Cash at home

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Cash at home

Postby Streptococcus » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:13 pm

Do bogleheads keep cash at home as part of their emergency funds? I mean, if the mother of all emergencies happens tomorrow and the whole nation fails, including internet, the only thing that might matter is cash.
Just curious to know what you guys think.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby avalpert » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:19 pm

Why would you think cash would matter if the nation failed - who would want to take it?
Maybe gold or diamonds or oil or canned food - the best currency will heavily depend on the specifics of the situation.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Rainier » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:27 pm

During a regional failure like Katrina or Sandy cash was still king. I didn't see anybody in gas lines using silver to fill the tank.

Prior to Sandy we had just been traveling so we had a couple hundred in cash on hand. If that wasn't the case I would have taken some out. I also topped off all my gas tanks. If I lived in earthquake country I would keep cash in my house, but only a few days worth (maybe $200).
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Re: Cash at home

Postby mike143 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:30 pm

If you consider an assortment of firearms and an unnecessary stock of ammo, then yes. I should really keep some actual cash on hand since we are in hurricane central (Florida).
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Re: Cash at home

Postby livesoft » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:34 pm

No cash or valuables at home.

As I have written before, cash did me no good during hurricanes and or natural disasters. Most recent experience was Sandy: with no electricity and trees blocking roads, there was no where to go to spend one's cash even if I had it. Once roads were cleared, the important thing was a car (preferably SUV capable of going through high water) with a full-tank of gas to drive out of the disaster zone to where one's credit cards would work.

With Sandy, we drove out past all the long lines at gas stations and didn't have to ever stop. Just because you have cash for gas does not mean the gas stations will have gas. That was a lesson folks learned during hurricane Rita. We drove out. Hurricane Ike was better managed as gas was diverted to stations on interstate highways. We drove out of Ike as well.

So the most important thing is a vehicle with a full-tank of gas and place to go. So choose your relatives and friends wisely and be diversified: All your friends and family cannot live in the same place as you do.

Cash is not needed by folks who are prepared. Maybe containers of gasoline would be something better to have. You could sell them to folks who were not prepared.
It's all about short-term opportunistic rebalancing due to a short-term change in one's asset allocation, uh, I mean opportunistic rebalancing, uh I mean rebalancing, uh I mean market timing.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby rfburns » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:41 pm

I keep about a weeks worth of cash at home, but not for the reasons you mention nor as part of my emergency fund. It matters little in a year's time, but nice to have for incidentals.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Streptococcus » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:41 pm

livesoft wrote:No cash or valuables at home.

As I have written before, cash did me no good during hurricanes and or natural disasters. Most recent experience was Sandy: with no electricity and trees blocking roads, there was no where to go to spend one's cash even if I had it. Once roads were cleared, the important thing was a car (preferably SUV capable of going through high water) with a full-tank of gas to drive out of the disaster zone to where one's credit cards would work.

With Sandy, we drove out past all the long lines at gas stations and didn't have to ever stop. Just because you have cash for gas does not mean the gas stations will have gas. That was a lesson folks learned during hurricane Rita. We drove out. Hurricane Ike was better managed as gas was diverted to stations on interstate highways. We drove out of Ike as well.

So the most important thing is a vehicle with a full-tank of gas and place to go. So choose your relatives and friends wisely and be diversified: All your friends and family cannot live in the same place as you do.

Cash is not needed by folks who are prepared. Maybe containers of gasoline would be something better to have. You could sell them to folks who were not prepared.
Rainier wrote:During a regional failure like Katrina or Sandy cash was still king. I didn't see anybody in gas lines using silver to fill the tank.

Prior to Sandy we had just been traveling so we had a couple hundred in cash on hand. If that wasn't the case I would have taken some out. I also topped off all my gas tanks. If I lived in earthquake country I would keep cash in my house, but only a few days worth (maybe $200).


