Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

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Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby DidItMyWay » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:26 pm

This is a new one to me. Wanted to see if this has happened to any of you, or if you have heard of this.

I have a savings/money market account (my emergency fund) and checking account at one of the "big" banks and have for several years.

One day last week, someone from the branch called my house and said that there is some information missing on my accounts that they need to have and update: my citizenship, occupation, and income. They said I could give it to them over the phone or come into the branch. I told the I would come in to the branch when I had a chance. I did advise him I had never been asked his before, and he said they need it for all customers and have to update it "before March."

So this week, a different person from the same branch called me again, and I told her the same thing (that I would come in to the branch when I had a chance.)

I have no mortgage or loan with them. Am wondering if they want me to come in so they can try to sell me something, which I am not interested in.

Any feedback in this?
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby HueyLD » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:32 pm

Don't give out such information over the phone. You don't know who may be calling.

Unless there is a federal or state law mandating the requested information, I won't bother with such requests.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Fallible » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:33 pm

You've chosen the right option: not to tell them anything over the phone and to go to your branch bank. But only you can answer your questions - by going to the branch bank. If you do, please let us know what they say. You also can call your main or branch bank, but not using the number the callers gave you, if they did.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby dekecarver » Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:35 pm

I would ask them to send me a copy of the document that is directing their request for said personal information including verification of due date.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Epsilon Delta » Fri Jan 17, 2014 1:37 pm

Do you want to stay with this bank? If I had another transaction account at a different bank I would ignore them and see what happens.

If the information is required for regulator purposes any even marginally competent bank would volunteer that at first contact and follow up in writing and not a phone call. They almost certainly want to sell you something.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby ddunca1944 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 1:41 pm

Are you certain that it IS the bank calling? I'd call the local branch and ask if they really are asking these questions.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby obgraham » Fri Jan 17, 2014 1:44 pm

My oft-quoted response to things like this:

"Your perceived need for this information does not obligate me to provide it."

If it is some urgent matter, they will take steps to do something about it. Meanwhile, forgettaboutit.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Whatyear? » Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:16 pm

Sounds like a scam to me - I would do nothing. Unless you want to alert your bank to the scam.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby 123 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:30 pm

This sounds odd unless you've got a business account of some kind with them.

If you're just a retail bank customer I'd ask them to send you a form to fill out and return.

When you get the form simply answer all questions "Decline to state" if you're in that kind of mood and send it back. Save yourself a trip to the branch.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby dm200 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:24 pm

I can not judge anything about your specific situation, but I know that there is considerable (and increasing) scrutiny on financial institutions (banks and credit unions) to "know your customer", and this may be fully justifiable. These requirements and scrutiny do apply to all accounts, whether personal or business and the level of such scrutiny of customers may differ greatly from one institution to another, based on that institution's "risk analysis" or findings by that institution's regulator. For example, if it were found that a particular bank was lax in tracking and reporting of actual or potential money laundering, increased scrutiny might be required of all customers. It may also be that the information you are being asked for may now be required of new customers, but you did not have to supply it because the account was opened before those requirements were in place.

if this were me, I would supply the requested information by going into a branch and making sure the requests were legitimate - then supply the information.

Just my "seat of the pants" guess - I believe these requests are both real and legitimate.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby prudent » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:36 pm

I vaguely recall seeing that some Dodd-Frank rule becoming effective March 30 but I don't remember what it was about.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby harrychan » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:38 pm

Call your bank immediately. Sounds like a scam. Obligate the phone caller to provide details of you such as part of your address. Never offer info over the phone.
This is not legal or certified financial advice but you know that already.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby ResearchMed » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:38 pm

dm200 wrote:I can not judge anything about your specific situation, but I know that there is considerable (and increasing) scrutiny on financial institutions (banks and credit unions) to "know your customer", and this may be fully justifiable. These requirements and scrutiny do apply to all accounts, whether personal or business and the level of such scrutiny of customers may differ greatly from one institution to another, based on that institution's "risk analysis" or findings by that institution's regulator. For example, if it were found that a particular bank was lax in tracking and reporting of actual or potential money laundering, increased scrutiny might be required of all customers. It may also be that the information you are being asked for may now be required of new customers, but you did not have to supply it because the account was opened before those requirements were in place.

if this were me, I would supply the requested information by going into a branch and making sure the requests were legitimate - then supply the information.

