Taiwan Local Chapter

[Mel Lindauer]

Hi Everyone:

The Bogleheads message and reach are expanding into Asia.

I'm happy to announce that we have a new Local Chapter in Taiwan. If you're interested in joining, or you know someone who is, here's the contact information:

Contact Name = Kelvin
Email address = service.taiwanbogleheads@gmail.com

You can contact Kelvin directly or you can express your interest here on this thread.

Good luck to Kelvin and our Taiwan Bogleheads.

(FWIW, Kelvin, an author, flew 8000 miles to attend our recent Bogleheads 11 Conference.)

[stan1]

你好 (Hello!)

[Mel Lindauer]

你好 (Hello!)

And "Hello" to you, too!

[verfasser]

Dear Mel,

Thanks for your help.
I hope we can have our first meeting in Taipei in 2013.

Any Bogleheads from Taiwan interested in this event?

[Tim_in_GA]

That's pretty cool! I had no idea there would be an interest over there. Hopefully the local chapter is still around by the time I retire and move to Taiwan.

[Faith20879]

That's pretty cool! I had no idea there would be an interest over there. Hopefully the local chapter is still around by the time I retire and move to Taiwan.

What a coincident! We (me and DH) also looked into that possibility. But eventually its high cost of living (compare to other SE countries) and extreme humidity voted it off our list.

Now about investing BH style in TW, would you be investing in the US or the TW market? From what I hear, their stock market is largely still like a roulette and index funds are non-existing. Is that a wrong impression?


Best,
Faith

[Tim_in_GA]

What a coincident! We (me and DH) also looked into that possibility. But eventually its high cost of living (compare to other SE countries) and extreme humidity voted it off our list.

Now about investing BH style in TW, would you be investing in the US or the TW market? From what I hear, their stock market is largely still like a roulette and index funds are non-existing. Is that a wrong impression?

Best,
Faith

Yeah, the real estate prices are quite high but other than that things are very affordable. It's my wife's home country so it will be very easy for me to get permanent residency. Although I wouldn't rule out other areas in SE Asia. Who knows, in 15 years or so a lot can change.

I will merge all my retirement funds into Vanguard funds when I retire and just transfer cash around when I need it. I have no interest in the TW market. I think it is a lot like you said. Nobody in my wife's family except her older brother does any real investing. That's why I was surprised about a BH chapter there. I don't picture many Taiwanese investing the BH way.

-Tim

[edge]

I have a home in Taiwan in Kaohsiung. It is my wife's home country and we spend a month or two there during 'Winter' every few years. I too am surprised there are enough Boglehead-like investors in TW to support a chapter.

[Mel Lindauer]

I have a home in Taiwan in Kaohsiung. It is my wife's home country and we spend a month or two there during 'Winter' every few years. I too am surprised there are enough Boglehead-like investors in TW to support a chapter.

Actually, there's a Chinese version of our first book (The Bogleheads' Guide to Investing). Here's a link: http://product.dangdang.com/product.asp ... d=20735133

[verfasser]

In Taiwan, we have some index funds and ETFs tracking local stock and bond markets.
But for international markets, our choice is very limited.
One solution is to open U.S brokerage accounts.
Then we can use all the ETFs in the States.

That's pretty cool! I had no idea there would be an interest over there. Hopefully the local chapter is still around by the time I retire and move to Taiwan.

What a coincident! We (me and DH) also looked into that possibility. But eventually its high cost of living (compare to other SE countries) and extreme humidity voted it off our list.

Now about investing BH style in TW, would you be investing in the US or the TW market? From what I hear, their stock market is largely still like a roulette and index funds are non-existing. Is that a wrong impression?


Best,
Faith

[verfasser]

I am a Boglehead from Taiwan and I have a financial Blog.
In my blog, I write lots of articles talking about the benefits of indexing and asset allocation, what Mr. Bogle did and the importance of cost.
Now my blog has 13,000 feedburder subscribers. And most of them are local investors.