So far, it emerges that cash and gas would be key during the emergency situations. I personally experienced a situation where for a week, there was blackout, the banks were closed and ATMs non functioning. Having cash was extremely helpful. having millions in the bank and no cash available was a bummer.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Atilla » Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:22 pm

A grand or two in cash.
3-4 cases of wine/top shelf liquor in storage
Pistols, rifles, a shotgun and several thousand rounds.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby livesoft » Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:23 pm

Streptococcus wrote:I personally experienced a situation where for a week, there was blackout, the banks were closed and ATMs non functioning. Having cash was extremely helpful. having millions in the bank and no cash available was a bummer.

Me, too, except I drove out of the blackout zone as the week of blackout started to a zone where banks were open, credit cards worked, and life went on.

Some of my neighbors just drove to a local airport and flew to Disney World with their kids since in a blackout the schools are not open anyways.
It's all about short-term opportunistic rebalancing due to a short-term change in one's asset allocation, uh, I mean opportunistic rebalancing, uh I mean rebalancing, uh I mean market timing.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby OnFire » Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:02 am

I have about a grand in cash, including small bills. About 20 silver 1 oz coins. I also have a small stock of non-perishable food, and two six-gallon gas cans I rotate about every six months. I also have two SUVs, a Jeep Wrangler and an Acadia. All-weather radio, drinking filters, firearms, a few hundred rounds, and a good stash of batteries. Access to a generator, and some alcohol stores as well.

I like to be prepared.

Never know when the zombie apocalypse is coming...

Do a search, it's a frequent topic...
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Default User BR » Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:11 am

livesoft wrote:Sandy
hurricane Rita
Hurricane Ike

Lesson, stay away from Livesoft, he attracts hurricanes.


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Re: Cash at home

Postby jon-nyc » Thu Jun 27, 2013 4:44 am

I have since the blackout in 2003.

It has come in handy too when a plumber needs to be called and gives a discount for cash.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby BrandonBogle » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:04 am

mike143 wrote:If you consider an assortment of firearms and an unnecessary stock of ammo, then yes. I should really keep some actual cash on hand since we are in hurricane central (Florida).


Growing up in Fort Lauderdale/Miami, Florida, I can tell you that no hurricane ever "surprised" us so quickly that we didn't have time to fill up our tanks and take cash out the ATM. So cash on hand when the hurricane approaches is fine, but beyond that I don't think we could scrounge up $20 in cash in the house.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby BrandonBogle » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:08 am

Streptococcus wrote:So far, it emerges that cash and gas would be key during the emergency situations. I personally experienced a situation where for a week, there was blackout, the banks were closed and ATMs non functioning. Having cash was extremely helpful. having millions in the bank and no cash available was a bummer.


I have not had a single blackout or power outage (knock on wood) for 5 years now. But the last time I experienced one, the ATM by my house and the ATM by my work were on battery backup. The same with the ones in my local grocery store (they had a localized outage last month around the store). Gotta love underground power!
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Cash » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:10 am

I keep a hundred around just in case the need arises and I don't want to go to the ATM a block away. Mostly my wife takes from it for cab fare because she likes to go to the ATM even less than I do.

I don't live in an area prone to natural disasters. But for those who do: If stores are open and taking cash but not credit (telephone lines down?), are the banks not open as well?
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Re: Cash at home

Postby frugaltype » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:38 am

OnFire wrote:I have about a grand in cash, including small bills. About 20 silver 1 oz coins. I also have a small stock of non-perishable food, and two six-gallon gas cans I rotate about every six months. I also have two SUVs, a Jeep Wrangler and an Acadia. All-weather radio, drinking filters, firearms, a few hundred rounds, and a good stash of batteries. Access to a generator, and some alcohol stores as well.


I'm prepared for two different types of things:

1. I keep $100-$200 in cash on hand because I engage in some transactions (farmers' markets, etc.) where I use cash, so this is a convenience that I refill periodically.

2. A stock of food, candles, lanterns, battery powered radio, lots of batteries changed periodically, water, and so on for about a month long disruption of normal life, like a hurricane that doesn't significantly damage the house, or being snowed in. I fill the car with gas when there's a hurricane warning, and I rarely let it get below a half tank normally.

