buying my first home...(long)

Have a question about your personal investments? No matter how simple or complex, you can ask it here.
Post Reply
Topic Author
doc hoc
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:29 am

buying my first home...(long)

Post by doc hoc »

hello people...just want to take a second to post a heavy question...and by the way appreciate all the insight and thoughts i have picked up along the way reading this forum for the past months...you guys really are a tremendous help!!

i am a resident moving to st. louis for residency. because i will be there for about 4-5 years...i was strongly considering buying a home...i have saved up about $15,000....and i'm looking to buy a place near my hospital, in the neighborhood of 150-175K...i have been renting for the last 7 years cause i had no income as a college and medical school kid. I am just sick and tired of flushing my money down the toilet, so i have decided to buy a home/condo...

yearly salary: 46000
student loans: deferred until after residency (170K)
credit card monthly: $400...(using CC mostly as a tool to improve FICO)
other debts: no car, no kids, but will be getting married at some point, geologist wife is a perpetual student, like me!

i know people on the site have been somewhat cautious about purchasing a home in this market context. specially for someone like me who really doesn't have the full 20% saved up....

my basic question is...am i making the right decision looking to buy...and am i trying to buy too much house based on my salary....my goal is obviously to make a good investment where i don't lose money....but the way that i see it....lets say i buy a 150K home...and i sell the home for a loss at 110K...thats 40K that i would have lost anyway renting...now if i break even and sell the house for a lil more than 150K and cover my closing costs...thats basically living there for free......


what do you guys think? am i being overly simplistic? over - eager? am i missing stuff a rookie shouldn't miss??
User avatar
oneleaf
Posts: 2562
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:48 pm

Post by oneleaf »

Yes, I think you are being way oversimplistic.

You are not throwing money away by renting, since there is a cost for shelter whether you are renting or owning. I wish people would stop saying "renting is throwing money down the toilet" because it is nonsense.

Owning a home means you have costs for property tax, upkeep and maintenance, interest (whether on loans or forgone interest), closing costs, all of which are significant.

In your example where your house goes down 40K, and you think that's all you lose, you are off by several tens of thousands of dollars there, as you are forgetting all the other costs that add up over the years. Interest alone will cost you pretty much as much as renting over those 5 years (money down the toilet, just like renting). And don't be suckered into thinking you will be saved by tax deductions. The difference between your interest paid and the standard deduction will not be as substantial as you might think.

I'm not saying buying is a bad idea, but that if you think it's a financial slam-dunk, then you have a lot of number-crunching to do.
captain3d
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2008 2:53 am

Post by captain3d »

You might have fun playing with this...


http://www.housemath.us/
Topic Author
doc hoc
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:29 am

Post by doc hoc »

captain and oneleaf...

thanks a bunch guys...i really started crunching earnestly after your frank responses...

just to throw some numbers at you...

cost of rent: $800/month. (4 yrs...around 40K)
cost of utilities: 50/month ( 4 yrs ..around 2500)
cost of rent for one year: 12,500
cost of rent over four years: 50K

buying a condo

property tax: averages around 2000...(8K after 4 years, if steady)
condo/HOA fees: $250/month = 3000/year (12K after 4 years)
monthly payment = on 150K loan at 6.5 = $950/month (11.4K/year, 45K over 4)
pmi: 100/month = 1200/year (4800 over 4 years)
closing costs: 4000
utilities: 200/month (2400/year, 9600 over 4 years)
homeowner’s insurance: 250/year (for a home 750/year)

(total monthly payment: 166 + 250 + 950 + 100 + 200 + 25 = 1691* )

(this number obviously excludes closing costs)

cost of buying this condo over four years: (8 + 12 + 43 + 5 + 4 + 10 = 82 K )

82 K!!!! whew, this number didn’t even include the 15K downpayment…

the math is driving me nuts...so..it looks like renting is atleast 40K cheaper than buying…how can this be?????!!!!!! i suppose the numbers would look different if i stayed in STL a lil longer....also...this calculation doesn't take into account the tax breaks...which could be around 5K over the 4 years...

what other numbers do i need to input into my calculations guys?? suggestions please!!!! this has already kept me up half the night!! but i'm trying to iron out the kinks before i even go look at houses...

thanks alot fellas...i appreciate it!!!
seattlewindpig
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 7:57 pm

Will you be able to sell when you want?