The biggest ETF in Taiwan is Polaris Taiwan Top 50 Tracking Fund, which is the counterpart of SPY.
It has more assets than any active equity funds investing in Taiwan's stock market.
And the largest index fund in Taiwan ranks top ten in assets.

Although still a minority when compared with active investors, there are many indexers in our country.

What a coincident! We (me and DH) also looked into that possibility. But eventually its high cost of living (compare to other SE countries) and extreme humidity voted it off our list.

Now about investing BH style in TW, would you be investing in the US or the TW market? From what I hear, their stock market is largely still like a roulette and index funds are non-existing. Is that a wrong impression?

Best,
Faith

Yeah, the real estate prices are quite high but other than that things are very affordable. It's my wife's home country so it will be very easy for me to get permanent residency. Although I wouldn't rule out other areas in SE Asia. Who knows, in 15 years or so a lot can change.

I will merge all my retirement funds into Vanguard funds when I retire and just transfer cash around when I need it. I have no interest in the TW market. I think it is a lot like you said. Nobody in my wife's family except her older brother does any real investing. That's why I was surprised about a BH chapter there. I don't picture many Taiwanese investing the BH way.

-Tim

[verfasser]

What a surprise. I don't expect my home town to be mentioned in this thread. Kaohsiung is the biggest harbor in Taiwan., It locates in southern part of Taiwan, facing the Taiwan Strait. With a population of 2.7 million, it is also the second largest city in Taiwan.

I have a home in Taiwan in Kaohsiung. It is my wife's home country and we spend a month or two there during 'Winter' every few years. I too am surprised there are enough Boglehead-like investors in TW to support a chapter.

[stan1]

What a surprise. I don't expect my home town to be mentioned in this thread. Kaohsiung is the biggest harbor in Taiwan., It locates in southern part of Taiwan, facing the Taiwan Strait. With a population of 2.7 million, it is also the second largest city in Taiwan.

I have a home in Taiwan in Kaohsiung. It is my wife's home country and we spend a month or two there during 'Winter' every few years. I too am surprised there are enough Boglehead-like investors in TW to support a chapter.

I have ridden the high speed rail to Kaohsiung, and even stopped to visit the 1000 Buddha Temple for an hour between business meetings (but I think there may have been closer to 1,000,000 Buddhas). But -- alas -- there is no Din Tai Fung in Kaohsiung.

I am not at all surprised to hear that there is a large following of index fund investors in Taiwan.

[simplesimon]

Can you provide a link to your blog?

Edit: Nevermind, found it!

[Tim_in_GA]

I am a Boglehead from Taiwan and I have a financial Blog.
In my blog, I write lots of articles talking about the benefits of indexing and asset allocation, what Mr. Bogle did and the importance of cost.
Now my blog has 13,000 feedburder subscribers. And most of them are local investors.

The biggest ETF in Taiwan is Polaris Taiwan Top 50 Tracking Fund, which is the counterpart of SPY.
It has more assets than any active equity funds investing in Taiwan's stock market.
And the largest index fund in Taiwan ranks top ten in assets.

Although still a minority when compared with active investors, there are many indexers in our country.

Very interesting - thanks!

But -- alas -- there is no Din Tai Fung in Kaohsiung.

That's a shame for such a big city. I miss them - there's only one place in Atlanta where you can get xiao-long-bao that comes close to DTF. They just opened one in Taichung and we'll be there next year visiting my wife's family.

[verfasser]

I am a Boglehead from Taiwan and I have a financial Blog.
In my blog, I write lots of articles talking about the benefits of indexing and asset allocation, what Mr. Bogle did and the importance of cost.
Now my blog has 13,000 feedburder subscribers. And most of them are local investors.

The biggest ETF in Taiwan is Polaris Taiwan Top 50 Tracking Fund, which is the counterpart of SPY.
It has more assets than any active equity funds investing in Taiwan's stock market.
And the largest index fund in Taiwan ranks top ten in assets.

Although still a minority when compared with active investors, there are many indexers in our country.

Very interesting - thanks!

But -- alas -- there is no Din Tai Fung in Kaohsiung.

