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Speedie
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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 Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| tfb wrote: | Thank you BearWolf for keeping us updated. This Vanguard offer is disappointing. Not allowing incoming rollovers. No online access for moving between funds? $20 fee per fund? No brokerage access.
| Quote: | | Employees can move money between different Vanguard funds by phone or in writing only. |
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Not sure that's entirely true. See this link which suggests that plan administrators can perform online exchanges. Given that the plan is designed for sole proprietors, the plan administrator is also highly likely to be the employee. Also fees in a Simple IRA are $25 per fund, so it's at least partially cheaper.
The lack of rollovers is very troubling though. Given that many people interested in the Individual 401(K) are likely to already have a Simple or SEP IRA, and that the Individual 401(K) has much higher contribution limits, rollovers would seem to be a basic requirement. |
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:02 am Post subject: |
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| Speedie wrote: | | tfb wrote: | Thank you BearWolf for keeping us updated. This Vanguard offer is disappointing. Not allowing incoming rollovers. No online access for moving between funds? $20 fee per fund? No brokerage access.
| Quote: | | Employees can move money between different Vanguard funds by phone or in writing only. |
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Not sure that's entirely true. See this link which suggests that plan administrators can perform online exchanges. Given that the plan is designed for sole proprietors, the plan administrator is also highly likely to be the employee. Also fees in a Simple IRA are $25 per fund, so it's at least partially cheaper.
The lack of rollovers is very troubling though. Given that many people interested in the Individual 401(K) are likely to already have a Simple or SEP IRA, and that the Individual 401(K) has much higher contribution limits, rollovers would seem to be a basic requirement. |
OK, that's better. Rollover is a must-have for me. Not having brokerage access also means you can't buy individual TIPS in this account. They should've made this competitive to SEP IRA, not SIMPLE IRA.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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| bearwolf wrote: |
It seems it is not ready for prime time yet. I called to speak to a rep and they said it won't officially be rolled out till december.
BearWolf |
Well, I jumped the gun again. While I was talking to the small business rep she transferred me to a Flagship rep. He told me that they were targeting November 10th for the rollout. I still don't know about part time employees.
BearWolf |
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Clevelander
Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm disappointed. Vanguard has chosen to limit participation to sole proprietors and partners. This rules out owners of corporations like me. Guess I'll stick with Fidelity. |
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Speedie
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Clevelander wrote: | | I'm disappointed. Vanguard has chosen to limit participation to sole proprietors and partners. This rules out owners of corporations like me. Guess I'll stick with Fidelity. |
Do you own the corporation but not have any employees? If so then IMHO you are a sole proprietor regardless of corporate structure. A Vanguard rep would probably clear that up for you. |
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psychdoc
Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 3:48 pm Post subject: Re: Fees |
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Fees are waived if Voyager or above status
This is from vanguard website.
Account fees
Fee or Cost Amount When Does a Fee Not Apply?
Account service fee
$20 per year each Vanguard fund in an Individual 401(k) account.
If at least one participant in a Vanguard Individual 401(k) plan qualifies for Flagship™, Voyager Select™, or Voyager™ Services, the account service fee will be waived for all participants in the plan. |
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expat
Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 249
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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>> Rollover is a must-have for me.
Why do you need to roll your SEP IRA into a 401K? You can keep it open and open a solo-401k. Also, it is more difficult to withdraw from a 401k than a SEP IRA in case of an emergency. |
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Speedie
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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Speaking personally, my assets are in a simple 3 fund portfolio within a Simple IRA. Vanguard already charges me $25 per fund per year, I don't want to duplicate the portfolio in an Individual 401(K) and pay another $20 per fund per year. That's quite a cost drag for a smaller investor.
I guess the bigger point is why wouldn't they allow such rollovers? It's all pre-tax money and the other players in this field allow them. |
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Spirit Rider
Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 270
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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One reason for rollovers to an individual 401k is to effectively do non-deductible Roth convenrsions. Roth conversions are prorated as to all your IRA funds. If you have substantial non-deductible IRA contributions you can not "just" convert those. You have to prorate all your IRAs.
However, if you rollover all your deductible IRAs to a 401k, you can convert all your non-deductible IRA funds and only pay taxes on the gains.In 2010 Roth conversion are not income limited. So if you don't have deductible IRA funds, you can do a non-deductible IRA contribution and immediately do a Roth conversion with no tax liability.
Many people (including myself) have been doing non-deductible IRA contributions in anticipation of 2010.
