Here we go again...

Have a question about your personal investments? No matter how simple or complex, you can ask it here.

Here we go again...

Postby Larry_M » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:21 pm

Ok so here I go again, trying to move some funds from T. Rowe Price into my Vanguard account, and T. Rowe Price requires a medallion signature guarantee...

Ok no problem, off I go to my credit union, and strike one, they don't provide signature guarantees.

Ok, so I pick up my phone book, and call every bank within a 50 mile radius of my house - not a single one of them will provide me with a signature guarantee unless I am a member of their bank.

You must be freaking kidding me right?

So now what do I do? I never dreamed it would be so difficult for me to get to MY OWN MONEY!

Is there any way I can get around this?

Any suggestions? I'm at a loss.


If it helps any, the funds I want to transfer from T. Rowe Price are in a Roth IRA. Could I move the funds from T. Rowe Price into my bank account, and then move them from my bank account over to Vangaurd without any sort of penalty or signature guarantee required?

I would rather close my T. Rowe Price account before opening a bank account just to get a stinking signature medallion guarantee.

This is preposterous, and incredibly frustrating.
Larry_M
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 2:31 pm

Postby TheDan666 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:31 pm

What do you mean exactly by medallion? Is that the same as having it notarized by a notary public? If so, you can get something notarized at virtually any currency exchange (if you have them, I'm in the Chicago area). Also, most mid-to-large companies have someone who is a notary public on staff.
User avatar
TheDan666
 
Posts: 268
Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 2:00 pm

Postby jpsfranks » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:36 pm

I believe you've got another thread up about transferring money from Fidelity to Vanguard. If you are still a Fidelity customer I've always been able to get signature guarantees at my local Fidelity branch. I'm not sure they will be thrilled to help you with a transaction between T. Rowe Price and Vanguard even as you are pulling money out from them, though. :)
User avatar
jpsfranks
 
Posts: 883
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 12:45 am

Postby Larry_M » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:38 pm

TheDan666 wrote:What do you mean exactly by medallion? Is that the same as having it notarized by a notary public? If so, you can get something notarized at virtually any currency exchange (if you have them, I'm in the Chicago area). Also, most mid-to-large companies have someone who is a notary public on staff.


I wish it were that simple.
I have relatives who are notary's, and my credit union offers notary stamps free of charge.

Here is precisely what a Medallion Signature Guarantee is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medallion_signature_guarantee


My bank does not offer a Medallion Signature Guarantee, and neither do any other banks where I live (unless I am a member).

I am in quite a pickle here it seems!
Larry_M
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 2:31 pm

Postby Kenster1 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:40 pm

TheDan666 wrote:What do you mean exactly by medallion? Is that the same as having it notarized by a notary public? If so, you can get something notarized at virtually any currency exchange (if you have them, I'm in the Chicago area). Also, most mid-to-large companies have someone who is a notary public on staff.


No, a Medallion Signature is something different and is usually done in a financial institution. In the past - since I had my mortgage thru Washington Mutual, I went to their branch and had a medallion signature done thru them. Their branch manager was certified to do this. Otherwise, that's one of the perks of being a customer of a bank with local branches.

From wiki:

In the United States, a medallion signature guarantee is a special signature guarantee for the transfer of securities. It is a guarantee by the transferring financial institution that the signature is genuine and the financial institution accepts liability for any forgery. Signature guarantees protect shareholders by preventing unauthorized transfers and possible investor losses. They also limit the liability of the transfer agent who accepts the certificates.

Individuals would normally obtain the guarantee from selected banks or other financial institutions. Different institutions have different policies as to what type of identification they require to provide the guarantee and whether they charge a fee for such service (usually nominal if any.) Most institutions would not guarantee a signature of someone who has not already been their customer.

