Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

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celia
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by celia »

I think this story qualifies:

I was trustee for an aunt who never married or had kids. She died at age 86. She worked for about 40 years for the same Fortune 500 company (who gave her a pension), in one of the smaller branch offices as a secretary, eventually becoming the secretary for the branch manager. (I doubt that she consciously took the job over others, but could be considered lucky in that part of her financial success was due to the company she worked for.) Basically, she lived below her means, always spending less than her income. Through payroll withholding, she invested a few dollars each paycheck in the company stocks and in savings bonds and in life insurance. She opened a traditional IRA when they first became available but retired after 3 years or so and never had a chance to put much money in it. It appears she started withdrawing when she was 70 1/2 and her account balance was a little over $1,000 when she died.

She was not financially savvy, just a saver. Her biggest fear for retirement was that her rent would keep increasing as it had for the previous 40 years. We helped her buy a condo where the previous owner was facing the end of a 5- or 10-year interest only mortgage where the principal was soon to be due, which the owner wouldn't be able to pay. My aunt sold some of the stock in order to buy the condo. After a few years adjusting to her new expenses (HOA dues, paying for inside repairs, property taxes), she felt more financially secure and retired.

She was everyone's "favorite aunt" and traveled just about anywhere when anyone she knew asked her to go along. She went to Brazil, Australia, Poland, Czech Republic, Rome, and all over the U.S. to visit her relatives. She took up new hobbies in retirement and enjoyed herself. After 15 years, it became apparent that she needed someone to help take care of her and her finances, so I stepped in and started as trustee.

The first thing I did was figure out where her assets were and how much they were to see if we needed to help support her financially. I ran across a couple of hand-written lists of the financial institutions where she had accounts with the account numbers, but she didn't record balances. I don't think she considered the condo as an investment (although it increased in value) but as a relatively fixed-expense place to live. Her mail was forwarded to my house and I notified each institution that I was acting as trustee. We were there for her in her final years which involved increased costs, but she made it without anyone ever having to chip in financially. I never sold her remaining stock while was living as some of it had been owned for over 50 years. It had 4 or 5 stock splits during that time and I was able to calculate the basis for every share, but much of it had a basis of under a dollar.

Upon death, her estate was just under a million. It was composed of about 1/3 company stock, 1/3 condo, and 1/3 savings.

I consider her financially successful even though she was never aware of it.
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celia
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by celia »

livesoft wrote:
techcrium wrote:I am just wondering if there's anyone here who has a multi million dollar stock portfolio but has never made more than $50,000 (in their day job) or is that near impossible to achieve?
That will be very tough. I imagine there are folks in that category, but they probably received a windfall or have a working spouse. OTOH, I know that it took a number of years before either I or my spouse made more than $50,000 a year. One has to start somewhere.
When DH and I finished college, we had our eyes on those high-paying teaching jobs that paid almost $12,000 a year!

I would estimate that anyone who is in the same job for 40 years could figure their ending salary is 3 to 4 times their beginning salary. Inflation doesn't just affect the cost of things we buy, but our incomes too.
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House Blend
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by House Blend »

jay22 wrote:
vachica wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:This is a tough crowd to hang with if you are merely "middle class" which is too bad because the principles are the same. I have noticed several lower income first time posters that don't seem to come back after their first post.
Agreed. I made <50k until about two years ago, and was able to save 20% of my income and pay off student loans...but things were definitely tight, and that's with being in my 20s, single, and living in a studio. Saving and having a family on that salary would be much harder, but even saving 6-10% for 40 years would secure a decent nest egg.

This forum can be extremely hostile to those who don't roll out of school with computer science or medical degrees. Not everyone makes $100k at their first job, and not making enough to max your 401k doesn't mean you lack intelligence. There are a ton of highly educated careers that add value to society and don't bring high incomes. Unfortunately, this forum seems to scare most of those people away.
100% agree with that.
I read only a small fraction of the threads started by those seeking advice, but I what I commonly see is not so much hostility, but mockery, sarcasm, and jokes from veteran posters who seem more interested in scoring points than providing helpful advice. Even if these barbs are aimed not at the OP but other responders, it doesn't create a congenial atmosphere.

And it seems to be independent of the income level of the OP, not that it's much consolation.