I have a tuned list of what to take if I have to evacuate for a major hurricane or whatever. I'm assuming there's some place to evacuate to with a normal lifestyle going on.

I really haven't prepared for the zombie apocalypse, other than to grow more of my own food and do preserving. I'm not self-sufficient in that regard. If the zombies invade, I don't think cash is going to be much good. Only usable stuff will have value. Maybe the zombie queen would like some gold, but otherwise it will probably have no value.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby livesoft » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:08 am

More disaster prep stuff: My spouse is a member of the county's FEMA's Certified Emergency Response Team and a local Search & Rescue Team. We have all kinds of cool T-shirts, spare water, and radios stored in every room in the house. However, my biggest disaster that I was unprepared for was ...


... My laptop broke while I was travelling overseas. I had no easy way of looking up anything on the internet without using a computer in a hotel's business center. I also charge my cell phone through my laptop, so I was unable to easily charge my phone. I had to ration my phone use so that the battery would not run out.

So does everyone have a backup plan when their phones and computers don't work?
It's all about short-term opportunistic rebalancing due to a short-term change in one's asset allocation, uh, I mean opportunistic rebalancing, uh I mean rebalancing, uh I mean market timing.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby bpp » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:38 am

I keep some cash stashed away, and generally try not let the gas tank in the car get below half full.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby avalpert » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:40 am

livesoft wrote:More disaster prep stuff: My spouse is a member of the county's FEMA's Certified Emergency Response Team and a local Search & Rescue Team. We have all kinds of cool T-shirts, spare water, and radios stored in every room in the house. However, my biggest disaster that I was unprepared for was ...


... My laptop broke while I was travelling overseas. I had no easy way of looking up anything on the internet without using a computer in a hotel's business center. I also charge my cell phone through my laptop, so I was unable to easily charge my phone. I had to ration my phone use so that the battery would not run out.

So does everyone have a backup plan when their phones and computers don't work?

That is far more of a problem in the US than overseas - even in place like Indonesian Borneo and Rwanda I've had an easier time finding a public internet cafe of some form than I would here. You also can usually find a public phone service more easily and there is always asking to borrow someone else's cell phone for a quick call.

But the best backup plan is to never let your primarily plan be reliant on having a computer and a phone - they should be conveniences, not necessities whenever possible
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Re: Cash at home

Postby parsi1 » Thu Jun 27, 2013 9:00 am

I don't believe in firearms that's why I keep a few pepper sprays around the house.
In a situation like that it might be a good idea to have some cash to invest.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby frugaltype » Thu Jun 27, 2013 9:49 am

livesoft wrote:... My laptop broke while I was travelling overseas. I had no easy way of looking up anything on the internet without using a computer in a hotel's business center. I also charge my cell phone through my laptop, so I was unable to easily charge my phone. I had to ration my phone use so that the battery would not run out.

So does everyone have a backup plan when their phones and computers don't work?


I keep a cell phone charger via an electrical outlet in my pocketbook. I have a charger that works with a car's cigarette lighter in my car. I keep my files frequently backed up and encrypted on a flash thumb drive in my pocketbook.

I have fought Verizon tooth and nail to keep my copper-based landline that, of course, runs on phone company power and is likely to work in a power failure. Eventually I will lose.

Edited to add: I wonder if you could have still charged your cell phone via the usb port even if your computer wouldn't boot. That electrical connection might have worked?
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Ged » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:27 am

livesoft wrote:No cash or valuables at home.

As I have written before, cash did me no good during hurricanes and or natural disasters. Most recent experience was Sandy: with no electricity and trees blocking roads, there was no where to go to spend one's cash even if I had it. Once roads were cleared, the important thing was a car (preferably SUV capable of going through high water) with a full-tank of gas to drive out of the disaster zone to where one's credit cards would work.


When the forecasts for Sandy went out I filled my cars and the 5 gal can I keep for my lawn tractor. I also took an extra $200 out of the bank.