A medallion signature guarantee is not the same as an acknowledgment by a notary public, in the sense that a "signature guarantee" is a certification by the institution that the signature is authentic, and an acknowledgment is a certification by a notary public attesting that the signer signed a document voluntarily.
Last edited by Kenster1 on Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
SURGEON GENERAL'S WARNING: Any overconfidence in your ability, willingness and need to take risk may be hazardous to your health.
User avatar
Kenster1
 
Posts: 2871
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:50 pm

Postby TheDan666 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:41 pm

Larry_M wrote:
TheDan666 wrote:What do you mean exactly by medallion? Is that the same as having it notarized by a notary public? If so, you can get something notarized at virtually any currency exchange (if you have them, I'm in the Chicago area). Also, most mid-to-large companies have someone who is a notary public on staff.


I wish it were that simple.
I have relatives who are notary's, and my credit union offers notary stamps free of charge.

Here is precisely what a Medallion Signature Guarantee is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medallion_signature_guarantee


My bank does not offer a Medallion Signature Guarantee, and neither do any other banks where I live (unless I am a member).

I am in quite a pickle here it seems!


Oh, that sounds familiar. I had to get that done at my local Chase bank. I remember it being kind of a pain even with having an account there.
User avatar
TheDan666
 
Posts: 268
Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 2:00 pm

Postby livesoft » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:46 pm

My spouse needed a medallion sig guarantee to transfer some of her deceased mother's accounts to her. She opened a free checking account at a bank, held it for 30 days, got the signature, got the transfer completed, closed the checking account.
livesoft
 
Posts: 34230
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:00 pm

Postby Larry_M » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:46 pm

jpsfranks wrote:I believe you've got another thread up about transferring money from Fidelity to Vanguard. If you are still a Fidelity customer I've always been able to get signature guarantees at my local Fidelity branch. I'm not sure they will be thrilled to help you with a transaction between T. Rowe Price and Vanguard even as you are pulling money out from them, though. :)


Indeed I do, but the Fidelity account is now officially closed - HAH, I can't catch a break.

I am just trying to consolidate all of my retirement accounts down to Vanguard - so far my pitfalls have been a $50 "exit" fee from Fidelity, and now this signature medallion guarantee speed bump for T. Rowe Price...
Larry_M
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 2:31 pm

Postby Larry_M » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:52 pm

livesoft wrote:My spouse needed a medallion sig guarantee to transfer some of her deceased mother's accounts to her. She opened a free checking account at a bank, held it for 30 days, got the signature, got the transfer completed, closed the checking account.


Thanks for the suggestion. I have been considering doing just that, but then when I stop and think about how ludicrous it is to have to do that in order to get to my own money, I manage to talk myself out of it. So now I am trying to figure out a work around, if possible.

Looks like I will be calling T. Rowe Price and see exactly what it is they suggest I do. I would be shocked if they suggest that I open a new bank account (and then wait 30 days), JUST to get a signature medallion guarantee in order to get to my money.
Larry_M
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 2:31 pm

Re: Here we go again...

Postby tetractys » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:58 pm

Larry_M wrote:Ok no problem, off I go to my credit union, and strike one, they don't provide signature guarantees.

Signature guarantee stamps are held by individual officers, so if you haven't already, maybe you just need to check around a little more at different branches to find the right person.

Just a suggestion, Tet
User avatar
tetractys
 
Posts: 4198
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:30 pm
Location: Along the Salish Sea

Postby Opponent Process » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:58 pm

it helps me to remember these things are for my own protection.
30/30/20/20 | US/International/Bonds/TIPS | Average Age=37
User avatar
Opponent Process
 
Posts: 5159
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:19 pm

Postby mikep » Thu Jul 30, 2009 2:59 pm

You have to open an account at another bank or credit union in order to do this, I had to this year. I was moving from Etrade to VG and I couldn't even get one at the local Etrade office as my credit union didn't do it either. It is a royal PITA but that's the system. I opened a simple savings share acct for $5 at a credit union online, walked in the next day and got the guarantee. Then after everything settled at VG I closed the acct, got my $5 back. Ask which banks guarantee if you are already a customer and they shouldn't charge you. I even called the local Fido and they only do it for things involving Fido accts.

