Knives set recommendations

[newkidontheblock]

We are looking for new knives set for our kitchen.
I have narrowed down the choices to
J a heckles 7 piece twins professional set
http://www.amazon.com/Zwilling-J-A-Henc ... roduct_top

And
Width of 12 piece set

http://www.amazon.com/Wusthof-Gourmet-1 ... +knife+set


Consumer reports gives top ratings to these two sets.


Let me know if you have any experience with either of these.

Thanks

[ObliviousInvestor]

I would recommend fewer knives and going for the more high end lines of either brand. For Wusthuf, that would be their "Classic" line. For example, a single 8" chef knife can do the majority of the work in your kitchen. Add a paring knife and you're pretty much set. Those two knives, properly cared for, should last for decades.

[centrifuge41]

3 days too late on a killer deal (no pun)
http://slickdeals.net/f/5322334-Chicago ... 50-shipped

Set up a deal alert on Slickdeals for some nice forged block sets.

[sscritic]

Agree with Oblivious. The knife I use the most is a Gerber French chef knife given to me and my wife as a wedding present in 1970. I had it sharpened in 2010 by Ross Cutlery; it was $1 an inch, and I paid $15 for the 8" on the chef knife and the 7" on the companion Durendal boning blade. I know they did a good job because I cut myself three times in the next month. Ouch!

[grogs4dogs]

While knife sets are a popular way to sell lots of knives, you likely don't need more than three: http://terrygruggen.blogspot.com/2011/0 ... nives.html

[Sidney]

While knife sets are a popular way to sell lots of knives, you likely don't need more than three: http://terrygruggen.blogspot.com/2011/0 ... nives.html

This is similar to what I use. My middle knife is more traditional but the same idea. I have two of the small ones -- sometimes there are two of us working on veggies or whatever and it is handy to have a second small utility knife.

[jidina80]

While I agree with those suggesting buying fewer, but higher quality, knives, you might need more than two or three. If you cut breads you will want a knife with a serrated edge. If you fillet fish or debone meats, you'll find a good fillet knife worth the money.

A sharpening stone is well-worth keeping in the kitchen. Sharp knives are a joy to use!

[mike143]

Some of the top rated knives on Amazon.com are inexpensive: Top Rated Chef Knives on Amazon.com

I like my Cutco demo set that I have had for 10 years now. All of them are the except one are the Double-D ("serrated") type. I sharpen the one straight edge and the Double-D ones can use a sharpening but they are still safe and usable. I use them everyday. Still meaning to mail them in for sharpening but then I would be without them for a short duration.

[minesweep]

Here's a previous Boglehead discussion on knife sets:

Best knife set at reasonable price

Mike

[Lollytiger]

I'm more or less repeating what everyone else is already saying, but don't get a knife set. Get 1-2 knives and then add other knives only as you actually feel the need for them. The main knife you need is a chef's knife. This will probably be 8 inches although the pros use bigger knives. You could probably use this for everything but it's also useful to have a paring knife. For example, the following two knives are basically the cheapest "good" knives, which I used for about two years and was pretty happy with even though I never sharpened them (that doesn't mean they don't need to be sharpened, that means it didn't bother me that they were dull):

http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Swiss- ... pd_sim_k_1
http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-4-Inch ... pd_sim_k_3

Later I bought more expensive knives (two MAC Pros), but this was more due to having too much money rather than any actual need to upgrade. I did feel that I needed to sharpen them but the angles are different between Western and Japanese knives and so a sharpener that works on one doesn't work on the other (unless you use free-hand stones) and I thought, why buy a sharpener that is incompatible with a future upgrade instead of just doing the future upgrade. I don't think it was worth it, but unfortunately after you've used a knife for a while you can't return them. Another thing to keep in mind is that assuming your knives are not absolutely horrible they are not going to be the limiting factor in your cooking. Even really crappy knives like the ones my parents have don't really decrease the quality of your food, they just make the preparation frustrating and slow.

Also keep in mind that it makes no sense to worry about the sharpness of different knives if you're not going to actually sharpen them. Unfortunately I have no real knowledge or experience on knife sharpening so I can't give meaningful advice.

[interplanetjanet]

While I agree with those suggesting buying fewer, but higher quality, knives, you might need more than two or three. If you cut breads you will want a knife with a serrated edge. If you fillet fish or debone meats, you'll find a good fillet knife worth the money.

That's very true. Thankfully, good serrated bread knives can be found on the cheap. Our boning knife is carbon steel and takes and holds an edge like nobodys business, but it will rust if left to sit in air while wet.

