M* to Launch Upgraded Message Boards

Non-investing personal finance issues including insurance, credit, real estate, taxes, employment and legal issues such as trusts and wills

M* to Launch Upgraded Message Boards

Postby bob90245 » Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:26 pm

M* to Launch Upgraded Message Boards. Click HERE

New Discuss area coming next week! Community Watch
M*_Darrin | 09-07-07| 12:12 PM| Total Replies: 0
I am pleased to report that next week we will be launching a significant upgrade to the Conversations area. A video will be prominently displayed on the new site introducing all of the new features.

We are tentatively planning to close the Conversations area briefly on Wednesday in the very early morning hours. During that time we will migrate all of the old posts to the new system, then will re-launch with the new Discuss area. If you find your bookmarks do not work on Wednesday morning, click the Discuss tab on Morningstar.com to see the new site.

I am excited to share our hard work with you and look forward to your comments on the new site!

Thanks,

M*_Darrin

NOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I shudder to think that the many links on my website to M*'s various message boards will all be broken.

[Big heavy sigh] :(
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Postby jebmke » Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:53 pm

Great ... there goes the neighborhood.
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M*Upgrade

Postby Judsen » Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:10 pm

Why is it whenever I hear new and improved I always think "new and unproven"? Guess it's just change resistance as usual for me.
I'm really looking forward to the new features with both hope and optimism.
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Postby Dino » Fri Sep 07, 2007 7:46 pm

Does that mean we won't have to shell out 5 dollars to post there? Wishful thinking. I do hope it is really an improvement.

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Postby Murray Boyd » Fri Sep 07, 2007 7:59 pm

As someone who's been doing web programming since 1994, let me tell you, there's no excuse for breaking links, ever. It's just laziness, stupidity, or arrogant disdain.
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Postby Alex Frakt » Sat Sep 08, 2007 12:04 am

Murray Boyd wrote:As someone who's been doing web programming since 1994, let me tell you, there's no excuse for breaking links, ever.

This is obviously going to break the M* listings on the diehards.org homepage until we have a chance to do some reprogramming. The guy in charge has sent me a couple of e-mails and he is promising a working RSS feed from the start that we can probably repurpose, so with a bit of luck the downtime won't be too long.
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Good news

Postby cfs » Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:32 pm

Good news.

Change is good.

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Postby jeff mc » Tue Sep 11, 2007 7:11 pm

well, let me be the first to weigh in on the new m* forum software....

i hate it and i love it

they've done some things that are really good and improved, yet done some things that i find unappealing.

sure, it'll take some getting used to, but i think it should work out. hopefully, they can fix some of these initial bugs and speed issues asap.

oh, wait... you want me to actually see the new board before commenting? fine. but i stand my this initial review :wink:

actually, just wanted to bump this up so people realize what's going on.

i won't repeat my earlier thoughts on the beta version... but i will say that i just peaked at the beta forum, and it's unchanged from the initial preview. my biggest complaint then was 'screen space'... look at the blue box... that's where the 'content' fits. how big is that? about 5% of the screen? everything else is fluff, ads, or unneeded banners.

regardless, it'll be an interesting week in bogleland (or is it boglestan? or bogleton? or boglania?) (my boglania has a first name... it's J. A. C. K... my boglania has a second name, it's M. O. N. E. Y.)

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Postby CyberBob » Wed Sep 12, 2007 11:11 am

chuck D wrote:...the new m* forum software...

They reverted back to the old boards.
Apparently they are delaying the new boards by at least one day, to Thursday Sep 13.

Is it still going to cost $5?

Bob
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Postby stratton » Wed Sep 12, 2007 1:26 pm

Is it still going to cost $5?

I haven't paid $5 to post on the old boards and I won't on the new ones.

Paul
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Postby Target2019 » Wed Sep 12, 2007 1:47 pm

CyberBob wrote:
chuck D wrote:...the new m* forum software...

They reverted back to the old boards.
Apparently they are delaying the new boards by at least one day, to Thursday Sep 13.

Is it still going to cost $5?

I think that was a one-time fee. If I had to pay again, I would decline. It looks like more ad space, and less content on a page.
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Postby Sunny Sarkar » Wed Sep 12, 2007 2:22 pm

chuck D wrote:i hate it and i love it

they've done some things that are really good and improved, yet done some things that i find unappealing.

sure, it'll take some getting used to, but i think it should work out. hopefully, they can fix some of these initial bugs and speed issues asap.

oh, wait... you want me to actually see the new board before commenting?


