O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

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an_asker
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O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by an_asker »

We are planning an incursion trip just over the border this summer. I have a few questions that I would appreciate any answers for:

- what are the "nature" related things we could do within, say, five hours of Niagara Falls into Canada (any direction)?

- what documents would we need to carry with us to bring my nine-year-old niece with us?

- obviously, because of toll rules associated with the car, I would not want to go through E-tolls. Is the friendship bridge E-tolled or is it manned so that we could pay in cash without triggering the car's toll mechanism?

- last but probably most important - right now, the only relatively good deals I am seeing for car rentals is via Priceline. How do I ensure beforehand that the 'unlimited miles' deal permits trips across the border? Or is that a given? Been a while since we last drove across the border (more than a decade in fact!).

Also, I would appreciate any other insights into Niagara Falls that we might be missing. The last time we were there, we did the Maid of the Mist (or whatever it is called) :-) but not much more either at the Falls or in Toronto.
Last edited by an_asker on Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
bpp
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Re: O Canada!

Post by bpp »

an_asker wrote: - what documents would we need to carry with us to bring my nine-year-old niece with us?
Passports for everybody, including the niece.
- obviously, because of toll rules associated with the car, I would not want to go through E-tolls. Is the friendship bridge E-tolled or is it manned so that we could pay in cash without triggering the car's toll mechanism?
Manned immigration booths, as of a few years ago. (Actually, don't remember a toll, just immigration booths. Is there a toll?)
Also, I would appreciate any other insights into Niagara Falls that we might be missing. The last time we were there, we did the Maid of the Mist (or whatever it is called) :-) but not much more either at the Falls or in Toronto.
Did you do the tunnel under the falls? More impressive than Maid of the Mist, in my opinion.
Random Poster
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Re: O Canada!

Post by Random Poster »

I thought that this thread was posted in honour of Canada Day.....

I don't really know the answers to your questions, although I suspect that Georgian Bay is within 5 hours of Niagara.

Oh, and as to your niece, she'll need a passport. And a few other documents. See here: http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/un ... y-can.aspx
AND_YOU_ARE
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Re: O Canada!

Post by AND_YOU_ARE »

As a resident of western NY, Niagara Falls is a frequent day trip for us. You'll need passports, enhanced drivers lisences, or enhanced NY ID cards. There are tolls on only one direction of each bridge between US and Canada. Ive always paid the toll in cash (USD), I dont recall if they take ezpass.

As for things to do (on the Canadian side);
- Niagara-on-the-Lake is a nice quaint town with a British feel. Its great for arts, theater, and shopping.
- Marine Land, an amusement park. Not quiet the size of a six flags.
- Butterfly Conservatory/Botanical Gardens is a great place to spend an afternoon. You can wander through the gardens and butterflies will actually land on you.
- Skylon Tower, it can be pricey, but it gives you a great view of the area. There is a restaurant on the top of the tower that is expensive.
- There is the Niagara Wine Trail for a wine tour.
- Maid of the Mist is a must, you'll get wet if you are on the open deck of the boat.

US Side;
- Aquarium
- Fort Niagara
- Cave of the Winds tour, you'll walk along and behind the US Bridal Falls. You will get wet even with the poncho, which if its hot will be welcomed.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Epsilon Delta »

The boarder patrol recommends that you have a consent letter, signed by both parents, giving details of your trip and acknowledging permission to take your niece out of the country. I would also get a medical power of attorney. Neither of these is strictly necessary but there are circumstances where they could save you a lot of aggravation.

https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... FRRHRjWWw=

The Butterfly Conservancy and botanical gardens are worth a trip. There is hiking in many places. Best access into the gorge is on the US side. There is a paved bike/walking trail along much of the Canadian side of the river. Bike rentals are available. If you're really serious the Bruce trail follows the escarpment from from Brock's monument on the Niagara river to Georgian bay. Some sections make very nice day or half day hikes. Probably best to check a guide book since I wasn't driving and can't remember where we went.

The Niagara peninsula is a major bird flyway. You'd need to check with the twitchers for locations and times of year to catch migrations.

I'm not sure what you mean by the Friendship Bridge. There are tolls into Canada on all the Niagara river crossings. All of them take cash as well as EZ pass. You may need to avoid the Whirlpool bridge which requires NEXUS.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by ResearchMed »

Epsilon Delta wrote:The boarder patrol recommends that you have a consent letter, signed by both parents, giving details of your trip and acknowledging permission to take your niece out of the country. I would also get a medical power of attorney. Neither of these is strictly necessary but there are circumstances where they could save you a lot of aggravation.

https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... FRRHRjWWw=
...
This could be very important, and the consent letter(s) should have notarized signatures of both parents.

