Saving on major renovations

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Leemiller
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Saving on major renovations

Post by Leemiller »

We are buying our first home and got a fantastic deal (a couple of hundred thousand below assessed value) but it needs some major renovations. Complete kitchen, at least one new bathroom, redoing the floors, some other issues like some gutters don't drain correctly. I'd love to hear some tips on how to save on these things, but honestly, DYI is probably not going to happen. I'm more looking for tips on where to get great discounts on applicances (because we are planning to sell in a few years I do want tops brands, I just don't want to pay top dollar). We have a trusted family friend who is a realtor and can recommend people to do the work - that said do people bargain with the initial quote? As in, "that is great you can do it for $1,200, any way you can do it for $1,000 and I'll contract with you today." Is that something that is done or tacky?

And since this seems like the right place to ask, the bathrooms are 1950s and in pretty amazing shape (with the exception of the master which is getting gutted & hopefully expanded). I sort of am leaning to refinishing the tubs, and cleaning up the tile, but leaving as is instead of putting a coat of white all over some pretty awesome looking tile & sinks that really look like the ones that are coming back in style.
555
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by 555 »

The best way to save on major renovations is to not do them.
davebarnes
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First things first

Post by davebarnes »

1. Hire an architect. Spend some time (months) thinking, planning before demolition.
2. Ask the architect for general contractor recommendations. Interview and check references. If you can, visit houses the GC has done.
3. Spend some time planning and tweaking.
4. Spec everything. Down to the studs.
5. Now, you can start.

Based upon on excellent experience popping the top 26 years ago.
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investingdad
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by investingdad »

If you want to save on major renovations, figure out what work you can do yourself.

We're in the middle of finishing a portion of our basement, about 800 ft2 of finished area. By opting to do the paint and stain work myself, it reduced my renovation cost by $2700...about 10% of the project cost. The materials are setting me back $400 so it's a net savings of $2300. I've done a lot of painting (two houses) in the past so doing the basement is something I'm quite comfortable with.
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Leemiller
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Re: First things first

Post by Leemiller »

davebarnes wrote:1. Hire an architect. Spend some time (months) thinking, planning before demolition.
2. Ask the architect for general contractor recommendations. Interview and check references. If you can, visit houses the GC has done.
3. Spend some time planning and tweaking.
4. Spec everything. Down to the studs.
5. Now, you can start.

Based upon on excellent experience popping the top 26 years ago.
Thanks. I'm wondering if we need an architect vs a GC. Might be a good idea since we want to move some walls. For the most part, we are keeping the home's existing footprint.
Topic Author
Leemiller
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Leemiller »

investingdad wrote:If you want to save on major renovations, figure out what work you can do yourself.

We're in the middle of finishing a portion of our basement, about 800 ft2 of finished area. By opting to do the paint and stain work myself, it reduced my renovation cost by $2700...about 10% of the project cost. The materials are setting me back $400 so it's a net savings of $2300. I've done a lot of painting (two houses) in the past so doing the basement is something I'm quite comfortable with.
I can't believe how much painting costs. I told my husband that is the one thing we really need to do ourselves. I'm pretty sure we can handle regrouting as needed the bathroom tiles and fixtures - minor stuff there.
DieselEngineer
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by DieselEngineer »

Even if you are not the DIY type, you can probably do the demo and rip out work yourself.
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hand
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by hand »

There are significant savings opportunities related to appliances if you are not wedded to a specific brand / model.
With enough lead time / legwork, floor models, closeouts, and scratch and dent appliances can really provide an opportunity for savings.

I personally have had good luck using online vendors for major appliances as very easy to compare prices / features, though wouldn't suggest for scratch & dent.
WhyNotUs
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by WhyNotUs »

Two things tend to change the budget in a renovation for the worse- change orders and unexpected issues- water damage/structural defects/code compliance.
The third is driven by whether the renovations require a building permit. If so, one needs to work with someone with code knowledge. That can be a well-versed builder or architect.
The electrical and plumbing requirements have changed quite a bit and renos are an opportunity to bring them to code.
Structural defects should have been identified during your inspection, assuming a good inspector but come into play if you expansion of bathroom requires an expansion of footprint.
Water damage is sometimes a little harder to detect until everything has been demoed. It can be simple or complicated to address.

