Couch Surfing

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investor1
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

Yeah, you can create a very minimal profile and fill it in later.
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VictoriaF
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by VictoriaF »

investor1 wrote:
Raybo wrote:
DaftInvestor wrote:
Raybo wrote:
That is how I would view the "horror" stories about couchsurfing (or hitch hiking, for that matter). I have never had anything close to a threatening experience in over 10 years of couchsurfing on 3 continents. In fact, many of my memorable interactions with people have come as a result.
The risk is up to you - a lot of the stories come from respected publications/journalists (just google "couchsurfing incident" or "couchsurfing rape" , etc.). For me - I'm more comfortable in a locked hotel room at a reputable global brand.
I looked up "couchsurfing incident" and "couchsurfing rape" on google and see a number of reports of a single rape that occurred in Leeds (I didn't go beyond the first page on both). I was much more concerned about the links on the "hotel rape" search.

As you say, the risk is up to you. But, one thing I don't worry about with couchsurfing is credit card theft!
It has definetly happened. The wikipedia entry for CS lists multiple incidences. I have read profiles while looking for a host where people were accused of rape. There are definetly people that use the website as a dating service too, well I guess more like a one night stand service if that's a thing. Some people call them crotch surfers.

Like I said before, you can usually weed out the bad ones by sticking to people with a lot of good references.
It's interesting that people keep their profiles even after rape and other accusations. I'd assume that they would change their identity, or at least try to refute the accusations. Which brings up some questions:
- Is there a process for the dispute resolution?
- Can accusations of rape result in a legal action on the part of the accused for the character defamation?
- If someone posts a review that the guest was not prompt or tidy or committed some other misdemeanors, is it likely to prompt a dueling review from the guest accusing the host in something minor or annoying?

Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake | Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)
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Frugal Al
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by Frugal Al »

TomatoTomahto wrote:She reported that very seldom was there an issue of confused expectations on the part of the hosts, and that setting those expectations in line early was always sufficient. She couldn't have afforded the trip staying in hotels, and hostels would have also been a strain financially. She met wonderful people on the trip, and half-stumbled into a photo-journalism career based initially in Cairo and now in Thailand.
Confusing a successful outcome with a successful strategy comes to mind here.
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VictoriaF
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by VictoriaF »

Frugal Al wrote:
TomatoTomahto wrote:She reported that very seldom was there an issue of confused expectations on the part of the hosts, and that setting those expectations in line early was always sufficient. She couldn't have afforded the trip staying in hotels, and hostels would have also been a strain financially. She met wonderful people on the trip, and half-stumbled into a photo-journalism career based initially in Cairo and now in Thailand.
Confusing a successful outcome with a successful strategy comes to mind here.
The strategy is to have fun while taking some calculated risks. As for the outcomes, rapes and other crimes have a greater sensational value and are more likely to be reported. TomatoTomahto reports a normal non-sensatinal outcome that helps to draw a balanced view.

Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake | Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)
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investor1
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

VictoriaF wrote:It's interesting that people keep their profiles even after rape and other accusations. I'd assume that they would change their identity, or at least try to refute the accusations. Which brings up some questions:
- Is there a process for the dispute resolution?
- Can accusations of rape result in a legal action on the part of the accused for the character defamation?
- If someone posts a review that the guest was not prompt or tidy or committed some other misdemeanors, is it likely to prompt a dueling review from the guest accusing the host in something minor or annoying?

Victoria
I honestly don't know about the dispute/appeals process. I believe there is one, but I've never had a need to find out for sure. I know multiple people have been banned from the site for inappropriate activity with other CS'ers.

If someone does something illegal, they can absolutely go to jail for it. I'm not sure how interested cops, lawyers, judges would be in defamation cases though. Again, I've never dealt with it.

People do leave negative reviews for arguably unimportant things, and others do respond to it (sometimes in childish ways). IIRC, the appeals process can get involved here. I know I've read profiles with members trading negative reviews that seemed childish both ways to me. I won't say that is the norm though.