I would add a cleaver to this list as well. Very handy for dismembering large cuts of meat and dealing with crab and lobster shells. Oh, and opening coconuts (with the back of the blade), nothing opens one faster than a cleaver - takes all of 5 seconds if you do it right.

I'll agree with some other posters that knife "sets" are really a bit silly much of the time, you are much better off buying good examples of what you need. Oh, and good knives should never go in the dishwasher, hand wash them, wipe them off and let them air dry. If they're carbon steel, wash, wipe and oil.

[englishgirl]

Finally, being a gluten-free vegetarian has its advantages. I basically use 1 6" Shun utility knife for everything. Yay me.

I do own more than one knife, and occasionally a bigger knife comes in useful for chopping a head of cabbage, or a small paring knife will come in handy for more delicate work. So, yeah, ideally, I'd have 3 knives, but not the same 3 that everyone else has. And, yes, 'tis true, I don't have a great way to get into coconuts. But then, I'm too darn scared to wield a cleaver anyway. I'd probably chop my fingers off.

Sets are really not necessary.

Edit: I do recommend going and playing with knives before you buy them. I picked one type of knife based on what I read, but when I went into the fancy kitchen goods store to get the feel of the handles, I didn't like them as much, whereas the handle on a different knife line felt like it was actually made for my hand.

[interplanetjanet]

Finally, being a gluten-free vegetarian has its advantages. I basically use 1 6" Shun utility knife for everything. Yay me.

That definitely simplifies things some. I was a veg for about a decade and there are definitely some different needs in the kitchen - but I found that dealing with large melons, squash and the like still required either a chef's knife or Chinese-style cleaver to work with comfortably. This might be less of an issue if you're feeding fewer people (I have three hungry teens to deal with).

One other surprising use for a Chinese cleaver I've run into is with dealing with large, firm cheeses. There's no way I could get the rind off of a quarter-wheel of Manchego as quickly without one, for example - the Costco near me regularly carries a lovely raw sheeps milk Spanish DOP version that has all but replaced cheddar in my world, but the quarter-rounds need to be broken down some to be convenient to use.

Edit: I do recommend going and playing with knives before you buy them. I picked one type of knife based on what I read, but when I went into the fancy kitchen goods store to get the feel of the handles, I didn't like them as much, whereas the handle on a different knife line felt like it was actually made for my hand.

Agreed, absolutely, it's very important to find something that feels good and fits well to the hand.

-janet

[Spades]

We are looking for new knives set for our kitchen.
I have narrowed down the choices to
J a heckles 7 piece twins professional set
http://www.amazon.com/Zwilling-J-A-Henc ... roduct_top

I've used that Henckel set for almost 6 years. They are extremely durable if you follow the instructions for caring for them. I use the santoku for almost everything. You can break through bone if you really want to, but if you know how to cut at the joints you'll be good and save the blades. The serrated knives are great. The handles are smooth, but you won't have any issue with grip.

[DualIncomeNoDebt]

I have portions of the second set you are considering, the Wusthof knives. I say get them. That is a good price and the knives are excellent. Also, don't overlook the block, the Wusthof block is one of the best out there. I am something of an amateur chef, I do the cooking in the house, and can recommend them without reservation. I also have a Henckel's chef knife and four Henckel steak knives, they also are very good, but the Wusthof are a little better due to superior handle, construction and design. Pro-tip: when you put your steak knives in the block, the sharp edge should be pointed UP. You don't slip the knife into the block with the knife edge pointing down with the sharp edge contacting the wood all the way in -- this is stupid because it dulls the knife. Entire point of the wood block is to put the knife blades facing UP so that nothing is touching or scraping them -- this also is why for the big blades, the slits are on their side, so that the knife edge isn't striking wood. Whenever I see people putting their knives in the block with the blade facing down into the wood, I know it's amateur hour.

I also think any of the recommendations you've received will be good.

Another critical recommendation for you: get a Chef's Choice three-stage electric sharpener. They are pricey, but they sharpen knives extremely well, especially if you don't know how to use a whetstone. Nearly every other sharpener on the market is garbage, and many will ruin your knives, especially those metal "wheel" sharpeners, those are the worst. But not the Chef's Choice -- professional kitchens use the Chef's Choice sharpeners (or they send them out to a service). Again, it's pricey, but it will last you many years. It will put a fine edge on any knife set you purchase. In fact I'd say getting a good sharpener may be more important than the knives, because even the most expensive knife is worthless without a proper cutting edge.