In short, savings on the appliances and trying to get a couple hundred out of the subs may not be the place to put your lever for greatest impact.
A better plan might be removing a toilet and looking at the floor around it, removing a bottom or back panel from the sink base, and crawling around the crawl space or basement (if available) to look for areas of concern would be my first choice.

With the kitchen demo, I would take very careful measurements and then meet with a layout person at the mega home improvement center in your area to get a layout for in-stock cabinets. I would tell them that I am doing a rehab for resale and if the person is experienced they will use that to direct their proposal. Then I would ask then when the next in-stock cabinet sale takes place and I would store them on site based on that schedule, if possible.

The home stores are hard to beat for appliances as they have largely put local appliance stores our of business and often have 12 month no-interest deals going that are great for rehabbers. Habitat Restores will sometimes have signature appliances that came out of a fancy remodel that you can build your other appliances around. A nice stove is the only place that I think you are adding value. Most people do not want a sub-zero energy hog refrig or a 6 burner viking that is impossible to clean and require re-venting your exhaust. A nice stainless LG double oven with 5 burners is about $1300 and makes a nice impression.

Bathrooms are the same, once you tear the existing one out, you need to fix anything that you find and bring it up to code if a building permit is needed. Last one that I did required going down to the studs once I saw some water damage. It turned out to not be bad but sometimes that is not the case. That said, the master needs to be spotless and updated if you are looking for a quick resale. Take a tour of some open houses in the area of homes in the price range that you want at sale and see what the competition looks like. That will help inform your investments.

Once you get a plan, stick to it. Change orders throw the budget out the window. You will learn something new on each project--- use that on the next project not this one. Be a decorator on the house you want to live in not the one that you want to sell for a profit. Good luck
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smackboy1
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Re: First things first

Post by smackboy1 »

Leemiller wrote:Thanks. I'm wondering if we need an architect vs a GC. Might be a good idea since we want to move some walls. For the most part, we are keeping the home's existing footprint.
I feel your pain. We are just starting the process of a major home renovation ourselves. It's our first home remodel but having worked in real estate, I have an idea what to expect. IMHO the most important ingredient to a successful project is time. Measure twice, cut once. Change orders will kill your budget and schedule. Spend the time to think about a wish list, creating a budget, interviewing professionals, reading the contract, going over the design/plans etc.. Also, be realistic, many projects go over time and over budget. An older house may be full of hidden problems. Up to +20% is a good rule of thumb.

Your project involves creating a bathroom and moving walls. You're probably going to need an architect or other design professional. The question is who will hire that person, you or the GC? The traditional model has checks and balances. The owner hires the architect/designer who comes draws the plans. Then the plans are sent out to builders to bid. The chosen builder will build the plans while the architect/designer administers the project to make sure the builder is doing everything according to plan. The downsides are that the owner has to deal with 2 parties; architects may not be good estimators of actual construction costs; conflict between the design and the build. Another option is the design build firm. It's a one stop shop with design and construction together. It's easy dealing with just one company. The downside is there may not be checks and balances and owners may be steered towards designs that are more profitable for the company. There are also in between arrangements e.g. the architect/designer is independent, but a builder is brought into the project earlier as a consultant, pre-bid.

When trying to save $, don't lose track of the forest for the trees. The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten. Be wary of going with the lowest bid (but be careful of the highest bid too). DIY is fine, as long as it doesn't end up costing more to fix mistakes, cause delays, or adversely affect your warranty.

