Bogleheads

[Tramper Al]

Hi,

Like many of you, I have had a brokerage account with WellsTrade for a while now, and a PMA checking account (which I don't use) in order to qualify for the brokerage services.

Today I received an email from Wells Fargo mainly about BillPay, but started out with:

"Our records indicate that your Bill Pay fee account XXX-XXXXXXX has
been closed."

Signing in at WellsTrade, I do seem no longer to have a PMA checking account with $105 in it.

I'm just wondering if anyone else is experiencing this, whether it is a temporary glitch, or if my lack of activity in the PMA account has triggered some swift account closure procedure. If so, then I imagine my WellsTrade brokerage account is in some jeopardy.

I know from experience that trying to get answers from Wells Fargo by phone is a dismal process, so I thought I would ask here first.

[Plainsman]

Yes, it is due to inactivity in your PMA checking account. WF requires at least one transaction in the 12 months from your anniversary date. WF requires the PMA checking account in order to qualify for the free trades in your brokerage account, but your account is not in jeopardy, as you can remedy it with a phone call. The rep will likely confirm the inactivity as the reason, and they can re-activate the PMA account. It will show up online again in a day or two.

Yes, I had the same problem last year, so I now just make sure I make a small deposit into the checking account (which I do not use either) at least once a year.

[indexfundfan]

My PMA/Wellstrade is ~ one year old. I just checked -- my accounts are all OK, and I have $40 in the PMA account.

I hope what you experienced is not an indication of the things to come.
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My signature has been deleted.

[indexfundfan]

[knci]

I am in the process of converting my checking account to PMA and opening a Wellstrade account...it is very fustrating. I call to ask if it is set up and I'm told to wait a few days and call to link the PMA to the Wellstrade; (quotes not exact) "doesn't that happen automatically since the online application indicated it?"; "Not necessarily, also you will need to activate the Wellstrade account to be seen online...so please call us in a few days to help you...then we will give you a number to call to link to your PMA to insure you get the 100 free trades". They later send me an email to call them to confirm information. I call and the representative doesn't know why I was told anything more was needed. He took my phone number to call should anything be needed (which is good). The representatives seem a little clueless and not reassuring.

[diasurfer]

the new account process has not been smooth for me either, but I expect it will eventually work itself out.

[SoonerSunDevil]

The only frustrating thing I've encountered with Wells Fargo is the lack of integration with respect to the PMA Checking Account and your brokerage account(s).

You have to open the PMA Checking separately from the brokerage side, and it does take a couple of days to link the accounts, but once the link has been established, it is very easy to move money from one account to the other. The speed in which Wells Fargo processes transactions is quite impressive.

Bottom line, bite the bullet with the initial start-up and make a checking deposit or two once a year and you'll be so happy you use Wells Trade via Wells Fargo.

[livesoft]

I am pleased to use the PMA checking account as my primary account. It is a superb checking acount, so I am surprised you haven't closed all your other checking accounts and switch to it already. I see no reason to have another checking account.

[Tramper Al]

I had similar problems with the initial set-up, and to this day its seems as if the brokerage reps and bank reps are continents apart and do not communicate with each other, even though the whole PMA think is supposed to be an integrated product. And then a couple of times I was referred to the internet reps as well, a third group not often in sync with the other two.

Incidentally, I have never actually achieved a link between the Wellstrade PMA (bank and brokerage) accounts such that I can transfer funds between them, though you would think this would happen very smoothly when setting the accounts up simultaneously. When I asked later, I was told the only way to set up a transfer connection was to fill out another form, not available on the web site. They said they would send it by mail but it did not arrive. The funny thing is, to set up any other bank to (completely unrelated) brokerage connection like this, I have easily done so online, inputing info like routing number, account numbers, driver's license number, test deposit confirmations, etc. So my WF checking account is to this day sitting with my initial deposit, no interest, and my booklet of checks. Kind of silly. I suppose I should keep trying to fix it, though, if only to remind myself to make an online transfer once in a while, as right now I have to remember to make a transaction by check or deposit slip each year. Apparently, though, it is sufficiently "linked" that I do have the free trades.

[DaveTH]

[Ricola]

Am now just learning that they do not offer postage paid deposit envelopes. I asked for their deposit kit which is just some addressed envelopes.

[DaveTH]

[Tramper Al]

[Ricola]

[Amishman]

[DaveTH]

[livesoft]

Hmmm, I have postage-paid envelopes and I get my ATM fees reimbursed ... including ATM fees in foreign countries.

[Ricola]

[DaveTH]

[HikerNC]

I have a WF Debit card with my WF brokerage account but don't know the PIN number. I also have a supply of checks but I've never used one. My PMA account has been opened for around 14 months and has the original $100 plus a few pennies interest - no activity and no consequences so far.

I'm very pleased with my brokerage accounts with WF.

[CoderDude]

Does anyone know what types of transactions are sufficient to keep the account open? For example, would it be sufficient to make a small transfer from brokerage to checking (then back to brokerage)?

Also, I wonder if this is somehow related to BillPay. I haven’t touched my PMA checking account since it was opened over a year ago, and it hasn’t been closed yet. I don’t use BillPay, and it seems that most of the people getting their account closed have been using BillPay.

[hoxbox]

I would also be interested in knowing what type of transactions count towards activity. The closest branch is 800 miles away so if they require physical presence at a branch I am out of luck...

[Easy Rhino]

I would hazard that a one penny transfer into and out of the bank from the brokerage would work.