I have no idea if it is driving newbies away, but it surely doesn't help.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by stoptothink »

pennstater2005 wrote:I make just over 50k including my wife's part time work. I am managing to save, although not as much as I'd like, enough for a comfortable retirement. I do count on SS being there in some form though. I've never felt like I didn't belong here because of my lower income. Boglehead principles still apply.
Although I've worked the entire time, I was in school for 11yrs between the ages of 17 and 30. I also never made more than $50k/yr during that time period and had zero help from my parents (even helped them for a bit). Despite all this, at 30 I already had 6-figures in retirement and no debt. I suspect, had I stayed making <$50k/yr that I still would have had no worries about retirement. Now that I am married, have a wife that works as well (not for long with baby #2 on the way), things are ramping up. In the words of Outkast, "it's not how much you make, it's how much you spend".

My grandfather probably never made more than $40k/yr as a blue-collar factory worker, had a wife with MS (who went blind in her 30's and never was able to work), and 3 children; because of LBYM he was able to retire at 55, live to 81, and spoil his 8 grandchildren rotten without a financial care in the world. He's been my greatest influence.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by thenextguy »

My parents were blue collar workers and accumulated a pretty good nest egg by the time they retired. Although that was mostly from Southern California real estate over the last 50 years. It was more of a "right place at the right time" story. It's not really something one could duplicate easily.
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mlipps
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by mlipps »

My parents have never made more than $45k and I can't think of too many mistakes they've made financially, except buying a business for $20k that didn't work. On the other hand, they built their home & took out a loan of only $17k to do so, so I think those cancel each other out. They only have a low six figure portfolio, but I will always aspire to attain their level of success in life, financially and otherwise. I think your definition of success is a little unrealistic, and also unnecessary. My parents will be fine with Social Security & their nest egg for emergencies.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by mnnice »

I have been a k12 educator my whole working life. I have had one yearly contract that was more than $50k. DH has made more, but never more than $80k. We have two children, started our careers with school loans, we have had no major windfalls, and zero inheritance. DH and I entered the two comma club late last year. We are 45 and 46.

We have been very healthy and had very healthy children too. I know that has helped a lot :D
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stemikger
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by stemikger »

Busting Myths wrote:I think a definition of "success" is needed.
+1

First you have to decide what you think success is when it comes to saving. Although I make more than $50K, I would be considered a low earner around these parts. I never let that get in my way. Having said that, many of my friends are high earners and their definition of success is probably different than mine.

My goal was always to have a paid off home and that magic number in my 401K ("1 million"). My home is paid for and I'm half way to my million. I'm 50 and by the time I'm 62 should be there and maybe more.

I provided some You Tube links to people who make a lot less than $50K and they still achieved their financial goals. It's not what you make, it's what you save!

Please note, this is just my financial life I'm talking about. Success to me is so much more than money. It's being able to look in the mirror and being proud at who is looking back.

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G12
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by G12 »

House Blend wrote: This forum can be extremely hostile to those who don't roll out of school with computer science or medical degrees. Not everyone makes $100k at their first job, and not making enough to max your 401k doesn't mean you lack intelligence. There are a ton of highly educated careers that add value to society and don't bring high incomes. Unfortunately, this forum seems to scare most of those people away.


100% agree with that.



I read only a small fraction of the threads started by those seeking advice, but I what I commonly see is not so much hostility, but mockery, sarcasm, and jokes from veteran posters who seem more interested in scoring points than providing helpful advice. Even if these barbs are aimed not at the OP but other responders, it doesn't create a congenial atmosphere.

And it seems to be independent of the income level of the OP, not that it's much consolation.
Anecdotal, but circa 2008 I do not recall the high earners being so overrepresented on the board. Seems it really started becoming noticeable around 2011. Maybe it's driven by a large number still hurting from the Great Recession, maybe the high earners like to post more.

I was a moderate earner with a masters degree, wife was a low earner, she quit and spent 5-yrs taking electives, interning, and earning a second degree. I changed positions a couple of times and suddenly combined household income was $300k. Some years later she and I received moderate inheritances which in aggregate were about equal to what we had saved, mine was 2007 hers was 2009/2011. Max draw down through 3/2009 was less than 16%, now investments are into multiple 7's. I ER'd at 47 after a medical event and was tired of commutes, work, etc, wife will likely ER in 16 months with pension. I had much better 401k plans than she had.

