Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

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3504PIR
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Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by 3504PIR »

Looking for suggestions on a tractor for my 12 acre horse farm. All 12 acres in pasture less a 1/2 acre yard. Terrain is moderately rolling.

Priority use -in order- will be cutting the pastures, road maint., gardening (planning 1/4 acre) and possibly hay production. If I want to bale hay, that will possibly add a lot of hp requirements and additional costs of equipment.

Local dealers: Kubota (3 miles), Massey Fergeson (19 miles) and New Holland (40 miles). MF seems to have the most robust hp in compact/small utility tractors. Kubota have good reputations, but seem to have gaps in pto hp from about 25-32 pto then jumping up to 55+.

Pretty confident baling hay won't be cost effective - but want to keep it as a possiblility when considering this tractor (the farm is how I'll spend a good part of my time the next 20+ years as I head into early retirement).

Any bogleheads hobby/horse farmers with insight?
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craigr
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by craigr »

My experience is this: Buy a Kubota diesel compact tractor. A BX series with their max horse power option will do all you need. Don't buy a gas tractor. They not only use a lot more fuel, but do not have the low end torque of the diesel that is most used for a farm tractor. The Kubota is also extremely reliable. Buying a tractor that is too big can also be a drawback on a small property. It's harder to maneuver, garage, mount attachments, etc. A compact 25HP diesel is much more powerful than you may think and can handle a small farm with no problems.

Also get the front end loader option as you will use it much more than you think. It's also a lot cheaper than a back operation from lifting heavy things all the time. A box scraper will allow you to maintain driveways and will also be a good counter weight for the loader when attached. The BX can also run a brush hog without problems. As for bailing, honestly you would be better hiring someone that has he right equipment to do it. It will be cheaper and far less hassle. You can buy a tiller for the Kubota that can do any garden you're likely to grow as well.
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walkabout
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by walkabout »

Not a tractor recommendation, but something to consider as you research tractors...

Backup generators come up pretty frequently here on BH. For a farm, you might consider a tractor driven (via PTO) generator like this:

http://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.com ... p1183.html

I can't comment on the effectiveness or quality of such a generator vs a conventional portable generator or built-in generator, but you could certainly look into it. If you do some research and deem that such a generator would be worthwhile, you should consider if the tractors you are considering have adequate PTO to power the generator.

Again, I can't say if it is a good idea or not, but you might as well look into it as you are researching tractors.
YttriumNitrate
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by YttriumNitrate »

It might not be enough tractor for a 12 acre farm, but at my 5 acre hobby orchard I use a walk behind Grillo tractor. Some of the trees are at 10 foot spacings, and the smaller tractor is better at getting into those tight spaces. The orchard is more than "moderately rolling" so another benefit of the walk behind is that if you roll the tractor the damage will most likely be limited to the tractor and not you.

EDIT: As pshonore pointed out, Gravely also made walk behind tractors. Unfortunately, they are no longer made and most of the tractors you see coming up for sale are 20+ years old. That being said, you can find a ton of implements for them on Craigslist at really good prices.
Last edited by YttriumNitrate on Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mick
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Mick »

I second the Kubota B series with a front end loader. I had the Kubota L3710 which is much bigger but also had 55 acres of trees to cut for firewood/clear from lane, etc. I also cut extensive areas of brush with a larger brush hog and scooped a lot of gravel from a creek. 10 years of setting outside with minimal maintenance and still ran great. Still on the original battery but had to jump it if it set more than a couple of months. The loader is so handy for everything. Throw a rake and shovel in it and drive down the road to clear culverts. Park so the bucket is right near the culvert to throw twigs and leaves in. I constantly found uses for the loader.

As far as hay, forget it. Just consider the cost of the baling addons (not even looking at the tractor itself) and the payback period would probably be forever.
l2ridehd
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by l2ridehd »

Third vote for Kubota. I have a B-7610 26 HP diesel tractor 4 X 4 and it far exceeds my expectations. I have a mower deck, 3 point hitch plow, a front end loader, bush hog and can borrow a friends back hoe if needed. It is plenty powerful to do every thing you asked. It will pull a hay baler with no problem. My brother has a ford tractor a couple sizes up from this and the Kubota can do more. Love the Hydrostatic drive, power steering, the ease of use and the reliability. I have a large wooded lot that I used the bush hog to clear out the undergrowth between the trees. I use the BH every third year and the mower deck with mulching blades in between. My biggest regret is not having a front end loader years ago. I would have a much better back today. I never lift anything heavy any more. Just fire up the Kubota and use it. I can haul it easily on my two wheel 6 X 10 landscape trailer where my brother needs a 4 wheel equipment trailer to move his.

