Please help me learn how to do this.stoptothink wrote: it takes as little as 5min to make a meal at home (and we actually prepare most of our meals for the entire week in one shot on Sunday afternoons),
Behavioral finance and restaurants
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Well, sure. I think that's the point of this thread, but would you go anywhere to eat if the "good converstation with friends or family" were not part of the eating deal? Take that away and now what?Fallible wrote:As for traveling to restaurants, I'll go anywhere in our metro area (could be up to 40 miles) for healthy food, decent wine, and good conversation with friends or family.
Here is an LA Times Op-Ed about some of this: http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la ... story.html
"First we surveyed 96 Americans, ages 18 to 67, asking them how much they imagined they would enjoy certain activities, either alone, with significant others or friends — dinner out, fitness walks, heading out for a movie — and how likely they'd be to do them."
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
We're in the letsgobobby, live/travel-to-eat camp. One of the primary factors in our recent house purchase was its proximity to the best restaurant scene in the area. We frequently drive about 45 mins to go to a particularly good restaurant in the boonies. We took a 4-day trip to Italy earlier this month mostly to eat and drink wine. We will probably travel to San Francisco later this year primarily to eat at French Laundry (we live on the east coast). So yeah, we like restaurants and food.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
We have another couple with whom we frequently socialize. One, longstanding tradition is that we celebrate one another's birthdays and Valentine's together with the honoree choosing the restaurant. This is the time we choose new restaurants or old favorites and may drive up to an hour in our metropolitan area where there are many choices from which to choose. We typically have a glass of wine at one of our houses before eating and do not order wine or alcoholic drinks with our meals. This makes what is typically a more expensive restaurant less costly, though some might consider alcohol an important part of a meal, just as the restaurant considers it to be a source of considerable profit. Occasionally, we do drink alcohol with meals sponsored by local establishments that pair wine with various courses. One of the four drinks more moderately and drives on these occasions.
Tim
Tim
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Where I live (Chicago) I can drive to 3000 restaurants in 45 minutes. But 99% of them represent poor value. Steak and chop places? Pasta and pizza? Tacos? I can replicate the food from such places at one-fourth the price, with zero drive time. My wife is an extremely talented cook, and by nature very thrifty. So we have even less incentive to dine out. But sometimes it pays to make exceptions. An memorable French cafe dinner for $85 per person? A bargain. A Mexican place with a great chef and freshly made mole sauce for $70pp? Out of town visitors, certainly. It can make sense to visit some specialty Asian places: Peking Duck $25pp, homestyle Thai food $20pp; pay the experts and don't worry about it. At the other extreme, we have found that multicourse "winemakers" dinners can be fun, and almost economic for the alcohol involved; figure $80-$150pp all-inclusive.livesoft wrote:... Do you go out of your way to try a restaurant you have heard about? How far or how many minutes would you go?
When traveling, we will drive an hour to get to well-regarded places. Lake Tahoe, Indianapolis, Duluth, Vancouver: all offer world-class cafe dining at not-so-outrageous prices. In expensive big cities (Paris, Beijing), no need to travel; great food is everywhere.
Eating well is the reward for all the financial wisdom we have followed for years.
HTH
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
We cook. We will drive for ingredients, 8 hours for cheese, 2 hours for meats, pets milk. Specialty stores become good stopping points when travelling, such as the cheese.
There are not many meals we are willing to pay for that could not be done better, cheaper at home.
There are not many meals we are willing to pay for that could not be done better, cheaper at home.
Pale Blue Dot
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Now I don't go. But That's kind of what I said, or meant to.livesoft wrote:Well, sure. I think that's the point of this thread, but would you go anywhere to eat if the "good converstation with friends or family" were not part of the eating deal? Take that away and now what? ...Fallible wrote:As for traveling to restaurants, I'll go anywhere in our metro area (could be up to 40 miles) for healthy food, decent wine, and good conversation with friends or family.
"Yes, investing is simple. But it is not easy, for it requires discipline, patience, steadfastness, and that most uncommon of all gifts, common sense." ~Jack Bogle
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Live in Harrisburg. Pa.