More directly on OP target and like another poster commented, someone's income remaining "x" their entire working life is highly unlikely. There is a lot to be said for consistent savings combined with a well constructed investment plan and living below one's means, ie not overspending and entering into bad debt, there are obviously advantageous forms of debt as well. There were years we saved 50% of our income, but it wasn't early on. I am not a 100% Boglehead, nor do I think it takes a life of extreme frugality to be considered one. To me it is more centered on being aware of the need to save, and investing to meet future needs in a sound manner - preferably with low cost and tax impact - and to start at an early stage in life to increase the odds of meeting your goal.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Silence Dogood »

techcrium wrote:Often, when browsing this forum, I see people asking for portfolio advice and usually they are dual medical professionals making north of $300,000 per year and have a $3 million plus portfolio.


I am just wondering if there's anyone here who has a multi million dollar stock portfolio but has never made more than $50,000 (in their day job) or is that near impossible to achieve?
Well, I don't have a multimillion dollar stock portfolio but I am 23, have never made more than $30,000 a year, and have $55,000 in retirement savings (and no, didn't get any inheritance).

I am pretty happy with this and would consider it a success (so far).
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by jackietreehorn »

If this question is for confidence reasons, please do not become discouraged. The "Boglehead" style of investing is meant to make you comfortable in retirement, not rich. If you live within your means, if not below, there is no reason to think that you will not be comfortable in retirement.

The majority of people who are extremely wealthy, started their own businesses or were in Real Estate (which is essentially it's own business). Most people don't become wealthy by investing, and I would say the ones that do, were extremely lucky.

Amount and frequency of saving is most important, but teamed with living below your means, you will be comfortable no matter what.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by fposte »

anonforthis wrote:I have a question for you. Why would you need a million in portfolio to be successful? What about a person is making 50k with a 500k in portfolio and 50k in pension a year. Who would be in a better position? I rather have a million though.
Right, that's what I was thinking of--those are the people I know and consider successful. Those often fall into the "educator" outlier category in The Millionaire Next Door, too. I also think that you'll see more of that outside of the big cities and in places where COL drops from the stratospheric and $50k can provide a decent life.

So if we're asking about people who earned under $50k and managed to buy Lamborghinis in their retirement, I don't know any of those. But If you're asking about people who retired happily and enjoy travel and hobbies and don't worry about money, yes, I know some.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by TRC »

techcrium wrote:Often, when browsing this forum, I see people asking for portfolio advice and usually they are dual medical professionals making north of $300,000 per year and have a $3 million plus portfolio.


I am just wondering if there's anyone here who has a multi million dollar stock portfolio but has never made more than $50,000 (in their day job) or is that near impossible to achieve?
If this $50K a year person starts working at at age 22 and saves 20% of the salary ($10,000) per year for 43 years, while achieving an annual return of 8%, they'd have $3,559,496 by age 65. This doesn't account for inflation or likely salary increases, but it's a simplistic example of it being totally possible.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by montanagirl »

I never came close to 50k, and even though I started late at 45 I am delighted that I seem to have enough to retire on 65. It's certainly not a million... I am relying on SS when I turn 70. I did get a bit of a windfall 12 years ago but that mostly went to a new house, which I didn't really need myself because my own little house was paid off along with all my other debts by then. But some of the excess did end up in my IRA at Vanguard. I also saved like a crazy person.

I am in a low COL area and fortunately got a lot of my bucket list done years ago so my needs are few.

[The new "three legged stool" of retirement ought to be Social Security, 401k/IRA savings and a paid off house].
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by tibbitts »

Maybe we need to reset this thread and specify $50k income in 2014 dollars, because obviously we're getting responses about cases of never earning more than $50k, back when $50k was a very, very generous income.

And we need to decide if it's $50k personal income, maybe x2, or the approximately-average $50k household income.

A lot depends on luck. If starting employment today, at an income of $50k, we get 40 years of 2% inflation, 1% salary growth, and 2% real investment returns, the "miracle of compounding" isn't going to be very miraculous, and no reasonable savings rate is going to fix that. If instead we get 40 years of 2% inflation, 4% salary growth, and 6% real investment returns... completely different story.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Abe »

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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by jstash »

I'm in my mid-30s, make about 35k and save 30% of my salary. I hope to retire relatively young, say in about 20 years, on my portfolio and pension. My cost of living is very cheap.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by vv19 »

tibbitts wrote:Maybe we need to reset this thread and specify $50k income in 2014 dollars, because obviously we're getting responses about cases of never earning more than $50k, back when $50k was a very, very generous income.

And we need to decide if it's $50k personal income, maybe x2, or the approximately-average $50k household income.