I wasn't in the real disaster zone, but we had no power for essentially two weeks. We also had a sunset to sunrise curfew.

I was glad I took the extra money. The banks around me were closed. Nobody was able to process credit cards for the first week. While the power was out it was a cash only economy.

The money was used for replenishing groceries and buying hot meals at two of the restaurants that managed to be open because they had gas ovens. Other than that though there wasn't much to buy because the stores had been stripped bare of everything useful. Grocery stores were very depressing because all they had was non-perishables.

I now keep $500 in my sock drawer. I'm also now own a tri-fuel generator.
Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby tigerman3 » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:31 am

When San Francisco had its quake in 1989, all ATM's were down. Stores with cash registers that used electricity couldn't operate. Credit cards weren't accepted. Since then, I've kept an emergency cache of cash in addition to my usual earthquake preparedness kit.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Bogle101 » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:38 am

Streptococcus wrote:Do bogleheads keep cash at home as part of their emergency funds? I mean, if the mother of all emergencies happens tomorrow and the whole nation fails, including internet, the only thing that might matter is cash.
Just curious to know what you guys think.


Umm, if your apocalyptic scenario happens cash will be worthless and the only form of currency will be weapons.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Sidney » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:52 am

Bogle101 wrote:Umm, if your apocalyptic scenario happens cash will be worthless and the only form of currency will be weapons.

or Slim Jims. Edible, infinite shelf life. Wouldn't be surprised if some inspired chemist determined how to refine them into gasoline.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Phineas J. Whoopee » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:54 am

Bogle101 wrote:
Streptococcus wrote:Do bogleheads keep cash at home as part of their emergency funds? I mean, if the mother of all emergencies happens tomorrow and the whole nation fails, including internet, the only thing that might matter is cash.
Just curious to know what you guys think.


Umm, if your apocalyptic scenario happens cash will be worthless and the only form of currency will be weapons.

How might that work, I wonder.

Me: I'll give you this weapon for your can of tomato soup.

Them: Throw in 10 rounds and its a deal.

Me: Sounds good. Here you go.

Them: [Load weapon and point it at me] Give us our can of tomato soup back.

Me: OK

PJW
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Sidney » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:55 am

I think he means that you only trade the bullet (or a put option) for the can of soup.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby learning_head » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:57 am

livesoft wrote:As I have written before, cash did me no good during hurricanes and or natural disasters.
[...]
Cash is not needed by folks who are prepared. Maybe containers of gasoline would be something better to have. You could sell them to folks who were not prepared.


So, sounds like cash might still be good in case you are not prepared for the unforeseen... E.g. to buy that gasoline container from livesoft... assuming he is selling it for cash ;-)
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Re: Cash at home

Postby livesoft » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:05 am

frugaltype wrote:Edited to add: I wonder if you could have still charged your cell phone via the usb port even if your computer wouldn't boot. That electrical connection might have worked?

Good question: I had a voltage-adapter with a USB port, but it did not work. I used the hotel computer's USB port to charge my phone. My laptop was really dead.
It's all about short-term opportunistic rebalancing due to a short-term change in one's asset allocation, uh, I mean opportunistic rebalancing, uh I mean rebalancing, uh I mean market timing.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Dandy » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:10 am

Hurricane Sandy knocked out power for 5 days - 1st time power had been out for a day or more in 40 years.
I was glad for two things: gas stove - to at least have coffee and some hot meals and cash I took out a few days before.
Don't think you can really keep enouogh cash for doomsday but $500 to $1000 might make lesser disasters more liveable.

Made me think about all electric cars and no power and that our gas stations don't have generators. People with generators
found out they only last a few hours and then you need more gas. Gas fired fireplace?
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Re: Cash at home

Postby mlipps » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:12 am

Streptococcus wrote:Do bogleheads keep cash at home as part of their emergency funds? I mean, if the mother of all emergencies happens tomorrow and the whole nation fails, including internet, the only thing that might matter is cash.
Just curious to know what you guys think.


