Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby englishgirl » Mon Oct 29, 2012 2:13 pm

Good luck all. I'm praying that everyone stays safe.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Valuethinker » Mon Oct 29, 2012 2:23 pm

englishgirl wrote:Good luck all. I'm praying that everyone stays safe.


As always it is hard to weigh these things, and if damage is minimal then Conventional Wisdom will scream 'overreaction'.

But things look nasty at least from this side of the Atlantic. And it's hitting perhaps the most densely populated part of the USA, where underground flooding could cause a lot of grief, and even fatalities.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby LadyGeek » Mon Oct 29, 2012 2:45 pm

Sandy is going to make landfall between Atlantic City and Cape May NJ between 5 and 6 PM. This is sooner than expected (it sped up), which is better for the timing of the high tides and full moon.

BTW, the Atlantic City boardwalk is gone (or at least a large chunk of it). Unbelievable video on the local news.

We're at tropical force winds now, expecting hurricane force in a few hours.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby jebmke » Mon Oct 29, 2012 2:49 pm

Wind about 40 knots now. Over 50 robins wandering around the front yard. Can only guess that it is safer on the ground than in the trees. Amazing to watch them fly upwind in 40 knot wind.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Calm Man » Mon Oct 29, 2012 2:58 pm

Valuethinker wrote:
Calm Man wrote:I am in Central NJ near Princeton in a town called Lawrenceville. I always tend to minimize this type of thing anyway. But it is now noon and we have minimal drizzle if anything and minimal winds. I did my 30 minute run without a problem. I have been on a crusade that it is ridiculous that we can literally predict that people will lose power whenever there is a storm. We have put a person on the moon and found the Higgs boson. Can we really not find a long term solution how to build the energy grid so that this doesn't happen all the time? Maybe starting with not having overhead power lines near trees?? Or am I nuts?


You can put power lines underground but you have greater issues with overheating. In Europe a lot of power lines are underground.

And the cost is 5-10x as much. (EDIT: that is a figure for long distance high voltage Transmission lines up and down the UK, so the actual number for local power might only be 2-3 times as much).

Finding a fault in an underground cable, eg if it floods, is more difficult.

In NYC, live underground cables periodically kill passers by by electrocution. Out in suburbs and rural areas, you have the problem of someone digs into one inadvertently. With an overhead line, if it comes down, it's hard to miss that it's there.

I should add that since power lines go to every house, cutting back the trees would be expensive, maybe prohibitive, and it would rob a lot of streets and towns of much needed shade and of character. It would be fiercely resisted, at the very least.


I indeed hear you and thank you for the additional info. I guess I think of this because I grew up in New York City in Queens where there were no overhead power lines. I never thought of where the power came from. But except for one hurricane, which was a "once in a lifetime one" somewhere about 1963 or so, I never experienced loss of power in my 18 years in Queens or my 4 or 5 years in Manhattan. But I do hear what you are saying. What about underground but literally a few feet below the surface? Anyway, I will continue to try and learn more but I can't do anything anyway.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby baw703916 » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:01 pm

Valuethinker wrote:
englishgirl wrote:Good luck all. I'm praying that everyone stays safe.


As always it is hard to weigh these things, and if damage is minimal then Conventional Wisdom will scream 'overreaction'.

But things look nasty at least from this side of the Atlantic. And it's hitting perhaps the most densely populated part of the USA, where underground flooding could cause a lot of grief, and even fatalities.


I'm hoping it will be less bad than expected, of course. But one reason for extra caution is that it's a very unusual storm, having characteistics of both a typical hurricane and a winter Nor'easter (hurricane warnings and blizzard warnings for the same storm is quite unusual!). So simply because nobody has seen a storm like this in the era of modern forecasting, it's worth being a little cautious. There's nothing to compare it to and predict the effects with any reliability.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby LadyGeek » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:15 pm

jebmke wrote:Wind about 40 knots now. Over 50 robins wandering around the front yard. Can only guess that it is safer on the ground than in the trees. Amazing to watch them fly upwind in 40 knot wind.