A lot depends on luck. If starting employment today, at an income of $50k, we get 40 years of 2% inflation, 1% salary growth, and 2% real investment returns, the "miracle of compounding" isn't going to be very miraculous, and no reasonable savings rate is going to fix that. If instead we get 40 years of 2% inflation, 4% salary growth, and 6% real investment returns... completely different story.
That's a great point. We also should consider the COL. 50K in the Midwest is very different than 50K on the SF bay area.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by placeholder »

Recent story on the news about two sisters who lived together for many years neither married and they both worked as secretaries so when the last of them died at age 95 there was an estate of 1.3 million which is decent given their jobs but no will and no close relatives so now it's a fight among distant relatives back in Eastern Europe.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by maroon »

I only started earning >$50K/year about 3-4 years ago. But I've been saving for retirement since my first "real" job at 21. I live in a small starter home in a working-class neighborhood. I doubt I qualify as a "success story" to anyone on this board, but I'm fairly confident I won't have to worry about money when I'm old. That signals (financial) success to me.

I've invested with Vanguard for about 15 years. What got me seriously investing was a book called "Get a Financial Life: Personal Finance In Your Twenties and Thirties" by Beth Kobliner (2000 edition). I very much appreciate this forum and the contributions of the many posters.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

vachica wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:This is a tough crowd to hang with if you are merely "middle class" which is too bad because the principles are the same. I have noticed several lower income first time posters that don't seem to come back after their first post.
This forum can be extremely hostile to those who don't roll out of school with computer science or medical degrees. Not everyone makes $100k at their first job, and not making enough to max your 401k doesn't mean you lack intelligence. There are a ton of highly educated careers that add value to society and don't bring high incomes. Unfortunately, this forum seems to scare most of those people away.
The first sentence made me laugh since most of the MD's out there are completely clueless when it comes to personal finance, period. If it wasn't for this forum and EmergDoc's book, they'd still be buying whole life as a retirement plan. A person's salary doesn't determine their worth to society. As far as those 20 somethings making 200K and loaded with "options", it doesn't take much for a good dose of reality to bring them down to earth, they were only kids when the last crash happened, I'll tell you San Fran wasn't looking too good back then.

Anyone who posts on this forum should not feel scared or intimidated, this is an anonymous forum so you can't tell who really has it and who doesn't. You don't have to max out your 401k to the top level of $17.5K, if you can save 10 to 15% of your salary over time, you will be well on your way to a reasonable retirement. Those who are high income - if you want to maintain the same level of "comfort" in retirement, you'd better max out the 401k, Roth and another 10-15% of net in taxable savings before you even think of buying a Tesla.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

maroon wrote:I only started earning >$50K/year about 3-4 years ago. But I've been saving for retirement since my first "real" job at 21. I live in a small starter home in a working-class neighborhood. I doubt I qualify as a "success story" to anyone on this board, but I'm fairly confident I won't have to worry about money when I'm old. That signals (financial) success to me.

I've invested with Vanguard for about 15 years. What got me seriously investing was a book called "Get a Financial Life: Personal Finance In Your Twenties and Thirties" by Beth Kobliner (2000 edition). I very much appreciate this forum and the contributions of the many posters.
Guess what? You are a success! Let's go down the checklist:
Employed - Great
Saving for retirement since age 21 - Great
Living in a starter home - Great
Has confidence - Great

What's not to like? Give yourself a pat on the back. Keep at it. :sharebeer
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by skylar »

danwhite77 wrote:In my mind, Bogleheads isn't about numbers, it's about philosophy. The number of zeroes behind the first number really doesn't matter - it's your approach to investing that's important.

I don't have my copy handy, but in Jack's book "The Little Book of Common Sense Investing" he relates the following story (cribbed from an Amazon review):
On page 13 of this book Jack Bogle relates a letter that he received in early 2005 about someone who's been investing with Vanguard for about 30 years, and whose portfolio had grown to over $1.25 million, but he'd never made more than $25,000 in any year in his life.
That's a true Boglehead!
Indeed. I don't have a copy handy either, but my memory is that the man never invested in anything besides the S&P 500 and Total Bond Market.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

skylar wrote:
danwhite77 wrote:In my mind, Bogleheads isn't about numbers, it's about philosophy. The number of zeroes behind the first number really doesn't matter - it's your approach to investing that's important.

