you're thinking 10 year returns, not 5 month returns. Does this make sense to you? You're pointing out a short-term 2% loss in bond funds as a reason not to invest in them, but you're okay if stock funds drop because you're a long-term investor. You're not being consistent. Something to note... Bond funds are self-correcting. The reason the NAV is down is because the yield is increasing. So they are starting to pay larger and larger dividends, which over time, will make up ...
by fantasytensai
Thu May 24, 2018 5:16 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: NY Insurance Costs on the Rise
Replies: 21
Views: 2799

Re: NY Insurance Costs on the Rise

I live on Long Island, too, and allowed Liberty Mutual to [take advantage of me --admin LadyGeek] on premiums for years. Very long time customer with no claims which I thought would qualify me for a rate break. Absolutely the opposite. When I complained they absolutely refused to budge on premiums. Their solution was for me to cut down the amount of my coverage and raise my deductibles. So I shopped rates with Amica, and the Hartford. Though Amica was lower than Liberty, the Hartford was much lower to the the tune of about 40% for bundled, auto, home and umbrella They also increased the amount of my home coverage by about $125,000 and doubled up my umbrella to 2 million for less money than I paid Liberty for $1 million. The lesson here? Sh...
by fantasytensai
Thu May 24, 2018 4:19 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

If you have an investment horizon greater than ten years, and don't plan to sell your holdings in that timeframe, what does it matter what the NAV does? In fact, if you're reinvesting dividends, the greater dividend yield of bond funds combined with lower NAV would seem to be reason to prefer holding them versus stock funds, rather than a reason to shun them in favor of stock funds. What am I missing? I mean, is this serious? Why does NAV matter? The reason to invest is to make money. If you started out the year with 100k of VBILX at $11.33 a share. Today, on May 15, 2018 the NAV is $10.85. That means your 100k is now worth 95.76k, or a loss of more than 4k. Let's be generous and say that the yield is 3% for the year, that means in 5 month...
by fantasytensai
Fri May 18, 2018 1:10 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Insight Card (APY 5%) full personal review
Replies: 63
Views: 9374

Re: Insight Card (APY 5%) full personal review

BogleMelon wrote: Fri May 18, 2018 12:46 pm
fantasytensai wrote: Fri May 18, 2018 12:44 pm Just as a FYI since there are some conflicting reporting here, the 5% you earn is ONLY on the $5000. Any interest that you earn will stay in the $5000 saving account, but WILL NOT earn 5% interest on top.
There is a reddit post that assure that the interest stays there earn interest. Some people did the math and posted it. But I am out anyways
It doesn't. Do your own math and you will see.
by fantasytensai
Fri May 18, 2018 12:44 pm
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Insight Card (APY 5%) full personal review
Replies: 63
Views: 9374

Re: Insight Card (APY 5%) full personal review

Just as a FYI since there are some conflicting reporting here, the 5% you earn is ONLY on the $5000. Any interest that you earn will stay in the $5000 saving account, but WILL NOT earn 5% interest on top.
by fantasytensai
Thu May 17, 2018 11:39 am
Forum: Personal Finance (Not Investing)
Topic: Is it worth quitting my private-sector job and taking a government job so I can invest in the 457 account, too?
Replies: 15
Views: 2486

Re: Is it worth quitting my private-sector job and taking a government job so I can invest in the 457 account, too?

Assuming the paycut is not too significant, and you plan on working for the next 10+ years to vest your pension, I would do it for the pension alone.
by fantasytensai
Thu May 17, 2018 9:25 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

It appears that nobody is understanding the point that I am trying to make. When this many people are not getting it, it must be my fault. I will try one more time in the simplist terms possible, and if I still fail, I'm giving up. 1. Everyone is quick to point out that yield is increasing. But THE DROP IN NAV IS MUCH MORE THAN THE INCREASE IN YIELD. You start with $100. You lose $20 but gain $10. That's NOT good. 2. Everyone is also quick to point out that you have to look at the long term - 10 years rather than 5 months. But over a period of 10 years, owning 100% stocks has a much greater ceiling than 80/20, or even 90/10. The risks with stocks is almost always within shorter durations. Yes, we are all stupid. I remember a while back you...
by fantasytensai
Thu May 17, 2018 9:01 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

It appears that nobody is understanding the point that I am trying to make. When this many people are not getting it, it must be my fault. I will try one more time in the simplist terms possible, and if I still fail, I'm giving up.

1. Everyone is quick to point out that yield is increasing. But THE DROP IN NAV IS MUCH MORE THAN THE INCREASE IN YIELD. You start with $100. You lose $20 but gain $10. That's NOT good.