Given the problems with non-custodial parents removing children from the country (and thus from the custodial parent), many international borders have become far more concerned with this potential problem.

RM
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an_asker
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by an_asker »

ResearchMed wrote:
Epsilon Delta wrote:The boarder patrol recommends that you have a consent letter, signed by both parents, giving details of your trip and acknowledging permission to take your niece out of the country. I would also get a medical power of attorney. Neither of these is strictly necessary but there are circumstances where they could save you a lot of aggravation.

https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... FRRHRjWWw=
...
This could be very important, and the consent letter(s) should have notarized signatures of both parents.

Given the problems with non-custodial parents removing children from the country (and thus from the custodial parent), many international borders have become far more concerned with this potential problem.

RM
That was what I am unsure of - whether the consent letter needs to be notarized or not. Per the link by "Random Poster" it appears that notarization is not needed.

Thanks for everyone who replied.
Random Poster
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Random Poster »

an_asker wrote:That was what I am unsure of - whether the consent letter needs to be notarized or not. Per the link by "Random Poster" it appears that notarization is not needed.

Thanks for everyone who replied.
You may find this link to be somewhat helpful: http://www.ezbordercrossing.com/the-ins ... da-border/

It has a link to a sample "Consent Letter to a Allow Minor Child to Cross the U.S. Canadian Border" along with instructions.
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Re: O Canada!

Post by oxothuk »

bpp wrote:Did you do the tunnel under the falls? More impressive than Maid of the Mist, in my opinion.
"The falls would be even more impressive if they flowed the other way" (quote from Oscar Wilde after seeing Niagara).
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by joe8d »

AND_YOU_ARE

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Love that location :happy

As far as Niagara Falls, this year, a new boat( Hornblower) tour has started on the Canadian side. M of M can only operate on US side this year.

Also check out the ever developing Canal Side on the Buffalo waterfront.
All the Best, | Joe
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

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This thread is now in the Personal Consumer Issues forum (travel).
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

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Be sure to look up a good place for poutine, Canada's most significant contribution to the culinary arts. Not for the faint-hearted but when done well - it is memorable.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by kramer »

Canada is much stricter about letting Americans cross the border than vice versa. If you or anyone in your party has any sort of criminal record during your lifetime (including things like 30 year old drug misdemeanors), or any DUI or alcohol-related conviction, you will probably be denied entry. Border officials have complete access to USA criminal records database at their fingertips.

So many US citizens were being turned away that they recently tried to make it a bit less strict:

http://www.ezbordercrossing.com/new-can ... 7NuiPndl0w
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by hmw »

We did a similar trip a couple of years ago. We liked Niagara-on-the lake. It was a quaint little town within an easy drive from Niagara Falls. There are wineries you can visit along way. We also enjoyed the butterfly conservatory. I think most kids will like it.

There aren't too many toll roads in Ontario. There is a E-toll road in the north part of Toronto. I can't remember the name right now. Cash is no good as there is no toll booth to collect the cash.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by dm200 »

As a resident of western NY, Niagara Falls is a frequent day trip for us. You'll need passports, enhanced drivers lisences, or enhanced NY ID cards. There are tolls on only one direction of each bridge between US and Canada. Ive always paid the toll in cash (USD), I dont recall if they take ezpass.
Many years ago, I used to live in Western NY - and visited Canada regularly, but it has been a few years.

What is an "enhanced" drivers license? I know about the passport requirement now.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by DSInvestor »

dm200 wrote:What is an "enhanced" drivers license? I know about the passport requirement now.
From US Customs and Border Patrol:
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... 8edl%29%3F
What is an Enhanced Driver's License (EDL)

The Enhanced Driver's License (EDL) is a driver's license that is issued to U.S. Citizens or Canadian citizens in the U.S. State or Province in which you reside. This driver's license is a Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative (WHTI) compliant document for travels by land or sea only. It denotes both identity and citizenship and is a Radio Frequency Identity card (RFID).

Not all U.S. States and Canadian Provinces issue the EDL. For a list of U.S. States and Provinces as well as locations for its application; please click here. (Note: Beginning February 3, 2014, Minnesota will offer the EDL.)
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Bylo Selhi »

an_asker wrote:- what are the "nature" related things we could do within, say, five hours of Niagara Falls into Canada (any direction)?
In Toronto, the Zoo (in the burbs) and Aquarium (downtown beside the CN Tower.) Toronto is about a 2 hr drive from Niagara.