I don't have my copy handy, but in Jack's book "The Little Book of Common Sense Investing" he relates the following story (cribbed from an Amazon review):
On page 13 of this book Jack Bogle relates a letter that he received in early 2005 about someone who's been investing with Vanguard for about 30 years, and whose portfolio had grown to over $1.25 million, but he'd never made more than $25,000 in any year in his life.
That's a true Boglehead!
Indeed. I don't have a copy handy either, but my memory is that the man never invested in anything besides the S&P 500 and Total Bond Market.
With two postings on this already, I decided to pull the book down from my bookshelf loaded with numerous investment tomes. Here's the exact quotation from The Little Book of Common Sense Investing by John Bogle, page 213 "The simple ideas in this book really work, A few years ago I received this letter from a Vanguard shareholder holding our 500 Index Fund and Total Stock Market Index Fund, several of our managed equity funds and taxable and tax exempt bond funds and a diversified list of individual stocks. Most of my shares were purchased when you were chairman. I am 85 years old and have never earned more than $25,000 a year. I started investing in 1974 with $500. I have only bought - never sold. I remember when things weren't going so well, your advice was to "stay the course". He enclosed a list of his investments at the start of 2004: Total value, $1,391,407.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by livesoft »

But the OP wrote "who has a multi million dollar stock portfolio" which I think means at least two million. That's gonna be tough unless someone was an early employee with stock options of a few select companies.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

upperleftcoast wrote:I'm a good example, though not a "success story".
Currently make $50K/yr, 25% plus company match goes into 401K. Very frugal, single. Started about age 25 (w/ lower salary and lower saving rate). Agressive portfolio, indexed. Now age 49 inching up to $400K. Not bad, and maybe on a path to double comma, but far less than many (most?) on this board.
Fidelity recommends 8x salary at age 65, you have reached that at age 49. If that's not successful.......great job! :sharebeer
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by angelescrest »

House Blend wrote:
jay22 wrote:
vachica wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:This is a tough crowd to hang with if you are merely "middle class" which is too bad because the principles are the same. I have noticed several lower income first time posters that don't seem to come back after their first post.
Agreed. I made <50k until about two years ago, and was able to save 20% of my income and pay off student loans...but things were definitely tight, and that's with being in my 20s, single, and living in a studio. Saving and having a family on that salary would be much harder, but even saving 6-10% for 40 years would secure a decent nest egg.

This forum can be extremely hostile to those who don't roll out of school with computer science or medical degrees. Not everyone makes $100k at their first job, and not making enough to max your 401k doesn't mean you lack intelligence. There are a ton of highly educated careers that add value to society and don't bring high incomes. Unfortunately, this forum seems to scare most of those people away.
100% agree with that.
I read only a small fraction of the threads started by those seeking advice, but I what I commonly see is not so much hostility, but mockery, sarcasm, and jokes from veteran posters who seem more interested in scoring points than providing helpful advice. Even if these barbs are aimed not at the OP but other responders, it doesn't create a congenial atmosphere.

And it seems to be independent of the income level of the OP, not that it's much consolation.

I have no idea if it is driving newbies away, but it surely doesn't help.
I would agree with a lot of this--one time I posted something about lower income people feeling less welcome and would you believe it but someone mocked that notion with great derision. I was disgusted, as I was just trying to encourage a sense of community here for those who actually are struggling a lot more financially. I'd always wished the forum could do more in that regard--what I'm not sure.

So I understand why a lot of people don't stick around, as your point is well taken that there is a lot of point scoring. But overall, I have been so grateful to the individuals who have taken precious time to read through my questions and portfolio, and look to guide me in a better direction. I have learned and continue to pass it on to individuals who would never actually come spend the time on this forum.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Gnirk »

My parents never made anywhere near $50,000 per year, probably not even $25,000 per year, between them. And they retired in 1976. They saved, invested wisely, paid off their home, didn't believe in keeping up with the Joneses, whoever they are, were frugal and kept their cars until they died. They did some traveling on a budget, and enjoyed being with each other until dad's death at the age of 66. Mom is 89, and now has a net worth of low seven figures.
hulburt1
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by hulburt1 »

I never made more then 40,000. Saved when I started working. I'm 61 and have not worked for 5 years I'm at 825,000..
Wife just about the same story. we averaged about 60-70 a year and are at 1.6 mil.
I Paid cash and still have 2 car that are over 20 years old. House paid off in 10 years. People use to make fun of my at work most of them are still working. I still live cheep $40,000 a year but boy am I happy.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by livesoft »

boroc7 wrote:So I understand why a lot of people don't stick around, ...
I imagine that lots of people come here, get the answers to their questions, and move on. Not everyone needs or wants to spend time hanging out on a message board forum. They probably have lots of better things to do with their time, once their portfolios are set up the way they want them to be.

