Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

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vveat
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Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by vveat »

My husband was getting today our boat on water, a bit late in the season. He was at the yacht club yard, working with a couple of friends on getting the mast in place, when a person whom he knows from the club approached them. They exchanged a couple of words and then the man decided to see from up close "what you guys are doing" and he climbed on the trailer, slipped and fell, cutting his leg in the process. My husband said it looked deep enough to need stitches, so one of our friends drove him to the nearest ER. The man also seemed a bit drunk, if it matters. Before leaving he asked my husband whether he has insurance - which makes us think he may sue.

We have very limited experience with the court system here and have no lawyer to ask for advice.
1. We need to read the fine print on the boat liability insurance, but could this be possibly covered by it, given that this happened on land and not on water?
2. Does he have grounds for suing, given that nobody asked him to climb on the trailer, he was not asked for help in any way (my husband barely knows him) - and we have 2 witnesses to this?
3. Should we wait and see if he sues, or are there any preemptive measures to take - e.g. find a lawyer, talk to insurance, not sure what else

Any advice would be appreciated.
Professor Emeritus
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Professor Emeritus »

reducing the uncertainty in such cases is one of the reasons you buy liability insurance. There is absolutely NO way to tell from your post if there is any kind of case, but I carry a large personal liability policy so that I don't have to worry about it
Mordoch
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Mordoch »

I would note if nothing else to be somewhat reassuring, it sounds like barring a highly unlikely medical complication, there is no way he could remotely plausibly get much money at all from you guys in damages even in a worse case scenario. (The medical expenses in this case simply should not be that high.)

I would think a lawsuit would be difficult in this case for him to win regardless given he was not asked to go on the trailer and there is nothing about the condition of the trailer described so far which would suggest you were negligent enough to be liable in spite of this fact. Having said this, with regards to the second comment I am not a lawyer, so I would let anyone else more knowledgeable on this aspect of things to chime in.
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Rob5TCP
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Rob5TCP »

People, in this country, sue for anything. Finding a lawyer to take it and whether the jury responds is another matter.
Hopefully you have insurance. There are seedy lawyers/doctors who will make things seem much worse then they are.
An insurance company would probably give him a few thousand just to go away; it's not worth pursuing in court and taking
a chance on a higher verdict.
john94549
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by john94549 »

Had you been onboard, you could have screamed "repel boarders" and whacked him with a belaying pin. The guy was obviously a drunk pirate, and should have been arrested as such. Sue him for trespass by piracy, right now. I doubt his homeowner's insurance (assuming he has any) will cover his defense for an alleged piracy charge. Bleed him with attorneys' fees. A pre-emptive strike, and all that.
Last edited by john94549 on Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
BigPrince
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by BigPrince »

If it was me I think I would:

1. Say nothing other then providing your insurance information if asked. Do not apologize.

2. If contacted by insurance company, contact a lawyer.

3. Allow lawyer to handle communication.
Lafder
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Lafder »

Vveat,
It seems very unlikely he will sue.

If he does not have health insurance, he may be hoping you have some type of insurance that would cover an accident involving your boat. I am not sure if it would be auto or boat insurance, or an umbrella policy. And it may cover his medical bill.

If he does not have insurance, he may ask for your insurance to cover his medical bill. Even if he does have medical insurance it may be considered an accident and they may try to get your policy to cover. In which case I believe it would not go through you (the insurances would handle it).

In that case, your insurance would get involved and hopefully resolve the situation.

This is very different than getting sued. Sued would mean he got attorneys involved and is likely after more than medical bills.

It seems clear that he had an accident that was not due to your negligence. But he did slip and cut himself on your trailer, so your insurance on the boat or trailer may be responsible for the accident damage to him.

I see zero reason to contact an attorney.

However, it might be a good idea to contact the insurance that covers your boat/trailer and let them know what happened. They may make you give a recorded statement.

It would help to have names of witnesses, especially that could say he appeared intoxicated.

I understand that this is very anxiety provoking. But it seems like it will not be a big deal and you may never hear about it again. And if you do, that is why you have insurance, and it should all go through them.

Yes there is an extremely slim chance he will try to sue for something. But it seems so unlikely you should not worry about it, since you will have time to deal with it later if it does happen.

If contacted by your insurance company, personally I would talk to them directly and not get a lawyer involved. They must get your version of what happened to resolve the case and no point involving a lawyer at that stage, in my opinion.

Lafder
dgdevil
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by dgdevil »

Get the witnesses to write down their stories while their memories are fresh, and make sure you have their contact info. Beyond that, no communication with the pirate or his representatives.