So if you are a serious cook, get the Wusthof and get the Chef's Choice sharpener. Knives are the single most important tool in the kitchen, and a razor-sharp knife is a safe knife.

I find we prepare great gourmet meals at home because our tools make the job easy, and it all starts with a proper set of sharp knives. We don't need food processors or other gizmos, we just reach for our trusty sharp knives. This also has saved us a lot of money versus going out to eat, we avoid paying exorbitant drink prices and tips, which just bleed money. And what we make at home often is better than restaurant meals (farmer's market vegetables plus prime cuts usually destroy most restaurant offerings at a fraction of the cost).

[legio XX]

Mine are Henckel. I didn't buy them as a set, but pretty much have one and stash them in a knife block instead of the drawer. It keeps them handy and people think I'm a much better cook than I am. As for what to get first, I pretty much go with the crowd. Mid-size chef, two parers, boner, occasionally use the cleaver, seldom use the larger chefs, regularly use the sharpening steel. That also makes people think I'm more of a cook than I am.

Good grief! The oldest ones are approaching the 40-year mark!

Vic

[hand]

I'm also a fan of the fewer knives of high quality approach...

Check out the "JCK Special Set "First Japanese Knife Set"" http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/JCKSpecialKnifeSet.html

The website is a bit creaky, but I'm a huge fan of the seller and the quality and selection. Disclaimer, I have not used the specific knifes in the bundle, but they are from a well recognized brand.

[JTJjr]

We have 3 MAC knives that we bought in 1967. The 4 inch paring knife. The 6 3/4 inch utility knife. And, the 9 inch carving knife. They all sharpen on the back of a china plate. I have been giving these knives as wedding presents for years. All three will cost less than $150 and they will last a lifetime. They are simply perfect. Can be purchased on-line. Peace JTJjr

[marie17]

As a few others mentioned, you really only need a paring knife and a chef's knife. I have global knives, and really like them. They are from Japan.

[Feb29]

Find out if any cooking schools near you offer a knife skills class. Wusthof offers a hands-on 2 hour class where you will learn about knife types, cutting techniques, knife care, and sharpening. The cost was $55, but at the end we all received a $40 Wusthof Classic paring knife. The class was really practical and I now use my 8" chefs knife about 90% of the time.

[JupiterJones]

I agree that it's better to buy knives "a la carte" rather than in a set.

And I'll add that, if you cook with someone else, it might even be worth getting duplicates of certain knives. Often, my wife and I will be doing prep work at the same time, and having two chef's knives and multiple paring knives is quite handy.

JJ

[HongKonger]

Henkels all the way. Buy only those you need. I have 2 x paring, 1 serrated and a Chefs knife. Has done everything I need as a veggie for the last 10 years plus.

[Bengineer]

I'll chime in. I do most of our cooking and am into tools of all sorts.

Agreed, buy a la carte, beginning with an 8" cook's / chef's knife, a paring knife, a 6-8" utility knife and extend with a bread, filet, parers, smaller and larger versions of the cook's and a cleaver. That way you'll get the perfect knife for each job you do.

See how the handle of the knife feels in your hand and how it balances as you use it. If you and your partner both cook, what fits one's might not the other's, so dupes of the most commonly used ones might be in order.

You can spend lots on really good knives, or not so much for perfectly adequate ones, perhaps at a restaurant supply. I own several Forschner knives, one of the brands mentioned above. They're not of the quality of steel found in a Mac, Wusthof or high-end Henckels, but they are pretty good and will get the prep work done and dinner on the table just fine. They're light, thin, take a good edge and stay sharp for a reasonable time.

I personally sharpen my knives with stones every few months and maintain the edge with a steel (a steel, not a diamond-grit or ceramic rod hone) almost every time I use them. I prefer being careful with a sharp knife to wrestling with a dull one.

I prefer cutting on wood boards. Whatever you do, throw out the glass cutting board...

Instead of a block taking space on the counter, you might consider racks in a drawer, racks under the upper cabinets or magnet strips on the upper cabinets, say beside the sink where you can see the blade you're picking up, rather than just the handle.

Time to go cook something!

[smackboy1]

A quick tip:

Whatever knives you buy, buy a steel to hone the edges, and a sharpener to put on a new edge when honing no longer works.