Here are some useful resources:

Creating a realistic budget

http://www.remodeling.hw.net/cost-vs-value/2014/

Avoiding the Con in Construction by Kia Ricchi - this book is excellent. If you've never dealt with contractors and bidding, this is essential reading.

http://thecontractress.com/sections/1-welcome

Understanding the contract

http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/ ... 32271.html

Good luck!
Disclaimer: nothing written here should be taken as legal advice, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
555
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by 555 »

Leemiller wrote:... we are planning to sell in a few years ...
Then you will very little time to "enjoy" your changes, and future buyers most likely will not think your changes are worth the money you paid for them.
Grt2bOutdoors
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

555 wrote:
Leemiller wrote:... we are planning to sell in a few years ...
Then you will very little time to "enjoy" your changes, and future buyers most likely will not think your changes are worth the money you paid for them.
+1 - Don't sink major $$$ into a home that you will not be living in over the next 20 years, you will likely not recoup those dollars.
+ 1 on smackboy1 talking about taking your number + 20%. One thing about opening up old walls, the problems that are hidden are now in full view and correcting them will definitely cost you money - labor being the highest cost.
-1 on demo'ing walls - careful, if you remove a supporting wall you may find your renovation costs skyrocketing, after half your house falls down.
Saw this happen where someone who thought they knew construction cut the main beam holding up the house. :shock: :oops: It cost them beucoup bucks to fix the problem the created, not to mention the heat from the building inspector.
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MathWizard
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by MathWizard »

Habitat for Humanity Restore, though you may not be able to get the top brands.

I find it utterly impossible to get a good deal unless I am flexible.
scubadiver
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Re: First things first

Post by scubadiver »

Leemiller wrote:Thanks. I'm wondering if we need an architect vs a GC. Might be a good idea since we want to move some walls. For the most part, we are keeping the home's existing footprint.
Financially speaking, this sort of renovation is not consistent with wanting to sell in a few years. So, first thing to do is decide whether you're staying or selling. If you decide to stay, I would not go cheap on this sort of renovation. There are DIY jobs, jobs you contract out and jobs you contract out to someone who no kidding knows their stuff. I would start this job by contacting an architect.

After consulting the architect, you should solicit quotes from multiple GCs and pick the one that has the best combination of price and reputation.

Gutters don't drain right? Are they clogged or is it that the downspout deposits water at the foundation and doesn't channel it away from the structure? Either way this is a DIY job, but if you mention it to the GC you select, they'll probably throw it in as a freebee given the scope of what you are proposing.
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DiscoBunny1979
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by DiscoBunny1979 »

It's been my experience that almost no one will like your improvements and will always find something to complain about. For instance, not liking the choice of Granite, having OR not having Stainless Steel Appliances, type of cabinets, having or NOT having 2 sinks in bathrooms, type and color of carpeting, color of walls, are all examples of areas where potential buyers will find something to nag about.

Therefore, if you're going to live in a house for 5 or more years, the improvements should be done for your benefit. Appliances typically need replacement after 8-10 years and therefore sinking money into renovations is for you to enjoy. When the house is put on for sale, they will be older appliances and older upgrades no matter what you do because you have lived in the house and used every square inch. Styles change quickly and people change their minds of what they like as well. What's in today might be out tomorrow. However, old tile always looks old and even if it comes back into style, it's still old tile. If you plan to sell in 2 years, still, putting lower end appliances and finishes can tip off buyers that they will need to 'replace' to their taste and they will offer a price with that in mind.

A good deal of money in a renovation is for labor. Unless you are willing to roll up your sleeves, you probably can't save the type of bucks that would make you happy.

I recently went shopping to replace my Dual Fuel Range in the kitchen. The truth of the matter is that many 'top brand' names, like what I have, Jenn Air for instance, do not offer discounts, may bundle appliances together in a package deal. . .but to dicker with the price tag in some stores means you can't afford it. My new Range cost about $5,000 (with a 'free' dishwasher) . . . and the price was the price set by the Manufacturer, not the dealer. With the model I chose, there are no 'close-outs' or bargain section. Often if you want Top Brand or Top Quality, there's a price to pay. However, if the OP is talking buying a Brand that is recognizable to general public that can be bought at Home Depot, then there is room to deal. They just aren't Professional grade appliances.
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black jack
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by black jack »

As several people have already noted, given that you are planning to move in a few years the best way to save on your proposed renovations is not to do them. You could limit yourself to cosmetic changes (paint (DIY), new light fixtures, etc) that may make a good first impression on prospective buyers and do not require much expert labor.