Easy for me to say, but don't worry yourself sick over this. A chat with your insurance agent should soothe you, and he will likely take over from here. If he was drunk - which would be great to verify - one of your (many) defences, in the highly unlikely event of litigation, is that you felt threatened by his belligerent demeanor.
BigPrince
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by BigPrince »

Lafder wrote:Vveat,

However, it might be a good idea to contact the insurance that covers your boat/trailer and let them know what happened. They may make you give a recorded statement.
If I thought the guy was crazy, I would not provide a recorded statement without an attorney.

If I thought this was going to be a simple matter then I would be okay with it.

Example Scenerios:

I rear ended a car, no serious injuries, but the person starts saying "I WILL SUE YOU FOR EVERY PENNY YOU OWN!" I would get a lawyer to deal with insurance, regardless of me being a moron.

I rear ended a car, no injuries, everyone involved was cooperative. I would just contact insurance and admit I was a moron.

I guess the OP needs to decide which situation he can relate closer too.
LeeMKE
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by LeeMKE »

+ Lafeder

Contact your insurance agent and let them take it from here.

I would not get an attorney. The ones who are aggressive will make matters worse, and the ones who are more conciliatory aren't who you want if this goes to court. Your insurance company retains attorneys for these purposes, and this is what you pay them for. Let them do their job instead of dealing with an attorney you hired before calling them.

If you don't have umbrella liability coverage, take this as a wake up call and get it for future such instances. When I owned a duplex, I added extra liability coverage, and then when I married someone with two teenagers, I doubled the liability coverage. I sleep well at night.

Years ago, an unusual situation occurred and my insurance carrier, State Farm, stepped in and went above and beyond my expectations to help me with the legal issues. I could not have done as good a job on my own. Their pre-trial attorney handled the initial negotiation, a solid, calm and generous offer to go away. When they didn't want to settle, another attorney with blood dripping from their teeth came in for the trial. In the end they settled by paying me to avoid our counter-suit.
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vveat
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by vveat »

Thank you for the reassuring replies and advice!

We'll just review our boat insurance details to see what provisions it makes, maybe speak to somebody at the club who knows the guy, and then wait and see what happens. The injury wasn't serious, just a deep calf cut, so unlikely to be high cost indeed. The reason our friend had to drive him to the ER is because he doesn't have license (was taken for DUI). It does feel if you look at the news that everybody is suing at the smallest opportunity, but hopefully people are more reasonable than that.

By the way, I did plan to get umbrella insurance this year, mostly after reading Bogleheads posts - but I was thinking of doing it upon renewal of our home/auto policies in November. Oh, well ...
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Kenkat
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Kenkat »

You could also ask him for HIS insurance information has there is possible damage to your boat from his drunken fall... :D
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steadyeddy
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by steadyeddy »

There is a big difference between paying some medical bills through your insurance and actually getting sued. Odds are good that nothing will come of this at all anyway.
obgraham
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by obgraham »

There is a big difference between paying some medical bills through your insurance and actually getting sued.
This is the whole point. I would do nothing unless he contacts you demanding payment of his bills. Then call your agent and let the insurance handle the negotiations. They would likely pay a bit to avoid a suit, but let them call the shots.

Being sued is not a big deal, though it is stressful. You immediately are thrust into the world of lawyers and out of the common sense world. But that is what insurance (the "liability" part of your policy) is for. If your limits are too low, get an umbrella.
chaz
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by chaz »

Talk to a lawyer for peace of mind.
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FelixTheCat
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by FelixTheCat »

Your story is why I have medical on my house/car insurance. It pays for accidents like the one you mentioned. I also have liability insurance in case the person is trying to get more cash then the medical insurance provides.

The best you can do is 1) Document the incident and 2) Have a chat with your insurance agent.
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nisiprius
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by nisiprius »

vveat wrote:...Before leaving he asked my husband whether he has insurance - which makes us think he may sue....
I wouldn't jump to that conclusion. I think it is a very natural question, and there's good reason for him to ask it even if he doesn't plan to sue.

Due to "coordination of benefits," whenever you file a claim with your own insurance company, they always want to know other insurance company that might also be paying. He knows his own insurance company is going to ask "did the other guy have insurance" so he could just be getting the information he needs to have in order to file his claim.

The general idea is that a claim only gets paid once. If something is covered by insurance on three different policies, it doesn't get paid three times. You may well say, "Why ever not? Three premiums were paid." And I would say "I don't know why not. But that's the way it is." (I think "coordination of benefits" is a nice sneaky euphemism).
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

If you him again, ask him what his blood alcohol level was that day. If he is confused as to why you think he would know this, mention that getting this is standard procedure for any er visit.
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denovo
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by denovo »

dgdevil wrote:Get the witnesses to write down their stories while their memories are fresh, and make sure you have their contact info. Beyond that, no communication with the pirate or his representatives.