A couple times a year we drive the 2:45 to NYC for dinner. We also drive the 2 hours to eat in DC at Rasika or Founding Farmers.
We sometimes drive 34-40 minutes for restaurants in Lancaster, the apple country, etc. those are maybe once every other month. That's always to meet friends.
Other than that, 15 minutes incorporates about every restaurant we eat at.
A couple times a year we drive the 2:45 to NYC for dinner. We also drive the 2 hours to eat in DC at Rasika or Founding Farmers.
We sometimes drive 34-40 minutes for restaurants in Lancaster, the apple country, etc. those are maybe once every other month. That's always to meet friends.
Other than that, 15 minutes incorporates about every restaurant we eat at.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Well I could say it's a pancake, but that's really an understatement. I don't know quite how they do it. But they mix things like bananas and nuts into the batter, but then they put the whole thing in the oven for twenty minutes. When they bring it out it has ballooned up into this soufflé kind of thing the size of a small cake. They set it down in front of you and it deflates down to the size of a normal pancake. It tastes more like a pastry than a pancake, and is so rich and moist it's almost a shame to put syrup on it. Except the 100% pure maple syrup they serve there is so good I can't help but put it on anyway. It's like a mix between a pancake, a funnel cake and a pastry. One pancake is big enough for one person with a healthy appetite.cherijoh wrote:Ok, I have to ask, what was the dish?toto238 wrote:Last Sunday I drove 25 minutes to get there, waited 30 minutes to get seated, and then another 45 minutes to get my food, and I was very satisfied with my experience. Crazy? Perhaps. But it was Sunday morning brunch hour, and I was going to a breakfast restaurant. And this breakfast restaurant makes a particular dish that is so out-of-this-world that I would wait 2 hours for it if necessary. I haven't found a single other place that makes it, and it is truly a unique experience. It takes 20 minutes or longer for them to make it on a good day. In our case, because it was busy, it took them 45 minutes. Worth every minute.spectec wrote:A follow-up question would be "How long are you willing to wait for a table?" When I go to a restaurant which doesn't accept reservations, my maximum is about 15-20 minutes. Asking me to wait longer is asking me to go somewhere else. Of course, if I have a large party or some other unusual circumstance such as wanting special seating, things are slightly different.
To be fair, I was spending that time with my spouse, and I enjoy hanging out with her.
As a single person, I usually eat out with friends. So how far I will drive will depend on who I'm meeting. I usually drive no further that the distance between my house and that of the friend. When traveling, I have taken a more circuitous route to eat at a restaurant I like. I have probably gone 45 minutes out of my way to do so.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
I worked in a restaurant in Hawaii for many years. While almost nobody came to Hawaii solely for our restaurant, dining with us played an important role in many people's travel plans. People proposed to their fiancées, celebrated their anniversaries, welcomed home soldiers, and some just really like prime rib.
My own interest in dining out disappeared quite a while ago. Additionally, I'm trying to monitor my diet (sodium, gluten, cholesterol, etc). As such, I never account for restaurants in my travel planning and at home I suppose I am willing to drive zero minutes to go to any restaurant solely for the cuisine. However, if going to a restaurant involved meeting family or friends, or involved a scenic drive I could theoretically travel for hours if not days.
I do however enjoy my morning coffee and when I travel may factor in visiting a notable café in the area as part of the planning.
My own interest in dining out disappeared quite a while ago. Additionally, I'm trying to monitor my diet (sodium, gluten, cholesterol, etc). As such, I never account for restaurants in my travel planning and at home I suppose I am willing to drive zero minutes to go to any restaurant solely for the cuisine. However, if going to a restaurant involved meeting family or friends, or involved a scenic drive I could theoretically travel for hours if not days.
I do however enjoy my morning coffee and when I travel may factor in visiting a notable café in the area as part of the planning.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
We flew to Chicago from DC for a long weekend - the main point of going was to go to Alinea. http://www.alinearestaurant.com
We have also gone to Philly for an overnight with friends just to try specific food places.