Chuck,

If there's ever a Bogleheads magazine, please make yourself available for the astrology page. Your cold reading skills are excellent.

"I see a heart problem with a father-figure in your family, a father, a grandfather, an uncle, a cousin... I'm definitively seeing chest pain here for a father-figure in your family."

"You have a box of old unsorted photographs in your house."

"Most of the time you are positive and cheerful, but there has been a time in the past where you were very upset."
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Postby bob90245 » Wed Sep 12, 2007 4:27 pm

An update:

4. Links
xdickben| 09-12-07 | 12:17 PM
Just posted this on the Morningstar.com board, and will look for a response there. But thought I would also bring up my concern here.

Darrin,

There has been talk of "broken links" due to the upcoming changes in the Discuss area. Could you describe what this means.

If we have a conversation number, will we still be able to reach that conversation using that number? Do we need to download and save favorite conversations before this change occurs?

Dick


5. Hello xdickben
M*_Darrin| 09-12-07 | 12:56 PM
All old conversations have been ported over to the new system, as well as the conversation numbers. So if you do a search for an old conversation number, the thread will come up.

We are also working on making it so old bookmarks/old links will still work and will automatically be redirected to the new thread on the new site. We hope to have that redirect feature working by tomorrow, but it is somewhat complex so it may be delayed by a few days. So don't delete your bookmarks just yet :)

Thanks,

M*_Darrin

Keeping my fingers crossed and hoping this will all work. I'll give M*Darrin the benefit of the doubt for the "few days delay" he says it might take.
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gimmicky new board at the *

Postby FEDFERS » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:54 am

sigh - reply #s are missing and replies are in reverse order, latest reply on top of the thread. don't see an option as on other boards to change back to first reply at top of thread - really don't like that at all. doesn't feel streamlined or intuitive. don't care for the lost space at left margin: users and tags. tags - they're not my tags.
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Postby Gekko » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:34 am

the changes are TERRIBLE in my opinion.

orange color
poor indexation of threads
slower load time

terrible
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Is this right?

Postby petrico » Thu Sep 13, 2007 7:22 am

Are we really limited to reviewing only up to 30 days of posts without having a post # or using a search on the new M* forum?

(Each individual POST is numbered, not threads. Will we be into 8 digits soon?)
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Postby gkaplan » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:25 am

I got this response when I clicked on one of the links in the Diehards.org M* site.

Server Error in '/NewSocialize' Application.
The resource cannot be found.
Description: HTTP 404. The resource you are looking for (or one of its dependencies) could have been removed, had its name changed, or is temporarily unavailable. Please review the following URL and make sure that it is spelled correctly.

Requested URL: /NewSocialize/Asp/FullConv.asp

Version Information: Microsoft .NET Framework Version:2.0.50727.42; ASP.NET Version:2.0.50727.210
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Yikes

Postby Petrocelli » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:52 am

I have gotten several error messages already.

I don't like the interface, but I will use it for a week or so (when, if ever, the board is working) and make a decision then.
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Re: gimmicky new board at the *

Postby tfb » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:57 am

FEDFERS wrote:sigh - reply #s are missing and replies are in reverse order, latest reply on top of the thread. don't see an option as on other boards to change back to first reply at top of thread - really don't like that at all. doesn't feel streamlined or intuitive. don't care for the lost space at left margin: users and tags. tags - they're not my tags.


The reverse chronological order is terrible. Conversations don't happen that way. You read a reply and you have no clue what was said before.
Harry Sit, taking a break from the forums.
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Re: gimmicky new board at the *

Postby jeff mc » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:05 am

tfb wrote:The reverse chronological order is terrible. Conversations don't happen that way. You read a reply and you have no clue what was said before.

!dlrow wen evarb…margorp eht htiw teg tsuj ot deen uoy, llew
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I like the new forum

Postby cfs » Thu Sep 13, 2007 11:07 am

I like the new look and feel, now what I need to do is to LEARN how to navigate my way around it .... this will take some time. Patience please!

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Ugh

Postby TimDex » Thu Sep 13, 2007 1:34 pm

I don't like the reverse chrono. order either.

First impression of the new boards is that it's very fancy, but will take a little time to get used to. I'm not entirely sure I want to spend the time, as I found this board immediately to be easy to navigate.

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Re: Ugh

Postby CyberBob » Thu Sep 13, 2007 1:49 pm

TimDex wrote:First impression of the new boards is that it's very fancy, but will take a little time to get used to. I'm not entirely sure I want to spend the time, as I found this board immediately to be easy to navigate.