In fact, isn't it rather exceptional and odd that folks stick around?

Checking some stats: 39360 registered users, but only about 2500 have more than 100 posts.
Last edited by livesoft on Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

hulburt1 wrote:I never made more then 40,000. Saved when I started working. I'm 61 and have not worked for 5 years I'm at 825,000..
Wife just about the same story. we averaged about 60-70 a year and are at 1.6 mil.
I Paid cash and still have 2 car that are over 20 years old. House paid off in 10 years. People use to make fun of my at work most of them are still working. I still live cheep $40,000 a year but boy am I happy.
Great story! Congrats! :sharebeer
Funny how you're the one who has the last laugh. :wink:
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by MossySF »

I know of several immigrant families that have roughly followed the same path -- never earned much money, saved 50%+ (like they did back in China), spent zilch on vacations/eating out/etc. and ended up owning 2-3 houses in San Francisco at retirement. Since each SF house is $1M+ nowadays, that gets them into the "multi-millionaire" range on puny salaries.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by crowd79 »

Very modest income here, but I enjoy a stress-free job in one of the lowest-cost of living cities in the country with tons of recreation, beauty, etc just a few minutes from my house. The key is I keep my expenses extremely low, rent a house (no stress of homeownership..housing is shelter, NOT an asset), have no debt, and enjoy the simpler things in life, i.e., camping, kayaking, going to the library, jogging, basketball with the guys, workout at gym, etc. I have a healthy-sized retirement account for my income level, saving 30% of my income. Hope to retire in my mid 50's. The one area I do splurge on is I take extravagant vacations every year around the world. I invest in experiences rather than "stuff", so I guess that sort of makes me "anti-American" in a way. I'll be going to Vietnam, Cambodia and returning to Thailand this winter for a month. People are jealous of me at work and wonder how I can pull it off with all my traveling. Love living a stress-free lifestyle with no responsibilities for anything or anyone but myself.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by mlipps »

Gnirk wrote:My parents never made anywhere near $50,000 per year, probably not even $25,000 per year, between them. And they retired in 1976. They saved, invested wisely, paid off their home, didn't believe in keeping up with the Joneses, whoever they are, were frugal and kept their cars until they died. They did some traveling on a budget, and enjoyed being with each other until dad's death at the age of 66. Mom is 89, and now has a net worth of low seven figures.
$25,000 in 1976 is the equivalent of $104,977 today. I'm not sure that quite fits the bill here...
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by joe8d »

All I will say is that it can be done :happy
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danwhite77
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by danwhite77 »

This lady enjoyed some incredible luck, but here's an example for OP of someone who made very little but amassed a fortune. The folks over on Early-Retirement are discussing the story.

http://blogs.barrons.com/penta/2014/09/ ... f-buffalo/
"While some mutual fund founders chose to make billions, he chose to make a difference." - Dedication to Jack Bogle in 'The Bogleheads' Guide to Investing'.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by thewizzer »

livesoft wrote:
boroc7 wrote:So I understand why a lot of people don't stick around, ...
I imagine that lots of people come here, get the answers to their questions, and move on. Not everyone needs or wants to spend time hanging out on a message board forum. They probably have lots of better things to do with their time, once their portfolios are set up the way they want them to be.

In fact, isn't it rather exceptional and odd that folks stick around?

Checking some stats: 39360 registered users, but only about 2500 have more than 100 posts.
I just replied to see how many posts I have.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Pizzasteve510 »

One story I know.

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LongerPrimer
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by LongerPrimer »

US. Some years we did better and some years we had to real careful.
Fairly aggressive investing targeting 12% CAGR. :annoyed
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Johm221122 »

Made 25k to40k a year last 15 years and at 300k.Saved close to 30% of income plus fair company match.Have 15 years to go and would feel lucky to be at a millon.

John
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techcrium
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by techcrium »

Toons wrote:Yes,It CAN be done
fareastwarriors wrote: It depends where you live too. If you're making 50k in NYC or SF, then yes saving and investing for the long term can be really difficult. It will be easier to live in a lower cost of living area with a 50k/year income.

