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New investor here! Vanguard help please

 
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brian1984



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:43 pm    Post subject: New investor here! Vanguard help please Reply with quote

Hey all - 1st post here. I'm posting to hear your opinions on which vanguard funds and allocations I should invest in. I am 24, and have $40K in an online savings account earning 3%. I also have emergency funds covered in my checking account. I'd like to move the entire 40K from savings and create a portfolio in Vanguard. I currently work, but my employer does not offer 401K. I plan on investing an additional $15K/year. Here is what I've come up with:

ROTH IRA:
$5,000 Vanguard REIT Index (VGSIX) (0.20%)

Taxable:
$10,000 Vanguard FTSE All-World ex-US Index Inv (VFWIX) (0.40%)
$15,000 Vanguard Total Stock Mkt Idx (VTSMX) (0.15%)
$10,000 Vanguard Total Intl Stock Index (VGTSX) (0.27%)

Is this too aggressive? Please let me know your thoughts/recommendations!
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YDNAL



Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 5772
Location: Biscayne Bay

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:06 pm    Post subject: New investor here! Vanguard help please Reply with quote

brian1984,

Welcome to the forum.

Quote:
$10,000 Vanguard FTSE All-World ex-US Index Inv (VFWIX) (0.40%)
$10,000 Vanguard Total Intl Stock Index (VGTSX) (0.27%)
FTSE includes Canada and it's not a fund of funds (VGTSX is). Otherwise, these 2 funds are *practically* the same.

ROTH IRA ($5K):
12.5% Vanguard REIT Index (VGSIX) (0.20%)

Taxable ($35K):
50% Vanguard FTSE All-World ex-US Index Inv (VFWIX) (0.40%)
37.5% Vanguard Total Stock Mkt Idx (VTSMX) (0.15%)

100% Total

Overall: 0/100 Stocks/Bonds
Stock split: 50/50 Domestic/Foreign

This is aggressive in that it has 0% Bonds, but I'm not disagreeing with it at this early stage if you are comfortable with the added risk with no benefit. do you know that Total Bond Index (VBMFX) has bested Total Stock Index (VTSMX) over the past 10 years? the 50/50 split between Domestic/Foreign stocks is acceptable. Having 1/4 of domestic holdings in REITs is unique, but I understand the issue of $3K minimum requirements.

Regards,
Landy


Last edited by YDNAL on Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
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prouddad



Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:09 pm    Post subject: portfolio help Reply with quote

It really depends on what your target asset allocation is. If you want to hold the REIT index, a tax-deferred account is the way to go.

I would not buy VGTSX in a taxable account because you do not take advantage of the foreign tax credit. Just looking at it, you have a large international exposure. Most people would recommend between 20 and 40%, but that is a personal decision.

Also, what is your risk tolerance? You do not have any bonds at all. Even a very aggressive portfolio should have some bond exposure. Do you have an emergency fund already?
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mudfud



Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 1003

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any reason why you are investing in both VFWIX and VGSTX?

In more general terms, you could should up with something like an Investment policy statement (IPS) so that you have a basic framework, goals etc. And then the key is to resist the temptation to tweak it all the time.

Best,
Mud
_________________
"Are you sure you have tested an a priori hypothesis?"

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PiperWarrior



Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 4068
Location: right on course

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the forum!

mudfud wrote:
In more general terms, you could should up with something like an Investment policy statement (IPS) so that you have a basic framework, goals etc. And then the key is to resist the temptation to tweak it all the time.

Great idea. You can find out more at Investment Policy Statement.
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brian1984



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks guys. I know I have a lot to learn in terms of investing, but that's why I'm here. My risk tolerance is high, I think a 90/10 allocation would suit my needs well. If you were in my situation, how would you allocate the $40K among the various Vanguard funds?

---

Investment Philosophy: "Buy-and-hold, long-term, all-market-index strategies, implemented at rock-bottom cost, are the surest of all routes to the accumulation of wealth" - John C. Bogle

Asset Allocation: Maintain overall 90% stock allocation + 40% fixed-income allocation until home purchase to accommodate both short-term and long-term requirements.

Funds & Accounts: Use low cost mutual funds - index funds preferably - which do not overlap and provide maximum diversification across asset classes. Try to shelter tax-inefficient funds in tax-advantaged accounts to reduce tax drag.