But, we love cooking and are kind of foodies; so we are probably more extreme than most.
My husband has also driven 2 hours (each way) out of his way to get a specific beer in VT, that is only sold at the brewery...
Edited to add: on the flipside, if we are traveling, we love finding places that have been on Diners, Drive-Ins, and Dives...
We have also gone to Philly for an overnight with friends just to try specific food places.
But, we love cooking and are kind of foodies; so we are probably more extreme than most.
My husband has also driven 2 hours (each way) out of his way to get a specific beer in VT, that is only sold at the brewery...
Edited to add: on the flipside, if we are traveling, we love finding places that have been on Diners, Drive-Ins, and Dives...
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Interesting question!
For me, it has depended on where I have lived. Right now, I can walk to restaurants, and going anywhere not in walking distance takes 30-45 minutes or even more. When I meet friends for a meal, they may come to my neighborhood, I may go to their neighborhood, or we may meet in a different part of town.
When I lived in a small town with only a couple of restaurants (one of which was a Subway in the gas station) I was willing to drive 45 miles to eat Thai, even though there were other restaurants 15-20 miles away.
Is it a destination restaurant? Is it a beautiful drive up the coast? Is part of the pleasure just getting there? Then 1 1/2 hours is not extreme.
What I don't like to do is wait for a table more than 10-15 minutes if the restaurant doesn't take reservations. If they tell me it is going to be 20 minutes or more, and it is my decision, I go somewhere else.
I have friends who have gone on the train from New York to Philadelphia for the weekend just to eat in certain restaurants. Anything else they did was incidental to dining. Even breakfast was planned ahead of time.
For me, it has depended on where I have lived. Right now, I can walk to restaurants, and going anywhere not in walking distance takes 30-45 minutes or even more. When I meet friends for a meal, they may come to my neighborhood, I may go to their neighborhood, or we may meet in a different part of town.
When I lived in a small town with only a couple of restaurants (one of which was a Subway in the gas station) I was willing to drive 45 miles to eat Thai, even though there were other restaurants 15-20 miles away.
Is it a destination restaurant? Is it a beautiful drive up the coast? Is part of the pleasure just getting there? Then 1 1/2 hours is not extreme.
What I don't like to do is wait for a table more than 10-15 minutes if the restaurant doesn't take reservations. If they tell me it is going to be 20 minutes or more, and it is my decision, I go somewhere else.
I have friends who have gone on the train from New York to Philadelphia for the weekend just to eat in certain restaurants. Anything else they did was incidental to dining. Even breakfast was planned ahead of time.
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Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
So do we. It sounds as if you probably already know this, but if you have a GPS, you can download points of interest from http://www.poi-factory.com/poifiles with that category (among many others) of restaurants.kaudrey wrote:We flew to Chicago from DC for a long weekend - the main point of going was to go to Alinea. http://www.alinearestaurant.com
We have also gone to Philly for an overnight with friends just to try specific food places.
But, we love cooking and are kind of foodies; so we are probably more extreme than most.
My husband has also driven 2 hours (each way) out of his way to get a specific beer in VT, that is only sold at the brewery...
Edited to add: on the flipside, if we are traveling, we love finding places that have been on Diners, Drive-Ins, and Dives...
