U.S. stocks in free fall

Discuss all general (i.e. non-personal) investing questions and issues, investing news, and theory.
Locked
User avatar
Topic Author
Lbill
Posts: 4997
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:25 pm
Location: Somewhere between Up and Down

U.S. stocks in free fall

Post by Lbill »

DOW is down by over 550 points with a couple hours of trading left. Trading halt on the way?
"Life can only be understood backward; but it must be lived forward." ~ Søren Kierkegaard | | "You can't connect the dots looking forward; but only by looking backwards." ~ Steve Jobs
User avatar
ofcmetz
Posts: 2465
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:09 pm
Location: Louisiana

Post by ofcmetz »

I put in an order to sell some of my bond fund today and purchase a little of my stock index. Would that still go through after hours if trading was halted?
Never underestimate the power of the force of low cost index funds.
User avatar
ddb
Posts: 5511
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 11:37 am
Location: American Gardens Building, West 81st St.

Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Post by ddb »

Lbill wrote:DOW is down by over 550 points with a couple hours of trading left. Trading halt on the way?
Why would there be a trading halt? On 09/29/2008, DJIA was down 774 points and I don't believe there was any serious talk of a halt. Also down 679 point on 10/09/2008, 733 points on 10/15/2008...you get the idea.

- DDB
"We have to encourage a return to traditional moral values. Most importantly, we have to promote general social concern, and less materialism in young people." - PB
e5116
Posts: 867
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:22 am

Post by e5116 »

US Stocks? How about international stocks too. Emerging Markets are down over 8%...Only a 5.5% decline for US Stocks? Weak! ;)
User avatar
tipswatcher
Posts: 481
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 5:17 pm
Location: North Carolina
Contact:

Post by tipswatcher »

I said yesterday I suspected we'd see Dow 10,000.

Didn't expect it all in one day (!)

This is another lightning strike of our long-term bear market. Investors are running to the sidelines, fear is rampant. And who can blame us? This is how a bear market works: We have seen this before.

I am not doing anything at the moment. My stock/bond allocation was pretty conservative, and it got more conservative today, even though I did nothing.
TIPS: Perfect investment for imperfect times?
shawcroft
Posts: 929
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 3:18 pm
Location: Connecticut

The Chinese had a thought for these situations....

Post by shawcroft »

"May you live in interesting times"
(said to be an ancient Chinese curse)
Shawcroft
newport1
Posts: 281
Joined: Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:37 am

Post by newport1 »

VIX is up 46%! Fear is rampant.
User avatar
Morgthorak
Posts: 359
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:32 am

Post by Morgthorak »

We can only hope that this continues through the end of September, when our next round of dividends hits, so we can get more shares cheap! 8-)

:sharebeer
Avo
Posts: 1099
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:21 am
Location: California

Post by Avo »

This is nowhere close to a "freefall". The flash crash was a freefall. Black Monday was pretty close to a freefall.

This is an orderly, completely predictable (and predicted) response to meaningless "news" that's followed a huge run up.
User avatar
aja8888
Posts: 484
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:28 pm
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Post by aja8888 »

I'm pretty sure I will live through this correction. Maybe we will know the bottom when CNBC or Cramer calls it?
richard
Posts: 7961
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:38 pm
Contact:

Re: U.S. stocks in freefall

Post by richard »

Lbill wrote:DOW is down by over 550 points with a couple hours of trading left. Trading halt on the way?
Before 2:30, you need a 1,200 point drop. After 2:39, a 2,400 point drop

http://usequities.nyx.com/markets/nyse- ... t-breakers
User avatar
greg24
Posts: 4508
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:34 am

Post by greg24 »

When is the vanguard purchase deadline?
User avatar
Dan Moroboshi
Posts: 866
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 7:10 pm

Post by Dan Moroboshi »

tipswatcher wrote:I said yesterday I suspected we'd see Dow 10,000.

Didn't expect it all in one day (!)
Bah. I'm waiting for the Dow to hit 9000 so I can post pictures of Vegeta.

Image

IT'S UNDER NINE THOUSAAAAAAND!!!

If you don't already get this meme, it's really not worth looking it up...