That's a shame for such a big city. I miss them - there's only one place in Atlanta where you can get xiao-long-bao that comes close to DTF. They just opened one in Taichung and we'll be there next year visiting my wife's family.

Wow! I don't expect so many of you have some kind of connection with Taiwan.

Din Tai Fung serves tasty food with reasonable price. Last Saturday I had dinner at its Taichung branch.
This restaurant is expanding rapidly. You can find it in Seatle and LA.

[Tim_in_GA]

Wow! I don't expect so many of you have some kind of connection with Taiwan.

Yeah, I really love it over there. My first visits to Taiwan were on business over 12 years ago. Initially it was a shock as that was my first time outside North America. Then I met my wife while on one of those business trips and all that changed. Unfortunately I don't get to go there on business any more but we do go back every other year to see family and travel around the island with all our camera gear. It's such a beautiful place with so many photo opportunities.

Glad to hear there are some Boglehead-minded investors there. It will be nice to have some people locally to talk to when I eventually move there. My wife has no interest in that stuff.

[Faith20879]

Din Tai Fung serves tasty food with reasonable price.

Huh? I was in TW for a business trip in 2007. The University staff took us lunch there. The only thing I remembered from that meal was their jaw-dropping price.

In another thread that’s going on right now -“Vacation to Washington DC”, someone said “…Metro is cheap…”. I almost couldn’t believe my eyes.

Perhaps I am just a little dated.

Regards,
Faith

[suming]

Very happy to hear the good news!!
- I moved from windy city, Taiwan to another windy city, US about 20 some years ago -
Taiwan is such a friendly country. Can't wait to move back there in retirement.

[sscritic]

This restaurant is expanding rapidly. You can find it in Seatle and LA.

http://www.dintaifungusa.com/locations_us.html

What should I order?
http://www.dintaifungusa.com/menu_la.html

[Tim_in_GA]

What should I order?
http://www.dintaifungusa.com/menu_la.html

You must get xiao-long-bao. It's what they are famous for. Look under "Steamed Dumplings" and get the "Juicy Pork Dumplings" and the "Juicy Pork & Crab Dumplings." Those are our standard go-to items. We tried some other stuff once at their oldest Taipei location but it wasn't outstanding. We just stick with the XLB there from now on.

[sscritic]

What should I order?
http://www.dintaifungusa.com/menu_la.html

You must get xiao-long-bao. It's what they are famous for. Look under "Steamed Dumplings" and get the "Juicy Pork Dumplings" and the "Juicy Pork & Crab Dumplings." Those are our standard go-to items. We tried some other stuff once at their oldest Taipei location but it wasn't outstanding. We just stick with the XLB there from now on.

Thanks. I have had the dumplings that squirt all over the place when you bite into them (thus the required spoon and gentle teeth), and I thought they were the XLB, but I wasn't sure. The green melon and shrimp looked interesting as well.

P.S. I fixed your quote.

[stan1]

My other favorite:
Sung Chu (for Roasted Duck), in an alley across from the main Taipei bus station/MRT station.

[Faith20879]

...and get the "Juicy Pork Dumplings" and the "Juicy Pork & Crab Dumplings."...

...I have had the dumplings that squirt all over the place...

Yes, Tim is right, #D2 it was. If I recall, the word "juicy" real meant "soupy" as it was explained to me. The secret is in the dough, it has to be strong enough to hold the extra juice so it doesn't collapse between the chopsticks and yet tender (or thin) enough so that you don't taste the “doughiness”.

I envy you west-coasters. The closest place to get something as good is 5 hours away in NYC.

Regards,
Faith

[Tim_in_GA]

Yes, Tim is right, #D2 it was. If I recall, the word "juicy" real meant "soupy" as it was explained to me. The secret is in the dough, it has to be strong enough to hold the extra juice so it doesn't collapse between the chopsticks and yet tender (or thin) enough so that you don't taste the “doughiness”.

I envy you west-coasters. The closest place to get something as good is 5 hours away in NYC.

Regards,
Faith

Yep, Din Tai Fung does a great job with that thin, translucent skin. Our local place serves some good regular and crab XLB but it's thicker with much more of a "bite" to the skin.