Further afield if you like hiking and spectacular views, Algonquin Park, the Bruce Peninsula, or just about anywhere along the Bruce Trail. Driving time ranges from under an hour to several hours depending.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Valuethinker »

hmw wrote:We did a similar trip a couple of years ago. We liked Niagara-on-the lake. It was a quaint little town within an easy drive from Niagara Falls. There are wineries you can visit along way. We also enjoyed the butterfly conservatory. I think most kids will like it.

There aren't too many toll roads in Ontario. There is a E-toll road in the north part of Toronto. I can't remember the name right now. Cash is no good as there is no toll booth to collect the cash.
The toll road is the 407. There's a wikipedia on it. I am not aware of any other Toll roads in Ontario (bridges yes).

I don't know off hand what the rules are if you don't have a transponder.

In general you want to avoid the 401 (parallel road to the south) and even the 407 if you can at peak periods in the GTA. The Greater Toronto Area really does have nightmare traffic-- I believe the 401 is both one of the world's widest highways and at peak periods one of the world's busiest. And it NEVER is empty (even at 3am there's traffic). From about 7am to about 9.30am and from about 4pm to about 7pm (weekdays) it really ranges from pain in the ass to nightmare-- keep an ear peeled to local traffic radio. If I found myself in downtown Toronto at 4.30-6pm wanting to leave (by car), on a weekday, I'd probably go get dinner and wait until after 7-- it might not take me any longer to get home-- the Gardiner Expressway (along the Lakeshore) can just be a giant parking lot at that time.

So both the Toronto Aquarium and the Toronto Zoo are doable (the Zoo more of a stretch as it is in the north eastern end of the city proper, what is known as Scarborough). And they are both great. Even with ideal traffic flow you'd probably be talking 60 minutes+ to the Aquarium from the border (maybe realistically including parking 75-90 minutes?) and another 30 minutes at least to the Zoo (each way). Aquarium is right downtown near the waterfront.

But in the time you have (1 day) you are unlikely to want to go east of Hamilton. The Royal Botanical Gardens there is nice-- has a nature trail. Hamilton itself has regenerated a bit (steel town) but is not a great sight.

http://www.ontarioparks.com/park-locator

Look for the Ontario provincial parks to the west of Niagara Falls Ontario. Of Niagara Falls Ontario one can really only say that the Falls are impressive and the town does not do them justice.

Try googling something like 'Ontario for kids' or 'Western Ontario for kids' and see what you get.

Niagara on the Lake is kitschy quaint but I do like it, not sure how much is there for kids (worth checking town website).

All the commentary about nieces and permission I have to heartily endorse.
There are international treaties now about protecting children from parental and familial cross border abduction and authorities are ultra paranoid.

Because of very different gun control laws, Canadian border security can be paranoid about Americans bringing their handguns across. The rules for transporting firearms in Canada are quite strict, and it's really best avoided by American tourists (not sure what hunters do, as its perfectly possible to own hunting weapons in Canada, most of my family (who live in rural areas) do in fact, but I am not sure what Americans crossing into Canada for hunting season do).

The other usual paranoia is about Canadians going shopping for cheap booze, cigarettes etc. in America and bringing it back across, so you shouldn't get hassled too much.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by gary11 »

an_asker wrote: Also, I would appreciate any other insights into Niagara Falls that we might be missing. The last time we were there, we did the Maid of the Mist (or whatever it is called) :-) but not much more either at the Falls or in Toronto.
I visited Niagara Falls from both Canada and US side just 2 weeks ago. Tips given by poster AND_YOU_ARE are spot on - can be very helpful!

You would need your US passports to cross border along with driver's license of the driver. We had a rental vehicle and were asked to show rental agreement.

Couple of nitpicks:
Canadian side seems to have acquired new boats for the rides to the fall. These boats are bigger and wider however we noticed from top that these boats do not spend as much time as US side boats at the fall; once they reach near Horseshoe Falls they take the immediate U turn and return right away versus US side boats (known as 'Maid of the Mist') spend way more time negotiating rough water at the Falls and slowly turns back.
We used Rainbow bridge to cross the border and observed that from 11 AM to 4 PM bridge was a parking lot. Someone could easily get stuck in traffic on bridge for about an hour.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Bylo Selhi »

gary11 wrote:We used Rainbow bridge to cross the border and observed that from 11 AM to 4 PM bridge was a parking lot. Someone could easily get stuck in traffic on bridge for about an hour.
The Peace bridge in Buffalo is usually faster. If you have a smartphone you can monitor for delays here.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by hmw »

Valuethinker wrote:
hmw wrote:We did a similar trip a couple of years ago. We liked Niagara-on-the lake. It was a quaint little town within an easy drive from Niagara Falls. There are wineries you can visit along way. We also enjoyed the butterfly conservatory. I think most kids will like it.