Sometimes it is good for a laugh though. There is a CS'ing group called Funny Negative References.
4nursebee
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by 4nursebee »

We host on couchsurfing, AirBnb, and Warm showers.

Couch surfing is not as popular as it was. We have had families from France and Spain. One was very musical, brought instruments and we had many informal concerts here. One of their destinations after us was New Orleans. I told them they would really be special if they could play on the streets on New Orleans and get paid....
http://youtu.be/ElkmMCHwyEQ
http://youtu.be/zmt-UfAWBQc

Most couch surfers seem to be college aged/not settled in life set with different hours then ours. We generally turn down the travelling band requests as they would arrive at 1 am.

I think Airbnb was our first service and we have been on since maybe 2009. At first our profile was minimal, we don't need the money, had concerns about safety. We installed a safe in the house and put in a programmable lock to customize access. We try to price ourselves at a point that we will attract some business and not go broke if we over extend ourselves. Cheaper than a hotel for sure. Two listings, one with a private bathroom, whole floor of our house. We enjoy cooking and offer to break bread with our guests. We do not advertise the food (and drink!) that we offer to keep us from attention of food police. We've had a family stay with us for a second time and recently had a medical student for nearly a month.

Warm showers started as an extension of my fantasy of long distance travelling via pedal power. We hosted one chap on a long journey and supported his excursion as able.

We have traveled once using CS. There is a great host in Winchester VA that did a nice walking tour of the town. We were gonna stay at a house in Pittsburgh but an elderly relative familiar with the area told us to be careful if staying "on the hill". A drive around the area showed suspected drug dealing a block or two away so we went to a hotel. We also stayed downtown Philly as someones first hosting experience. His profile talked about his being a nudist interested in massage, so we had a chat about that before we arrived. His place was immaculate, he should charge a lot of money for what he offers. We took him out for a great meal at an old timey Italian place. Since then it appears he has mainly hosted lost boys traveling on the cheap (but the profile was honest and intelligent people can read between the lines).

As hosts our lives have been enriched. The TV stays off, we meet and share with others and the world seems friendlier because of it. We encourage you to join, host, travel, let common sense be your guide. There is fun and adventure out there. Never an issue with safety related to guests.
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kramer
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by kramer »

I have had some wonderful couchsurfing experiences in several countries. I never used it to find a place to stay, just as a way to meet local people and expatriates open to meeting foreigners. I decided to start using it when I was traveling around Asia and I went to a certain tourist place on the beach for three days and for the first time in my travels I did not really meet anyone. I made sure that never happened again and couchsurfing really worked.

I will never forget a day we had in Kuala Lumpur. I was with an American friend and three locals were showing us the best sites inside and outside of the city. We were at a nice local park and there was a wedding reception going on. We stopped and were discreetly taking some pictures from the outside when we got invited in by the bride. We demurred but they absolutely insisted. It was awesome. One of the hosts who had been showing us around the city was a super intelligent girl (about to start medical school) whom I will never forget. We were walking out of that wedding reception when she exclaimed, "Wow, with you guys we can do anything!!"

Edit: I was staying in Mazatlan, Mexico and I had been conversing with a local via couchsurfing although we had not yet met in person. One night I was jogging on the malecon area next to the Pacific Ocean when someone shouted, "Hey, Kramer, is that you!" -- it turned out to be that couchsurfer. That was the start of a nice friendship. We even had a party at the condo I was renting a couple weeks later and invited the local couchsurfer community.
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juggernaut
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by juggernaut »

VictoriaF wrote:
juggernaut wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:I wanted to check out couchsurfing events in Washington, DC, but I could not do it unless I had established a login using either Facebook or email. On one hand, it's a demonstration of couchsurfing's concern about their member identities, which is great. On the other hand, I'd like to get my toes wet before diving in (surfing in?).

I slightly prefer to use my email, because that's how I'll be corresponding with the others. But the advantage of linking to Facebook is that it describes who I am and could make me an interesting company for potential couch owners.

Are there important considerations I should be aware of before signing up?