That's kind of what I was thinking too. There are fewer posts to read over there anyway. On most days, there are 50-60% fewer posts at Morningstar than here. (according to Diehards.org numbers)

Bob
Last edited by CyberBob on Thu Sep 13, 2007 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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mixed reaction

Postby hollowcave2 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 1:50 pm

I basically like the new format, especially the edit feature, but I am finding it a bit more difficult to navigate. For instance, I posted a post in the new Options forum, but my post doesn't show up when the listing of All posts is displayed on the overview page. So there's bugs to work out yet.

But I'm hopeful those issues will be resolved. We have this forum, anyway.

And, it was the creation of THIS forum that finally inspired M* to improve their format. Competition is good after all.

Steve
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Postby jebmke » Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:40 pm

Quite busy and confusing at first. Will give it a try for a while but likely drop the "old board" and stay here mostly.
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Postby George » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:40 pm

A year late and five-dollars short.
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Re: gimmicky new board at the *

Postby bob90245 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:12 pm

FEDFERS wrote:sigh - reply #s are missing and replies are in reverse order, latest reply on top of the thread. don't see an option as on other boards to change back to first reply at top of thread - really don't like that at all. doesn't feel streamlined or intuitive. don't care for the lost space at left margin: users and tags. tags - they're not my tags.

Agreed. Are they trying to be "different" just for the sake of being different? Oh ,well. I'll wait until the programming wizards at diehards.org get their feed back up and working. I never used it as my "front-end interface". Hopefully, their "front-end interface" will make M* easier to navigate.
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Postby gkaplan » Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:01 pm

I think it's horrible. I'm hoping the diehards.org website will make more sense of it. That will only solve the Vanguard forum issue, however. I'll still have to deal with the new and improved Morningstar forums if I want to venture into forums other than Vanguard.
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Postby Kenster1 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:25 pm

I've been having problems all afternoon getting into the M* Forums.

Although I like some of the posting features, I don't like the front-end interface -- it makes it more difficult to view and navigate the collection of posts.
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Postby Gekko » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:02 pm

ABSOLUTELY AWFUL changes.

I preferred the M* forum over this one, but after that change I will be using this one almost exclusively.
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Postby rob » Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:43 pm

The interface is pathetic.... The flow & sequence is bad but it's not just that... colours match ING and nothing like the rest of M*. Interface bugs all over the place. Non obvious voting on threads and what not. Incredibly bad use of space.... want to see it on a decent sized screen. Amazing they went that far backwards (they even outdid Vanguard a few years back) :shock:

I guess when you spend your life in the IT world you tend to be more critical but holy batman they need to go back to the drawing board.
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Postby Murray Boyd » Thu Sep 13, 2007 7:58 pm

It's a shame. I was fond of the old board, but they really seem to have gone off the deep end.
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illogical

Postby pkcrafter » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:12 pm

I'll chime in too. I cannot believe this reverse order of posts made it through beta. You get the OP, then the next in line is the last response in the thread. No continuity. I would also like to see a compressed list of postings. The orange color grates the nerves. And what are those orange boxes with the up and down arrows next to the posts? I don't like the popularity contest either. But I'll give M* a chance. I can live with it except for the revere posting order.

Paul
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Postby SoonerSunDevil » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:20 pm

Nothing good comes in orange.
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Postby fishnskiguy » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:28 pm

Help!

All I get when I log into the Vanguard site is a totally blank screen. When I tried the Fidelity site, just to see if it looked the same there, it came in just fine. Anybody got any ideas?

Chris
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Re: illogical

Postby Ken Schwartz » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:31 pm

pkcrafter wrote:And what are those orange boxes with the up and down arrows next to the posts?

The arrows allow you to cast one vote, up (+1) or down (-1), with respect to each post. The number in the orange box is the running tally of votes.

Best wishes,
Ken
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Ken, orang boxes

Postby pkcrafter » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:36 pm

Ken, do you mean clicking on one of the arrows signifies a vote that the post was good or the person making the post is worth listening to? Isn't the vote going to be very dependent on what the OP wanted to know? For instance, the reply might be exactly what the OP needed, but the information isn't worth anything to anyone else. It seems to me the whole voting idea is a waste of time. I know I won't be using it.

Paul
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Postby Ken Schwartz » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:44 pm

pkcrafter wrote:Ken, do you mean clicking on one of the arrows signifies a vote that the post was good or the person making the post is worth listening to?