P.S. This may be why they are not allowing rollovers. One additional reason is that you can not rollover non-deductible contributions. They may not want to deal with the mess of trying to ensure people comply with this if they don't have direct knowledge of the funds. |
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segfault
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 115
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Apparently, you're on your own for preparing IRS form 5500 if the value of your account exceeds $250,000. (Not an issue for me, but I hope to have that problem someday!) |
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giacolet
Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 798
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
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| Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 12:05 am Post subject: |
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The link isn't working now although it worked yesterday. I can't find anything on the Vanguard site when I search Individual 401K.
Has the solo 401k already been withdrawn?
I printed off every page yesterday and all internal references that provide expanded information including the nine page tour.
I, too, was not able to download the application form.
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May you stay forever young.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| giacolet wrote: | The link isn't working now although it worked yesterday. I can't find anything on the Vanguard site when I search Individual 401K.
Has the solo 401k already been withdrawn?
I printed off every page yesterday and all internal references that provide expanded information including the nine page tour.
I, too, was not able to download the application form. |
I don't think it has been withdrawn. They probably realized they were getting hits on it and removed it from public access. Based on my conversation with the Vanguard rep I think you will be able to access it on the real Vanguard site on Monday.
BearWolf |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| giacolet wrote: | The link isn't working now although it worked yesterday. I can't find anything on the Vanguard site when I search Individual 401K.
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Looks like the link is back.
BearWolf |
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giacolet
Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 798
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
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| Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 3:47 pm Post subject: Individual 401k on Vanguard Site |
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Thank you BearWolf. The link is back but it takes one to Easy Account Management rather than to Vanguard Individual 401k.
Use the menu on the left to get back to the beginning.
The on-line and printed applications are still not available.
Two steps forward, one step back.
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 1:12 am Post subject: |
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Has anybody looked at ING's Sharebuilder Solo 401(k)? Their expense ratios seem pretty good, and they will allow other employees in their "Two to Ten" plan.
http://www.sharebuilder401k.com/
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Speedie
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| tfb wrote: | | Rollover is a must-have for me. |
Just a thought as we're in the same boat on this: is there any reason you couldn't establish a Solo 401(k) with for example 401kbrokers.com (who do accept rollovers), perform the rollover, then roll those assets into a Vanguard Individual 401(k)? Vanguard indicate on their site that rollovers from an existing Solo 401(k) are permissible (link - scroll all the way to the bottom).
For someone with a one-time need to do a rollover, which would be me since I want to get my Simple IRA assets into an Individual 401(K), I see no reason why that wouldn't work? |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="Speedie"] | tfb wrote: |
For someone with a one-time need to do a rollover, which would be me since I want to get my Simple IRA assets into an Individual 401(K), I see no reason why that wouldn't work? |
Is the individual 401K part of the tax package that is set to expire in 2010? Or will we still be eligible after that? I hate to go through setting up a plan, rolling it into another plan and then find out I have to shut it down after 2010.
BearWolf |
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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I'm working on a spreadsheet comparing Solo 401(k) offerings from different companies. If anybody knows the answer to any of the boxes I have ?'s in, or suggestions for improvement, I hope you'll let me know either in this thread or via PM.
http://spreadsheets.google.com....sxMk9ruhfA
(I looked into Sharebuilder by ING and dismissed it -- the fees are too much and I can't find their investment options)
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Speedie wrote: | Just a thought as we're in the same boat on this: is there any reason you couldn't establish a Solo 401(k) with for example 401kbrokers.com (who do accept rollovers), perform the rollover, then roll those assets into a Vanguard Individual 401(k)? Vanguard indicate on their site that rollovers from an existing Solo 401(k) are permissible (link - scroll all the way to the bottom).
For someone with a one-time need to do a rollover, which would be me since I want to get my Simple IRA assets into an Individual 401(K), I see no reason why that wouldn't work? |
It would but I don't feel like using somebody just as a bridge. I want to be able to keep my individual bonds anyway. I didn't see a brokerage option in Vanguard's Individual 401(k). I will just use Fidelity.
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Ducks wrote: | I'm working on a spreadsheet comparing Solo 401(k) offerings from different companies. If anybody knows the answer to any of the boxes I have ?'s in, or suggestions for improvement, I hope you'll let me know either in this thread or via PM.
http://spreadsheets.google.com....sxMk9ruhfA |
Roth option: Vanguard yes, TRP yes.
Fidelity uses a standard brokerage account. You can buy any mutual fund, ETF, bond, or CD. It's not limited to only Fidelity funds. From the limited info on Vanguard's website, Vanguard's plan is limited to Vanguard funds only. TRP's plan is also limited to TRP funds only.