2. Everyone is also quick to point out that you have to look at the long term - 10 years rather than 5 months. But over a period of 10 years, owning 100% stocks has a much greater ceiling than 80/20, or even 90/10. The risks with stocks is almost always within shorter durations.
by fantasytensai
Wed May 16, 2018 8:23 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

If your investment horizon is over ten years, there is absolutely no reason to own bond funds right now. VBTLX has a 2.64% dividend yield, while VBILX has 2.76%. VTSAX has 1.74%. Why chase the less than 1% difference in yield, when bond funds have fallen so much harder than VTSAX? If you have an investment horizon greater than ten years, and don't plan to sell your holdings in that timeframe, what does it matter what the NAV does? In fact, if you're reinvesting dividends, the greater dividend yield of bond funds combined with lower NAV would seem to be reason to prefer holding them versus stock funds, rather than a reason to shun them in favor of stock funds. What am I missing? I mean, is this serious? Why does NAV matter? The reason to in...
by fantasytensai
Tue May 15, 2018 10:09 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

letsgobobby wrote: Tue May 15, 2018 9:39 pm
fantasytensai wrote: Tue May 15, 2018 11:47 am If your investment horizon is over ten years, there is absolutely no reason to own bond funds right now. VBTLX has a 2.64% dividend yield, while VBILX has 2.76%. VTSAX has 1.74%. Why chase the less than 1% difference in yield, when bond funds have fallen so much harder than VTSAX?

In the event of a market crash, bonds will lose less value, sure. But if your investment horizon is ten years, and you are financially sound, you don't need to sell bonds to buy stocks on the cheap.

Bonds funds are supposed to provide volatility while offering reduced performance. If they fail at that, there is no reason to have them.
Bonds are more attractive relative to stocks than they've been in a long, long time.
bonds or bond funds?
by fantasytensai
Tue May 15, 2018 10:08 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

If your investment horizon is over ten years, there is absolutely no reason to own bond funds right now. VBTLX has a 2.64% dividend yield, while VBILX has 2.76%. VTSAX has 1.74%. Why chase the less than 1% difference in yield, when bond funds have fallen so much harder than VTSAX? If you have an investment horizon greater than ten years, and don't plan to sell your holdings in that timeframe, what does it matter what the NAV does? In fact, if you're reinvesting dividends, the greater dividend yield of bond funds combined with lower NAV would seem to be reason to prefer holding them versus stock funds, rather than a reason to shun them in favor of stock funds. What am I missing? I mean, is this serious? Why does NAV matter? The reason to in...
by fantasytensai
Tue May 15, 2018 1:29 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

Are you selling swaps in the event stocks underperform bonds over arbitrary 10-year periods? Bonds are there useful because stocks can and have previously gone through extremely brutal sustained drawdowns. I may be wrong but I don't believe VTSAX has undergone any 10 year segments where the price went down , and the upsides are so much higher. Looking at this post we have had negative real return periods as long as 20 years. I believe the 10 year period ended in February of 2009. Lately, we've seen a lot of discussion revolving around expected returns from equities. This is obviously unpredictable, but history can give us a lot of insight into the possibilities. As Mark Twain said, "History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme.&qu...
by fantasytensai
Tue May 15, 2018 12:15 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

livesoft wrote: Tue May 15, 2018 12:07 pm Don't look now then because BND is trading down more than 0.4% today! ;)

That means that if one rebalances into VBTLX today, then they will outperform VBTLX for 2018 by about 2.75%. That's simply Amazing! to be able to outperform a bond fund by that amount with a similar bond fund.

BTW, bond funds like VBTLX don't move by 0.5% in a day, so today could be somewhat of an RBD for VBTLX.
Can you explain how buying VBTLX today will outperform it by 2.75%?

Edit: wow just noticed the 0.50% drop on BND too. Now VBTLX is dropping as much as VTSAX on a bad day. I can't even sell VBTLX to buy VTSAX...talk about being 100% useless.

Edit: fixed to 0.50%. Thanks livesoft!
by fantasytensai
Tue May 15, 2018 12:08 pm
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

HomerJ wrote: Tue May 15, 2018 12:06 pm
fantasytensai wrote: Tue May 15, 2018 11:59 ambut I don't believe VTSAX has undergone any 10 year segments where the price went down
Oh, are you saying it's impossible then? Because it hasn't happened yet?

And what if you need the money before 10 years? Are you saying it's impossible to lose one's job as well?
I mean, if that is your entire argument, then for many people, no, there is no reason to hold bond funds.
by fantasytensai
Tue May 15, 2018 11:59 am
Forum: Investing - Theory, News & General
Topic: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%
Replies: 106
Views: 17769

Re: YTD: VBTLX down 2.28%; VBILX down 2.99%; VTSAX down 0.23%

triceratop wrote: Tue May 15, 2018 11:54 am Are you selling swaps in the event stocks underperform bonds over arbitrary 10-year periods?

Bonds are there useful because stocks can and have previously gone through extremely brutal sustained drawdowns.
I may be wrong but I don't believe VTSAX has undergone any 10 year segments where the price went down, and the upsides are so much higher.