If you disregard this advice, take an hour or two to read "Make It Right: Expert Advice on Home Renovations" by Mike Holmes (of TV fame); it's probably available at your local library. The chapter on hiring a contractor explains why the idea of bargaining with contractors to get a reduced price is unlikely to be successful, unless you are dealing with the kind of contractors that you don't want to be dealing with - in which case the savings will likely disappear when the guy cannot finish the project for the contracted amount and you either pay more or he walks away, or he cuts so many corners that you have to hire someone else to clean up after him.

If you don't feel like reading the book, this is an excellent summary (except that Holmes doesn't insist on the architect):
davebarnes wrote:1. Hire an architect. Spend some time (months) thinking, planning before demolition.
2. Ask the architect for general contractor recommendations. Interview and check references. If you can, visit houses the GC has done.
3. Spend some time planning and tweaking.
4. Spec everything. Down to the studs.
5. Now, you can start.
When you see a big-bucks estimate for a renovation, it's easy to assume that there are opportunities to save on that cost - and there may be, if you are willing to forgo certain things, or go for cheaper options. But getting your contractor to do you a favor by cutting his take-home pay is not likely to be one of those savings opportunities. When you have everything - EVERYTHING - specced, you will understand where the opportunities for savings lie - and after putting in the time and attention required to get to that point, you will better appreciate whether you really want to do this at all, given the cost and the trade-offs involved.

For deals on appliances, in addition to the scratch and dent stores, you can check the perimeter of your big box home stores; they often have appliances that people have returned. I recently chanced on a deal on a fancy clothes dryer that (a) had been returned and (b) was being replaced by a newer model; I got it for about half off the regular price. But that is not likely to be a time-efficient approach to finding appliances if you have specific models in mind.
We cannot absolutely prove [that they are wrong who say] that we have seen our best days. But so said all who came before us, and with just as much apparent reason. | -T. B. Macaulay (1800-1859)
Sidney
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Sidney »

Some of our most cost-effective remodeling was done right in the middle of the last recession. Prices were fantastic and we had our pick of the contractors. If you can wait on some of this until the next economic crash, you will get better deals.
I always wanted to be a procrastinator.
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Leemiller
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Leemiller »

WhyNotUs wrote:Two things tend to change the budget in a renovation for the worse- change orders and unexpected issues- water damage/structural defects/code compliance.
The third is driven by whether the renovations require a building permit. If so, one needs to work with someone with code knowledge. That can be a well-versed builder or architect.
The electrical and plumbing requirements have changed quite a bit and renos are an opportunity to bring them to code.
Structural defects should have been identified during your inspection, assuming a good inspector but come into play if you expansion of bathroom requires an expansion of footprint.
Water damage is sometimes a little harder to detect until everything has been demoed. It can be simple or complicated to address.

In short, savings on the appliances and trying to get a couple hundred out of the subs may not be the place to put your lever for greatest impact.
A better plan might be removing a toilet and looking at the floor around it, removing a bottom or back panel from the sink base, and crawling around the crawl space or basement (if available) to look for areas of concern would be my first choice.

With the kitchen demo, I would take very careful measurements and then meet with a layout person at the mega home improvement center in your area to get a layout for in-stock cabinets. I would tell them that I am doing a rehab for resale and if the person is experienced they will use that to direct their proposal. Then I would ask then when the next in-stock cabinet sale takes place and I would store them on site based on that schedule, if possible.

The home stores are hard to beat for appliances as they have largely put local appliance stores our of business and often have 12 month no-interest deals going that are great for rehabbers. Habitat Restores will sometimes have signature appliances that came out of a fancy remodel that you can build your other appliances around. A nice stove is the only place that I think you are adding value. Most people do not want a sub-zero energy hog refrig or a 6 burner viking that is impossible to clean and require re-venting your exhaust. A nice stainless LG double oven with 5 burners is about $1300 and makes a nice impression.

Bathrooms are the same, once you tear the existing one out, you need to fix anything that you find and bring it up to code if a building permit is needed. Last one that I did required going down to the studs once I saw some water damage. It turned out to not be bad but sometimes that is not the case. That said, the master needs to be spotless and updated if you are looking for a quick resale. Take a tour of some open houses in the area of homes in the price range that you want at sale and see what the competition looks like. That will help inform your investments.