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psychdoc
Joined: 18 Jun 2008
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 4:26 pm Post subject: Solo 401k permanent |
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| Quote: | | Is the individual 401K part of the tax package that is set to expire in 2010? |
Apparently the Pension Protection Act of 2006 made provisions for individual 401k's permanent. I'm guessing Vanguard waited until after it was passed before they decided to offer this option.
See this link:
http://www.eons.com/money/feat....oyed/13527 |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Ducks wrote: | I'm working on a spreadsheet comparing Solo 401(k) offerings from different companies. If anybody knows the answer to any of the boxes I have ?'s in, or suggestions for improvement, I hope you'll let me know either in this thread or via PM.
http://spreadsheets.google.com....sxMk9ruhfA
(I looked into Sharebuilder by ING and dismissed it -- the fees are too much and I can't find their investment options) |
Would you consider adding theonline401k.com to your spreadsheet? They are currently my leading contender.
BearWolf
Company Theonline401k
Website theonline401k.com
Plan Name Single(K)
Allow Rollovers yes
Allow Other Employees Spouse and part time yes
Roth Option yes
Account Maintenance fee $175 per year flat fee $25 for spouse
Account closure fee ?
Expense ratio (standard vanguard ERs)
Fund Minmum (standard vanguard minimum) |
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2008 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the suggestions/fixes, bearwolf & TFB. I've added them.
http://spreadsheets.google.com....sxMk9ruhfA
Bearwolf - does online 401k have additional admin fee for part time employees as well? I tried to add them onto my spreadsheet earlier but got confused by their website, so I'm glad you were able to hunt the details down.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 2:32 am Post subject: |
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| Ducks wrote: | | Bearwolf - does online 401k have additional admin fee for part time employees as well? I tried to add them onto my spreadsheet earlier but got confused by their website, so I'm glad you were able to hunt the details down. |
I don't think there is a fee. I think their plan allows you to specifically exclude part time employees. They will not allow you to open a plan at Fidelity if you have part time employees because their plan document doesn't specifically exclude them. That is the main question I want to get answered at Vanguard when they finally roll out the plan.
BearWolf |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Ducks wrote: | Thanks for the suggestions/fixes, bearwolf & TFB. I've added them.
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Ducks, do you have part time employees? I was curious if that was a consideration for you and which plan you are leaning towards. I noticed that theonline401k will prepare the form 5500 for a fee of $175, do you know if that is included in any of the other plans?
BearWolf
I looked at the Vanguard web site this morning and still no Individual 401k info. Looks like they are still pushing it out. |
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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Bearwolf - I am a part-time sole proprietor. No employees for me. I hope to sock away my entire net earnings of about $16k. It'll be a while before I hit this $250,000 limit and have to deal with Form 5500. 
At this time I am leaning toward going with Vanguard, and keeping the # of funds to a minimum.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 9:10 am Post subject: |
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Yay! The individual 401K is now available on the Vanguard website. It's weird because I called yesterday asking about it and they said they didn't know when it would be released.
BearWolf |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 11:57 am Post subject: |
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| bearwolf wrote: | Yay! The individual 401K is now available on the Vanguard website. It's weird because I called yesterday asking about it and they said they didn't know when it would be released.
BearWolf |
What a rollercoaster. Even though you can get to the information from the public web site it still isn't available. The rep said sorry about that but just keep checking back. I'm almost ready to give up on them, it's like no one knows what's going on.
BearWolf |
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Quantext
Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:04 pm Post subject: 401(k) for small firms |
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Hi:
My small company has a 401(k) plan through Edward Jones. The advantage is that it is low cost and allows me to invest in anything I want. There are cheaper plans--like the solo 401(k)--but I have not found one that provides the breadth of choices that I can get with my Edward Jones account. |
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Bri guy
Joined: 11 Nov 2008
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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| First off, Thank-you for all the info on the Vanguard individual 401k. Very helpful stuff! This my first reply to anyone so be patient . I called the phone number from the above mentioned Vanguard site and the rep. I talked to could not access the site I was on. So....... The indiv. 401k is STILL not available. Sucks! Blah, blah, " hope to have by end of year"The rep. was very helpful in answering a lot of ?'s though. There is no minimum to open the Ind. 401k, the $20 per account fee can not be waived if you sign up for the "e-delivery" as it is not available on the Ind. 401k. He was not sure how they were going to split an account if as I want to put 1/2 in a roth and the other 1/2 in the tax deductible type. As I recall reading in the IRS Ind. 401k guidelines the roth part has to come from the "elective deferrals" . Got to scoot to work. Hope to write more later. Thanks again for all the info. |
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Sonoran
Joined: 27 Jan 2008
Posts: 107
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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What a rollercoaster. Even though you can get to the information from the public web site it still isn't available. The rep said sorry about that but just keep checking back. I'm almost ready to give up on them, it's like no one knows what's going on.