Thank you,
Victoria

I haven't had a problem using my Facebook, but if you have doubts about linking FB, it's not a big deal. A complete, coherent, well-thought-out profile with pictures other than bathroom selfies is more important. Attend some local meetups and events in your area to meet a few people, make friends, and get some references going.
Can I create a CS profile using my email, attend some local events, and then post pictures? Is there the minimum requirement for the profile information? Once I start participating in CS, it won't be a big deal, but I don't want to go all the way until I know what I am getting into.

Victoria
You are not required to post any pictures. But, its better to have some, so people will know your face when they see you at a meetup. Then, you won't be a stranger, the ice has already been broken.

You are required to fill out the profile but, how much information you post is up to you. That being said, the point of the profile is to give people a sense of who you are. Your interests, hobbies, skills, and talents will let others relate to you. If you just haphazardly fill out a profile others will find you distant and not very interesting. And, in major cities and tourist destinations (NYC, Paris), you're not going to get very far. Most seasoned CS host don't waste their time with haphazard profiles.
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VictoriaF
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by VictoriaF »

juggernaut wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:
juggernaut wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:I wanted to check out couchsurfing events in Washington, DC, but I could not do it unless I had established a login using either Facebook or email. On one hand, it's a demonstration of couchsurfing's concern about their member identities, which is great. On the other hand, I'd like to get my toes wet before diving in (surfing in?).

I slightly prefer to use my email, because that's how I'll be corresponding with the others. But the advantage of linking to Facebook is that it describes who I am and could make me an interesting company for potential couch owners.

Are there important considerations I should be aware of before signing up?

Thank you,
Victoria

I haven't had a problem using my Facebook, but if you have doubts about linking FB, it's not a big deal. A complete, coherent, well-thought-out profile with pictures other than bathroom selfies is more important. Attend some local meetups and events in your area to meet a few people, make friends, and get some references going.
Can I create a CS profile using my email, attend some local events, and then post pictures? Is there the minimum requirement for the profile information? Once I start participating in CS, it won't be a big deal, but I don't want to go all the way until I know what I am getting into.

Victoria
You are not required to post any pictures. But, its better to have some, so people will know your face when they see you at a meetup. Then, you won't be a stranger, the ice has already been broken.

You are required to fill out the profile but, how much information you post is up to you. That being said, the point of the profile is to give people a sense of who you are. Your interests, hobbies, skills, and talents will let others relate to you. If you just haphazardly fill out a profile others will find you distant and not very interesting. And, in major cities and tourist destinations (NYC, Paris), you're not going to get very far. Most seasoned CS host don't waste their time with haphazard profiles.
You are making fair points. What I have in mind is to start slowly, attend some CS events, meet people, and then update my profile and get ready to surf couches. My normal mode of operation is to be reserved and observing in the beginning and warm up as I become familiar with people and groups.

Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake | Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)
cannondale
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by cannondale »

I just wanted to add a few points to this conversion.

I used to be a part of CS but never really hosted or stayed with anyone. It was at the beginning of my nomadic life.

I belong to another international group that's usually invite only. It's more of a brotherhood kind of thing. Once you're in, you're family. I use that connection while traveling. I've hosted people for as long as 2 weeks on my couch before.

A few points on couch surfing and similar services.

1) In hot areas, like SF, London, Paris, and NYC, it's a bit harder to find hosts.
2) If you're a pair of 20 yr old blond Swedish gals, you will have about 10x easier time finding accommodation than a single guy. That said, women usually have an easier time finding lodging than men.
3) You generally have to work w/ the host's schedule. I've seen where the guest is not allowed to stay inside the host when the host is at work.
4) Starting out is harder b/c nobody knows you and nobody vouches for you. So, I guess the easiest way is to go to those CS meetings to get to know people to get their endorsements.
5) Often, even if people cannot host you, they can offer to show you around their cities.

My knowledge is from 4 years ago, so things may have changed.