I've got a heavy-duty bird feeder. I don't know how they manage to land on it, but they do - and they're chowing down. :happy

I'm not expecting to have power much longer. With 2 engineers home all day and nothing better to do, we've made some new heavy duty extension power cables and outlet workbox (to code). We can now run power to the laptop and Verizon FiOS boxes (terminal and router). As long as Verizon is up, I'll be online.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Igglesman » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:22 pm

Northern Delaware --- in the path, to pass in next 3-4 hours. Power good so far. Watching local News can be quite alarming.

So on the local news show, they took viewer questions....and the best I heard: "What time will we lose our power?"

The question reminds me of this phone call to a radio show...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI8UPHMzZm8&feature=player_embedded

Hopefully I can post again...winds are picking up.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby LadyGeek » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:23 pm

The power just started flickering, UPS kicked in. Soon...
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Fallible » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:51 pm

jebmke wrote:Wind about 40 knots now. Over 50 robins wandering around the front yard. Can only guess that it is safer on the ground than in the trees. Amazing to watch them fly upwind in 40 knot wind.


I remember reading up, in tears, on birds and storms after a massive storm across the entire metro area in May 1998 dropped huge hail driven by strong winds that killed hundreds of them, including two mourning doves in my yard. They do have many ways of detecting storms so they can "evacuate" in time or ride one out, but with our storm occurring in spring, many apparently stayed with nests.

Good luck to everyone in Sandy's path.
Last edited by Fallible on Thu Nov 08, 2012 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Grt2bOutdoors » Mon Oct 29, 2012 4:25 pm

Well, they just shut down the GW Bridge, Tappan Zee bridge, Holland Tunnel, Verrazano-Narrows Bridges.
There is a crane dangling from the 90th floor construction site of a condo building going up on 57th St and Seventh Avenue in NYC - hope it doesn't fall - conditions are too dangerous to make an attempt to secure it to the building, it's sort of dangling in the wind.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Igglesman » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:26 pm

....hope everyone is back to check in. Not much fun since Monday.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby LadyGeek » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:55 pm

I'm back. I have no power, running on a generator.

BTW, I discovered that I can't siphon fuel out of my car's tank - the siphon tube doesnt work. I guess a lot of cars have anti-siphon protection (or an anti-roll device that keeps the siphon tube from getting to the gas).

In any case, there's no problem getting gas in my area.
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Things are surreal

Postby grok87 » Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:05 pm

Ok a quick update for those not in the metro NYC area who have not been following the news.
Things in northern NJ have degenerated into a post apocalyptic scenario. There is no power, no gasoline. Public transit is limited. The governor of Nj Chris Christie has just instituted even/odd gas rationing. Welcome back to the 1970s.
Cheers,
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby baw703916 » Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:23 pm

Good to see the site back up again. My best wishes to all those affected. We were quite lucky here, so I really can't complain about anything.

Best wishes,
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby livesoft » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:43 am

A whole new set of people have now experienced a weather disaster. They won't be caught with their pants down and gas-tanks not topped up the next time. Unfortunately, many folks did not heed the warnings and died.

We lost power on Monday, then sheltered in place until Wednesday. We made the decision to drive out on Wednesday since the roads were clear. The car had enough gas to get to somewhere in Pennsylvania, so a little cash was needed for the tolls on the NJ Turnpike and the Pennsylvania Tpk, but otherwise credit cards worked everywhere.

So my experience with Sandy was just like my experience with other recent hurricanes like Katrina, Rita, and Ike. Plan ahead and don't be caught in a flood zone. Also useful local info was not forthcoming. By this I mean: Are the local roads clear of trees and power lines so that it is safe to drive to the freeway? Is the freeway then clear? We heard all about Manhattan and the beaches of NJ, but that was not useful info.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby alisa4804 » Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:32 am

Thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences; we're in the Pacific Northwest, so are glad to hear news that friends are safe. I was wondering about those in the Philadelphia area, including LadyGeek - glad you are OK. Amazing Boglehead tech support getting the forum up and running again. Nothing posted from VictoriaF yet?
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby VictoriaF » Sat Nov 03, 2012 10:00 am

alisa4804 wrote:Thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences; we're in the Pacific Northwest, so are glad to hear news that friends are safe. I was wondering about those in the Philadelphia area, including LadyGeek - glad you are OK. Amazing Boglehead tech support getting the forum up and running again. Nothing posted from VictoriaF yet?