Just my "seat of the pants" guess - I believe these requests are both real and legitimate.


This is what I'd guess, too.

And you probably didn't need to provide all of the detail if you opened the account years ago.
So they are probably updating records to be cautious/pro-active, or they may have a new requirement to do so for all existing customers.

You were, of course, wise NOT to give out any information over the phone, but you should at the very least call the branch manager to ask if the call was legit. If it was, then you can give them the necessary info over the phone (YOU called THEM this time, not vice versa), or head on over to provide it.

And if they do not know what "call" you are referring to, then you might want to alert them that there is indeed some sort of scammer out there.

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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby greg24 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:40 pm

It'd be quicker if they'd just call the NSA and get the information from them.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby rr2 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:47 pm

Recently, we received a letter from TIAA Direct to provide similar information. We have our emergency funds in a savings account there. I did call and provide them this. It wasn't a scam.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby jf89 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 4:10 pm

Is this really a hill you're going to die on?

Just call them back on a number you know to be accurate and give them three innocuous pieces of information along with a request that they not send you marketing materials. Being cautious and pessimistic is a good thing with your personal information, but sometimes I think people get a little too paranoid when they are asked for information.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby livesoft » Fri Jan 17, 2014 4:14 pm

Hasn't anybody mentioned the Patriot Act?

http://www.homelandsecurity-us.com/banking.html
It's all about short-term opportunistic rebalancing due to a short-term change in one's asset allocation, uh, I mean opportunistic rebalancing, uh I mean rebalancing, uh I mean market timing.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Steelersfan » Fri Jan 17, 2014 4:31 pm

It may or may not be your bank calling so be sure of that.

If it is your bank, find out exactly why they need that, i.e what new regulation requires it.

Bank branches are pushing investment products these days and they just may want that information to better guide their marketing efforts.

I would give that information out only after great resistance.

I would be a prime marketing target and my bank hasn't asked me.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Epsilon Delta » Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:22 pm

dm200 wrote:
if this were me, I would supply the requested information by going into a branch and making sure the requests were legitimate - then supply the information.

Just my "seat of the pants" guess - I believe these requests are both real and legitimate.


Your definition of legitimate seems to be that the bank wants the information. My definition is quite different. I have a couple of accounts. If all of them ask I have to decide if I want to die on that hill. If a too big to fail bank asks and my credit union doesn't I can let too big to fail die on the hill. If too big to fail is under special scrutiny by regulators then they are shady and I don't want to deal with them if I have a choice.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby TomatoTomahto » Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:32 pm

KYC (Know Your Customer) is a big deal for banks. My wife's employer is spending millions to develop systems and operational support to deal with the requirement. I don't know what the retail customer requirements are, but I know that my wife's bank would love for it to go away :annoyed ... but it won't.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby HornedToad » Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:36 pm

Citizenship and occupation seem legitimate. I'd be skeptical about "needing" to provide income....
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby G-Money » Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:39 pm

The troublemaker in me would want to see what happened if I didn't provide the info at all.

Don't take the above as advice.
Don't assume I know what I'm talking about.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby dm200 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:01 pm

Epsilon Delta wrote:
dm200 wrote:
if this were me, I would supply the requested information by going into a branch and making sure the requests were legitimate - then supply the information.

Just my "seat of the pants" guess - I believe these requests are both real and legitimate.


Your definition of legitimate seems to be that the bank wants the information. My definition is quite different. I have a couple of accounts. If all of them ask I have to decide if I want to die on that hill. If a too big to fail bank asks and my credit union doesn't I can let too big to fail die on the hill. If too big to fail is under special scrutiny by regulators then they are shady and I don't want to deal with them if I have a choice.