The number one concern I have about hosting is people snooping through my things. We saw an incidence where one of the visitors was snooping through the hosts' computer/desk at 12:00 in the evening. That person got kicked out in the middle of the night.
aerofreaky11
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by aerofreaky11 »

I met my wife on CS. It was a fluke... the person I was supposed to stay with (a guy) canceled on me a few hours before meeting and I found a replacement (my future wife.) I didn't end up staying over because of an early flight, but she showed me her city during my lay over.

I also have several life long friends who I met on CS. We keep in touch and visit when possible--different continents.

I hosted multiple times before that and surfed in several different countries. I haven't hosted lately due to scheduling, my wife is a medical resident.

Worst experience I had? One lady was crazy. I brought her home to drop off her belongings and told her we were meeting up with my GF at the time. We all went out to dinner. They wanted to dance and I don't like dancing, so they went out together. When they came home, my GF was upset and ultimately broke up with me. I'll never understand that, :confused but I'm happy she (CS lady) was only staying a few days. That breakup paved the road to meeting my wife, so it was ultimately a good thing. :happy
2stepsbehind
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by 2stepsbehind »

Couch surfing strikes me as a modern day gloss on hitchhiking. It may work well in the vast majority of circumstances, but there's certainly risk involved for both sides of the transaction. The fact that someone links to facebook or email to me is of little comfort given how easy it is to make and fake an online profile (see catfishing). Even online "reviews" may be manipulated and of course nothing stops a predator from behaving like a perfect gentlemen to other guests to make his profile more attractive for desired prey.
leonard
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

fposte wrote:
leonard wrote: Risk is great. But, why not choose risks were the return is greater and one has more control of the outcome - if one is looking for risk for risks sake.
I don't see anything that suggests it's for risk's sake. It's for meeting people's sake and interacting with them in certain circumstances.

I run more to hotels myself, but I feel like you're comparing hotels as if they're totally safe. They're certainly not that--assaults on and robberies of hotel guests definitely occur. Couchsurfing sounds like it gives you a lot more control over the choosing the people who actually have access to you where you're staying than booking a hotel room would, and that you can indeed mitigate your risk by choosing who you stay with. (It also sounds like people are encouraged to use their real names, which means you can corroborate their existence and reputation.)

You're probably taking on more risk by going into most bars. And that's a risk many of us are willing to assume.
The comparison to hotel safety versus couch surfing safety is insane. In a hotel - you are behind a locked door, that likely has a redundant safety latch as well. In addition, one can bring one of those door wedges with an alarm and other further redundant door locks. There is simply no way being exposed on a couch or elsewhere in someone's home is safer. Simply isn't possible.

Also, if the goal is interaction, one can do that outside of each other's homes. So, why impose the risk of unfamiliar strangers if the goal is simply to talk to people. There is no need to take on the additional risk for that goal.
Leonard | | Market Timing: Do you seriously think you can predict the future? What else do the voices tell you? | | If employees weren't taking jobs with bad 401k's, bad 401k's wouldn't exist.
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VictoriaF
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by VictoriaF »

leonard wrote:Also, if the goal is interaction, one can do that outside of each other's homes. So, why impose the risk of unfamiliar strangers if the goal is simply to talk to people.
Some particularly stimulating discussions last into the wee hours. The need to go back to another place to sleep places a damper on the possibility of such discussions.

When I attend meetings of certain groups, such as the Bogleheads, I stay in the conference hotels to be able to participate in spontaneous interactions. But if I arrived to a new place and wanted to meet local people, by staying in a hotel I would preclude deeper encounters. When I stay in hostels, I interact with other like-minded travelers. It's frequently very rewarding, but still, it's not the same as interacting with the locals.

Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake | Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)
leonard
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

VictoriaF wrote:
leonard wrote:Also, if the goal is interaction, one can do that outside of each other's homes. So, why impose the risk of unfamiliar strangers if the goal is simply to talk to people.
Some particularly stimulating discussions last into the wee hours. The need to go back to another place to sleep places a damper on the possibility of such discussions.

When I attend meetings of certain groups, such as the Bogleheads, I stay in the conference hotels to be able to participate in spontaneous interactions. But if I arrived to a new place and wanted to meet local people, by staying in a hotel I would preclude deeper encounters. When I stay in hostels, I interact with other like-minded travelers. It's frequently very rewarding, but still, it's not the same as interacting with the locals.

