Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plug"

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atlanta_dad
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Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plug"

Post by atlanta_dad »

When I went for oil change for my 99 camry, dealer recommended this service. I have not confirmed with dealer but I guess they meant repair to the thread.

I usually get these repairs at a local mechanic, he suggested that repairs to thread won't last longer, so better replace the oil pan itself. He estimated 3 hrs of labor. Considering the age of the car, is it worth it. Could someone please suggest.
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stat5
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by stat5 »

I just had an oil leak that they blamed on a previous shop rethreading the plug after tightening it too much. They had to replace the oil pan to fix the issue.
Penguin
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Penguin »

I am not a mechanic. Google "replace oil pan drain plug" and find that you can buy a new plug that is self tapping and much less expensive than a new oil pan.
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armeliusc
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by armeliusc »

This is not uncommon, especially on older car. Threads do wear out. However, if you have a trusted local mechanic, getting it replaced there would likely be less expensive than having it done at the dealership. This is not a major / complicated job so any competent mechanic should be able to do it.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by livesoft »

Since the Camry is one of the most sold cars, getting an oil pan in good condition from a junk yard might be very cheap.
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atlanta_dad
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by atlanta_dad »

This is not uncommon, especially on older car. Threads do wear out. However, if you have a trusted local mechanic, getting it replaced there would likely be less expensive than having it done at the dealership. This is not a major / complicated job so any competent mechanic should be able to do it.
I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
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fire5soon
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by fire5soon »

atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Khanmots »

fire5soon wrote:
atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
I would suspect that it greatly depends on which car.

I know I was surprised at how much of a PITA it was to replace my starter. On my car you either have more than one elbow on your arm or you start pulling your intake manifold and all sorts of other stuff off the front of the engine.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

fire5soon wrote:
atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
It's not that simple, I had my pan replaced on a Honda Civic, it took about 1 1/2 hours using competent mechanics - to get to the pan, first drain the oil, then take out the oil filter, less you want oil dripping all over the floor and you will still have oil dripping on the floor, you have to remove other parts to get the pan out, then you put the gasket in, attach the new or used pan, tighten the bolts, then replace the parts you took out to get to the pan. Be careful if you are getting a new pan from the dealer, it could cost over $300 just for the pan - i'm betting the dealer will want to take you for close to $800 for this kind of job, including a new oil change and filter.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

Khanmots wrote:
fire5soon wrote:
atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
I would suspect that it greatly depends on which car.

I know I was surprised at how much of a PITA it was to replace my starter. On my car you either have more than one elbow on your arm or you start pulling your intake manifold and all sorts of other stuff off the front of the engine.
Changing the pan requires a car to be up on a lift, this is not a let's slide the dolley under the car and try it operation. I agree with you, but the starter is usually located at the bottom of the car behind the engine, the best way to approach a starter job is from under the car on the lift. The alternators are usually the PIA - because they are usually wedged between the side of the motor and the inside wheel well, requires you to loosen the belts, etc., usually you don't have to touch the manifold at least on my car - Civic has mainfold in front of car, not on side, but my old Toyota had the manifold exhaust on the side of motor so I see what you are saying there.
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fire5soon
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by fire5soon »

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
fire5soon wrote:
atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
It's not that simple, I had my pan replaced on a Honda Civic, it took about 1 1/2 hours using competent mechanics - to get to the pan, first drain the oil, then take out the oil filter, less you want oil dripping all over the floor and you will still have oil dripping on the floor, you have to remove other parts to get the pan out, then you put the gasket in, attach the new or used pan, tighten the bolts, then replace the parts you took out to get to the pan. Be careful if you are getting a new pan from the dealer, it could cost over $300 just for the pan - i'm betting the dealer will want to take you for close to $800 for this kind of job, including a new oil change and filter.
That may be the case as every car is different. My experience has been it's a relatively easy repair. Unless there's something I'm totally missing I wouldnt' pay $800 for something like this.