The reason is that the bank/CU is effectively responsible for the guarantee, their neck is out for the amount of the guarantee incase of fraud. Even the credit union I used wouldn't guarantee if account was worth over 100K (regulated by their "guarantee insurance"). So if you are moving large sums, you have a big problem on your hands. No one will do this without an account at the bank.

So they have no incentive whatsoever to extend this to every random person that walks in the front door and it also provides more of a guarantee if they have your identity more confirmed with an open account.

This should be your hopefully only negative experience with Vanguard that doesn't have a local branch everywhere.

Edit - and there's also different types of guarantees, I initially called my CU to check if they offer it, they said yes, I showed up and they told me they couldn't since they didn't have the "medallion" stamp. It costs a lot of money to get this stamp so you'll have better luck with the big banks. You'll need the medallion w/green ink version.
Last edited by mikep on Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
mikep
 
Posts: 3111
Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:27 pm

Re: Here we go again...

Postby knowmad » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:01 pm

Larry_M wrote:Ok so here I go again, trying to move some funds from T. Rowe Price into my Vanguard account, and T. Rowe Price requires a medallion signature guarantee...


Signature guarantees are a pain. It took me 9 months to get one for opening a Treasury Direct Account. I had to visit dozens of branches of my bank until one provided the guarantee. Calling my bank was no help. They said yes we do provide the medallion guarantee, but only at certain branches and we don't know which branches those are. You'll need to visit each one in person until you get lucky.

Insane. The whole program should be scrapped.
knowmad
 
Posts: 459
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:39 am

Postby surveyor » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:06 pm

Can't you simply rollover the money? I think you have a 60 day window from withdrawing it to deposting it. You might have to tell TR that you're rolling it over to avoid them witholding the 10% penalty.

I'd call TR and explain what you want to do and ask about your options since you can't get the Medallion easily.

I am not a tax professional, but I did have to deal with the Medallion to transfer a small IRA to vanguard. Frustrating.
surveyor
 
Posts: 143
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2008 9:05 am

Postby Rager1 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:06 pm

I have shared your frustration over the medallion signature in past years. My solution is to maintain a small checking account with the bank where our safe deposit box is located.

You will find that, even as a Vanguard investor, Vanguard will require a medallion signature from time to time, depending on the transactions you want to do. So, to save yourself the hassle in the future, open an account at a bank in your area that has someone who can do a medallion signature.

As to your current situation, I've heard that some full service brokerage houses will do medallion signatures, but charge a fee. So, the most cost effective method for you is to open an account at a local bank.

Ed
Last edited by Rager1 on Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Rager1
 
Posts: 802
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:03 pm

Postby Prokofiev » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:06 pm

Larry_M wrote:
jpsfranks wrote:
I am just trying to consolidate all of my retirement accounts down to Vanguard - so far my pitfalls have been a $50 "exit" fee from Fidelity, and now this signature medallion guarantee speed bump for T. Rowe Price...


This is one of the many reasons to consolidate your accounts as much as possible. I have been thru this process for my own investments, for my girlfriend who just retired last year and now for my parents - who have/had a variety of DRIPS, brokerages, certificates, bank accounts, CDs etc. I am in the 2nd year of working with my dad to transfer things to VG!

You can work directly with a special VG rep who specializes in account transfers. They can be very helpful and will contact most firms/banks on your behalf over the phone (conference call), but can't do all the work for you. Other institutions will drag things out for months. Each has a different signature policy and will charge varying fees. A major ongoing pain.

Good Luck
Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler - Einstein
User avatar
Prokofiev
 
Posts: 907
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 10:45 pm
Location: New Orleans

Postby fishndoc » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:25 pm

Larry,

Your signature doesn't say where you reside, but if you have Wachovia (now Wells Fargo) nearby, you might check with them. We have two very small Wachovia branches near my home, and the managers at both locations can do Medallion Signature guarantees, so it may well be the same at all their locations. Also, they have some pretty good deals now trying to get in new accounts.