There aren't too many toll roads in Ontario. There is a E-toll road in the north part of Toronto. I can't remember the name right now. Cash is no good as there is no toll booth to collect the cash.
The toll road is the 407. There's a wikipedia on it. I am not aware of any other Toll roads in Ontario (bridges yes).

I don't know off hand what the rules are if you don't have a transponder.


Because of very different gun control laws, Canadian border security can be paranoid about Americans bringing their handguns across. The rules for transporting firearms in Canada are quite strict, and it's really best avoided by American tourists (not sure what hunters do, as its perfectly possible to own hunting weapons in Canada, most of my family (who live in rural areas) do in fact, but I am not sure what Americans crossing into Canada for hunting season do).

The other usual paranoia is about Canadians going shopping for cheap booze, cigarettes etc. in America and bringing it back across, so you shouldn't get hassled too much.
I entered the 407 by mistake a couple of years ago. I knew it was a toll road and I thought I could just pay cash at the entrance of the 407. Turned out that they didn't have a toll booth, and I had to proceed to drive on 407. The traffic on 407 was much faster than 401. I was wondering if I was going to get a ticket in the mail afterwards but never did. I was living in MA at the time and my car plate was from MA. I guess they couldn't be bothered.

American hunters can bring their hunting rifles into Canada. I don't know the exact process. But one of my colleague used to go hunting in Quebec each fall from MA.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by DSInvestor »

hmw wrote:I entered the 407 by mistake a couple of years ago. I knew it was a toll road and I thought I could just pay cash at the entrance of the 407. Turned out that they didn't have a toll booth, and I had to proceed to drive on 407. The traffic on 407 was much faster than 401. I was wondering if I was going to get a ticket in the mail afterwards but never did. I was living in MA at the time and my car plate was from MA. I guess they couldn't be bothered.
Here's something about toll collection on the 407 if you don't have a toll transponder. It seems that MA isn't one of the states that shares the DMV database with the 407 billing program.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ontario_Highway_407
wikipedia wrote:For drivers without transponders, the automatic number plate recognition system is linked to several provincial and U.S. state motor vehicle registries. Only the provinces of Ontario, Quebec, and the states of Illinois, Michigan, Wisconsin, Ohio, New York, Maryland, Maine, Georgia, Florida, New Jersey, Delaware, and possibly several adjacent states and provinces provide 407 ETR access to their registry databases due to the privacy laws of these states.[citation needed] This has resulted in motorists from other jurisdictions being able to travel on 407 ETR without receiving a bill.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Bylo Selhi »

hmw wrote:I entered the 407 by mistake a couple of years ago... I was wondering if I was going to get a ticket in the mail afterwards but never did. I was living in MA at the time and my car plate was from MA. I guess they couldn't be bothered.
You were lucky. Other Bogleheads, not so much: Stay off the Ontario 407 ETR! [Electronic Toll Road]
hmw
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by hmw »

Bylo Selhi wrote:
hmw wrote:I entered the 407 by mistake a couple of years ago... I was wondering if I was going to get a ticket in the mail afterwards but never did. I was living in MA at the time and my car plate was from MA. I guess they couldn't be bothered.
You were lucky. Other Bogleheads, not so much: Stay off the Ontario 407 ETR! [Electronic Toll Road]
I guess I did get lucky. Being a Canadian myself, I am not surprised that most things are more expensive in Canada than the US except health care and post-secondary education (two biggies).
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an_asker
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by an_asker »

Valuethinker wrote:
hmw wrote:We did a similar trip a couple of years ago. We liked Niagara-on-the lake. It was a quaint little town within an easy drive from Niagara Falls. There are wineries you can visit along way. We also enjoyed the butterfly conservatory. I think most kids will like it.

There aren't too many toll roads in Ontario. There is a E-toll road in the north part of Toronto. I can't remember the name right now. Cash is no good as there is no toll booth to collect the cash.
The toll road is the 407. There's a wikipedia on it. I am not aware of any other Toll roads in Ontario (bridges yes).