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Not to derail this thread, but this sounds like a "Dutch baby", aka German pancake, David Eyre's pancake, etc. These are darned good; I like them with apples baked into them myself. If you are a home cook (or even if not; these are really easy to make), you might save yourself the drive by making it at home. Lots of recipes online.toto238 wrote: Well I could say it's a pancake, but that's really an understatement. I don't know quite how they do it. But they mix things like bananas and nuts into the batter, but then they put the whole thing in the oven for twenty minutes. When they bring it out it has ballooned up into this soufflé kind of thing the size of a small cake. They set it down in front of you and it deflates down to the size of a normal pancake. It tastes more like a pastry than a pancake, and is so rich and moist it's almost a shame to put syrup on it. Except the 100% pure maple syrup they serve there is so good I can't help but put it on anyway. It's like a mix between a pancake, a funnel cake and a pastry. One pancake is big enough for one person with a healthy appetite.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Live to eat, here. I often, if not exclusively, select vacation destinations after a serious consideration of the quality of the local cuisine. It is nothing to me to travel an hour on public transit to eat at a particular restaurant (this might just as well be a hole-in-the-wall Thai place as a Michelin starred restaurant). One of these days, I'm gonna make the 3 hour round-trip drive to New Haven to eat pizza. I planned the timing of a trip to CA from the East coast based on snagging a reservation at French Laundry (would have gone anyway to visit friends, but it was a not-insignificant motivation for the trip...and to poster "Cash" above: it was worth it!) I would have flown to Spain, had I ever had the luck of getting a reservation at El Bulli (so probably a good thing for my wallet that it has closed). What can I say; I love food!
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Since you're already a foodie and you're already excited to try New Haven pizza, then I highly encourage you to make that trip. New Haven pizza is my absolute favorite pizza in the world. I've had pizza from NY, Chicago, SF, Detroit, Italy and I think New Haven is the best. Of course pizza preference is a very personal matter.sevenseas wrote:One of these days, I'm gonna make the 3 hour round-trip drive to New Haven to eat pizza.
Frank Pepe's white clam pie is the most famous, but my personal favorite is their fresh tomato pie that they only serve in the summer time due to the fact that they use fresh, local tomatoes for this pie.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Thank you for the information! I grew up in NJ and am biased towards NY/NJ pizza myself, but I just gotta see what all the fuss is about when it comes to New Haven pizza. You are motivating me to try to make a trip up there this summer.jayjayc wrote:Since you're already a foodie and you're already excited to try New Haven pizza, then I highly encourage you to make that trip. New Haven pizza is my absolute favorite pizza in the world. I've had pizza from NY, Chicago, SF, Detroit, Italy and I think New Haven is the best. Of course pizza preference is a very personal matter.sevenseas wrote:One of these days, I'm gonna make the 3 hour round-trip drive to New Haven to eat pizza.
Frank Pepe's white clam pie is the most famous, but my personal favorite is their fresh tomato pie that they only serve in the summer time due to the fact that they use fresh, local tomatoes for this pie.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
+1 to this sentiment. I will spend a ton of time and energy gathering ingredients (while living in tokyo, I'd go to one store for cilantro, another for lemon grass, another for tianmenjiang, another for ghee, etc, none of which were particularly near each other).4nursebee wrote:We cook. We will drive for ingredients, 8 hours for cheese, 2 hours for meats, pets milk. Specialty stores become good stopping points when travelling, such as the cheese.
There are not many meals we are willing to pay for that could not be done better, cheaper at home.
In terms of going to a place where 75%+ of the impetus is to visit a restaurant, maybe 1 hour. But then only if there was a nice park or downtown area to walk around nearby. I think this point needs a caveat--I would not live in a place that did not have restaurants I like nearby, and would pay significantly more rent to be in a place with great restaurants nearby.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Funny enough all of those things are more or less guranteed when dining out in Atlanta. We eat out fairly often and drive max about a half hour. You'd have to really talk me into anything further than that.tyrion wrote:
What I wouldn't put up with:
Parking hassles
Valet only parking
Sitting in traffic
I’d trade it all for a little more |
-C Montgomery Burns
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Good to know! We would also visit friends in San Francisco...but the main attraction would be French Laundry . And ditto El Bulli. One of our biggest traveling regrets is not going to Noma when we were in Copenhagen in 2010.sevenseas wrote:I planned the timing of a trip to CA from the East coast based on snagging a reservation at French Laundry (would have gone anyway to visit friends, but it was a not-insignificant motivation for the trip...and to poster "Cash" above: it was worth it!) I would have flown to Spain, had I ever had the luck of getting a reservation at El Bulli (so probably a good thing for my wallet that it has closed). What can I say; I love food!