I like the Chef's Choice manual sharpener. It's available for both Japanese knives and European knives (although I prefer a Japanese edge angle on all my knives). It's cheaper than an electric and takes no skill, unlike water stones. In 5 mins I can put a sharper-than-factory edge on any of my knives.

http://www.amazon.com/Choice-Pronto-San ... ner+choice

Avoid knives with a bolster that extend all the way down to the heel of the blade. A DIY sharpener will not be able to grind down the bolster and after a while the steel at the heel will be worn down but not the bolster, effectively leaving a gap so the heel of the blade will not meet the cutting board. At that point the knife will have to be taken to a professional to grind down the bolster. Most Japanese chefs knives are OK. Many European knives have this flaw.

[Stonebr]

After 4 years of heavy use, we are extremely happy with our Cutco knives.

- not cheap
- made in USA
- extremely high quality

[serbeer]

Could not be happier with Wustoff Classic set. So good, in fact, that my babysitter, who also cooks for us, [I think] stole a couple of smaller knives from the set (smallest one disappeared and then a few weeks later one size larger one after she told me previously how much she loves the new set, but no, don't have solid proof otherwise, so maybe I just got senile and throw knives into garbage lately). And she never stole anything else in many years she been working for us (I have a very sharp eye for anything missing), before or since. I did not even bother to grill her about it, just replaced the missing knives as we like her very much, pay her not enough to get Wustoff set of her own, and hey, with Wustoff, and having to cook at home too for her very large extended family, she simply could not help it, I can relate

[reisner]

Sets are a bad idea. Cf. Cooks' Illustrated and Barbara Flanagan's Home book. Wusthof is good, but their chef's knife can't hold a candle in cutting ability to the much cheaper Victorinox Forschner which is both stamped rather than forged and does not boast the much-vaunted full tang. I also like Forchner's 4" paring knife rather than the 3". Either one, kept sharp makes a tomato knife unnecessary. The F. chef's cuts bread better than any bread knife I've ever used--goes right through the loaf without scattering crumbs. For a third knife, my day-to-day go-to, look at Forschner's 5" Rabbit; it can do almost anything. Depending on your cooking you might need to add an oyster knife, a boning or fillet knife.

All that said, the very best knives you can buy are handmade by Bob Kramer, but you have no hope of getting one. Fortunately he has contracted with Henkels to mass-produce his designs out of ball-bearing steel (carbon, not stainless) in Japan. From Sur La Table an 8" chef's will run you $300 plus. I decided to forgo that in favor of my 90 per cent as good Forschner. Both designs slightly round the top edge, so it doesn't cut into your hand when you press down on a hard squash or dog bones the way other top knives do.

As important as the knife is the sharpener and hone. You need a steel or ceramic or diamond hone to keep the edge straight with every use. And a Norton or Japanes water stone of 1000 grit or higher for real sharpening. Cooks' has determined that with a Norton you don't really need to use oil--it only makes the job messier.

Not to highjack this thread, does anyone care to start threads on the perfect pocket knife, shotgun, deer rifle, birding binoculars?

[midareff]

I recently retired and having the time I do much more cooking. I went through my kitchen and replaced 2 decade + old Calphalon cookware that was neither dishwasher safe or no-stick with new Calphalon that was. Then came the knifes....... again 2 plus decades ago I had bought a knife set, Henckles Professional S .... no stain, ice hardened, yadda, yadda. after all that time and a bazillion times in the dishwasher all they needed was an introduction to the Henckles sharpener to be like new. I bought a new block and added a few pieces at Bed, Bath and Beyond with their 20% off coupons and now have 20 pieces. .. a knife for every occasion. I would rcommend the Pro S Henckles (the dishwasher safe no stain ones) to anyone, and buy the set, they are much more expensive by the piece. And BTW, be prepared to have them a long, long time.

[interplanetjanet]

Depending on your cooking you might need to add an oyster knife, a boning or fillet knife.

I found an odd use for an oyster knife a while back (coconuts...why did it have to be coconuts!?!). The short stubby cheap ones (OXO has one) are fantastic for popping/prying coconut flesh out of the shell. You need something not too sharp that you can put leverage on, they work marvelously. I don't eat oysters often at home (I much prefer the Atlantic varieties to most of the Pacific ones) and ended up buying an oyster knife just for this.

[4stripes]

In that price range (under $300/set) I've been very happy with the Victorinox Fibrox handle series, and have bought them for friends that love them as well:

http://www.swissarmy.com/us/category/Ca ... 150&m=add&

http://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Swiss- ... B008M5U1C2

[mr.ajandkj]

If you don't mind the look of commercial/professional knives, such as for a restaurant kitchen, then the "Bakers & Chefs" knives at Sams Club are an excellent value. They are high quality German steel and hold their edge very well. I put together a set of Chef's, Santuko, Filet & Slicing and paring knives for about $60.