Also, as someone mentioned already: although it is a hassle, the Medallion requirement IS for our protection; it would be even more of a hassle if some on-line bandit made off with your money

Wayne
" Successful investing involves doing just a few things right, and avoiding serious mistakes." - J. Bogle
fishndoc
 
Posts: 2316
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 12:50 pm

Postby retiredjg » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:35 pm

You can have them send you the money and then you have 60 days to put it into another location (IRA, 401. etc.)

The problem is they have to withhold 20% for taxes. I'm sure you get that money back at tax time, but I don't know how you get it back into a tax-advantaged location.

Edit: Sorry. I didn't note in your OP that this is for a Roth IRA. What I said above is for Traditional IRA.

http://www.irs.gov/publications/p590/index.html

I'd keep searching for the medallion thing. What a pain.

I will say I did a rollover last year and the paperwork asked for the Medallion signature, but the company told me I didn't need to worry about it. I don't recall if it was the receiving company or the losing company that said to skip that step, but the money was transferred. You might look into that.
Last edited by retiredjg on Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
retiredjg
 
Posts: 18122
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 1:56 pm

Postby tfb » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:51 pm

You are with the wrong bank/CU or you talked to the wrong person. A competent bank provides signature guarantees to its customers as a service. All the banks I dealt with provided such service. Talk to a manager or go to a different branch. Don't take no for an answer.
Harry Sit, taking a break from the forums.
User avatar
tfb
 
Posts: 6687
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:46 pm

Postby ResearchMed » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:53 pm

First suggestion: Contact Vanguard to ask them to help GET your funds from TRP. It's in Vanguard's interest to help in cases like this, and a direct custodian-to-custodian transfer may bypass that specific signature requirement (?).

Having the funds transferred directly from one custodial account to another is the most simple way, and Vanguard should be familiar with working with just about every other major financial/brokerage firm.

Next suggestion: You mentioned moving your funds into a TRP bank account. IF your "funds" are indeed "cash" (and not mutual funds or equities that you wish to transfer "in kind"), then you might be able to do with a Roth IRA what can be done with a regular IRA: Remove the money by having a check issued to you, and within 60 days (make it 59 days and preferably much sooner to be sure, because missing by 1-day can be very costly) and send the money to Vanguard and open the new account that way.

I have NOT had experience doing this with a Roth.
Our experiences with this have been with regular IRA's, and we are over 59.5, so I'm not completely sure if this "works" for a Roth or for those who are younger.

To do this, just make sure that you "check the boxes" so that NO TAXES ARE WITHHELD, because no taxes will be due IF you move that money to a NEW IRA ACCOUNT within the time period (caveats above apply).

Also note: This process - moving the money YOURSELF *into* or *out of* any single IRA account can only be done ONCE per year. If you need to do it "again" within a year, make sure you open a NEW IRA! (You'd need to do this on "both ends" - move remaining TRP money, for example, to a *new* TRP IRA, and THEN transfer OUT; ditto, transfer INTO a *new* Vanguard IRA.)

These "once per year" rules do not apply if the money is transferred *directly* from one custodian to another, which is usually the more simple way to do it (although it might not be faster, as the institution "sending" the money has an incentive to act, er, slowly).

RM
ResearchMed
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 12:25 am

Postby RobG » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:26 pm

tfb wrote:You are with the wrong bank/CU or you talked to the wrong person. A competent bank provides signature guarantees to its customers as a service. All the banks I dealt with provided such service. Talk to a manager or go to a different branch. Don't take no for an answer.


Nah, I had the same issue as the OP. A "medallion" isn't a normal signature guarantee. Maybe a bank here/there does it, but financial houses (Edward Jones, etc) are the ones that normally do it.

I finally gave up trying to fix my wife's Vanguard Roth account so I could do direct deposit from our joint account. I just mail the deposit checks into Vanguard; it is a pain. This, of course, is for my protection. After all, I wouldn't want unauthorized people making deposits into my wife's Roth IRA! :roll:

rg
RobG
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:59 am
Location: Bozeman, MT

Re: Here we go again...

Postby YDNAL » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:43 pm

RobG wrote:Nah, I had the same issue as the OP. A "medallion" isn't a normal signature guarantee. Maybe a bank here/there does it, but financial houses (Edward Jones, etc) are the ones that normally do it.
This is untrue.... a major bank will provide the medallion without hassle.