Easy for me to say, but don't worry yourself sick over this. A chat with your insurance agent should soothe you, and he will likely take over from here. If he was drunk - which would be great to verify - one of your (many) defences, in the highly unlikely event of litigation, is that you felt threatened by his belligerent demeanor.

This is the best advice here. Make sure everyone notes that he was told to go away, and come on to the trailer on his volition. Don't contact the "pirate" , but if he tries to contact you say, say nothing.
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by pshonore »

imgritz wrote:Your story is why I have medical on my house/car insurance. It pays for accidents like the one you mentioned. I also have liability insurance in case the person is trying to get more cash then the medical insurance provides.

The best you can do is 1) Document the incident and 2) Have a chat with your insurance agent.
How much is the Med Pay limit on your Homeowners Policy? Typical limit is 1K which probably won't cover an ER visit these days.
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Tozmo »

As an er doc, keep in mind that we do ask whether there are any exacerbating factors (alcohol, drugs, etc)
I would not talk to a lawyer right now and just wait. Maybe he will ask you to pay his co pay. Maybe he hires an attorney and contacts you, in which you do not talk to him and contact insurance.

Maybe his chart reflects intoxication which has the potential to limit damage or a case even.

I would wait. And stress, but wait.

*edited autocorrect
Last edited by Tozmo on Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
MnD
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by MnD »

Just contacting your own insurance with an "incident" report can raise your rates.
I would not contact your insurance unless the pirate or an agent of his actually initiates a claim of liability against you.
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by Meaty »

john94549 wrote:Had you been onboard, you could have screamed "repel boarders" and whacked him with a belaying pin. The guy was obviously a drunk pirate, and should have been arrested as such. Sue him for trespass by piracy, right now. I doubt his homeowner's insurance (assuming he has any) will cover his defense for an alleged piracy charge. Bleed him with attorneys' fees. A pre-emptive strike, and all that.
+1

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BigOil
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by BigOil »

A lot of well-meaning commentary perhaps, but somethings would definitely not be my advice here.
I am not a lawyer, but gosh knows I've used enough of them in my personal and professional life over the years!!!

Couple of points. There's really no need to contact a lawyer this early stage. It will just confuse matters because should this go forward against your insurance, and implicitly you, your insurance will defend you and appoint a lawyer. You purchase the insurance for this very purpose. This lawyer has a duty to advise you if your rights might be in conflict with the insurance company because he will be with representing both of you, even though he will be paid by insurance company. Bottom-line stay away from the lawyers until real. I've been here, and never had an issue, but I did ask assigned attorney explicitly if my interests were not identical to insurance what happened.

I would certainly provide my insurance companies' information if asked to injured party, or his medical insurance company. His medical insurance might try to recover from you, but common sense says this is unlikely unless it's a major medical bill with with reasonably clear liabilities apparent. Legal services are incredibly expensive. His medical insurance company will be looking to minimize cost.

I would not notify my insurance company until it's "real" -- they or me have been contacted by another Insurance or Legal person, I don't want any excuse to raise my rates. And it seems unreasonable for you to assume that you have a potential liability claim from a drunk guy that got cut and got a few stitches after he was not careful (A reasonable interpretation of the situation at first pass). There's always notification requirements in your policy language if you want to be 100% certain. That's all those attachments to the policy and bill most people never read...

Should this person get a personal injury attorney. Obviously you say nothing and immediately go to your Insurance company -- when you get a letter. You might need to notify both the boat policy & your umbrella liability policy companies. The plaintiffs personal-injury attorney will not expect anything out of you anyway other than your insurance company contact information and policy number.

Perhaps most importantly - do not admit fault in any way at any time. I would be incredibly polite. You can certainly say you're sorry it happened. You're sorry for the inconvenience. etc. Also you do not have an obligation, nor should you, make a statement to the other insurance company. Only yours.
YttriumNitrate
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by YttriumNitrate »

Suing a fellow member of a yacht club for your own drunken negligence would be a good way to get ostracized by the other members of the social club...so I would be less worried than if a random drunkard had stopped by and done something stupid.
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Re: Possibility of getting sued - what steps to take

Post by skepticalobserver »

It's not clear whether the trailer was attached to your vehicle. In any case, promptly report the incident to your insurance carrier, vehicle and/or car, and let them handle it. When you buy insurance you are, in large part, paying for legal representation.
Other than polite conversation with the injured party, do not discuss the accident with anyone other than your insurance company rep. Don't apologize, don't accuse, don't offer compensation. What you don't say can not be used against you later on.
Leave theories of negligence to the attorneys. Tort law is a bit more complicated than most laypersons think. A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.
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