Depending on many factors, including just how you refuse or decline to provide the requested information, the bank or credit union may (or believe it is obligated to) file a SAR (Suspicious Activity Report) with the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network. YOUR definition of "legitimate", when it comes to compliance with statutory and regulatory requirements on financial institutions is irrelevant. failure to comply with such requirements can result in huge financial penalties to these financial institutions - even if not a single terrorist, money laundered, criminal, etc. has ever slipped through the cracks. The bank's representative with whom you deal could be fired on the spot for letting something slip by that was required by the bank's policies and procedures. I am in this business and I am very familiar with the rules banks and credit unions must comply with.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby sscritic » Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:08 pm

The request came last week. Today is Friday, so the request is somewhere between 7 and 11 days old. Should we have a poll on how long it will take the OP to get to his branch?
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby cherijoh » Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:11 pm

Citizenship and occupation could definitely be part of know your customer. The latter could help identify whether you would be expected to run a cash-based business (e.g., a hairdresser). I would call or stop by the bank since they probably are not going to give up - especially if they are getting ready for an audit or just had a negative audit finding.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby AAA » Fri Jan 17, 2014 6:42 pm

I inherited an account at one of the large brokerage firms and they periodically send me a form, implying that it is required, that includes questions about my income and savings. I have so far totally ignored it.

Vanguard has never asked me for such information, so I doubt that there is any legal reason to do so. I assume it is part of the other brokerage firm's marketing efforts.
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Postby pinecrest » Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:03 pm

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Last edited by pinecrest on Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:44 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Grt2bOutdoors » Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:39 pm

TomatoTomahto wrote:KYC (Know Your Customer) is a big deal for banks. My wife's employer is spending millions to develop systems and operational support to deal with the requirement. I don't know what the retail customer requirements are, but I know that my wife's bank would love for it to go away :annoyed ... but it won't.


It's always been a big deal for the banks - sounds like your wife's company recently fell victim to being regulated by either the Fed, Comptroller of the Currency or FDIC or perhaps more than one of those agencies because they are considered to be Systematically Important Financial Institutions - congrats on making the VIP list. Forget it, it will never go away.

The primary purpose of KYC - is to track the flow of funds from point a to the last point - in other words, they are trying to keep money laundering, terrorist financing and scams to a minimum. How do you accomplish this? by making it difficult for the criminals to have open access to the financial system and holding the banks accountable with the threat of fines and charter seizure and bad publicity. HSBC is one such bank who've had issues complying with KYC - they are always in the news about compliance lapses and may I mention?, fat fines.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Grt2bOutdoors » Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:42 pm

pinecrest wrote:
cherijoh wrote:Citizenship and occupation could definitely be part of know your customer. The latter could help identify whether you would be expected to run a cash-based business (e.g., a hairdresser). I would call or stop by the bank since they probably are not going to give up - especially if they are getting ready for an audit or just had a negative audit finding.


I'm not sure about citizenship but I highly doubt that occupation is a legal requirement for individuals. Especially since it would be extremely hard to keep track of when people change occupation or retire. But as I understand it, even if it's not a legal requirement, banks have the right to make this a bank requirement and can refuse to do business with you if you don't comply. In a case like that, if you don't want to provide the information, your alternative would be to do business with another bank.


Cherijoh is correct, both citizenship and occupation are legal requirements - for all customers, not just business clients.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby stormswami » Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:49 pm

As per the OP, I had this very thing occur this week. I was initially very suspicious, but while still on the call I was able to verify that it indeed my local branch of Chase calling. The were wanting just to confirm U.S. citizenship and something else (specific thing escapes me, but it was not a particularly private thing). Their identified need for calling was a review of standing accounts for compliance with newer security regulations.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Fallible » Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:00 pm

stormswami wrote:As per the OP, I had this very thing occur this week. I was initially very suspicious, but while still on the call I was able to verify that it indeed my local branch of Chase calling. The were wanting just to confirm U.S. citizenship and something else (specific thing escapes me, but it was not a particularly private thing). Their identified need for calling was a review of standing accounts for compliance with newer security regulations.


Just wondering how you were able to confirm it was your branch bank calling.
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Postby pinecrest » Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:01 pm

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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby stormswami » Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:25 pm

Fallible wrote:Just wondering how you were able to confirm it was your branch bank calling.


My caller ID showed it as a local number (aside from saying the bank name, which can be faked I suppose) and so I quickly looked it up via my cell phone as they began to state why they were calling. The specified number came back as the local branch. Even so, they quickly let it be know what specific info was being requested, which I personally deemed not to be critically sensitive. Regardless, I still wouldn't have given out more sensitive data over the phone.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby jsl11 » Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:45 pm

A Boglehead can always use "investor" as an occupation.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby IlliniDave » Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:53 pm

Steelersfan wrote:It may or may not be your bank calling so be sure of that.