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/its-over-9000
chaz
Posts: 13604
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:44 pm

Post by chaz »

Just fluctuation.
Chaz | | “Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons." Woody Allen | | http://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
FillorKill
Posts: 1007
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:01 am

Post by FillorKill »

Now I wish my buy transactions that will close today and tomorrow were bigger. More buying will be the name of the game for me.
AndroAsc
Posts: 1240
Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2009 6:39 am

Post by AndroAsc »

Why is it drop in stock market indexes are always reported in absolute figures? Not everyone know what the value was a week ago you know... reporting it in percentages would make things much better.
MWCA
Posts: 2820
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:21 pm
Location: A wonderful place

Post by MWCA »

I know that meme. Never seen it applied to this forum. Thanks for the laugh ;)
We are all worms. But I believe that I am a glow-worm.
User avatar
ofcmetz
Posts: 2465
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:09 pm
Location: Louisiana

Post by ofcmetz »

AndroAsc wrote:Why is it drop in stock market indexes are always reported in absolute figures? Not everyone know what the value was a week ago you know... reporting it in percentages would make things much better.
I've always thought this as well. Thankfully my app on my phone shoes me the percentages real time as well.
Never underestimate the power of the force of low cost index funds.
User avatar
bcboy57
Posts: 272
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:41 pm
Location: saginaw bay

Post by bcboy57 »

chaz wrote:Just fluctuation.
That's what McArthur said to the Japanese in 1945.....
chaz
Posts: 13604
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:44 pm

Post by chaz »

bcboy57 wrote:
chaz wrote:Just fluctuation.
That's what McArthur said to the Japanese in 1945.....
"I will return."
Chaz | | “Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons." Woody Allen | | http://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
minesweep
Posts: 1667
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 8:17 pm
Location: 27,000 light years from the Galactic Center of the Milky Way Galaxy (the suburbs)

Post by minesweep »

Down is faster.

MIke
User avatar
Dan Moroboshi
Posts: 866
Joined: Sat Jul 07, 2007 7:10 pm

Post by Dan Moroboshi »

I bought some equities today.

I felt like Major Kong.

Image

For those that don't get the reference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlSQAZEp3PA#t=0m21s
User avatar
stevewolfe
Posts: 1672
Joined: Fri Oct 10, 2008 7:07 pm

Post by stevewolfe »

chaz wrote:
bcboy57 wrote:
chaz wrote:Just fluctuation.
That's what McArthur said to the Japanese in 1945.....
"I will return."
1942.
natureexplorer
Posts: 4207
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:52 am
Location: Houston

Post by natureexplorer »

Interesting, how, on the first maket day after the (first) downgrade of US debt, international equities dropped more than US equities.
chaz
Posts: 13604
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:44 pm

Post by chaz »

stevewolfe wrote:
chaz wrote:
bcboy57 wrote:
chaz wrote:Just fluctuation.
That's what McArthur said to the Japanese in 1945.....
"I will return."
1942.
"The S&P will return."
Chaz | | “Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons." Woody Allen | | http://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
User avatar
Trader007
Posts: 147
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 1:43 am
Location: Europe

Post by Trader007 »

Free money from QE2 that´s selling i guess. If the area around here (~1090) in Spx does not hold i would not be surprised if we fall another 20%. Around 900. Last years June Low is also important.
Pacal
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2010 11:33 am

Post by Pacal »

Run for the hills, and take your money with you.... not :roll:
User avatar
aja8888
Posts: 484
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:28 pm
Location: The Woodlands, Texas

Post by aja8888 »

I can't wait to hear Cramer tonight. :lol:
User avatar
Topic Author
Lbill
Posts: 4997
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:25 pm
Location: Somewhere between Up and Down

Post by Lbill »

Now Asian stocks are in freefall overnight. Hong Kong and Korea are down over 7% and trading was halted in Korea. Japan down about 5%. Wow, this is starting to look pretty grim. Gather up the women and children. . .
"Life can only be understood backward; but it must be lived forward." ~ Søren Kierkegaard | | "You can't connect the dots looking forward; but only by looking backwards." ~ Steve Jobs
UNI4MER
Posts: 109
Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:44 pm