Post by seattlewindpig »

The cost of selling the condo will be a 6% hit. Factor in the opportunity cost of the down payment (maybe small, but the devil is in the details). What will the market be when you want to sell and move to your post residence local?

I think if you dig deep, you'll find that realestate appreciates a lot less than people think in most areas. On average it does a little better than inflation.
I would only consider a condo if a descent apartment was not a available. Google search "condo horror stories".

I think 4 - 5 years is generally to short a time to commit to buying.

Good Luck
Ralph
User avatar
Sunny Sarkar
Posts: 2443
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 12:02 am
Location: Flower Mound, TX
Contact:

Post by Sunny Sarkar »

Think of it this way: when you buy, you rent the money instead of the real estate. The bank interest paid is just as much flushing down the toilet as the apartment rent.

Buying is a good long term strategy, but the math may not work out over the short term. One way to make the math work out slightly better over the short term is to switch to a 15 year loan. If you look at the amortization tables for a 15 year loan and a 30 year loan, you'll be amazed at the difference. For me, the charts were eye popping.

However, if you own now when it may be hard, you'll likely keep owning later when it will be easy, and the math will work out for you very well over the long term.

The real benefit of buying over renting is inflation hedging your housing costs - rent keeps rising, but mortgage is fixed - but again, that becomes apparent only over the long term.

We're looking for our first home too, after renting for over 10 years. Wish we had started earlier.

Best wishes,
Sunny
"Buy-and-hold, long-term, all-market-index strategies, implemented at rock-bottom cost, are the surest of all routes to the accumulation of wealth" - John C. Bogle
User avatar
Sunny Sarkar
Posts: 2443
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 12:02 am
Location: Flower Mound, TX
Contact:

Post by Sunny Sarkar »

p.s. The cost of changing your home is approx 10% of your home's price. That's HUGE! Include that in your calculations. Buy & hold is good for housing too.
Lucija
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:36 pm

Post by Lucija »

...<snip>the math is driving me nuts...so..it looks like renting is atleast 40K cheaper than buying…how can this be?????!!!!!! i suppose the numbers would look different if i stayed in STL a lil longer....also...this calculation doesn't take into account the tax breaks...which could be around 5K over the 4 years...

what other numbers do i need to input into my calculations guys?? suggestions please!!!! <snip>...

Let's not forget about maintenance!

I think it would be pretty unbelievable if nothing in that house breaks or needs to be replaced for whatever reason. I think you need to budget at least 1% of the house cost for misc. repairs/upkeep (can you say: $ flushed down the toilet).

Are you handy and have time to deal with repairs/maintenance? If not, you should be aware that it will cost you at least $200 each time any type of repair person (electrician, plumber, etc.) shows up at your doorstep.

Buy house if you want one. Otherwise, it is not as good of an investment as you think. Good luck!


Edit: assuming you file 2008 taxes as married filing jointly - will you guys have more than $10900 in combined mortgage interest, state/local income tax & property tax? If not, essentially you will see not tax break. If yes, you will reap some tax benefits, but only on the amount of $ above $10900.
User avatar
oneleaf
Posts: 2562
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:48 pm

Post by oneleaf »

I wouldn't necessarily assume that owning is better (financially) than renting, even over the longterm. Like Sunny said, the advantage is in the characteristic (protection against future rent increases, which is unknown), not necessarily in the raw numbers.

A house is a consumption item, so there is no reason to expect that the market wouldn't price a single family home to be more expensive than renting, and that people have to PAY to gain the benefit of home ownership (permanent place, ability to fix it up how you want it, privacy). Only when the market starts to think home ownership is a hassle and burden (financially or otherwise) will owners start to be REWARDED for owning a home.

Right now, I think it's safe to say for single family homes, the likelihood that you are paying (relative to renting) to own is very high, whether it's short-term or long-term. So make sure that owning a home is something that is really what you want, and is good for your family, and don't do it because you think it's automatically a financially sound choice. IMO.

edit: you mention that you think the numbers will look better over the longterm, and usually it does. But the reason is because you will be diligently saving and putting money into the house, and slowly building equity. It is still your diligence, hard work, and ultimate savings rate that determines your success, not necessarily the decision to own a home. The home ownership simply facilitates the process because the monthly payments forces you to save. You can continue to rent and choose to save diligently for your family's future in a traditional stock/bond portfolio, as well.
User avatar
White Coat Investor
Posts: 17409
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 8:11 pm
Location: Greatest Snow On Earth

Re: buying my first home...(long)