I don't know off hand what the rules are if you don't have a transponder.

In general you want to avoid the 401 (parallel road to the south) and even the 407 if you can at peak periods in the GTA. The Greater Toronto Area really does have nightmare traffic-- I believe the 401 is both one of the world's widest highways and at peak periods one of the world's busiest. And it NEVER is empty (even at 3am there's traffic). From about 7am to about 9.30am and from about 4pm to about 7pm (weekdays) it really ranges from pain in the ass to nightmare-- keep an ear peeled to local traffic radio. If I found myself in downtown Toronto at 4.30-6pm wanting to leave (by car), on a weekday, I'd probably go get dinner and wait until after 7-- it might not take me any longer to get home-- the Gardiner Expressway (along the Lakeshore) can just be a giant parking lot at that time.

So both the Toronto Aquarium and the Toronto Zoo are doable (the Zoo more of a stretch as it is in the north eastern end of the city proper, what is known as Scarborough). And they are both great. Even with ideal traffic flow you'd probably be talking 60 minutes+ to the Aquarium from the border (maybe realistically including parking 75-90 minutes?) and another 30 minutes at least to the Zoo (each way). Aquarium is right downtown near the waterfront.

But in the time you have (1 day) you are unlikely to want to go east of Hamilton. The Royal Botanical Gardens there is nice-- has a nature trail. Hamilton itself has regenerated a bit (steel town) but is not a great sight.

http://www.ontarioparks.com/park-locator

Look for the Ontario provincial parks to the west of Niagara Falls Ontario. Of Niagara Falls Ontario one can really only say that the Falls are impressive and the town does not do them justice.

Try googling something like 'Ontario for kids' or 'Western Ontario for kids' and see what you get.

Niagara on the Lake is kitschy quaint but I do like it, not sure how much is there for kids (worth checking town website).

All the commentary about nieces and permission I have to heartily endorse.
There are international treaties now about protecting children from parental and familial cross border abduction and authorities are ultra paranoid.

Because of very different gun control laws, Canadian border security can be paranoid about Americans bringing their handguns across. The rules for transporting firearms in Canada are quite strict, and it's really best avoided by American tourists (not sure what hunters do, as its perfectly possible to own hunting weapons in Canada, most of my family (who live in rural areas) do in fact, but I am not sure what Americans crossing into Canada for hunting season do).

The other usual paranoia is about Canadians going shopping for cheap booze, cigarettes etc. in America and bringing it back across, so you shouldn't get hassled too much.
Looks like I have not been really clear. We will be staying with relatives in the Mississauga area for a couple of days. My plan is for a couple of day trips - or one two-day trip if there is one worthwhile - in that time-frame. That is why I was asking for some touristy place about four-five hours away (that was my definition of a day trip).

At this time, I am looking into the Bruce Trails and the Algonquin Park.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by bloom2708 »

We bought a Passport ID card for each of our 3 kids. I think they are $35. Last for 5 years.

Find a 5 pin bowling alley. A small ball, 5 pins on strings, 3 throws per frame. Our kids loved it as the ball was more throw-able. It was a hoot.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Valuethinker »

an_asker wrote: Looks like I have not been really clear. We will be staying with relatives in the Mississauga area for a couple of days. My plan is for a couple of day trips - or one two-day trip if there is one worthwhile - in that time-frame. That is why I was asking for some touristy place about four-five hours away (that was my definition of a day trip).

At this time, I am looking into the Bruce Trails and the Algonquin Park.
Ah. OK.

*Outside* of rush hour, you can get to downtown Toronto (Aquarium) in 45 minutes from Mississauga (even 35 minutes). The Zoo probably in an hour (right across the 401). If you can avoid 7am-9.30am (especially inbound) and 4.30pm-7pm outbound (for setting out back to Miss). Traffic is never not busy in GTA but it's awful then (your relatives will know the right times).

There's no 'one way' for traffic in Toronto, but probably 2/3rds of the traffic in the morning flows towards Yonge St (from E and W) and reverse in evening-- along the 401, the 407, the Gardiner (on the Lake) and down the Don Valley Parking Lot (I mean Parkway ;-)).

Depending on where you are in Miss it may be easier to park at a station and take the Go Train/ Metrolinx for the Aquarium (takes you to Union Station, about 5-10 minutes walk). Coming back there are often only a few train times so check.