Like others as said, the philosophy doesn't change.
yukon50 wrote:much harder but can be done, easier to do on 2 incomes and get some nice marriage tax breaks

Yes, there's no debating that it CAN be done. Simple mathematics tells us, if you save half your income and rent with roommates for 40 years, you will retire a multi millionaire. I am asking if it HAS been done.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Spirit Rider »

techcrium wrote:Often, when browsing this forum, I see people asking for portfolio advice and usually they are dual medical professionals making north of $300,000 per year and have a $3 million plus portfolio.

I am just wondering if there's anyone here who has a multi million dollar stock portfolio but has never made more than $50,000 (in their day job) or is that near impossible to achieve?
I think you are looking at this from the wrong frame of reference. Someone whose lifestyle is supported by < $50,000/year doesn't need a multi-million dollar portfolio at retirement. It is not about absolute portfolios, but what is needed by each individual.

One significant factor to consider is that Social Security benefits are weighted to give a higher percentage benefit to lower wage earners than higher wage earners. Compare two retirees who retire at full retirement age in 2014, need 80% of their final salary to live a comfortable retirement, and will use a 4% SWR.

The one who made the equivalent of $48K (in 2014 dollars) throughout their career will receive approximately 44% of their final earnings as a SS benefit at FRA.
The one who made the equivalent of $300K (in 2014 dollars) throughout their career will receive approximately 11% of their final earnings as a SS benefit at FRA.

80% - 44% = 36% * $48K = $17,280 * 25 = $432,000 portfolio required. 9 times salary.
80% - 11% = 69% * $300K = $207K * 25 = $5,175,000 portfolio required. 17.25 times salary.

This is an oversimplification of the issues, but the main characteristics are true. Your goal should not be to obtain some predetermined portfolio, but rather to obtain a beneficial portfolio based on your particular circumstances. As you can see it is a much bigger challenge for higher income earners.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Novine »

"This forum can be extremely hostile to those who don't roll out of school with computer science or medical degrees. Not everyone makes $100k at their first job, and not making enough to max your 401k doesn't mean you lack intelligence."

I'll disagree with this. I maxed out by 457 for the first time last year, have yet to break the $100k mark in salary but I've still learned a tremendous amount from fellow Bogleheads without ever feeling like anyone was looking down on my financial situation. I think most people who aren't making 6 digit incomes or who don't have multi-million dollar portfolios get that some of the questions or some of the recommendations may not apply to their situation. But you can still learn quite a bit from reading about how others are investing and managing their dollars. I've found that the principles of the Boglehead way apply whether you're making $25,000 a year or $250,000 a year. I know it's been a huge help to my wife and I. By straightening out our finances and getting serious about saving for retirement, we've doubled our retirement savings over the past 4 years. Some of that is thanks to the markets but we wouldn't have been able to take advantage of that run up in stocks if we hadn't been putting money away each month. I don't know if our retirement portfolio will ever reach 7 digits. But I'm a lot more confident that we'll be in good shape when we decide to retire.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by countofmc »

"Success is peace of mind which is a direct result of self-satisfaction in knowing you did your best to become the best you are capable of becoming." - Coach John Wooden

By that very apt definition, I'm sure there are lots of successful people who never made more than $50,000.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by sdsailing »

When the lump sum that a poster was worrying about was referred to as "chump change" by one of the very senior posters here, I found that extremely offensive and was surprised that nobody spoke up.

Yes, of course such attitudes will drive people away !
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by willie838 »

Novine wrote:"This forum can be extremely hostile to those who don't roll out of school with computer science or medical degrees. Not everyone makes $100k at their first job, and not making enough to max your 401k doesn't mean you lack intelligence."

I'll disagree with this. I maxed out by 457 for the first time last year, have yet to break the $100k mark in salary but I've still learned a tremendous amount from fellow Bogleheads without ever feeling like anyone was looking down on my financial situation. I think most people who aren't making 6 digit incomes or who don't have multi-million dollar portfolios get that some of the questions or some of the recommendations may not apply to their situation. But you can still learn quite a bit from reading about how others are investing and managing their dollars. I've found that the principles of the Boglehead way apply whether you're making $25,000 a year or $250,000 a year. I know it's been a huge help to my wife and I. By straightening out our finances and getting serious about saving for retirement, we've doubled our retirement savings over the past 4 years. Some of that is thanks to the markets but we wouldn't have been able to take advantage of that run up in stocks if we hadn't been putting money away each month. I don't know if our retirement portfolio will ever reach 7 digits. But I'm a lot more confident that we'll be in good shape when we decide to retire.

cheers.

at 49/yr right now and can't quite get to a full roth ira/ full 457 contribution yet.....i need to trim my budget because it is possible given my current living situation....

my success isn't really linked to a set target #. If i just put my head down and manage to hit those marks year in/year out- i'll be a good position when i finally get down the road.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by Bud »

My wife and I combined have never made over $60k, I am 50 years old, married for 22 years with 4 kids, ages 14-7. I have worked for a non-profit for the last 20 years which is very fulfilling but doesn't pay well. My wife and my skills could probably net $150-200k annually if we worked in a different area.