Thanks again BearWolf. If they have all this information already available on their website, I would think that Vanguard should be rolling it out soon.
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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I can't believe I am the one to break this news... 
INDIVIDUAL 401(K)
Vanguard Individual 401(k)'s are now available. For more information or to
request an application, please see the below link.
https://personal.vanguard.com/....ontent.jsp
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Speedie
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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| The application PDF seems to be password protected? |
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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I'm on the phone w/ them now. hope to have an answer shortly.
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Speedie wrote: | | The application PDF seems to be password protected? |
Tried Vanguard, vanguard, 401k. Didn't work.
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Ducks
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 498
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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They said their web team is having trouble with that link, and that if I wanted she'd send it to me by mail. I said sounds good.
So, for those of you who don't want to wait for the link to come back up, give them a call and ask for a mailed copy. 7-10 days ETA, she said.
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Sonoran
Joined: 27 Jan 2008
Posts: 107
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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I called Vanguard yesterday to ask a few questions about the Solo 401k Plan and the rep said that he wasn't allowed to discuss anything about it until it's officially released.
He did go on to say that we was told that it would be out by the end of the 4th quarter... but no specific date.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:29 pm Post subject: Re: 401(k) for small firms |
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| Quantext wrote: | Hi:
My small company has a 401(k) plan through Edward Jones. The advantage is that it is low cost and allows me to invest in anything I want. There are cheaper plans--like the solo 401(k)--but I have not found one that provides the breadth of choices that I can get with my Edward Jones account. |
I onlyl plan to put one or possibly two funds in mine. It will be part of a larger portfolio and will only contain my tax inefficient holdings like Bonds, TIPS or REIT. I really don't need a large range of choices.
BearWolf |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Ducks wrote: | They said their web team is having trouble with that link, and that if I wanted she'd send it to me by mail. I said sounds good.
So, for those of you who don't want to wait for the link to come back up, give them a call and ask for a mailed copy. 7-10 days ETA, she said. |
I was not able to access the form from the public Vanguard site, It prompted me for a password. But when I logged in I was able to download the PDF application form. I called and spoke with my flagship rep and he wasn't able to answer specific questions. You have to speak with the small business rep and they go home at 7:00 Eastern time.
But now that the plan is available I can at least make a decision and move on. Assuming the small business people are able to make a determination on part time employees.
Bearwolf |
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Sonoran
Joined: 27 Jan 2008
Posts: 107
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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Even though I started this topic, I recently realized that a SEP IRA is the best choice for my situation. Doh!
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Speedie
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:17 am Post subject: |
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If you go to "Forms" and search for "Individual", the whole plan setup package is available (seems to work whether you're logged in or not).
Now to try to get them to allow rollovers.... |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:55 am Post subject: |
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| Sonoran wrote: | | Even though I started this topic, I recently realized that a SEP IRA is the best choice for my situation. Doh! |
I'm beginning to feel the same way. I won't be able to defer as much money each year, but it is sure a lot less hassle.
If you don't mind my asking why are you leaning toward the SEP and away from the Individual 401k. For me there seems to be a large hassle factor as far as being the plan administrator. Also having part time employees seems to be a deal killer for Vanguard and Fidelity. The third party vendors don't seem to have any problems with excluding them though.
Bearwolf |
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:34 am Post subject: |
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It looks like you won't be able exclude part-time employees from the Vanguard plan because the adoption agreement does not let you specify any age or service requirement. However my reading of the Fidelity plan is that you can exclude part-time employees from participating. From Fidelity plan document:
| Quote: | 2.37. Year of Service. “Year of Service” means a period of 12 consecutive months, commencing on the date on which an individual first performs an Hour of Service or on any anniversary thereof, during which he is credited with at least 1,000 Hours of Service; except that in the case of an Employee who returns to service with the Employer after having incurred a Break in Service, the 12-month period shall commence on the date on which he first performs an Hour of Service after the Break in Service, and each anniversary thereof.
3.1. General Rule. Each Employee shall become a Participant on the first day of the calendar month in which he first fulfills the age and service requirements specified by the Employer in the Adoption Agreement. |
If you require 1 year of service in the Adoption Agreement under the Coverage section, any employee who doesn't perform at least 1,000 hours of service within 12 months will never meet the eligibility requirement. Therefore you can have part-time employees and only have owner and spouse participate in the plan. If you are still interested in the Fidelity plan, ask them specifically about this section 2.37. They might have misunderstood thinking you wanted your part-time employees be participants, which no solo 401k plan will allow.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| tfb wrote: | | Therefore you can have part-time employees and only have owner and spouse participate in the plan. If you are still interested in the Fidelity plan, ask them specifically about this section 2.37. They might have misunderstood thinking you wanted your part-time employees be participants, which no solo 401k plan will allow. |
Thanks, I didn't actually dig into the plan document. I have called and talked to 2 or 3 reps who told me I couldn't sign up if I had part time employees. I'll check back with them on it though. Thanks again!