Algonquin is doable but *not* on a Friday afternoon-evening. Traffic is heavy north of Barrie basically most of Friday in the summer and godawful around 4-8pm (on a nice weekend it can start even earlier). From west side of GTA (ie Miss) it should take 2-2.5 hours (straight up the 400) but can take 5 at those times.

It's all less painful going *west* from Miss. in the morning. So your plan to go 'out' is good.

Bruce Trail is amazing.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Cigarman »

From Kramer:
Canada is much stricter about letting Americans cross the border than vice versa. If you or anyone in your party has any sort of criminal record during your lifetime (including things like 30 year old drug misdemeanors), or any DUI or alcohol-related conviction, you will probably be denied entry. Border officials have complete access to USA criminal records database at their fingertips.
THIS JUST HAPPENED TO ME!

My wife and I were crossing the border in Vancouver to pick up a cruise ship for an Alaskan Cruise. My 10 year old DUI flagged my record and we spent an extra hour going through customs. Essentially, since we were leaving the next day (it was midnight, coming in from Seattle on the train) I was allowed in because I was leaving Canada "as soon as reasonably possible". However, had we planned a more extended stay I would have spent the night at Customs and then been put back on the next train to the US. Do not under estimate this policy. I can be "rehabilitated" by filing out a form and paying a fee of $200 - $1000.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Bylo Selhi »

Cigarman wrote:My 10 year old DUI flagged my record and we spent an extra hour going through customs...
The paranoia and arbitrariness cuts both ways.

Our two countries have information-exchange treaties that includes access to each other's criminal records databases. (Our tax collection agencies also share financial data, etc....) In principle that's a good thing. However the implementation has numerous flaws. For example Canadian woman denied entry to U.S. because of suicide attempt and Privacy commissioner attacks police regarding disclosure of mental health records
In a sworn affidavit, [Ontario’s privacy commissioner Ann] Cavoukian alleges Toronto police are in breach of the Municipal Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act by “automatically disclosing personal information concerning all incidents of attempted suicide and threats of suicide” in [Canadian Police Information Centre] CPIC.

That information, she says, is made “routinely available to other Canadian law enforcement agencies and the United States Federal Bureau of Investigation, the Department of Homeland Security and U.S. Customs and Border Protection Officials.”...

More than two dozen readers have told the Star their mental health records have been accessed by U.S. border officials. “I was stunned when I was stopped at the Detroit border and told to go into the office for questioning,” said Nadia, a 42-year-old Torontonian who called 911 during a troubled period in her life eight years ago. She asked that her full name not be published.

“I eventually found out I was flagged because of what they called a contact with police. I had no idea what they were talking about. Then I figured out they were looking at my 911 call. I was humiliated and stunned that some American border guard could access my personal health information. It’s obscene.”
A further problem is the blanket powers given to border agents to bar people from entry into their country without explanation and essentially without avenue for appeal. If a border agent decides that you've lied to them, you're barred for at least 5 years.

One example. A Canadian was convicted of pot possession decades ago. In those days that was a criminal offense and he had a criminal record. Many years later, without further brushes with the law, he applied for and was granted a pardon. Under Canadian law his record is expunged as if he was never charged or convicted. When he tried to cross the border a US agent asked if he had a criminal record. He said no. The agent saw the unexpunged record in his copy of the CPIC database, determined that he caught the guy in a lie and decided to ban him from entry from the US for 5 years.

The problem gets even worse. If you have a record, years have passed and/or you have a pardon, etc. you're in a catch-22 position. If you declare this at the border you could be barred for having a record. If you don't declare, even if legally you shouldn't have to, and are caught in what's considered to be a lie, you could be banned for making a false declaration.

I hope y'all feel safer ;)
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an_asker
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by an_asker »

Back from a fun trip and would love to share our experience.

We flew MCO-PHL-MCO and rented a car there. As explained in another thread, that rental cost us $416 for eight days, by far the most I've rented a car for, for that short a timeframe. Drove to relative's place in NJ and stayed there the next day (DD wanted to spend more time with DC Dear Cousin), thereby reducing available time in Canada.