Post by White Coat Investor »

doc hoc wrote:hello people...just want to take a second to post a heavy question...and by the way appreciate all the insight and thoughts i have picked up along the way reading this forum for the past months...you guys really are a tremendous help!!

i am a resident moving to st. louis for residency. because i will be there for about 4-5 years...i was strongly considering buying a home...i have saved up about $15,000....and i'm looking to buy a place near my hospital, in the neighborhood of 150-175K...i have been renting for the last 7 years cause i had no income as a college and medical school kid. I am just sick and tired of flushing my money down the toilet, so i have decided to buy a home/condo...

yearly salary: 46000
student loans: deferred until after residency (170K)
credit card monthly: $400...(using CC mostly as a tool to improve FICO)
other debts: no car, no kids, but will be getting married at some point, geologist wife is a perpetual student, like me!

i know people on the site have been somewhat cautious about purchasing a home in this market context. specially for someone like me who really doesn't have the full 20% saved up....

my basic question is...am i making the right decision looking to buy...and am i trying to buy too much house based on my salary....my goal is obviously to make a good investment where i don't lose money....but the way that i see it....lets say i buy a 150K home...and i sell the home for a loss at 110K...thats 40K that i would have lost anyway renting...now if i break even and sell the house for a lil more than 150K and cover my closing costs...thats basically living there for free......


what do you guys think? am i being overly simplistic? over - eager? am i missing stuff a rookie shouldn't miss??
Congratulations on your recent graduation. I have a friend finishing residency in St. Louis this summer. Perhaps you can buy his place. They have lots of older homes that are relatively inexpensive and I don't think St. Louis has been particularly bubblicious, so I think you'll be fine buying there, especially since you seem to have a downpayment, and may even be able to scrape up a 20% downpayment, which I would do rather than take a "doctor loan." I just wanted to correct your misunderstanding above. What you aren't realizing (and many don't so don't feel bad) is that rent=interest. What you would pay in rent if you were renting you will pay in interest if you buy. You probably won't be able to deduct that interest as a resident, so it is essentially a direct comparison. All that money you pay as interest (as much as 90-95% of your mortgage payment) goes poof each month just as much as your rent does. You sound like you're as overeager to buy a house as I was as a med student. I ended up losing money after four years (and I'm not just subtracting final house value from purchase value, I'm including realtor fees, fix-up costs, difference between my interest payments and rental costs etc.) so realize that buying isn't always better, especially for any term less than 5 years.

RE: Improving your FICO score. You don't actually have to carry a credit card balance to improve your FICO score. You can simply put your gasoline on the card each month and pay it off completely each month. That way you pay no interest and still build your FICO just as well.

Good luck.
1) Invest you must 2) Time is your friend 3) Impulse is your enemy | 4) Basic arithmetic works 5) Stick to simplicity 6) Stay the course
financialguy
Posts: 306
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 5:47 pm

Post by financialguy »

oneleaf wrote:edit: you mention that you think the numbers will look better over the longterm, and usually it does. But the reason is because you will be diligently saving and putting money into the house, and slowly building equity. It is still your diligence, hard work, and ultimate savings rate that determines your success, not necessarily the decision to own a home. The home ownership simply facilitates the process because the monthly payments forces you to save. You can continue to rent and choose to save diligently for your family's future in a traditional stock/bond portfolio, as well.
I'm one of those who has decided to rent rather than own.

My woman and I have decided to move because the neighborhood has gone more "ghetto" recently. For example, we had some solar yard lights stolen from our front yard a couple nights ago. Thank goodness we can easily leave as soon as the lease runs out and move to a better location. If I owned this house, we would NOT be able to move at the drop of a hat.

The flexibility you get from renting is an amazing benefit. The location risk that home owners face is completely non-existent.

Also, my investments are almost at the point where interest and dividends would be enough to cover the rent, so it's practically the same as having a paid-off mortgage. It's just that rather than have my equity being concentrated in a house, it's diversified in securities.
User avatar
oneleaf
Posts: 2562
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:48 pm

Post by oneleaf »

financialguy,
My wife and I came to the same conclusion. There are nice things about owning a home, but the flexibility of renting for people in our situation outweighs the benefit. So we would be willing to pay more money to rent vs. owning a home.