Victoria
Seems a bit romanticized. The reality is that a conversation of any character can happen anywhere and at any time. And I doubt the couch surfing subset has the market cornered on the meaning of life (or whatever).
Leonard | | Market Timing: Do you seriously think you can predict the future? What else do the voices tell you? | | If employees weren't taking jobs with bad 401k's, bad 401k's wouldn't exist.
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VictoriaF
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by VictoriaF »

leonard wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:
leonard wrote:Also, if the goal is interaction, one can do that outside of each other's homes. So, why impose the risk of unfamiliar strangers if the goal is simply to talk to people.
Some particularly stimulating discussions last into the wee hours. The need to go back to another place to sleep places a damper on the possibility of such discussions.

When I attend meetings of certain groups, such as the Bogleheads, I stay in the conference hotels to be able to participate in spontaneous interactions. But if I arrived to a new place and wanted to meet local people, by staying in a hotel I would preclude deeper encounters. When I stay in hostels, I interact with other like-minded travelers. It's frequently very rewarding, but still, it's not the same as interacting with the locals.

Victoria
Seems a bit romanticized. The reality is that a conversation of any character can happen anywhere and at any time. And I doubt the couch surfing subset has the market cornered on the meaning of life (or whatever).
People used to have deep discussions with strangers on the train. Now couch class has replaced coach class.

Victoria
Inventor of the Bogleheads Secret Handshake | Winner of the 2015 Boglehead Contest. | Every joke has a bit of a joke. ... The rest is the truth. (Marat F)
leonard
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

VictoriaF wrote:
leonard wrote:
VictoriaF wrote:
leonard wrote:Also, if the goal is interaction, one can do that outside of each other's homes. So, why impose the risk of unfamiliar strangers if the goal is simply to talk to people.
Some particularly stimulating discussions last into the wee hours. The need to go back to another place to sleep places a damper on the possibility of such discussions.

When I attend meetings of certain groups, such as the Bogleheads, I stay in the conference hotels to be able to participate in spontaneous interactions. But if I arrived to a new place and wanted to meet local people, by staying in a hotel I would preclude deeper encounters. When I stay in hostels, I interact with other like-minded travelers. It's frequently very rewarding, but still, it's not the same as interacting with the locals.

Victoria
Seems a bit romanticized. The reality is that a conversation of any character can happen anywhere and at any time. And I doubt the couch surfing subset has the market cornered on the meaning of life (or whatever).
People used to have deep discussions with strangers on the train. Now couch class has replaced coach class.

Victoria
Well said. Be careful.
Leonard | | Market Timing: Do you seriously think you can predict the future? What else do the voices tell you? | | If employees weren't taking jobs with bad 401k's, bad 401k's wouldn't exist.
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roymeo
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by roymeo »

2stepsbehind wrote:Couch surfing strikes me as a modern day gloss on hitchhiking. It may work well in the vast majority of circumstances, but there's certainly risk involved for both sides of the transaction. The fact that someone links to facebook or email to me is of little comfort given how easy it is to make and fake an online profile (see catfishing). Even online "reviews" may be manipulated and of course nothing stops a predator from behaving like a perfect gentlemen to other guests to make his profile more attractive for desired prey.
A similar case could be made (involving risk of money, not bodily threat) for nearly every merchant on Amazon, eBay, or the internet at large (see "shower cap shoe scam" and "sponge shoe scam"). I recall a story about a guy who set up a store on eBay and had built a business with employees and then started selling a bunch of high-priced items and ran off with 6-figures.

An old lady on the sidewalk today tried to convince me she was lost and confused and on the way to the hospital and needed money.* I don't recommend going to lunch outside the office.

Dating sites!

What if she's just going to run off with my engagement ring!!

I hope I never go off to a teardrop trailer rally organized by an upstanding member of the tnttt.com forum, only to discover it isn't camping but a cult initiation!**

roymeo

* I felt bad because maybe I could figure out where it was she needed to go with my phone, but on my way back to the office I saw she was still around, hanging out next to her shopping cart and in no hurry to get anywhere.