If it is your bank, find out exactly why they need that, i.e what new regulation requires it.

Bank branches are pushing investment products these days and they just may want that information to better guide their marketing efforts.

I would give that information out only after great resistance.

I would be a prime marketing target and my bank hasn't asked me.


This was my first thought. I've been harassed (mildly) of late. I guess they noticed all the money being transferred to Vanguard. Suddenly the bank became interested in helping me make sure I was meeting my financial goals. Their strategy was to send a 25 year old kid on a mission to convince me to let him advise me. The only time they've been more interested in me is when I went in there to have them wire the final payment to pay off my mortgage. The woman was trying to sell me an HEL/HELOC while I was sitting there waiting to get the transfer confirmation/receipt. They called me about once a month for a year trying to get themselves a lien on my house.

Citizenship seems like it could be a legit request under USA patriot but the rest sounds like data to target marketing efforts. I'd go in person and be pretty insistent on knowing why and how much/little they planned to use the information for.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby DougS » Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:34 am

I am very familiar with this given I work in a bank Compliance department. All banks are being forced to upgrade their anti-money laundering capabilities. To do so, banks have to update the information they have on their customers. So-called know-your-customer rules. It is absolutely legitimate. If you haven't been asked for information, it's only a matter of time.

That said, I would only give information in person to a branch or a trustworthy connection. Many scammers know banks have to do this, and thus are stepping in to try to impersonate banks.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby DidItMyWay » Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:38 am

Thanks, all, for your responses.

The bank is, in fact, Chase. Also, I know it was actually them calling, as it was the local branch's phone # that appeared on my caller ID.

I will go into the branch. It was just not convenient for me to go this week and, since the guy said that he needed the info "before March", I wasn't too worried about it.

I will probably end up providing the info as well; I will definitely first ask them what the recent requirement is that deems it necessary for them to now have this info (especially my income...the other two requests seem more reasonable) because I am curious about this.

I'd rather not listen to any marketing pitches trying to sell me a HELOC or give me "investment help" as they have tried to pitch to me in the past more than once when I go in to make a deposit and also over the phone. It gets to be a nuisance after a few times, so I have resorted to mostly just using the ATM to save myself time from having to tell them no thanks. So when I am there, maybe I will ask them if I can be put on their "do not call/do not market to" list if they have such a thing. I am a Bogglehead, so I do my own investment stuff, and not through them. :)
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby DidItMyWay » Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:40 am

jsl11 wrote:A Boglehead can always use "investor" as an occupation.


+1
Am just a regular old corporate drone, but "investor" sounds more important. :)
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby NYnative » Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:57 am

No problem with telling anyone that I'm a US citizen. As to occupation, unless I'm applying for a loan, my standard response is "unemployed pillow plumper." :shock: Gets strange looks, but they must put down what you say. When asked race, I always reply that I'm a native American. I was born in the US of US citizen parents. If they want to put down my race determined by looking at me, that's their prerogative. I really dislike all the fishing for personal information by people or companies that have no need for it. Frankly, at my age, if someone wants to put me down as "suspicious," I welcome the excitement. :sharebeer
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby dm200 » Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:53 am

It is one thing, in my opinion, to lie to a telemarketeer (or similar folks) about such matters - yet another to lie, be deceptive or even "joke" about certain matters to anyone with a highly regulated financial institution (bank or credit union). I strongly suggest not doing anythng like that. This might be similar to "joking" at an airport about having a gun, or similar situations.