We are fortunate that in our area, renting appears to be the more financially sound option anyway. Homes in our neighborhood are roughly 26-27 times annual rent. Crunching some numbers, my wife and I decided that rent either has to increase dramatically or home prices have to drop precipitously for us to even consider owning a home, from a purely financial standpoint. In terms of lifestyle considerations, it would need to happen on an even greater scale to outweigh the disadvantages of home ownership.

We have plenty to make a very strong down payment on a nice home, and believe we will stay in the area for a good while. But even so, home ownership is unattractive to us from every angle we look at.
YDNAL
Posts: 13774
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2007 4:04 pm
Location: Biscayne Bay

buying my first home...(long)

Post by YDNAL »

We are fortunate that in our area, renting appears to be the more financially sound option anyway. Homes in our neighborhood are roughly 26-27 times annual rent.
oneleaf,

Whoa! Where do you live? The reasonableness test for a single family residence is max 15x in most places (not NYC, SF, for sure).

1) So, at $2K/mo x 12 = $24K x 15 = $360K.

2) That property, purchased with 20% down, will cost more to own than $2K/mo (including property taxes, insurance, etc.).

3) That said, I don't agree that home-ownership is not for doc hoc, whom I estimate being 26yo. I believe he would be OK as a homeowner over a long lifespan.

FWIW, my son just finished his residency and bought his first home after consulting with dad (who happens to be involved in real estate. :roll:).

Regards,
Landy
User avatar
oneleaf
Posts: 2562
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:48 pm

Post by oneleaf »

Landy,
I live in Orenco Station in the Portland area. This area has been pretty popular for homeowners, due to the new development and proximity to schools/businesses/restaurants/banks/library/everything you need.

Most 3-bedrooms homes I have been looking at are in the neighborhood of $400K. On craigslist, you can find 3-bedroom townhomes in this area renting for between $1100 to $1600 per month.

I know someone living across the street from me in a 1-bedroom flat, renting for $500/month. Been there for 4 years though, so a new tenant might be paying at least $100 more. This is not an expensive area to rent by any means, but quite expensive to own.
tim
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri May 09, 2008 5:15 pm

Post by tim »

I just bought a house in St. Louis City in your price range not too far from where you will probably be doing your residency. I will agree with the others not to buy for financial purposes. This area while not bubbly did appreciate above the norm from 02-06 and is down generally about 5% yoy. I bought expecting to take a loss if I have to sell in less than five years and plan to keep this place for ten or more. That said, there are some spectacular gingerbreads and bungalows (as long as you don't mind small) in your price range. Inventory is high but seems to have stabilized in the past couple months. Just my 2 cents. If you have any questions about specific areas feel free to ask.
saferthansome
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri May 09, 2008 12:52 pm

Post by saferthansome »

What about buying a home that has an apartment built into it and then renting out that apartment while you live there... Would that make sense (financially, that is)?
YDNAL
Posts: 13774
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2007 4:04 pm
Location: Biscayne Bay

buying my first home...(long)

Post by YDNAL »

oneleaf,

Thanks for the added details. I was a bit surprised at 26-27x annual rents you mentioned and a bit curious (professional interest).

Real estate markets often differ by individual communities within very small areas..... a general benchmark such as 15x annual rent does not always apply.

In your area, the $400K 3-bd house should fetch $2,200/mo rent. This seems to be in-line with the 3-bd townhouse that goes for $1,600 (high end) and likely sells for around $300K. The same townhouse (likely not) at $1,100 would be a steal.

Have a great weekend!

Regards,
Landy
Topic Author
doc hoc
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 1:29 am

Post by doc hoc »

well....this really has been quite insightful...and unfortunately eye-opening. i don't think given my horizon to stay in STL 4-5 years is enough to make this viable from a financial commonsense standpoint....

after crunching numbers for property taxes, HOA, utilities, mortgage payments, relocation/selling costs, maintenance, i realized that i could potentially be on the hook for 1500-1800 bucks/month...which is a sizeable chunk of my 3000/month after taxes salary....NOT feasible!!

after talking it over with the boss (SO) collectively we think that buying is not as attractive as renting...as much as i would like to think that it would be cheaper to buy...even in the best case scenario with low HOA fees, taxes (both of what really hurt) the benefit of buying only saves a few grand...(and thats if i get the deal of a lifetime and minimal maintenance costs) ..and of course lets not forget the flexibilty of renting...i can move if the neighborhood starts to suck...

so...looks like back to renting...i wanna thank the bogleheads...cause i think you guys seriously saved me from committing financial suicide. my realtor and the banker are totally NOT gonna be happy with you guys though!!!
User avatar
oneleaf
Posts: 2562
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:48 pm