BearWolf |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| tfb wrote: |
They might have misunderstood thinking you wanted your part-time employees be participants, which no solo 401k plan will allow. |
Well, this is cool and frustrating. I called Fidelity (for the 5th or 6th time, i've lost track) and asked about that paragraph. They said, oh yeah! you can open it if you have part time employees, that's not a problem. The only problem comes if the part timers go above 1000 hours and are eligible.
So I called Vanguard and asked them the same question again. I described my conversation with Fidelity and asked if they had similar language in their plan document. The rep and I spent some time on the phone going over the plan but couldn't find it. She said there adoption agreement says something about the plan only being for individuals or individuals and their spouse. I left it at that and plan to read the plan document this weekend and see if there are any possibilities of opening with part time employees. I did ask what would happen if I opened the plan without part time employees (fire the kids), and then hired them next year. She said I would no longer be eligible to contribute to the plan.
It looks like my options are to go with 401K brokers, Fidelity, theonline401k or fire the kids and go with Vanguard. I think the minimum hassle option is looking like going with Fidelity.
Thanks Finance Buff for pointing out the section of Fidos plan.
BearWolf |
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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| bearwolf wrote: | It looks like my options are to go with 401K brokers, Fidelity, theonline401k or fire the kids and go with Vanguard. I think the minimum hassle option is looking like going with Fidelity.
Thanks Finance Buff for pointing out the section of Fidos plan. |
I'm glad you finally got a confirmation from Fidelity about the part-time employees issue. Too bad you have to put the issue directly under their nose. I sent in my paperwork to Fidelity earlier this week. Minimum hassle and more flexibility with their brokerage setup which lets me buy ETFs and bonds. With so many ETFs out there, the advantage of traditional open-end funds is getting smaller and smaller.
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The Finance Buff |
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DaveH
Joined: 16 May 2008
Posts: 663
Location: Los Angeles, Bangkok, Louisiana, New York City
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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I do my Solo 401k with Schwab but it would be nice to move it over to Vanguard. The application link is still password protected, but obviously they are very close to setting it up so I'm happy! It's so late in the year, I'd much rather go for a Jan 2009 transfer to Vanguard just to keep tax time simple.
One question I have is about the fees. With Schwab, the Solo 401k is free. With Vanguard, it looks like there might be a $20/account fee, which is pretty cheap.
Are there any other fees that I'm not seeing?
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The fewer our wants, the nearer we resemble the gods. — Socrates |
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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| tfb wrote: | | I'm glad you finally got a confirmation from Fidelity about the part-time employees issue. Too bad you have to put the issue directly under their nose. I sent in my paperwork to Fidelity earlier this week. Minimum hassle and more flexibility with their brokerage setup which lets me buy ETFs and bonds. With so many ETFs out there, the advantage of traditional open-end funds is getting smaller and smaller. |
Yea, it's weird that you would have to press so hard. I would think they would try to open more accounts rather than fewer. Maybe they don't get that question very often.
Do you know much about Fido bond funds? I suspect that is what I will primarily have in this account.
BearWolf |
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tfb
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3584
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| Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| bearwolf wrote: | | Do you know much about Fido bond funds? I suspect that is what I will primarily have in this account. |
I will fill mine with TIPS bonds and REIT ETF. You can buy Treasury bonds (nominal and TIPS) at auction for free. You can also buy FDIC-insured CDs for free. You can also buy Vanguard and iShares bond ETFs. Not really necessary to limit yourself to Fidelity bond funds.
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bearwolf
Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 1037
Location: Oklahoma
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 12:20 am Post subject: |
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| DaveH wrote: | I do my Solo 401k with Schwab but it would be nice to move it over to Vanguard. The application link is still password protected, but obviously they are very close to setting it up so I'm happy! It's so late in the year, I'd much rather go for a Jan 2009 transfer to Vanguard just to keep tax time simple.
One question I have is about the fees. With Schwab, the Solo 401k is free. With Vanguard, it looks like there might be a $20/account fee, which is pretty cheap.
Are there any other fees that I'm not seeing? |
Do you have a current online account at Vanguard? I tried opening the account form before logging in and it was password protected. After I logged in I was able to access it.
I Don't think there are additional fees.
BearWolf |
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