A quick Google search shows new oil pans (not OEM, however) for '99 Camry's can be had for roughly $30-$35 and it comes with a new plug.
http://www.discountbodyparts.com/catalo ... productads
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Grt2bOutdoors »

fire5soon wrote:
Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
fire5soon wrote:
atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
It's not that simple, I had my pan replaced on a Honda Civic, it took about 1 1/2 hours using competent mechanics - to get to the pan, first drain the oil, then take out the oil filter, less you want oil dripping all over the floor and you will still have oil dripping on the floor, you have to remove other parts to get the pan out, then you put the gasket in, attach the new or used pan, tighten the bolts, then replace the parts you took out to get to the pan. Be careful if you are getting a new pan from the dealer, it could cost over $300 just for the pan - i'm betting the dealer will want to take you for close to $800 for this kind of job, including a new oil change and filter.
That may be the case as every car is different. My experience has been it's a relatively easy repair. Unless there's something I'm totally missing I wouldnt' pay $800 for something like this.

A quick Google search shows new oil pans (not OEM, however) for '99 Camry's can be had for roughly $30-$35 and it comes with a new plug.
http://www.discountbodyparts.com/catalo ... productads
Depends on the model of car - my car is a honda, but the oil pan came from it's luxury car division, Acura - a standard oil pan is iron, the Acura pan is machined aluminum, very precise and very costly! My pan cost $315, the standard honda pan cost $50! Reason for the Acura pan was the engine is Acura VTEC engine, not Honda standard engine. Engine and pan go hand in hand.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by cheese_breath »

WOW!! Are there any particular car brands that are more susceptible to this problem that others? I've been driving since 1957 (first car was a '52 Ford), and I've never had this problem. I've gone through cycles of changing the oil myself, oil change shops, and dealer changes. The worst I ever had was a slight drip and it was fixed with a simple gasket on the oil plug.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Jack FFR1846 »

I did a quick search. Looks like an exhaust pipe has to come off to get the oil pan off. For a shade tree mechanic, this is no big deal. If you are paying a mechanic, expect an extra hour IF nothing goes wrong.

Here is what I would do. I'll preface this by saying that I have a lift and also assisted my son removing his 350Z oil pan after he used it as a jacking point.

Put the car on ramps. You can buy plastic ones at any autoparts store relatively cheaply. Get an oil change kit. Autozone was big on pushing these. You get the oil, filter, a drain pan, a funnel and some shop paper towels for like $25. Get under the car and remove the drain plug.

Ok, so now go back in time and order a Fumoto oil valve. I got mine through Amazon for $25. You can google for the correct part number for your car.

The Fumoto screws in place of the oil drain plug. I would coat the threads with an oil pan gasket former (tube of goop) first and use some brake cleaner to really clean the threads as much as possible. Use some of those autozone shop towels. Now you screw in the Fumoto valve. Give it an hour for the sealer to cure. I really doubt that it's needed, but just in case, it won't hurt.

Now, the next time an oil change is needed, you won't even have to remove the plug. You move a lever up and over and the oil drains out. When drained, move it back to close it.

Don't forget to change the filter and fill the car with oil.


******************


By the way.....places like Jiffy Lube use plastic oil pan plugs to replace the ones they cross thread or strip. This isn't an issue with the car, it's the issue with the mechanic. Oil change guys (even at dealers) are typically high school kids who normally do nothing but sweep the garage. Your skill is likely not far from theirs, even if you've never been under a car before.
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atlanta_dad
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by atlanta_dad »

A quick Google search shows new oil pans (not OEM, however) for '99 Camry's can be had for roughly $30-$35 and it comes with a new plug.
http://www.discountbodyparts.com/catalo ... productads
Thanks so much for the link!!

I find similar on Amazon for $55. Problem with online ordering is in returning if it is a mismatch.

Do people suggest local junk yard parts for this? Is there any warranty on junk yard parts?
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by hicabob »

cheese_breath wrote:WOW!! Are there any particular car brands that are more susceptible to this problem that others? I've been driving since 1957 (first car was a '52 Ford), and I've never had this problem. I've gone through cycles of changing the oil myself, oil change shops, and dealer changes. The worst I ever had was a slight drip and it was fixed with a simple gasket on the oil plug.
More likely someone cross-threaded the plug and trashed the threads. Steel threads in a steel pan lubricated with engine oil should last 100's of in/out cycles.
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Ged
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Ged »

armeliusc wrote:This is not uncommon, especially on older car. Threads do wear out. However, if you have a trusted local mechanic, getting it replaced there would likely be less expensive than having it done at the dealership. This is not a major / complicated job so any competent mechanic should be able to do it.
Yes, they are common, mostly because these days the drain pans are aluminum and the plugs are steel. I don't know if it was steel or aluminum in 1999. If you aren't careful with the torque you will need a new drain pan.