Larry_M wrote:Ok so here I go again, trying to move some funds from T. Rowe Price into my Vanguard account, and T. Rowe Price requires a medallion signature guarantee...

Ok no problem, off I go to my credit union, and strike one, they don't provide signature guarantees.
Larry,

A local credit union should be able to provide this for a customer. :? Back in the day, I moved from Smith Barney to Vanguard and I just walked up to a Wachovia branch and their customer service rep completed the medallion signature form in just minutes. Seems that the difficulties you mention stem from the fact that you don't have a relationship with a major bank (Bank of America, Wachovia (Wells), etc).
Landy | Be yourself, everyone else is already taken -- Oscar Wilde
YDNAL
 
Posts: 13699
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2007 5:04 pm
Location: Biscayne Bay

Postby ResearchMed » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:44 pm

RobG wrote: After all, I wouldn't want unauthorized people making deposits into my wife's Roth IRA! :roll:

rg


No, absolutely, you wouldn't want unauthorized people making deposits into your wife's account!
VERY thoughtful of you.

Please have them contact us immediately at 555.5555 ;-)


RM
ResearchMed
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 12:25 am

Postby tfb » Thu Jul 30, 2009 5:30 pm

RobG wrote:Nah, I had the same issue as the OP. A "medallion" isn't a normal signature guarantee. Maybe a bank here/there does it, but financial houses (Edward Jones, etc) are the ones that normally do it.

It is just a normal signature guarantee.

I just realized another possibility: the CU personnel didn't understand what the OP wanted. You ask them about "medallion guarantee", they say they don't do it, because they don't know what it is. If you ask them about "signature guarantee" they suddenly know what you are talking about. It's a training issue.
Harry Sit, taking a break from the forums.
User avatar
tfb
 
Posts: 6687
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:46 pm

Postby bearwolf » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:00 pm

RobG wrote:Nah, I had the same issue as the OP. A "medallion" isn't a normal signature guarantee. Maybe a bank here/there does it, but financial houses (Edward Jones, etc) are the ones that normally do it.

rg


I've had Medallion Guarantees done at a small local bank and a larger regional bank. I had accounts at both at the time and there was no problem and no hassle.

BearWolf
User avatar
bearwolf
 
Posts: 1714
Joined: Sun May 18, 2008 1:34 am
Location: Oklahoma

Postby RobG » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:10 pm

tfb wrote:
RobG wrote:Nah, I had the same issue as the OP. A "medallion" isn't a normal signature guarantee. Maybe a bank here/there does it, but financial houses (Edward Jones, etc) are the ones that normally do it.

It is just a normal signature guarantee.


OK, we are arguing over the meaning of "normal."

My bank has never done it. No really, they do not do it. They don't even do it if I ask two, three or ten or more times. :wink: The last time I needed one I had to go to a father's friend at a brokerage house after calling all over town. Wells Fargo does it for customers only, but that wouldn't help me. It is not "normal" in that regard.

rg
RobG
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:59 am
Location: Bozeman, MT

Postby RobG » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:15 pm

bearwolf wrote:I've had Medallion Guarantees done at a small local bank and a larger regional bank. I had accounts at both at the time and there was no problem and no hassle.


ok, ok I may have overstated the scarcity of banks that do it if you happen to be a customer.
RobG
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:59 am
Location: Bozeman, MT

Postby retiredjg » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:31 pm

RobG wrote:I finally gave up trying to fix my wife's Vanguard Roth account so I could do direct deposit from our joint account. I just mail the deposit checks into Vanguard; it is a pain.

rg

Huh? Can't you just link the bank account to the Roth account? Maybe I've misunderstood your situation, but I've got mine linked and I just tell money to go one way or the other and it does....
retiredjg
 
Posts: 18122
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 1:56 pm

Postby pshonore » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:07 pm

Might be easier to just drive to one of their offices (they do have 16 natiowide) if you're within a reasonable driving distance. Then you can sign in their presence - no guarantee required.
pshonore
 
Posts: 3085
Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2009 3:21 pm

Postby amp » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:10 pm

mikep wrote:I even called the local Fido and they only do it for things involving Fido accts.