Sometimes you'll hear it called xiao-long-tang-bao (小籠湯包) where "tang" mean soup.

Sorry this is turning into a food discussion but it's hard to mention Taiwan without talking about the food. My wife has me converted to Taiwanese when it comes to eating and I really miss the food as much as she does!

[HueyLD]

What should I order?
http://www.dintaifungusa.com/menu_la.html

You must get xiao-long-bao. It's what they are famous for. Look under "Steamed Dumplings" and get the "Juicy Pork Dumplings" and the "Juicy Pork & Crab Dumplings." Those are our standard go-to items. We tried some other stuff once at their oldest Taipei location but it wasn't outstanding. We just stick with the XLB there from now on.

Thanks. I have had the dumplings that squirt all over the place when you bite into them (thus the required spoon and gentle teeth), and I thought they were the XLB, but I wasn't sure. The green melon and shrimp looked interesting as well.

Geez, it may be worth a trip to the LA area just for food. However, I have a hard time driving on the country's biggest parking lots (a/k/a LA area freeways).

[verfasser]

The first annual meeting of Taiwan Bogleheads will be held on May 11, 2013 in Taipei from 13:00-17:20.

The event will be held at Mr.Brown Coffee, Naking 1st Branch.(Address :No.218, Sec. 2, Nanjing E. Rd., Taipei City, Taiwan)

We invite three financial authors to give speeches.

The first is Mr.Chen. (That's me). He uses Greenhorn as his penname. He has published three investment books and translated "The Investor's Manifesto" into traditional chinese. He is a vocal proponent of indexing and asset allocation. His blog has more than 14,000 subscribers.

The second author is Mr. Xiao. His penname is 怪老子. He has 2 investment titles. His first book "The Investment Principles You Should Know When You Get Your First Paycheck." is a long-time best seller.

The third author is Mr. Liu. He works in the insurance business. He builds his career by selling term-life insurances. He deeply believes that the correct objective of an insurance policy is to provide adequate protection. His books about insurance have a profound impact on the general public in Taiwan.

If you would like to know more about this event and how to register, please see the annoucement at:
http://greenhornfinancefootnote.blogspo ... nnual.html

[Mel Lindauer]

Hi Kelvin:

It's great to see that the Bogleheads Taiwan Local Chapter is up and running, thanks to your leadership. It was a pleasure meeting you at Bogleheads 11 last year. I want to wish you and the rest of the Taiwan Bogleheads all the very best. Good luck with your upcoming meeting!

[verfasser]

Hi Kelvin:

It's great to see that the Bogleheads Taiwan Local Chapter is up and running, thanks to your leadership. It was a pleasure meeting you at Bogleheads 11 last year. I want to wish you and the rest of the Taiwan Bogleheads all the very best. Good luck with your upcoming meeting!

Hello Mel,

Thank you. It's really great to be a Boglehead.

In less than 24 hr after the annoucemnt of this event, the 100 seats are completely sold out.
I have to ask the manager of the coffee house if they can accomodate more people.

This is a good start.

[LadyGeek]

Hello Kelvin,

May I suggest you consider creating a wiki article to describe Bogleheads investing for Taiwan?

For example, we have investing articles for European Union, Japan, and United Kingdom. Investing in Canada is treated by our sister Canadian forum: finiki, the Canadian financial Wiki.

Considerations include market composition, taxations, regulations, and available funds. There could be many interesting discussions to achieve a consensus on these topics, the results will help new investors. It could also be a topic of your blog.

If there is an interest, just start a new thread.

It was also my pleasure to meet you at the Bogleheads 11 conference and I wish you good luck with your meeting!

[Tim_in_GA]

May I suggest you consider creating a wiki article to describe Bogleheads investing for Taiwan?

I would love to see something like that since I will eventually be living there. My wife & I have talked about setting up an investment account over there when we visit next year and start building up some savings in local currency.