Post by UNI4MER »

BigD53 wrote:As soon as the President appeared on TV, the DOW went from being down "only" 300... to being down 500! :roll:

Moderator, you can delete my political comment. (Actually, just an observation.) :beer
I respect this forum immensly. But I would like to see more flexibility when it comes to subject of politics. Now more than ever politics is affecting every aspect of investing and I feel that comments on current political policies and how they are affecting investment decisions are in order.
User avatar
fishnskiguy
Posts: 2635
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 12:27 pm
Location: Castle Rock, CO

Post by fishnskiguy »

UNI4MER wrote:
BigD53 wrote:As soon as the President appeared on TV, the DOW went from being down "only" 300... to being down 500! :roll:

Moderator, you can delete my political comment. (Actually, just an observation.) :beer
I respect this forum immensly. But I would like to see more flexibility when it comes to subject of politics. Now more than ever politics is affecting every aspect of investing and I feel that comments on current political policies and how they are affecting investment decisions are in order.
Ain't gonna happen on our watch. Sorry.

Chris
Trident D-5 SLBM- "When you care enough to send the very best."
User avatar
Morgthorak
Posts: 359
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:32 am

Post by Morgthorak »

fishnskiguy wrote:
Ain't gonna happen on our watch. Sorry.

Chris
Thank you! That's one of the things I like most about this forum. No partisan crap to wade through. 8-)
User avatar
Imperabo
Posts: 1109
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:00 am

Post by Imperabo »

Lbill wrote:Now Asian stocks are in freefall overnight. Hong Kong and Korea are down over 7% and trading was halted in Korea. Japan down about 5%. Wow, this is starting to look pretty grim. Gather up the women and children. . .

Attempt to hide your glee.
WatchinU
Posts: 166
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 2:45 pm

Post by WatchinU »

I know some folks that are shorting the market and they are sitting on some good gains. however, this could easily reverse if the market bounces
User avatar
Regal 56
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 5:47 pm
Location: South Euclid, OH
Contact:

Post by Regal 56 »

I started my IRA a little over four years ago. Buy and hold all the way. My portfolio is now down 1.74% for that entire period. That's over four years of gains wiped away in the last two weeks. I'd imagine many people who started investing ten or twelve years ago have had similar experiences.

If you ask me, the last ten years are going to drive a whole lot people permanently out of the stock market. And frankly I wouldn't blame them.
Ed 2
Posts: 2692
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:34 am

Post by Ed 2 »

Findelglorin wrote:We can only hope that this continues through the end of September, when our next round of dividends hits, so we can get more shares cheap! 8-)

:sharebeer
+1
"The fund industry doesn't have a lot of heroes, but he (Bogle) is one of them," Russ Kinnel
richard
Posts: 7961
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:38 pm
Contact:

Post by richard »

Findelglorin wrote:We can only hope that this continues through the end of September, when our next round of dividends hits, so we can get more shares cheap! 8-)
Are you thinking dividends won't be cut?
User avatar
ddb
Posts: 5511
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 11:37 am
Location: American Gardens Building, West 81st St.

Post by ddb »

Regal 56 wrote:I started my IRA a little over four years ago. Buy and hold all the way. My portfolio is now down 1.74% for that entire period. That's over four years of gains wiped away in the last two weeks. I'd imagine many people who started investing ten or twelve years ago have had similar experiences.

If you ask me, the last ten years are going to drive a whole lot people permanently out of the stock market. And frankly I wouldn't blame them.
This will surely drive lots of people out of the stock market altogether, but I don't think it will be permanently for most. The fear and greed cycle seems to be one of the most reliable aspects of human behavior. People will get out now, and they'll get back in down the road after a period of good performance.

A super-simple portfolio of 50% Vanguard Total World Fund and 50% Vanguard Total Bond Fund has a YTD performance of -3% through yesterday. This is hardly earth-shattering territory yet. Those who abandon strategy will be the ones who were taking too much risk to begin with, as is always the case.

Fortunately, this year has been good for diversification. CCF funds have outperformed global equity indices year-to-date. TIPS returns have been so good, it's almost getting uncomfortable! And of course, those into Gold are sitting pretty, with a 20+% YTD return.