Hondas and VWs are particularly susceptible to this because these makes use seal washers that require a relatively high torque spec. Bad design IMHO.

The question is did the mechanic screw up and put too much torque on it? He should be using a torque wrench on these nowadays. Sometimes they get sloppy and skip this step.

You can tell by looking at the plug. If it's overtorque you will see the stripped threads in the bolt thread channels. Ah well I doubt you will get to see that plug.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by surfstar »

I HIGHLY, HIGHLY recommend following the above advice to use a Fumoto valve.

All you have to do is seal it (the threads) good, once, and you're set for the life of the car now. Cheap, simple solution.
Yeti
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Yeti »

On a '99 Camry, I would drill out old threads in the oil pan and re-tap with a slightly larger drain plug. Be sure to run a magnet to gather all shavings. Entire process would probably take ~40 minutes to do yourself and for very minimal cost. No need to replace the whole pan due to threads stripping.

Yeti
boglebob321
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by boglebob321 »

I had this happen to my Odyssey. It was about $300 for a new oil pan installed.

However, I wanted to point out that this changed my way of thinking. I used to take it to the Jiffy Lubes, etc when this happened. The skill level at these places is highly questionable. Now I have my mechanic change the oil. It cost more, but I can justify it based on the repairs needed. I also get a better feeling that it was done correctly, with better filters/oil being used.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Peter Foley »

I had this happen on a car and had the plug replaced with a new self tapping plug. It was a few years ago . . .$50 tops.
SamB
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by SamB »

Threads don't wear out unless they are stressed past their tensile limit to permanently deform. Or, there is a corrosion problem. There is no such thing as cyclic fatigue for oil drain plugs. When you have this issue with an oil plug it means that the person changing the oil did not replace the crush-washer, and repeatedly exceeded the specified torque. In other words new oil pans, heli-coils, whatever, are only necessary because of incompetence and negligence on the part of the person doing the oil change.

The fix is a new oil pan. If you want to take a chance on leakage, go with a re-thread. If the same people change your oil as in the past you will be right back in the same position in one or two oil changes.

I have been changing the oil from day one on my 19-year old Subaru. I spent $150 on a decent torque wrench and believe me there is nothing wrong with the threads in the oil pan. I also use the torque wrench to install the oil filter. Any mechanic, or mechanic wannabe, who does not have the tools to follow the specs for your car should not be working on it, and that includes you.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by sport »

Penguin wrote:I am not a mechanic. Google "replace oil pan drain plug" and find that you can buy a new plug that is self tapping and much less expensive than a new oil pan.
I had this done many years ago. It was not at all expensive. The mechanic just screwed in the replacement plug. It just took a minute or two.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by snowman »

This is just one of many reasons why I change the oil in our cars myself. At this point in time, I think the best solution for you is Fumoto valve, as suggested by other posters. Although, if you don't perform oil change yourself, quick lube places have been known to screw up Fumoto valve as well!

If you are not mechanically inclined, the second best option would be taking your car to a trusted local mechanic, get the oil pan replaced, and continue taking your car to the same place for future oil changes.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by random_walker_77 »

+1 on the Fumoto oil drain valve. My dad has one in his car and swears by it. It's got great reviews on amazon too.

http://www.amazon.com/Fumoto-F-106N-Eng ... lve+fumota

If you do buy it there, be sure to get to amazon by using the bogleheads.org affiliate link...:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/redirect.html? ... ive=390957
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by killjoy2012 »

Replace the oil pan. If you want to be frugal, then DIY. The pan is normally inexpensive (which is part of the problem) and most of the cost is in the labor. It'll take you a couple hours & it's not that hard.