Target Allocation:
VTSMX - Total Stock Market Fund 40%
VGTSX - Total Int'l Market Fund 20%
VGSIX - Vanguard REIT Index 12.5% - Roth
VISVX - Small-Cap Value Index 17.5%
VBLTX - Long-term Bond Index - 10%

Other considerations: Automate future contributions wherever possible. Rebalance yearly. No market timing.
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PiperWarrior



Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 4068
Location: right on course

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

brian1984 wrote:
Target Allocation:
VTSMX - Total Stock Market Fund 40%
VGTSX - Total Int'l Market Fund 20%
VGSIX - Vanguard REIT Index 12.5% - Roth
VISVX - Small-Cap Value Index 17.5%
VBLTX - Long-term Bond Index - 10%

As Landy suggested, I would use FTSE All-World ex-US although there is only a tiny difference between VGTSX and VFWIX. For a comparison between the two funds, see FAQ on Vanguard International Funds.

I would stick to a short- to intermediate-term bond fund. The risk adjusted return of a portfolio with long-term bonds is not as good as one with short- to intermediate-term bonds. Here are some examples:

Vanguard Inflation-Protected Secs (VIPSX) (0.20%)
Vanguard Interm-Term Treasury (VFITX) (0.26%)
Vanguard Short-Term Bond Index (VBISX) (0.18%)
Vanguard Short-Term Investment-Grade (VFSTX) (0.21%)

etc. They have slightly different characteristics, but I doubt an exact choice matters a lot over the long run.

If your tax bracket is high, you might consider tax-exempt bond fund. You can calculate taxable equivalent yields with:
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brian1984



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Piper! Does this look good?

ROTH IRA ($5K):
12.5% Vanguard REIT Index (VGSIX) (0.20%)

Taxable ($35K):
45% Vanguard FTSE All-World ex-US Index Inv (VFWIX) (0.40%)
32.5% Vanguard Total Stock Mkt Idx (VTSMX) (0.15%)
10% Vanguard Short-Term Bond Index (VBISX) (0.18%)
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PiperWarrior



Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 4068
Location: right on course

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brian1984 wrote:
Thanks Piper! Does this look good?

Looks good to me. As your Roth IRA becomes larger, you might want to shelter a part of bonds in your Roth IRA.
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brian1984



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK, will do. What are your thoughts on:

VISVX - Small-Cap Value Index 17.5%

Is it worth including a small cap fund?
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YDNAL



Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 5772
Location: Biscayne Bay

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: New investor here! Vanguard help please Reply with quote

Quote:
VISVX - Small-Cap Value Index 17.5%

Is it worth including a small cap fund?
Brian,

Early on in your investing life, your focus should continue to be maximizing the savings rate and not adding more funds looking at some past performance or some *premium* based on past performance. I'm glad that you considered some Bonds, if for nothing more than recognizing their effect on the overall portfolio and their relationship with Equities.

Regards,
Landy
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PiperWarrior



Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 4068
Location: right on course

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brian1984 wrote:
OK, will do. What are your thoughts on:

VISVX - Small-Cap Value Index 17.5%

Is it worth including a small cap fund?

Sure. Put some if you like. Historically, putting small-cap value puts you closer to the efficient frontier. You might be interested in reading Updated figures and results on slice and dice vs TSM.

I see that several things are competing for tax-advantaged space. Ideally, you want to put small-cap value, REITs, and bonds in a tax-advantaged account. Probably REITs and bonds take precedence.

I don't know your employment status, but if you are self employed, look into things like Solo 401(k) and SEP IRA.

You might also look into Health savings account.

If you get a job with a 401(k) plan, start maxing that out right away unless every single fund in the plan is horribly expensive.

If you have two or more very similar job offers lined up in the future, pick one with a better 401(k) plan.
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jhd



Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 66
Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brian1984 wrote:
VISVX - Small-Cap Value Index 17.5%

Is it worth including a small cap fund?


Some people say "yes", some people say "no". If there is still a small/value premium to be had (and I tend to think that there is), it's probably relatively small, and less important than other parts of your AA. And Landy gave the best advice:

YDNAL wrote:
Early on in your investing life, your focus should continue to be maximizing the savings rate
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