Chef's Knife set- http://www.samsclub.com/sams/bakers-che ... tid=208352

Note that these look similar to the Victorinox set in the post above, except these have white handles instead of the black.

[yobria]

I must say my flimsy $10 santoku comes out of the drawer more often than my Henckels. Slices and dices easier, very easy to keep sharp. For meat, a cheap boning knife gets the most use. Good chefs knives are best for tougher tasks, like cutting through a beet, but you don't need them for lighter work.

[yukonjack]

The most recent Consumer Reports recommends the 7 piece set by Ginsu for items under $100. While I agree with buying knives individually it's hard to argue with getting this as a set. Wondering if anyone has an experience with these knives.

[jasonlitka]

I'm a big fan of Wusthof "Classic Ikon" series. They fit better in my hands than the "Classic".

[JupiterJones]

The most recent Consumer Reports recommends the 7 piece set by Ginsu for items under $100. While I agree with buying knives individually it's hard to argue with getting this as a set. Wondering if anyone has an experience with these knives.

I saw some guy cut through a tin can with one. It was still sharp enough to slice a tomato.

JJ

[Bengineer]

The most recent Consumer Reports recommends the 7 piece set by Ginsu for items under $100. While I agree with buying knives individually it's hard to argue with getting this as a set. Wondering if anyone has an experience with these knives.

I saw some guy cut through a tin can with one. It was still sharp enough to slice a tomato.

JJ

But wait, there' s more!

[Lon]

Ginsu 7108 Chikara 8-Piece Stainless-Steel Knife Set with Bamboo Block
by Ginsu

I got this set through Amazon two months ago and have been more than pleased. Only $76.00 too.

[Curlyq]

I saw a medical show the other day that tested knive blocks and found that they harbor huge amounts of bacteria. The advise was to not use them or purchase a plastic/washable one.

On the knife front, I've had four Cutco knives and one Cutco kitchen shears for 35 years. They look to be in near perfect condition even though I've used them for all kinds of things, both indoors and outside, cutting everything you can imagine (food, fencing, metal, fabric, etc.)

[leonard]

Check America's Test Kitchen. Their product testing and recommendations seem pretty solid regarding kitchen equipment.

[ventjockey]

shun classic have performed exceptionally well

[central nj]

It makes almost no difference, as long as they can be sharpened. The "steel" included in a set doesn't sharpen, only hones/realigns the blade. I've stopped by countless friends houses with expensive sets of knives---invariably the knives are dull as butter knives. Buy a chef's choice electric sharpener--three wheels for grinding and sharpening. It will honestly turn a cheap knife razor sharp.

[lindisfarne]

I would recommend fewer knives and going for the more high end lines of either brand. For Wusthuf, that would be their "Classic" line. For example, a single 8" chef knife can do the majority of the work in your kitchen. Add a paring knife and you're pretty much set. Those two knives, properly cared for, should last for decades.

Add in a bread knife eventually & sharpening (honing) steel (which does not sharpen but rather unfolds the microedges after cutting). I didn't get a "classic" honing steel - I got a different brand on a good sale years ago (I think Henkel).
Note: surlatable has an 8" classic wustof for $50(combined with bamboo breadboard). I just got it after christmas but it's still in stock (might be in sale & clearance). It's a great deal on a Wustof classic bread knife. I've had my paring knife since college & got the chef's knife a few years later - they will last me a lifetime. Have been coveting a bread knife for years, but was waiting for a "good deal" which 20 years later, came along!

As someone mentioned America's Test Kitchen (Cook's Illustrated) tests kitchen things. One of the Victorinox was ranked "best" (or perhaps 2nd best?, but the Victorinox chosen was cheaper, about $25).

[bUU]

We've just added a couple of Kyrocera knives. Ceramic knives hold their sharp edge longer (but need to be sharpened back at the factory - for free). I'm still getting used to them. They weigh practically nothing, which is not a good thing, but they are sharpsharpsharp and since I never have time to get my knives sharpened as often as they need to be (okay - I've been chasing this knife sharpener around for three years and never managed to connect-up) that's a great advantage. The chefs knife does a great job on normally dangerous-to-cut-with-not-so-sharp-knives items like carrots. But the real winner for me is the microserrated "tomato knife" which I also use for thick slices of onion.

I wouldn't live without metal knives (there are some things you simply cannot use ceramic for, like cutting hard cheese) but these are nice to have in the arsenal.

[leonard]

Check America's Test Kitchen. They do great testing, reviews and recommendations on many kitchen items.