Current net worth is about $1.5 million, split about 1/3 in mutual funds, 1/3 in home, and 1/3 in other real estate. Very fortunate in all areas. No school loans, no home loans, no car loans, started saving when I was in high school & started investing when I was in college . Benefited from about $70k inheritance when my mom passed but would rather have my mom still with us.

We still have some major hurdles of financing four college educations - plus I plan to start on my doctorate next year - and a few weddings. So we aren't out of the woods yet...

But it seems that a simply lifestyle can trump high income.
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by yukon50 »

tibbitts wrote:Maybe we need to reset this thread and specify $50k income in 2014 dollars, because obviously we're getting responses about cases of never earning more than $50k, back when $50k was a very, very generous income.

And we need to decide if it's $50k personal income, maybe x2, or the approximately-average $50k household income.

A lot depends on luck. If starting employment today, at an income of $50k, we get 40 years of 2% inflation, 1% salary growth, and 2% real investment returns, the "miracle of compounding" isn't going to be very miraculous, and no reasonable savings rate is going to fix that. If instead we get 40 years of 2% inflation, 4% salary growth, and 6% real investment returns... completely different story.
+1
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by dbCooperAir »

I'm going to look at this from a different angle. I think the following is example that is relevant.

Could a person making $50k/year manage to fill just a IRA today?

If yes to the above and you did that for 35-40 years what would you end up with?

For us lonely working class, or was it middle income/middle class, what ever we call it, it gives some example of what can or can not happen.

If we make some assumptions that the past IRA deduction limits keep up as they did for the last 30 years you can end up in a decent spot. %10 of your $50k is just about enough to full fund a IRA today, if married and saving 22% you could fully fund two IRA's. That would leave you close to $40K to live on, a tad over $3k/month.

If you were really lucky (ok really, really lucky) and made 8% real and funded two IRA's that puts you at about $990,000, not quite a million but close enough in my book. I don't see $700,000 out of the question. $700,000 + some SS makes for a lifestyle many people would dream about and wish they had today.

http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtop ... n#p1539922
Just for fun I took the max amount one could put in an IRA without any catch up plans etc., based it on 6% real growth starting in the first year one could get an IRA (1974).

At the start of 2013 after 38-39 years you would end up around $310,000, if married go ahead and double it. These are just rough numbers of sorts.

Now put yourself in the shoes of one who did not have a 401K, pension etc. Just a plain Joe lunch box worker who lived below his means, owns his little America dream home, lived decent during your working years and was just was able to save the max for an IRA and that was about it.
Some other end numbers at different growth rates:
4% = $202,000
5% = $250,000
7% = $390,000
8% = $495,000
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Re: Any success stories of ppl who never made >$50,000?

Post by camptalcott »

Mike Scott wrote:This is a tough crowd to hang with if you are merely "middle class" which is too bad because the principles are the same. I have noticed several lower income first time posters that don't seem to come back after their first post.

1000% agree. I would never suggest my son come to this board. Never. it's simply to hostile. He's 24 just graduated from college and is working an entry level job at UPS. Between his rent, student loans and living expenses (car insurance etc) he is barely able to save 3% of his salary in his 401K.

NO way would I encourage him to post here. to be told that he's a slacker, that it's his fault because if he'd stop buying Iphones (which he doesn't have) new cars (which he doesn't have) he'd be able to have millions of dollars saved or to be told because God forbid he actually went to have a beer while watching the eagles game with friend, he is destined to live under a bridge when he retires.

Heck, I asked a question about an inheritance and was basically told by some one that it's was my own fault I don't know how the taxes on my inheritance will run. I should have paid attention when my husband was living instead of being a house wife. LOL. for the most part I've found people are extremely nice and answered my questions but there is a definite under current of "elitism".

that's why whenever I ask a question I apologize up front and admit that it might be a stupid question.
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