Post by oneleaf »

Landy,
I was unable to find any 3-bedrooms in this area renting for much more than $1,500 a month. It is possible that the $400k homes in this area are nicer than the ones that are being rented out. Square footage is similar though. Looking at the availability of townhomes for rent, I would think it is difficult for an owner of a $400k home here to rent it out for much more than $1,600. There have been a sudden increase of homes for sale in the past month or so, so it looks like prices might finally start coming down a bit.

doc hoc,
Good luck whatever you decide. You've done good saving so far, so maybe in another few years, you'll have enough to put down a more sizeable down payment, which would make a home more affordable. I don't have a crystal ball, but it sure doesn't seem like home prices are going to skyrocket anytime soon, so no harm to take your time and wait until you are ready.
User avatar
VictoriaF
Posts: 20122
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:27 am
Location: Black Swan Lake

Post by VictoriaF »

oneleaf wrote:financialguy,
My wife and I came to the same conclusion. There are nice things about owning a home, but the flexibility of renting for people in our situation outweighs the benefit. So we would be willing to pay more money to rent vs. owning a home.

We are fortunate that in our area, renting appears to be the more financially sound option anyway. Homes in our neighborhood are roughly 26-27 times annual rent. Crunching some numbers, my wife and I decided that rent either has to increase dramatically or home prices have to drop precipitously for us to even consider owning a home, from a purely financial standpoint. In terms of lifestyle considerations, it would need to happen on an even greater scale to outweigh the disadvantages of home ownership.

We have plenty to make a very strong down payment on a nice home, and believe we will stay in the area for a good while. But even so, home ownership is unattractive to us from every angle we look at.
oneleaf,

You expressed my own sentiment about home-buying. I find home ownership related chores daunting, the flexibility to change rented places highly valuable, and the financial analysis in favor of renting.

And then there is the issue of the concentrated risk. Taleb advises in "Black Swan" to look not at the probability of an adverse event (which is not known) but at the consequences of an adverse event taking place. Thus, the more equity one has in the house the more one has to lose in a Black-Swan disaster. The flip side, i.e., little equity, is not much different from rent.

Thanks,
Victoria
User avatar
VictoriaF
Posts: 20122
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:27 am
Location: Black Swan Lake

Portland, OR

Post by VictoriaF »

oneleaf wrote:Landy,
I was unable to find any 3-bedrooms in this area renting for much more than $1,500 a month. It is possible that the $400k homes in this area are nicer than the ones that are being rented out. Square footage is similar though. Looking at the availability of townhomes for rent, I would think it is difficult for an owner of a $400k home here to rent it out for much more than $1,600. There have been a sudden increase of homes for sale in the past month or so, so it looks like prices might finally start coming down a bit.
Oneleaf,
I have not been to Oregon, but I visited Seattle and hiked in the Cascades. I consider Portland, OR, somewhat similar to Seattle and a highly attractive place to live. The prices you quote seem too low, about a half of analogous prices in Arlington, VA.

I don't doubt what you wrote, and the ratio of rent-to-ownership cost is very similar to what I get here. But I am wondering why Portland is so cheap?

Thanks,
Victoria
chiefsfan
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat May 10, 2008 10:11 am

Post by chiefsfan »

Lots of good info here, I can add a perspective of a recent grad with 200K in student loans...Even though those loans are in deferment, don't forget that any interest that accrues during residency (unless paid off) will capitalize to the that original loan total. I don't know if you consolidated and locked in a low interest rate, but a 170K student loan obligation will become 200K at 4% after four years. That was a surprise to me. And since the Federal loans max out at 154K, the remaining private loans have a much higher interest rate, probably higher than a mortgage you can get.

Also FWIW, I had a friend who owned a home for the four years of school, then relocated for his residency, had trouble selling, then was forced to worry about that from many states away. Good luck to you.
firewynd
Posts: 184
Joined: Sun May 04, 2008 2:47 am

Post by firewynd »

doc hoc,

I would definitely pay off your credit card every month. Keeping a balance on it is flushing money down the drain. If you want to build your FICO score, then use the card for every purchase you can. Just make sure you pay it off in full every month so you don't have to pay the very high interest rates (usually 12%+). If you follow this strategy, then I would recommend you look into getting a cash back card. My wife and I have a pair of them and we put everything on them that we can. I'd put my mortgage bill on it too if the bank would let me! We make on average around $300 back a year. Great way to save some money and build your FICO score. Just make sure you can pay it off in full each month - otherwise you are doing yourself a disfavor.