Once you get a plan, stick to it. Change orders throw the budget out the window. You will learn something new on each project--- use that on the next project not this one. Be a decorator on the house you want to live in not the one that you want to sell for a profit. Good luck
Thanks for the detailed information. What do you think about Ikea cabinets? Great idea to get measurements and go to a store.

So is a Wolf range a bad idea? Our realtor agrees with you that the stove is the only place to really spend $. The house will be in the $1.6 m range so I'm keeping that in mind as well.
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Leemiller
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Leemiller »

Thanks for the tips everyone, especially the items to read.

The house is assessed for several hundred thousand above our contract price and needs some major renovations. It really isn't helpful to get " live with it advice" when we have cash to renovate and the kitchen looks like it does & a couple of other issues, e.g., wood flooring in the master stained with animal urine need to be addressed. I get that some of your are frugal, but come on.

There is a chance we will stay because it was in the price range we were looking in, so we are trying to balance our taste with a reasonable budget & resale value considerations. In our high COL area flips are very common, maybe more so though at the price range just below this.
sls239
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by sls239 »

No comment on the renovations.

But I will say that Black Friday is a good day to go appliance shopping, especially if you are wanting the top-of-the-line for a mainstream brand.
Grt2bOutdoors
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

Leemiller wrote:Thanks for the tips everyone, especially the items to read.

The house is assessed for several hundred thousand above our contract price and needs some major renovations. It really isn't helpful to get " live with it advice" when we have cash to renovate and the kitchen looks like it does & a couple of other issues, e.g., wood flooring in the master stained with animal urine need to be addressed. I get that some of your are frugal, but come on.

There is a chance we will stay because it was in the price range we were looking in, so we are trying to balance our taste with a reasonable budget & resale value considerations. In our high COL area flips are very common, maybe more so though at the price range just below this.
There's your first problem - the house is assessed far higher than the contract price. The first order of business is for you to get the county or town assessor out there to reassess it in it's current condition. No way, would I accept an assessed price several hundred thousand above selling price - the assessor is way off the mark here, I wouldn't undertake any renovation until its reassessed close to the selling price.

Yeah, you have the cash to renovate, but you said "I don't plan on being here more than 5 years". Would you knowingly place your cash at risk with no hope of recovery, let alone appreciation - that is what you will be doing if you sink money into this home and hoping that some other person will take it off your hands for the same or greater price in 5 years.
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DFWinvestor
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by DFWinvestor »

Leemiller wrote:I do want tops brands, I just don't want to pay top dollar
In general you get what you pay for.

I personally would never try to bargain with a contractor after being given an estimate. Just tactfully make them aware you are getting estimates from several people. If they want your business they will give you a fair and competitive offer,particularly if they know they have competition for the contract. I just think it's a bit insulting to them and I also think they are more likely to cut corners if not being paid what they believe their time is worth.
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hand
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by hand »

Having gone through a similar process buying and rehabbing a distressed and over-assessed property, a couple of thoughts:

1) Grt2bOutdoors makes a great point about reassessment - this has the possibility (or likelihood) of reducing taxes immediately, and increasing value if you sell in the future. In my experience, reassessment was as simple as showing sale price to the assessment board. It is hard to argue over the current value of the property with proof of a recent arm's length transaction.

2) For the scope of work you are proposing, it is critical to determine up front if this is for you, or your eventual buyers. If for you, there are many opportunities to make decisions that add long term quality, or reduce up-front costs but that will not impress buyers. If this is for resale, then focus should likely be on return on investment, rather than long term quality.

3) I did a gut renovation to the kitchen using semi-custom cabinets, and self-installed Ikea cabinets in an adjoining breakfast room. Considering cost savings and quality, warranty and of Ikea cabinets, If I had it to do over again to live in, I would absolutely consider Ikea (my spouse wouldn't), however look is more modern and pedestrian than top tier custom cabinets. Buyers of a $1.6M flip would likely be less enamored with Ikea, so I would go a more traditional (and expensive) route.