- DDB
"We have to encourage a return to traditional moral values. Most importantly, we have to promote general social concern, and less materialism in young people." - PB
whiskers
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 4:10 pm

Post by whiskers »

Regal 56 wrote:I started my IRA a little over four years ago. Buy and hold all the way. My portfolio is now down 1.74% for that entire period. That's over four years of gains wiped away in the last two weeks. I'd imagine many people who started investing ten or twelve years ago have had similar experiences.

If you ask me, the last ten years are going to drive a whole lot people permanently out of the stock market. And frankly I wouldn't blame them.
Over 4 years ago puts you in Spring, 2007 - that's a peaking area before the 2008 crisis. The DOW is down 20% over that time period, so I say you've done pretty well. I've been investing for about 2 years and the irrationality of the market has made me want to close all of my positions and throw my computer out the window multiple times. It's been a great learning experience.
You learn to deal with it - don't be greedy for the quick buck, buy stock in solid companies you like, diversify, diversify, diversify, don't forget about compounding, and hold the course - my hypothetical untouched portfolios (investopedia), my retirement account, as well as just index funds, all have outperformed what I have done in my 'fun' account.

Stocks are a bit up this morning, but they'll fall down again just like they'll rise as well.
Last edited by whiskers on Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
HomerJ
Posts: 21241
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:50 pm

Post by HomerJ »

Imperabo wrote:
Lbill wrote:Now Asian stocks are in freefall overnight. Hong Kong and Korea are down over 7% and trading was halted in Korea. Japan down about 5%. Wow, this is starting to look pretty grim. Gather up the women and children. . .

Attempt to hide your glee.
I know, right? There's seriously something wrong with Little Bill. He really is taking PLEASURE in this down-turn.

And it's a temporary down-turn, so I'm not even sure why he's so gleeful. It seems to make him happy to think we're all losing money, but in the long run we'll all be fine...
User avatar
Regal 56
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 5:47 pm
Location: South Euclid, OH
Contact:

Post by Regal 56 »

whiskers wrote:
Regal 56 wrote:I started my IRA a little over four years ago. Buy and hold all the way. My portfolio is now down 1.74% for that entire period. That's over four years of gains wiped away in the last two weeks. I'd imagine many people who started investing ten or twelve years ago have had similar experiences.

If you ask me, the last ten years are going to drive a whole lot people permanently out of the stock market. And frankly I wouldn't blame them.
Over 4 years ago puts you in Spring, 2007 - that's a peaking area before the 2008 crisis. The DOW is down 20% over that time period, so I say you've done pretty well. I've been investing for about 2 years and the irrationality of the market has made me want to close all of my positions and throw my computer out the window multiple times. It's been a great learning experience.
You learn to deal with it - don't be greedy for the quick buck, buy stock in solid companies you like, diversify, diversify, diversify, don't forget about compounding, and hold the course - my hypothetical untouched portfolios (investopedia), my retirement account, as well as just index funds, all have outperformed what I have done in my 'fun' account.

Stocks are a bit up this morning, but they'll fall down again just like they'll rise as well.
Well, today the market is up 430 points, so I'm happy again. Now where are my Lithium tablets?
User avatar
Topic Author
Lbill
Posts: 4997
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:25 pm
Location: Somewhere between Up and Down

Post by Lbill »

There's seriously something wrong with Little Bill. He really is taking PLEASURE in this down-turn.
I'm still seeking revenge against the stockbugs who were getting rich during the dotcom craze. I hope they've all lost their money by now. But, even more important, I want to see stocks get killed so I can buy. The last time I bought was the very day the S&P hit bottom at 666 back in March 2009. Going for a 2-fer.
"Life can only be understood backward; but it must be lived forward." ~ Søren Kierkegaard | | "You can't connect the dots looking forward; but only by looking backwards." ~ Steve Jobs
User avatar
Imperabo
Posts: 1109
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:00 am

Post by Imperabo »

Lbill wrote:
There's seriously something wrong with Little Bill. He really is taking PLEASURE in this down-turn.
I'm still seeking revenge against the stockbugs who were getting rich during the dotcom craze. I hope they've all lost their money by now. But, even more important, I want to see stocks get killed so I can buy. The last time I bought was the very day the S&P hit bottom at 666 back in March 2009. Going for a 2-fer.