He borrows mine once in while because it is so much easier to move and swears his next one will be the Kubota. The only advantage his has is the front end loader will pick up more dead weight. Mine is rated at 700 pounds and his at 1200. Mine will do a bit better then 700 and his wont do the 1200. So actual difference is about 800 to 1100. I can out pull, out mow, out work his in almost all other areas. Even plowing new ground, mine seems to work better.
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Jay69
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Jay69 »

Another vote for a Kubota. Not sure if I read what side of the county your are in but a snow blower with a cab would be nice depending on your snow needs!
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pshonore
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by pshonore »

I'll vote for Kubota (or similar compact brand) as well. There are quite a few used ones for sale (Craig's list, etc) although if you're new to tractors you may want to look for good used ones at dealers. One note of caution - read everything you can about tractor safety and follow it. They can be quite dangerous at times particularly if you have "rolling terrain" like OP stated. Try to get one with a roll bar and if you do, be sure to wear the seat belt. The bar will not protect you unless you do. And no roll bar equals no seat belt. Be very careful on a slope. Also be careful of any rotating PTO shafts and keep kids and spectators a safe distance away when operating. No riders at any time. But if you follow safe practices, they can be quite enjoyable and are good time savers (but also money pits). DAMHIKT.

I have a ancient Kubota B8200 but proabably use my Gravely 5665 walkbehind more frequently. Gravelys are tough and last forever.
Slick8503
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Slick8503 »

Go try all different colors. ASFAIK all the big "American" Brands (Deere, Massey, CIH, NH) utility size tractors are made in Europe. With 12 acres making your own hay will never pencil out. I'm not saying don't do it, because there are other things to consider besides absolute cost, but if cost savings is the main driver, it will never work.
jlawrence01
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by jlawrence01 »

3504PIR wrote:Local dealers: Kubota (3 miles), Massey Fergeson (19 miles) and New Holland (40 miles). MF seems to have the most robust hp in compact/small utility tractors. Kubota have good reputations, but seem to have gaps in pto hp from about 25-32 pto then jumping up to 55+.

Personally, I come from a John Deere family but that is another topic.

I would make ONE comment. Tractors are not the most stable vehicles there are. Please buy one with a roll bar and seat belts and use the seat belts provided.

Tractor rollovers are a MAJOR reason why farming is one of the more dangerous professions in the US.

Stepping off soap box ...
rckymtnwst
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by rckymtnwst »

Slick8503 wrote:Go try all different colors. ASFAIK all the big "American" Brands (Deere, Massey, CIH, NH) utility size tractors are made in Europe. With 12 acres making your own hay will never pencil out. I'm not saying don't do it, because there are other things to consider besides absolute cost, but if cost savings is the main driver, it will never work.

What is the break-even point on making hay? I would think that it's not an absolute acreage question, but rather depends on the yield and number of annual cuttings that you can do, right?
Atilla
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Atilla »

My dad has about 25 acres and he uses a '39 Allis Chalmers. First year for standard electric start. :D
nodenuff2
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by nodenuff2 »

First let me say I have owned John Deere tractors for over 40 years. If you are not going to buy a Deere then go with the Kubota because the dealership is close at hand. While dependable tractors do break on occasion. Having parts close by is handy when you are working. Buy a 25-32 horse power tractor. Buy one with a front end loader and 4 wheel drive. Hydrostatic transission make handling much easier. Best deals come in a package with 0% finaincing for 5-6 years. Baling hay question is not possible on 12 acres. You can not produce emough to make it feasible. Even if you buy used equipment the investment would be 15-20k besides the tractor. To run a hay mower you need at least a 50 hp tractor then it wouild be a small one . The 30hp tractor could pull the rake but to bale you need at least a 60-70 hp tractor. Buy your horse hay from a produceer during the summer and store it until you need it. Good luck I have had horses 40 years also. You love them but they break your heart sometimes.
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Topic Author
3504PIR
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by 3504PIR »

nodenuff2 wrote:First let me say I have owned John Deere tractors for over 40 years. If you are not going to buy a Deere then go with the Kubota because the dealership is close at hand. While dependable tractors do break on occasion. Having parts close by is handy when you are working. Buy a 25-32 horse power tractor. Buy one with a front end loader and 4 wheel drive. Hydrostatic transission make handling much easier. Best deals come in a package with 0% finaincing for 5-6 years. Baling hay question is not possible on 12 acres. You can not produce emough to make it feasible. Even if you buy used equipment the investment would be 15-20k besides the tractor. To run a hay mower you need at least a 50 hp tractor then it wouild be a small one . The 30hp tractor could pull the rake but to bale you need at least a 60-70 hp tractor. Buy your horse hay from a produceer during the summer and store it until you need it. Good luck I have had horses 40 years also. You love them but they break your heart sometimes.
Thanks - my big question in my head was picking up some older haying equipment with lower pto requirements - but significantly higher maintenance issues. Probably a bridge too far. I'll look into what other options I have for buying hay or getting someone out to cut/rake and bale.
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3504PIR
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by 3504PIR »