4) Few buyers would turn up their nose at a Wolf stove, but there may very well be a stove that better meets your needs. (We chose Blue-Star, which we love, but it probably wouldn't be as well known and therefore desirable to buyers)

5) In many cases, saving money during renovation isn't as much about the upfront cost as it is about doing quality work the first time around and preventing costly rework.

6) Ensure you have a significant budget for contingencies!
BillyG
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by BillyG »

This is all good advice -- I agree with Hand about Bluestar is a far better stove for cooking than Wolf, but buyers like those red Wolf handles...

Is there any way to split this renovation into stages, or are you opening all the walls?

Billy
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Leemiller
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Re: First things first

Post by Leemiller »

scubadiver wrote:
Leemiller wrote:Thanks. I'm wondering if we need an architect vs a GC. Might be a good idea since we want to move some walls. For the most part, we are keeping the home's existing footprint.
Financially speaking, this sort of renovation is not consistent with wanting to sell in a few years. So, first thing to do is decide whether you're staying or selling. If you decide to stay, I would not go cheap on this sort of renovation. There are DIY jobs, jobs you contract out and jobs you contract out to someone who no kidding knows their stuff. I would start this job by contacting an architect.

After consulting the architect, you should solicit quotes from multiple GCs and pick the one that has the best combination of price and reputation.

Gutters don't drain right? Are they clogged or is it that the downspout deposits water at the foundation and doesn't channel it away from the structure? Either way this is a DIY job, but if you mention it to the GC you select, they'll probably throw it in as a freebee given the scope of what you are proposing.
We are having the gutters cleaned but the problem is that water is deposited at the foundation. Unfortunately, due to the placement of one gutter it will require ripping up part of the driveway (asphalt on concrete) to be able to bury a hose for the water to drain from out of view.
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Leemiller
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Leemiller »

BillyG wrote:This is all good advice -- I agree with Hand about Bluestar is a far better stove for cooking than Wolf, but buyers like those red Wolf handles...

Is there any way to split this renovation into stages, or are you opening all the walls?

Billy
We will be doing things in stages. Depends also on the quotes we get. I want to keep a good enough cash cushion, so some things may be on the back burner for awhile.
pshonore
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by pshonore »

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:[There's your first problem - the house is assessed far higher than the contract price. The first order of business is for you to get the county or town assessor out there to reassess it in it's current condition. No way, would I accept an assessed price several hundred thousand above selling price - the assessor is way off the mark here, I wouldn't undertake any renovation until its reassessed close to the selling price.
That would depend on local custom and when the house was last assessed. If the last time was back in 2009, then the assessment might be valid. At one time in Connecticut, property was reassessed every ten years. In a rising market your house might be assessed for 25% of its market value if the assessment was 8 or 9 yrs old. But everyone else was in the same boat. In a falling market, just the opposite can happen. If similar houses are assessed for the similar amounts then its all relative
scubadiver
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Re: First things first

Post by scubadiver »

Leemiller wrote:We are having the gutters cleaned but the problem is that water is deposited at the foundation. Unfortunately, due to the placement of one gutter it will require ripping up part of the driveway (asphalt on concrete) to be able to bury a hose for the water to drain from out of view.
Funny, we had the same problem. My solution was not constrained by a "drain from out of view" requirement. We'll probably replace the driveway in 5-8 years and I'll implement a more aesthetic fix at that time. :)
dhodson
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by dhodson »

I'd search the hot deals forum of slickdeals.net for deals on appliances. They come up from time to time. You just don't know when but when they do, you need to be able and willing to jump on the deal before it expires.
555
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Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by 555 »

Leemiller wrote:The house is assessed for several hundred thousand above our contract price and needs some major renovations. It really isn't helpful to get " live with it advice" when we have cash to renovate and the kitchen looks like it does & a couple of other issues, e.g., wood flooring in the master stained with animal urine need to be addressed. I get that some of your are frugal, but come on.
And therefore you need to move walls? :oops:
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Leemiller
Posts: 1357
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 12:42 pm

Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by Leemiller »