Hi Alisa,

I was in Chicago last week, and my return flight was cancelled due to the East Coast hurricane. After having spent some quality time at the O'Hare airport, I am now catching up with my work and various obligations. One of these obligations is the BH-11 report, which will be delayed.

Victoria
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby JMacDonald » Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:09 am

Victoria wrote:I was in Chicago last week, and my return flight was cancelled due to the East Coast hurricane. After having spent some quality time at the O'Hare airport, I am now catching up with my work and various obligations. One of these obligations is the BH-11 report, which will be delayed.

Victoria

Hi Victoria,
Having spent a few hours at O'Hare waiting to catch my flight, I would not want to spend a very long time there. I would have tried to get a room at my favorite hotel anywhere, The Palmer House: http://www3.hilton.com/en/hotels/illino ... index.html It is the only luxury hotel that I have ever stayed at. I am too cheap to spend a lot for a hotel. I have managed to get a good rate when I have stayed there. The lobby is something to see if you have never been there.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Valuethinker » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:34 pm

In light of the damage caused ($40bn+ are current estimates), the loss of life and damage, I hope those who poo-pooed this as' only a category 1 storm' are ashamed of themselves.

Places that had not been flooded in 100 years were. The New York Metro (109 years old) has never sustained such damage. It wasn't just a failure to take precautions or evacuate-- the subway system was shut down, but it still flooded.

The authorities were right to sound the alarm. We know very little about hybrid storms, and we don't know yet if this is something that is likely to re occur in the future. Even the experts say that we know much less about hybrid storms than about hurricanes. And hurricanes is an inexact science.

i am sure though that prompt action by the American authorities saved lives. I am sure we will find that the wrong things were done, that more should have been done, that the warnings should have been taken more seriously. Nonetheless, people were evacuated.

Difficult questions await such as how to protect MTA in future disasters? Do we evacuate parts of Brooklyn, Long Island etc.
permanently?

My best thoughts to the people out there hit by this.

And to those grieving, having lost their homes, or worse, loved ones.
Last edited by Valuethinker on Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Things are surreal

Postby Valuethinker » Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:49 pm

grok87 wrote:Ok a quick update for those not in the metro NYC area who have not been following the news.
Things in northern NJ have degenerated into a post apocalyptic scenario. There is no power, no gasoline. Public transit is limited. The governor of Nj Chris Christie has just instituted even/odd gas rationing. Welcome back to the 1970s.
Cheers,


The thread between civilization and barbarism is so thin. We are reliant on a relatively small amount of critical infrastructure.

When the gasoline tanker drivers went on strike in Britain, within 4 days the streets were empty of cars and the stores were having trouble getting deliveries of food and necessities. Eventually the Army had to come in to operate emergency pumping stations for ambulance, fire and critical deliveries etc.

You need gasoline, and electricity to run the gasoline pumps and the cash registers, and you need telecommunications.

Without those, your society stops.

Fortunately by all accounts most Americans are reacting with maturity and cooperation. It's not 'Mad Max' or 'Road Warrior' even if it looks apocalyptic.

Best of luck to everyone in NJ and surrounding areas.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Dan999 » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:54 pm

I missed having the site up this week.
We are across from Trenton NJ and were without power for 2 days. We have a whole house generator and it worked fine.
My neighbor has one also but the circuit board went out and the dealer had no spare, so he borrowed my back up, back up generator to run his freezer and hot water heater exhaust fan. Now someone else has borrowed it. It is a Honda 2000, quiet, light weight, but only runs one or 2 things. 2000 watts.

I work in Trenton and we never lost power there, but many did and there were gas lines all week. Over in Pa, no lines, but some stations occasonally had no gas. But never a problem.

I have a relative in West Winsor (Pricneton) without power since Tuesday and it still is not on.
Traffic lights were out in many places, and the car on the right is supposed to go, but usually the most aggressive or biggest truck went first. On 4 lane highways, it was crazy in Pa and NJ.

The local shopping centers were out for 2 days but the Acme only closed one day. They had a big generator.

There were many sections southwest of me in Pa, that have older homes and larger trees that were out for many days. They are slowly coming back..

All in all it was an inconvenience to some but if you were on the Jersey shore or lower Manhatten it was a disaster.