I keep around $200. I also have an emergency box & I'm working on fleshing it out more. My goal is that if there were an emergency, we'd be able to get us, our 2 dogs, and supplies for 1 week out to our car in a single trip. Easier said than done...
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Re: Cash at home

Postby stupidkid » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:20 am

Atilla wrote:A grand or two in cash.
3-4 cases of wine/top shelf liquor in storage
Pistols, rifles, a shotgun and several thousand rounds.


You might be joking, but if not, +1. I like your style. Cash on hand is great for deals that pop up on craigslist where someone is desperate to get rid of something and I don't want to wait for an ACH transfer from my online bank to my local bank. Booze on hand is great when you're snowed in for a few days (I live in the mountains) or a group of bikers roll through and you need to entertain. Guns on hand are great when there's a bear (or bikers) on your porch, or of course, zombies.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby nisiprius » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:21 am

I think it is unwise to discuss the location of personal valuables online.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby MN Finance » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:26 am

I normally keep a couple grand in cash, but not because of an apocalypse. I just find it reassuring and convenient if I'm out of town and someone needs something or I want to get taken by the door to door steak sales guys or firewood trucks. Also makes it simple and quick to put 100 into a birthday/wedding/event card last minute.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Sam I Am » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:30 am

Message deleted.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Bogle101 » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:41 am

Phineas J. Whoopee wrote:
Bogle101 wrote:
Streptococcus wrote:Do bogleheads keep cash at home as part of their emergency funds? I mean, if the mother of all emergencies happens tomorrow and the whole nation fails, including internet, the only thing that might matter is cash.
Just curious to know what you guys think.


Umm, if your apocalyptic scenario happens cash will be worthless and the only form of currency will be weapons.

How might that work, I wonder.

Me: I'll give you this weapon for your can of tomato soup.

Them: Throw in 10 rounds and its a deal.

Me: Sounds good. Here you go.

Them: [Load weapon and point it at me] Give us our can of tomato soup back.

Me: OK

PJW



lol. This train of thought reminds me of the book, The Road.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Confused » Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:54 pm

frugaltype wrote:I wonder if you could have still charged your cell phone via the usb port even if your computer wouldn't boot. That electrical connection might have worked?


Perhaps look into a Battery Backup Unit for a computer. I have one, it ran me $100, and my computer is plugged into it. My computer just uses juice through it's connection to the wall electrical socket, but if the power goes out, the BBU can power my machine for seven minutes (it's a powerful computer with two monitors). It's normal purpose is to have enough time to shutdown the computer safely in the event of a blackout, but in an emergency, the BBU would have juice stored up for charging a cell phone or whatever other electrical device I needed to plug in.

We also keep two 72-hour kits. We each have a bag of non-perishable food and water, enough to last for three days. I would like to get three months worth of non-perishable food and water kept stored in our home, but we haven't gotten there yet.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby deanbrew » Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:33 pm

Atilla wrote:A grand or two in cash.
3-4 cases of wine/top shelf liquor in storage
Pistols, rifles, a shotgun and several thousand rounds.


^^++

Though not complete, that is one heck of a start. I would add some bottled or stored drinking water.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby fareastwarriors » Thu Jun 27, 2013 4:50 pm

Yes I always have some cash in my wallet and at home.
I like the paper.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby frugaltype » Thu Jun 27, 2013 9:50 pm

Dandy wrote:People with generators
found out they only last a few hours and then you need more gas.


That's why, if I were getting a generator I'd get one hooked up to natural gas. This house will be flooded in 20-30 years, so no sense spending a ton of money on big projects, tho.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby joe8d » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:12 pm

fareastwarriors wrote:Yes I always have some cash in my wallet and at home.
I like the paper.