555 wrote:
Leemiller wrote:The house is assessed for several hundred thousand above our contract price and needs some major renovations. It really isn't helpful to get " live with it advice" when we have cash to renovate and the kitchen looks like it does & a couple of other issues, e.g., wood flooring in the master stained with animal urine need to be addressed. I get that some of your are frugal, but come on.
And therefore you need to move walls? :oops:
Congratulations you've made two posts that add zero value. Want to aim for three?
555
Posts: 4955
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 6:21 am

Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by 555 »

Leemiller wrote:
555 wrote:
Leemiller wrote:The house is assessed for several hundred thousand above our contract price and needs some major renovations. It really isn't helpful to get " live with it advice" when we have cash to renovate and the kitchen looks like it does & a couple of other issues, e.g., wood flooring in the master stained with animal urine need to be addressed. I get that some of your are frugal, but come on.
And therefore you need to move walls? :oops:
Congratulations you've made two posts that add zero value. Want to aim for three?
Actually my posts are enormously valuable to you, and you should be grateful for them, but even if you don't realize that now, the penny may drop eventually.
WhyNotUs
Posts: 2610
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 11:38 am

Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by WhyNotUs »

Leemiller wrote:
WhyNotUs wrote:
Thanks for the detailed information. What do you think about Ikea cabinets? Great idea to get measurements and go to a store.

So is a Wolf range a bad idea? Our realtor agrees with you that the stove is the only place to really spend $. The house will be in the $1.6 m range so I'm keeping that in mind as well.
I would go with plywood box cabinets with solid wood doors or at least solid wood frames. I think that I could find a better product at Lowes than Ikea. Ready to assemble or stock are the bottom of the market. Start at semi-custom and try to avoid custom for price reasons. I once had a set of cherry cabinets built because I liked them and estimate that I lost 30% of value right away, even with my installation. Semi-custom should get you into plywood boxes and real wood doors. Those will look good to the next buyer and will last.

If you go the mega-home improvement store route, don't get the style that they always sell or the future owner will have seen it many times in other homes. Exception to the rule is modern style, which are pretty generic and you can spend money on custom knobs/pulls if desired. As long as you do not get carried away, a few storage upgrades help with resale- interior slides, lazy susan, baking pan storage divider. Just a couple that support your layout to show you were semi-custom.

A Wolf range can be ok. Is the location already vented for a high-output stove. If not, don't do it as the ventilation requirement is high for those stoves. If it is, I would exhaust my shots at a used one. Where I live, they are available used due to renovations, YMMV. I personally do not like them because I clean my own house. They are not convenient to clean. Just bought a new LG stainless gas range with five burners (including low BTU simmer and high but water boiler), a big oven, self-cleaning, and has a black basin around the burners that takes 60 seconds to clean. It was $900 and looks good. I love to cook and there is nothing that I will not be able to cook with that. Does not have double oven but we are not big bakers, if I was, similar ranges with double oven were available for about ($1,500). Dual fuel is the next step up and that gets you the next increment of pricing. If you have a cleaner and have vent for high output range then go for it if you want. KitchenAid actually makes a great line of pro-ranges but they do not have the cache you might be seeking.

Edit: I have never been in an Ikea store so I am only going off of the products that I have seen in people's homes. Maybe they make/sell better stuff than what I have seen and I am unaware of it.
I own the next hot stock- VTSAX
scubadiver
Posts: 1193
Joined: Sun May 04, 2008 9:48 pm

Re: Saving on major renovations

Post by scubadiver »

Wanting to make some fundamental improvements to the home so that it is more livable is understandable. There's a lot of subjectivity in the word "livable", but I could see taking a liberal interpretation if you have the financial means. That being said, modifications such as moving walls and / or tearing up a driveway to bury some corrugated pipe stretch the concept of making the home livable. If you can afford it, and you seem to be confident that you can, then even that's not a problem. It's just not consistent with someone who is trying to save money on home renovations b/c they are planning to sell in a few years.

My opinion is that you either need to decide whether your staying or selling and make improvements consistent with that decision or accept the fact that you could be putting more money into the home than you'll ever get back. Either way I'm sure you'll be fine.

Scubadiver
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