Fidelity did a medallion signature guarantee for me last week on some paperwork which had nothing to do with them. There was no charge either.

This was a branch on Manhattan's Upper West Side.
User avatar
amp
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Sun May 04, 2008 10:40 am

Postby nisiprius » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:36 pm

It wouldn't surprise to learn this a state law thing that varies from state to state, but anyway. Here, there is definitely a distinction between a notarized signature and a medallion signature guarantee.

At my local bank, many of the customer service representatives are notaries, you can get documents notarized any time the bank is open, and they just look at your driver's license (maybe one other kind of typical wallet identification) and note what kind of ID you provided. They don't go into the bank's signature file.

The only person who is available to do a medallion signature guarantee is a bank VP, who is only in weekdays, and he looks me up in the bank's signature file.

I think both of these services are only provided to people with accounts at the bank.

I'd love to know the real details of the distinction.
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.
User avatar
nisiprius
Advisory Board
 
Posts: 25791
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 10:33 am
Location: The terrestrial, globular, planetary hunk of matter, flattened at the poles, is my abode.--O. Henry

Postby RobG » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:41 pm

retiredjg wrote:Huh? Can't you just link the bank account to the Roth account? Maybe I've misunderstood your situation, but I've got mine linked and I just tell money to go one way or the other and it does....


I can go back/forth electronically between all my accounts except hers.

It is something maddeningly screwy, like our bank account is joint and her Roth is in her name. I forget the details, but they need a MDLN signature guarantee for electronic transfers to her account. I can't add a new bank to her account either. I can't even electronically transfer money from my Vanguard individual account into her Roth :Grrrrr:

I have the form sitting on my desk, but can't get a sig. guarantee. So I gave up and just mail the deposit check in.
Last edited by RobG on Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
RobG
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:59 am
Location: Bozeman, MT

Postby RobG » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:49 pm

nisiprius wrote:I'd love to know the real details of the distinction.


From the wiki referenced above
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medallion_signature_guarantee wrote:A medallion signature guarantee is not the same as an acknowledgment by a notary public, in the sense that a "signature guarantee" is a certification by the institution that the signature is authentic, and an acknowledgment is a certification by a notary public attesting that the signer signed a document voluntarily.
RobG
 
Posts: 1182
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:59 am
Location: Bozeman, MT

Postby woof755 » Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:14 pm

My bank didn't offer the service, either. Small outfit, but has 5 or so branches.

Anyways, the bank officer with whom I spoke gave me the name of an acquaintance of hers at a different bank (not different branch) who was kind enough to provide me the medallion service, free of charge.

I felt like I was a high roller, or something.

The situation was very painful, though, and I remember not being able to fathom having something more specialized than a notary. The medallion guarantor did the same thing a regular notary would have done!
"By singing in harmony from the same page of the same investing hymnal, the Diehards drown out market noise." | | --Jason Zweig, quoted in The Bogleheads' Guide to Investing
User avatar
woof755
 
Posts: 3005
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 3:03 pm
Location: North Carolina

Postby csoren » Fri Jul 31, 2009 12:24 pm

I was worried about this last year because medallion signature guarantees are not available in Europe. On one visit to the US I went to Bank of America and had them give me 2 of those 'guarantees' on blank asset transfer forms from VG and BofA brokerage. (I was still in the planning stage but thought I would need them.) The bank manager was bemused but had no problem with the request (I've had an account there for a long time).

But I never needed to use them. I transferred my Roth from TRP to Vanguard last year with no signature guarantee and no problem. You just need to have Vanguard pull the funds rather than having TRP push them. As long as your name & SS are the same at both institutions then no guarantee is needed. I used VG's IRA transfer form and mailed that to them, but you may be able to do it online now. This page https://personal.vanguard.com/us/openaccount?CompLocation=IRA_overview&Component=TransferIRAOnlineRN has a VeriSign secured logo on it now.