I'm not sure what my FICO score is now, but two years ago - after following this strategy for about 3 years - my score was 785 which put us into the top category for home mortgage rates.

-------------------

Also something you *might* consider... wait to buy the home until you have the 20% down so that you don't have to pay PMI. Some people might say to invest it in the stock market instead. My wife and I had enough money saved for a 20% down payment on our home and I'm really glad we did. Our monthly payments are a much lower, and the 20% down is like a guaranteed return of 7% (out mortgage rate - we had to file a no-doc due to use both being full-time students with no full-time job history). Also we save money on the extra PMI as well. I feel like it was a good choice, especially since the last year has been pretty rough market wise.

-----------------

Oh and if you do go out to buy a home - don't be afraid to be ballsy. If I could do it over again - I would have offered a LOT less than I did. I wouldn't be afraid to offer like 75% of their asking price... maybe less depending on if you mind waiting or not. The housing market is hurting in most areas and chances are a lot of the people have been trying to sell their homes for months and months. You will find someone desperate enough (if you don't mind taking the time) to sell even at a reduced rate because your 75% under bid may be the first bid they have received in like 6 months... they will be thinking that this might be their only bid... Anyway you can save a ton of money that way. Just depends on how long you are willing to spend. Keep in mind that they will just probably counter-offer your low ball figure (if they are really motivated to sell) and either way you can still probably get a good chunk off their asking price.

For our current home it was 180k asking which was at the very very tip of our price range. I decided to throw them an offer 11k less at 169k. My agent thought i was crazy. They countered at 172k and we bought it and saved 8k. But looking into it further... the owner kept re-listing it every 20-30 days so that it wouldn't look like it had been sitting on the market for a long time (a common practice). But in truth it had been empty for 6 months and she was very desperate to get out. I'm sure I could have got it for much less than 172k.

But this all depends on your area and how the market is there.
User avatar
oneleaf
Posts: 2562
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:48 pm

Re: Portland, OR

Post by oneleaf »

VictoriaF wrote: Oneleaf,
I have not been to Oregon, but I visited Seattle and hiked in the Cascades. I consider Portland, OR, somewhat similar to Seattle and a highly attractive place to live. The prices you quote seem too low, about a half of analogous prices in Arlington, VA.

I don't doubt what you wrote, and the ratio of rent-to-ownership cost is very similar to what I get here. But I am wondering why Portland is so cheap?

Thanks,
Victoria
Victoria,
The neighborhood I was quoting (Orenco Station) is located outside of Portland (about 15 minutes drive, or 20 minute light-rail). It is more expensive than most of the other neighborhoods in the surrounding suburbs (Beaverton, Hillsboro), but still less expensive than downtown Portland.

I agree that Portland is a very attractive place to live. I actually think it's more attractive than Seattle, but I think Oregonians tend to say that. :wink: The nice thing about this area is that the surrounding suburbs are well connected to Portland downtown. Also, the newer neighborhoods are built to have restaurants, shops, businesses, and residential areas all intermingled. It is the opposite of the urban sprawl I used to experience in Southern California.
User avatar
family_doc
Posts: 137
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 11:00 am

Additional thoughts

Post by family_doc »

All of the previous posters have done a great job commenting on the +/- of your upcoming rental/buy home decision. For my $.02, I would favor renting. I am commenting here as a recently retired doc, but with the memories of residency not yet too dulled by time.

You have a LOT on your plate for the next 4-5 years. New residency in a new geographic area, (and residencies of any type will likely be the hardest you have ever worked). 200K of loans to apportion and pay off, no doubt with the sage assistance of the DH's here, (hello to Emerg Doc!) Responsibilities of workload, night and weekend call. Malpractice and defensive med worries. Insurance documentation and billing concerns. I take it you intend to get married soon, fromyour initial post;new relationship of marriage. Possibility of starting family. Relating to colleagues, attendings, patients, staff, administrative types. Don't forget you will be targeted by "sharks" intent on blitzing you with entreaties of insurance and "investments". Being watchful of treating yourself to "toys" with increasing salary.

Just a an opinion that simplicity here may be a way to help swim through this all. Life will be complex for you as it is! KISS! Best of luck to you.

Family_doc
Post Reply