The next morning, we drove up to Niagara Falls, NY reaching there at about 5 pm (it was my third such drive in the last two decades) and was promptly stuck in traffic. We were on Niagara Blvd, and I learned from locals that Friday evenings are especially bad if you want to cross the Rainbow bridge into Canada (I hope this was not already explained in this thread, which means I should blame my reading comprehension). So, we parked in the two-hour zone and spent the next couple of hours walking around the US side, hoping that the traffic across the bridge would lighten up (it did not). Note to self: make sure that everyone (OK, the kids for sure) wears shoes when walking! :oops:

When we left, it was about 8 pm and after about 45 minutes, we were greeting the Canadian immigration folks. Without much ado, we proceeded onto QEW (I was quaking in my boots - NOT! - of inadvertently turning onto the dreaded 407). At that point, the heavens opened up. I have never seen thunder and lightning in those proportions in Central Florida, I kid you not! Folks were driving 45 mph on QEW and I did not even attempt to overtake them. Along the way, I was unsure if we were still on QEW (it does not appear that freeways are marked as prominently/frequently as they are in USA - or maybe it is just my perception) so had to call Mississauga cousin to confirm.

Wife's T-mobile plan stopped working as soon as we entered Canada so we were without the only smartphone we had for the entire Canadian leg - thankfully my emergency pay-as-you-go plan (on T-mobile, who else?) continued to work. And it was an emergency as we got lost following Google Maps directions. The exit 403-401-Ford (or something like that) forked right after exiting QEW and Google Maps did not specify which one to take. Validating Murphy, I chose Ford and immediately realized that I was off-course. In the rain and it being night, I had no option but to stop at a parking lot and call up cousin once more. Fortunately, we were very close and after taking a couple of other side roads, we were there within half an hour.

Our original plan had been to make a day trip, then a half-day trip and end up in Niagara Falls, ON in the afternoon. After further research (past this thread), I had realized that Algonquin would not work out. So, Bruce Peninsula it was. More specifically, we decided to drive up to Tobermory and take the cruise to Flowerpot Island. When we got to Tobermory at about 2 pm, we realized that we had brought Murphy along for the ride. Due to windy conditions, the cruise boats were all cancelled (and so were the kayak/canoe rentals). We ended up walking a couple of small trails but then made the decision which justified the trip. We went to the Secret Cave/Grotto. It was fun to squeeze into the hole in the rocks to get to the Grotto! We did not do anything IN the water though - too cold for Floridians ;-)

It was past midnight when we got back. Next morning, we woke up leisurely and drove to Niagara Falls, ON reaching there at about 1 pm. We did the Hornblower ride which was fun. Thanks to the Sun being in the ideal position, we got photos with a rainbow behind us on the Falls. Later, DS and I also went close up to the Horseshoe Falls. We stayed overnight locally; in the morning, I planned to go down to the rapids and family planned to do souvenir shopping. We came across the most amazing Buddhist temple - the Ten Thousand Stupas! It felt nice to spend time inside it. Later that afternoon, we drove back across the Rainbow Bridge (fortunately less congested right about 3 pm) and got back into NJ late night.

All in all, it was a fun trip though we probably blew our budget! :-)

PS: I had originally started this thread to ask my main question about taking niece with us. But she ended up dropping out of the trip even before we got there (which is why DD insisted on spending an extra day in NJ).
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Bylo Selhi
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Bylo Selhi »

an_asker wrote:Without much ado, we proceeded onto QEW (I was quaking in my boots - NOT! - of inadvertently turning onto the dreaded 407). At that point, the heavens opened up. I have never seen thunder and lightning in those proportions in Central Florida, I kid you not! Folks were driving 45 mph on QEW and I did not even attempt to overtake them. Along the way, I was unsure if we were still on QEW (it does not appear that freeways are marked as prominently/frequently as they are in USA - or maybe it is just my perception) so had to call Mississauga cousin to confirm.
Glad you had a good trip overall. You were extremely lucky on the drive to Mississauga despite getting lost. Last Thursday a dump truck with the box up (!) managed to get snagged on the Burlington Skyway bridge. That closed the bridge over the weekend until yesterday while engineers checked for structural damage. That created traffic snafus all around the area. Then came the rain, so much that parts of the QEW, 403 and 407 were under water and impassible.

Burlington Skyway reopens, 4 days after truck damaged bridge and then Burlington flood: 2 months worth of rain falls within hours.

And then there's More tornadoes than usual likely in Ontario this summer. Some of last week's tornadoes came down in areas you may have driven through on the way to Tobermory, e.g. Owen Sound.