Yep. Keep about $500 to $1000 in the house and as far as paper,anywhere from 40 to 100 rolls of toilet paper :happy
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Re: Cash at home

Postby MnD » Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:41 pm

No cash, valuables or guns/ammo as statistically they cause many problems in real world situations versus some "the whole nation fails" fantasy.
My boss (two bosses ago) was murdered in his home with his own rifle by a mentally disturbed adult child.
My boss (one boss ago) came found to find his only son dead in the back yard - he had killed himself at age 16 with my bosses handgun.

If no-one knows you have significant gold/silver/cash I guess that's safer, but I know plenty of people that I know have a store of gold/silver/coins/cash etc. in their homes. And if i know that, probably a bunch of other people know that - and those people know and talk to other people.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby scubadiver » Fri Jun 28, 2013 8:26 pm

We keep about $400 in cash.

If the zombie apocalypse hits you'll need guns to make it through the initial chaos. Long term though, a bow and machete are where it's at.

I would also try to loot all the toiler paper that I can find.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Kalo » Fri Jun 28, 2013 11:41 pm

I live as if nothing's ever going to go wrong (probably because so far, nothing has). After reading this I realize that's a silly assumption. But I doubt I'll change until I experience a crisis personally.

Most cash I ever have is $200 if I'm going on a trip, but more normally $100 at a time from the ATM. Usually hide $40 or $60 of it and put the remainder in my wallet.

Hardly ever use cash. Never really need to (although I can see how it would come in handy in a crisis where the juice was out). Sometimes I pay cash when I buy a bagel for breakfast because I feel stupid charging .99 on a credit card. Also pop machines require quarters.

Glad I read this thread. Might get me to start thinking ahead. There's a first time for everything.

:twisted:
"When people say they have a high risk tolerance, what they really mean is that they are willing to make a lot of money." -- Ben Stein/Phil DeMuth - The Little Book of Bullet Proof Investing.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Tom_T » Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:30 am

Having a little cash on hand can come in handy. After the hurricane, our town lost power for a week. The supermarket, however, was on generator power. Refrigeration wasn't working, but you could buy dry goods for cash. And a couple of the gas stations used backup power to run the pumps, as long as you were paying cash.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby vveat » Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:13 am

We usually keep the bare minimum at home (constant source of bickering with my husband who would prefer to have a bigger buffer for incidentals, but I like tracking expenses and cash has the tendency to disappear, and it's a pain to record it in Mint). Babysitter, farmer's market and a few small items, easily take $100 a week.

We did take out some $500 or so in cash before Sandy (you usually have plenty of advance notice) and it came useful during the 2 weeks with no power - at the farmer's market, at some convenience stores and at the gas station. You don't always have the option to leave the state, full tank or not - I still had to go to work, and we have pets at home.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby ruralavalon » Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:22 am

Streptococcus wrote:Do bogleheads keep cash at home as part of their emergency funds?

No. Just whatever is in the wallet, usually no more than $20-40.
"Everything should be as simple as it is, but not simpler." - Albert Einstein | Wiki article link:Getting Started
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Re: Cash at home

Postby DAK » Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:26 am

I keep about 50 dollars cash in the house to pay the babysitter when we get one. Not having money to pay the babysitter when we want one is an emergency to me.
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Re: Cash at home

Postby Lai0703 » Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:05 am

My purse got stolen on a Friday night - after the banks closed. Talk about feeling helpless. After that I started keeping some cash around. It has also comes in handy when I've asked service people to do some last minute work and I have been able to pay them in cash,
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Re: Cash at home

Postby deanbrew » Sat Jun 29, 2013 3:27 pm

MnD wrote:No cash, valuables or guns/ammo as statistically they cause many problems in real world situations versus some "the whole nation fails" fantasy.
My boss (two bosses ago) was murdered in his home with his own rifle by a mentally disturbed adult child.
My boss (one boss ago) came found to find his only son dead in the back yard - he had killed himself at age 16 with my bosses handgun.


I've had two friends killed in car accidents. Guess I should get rid of my car. I had an ex boss drown in a pool. Who should I call to fill in my backyard pool?
"The course of history shows that as the government grows, liberty decreases." Thomas Jefferson
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