** other than a dutch oven cult, that is.
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SmileyFace
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by SmileyFace »

roymeo wrote: An old lady on the sidewalk today tried to convince me she was lost and confused and on the way to the hospital and needed money.* I don't recommend going to lunch outside the office.
...but you didn't give her money, nor give her a ride to the hospital in your car, nor invite her back to your home to relax and sleep on your couch since she seemed distraught.....
I don't think this risk (nor your other examples) are comparable to that of having a stranger over for the night to sleep on your couch.
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Raybo
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by Raybo »

We all know that risk is a trade off of return vs loss.

If you don't want to take the risk of couchsurfing, don't.

But, to continue to insist that the risk isn't worth it without ever doing it is a broken record. Don't want to couchsurf? Don't do it. No one should take on risk they don't want to.

But, there is more than one road to Dublin. For those of us who are willing to take the risk, the reward can be substantial.

Enron, 2008, AIG haven't scared me away from investing and random (data mined?) events haven't scared me from staying with generous people around the world I find via hospitality websites.

And, just so you know, all the bleeting about what might happen will not stop me from continuing to use and enjoy hospitality sites like couchsurfing and warmshowers.

Your concern has been noted.
No matter how long the hill, if you keep pedaling you'll eventually get up to the top.
4nursebee
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by 4nursebee »

+1 Raybo.
There is a lot of worry and concern expressed from those that are not experienced, a bit like armchair quarterbacks!
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leonard
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

Raybo wrote:We all know that risk is a trade off of return vs loss.

If you don't want to take the risk of couchsurfing, don't.

But, to continue to insist that the risk isn't worth it without ever doing it is a broken record. Don't want to couchsurf? Don't do it. No one should take on risk they don't want to.

But, there is more than one road to Dublin. For those of us who are willing to take the risk, the reward can be substantial.

Enron, 2008, AIG haven't scared me away from investing and random (data mined?) events haven't scared me from staying with generous people around the world I find via hospitality websites.

And, just so you know, all the bleeting about what might happen will not stop me from continuing to use and enjoy hospitality sites like couchsurfing and warmshowers.

Your concern has been noted.
Certainly, we don't need to experience sleeping in a strangers house in order to have an opinion about it - do we.
Leonard | | Market Timing: Do you seriously think you can predict the future? What else do the voices tell you? | | If employees weren't taking jobs with bad 401k's, bad 401k's wouldn't exist.
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investor1
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

leonard wrote:Certainly, we don't need to experience sleeping in a strangers house in order to have an opinion about it - do we.
Certainly not. However experience often leads to practical decisions whereas inexperience often leads to speculation.
leonard
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

investor1 wrote:
leonard wrote:Certainly, we don't need to experience sleeping in a strangers house in order to have an opinion about it - do we.
Certainly not. However experience often leads to practical decisions whereas inexperience often leads to speculation.
I think we are bypassing common sense and that we all deal with people on a daily basis and form our opinions. I don't think any of that fundamentally changes when we are on their couch.
Leonard | | Market Timing: Do you seriously think you can predict the future? What else do the voices tell you? | | If employees weren't taking jobs with bad 401k's, bad 401k's wouldn't exist.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by Raybo »

leonard wrote:Certainly, we don't need to experience sleeping in a strangers house in order to have an opinion about it - do we.
Have all the (uninformed) opinion you like. Just don't expect others to respect it.
No matter how long the hill, if you keep pedaling you'll eventually get up to the top.
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investor1
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

leonard wrote:
investor1 wrote:
leonard wrote:Certainly, we don't need to experience sleeping in a strangers house in order to have an opinion about it - do we.
Certainly not. However experience often leads to practical decisions whereas inexperience often leads to speculation.
I think we are bypassing common sense and that we all deal with people on a daily basis and form our opinions. I don't think any of that fundamentally changes when we are on their couch.
When you are staying together you have more time to hang out together. Without that time, you wouldn't get the same experience. Hosting people is also a nice thing to do, and doing nice things for people helps put them at ease which makes it easier to socialize with them.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