[Barry Barnitz]

Hi:
As an aid to getting started, I have created a template and category for any future Taiwan related pages in the wiki: Category:Taiwan - Bogleheads

Some quick search links:
Taiwan Stock Exchange (TWSE) (english)
FTSE TWSE Taiwan 50 Index (english)
FTSE Taiwan index series
Central Bank of the Republic of China (Taiwan), Government Securities Services (english)

Papers:
Andy Lin and Anthony Chou, The Tracking Error and Premium/ Discount of Taiwan’s First Exchange Traded Fund web journal of Chinese Management Review, Vol. 9, No. 3, November 2006.

regards,

[verfasser]

Hello Kelvin,

May I suggest you consider creating a wiki article to describe Bogleheads investing for Taiwan?

For example, we have investing articles for European Union, Japan, and United Kingdom. Investing in Canada is treated by our sister Canadian forum: finiki, the Canadian financial Wiki.

Considerations include market composition, taxations, regulations, and available funds. There could be many interesting discussions to achieve a consensus on these topics, the results will help new investors. It could also be a topic of your blog.

If there is an interest, just start a new thread.

It was also my pleasure to meet you at the Bogleheads 11 conference and I wish you good luck with your meeting!

Hello LadyGeek,

That'a an interesting proposal.
I would like to write an article and let more people know the investment environment in Taiwan.

It's great to meet you and all the Bogleheads at BH11. It's a very special experience.

[verfasser]

Hi:
As an aid to getting started, I have created a template and category for any future Taiwan related pages in the wiki: Category:Taiwan - Bogleheads

Some quick search links:
Taiwan Stock Exchange (TWSE) (english)
FTSE TWSE Taiwan 50 Index (english)
FTSE Taiwan index series
Central Bank of the Republic of China (Taiwan), Government Securities Services (english)

Papers:
Andy Lin and Anthony Chou, The Tracking Error and Premium/ Discount of Taiwan’s First Exchange Traded Fund web journal of Chinese Management Review, Vol. 9, No. 3, November 2006.

regards,

Hello Barry,

Thank you for creating a wiki category specific for Taiwan.

Terrance Odean has published some research articles based on data from investors in Taiwan.
For example,
Just How Much Do Individual Investors Lose by Trading

Is the Aggregate Investors Reluctant to Realize Losses

These articles are very persuasive.

[Barry Barnitz]

Hi:
As an aid to getting started, I have created a template and category for any future Taiwan related pages in the wiki: Category:Taiwan - Bogleheads

Some quick search links:
Taiwan Stock Exchange (TWSE) (english)
FTSE TWSE Taiwan 50 Index (english)
FTSE Taiwan index series
Central Bank of the Republic of China (Taiwan), Government Securities Services (english)

Papers:
Andy Lin and Anthony Chou, The Tracking Error and Premium/ Discount of Taiwan’s First Exchange Traded Fund web journal of Chinese Management Review, Vol. 9, No. 3, November 2006.

regards,

Hello Barry,

Thank you for creating a wiki category specific for Taiwan.

Terrance Odean has published some research articles based on data from investors in Taiwan.
For example,
Just How Much Do Individual Investors Lose by Trading

Is the Aggregate Investors Reluctant to Realize Losses

These articles are very persuasive.

Thanks Kelvin:

Very informative papers.

I have (with some trepidation) sought to create a data spreadsheet. The TWSE created a total return version of the TAIEX stock index (covering the total market) in 2003 and allows access to index values from 2003 onwards. Here is the google.docs. spreadsheet which is published and open to edit. (The TWSE site has factbooks which provide a longer returns history of the TAIEX price indexes, but these do not take dividends into account). The Yuanta Polaris/P-shares: Yuanta Polaris site indicates that the index is tracked by an index fund.

I have not found total return values for the FSTE TWSE Taiwan 50 Index, which makes up 70% of Taiwan stock market capitalization, nor for the FTSE Taiwan Mid Cap 100 index (covering the next one hundred Taiwanese stocks according to market capitalization) and comprising nearly 20% of the Taiwan stock market capitalization.

Spreadsheet data sources:
Consumer Price Indices National Statistics Government of China (Taiwan), available for download
Taiwan Stock Exchange Corp., TAIEX Total Return calculator
regards,