I'm not trying to discourage anyone from visiting. All of these events are highly unusual. But had Murphy been meaner he could have really messed up your trip.
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an_asker
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by an_asker »

Bylo Selhi wrote:
an_asker wrote:Without much ado, we proceeded onto QEW (I was quaking in my boots - NOT! - of inadvertently turning onto the dreaded 407). At that point, the heavens opened up. I have never seen thunder and lightning in those proportions in Central Florida, I kid you not! Folks were driving 45 mph on QEW and I did not even attempt to overtake them. Along the way, I was unsure if we were still on QEW (it does not appear that freeways are marked as prominently/frequently as they are in USA - or maybe it is just my perception) so had to call Mississauga cousin to confirm.
Glad you had a good trip overall. You were extremely lucky on the drive to Mississauga despite getting lost. Last Thursday a dump truck with the box up (!) managed to get snagged on the Burlington Skyway bridge. That closed the bridge over the weekend until yesterday while engineers checked for structural damage. That created traffic snafus all around the area. Then came the rain, so much that parts of the QEW, 403 and 407 were under water and impassible.

Burlington Skyway reopens, 4 days after truck damaged bridge and then Burlington flood: 2 months worth of rain falls within hours.

And then there's More tornadoes than usual likely in Ontario this summer. Some of last week's tornadoes came down in areas you may have driven through on the way to Tobermory, e.g. Owen Sound.

I'm not trying to discourage anyone from visiting. All of these events are highly unusual. But had Murphy been meaner he could have really messed up your trip.
Wow! We left Mississauga Tuesday and left Canada on Wenesday. The thunderstorm I am referring to happened last Sunday night (27th).

On the way back from Tobermory, we ate at the Pizza Hut in Owen Sound. :-)
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by GeneralPerson »

"if you like hiking and spectacular views, Algonquin Park, the Bruce Peninsula"

+1 for this suggestion. I have been to these places and they are VERY beautiful. From Tobermory, you can also take a boat ride to the Flowerpot Island. It's very good. Algonquin in the fall season is highly recommended. I just love the scenic beauty of the Bruce Peninsula area. I have also been to the Manitoulin Island. I would recommend MI if you want to learn and experience the First Nations history. I found MI to be a little too big in size :-)

When I travel to the greater Toronto area, I try to stay away from 407-ETR. Do that by selecting "avoid toll road" option in your GPS/mapping software.
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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by Bylo Selhi »

amzsales wrote:From Tobermory, you can also take a boat ride to the Flowerpot Island.
When the boat is operating, which is generally during the summer months. But as an_asker discovered even then sometimes the boat can't run due to inclement weather.

This past winter for the first time in many years the water in Lake Huron and Georgian Bay was frozen solid. It was then possible to walk on water to Flowerpot, assuming you had the clothing and stamina to go several miles each way across blowing snow. (I was there in February but didn't attempt the crossing.)

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Re: O Canada! Questions about traveling to Canada :-)

Post by an_asker »

Bylo Selhi wrote:
amzsales wrote:From Tobermory, you can also take a boat ride to the Flowerpot Island.
When the boat is operating, which is generally during the summer months. But as an_asker discovered even then sometimes the boat can't run due to inclement weather.

This past winter for the first time in many years the water in Lake Huron and Georgian Bay was frozen solid. It was then possible to walk on water to Flowerpot, assuming you had the clothing and stamina to go several miles each way across blowing snow. (I was there in February but didn't attempt the crossing.)

Image
I used to be a frequent driver back in the days. Then, I got my DW and DS along with me for a ride that started and ended at Detroit. Plan was to circumnavigate (by car, of course) Lake Michigan in a clockwise direction. The first couple of days were pretty good. We drove past Chicago (loved those Indiana sand dunes - along I-90 I believe - though we spent only about an hour there), and spent the night in Green Bay, Wisconsin. It was May, and I had no clue. Next morning, we went up to the Lake to get some pictures and - literally - get our feet wet. Well, we barely - just barely - got to do so. For us Floridians/Indians, the water was SO cold that I can only laugh about it now!! ;-)

Later - or before (I forget which) - the smell of beer being produced as we went by Milwaukee still reeks to this day(I am a teetotaler, by way of explanation). I was a big one for exploring side roads back then - needless to say, it added to the travel time. We did not really have an itinerary except we needed to be back by Day X. Once we got into the Upper Peninsula area, the weather positively turned into a damp squib.It was rainy and foggy for the rest of our time in Michigan. One of the sights we had planned to see was the Painted Seashore by Lake Superior. Well, the mist was so bad/thorough that we saw absolutely NOTHING :oops:

We ended up visiting a small waterfall - Muneesing Falls - and drive back via the Mackinac Bridge. The rest of the drive was pretty uneventful.

TLDR: Missing out on short cruise off Tobermory was not the first time weather in the upper reaches of the continental US (or Canada, in this case) has stymied my plans :oops:
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