investor1 wrote:
leonard wrote:
investor1 wrote:
leonard wrote:Certainly, we don't need to experience sleeping in a strangers house in order to have an opinion about it - do we.
Certainly not. However experience often leads to practical decisions whereas inexperience often leads to speculation.
I think we are bypassing common sense and that we all deal with people on a daily basis and form our opinions. I don't think any of that fundamentally changes when we are on their couch.
When you are staying together you have more time to hang out together. Without that time, you wouldn't get the same experience. Hosting people is also a nice thing to do, and doing nice things for people helps put them at ease which makes it easier to socialize with them.
We're talking past each other.

Your filtering for the potential positives. The reality - it's also more time to be drugged and locked in their basement. The potential upside of a nice chat doesn't offset the risk for me. It does for you. Have fun. Be safe. And, hope you don't win this particular lottery.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

I think your world view is unrealistic if you think it is probable to be drugged and locked in a basement.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

investor1 wrote:I think your world view is unrealistic if you think it is probable to be drugged and locked in a basement.
Cause - it never happens, right?

And, the upside if it doesn't is a nice chat?

That cost benefit doesn't work for me.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

leonard wrote:
investor1 wrote:I think your world view is unrealistic if you think it is probable to be drugged and locked in a basement.
Cause - it never happens, right?

And, the upside if it doesn't is a nice chat?

That cost benefit doesn't work for me.
Practically.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

investor1 wrote:
leonard wrote:
investor1 wrote:I think your world view is unrealistic if you think it is probable to be drugged and locked in a basement.
Cause - it never happens, right?

And, the upside if it doesn't is a nice chat?

That cost benefit doesn't work for me.
Practically.
Again, not the lottery I would want to win. Just to secure the upside of a nice chat.
Leonard | | Market Timing: Do you seriously think you can predict the future? What else do the voices tell you? | | If employees weren't taking jobs with bad 401k's, bad 401k's wouldn't exist.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by VictoriaF »

leonard wrote:
investor1 wrote:I think your world view is unrealistic if you think it is probable to be drugged and locked in a basement.
Cause - it never happens, right?

And, the upside if it doesn't is a nice chat?

That cost benefit doesn't work for me.
Leonard,

I always appreciate your direct, common-sensical comments, including the ones you made in this thread. You are making a valid point that couch-surfing(CS) puts people in a more vulnerable situation than mainstream travel and thus presents a greater risk. However, some of us like to take more risk to do, or to start doing, couchsurfing--for the benefits that are not available elsewhere.

I asked the OP to start this thread to describe how CS works and to answer subsequent questions. I suggest that we revert to the original purpose of this thread.

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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by Raybo »

leonard wrote:Again, not the lottery I would want to win. Just to secure the upside of a nice chat.
I'm curious.

Do you drive a car? Fly in airplanes? Eat food at restaurants? Take public transit? Walk out in public?

Or, does your "death vs nice chat" outlook on life only apply to those things you've never done?
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by ieee488 »

Raybo wrote:
leonard wrote:Again, not the lottery I would want to win. Just to secure the upside of a nice chat.
I'm curious.

Do you drive a car? Fly in airplanes? Eat food at restaurants? Take public transit? Walk out in public?

Or, does your "death vs nice chat" outlook on life only apply to those things you've never done?
Some of the things you mention are what can be considered "necessary" actions.

Couchsurfing is not a necessity.

So for leonard the risk for an unnecessary action is not worth it.
It isn't for me either.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by SmileyFace »

Raybo wrote: Enron, 2008, AIG haven't scared me away from investing ....
Not sure if this one is the best example (although I appreciate your overall point of view) - observing these individual corporate failures is EXACTLY what convinced me to stop investing in individual stocks and move into Index Funds (and join the boglehead revolution).
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by leonard »

Raybo wrote:
leonard wrote:Again, not the lottery I would want to win. Just to secure the upside of a nice chat.
I'm curious.