Very happy to hear all the positive comments about Kubota. Completely agree with the comments about diesel and 4x4 - as well as the recommendations for attachments. Got to save my back :wink: .

I also agree with the posters commenting about safety. I couldn't agree more and would not want to cut my time short on our farm during retirement due to me doing something stupid.

Thanks for all the detailed comments. All of them are extremely helpful and I appreciate all of you taking the time to write them out.
wageoghe wrote:Not a tractor recommendation, but something to consider as you research tractors...

Backup generators come up pretty frequently here on BH. For a farm, you might consider a tractor driven (via PTO) generator like this:

http://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.com ... p1183.html

I can't comment on the effectiveness or quality of such a generator vs a conventional portable generator or built-in generator, but you could certainly look into it. If you do some research and deem that such a generator would be worthwhile, you should consider if the tractors you are considering have adequate PTO to power the generator.

Again, I can't say if it is a good idea or not, but you might as well look into it as you are researching tractors.
Very interesting, I'll check that out.

Thanks again, really appreciate everyone's comments.
Random Poster
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Random Poster »

nodenuff2 wrote:The 30hp tractor could pull the rake but to bale you need at least a 60-70 hp tractor.
:confused

A John Deere 328 (and a 338 and 348) hay baler requires a minimum of 25 pto hp.

Round balers would require more horsepower,* but I think that stating a tractor needs a minimum of 60-hp isn't quite accurate.

* Although even a JD 448 baler only requires a 45-hp PTO
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prudent
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by prudent »

I know nothing about farming or tractors, but our local news reports 3 or 4 tractor rollover deaths every year. And the victims are always experienced, so the danger must be greater than people believe it to be.
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Bengineer
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Bengineer »

My mom & dad faced a similar choice back when. We had a little under 20 acres with about 5 or so in hay. As you've possibly found, getting someone with equipment to come do your hay is difficult for a small acreage. When the time comes, they're all off cutting, raking, baling and getting up their own hay. My folks made the decision to go with a Diesel MF 35hp, which would run a small "square" baler. The MF was way more powerful than the gas Ford 8N (~13hp) it replaced. It would bushhog pretty much anything you could run over.

If I had been making the purchase decision, I'd have chosen smaller 4wd with a loader and negotiated something with the nearest aimiable guy that baled regularly.

Square balers are complex beasts with lots of moving parts and adjustments. An older one is a headache to keep running and making properly compacted and tied bales. Same thing for sicklebar mowers.

As recommended a few times, a front-end loader and box blade are invaluable around a farm. You'll be mowing, mucking out stalls, fencing, and doing drainage grading on a regular basis. The loader for moving materials and equipment and the blade for shaping land. My folks used "son-power", rather than hydraulics for a lot of this, which works if you've got a few of them around.

A final thought - what's the most popular brand around you? Might make it easier to get a mechanic to come out and to buy used implements.
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frugaltype
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by frugaltype »

I thought there was a pretty severe hay shortage in the last year or two, due to drought if I remember correctly. Maybe not in your area.
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BTDT
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by BTDT »

I really enjoy my Kubota Grand L4240 with front end loader, air conditioned cab, and hydrostatic drive (HST+). From a profit/loss standpoint its probably a significant waste of money, especially given I spend more time helping others than helping myself. But you know, life is short and I find myself always looking for an excuse to get out and use 'my tractor'. :oops:
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Bonnan
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Bonnan »

We have 3 tractors on 141 acres (~50 tillable) the 35hp New Holland compact with loader/backhoe has been very good. Chances are any of those that you mention will be satisfactory. Distances to the dealer is one factor but the atitude of the dealer towards your needs is another. Tractors are relaxing and stress relieving. Safe on flat ground but extremely dangerous around ditches,creek banks and improper hitching. Take care and have fun.
wingnutty
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by wingnutty »

I don't have a lot to add in the tractor dept., but I would strongly suggest just buying hay vs purchasing additional heavy metal to put up hay. You'd need much more than 12 acres to be able to financially justify purchasing machinery.
heyyou
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by heyyou »

Another vote for a Kubota, new or not new (if well maintained), with 4WD, hydrostatic, front loader, and box blade to counterbalance the loader.