Look what happened to Elliott Spitzer a few years ago. Whatever you think of his "activities" and the expenditure of funds (apparantly all his) for these "activities" -- it was neither of those issues that led to his being investigated and the "activities" and expenditures "exposed". http://nypost.com/2010/04/20/spitzers-r ... ll-report/

What began the investigation was hist request/attempt with his bank to strip/remove his name from a $5,000 transfer. The bank filed a SAR (suspicious activity report) and bad things happened to him. Some of the things proposed in this discussion may very well lead to s SAR being filed. Nothing good can ever come from such a filing - even though only a small percentage lead to problems. You take the risk at your own peril, in my opinion.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Diogenes » Sat Jan 18, 2014 3:36 am

DougS wrote:I am very familiar with this given I work in a bank Compliance department. All banks are being forced to upgrade their anti-money laundering capabilities. To do so, banks have to update the information they have on their customers. So-called know-your-customer rules. It is absolutely legitimate. If you haven't been asked for information, it's only a matter of time.

That said, I would only give information in person to a branch or a trustworthy connection. Many scammers know banks have to do this, and thus are stepping in to try to impersonate banks.


Please provide a link to the law that requires a bank customer to provide their occupation and income to maintain a deposit account. I just opened a new account of this type and was never asked. I would simply decline if I were. The bank is not extending credit.

Neither is their business. Sorry.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby DougS » Sat Jan 18, 2014 5:22 am

The Bank Secrecy Act is the main law as amended several times. Combined with the Patriot Act and Dodd Frank. Banks are obligated to "know your customer" under those laws and the rules are enforced by the Federal Reserve and other regulators.

And it has nothing to do with credit. Its about (ostensibly) fighting money laundering, drug money and terrorist funding. Hence why questions are asked on all types of accounts.

I'm not surprised you weren't asked recently for all of this information at account opening. The laws were tightened with Dodd Frank and the regulators have been focusing on the large banks first. Its only a matter of time. Not that I agree. Just telling you why.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Meaty » Sat Jan 18, 2014 7:18 am

I'm guessing ur with JP Morgan. That've been hit pretty hard recently on a number of fronts including bank secrecy act and money laundering violations. This was likely info tgey were obligayed to collect when you opened the account but they failed to do so. Go to the branch to provide the info.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby peppers » Sat Jan 18, 2014 7:45 am

I would go to the bank and verify if this is a legitimate request.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Lynxville » Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:22 am

Wells Fargo pulled that on me, while I was in the bank. I said why are you asking me this and they said they wanted to get to know me better. Told them none of your business.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Diogenes » Sat Jan 18, 2014 10:36 am

DougS wrote:The Bank Secrecy Act is the main law as amended several times. Combined with the Patriot Act and Dodd Frank. Banks are obligated to "know your customer" under those laws and the rules are enforced by the Federal Reserve and other regulators.

And it has nothing to do with credit. Its about (ostensibly) fighting money laundering, drug money and terrorist funding. Hence why questions are asked on all types of accounts.

I'm not surprised you weren't asked recently for all of this information at account opening. The laws were tightened with Dodd Frank and the regulators have been focusing on the large banks first. Its only a matter of time. Not that I agree. Just telling you why.


The Bank Secrecy Act is from 1970. There is no new requirement there or in the Patriot Act for anything like what the Op was asked for. The Know Your Customer push is to discourage money laundering and is designed to simply identify a account holder. No specific requirement to demand occupation or income information. Dodd Frank does not "require" that either.
http://useconomy.about.com/od/criticals ... rm-Act.htm
If this is wrong please post a link to that requirement. If you are identified by normal means (SSN etc) the government has more reliable means anyway for income and occupation if desired - the IRS.

Perhaps the bank is suspicious of the particular account. If so they are free to ask, but of course we are free to decline to provide it. I simply would never provide that kind of info when opening a simple deposit account. Lots of banks out there.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby Texas hold em71 » Sat Jan 18, 2014 10:47 am

DougS wrote:The Bank Secrecy Act is the main law as amended several times. Combined with the Patriot Act and Dodd Frank. Banks are obligated to "know your customer" under those laws and the rules are enforced by the Federal Reserve and other regulators.

And it has nothing to do with credit. Its about (ostensibly) fighting money laundering, drug money and terrorist funding. Hence why questions are asked on all types of accounts.

I'm not surprised you weren't asked recently for all of this information at account opening. The laws were tightened with Dodd Frank and the regulators have been focusing on the large banks first. Its only a matter of time. Not that I agree. Just telling you why.


+1

I suppose you could refuse to give the information until the regulations require them to close or freeze your account at which point, I am sure you will get a written request explaining it all to you with adequate notice. Until then, I would expect regular phone calls from them asking for it. I suspect moving the account will mean dealing with a new bank that will ask the question.