I definitely prefer Pepe's to Sally's. But I would also recommend a visit to BAR to eat their bacon and mashed potato pizza and beer brewed in-house.jayjayc wrote: Frank Pepe's white clam pie is the most famous, but my personal favorite is their fresh tomato pie that they only serve in the summer time due to the fact that they use fresh, local tomatoes for this pie.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
Love Rasika!canderson wrote:Live in Harrisburg. Pa.
A couple times a year we drive the 2:45 to NYC for dinner. We also drive the 2 hours to eat in DC at Rasika or Founding Farmers.
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
I have accidentally proven you right. (Does it also mean that I have proven myself wrong?) Today, I went on a self-guided walking tour of Madrid. Among other things, I was told to try a typical local dish el Cocido Madrileño. I was warned not to eat it after about 2pm because it´s so heavy that I would feel it all night. And so I went to a recommended restaurant, La Fragua de Vulcano on C/ Alvarez Gato #9, at about 1pm. First I had a glass of sangria with apetizers and excellent bread. Then a huge pot of vermicelli soup has arrived with spicy peppers and raw onions on the side. I asked what to do with the sides and was told that I should cut them into my soup, which I did. When I was already full of the soup and spices, the star dish has arrived.letsgobobby wrote:This from a woman who just flew to Spain and walked hundreds of miles for a good meal.VictoriaF wrote:I eat to live and don´t care about restaurants unless they are truly special. Normally, I would not spend much time getting to a restaurant, but when I am at a restaurant I don´t mind waiting for my food. For me the social value of eating with someone I like exceeds the value of food itself, and I don´t see a reason to curtail the experience. Fast service can be a disadvantage.
Victoria
It was an enormous plate full of all kinds of stuff. There were two types of sausages, several types of meat, a chicken drum, some pure lard, and some pure bones. There was also a potato, chickpeas, and something made of something like carrots. I did not eat all of it, no one could, but what I did eat will probably weigh me down all night even though I finished my meal before 2pm. I would have a siesta now, but if I lie down el Cocido Madrileño will crash me. I´m posting in the Bogleheads until I recover my strength for the night.
The price for the dish was 13 Euros, a glass of sangria was 2 Euros.
Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake |
Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. |
Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)
Re: Behavioral finance and restaurants
It´s time for another confession. There is a convent in Madrid called el Convento de las Monjas del Corpus Christi, known more familiarly as ¨Las Carboneras¨ (The Coal Women). For many years, cloistered nuns living there have been making cookies. Until mid-1950, sale of home-made goods by nuns was not allowed by the Church, and Las Carboneras were doing it clandestently.
Now, the sales are authorized, but the secret process is still in place. You come to a wooden door to the right of the church entrance and ring the intercom bell that says ¨Monjas.¨ The door opens and you walk along a passage, turn left, pass an inner courtyard, and come to a wooden turnstile table. You read the price list, decide what you wish, and ring a bell on the wall. An invisible nun takes your order. I asked for a half-kilo of almond cookies (pastas de almendra) and put a 20-Euro bill on the turnstile. Two minutes later I received my package of cookies in a nice box; in another minute the 10-Euro change has arrived.
The cookies are divine--as they should be considering that the nuns have specialized in them for many years. I don´t eat cookies in my normal life; I´m tryinng to avoid the carbs alltogether. But this deviation was well justified both gastronomically and behaviorally.
Victoria
Now, the sales are authorized, but the secret process is still in place. You come to a wooden door to the right of the church entrance and ring the intercom bell that says ¨Monjas.¨ The door opens and you walk along a passage, turn left, pass an inner courtyard, and come to a wooden turnstile table. You read the price list, decide what you wish, and ring a bell on the wall. An invisible nun takes your order. I asked for a half-kilo of almond cookies (pastas de almendra) and put a 20-Euro bill on the turnstile. Two minutes later I received my package of cookies in a nice box; in another minute the 10-Euro change has arrived.
The cookies are divine--as they should be considering that the nuns have specialized in them for many years. I don´t eat cookies in my normal life; I´m tryinng to avoid the carbs alltogether. But this deviation was well justified both gastronomically and behaviorally.
Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake |
Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. |
Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)