I'm not a fan of those valves - great idea in theory, bad idea in practice in my experiences. Due to the valve body still being in the drain hole while draining, they generally leave more oil in the bottom of the pan than just removing the plug. Flow rate is also lower, reducing the flushing effect. And many OEMs use a magnetic drain plug tip to collect/remove metallic residue - which will no longer be there with the valve on. It also disturbs me a little knowing that I have a valve protruding from the bottom of my oil pan that either could be hit my road debris and/or easily emptied in a parking lot by some smart alec w/o any tools and only needing a few seconds under the vehicle.
Last edited by killjoy2012 on Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Bidwell »

Son's 2002 Camry same deal. Bought a "drain plug washer" and used some tape which fixed it. I'd call the local Toyota Store and ask the parts dept for an over sized self threading drain plug. Then take to another oil place and have them "install ". This problem must affect a million Toyotas. (This fix was mentioned afore here).
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by haban01 »

I would also look at the Oil Pan for Rust from wintery salt conditions. My guess is that someone or many oil change techs over torqued the drain plug. There can't be more than a few threads going into the metal pan which is fairly thin. I would get a number of quotes and replace with the correct OEM pan. If you have never chased threads or re-tapped a hole before you are playing with fire. Considering as you need to take the pan off anyway to guarantee no chips or shavings in oil pan.

Good Luck!
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by iceport »

atlanta_dad wrote:
This is not uncommon, especially on older car. Threads do wear out. However, if you have a trusted local mechanic, getting it replaced there would likely be less expensive than having it done at the dealership. This is not a major / complicated job so any competent mechanic should be able to do it.
I am definitely not doing at dealer.
That is a very wise decision. Dealers expect to have a stable customer base no matter how lousy their service is or how dishonest they become. Unless there's important recall service to have done, they should be avoided by all means necessary.

There's no guarantee an independent garage will be superior, but the odds are far better than the 2.5% chance of finding a dealer that is both competent and honest.

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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by coacher »

Get a 2nd opinion. This was recommended to me by my dealer 4 years ago during an oil change for my Ford Escape. Every mechanic since then has said there is no imminent problem.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by michpocz »

I was a mechanic for years and when a oil drain was stripped I would use a rubber universal plug.
You can check out one of the examples at http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/need ... /5019834-P

There are also many other types, stop by the auto parts store and invest the cash you save....

Mike
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Khanmots »

Grt2bOutdoors wrote:
Khanmots wrote:I know I was surprised at how much of a PITA it was to replace my starter. On my car you either have more than one elbow on your arm or you start pulling your intake manifold and all sorts of other stuff off the front of the engine.
I agree with you, but the starter is usually located at the bottom of the car behind the engine, the best way to approach a starter job is from under the car on the lift. The alternators are usually the PIA - because they are usually wedged between the side of the motor and the inside wheel well, requires you to loosen the belts, etc., usually you don't have to touch the manifold at least on my car - Civic has mainfold in front of car, not on side, but my old Toyota had the manifold exhaust on the side of motor so I see what you are saying there.
'06 Acura RSX-S. Intake manifold is on the front... and the starter is underneath it. You may want to check the location of the starter on your civic, depending on year I wouldn't be surprised if it's in the same location.
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atlanta_dad
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by atlanta_dad »

Any idea, if a drain plug comes with it when I buy a new oil pan? Or do I need to buy it separately?

Thanks.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Bidwell »

michpocz wrote:I was a mechanic for years and when a oil drain was stripped I would use a rubber universal plug.
You can check out one of the examples at http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/need ... /5019834-P

There are also many other types, stop by the auto parts store and invest the cash you save....

Mike

This solution from Mike is brilliant - saves time, big money and effort, yet works.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by whomever »

This is not uncommon, especially on older car. Threads do wear out.
I have to dissent. If you have a 3000 mile oil change interval and you keep the car 300K miles, that's 100 times you remove the drain plug. That is not even close to enough cycles to cause appreciable wear.

Troubles with drain plugs, I submit, are 100% due to over torquing.

One of the very real advantages of doing your own wrenching is that you can religious about using the torque wrench, using anti seize, and so on. That prevents a world of problems.

BTW, this is not intended as bashing mechanics. They are trying to make a living in a competitive business, and unlike less scrupulous financial advisers, I don't see mechanics with yachts - but, as with a commissioned broker advising trades, your mechanic's interest and yours aren't precisely aligned. You have a good reason to take a minute to clean that bolt with a toothbrush, apply antiseize, and carefully torque to the proper spec. He has a good reason to take the gritty old bolt and run it in with the air wrench. If that means the threads need repair in 30K miles, either it will be some other mechanic's problem, or he'll get paid for the repair. I wish there were mechanics who slowed down and did a meticulous job. I would gladly pay the extra cost. Unfortunately, I don't think there is enough of a customer base that there are very many like that (and, again, I can't blame the mechanic - he's selling what his customers want - cheap repairs). I've tried a couple over the years that are well recommended, and always end up doing my own work again ... sigh.