To the person that said Vanguard did not collect such information, I can say that they did ask my husband citizenship and occupation when he opened a new account recently. I do not think they asked income. Vanguard is not a bank though so they are not subject to all of the banking regulations.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby blevine » Sat Jan 18, 2014 10:58 am

Patriot act and Anti Money Laundering (AML) require banks to verify your identify, that's it.
They are entitled to see your state ID (drivers lic, passport) to prove who you are when you open the account.
They do NOT need to know nor have the right to know anything other than name, address, and IDs to prove it
with associated ID #s (SS#, drive license # etc). Income and occupation is clearly a way to get marketing data on your,
so they can sell investment and loans to you. At the time you opened the account, you probably gave them identifying
information that is sufficient fro AML/Patriot act laws. My last bank account application did ask for employer, but
not income nor occupation (employer does not necessarily tell them occupation).

My policy is to not give any information to anyone not required.
Remember, every one of these banks is as much a taget for hackers as Target.
The more they have in their systems, the more exposed you are, to their own employees
and potential hackers who might access their systems. I wouldn't give even Vanguard any info
other than what I absolutely must. I turn down free discount card offers now from drug stores etc,
because I wont even give out my phone number to retail stores, after what happened at Target.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby dm200 » Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:46 pm

blevine wrote:Patriot act and Anti Money Laundering (AML) require banks to verify your identify, that's it.
They are entitled to see your state ID (drivers lic, passport) to prove who you are when you open the account.
They do NOT need to know nor have the right to know anything other than name, address, and IDs to prove it
with associated ID #s (SS#, drive license # etc). Income and occupation is clearly a way to get marketing data on your,
so they can sell investment and loans to you. At the time you opened the account, you probably gave them identifying
information that is sufficient fro AML/Patriot act laws. My last bank account application did ask for employer, but
not income nor occupation (employer does not necessarily tell them occupation).

My policy is to not give any information to anyone not required.
Remember, every one of these banks is as much a taget for hackers as Target.
The more they have in their systems, the more exposed you are, to their own employees
and potential hackers who might access their systems. I wouldn't give even Vanguard any info
other than what I absolutely must. I turn down free discount card offers now from drug stores etc,
because I wont even give out my phone number to retail stores, after what happened at Target.


I am in the business (regularly dealing in the front lines) and you just do not know what you are talking about. The types of questions and information requested in this discussion may clearly only be for regulatory complinace. Income, occupation and other information about the nature of the use of any account at a financial institution are very common and valid for regulatory compliance reasons - NOT JUST FOR MARKETING. I hope nobody relies on your very ill-advised and grossly incorrect information.
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Re: Anyone familiar with this? Bank asking for info...

Postby DougS » Sat Jan 18, 2014 3:43 pm

Lynxville wrote:The Bank Secrecy Act is from 1970. There is no new requirement there or in the Patriot Act for anything like what the Op was asked for. The Know Your Customer push is to discourage money laundering and is designed to simply identify a account holder. No specific requirement to demand occupation or income information. Dodd Frank does not "require" that either.http://useconomy.about.com/od/criticals ... rm-Act.htmIf this is wrong please post a link to that requirement. If you are identified by normal means (SSN etc) the government has more reliable means anyway for income and occupation if desired - the IRS.


If you are looking for a law that requires banks to collect occupation information, you won't find one. As a refresher, laws are written broadly and interpreted by regulators who pass rules. Think HHS for Obamacare, and the IRS for the tax code. In this case the BSA requires banks to maintain a know your customer program and monitor activity for money laundering, but the Federal Reserve and OCC are left to interpret that law, issue rules, and hold banks accountable to it. This guidance has been tightened over the past few years following Dodd Frank and high profile money laundering violations such as HSBC. Big banks get the most attention from regulators, thus you are seeing banks like Chase and Wells in the lead in asking for this type of information, but it will make its way to smaller banks and credit unions at some point.

Going back to the OP, agree with it or not, it is a legitimate request. But I would provide the information in person, just in case it is a phishing attempt from bad guys knowing banks are starting to gather this information.
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