NJ now has 70's style rationing in 12 counties. Odd / even purchases based on the last digit of the license plate and the number day of the month.

My sympathies to those "down the Jersey shore". Their lives will be in turmoil for quite a while. No school all this last week and next week for mnany in NJ.

And Lady Geek, I could not siphon gas many years ago, so i was pretty sure that would ot work.

The last thing on this is, please be prepared for 10 days to go without food, water, Rx, cash, gas and batteries,toiletires, and have a method to heat a portion of your home. Don't forget the pet food.

Good luck to all.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby bluelight » Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:07 pm

I'm also in Northern NJ and am pretty surprised how unprepared some people and companies were for this storm. We had plenty of advance notice that this was going to be a big storm. This morning I read that Hess had generators installed at many of their gas stations in advance of the storm and most managed to stay open. They also have an online site where you can see which stations had gas.

We were very lucky, for some odd reason my small dead end street was the only one in my neighborhood to have power. We finally got internet and cable back last night. I'm a work at home contract employee, so without internet access, I can't work. Luckily a friend's house about 10 miles away still had power and internet access so I was able to drive there with my laptop to work and only lost one day's pay. We stocked up on food, water and made extra bags of ice, and spent the weekend before the storm hit prepping for it. We were hit hard during Irene last year, so I prepared for flooding which thankfully didn't happen this time. The gas tanks were full before the storm hit and with the exception of driving to work, have gone nowhere. I hope the gas situation is better before I need more.

They are now predicting another nor'easter to hit on Wednesday. I hope the extra utility crews can get power restored to the many homes and businesses that still don't have it before that hits.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby LadyGeek » Sat Nov 03, 2012 5:49 pm

I'm still on a generator. PECO (power utility) has promised to restore service "today" for the past several days. Within the last hour, I saw a repair truck on my street - that's good.

I also want to point out that getting through this is a matter of attitude. On Tuesday night, we had the neighbors over for dinner. We had the grill going, everyone brought something. The best contribution was the paper plates and plastic flatware (forks, knives, spoons). It was the modern day version of stone soup; we had a good time together.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Fallible » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:18 pm

I hope all Bogleheads who were in harm’s way are now accounted for and safe, the most importing thing. The longer the site was down, the harder it was not to worry about everyone's fate.

And now I'm amazed how the forum is springing back to life. A beautiful sight (and site) :)
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Aptenodytes » Sat Nov 03, 2012 10:25 pm

We just got our power back tonight. Generator kept fridge and freezer cold. We had no damage to the house but many neighbors did. This is northern suburbs of NY.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby LadyGeek » Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:46 pm

My power was restored tonight, a total of 6 full days on a generator.

The repair crew was from Chicago. These guys are working hard. Since I had the generator running to watch football, they appreciated me keeping them up to date on the Bears game.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby Fallible » Sun Nov 04, 2012 10:42 pm

LadyGeek wrote:My power was restored tonight, a total of 6 full days on a generator.

The repair crew was from Chicago. These guys are working hard. Since I had the generator running to watch football, they appreciated me keeping them up to date on the Bears game.


LadyGeek, I just have to say that your running account of the approaching storm - the first-rate preparations, the emotions running higher and higher ("The power just started flickering, UPS kicked in. Soon..."), having enough beer, updates for the worried BH posters, then the week-long silence, the safe return online, the post-storm barbecue with neighbors and keeping the Chicago workmen updated on the Bears game - were the stuff of a first-rate diary. I'm also certain that a lot of readers learned how to prepare for a major storm from your accounts.
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby JMacDonald » Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:00 pm

Here is a video what Sandy looked like: Superstorm Sandy From Formation to Landfall http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap121107.html
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Re: Good luck to those hit by Hurricane Sandy...

Postby lucky3 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:29 pm

Thursday 11/8/12....

...as if Sandy wasn't enough we were hit last night by a Nor'easter which dumped 4 to 6 inches of snow and lots of wind. Lots of people still without power in Queens NY and New Jersey....I'm in Westchester County NY where for the first time in history the Hudson River overflowed her banks (due to the storm surge of Sandy).

One down day on Wall Street isn't a trend, just like one storm doesn't prove global warming but as for the weather....a trend may be forming! :(

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