Consider occasionally renting a tractor with a backhoe (Home Depot does that here), instead of owning the 'hoe attachment. That is less about the money and more to avoid the hassle of mounting, then needing to soon remove that heavy, unwieldy implement. I used the 'hoe often in the early years, then less as my focus changed from improving, to maintaining the property.

In my neighborhood, the horse owners couldn't afford to retire early, but correlation might not be causation.
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3504PIR
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by 3504PIR »

Bengineer wrote:My mom & dad faced a similar choice back when. We had a little under 20 acres with about 5 or so in hay. As you've possibly found, getting someone with equipment to come do your hay is difficult for a small acreage. When the time comes, they're all off cutting, raking, baling and getting up their own hay. My folks made the decision to go with a Diesel MF 35hp, which would run a small "square" baler. The MF was way more powerful than the gas Ford 8N (~13hp) it replaced. It would bushhog pretty much anything you could run over.

Square balers are complex beasts with lots of moving parts and adjustments. An older one is a headache to keep running and making properly compacted and tied bales. Same thing for sicklebar mowers.

As recommended a few times, a front-end loader and box blade are invaluable around a farm. You'll be mowing, mucking out stalls, fencing, and doing drainage grading on a regular basis. The loader for moving materials and equipment and the blade for shaping land. My folks used "son-power", rather than hydraulics for a lot of this, which works if you've got a few of them around.

A final thought - what's the most popular brand around you? Might make it easier to get a mechanic to come out and to buy used implements.
Good advice, thanks. The most popular brands are Kubota, MF and John Deere in that order from what I can tell. Neighbor currently renting our pastures has a Kubota B2620 4x4, which I used extensively this past summer. Among other tasks, I cut all the pastures last summer (for the first time) and it struggled in a few spots. They have 5 acres and bought the tractor for their needs rather than mine although use the tractor mostly on my land where they keep their horses. They have found the 2620 lacking on my land as well. The thing about the 2620 is that it is really a great size on the 12 acres - especially when working around the fencing and through the gates, etc (pastures are divided into 4 similar sized paddocks w/ 4 board fencing all around).

they seemed happy with the Kubota dealership, but I'll need to ask around some more.
jvclark02 wrote:I really enjoy my Kubota Grand L4240 with front end loader, air conditioned cab, and hydrostatic drive (HST+). From a profit/loss standpoint its probably a significant waste of money, especially given I spend more time helping others than helping myself. But you know, life is short and I find myself always looking for an excuse to get out and use 'my tractor'. :oops:
Haha, yep, thats sort of where I'm at. While I don't want to be pouring money stupidly into endless projects and equipment, I can afford something beyond whatever "return" I may get out of it.
Last edited by 3504PIR on Tue Nov 19, 2013 2:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
Topic Author
3504PIR
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by 3504PIR »

Bonnan wrote:We have 3 tractors on 141 acres (~50 tillable) the 35hp New Holland compact with loader/backhoe has been very good. Chances are any of those that you mention will be satisfactory. Distances to the dealer is one factor but the atitude of the dealer towards your needs is another. Tractors are relaxing and stress relieving. Safe on flat ground but extremely dangerous around ditches,creek banks and improper hitching. Take care and have fun.
Thanks for the comment on the New Holland, I will travel down to visit the dealer I mentioned regardless.

I feel much the same about tractors. Very peaceful.
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Runaway
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by Runaway »

Dealer support and distance was the deciding factor for me. Unless your also buying a trailer, someone to come out and do repairs when it's out of your comfort zone may be a factor. It's the attachments that make the tractor, the more the better. Go and visit mytractorforum.com
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3504PIR
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by 3504PIR »

Thanks, will check out mytractorforum.com.
pshonore
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by pshonore »

Also check out http://tractorbynet.com/ - probably the biggest
nodenuff2
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Re: Tractor for my 12 Acre Horse Farm

Post by nodenuff2 »

Random poster while a 40 hp tractor might be capable of pulling a small square baler it is very uncomfortable for the person ooperating the tractor. As the baler forces the hay into the chmber and the fly wheel comes around on a small tractor you get a strong jolt. We bale with the biggest tractor with a/c everyone wants to bale no one wants to rake.
2014 No. 42 2015 No.342 2016 No. 6 2017 238 2018 no. 175 2019 no. 144 6 year average 157.83. Proves I am just an average investor.What do I know? "Good bless America land that I love..."
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