Anyway, if you're a young boglehead wondering how to maximize the saving stream, you might be surprised at the payoff from doing a careful, fussy job of your own basic vehicle maintenance. It's not just the savings on the current job, it's the avoiding unneeded repairs down the road, and thus being able to keep a car running reliably for a long time w/o lots of costly repairs.

OP: I don't over torque my drain plugs, so no experience of repair :-), but I'd sure look into the various repair options not involving a new oil pan. It's a common problem, and Camry's are a common car - I bet there is some easy fix.
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Frugal Al
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Frugal Al »

killjoy2012 wrote:I'm not a fan of those valves - great idea in theory, bad idea in practice in my experiences. Due to the valve body still being in the drain hole while draining, they generally leave more oil in the bottom of the pan than just removing the plug. Flow rate is also lower, reducing the flushing effect. And many OEMs use a magnetic drain plug tip to collect/remove metallic residue - which will no longer be there with the valve on.
While I understand your concerns, they are unfounded in practice. Many oil pans leave quite a bit of oil in the pan--it's not a problem. Nor is a flushing effect or a magnetic drain plug necessary. These would all seem to be conducive to improving engine life, but they are not.

The Fumoto valves have been used for years and I have yet to hear of a problem. Depending on the application, most of these units do not protrude below other critical parts of the engine compartment or suspension, but I suspect there may be a some applications where clearance might be problematic. I will admit that they drain slower, especially if the one with the drain hose is used, so make certain the oil is warm. I also agree that you don't want your enemies to know you use a Fumoto drain valve. Fair disclosure, I've got them on both my vehicles.
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by fandango »

I would not replace the oil pan to solve this problem. Could result in other leaks around the pan and could cost several hundred dollars.

Just replace your drain plug yourself with a "Quikvalve" for about $24.

Solves the problem and gives you an easier way to drain your oil.

http://www.qwikvalve.com/
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atlanta_dad
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Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by atlanta_dad »

Is it a good idea to change the transmission oil pan also(if there is a problem with it) besides replacing the oil pan, if they are located close by, so that I can save on labor?

Thanks
NHRATA01
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Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:57 pm
Location: New York City area

Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by NHRATA01 »

Yeti wrote:On a '99 Camry, I would drill out old threads in the oil pan and re-tap with a slightly larger drain plug. Be sure to run a magnet to gather all shavings. Entire process would probably take ~40 minutes to do yourself and for very minimal cost. No need to replace the whole pan due to threads stripping.

Yeti
This.

I would get a second opinion from a trusted mechanic. You do not need to replace a whole oil pan because of worn plug threads. The threads can probably be chased easily enough and should be good as new. If not, as mentioned above simply drilling and tapping to a larger bolt size is quick and easy enough on a 15 year old car.

Never seen the bottom of a '99 Camry close enough, but often changing an oil pan is not a simply job on newer cars. Usually the motor has to be raised or shifted, and it's not uncommon for other things to be in the way - steering rack, exhaust plumbing, suspension parts, etc.
NHRATA01
Posts: 654
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:57 pm
Location: New York City area

Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by NHRATA01 »

Khanmots wrote:
fire5soon wrote:
atlanta_dad wrote:I am definitely not doing at dealer.

Is 3 hr labor reasonable?

Thanks
I'm just a shadetree mechanic, but you could replace the entire oil pan in only 30 minutes.
I would suspect that it greatly depends on which car.

I know I was surprised at how much of a PITA it was to replace my starter. On my car you either have more than one elbow on your arm or you start pulling your intake manifold and all sorts of other stuff off the front of the engine.
Heh, don't ever work on a Northstar V8. The starter is in the vee underneath the intake manifold. At least it stays dry - the engineer who designed it must have thought.
Ricola
Posts: 966
Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:38 am

Re: Auto repair - "Threads getting thin in oil pan drain plu

Post by Ricola »

I use Fumoto valves on all of my cars and install them as soon as I get a car. I have a car that is over 20 years old, still be driven with the original Fumoto value, never had a problem. :)

http://www.fumotousa.com/
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