I also did 2 partial IRA rollovers to a BofA brokerage account and again, having BofA pull the funds using their form, no signature guarantee was needed.

I'd better find those signed guarantees and put 'em in the shredder...
User avatar
csoren
 
Posts: 267
Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:22 pm
Location: DC 'burbs

Postby aainvestor » Fri Jul 31, 2009 12:38 pm

fishndoc wrote:Larry,

Your signature doesn't say where you reside, but if you have Wachovia (now Wells Fargo) nearby, you might check with them. We have two very small Wachovia branches near my home, and the managers at both locations can do Medallion Signature guarantees, so it may well be the same at all their locations. Also, they have some pretty good deals now trying to get in new accounts.

Also, as someone mentioned already: although it is a hassle, the Medallion requirement IS for our protection; it would be even more of a hassle if some on-line bandit made off with your money

Wayne


I used Wachovia for a Rollover from my 401k to D&C. Didnt even call, walked into my local branch and was out in 5 min.

Also I want anyone trying to move money out of my account to have to jump thru hoops. I want them to make every effort to make sure it was me.

I was buying a gift card at wachovia and i gave my account number and the teller never asked to see my Id, I asked her about it because I would not want anyone to be able to walk up and empty my account out by buying gift cards and them immediatly using them up.

F-
User avatar
aainvestor
 
Posts: 512
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 3:12 pm
Location: Northern Virginia

Postby nisiprius » Fri Jul 31, 2009 12:59 pm

RobG wrote:
nisiprius wrote:I'd love to know the real details of the distinction.


From the wiki referenced above
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medallion_signature_guarantee wrote:A medallion signature guarantee is not the same as an acknowledgment by a notary public, in the sense that a "signature guarantee" is a certification by the institution that the signature is authentic, and an acknowledgment is a certification by a notary public attesting that the signer signed a document voluntarily.
Bingo! Thanks.
Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness; Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.
User avatar
nisiprius
Advisory Board
 
Posts: 25791
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 10:33 am
Location: The terrestrial, globular, planetary hunk of matter, flattened at the poles, is my abode.--O. Henry

Postby retiredjg » Fri Jul 31, 2009 2:36 pm

csoren wrote: You just need to have Vanguard pull the funds rather than having TRP push them.

Now THAT is a very interesting concept.
retiredjg
 
Posts: 18122
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2008 1:56 pm

Postby sergeant » Fri Jul 31, 2009 8:26 pm

RobG wrote:
retiredjg wrote:Huh? Can't you just link the bank account to the Roth account? Maybe I've misunderstood your situation, but I've got mine linked and I just tell money to go one way or the other and it does....


I can go back/forth electronically between all my accounts except hers.

It is something maddeningly screwy, like our bank account is joint and her Roth is in her name. I forget the details, but they need a MDLN signature guarantee for electronic transfers to her account. I can't add a new bank to her account either. I can't even electronically transfer money from my Vanguard individual account into her Roth :Grrrrr:

I have the form sitting on my desk, but can't get a sig. guarantee. So I gave up and just mail the deposit check in.


Get someone back on the phone at Vanguard. You should only need the sig. guarantee to move money from a single account to a joint account. Going the other way is not a problem. The phone representative will put you on hold for a few minutes to get approval. I just went through this but eventually got the ok.
Sam One 10-8. Actually, Lincoln Five 10-8.
User avatar
sergeant
 
Posts: 409
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:13 am

What to do

Postby Dan Kohn » Fri Jul 31, 2009 9:35 pm

Go to the closest branch of a big national bank. Open a savings account or no-interest checking account with $10. Ask for the VP to do the medallion signature guarantee. Close the savings account, or leave it open in case you need to repeat.

It would take less than an hour, which is far less than you've already spent.
Image | | My autism therapy website.
User avatar
Dan Kohn
 
Posts: 1505
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:15 am
Location: New York, NY


Return to Investing - Help with Personal Investments

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Adastra, Alana888, Bing [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] and 38 guests