Do you drive a car? Fly in airplanes? Eat food at restaurants? Take public transit? Walk out in public?

Or, does your "death vs nice chat" outlook on life only apply to those things you've never done?
Yes. Rarely. Yes. Rarely. Yes.

What does the "death vs nice chat" dichotomy have to do with those other things you listed? There are a different set of cost benefits for those other activities.

Stuff I haven't done: Grabbed a hot pan on the stove. Fought a professional boxer. Worked as a Stunt man. Is it your assertion that I actually need to do those things before I can reasonably extrapolate whether they are worth it for me? Or can I use my good (common?) sense and make some reasonable conclusions based on my own cost benefit analysis?

Or, are you saying that the only way I can know I will get burned from a pan - let alone having an opinion on the cost benefits about the danger - is by grabbing that handle? Is experience really the only teacher - or can we apply reason?
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

leonard wrote:are you saying that the only way I can know I will get burned from a pan - let alone having an opinion on the cost benefits about the danger - is by grabbing that handle? Is experience really the only teacher - or can we apply reason?
Most people are applying reason. Many people have already pointed out that bad things can and sometimes do happen, and you should apply your reasoning to help keep you safe (in addition to the safety mechanisms provided through the website). Many people also acknowledge that after utilizing those safety precautions, it is extremely unlikely that anyone will try to kill you using CS'ing as a way to lure you in.

If you grab a hot pot, you will get burned. Cause and effect make that a fair statement. The same reasoning does not apply to "If you CS, you will be murdered."

Look you don't want to do it, we get it. Other people are more reasonable, and find CS'ing very enjoyable. I mean that in the most kind way possible.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by ieee488 »

investor1 wrote: Look you don't want to do it, we get it. Other people are more reasonable, and find CS'ing very enjoyable.
Most people are reasonable and find it enjoyable until that bad thing happens to them.
Once a rape or something even worse happens, it cannot be undone.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by roymeo »

Boy. I can't even tell anymore if that was even a horse when they got started.
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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by Barefootgirl »

I'm a woman and I probably wouldn't couch surf, but safety is only one of my concerns. Often, after a long day of travelling to a destination or spending all day on skis or hiking or sightseeing, I just want peace and quiet at night...it means I've been talking and seeing others all day and often at night, I just want to be alone with my thoughts or my bed partner. A long bath or shower, a good book or movie, a glass of wine and a nice bed at night are one of the pleasures of travel.

There are certain locations and occasions when I stay at hostels and I like to chat with people too sometimes, but I don't worry too much about safety at a hostel, I tend to do my homework first.

I'm including a link here to a hospitality travel club for those over 50 years of age.....I have never used it as I just became eligible a couple years ago and have yet to really get my feet wet...but it looks like it combines the best of many worlds - very economical, social and safe....why take unnecessary risks? life may be too short to miss an adventure, but it's also too short to deal with hassles and potential problems as well. FWIW, the amount one pays to an Evergreen host is only intended to cover their basic costs of your stay (extra utility costs, perhaps a meal, etc.) If I were to couch surf, I could not imagine at least making a similar donation to a host, so in my mind, the Evergreen club offers a better lodging model than couch surfing for the same financial arrangement- but to each their own.

https://www.evergreenclub.com/


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Re: Couch Surfing

Post by investor1 »

Barefootgirl wrote:I'm including a link here to a hospitality travel club for those over 50 years of age.....I have never used it as I just became eligible a couple years ago and have yet to really get my feet wet...but it looks like it combines the best of many worlds - very economical, social and safe....why take unnecessary risks? life may be too short to miss an adventure, but it's also too short to deal with hassles and potential problems as well. FWIW, the amount one pays to an Evergreen host is only intended to cover their basic costs of your stay (extra utility costs, perhaps a meal, etc.) If I were to couch surf, I could not imagine at least making a similar donation to a host, so in my mind, the Evergreen club offers a better lodging model than couch surfing for the same financial arrangement- but to each their own.

https://www.evergreenclub.com/
Never heard of it. Cool, thanks for sharing! It'll be a long time until I get to use it though.
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