[indexfundfan]

[tfb]

I don't know how much you can rely on the info from CSR. Often times you get different answers from different people. Logically if you have external activities, not just transfers within Wells Fargo family, whether they are physical or electronic, they should not tag the account as dormant. But of course I have no evidence one way or the other. Banks actively promote electronic transactions. Requiring in-branch activities doesn't make a lot of sense.
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The Finance Buff

[Sunny Sarkar]

[Easy Rhino]

Yep, the PMA's basically a virtually-zero-interest checking account with some freebies (checks, etc). Couldn't hurt to have it.

I really haven't gotten into it on the banking side, becase my Scwab bank account offers such better features than Wells Fargo (irony).

[livesoft]

[pointyhairedboss]

I really haven't gotten into it on the banking side, becase my Scwab bank account offers such better features than Wells Fargo (irony).

Weird how these things work out.

Fidelity offers a nice banking package, which I believe is as a loss leader to attract more investment assets, and Wells Fargo offers a nice banking package, which I believe they offer as a loss leader to attract more banking(/mortgage/credit card) assets.

[bob90245]

[indexfundfan]

[Easy Rhino]

It's the bank account going dormant (and in extreme cases, getting closed) that's the issue, not the brokerage account. (they don't talk to each other except for fund transfers)

Brokerage accounts don't really go dormant. In the old days some would be so barbaric as to have an inactivity fee, but you don't really see those any more.

[schwarm]

It seems strange that they would require activity at a branch when they don't have branches in over 25 states, and you can hold an account in any state.

[indexfundfan]

[tfb]

[bob90245]

[Sunny Sarkar]

[mdickson]

Question for IndexFan:

My "local" branch is about 100 miles away - I recently had a hardcopy check I wished to deposit in my PMA account - so I mailed it to the "local" branch with my deposit slip.

Would that qualify as "activity" under your understanding? I assume it would be the same as walking into the bank and presenting my deposit to a teller.

BTW, I was surprised the funds showed up in my PMA account the day after I mailed it!

Guess I have been lucky! I have had excellent luck getting my service questions answered although I always use email rather than phone. But, I always make sure that when I ask a brokerage question, I'm in the brokerage part of my online account and in the bank portion when asking a banking question so my question gets routed to the proper customer service area.

I have also found their trading platform meets my limited needs although I'm not an extremely active trader (an occassional addition and regular rebalancing)

So far, I have the PMA (joint with my wife), Roth for me, Roth for my wife, and brokerage account (me).

The one issue I have had with them is that when I log on as me I can see the PMA account, my brokerage, and my Roth. When I log on as my wife, we can see the PMA and her Roth. According to customer service there is no way to only have one online username that shows everthing in our household. If anyone knows different, please let me know!

But my first anniversary approaches in the next month - hope I don't experience the issues you all have.

Mike

[Easy Rhino]

Most financial institutions define "activity" as "customer-driven transactions". This usually means pretty much anything except for insurance or fees.

It's up to the bank of course, and I don't know about Wells Fargo specifically, although the criteria often mirror those for escheatment of unclaimed funds.

BTW, mdickson, your post encouraged me to dig around on the site and find the "email" link, I had though WF didn't have one at all!

[JamaicaMeCrazy]

Thanks for all the answers in this thread. Very imformative.

We too, are PMA customers at WF and are about to take a deep breath and transfer the managed brokerage account (with individual stock (30 ish) and bond holdings (17 or so) ) we have at another financial institution over to WF and then sell off all the individual stock holdings and start up some Vanguard mutual funds with the proceeds.

We are looking at a capital loss here when we do switch up, so no real tax triggers will occur. What will occur is the over 2.5% management and advisory fees that no longer will being charged.

We plan on parking the individual bonds at WF until they mature, then move those into bond funds at Vanguard when they do mature. All are Cali Muni T/E at 5% with 1-4 year durations.

Can someone answer the pros and cons of doing it this way? Is this the preferred way of handling individual holdings when you are doing it in this fashion?

TIA

[livesoft]

[indexfundfan]

[Easy Rhino]

I transferred in stocks and funds from two different brokerages into WF.

For stocks, sure. If you're going to liquidate them, you've got to do it somewhere. If you sell at Wells Fargo, you don't pay the commission. Selling at the "home" brokerage might make cost basis tracking easier, but that's it. Incidentally, Wells did a good job of "inheriting" my cost basis data a week or so after the stocks were transferred.

Wells Fargo may not have some mutual funds available, so you'd have to liquidate before transfer.

I don't hold individual bonds, but your idea of holding the individual bonds until maturity and gradually increasing bond fund allocation seems good.

[SoonerSunDevil]

[Hedgy]

I was told by the CSR when I set up my PMA accounts that there was a $100 minimum initial deposit to fund the checking account.
Now that I've funded it and put 25K into the Wells Trade account, can I transfer $99 out of the checking account, leaving only $1 in it, without incurring some kind of low balance fee?

[SoonerSunDevil]

[smcgrath12]

[livesoft]

On seeing your spouse's account, there is a loophole: All your accounts (his, hers, theirs) will be on your monthly statement which is available for viewing online. So even without filling out the authorization you will be able to at least see what happened last month and before in all your accounts.

Are you afraid that your spouse is secretly trading behind your back?

[Easy Rhino]

[smcgrath12]

I have exactly $1.00 in my PMA checking account. It really makes me wonder, I am getting all these free trades in each account and WF is paying for it without making any money off me as I don't do anything else with WF. Eventually, the free ride should come to an end... I think.