You consider these acceptable motivations for incessantly starting threads bashing stocks and those who hold them (most of which cover the same ground from slightly different angles), and reveling in the pain of others? Kinda sad.
User avatar
Topic Author
Lbill
Posts: 4997
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:25 pm
Location: Somewhere between Up and Down

Post by Lbill »

No, I honestly think that investing in stocks stinks. It's a legitimate viewpoint even though it's a voice in wilderness in the Cult of Equities. You can make pretty good returns without undergoing the torture of the stock market - I always have.
"Life can only be understood backward; but it must be lived forward." ~ Søren Kierkegaard | | "You can't connect the dots looking forward; but only by looking backwards." ~ Steve Jobs
User avatar
Imperabo
Posts: 1109
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:00 am

Post by Imperabo »

Lbill wrote:No, I honestly think that investing in stocks stinks. It's a legitimate viewpoint even though it's a voice in wilderness in the Cult of Equities. You can make pretty good returns without undergoing the torture of the stock market - I always have.
I liked your first answer better. It was refreshing honest. Envy is truly mankind's darkest motivator.
User avatar
HomerJ
Posts: 21241
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:50 pm

Post by HomerJ »

Lbill wrote:No, I honestly think that investing in stocks stinks. It's a legitimate viewpoint even though it's a voice in wilderness in the Cult of Equities. You can make pretty good returns without undergoing the torture of the stock market - I always have.
Well, you're doing it wrong... Instead of promoting an alternative point of view, you sound like a mooing cow.
User avatar
HomerJ
Posts: 21241
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:50 pm

Post by HomerJ »

Lbill wrote:You can make pretty good returns without undergoing the torture of the stock market - I always have.
The last time I bought was the very day the S&P hit bottom at 666 back in March 2009
even more important, I want to see stocks get killed so I can buy
You're not making a lot of sense.

You've never doubled your money via investment in 2 years OUTSIDE the stock market. So apparently you think the torture IS worth it. In fact, you're hoping to get back in again.
User avatar
Topic Author
Lbill
Posts: 4997
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:25 pm
Location: Somewhere between Up and Down

Post by Lbill »

Instead of promoting an alternative point of view, you sound like a mooing cow.
You seem to like that phrase. How many cows are you personally acquainted with, and what is the nature of your acquaintance? Just wondering...
"Life can only be understood backward; but it must be lived forward." ~ Søren Kierkegaard | | "You can't connect the dots looking forward; but only by looking backwards." ~ Steve Jobs
GammaPoint
Posts: 2661
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2009 10:25 am
Location: Washington

Post by GammaPoint »

I've seen dozens of Lbill's threads or posts against stock ownership. I always guessed that he just didn't have a high risk tolerance (which there's nothing wrong with) but then also wants the best of both worlds and is trying to justify the belief that investing in stocks is a loser's game in the long-term. Maybe so that he doesn't have to feel like he's missing out on any returns. And I guess this all started during the "dotcom craze" when he wasn't holding enough stock as he would have liked, as he basically just admitted to.

I say everyone should just invest along with their own need, ability, and desire to take risk, and let everyone else happily do the same.
User avatar
honkeoki
Posts: 317
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2009 1:39 pm
Contact:

Post by honkeoki »

Lbill wrote:I'm still seeking revenge against the stockbugs who were getting rich during the dotcom craze. I hope they've all lost their money by now. But, even more important, I want to see stocks get killed so I can buy.
I have to say it's truly refreshing to see your motivations laid bare. --inflammatory comments deleted--

Thanks for your honesty. I really do appreciate it.

Edited to add:

Since the mods saw fit to tone down my previous statement, let me reword it a little more tactfully:

Many who post in this forum have axes to grind, but it's rare that they're so up front and open about it. They very rarely show you the axe.

Thanks for showing us your axe.
Last edited by honkeoki on Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Be smug when others are fearful; be fearful when others are smug.
Locked