I guess it could mean either.

pkcrafter wrote:Isn't the vote going to be very dependent on what the OP wanted to know?

Yes.

pkcrafter wrote:For instance, the reply might be exactly what the OP needed, but the information isn't worth anything to anyone else. It seems to me the whole voting idea is a waste of time.

I tend to agree.

By the way, Morningstar's new How to Guide is somewhat useful.

Best wishes,
Ken
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Good bye M*

Postby Adrian Nenu » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:44 pm

I posted a new conversation and but it did not take. Good bye M* until it works out the bugs.

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It is embarassing.....

Postby CountryBoy » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:12 pm

The orange, lavender, and red says it all; unbelieveable.

I designed websites for ibm, etc. for years but one does not need experience to see that the site is amateur, unprofessional, and truly quantifiably sloppy.

Truly embarassing to the people who did it and those of us who might wish to use it.

Really.

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Beta

Postby woof755 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:22 pm

Any of you guys who tested this new site--what is up with the voting / rating system?

If Taylor or Larry post a new topic, they are actually going to need to be voted up to get to the top of the page?

Excuse me?

I will go back there until I realize that many of the great guys / gals who posted there are here preferentially. Then I'll jump into the exodus. [/u][/i]
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Postby Latestarter » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:29 pm

The whole idea of pushing everyone to judge one another's posts is distasteful. If they want that to be an available feature, fine, but I hate that this is the default way of organizing messages -- and, worse, even if you click on the option to display 24 hours' or 7 days' worth of messages, they're still ordered by rating. There seems to be no way to opt out of All Evaluation, All the Time in order to see the messages chronologically.
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Morningstar is a circus

Postby c.Alvin » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:31 pm

with all the moving advertisements one could suffer from motion sickness in a matter of seconds. It is like trying to read a newspaper while riding a roller coaster. I will not renew my subscription to Morningstar. The web site is useless.
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Postby woof755 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:36 pm

Latestarter wrote:The whole idea of pushing everyone to judge one another's posts is distasteful. If they want that to be an available feature, fine, but I hate that this is the default way of organizing messages -- and, worse, even if you click on the option to display 24 hours' or 7 days' worth of messages, they're still ordered by rating. There seems to be no way to opt out of All Evaluation, All the Time in order to see the messages chronologically.


I absolutely, whole-heartedly agree. Well said.
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Re: M* to Launch Upgraded Message Boards

Postby DRiP Guy » Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:59 pm

bob90245 wrote:M* to Launch Upgraded Message Boards. Click HERE



Meh.
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Re: Morningstar is a circus

Postby DRiP Guy » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:01 pm

c.Alvin wrote:with all the moving advertisements one could suffer from motion sickness in a matter of seconds. It is like trying to read a newspaper while riding a roller coaster. I will not renew my subscription to Morningstar. The web site is useless.


"The award-winning Mozilla Firefox Web browser is enjoyed by tens of millions of people worldwide, and has re-ignited innovation and competition on the Web."


http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/
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Postby 9Iron » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:04 pm

In a world with billions of message boards, someone has to have the worst.

Congrats Morningstar, you hold that honor!
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For what it's worth

Postby woof755 » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:08 pm

Sounds like M* is fixing the chronological listing that is currently being trumped by the (Q#$%#$Q!#$%) rating system.

Better days ahead!
"By singing in harmony from the same page of the same investing hymnal, the Diehards drown out market noise." | | --Jason Zweig, quoted in The Bogleheads' Guide to Investing
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Firefox

Postby pkcrafter » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:39 pm

Another vote for Firefox. It has a very effective ad blocker. I don't see any of these very annoying moving ads. Just lots of white space.

And I totally agree on the juvenile rating system. Several posters said no to this when M* asked, but it is apparent that they did not wish to listen and in fact Darrin said it would be implemented whether posters wanted it or not. All I can guess is M* had some other incentive for using it.

Paul
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From The Munchkin Man

Postby Munchkin Man » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:40 pm

Greetings To All:

Here is what the Munchkin Man doesn't understand.

The overwhelming majority of the posters voted not to include the poster rating system in the new Morningstar Forums site.

Passions against this rating system ran pretty high.

Posters were practically begging Morningstar not to do it.

And they go ahead and do it anyway.

To the Munchkin Man, the new Morningstar Forums site is ugly, confusing, and an outright abomination.

The old Morningstar Forums site was an antique, but it was infinitely better than the new one.

Sometimes you don't know what you have until you lose it.

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